How The Vegas Golden Knights Lost A Star Goal Scorer For Close To Nothing | Trade Trees
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2024
- Steve Dangle breaks down a 2018 trade between the Montreal Canadiens and Vegas Golden Knights and how it eventually left the Golden Knights with nothing, while the Montreal Canadiens are still reaping the rewards of trading their former captain.
EDITOR'S NOTE: This trade tree was filmed before Max Pacioretty was sidelined for 6 months with an achilles injury.
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Steve didn't even mention the fact that Montreal didn't want Suzuki. We asked for Glass and Vegas said no and countered with Suzuki.
I didn't know that. That is awesome.
this is actually not a fact. no one ever said that except some reporters from MTL. nothing about this has been proven yet.. maybe one day MB will admit it but until then its only rumor
Lol how poor is Vegas management to let that information leak if that is indeed true
@@henrifortier8621 i’ve seen you on so many videos and you keep on spreading this and misinformation.
@@slipperynodd578 god you sound like a creepy stalker .. where was it confirmed ??! show me the proof Im waiting. I'm sure you wont find me the proof
Tatar put up 149 points in 198 games (.75 per) with Montreal at $5.3M. Pacioretty put up 194 points in 224 games (.87 per) at $4.5M (1 year) or $7M (3 years) with Vegas. That's almost a fair one-for-one trade. All the other factors and deal inclusions make this absolute robbery.
It definitely would not have been a fair 1 for 1 but I get what you mean Tatar was very serviceable for us considering he was a cap dump
@@320ms4 he’s saying based on stats after the fact if it had been a 1f1 it would look like a even trade. Not that a 1f1 would of been a fair trade or anything at the time
I think if Patch didn’t get injured so much then It could have been a bit different but it was a bad trade for Vegas none the less.
@@itzmrbeau6386 ohhh that makes a lot more sense thanks for the clarification!
@@slipperynodd578 Well when you get your head driven into a turnbuckle by a 260lb giant, eh. Now, I am not putting that all on Chara, it happened in Montreal, Patches should have known where he was on the ice and who he was trying to blow by on the inside.
For anyone who wants to know what Detroit did with the picks from the Tatar trade. Detroit used the 1st and 2nd to draft Joe Veleno and Robert Mastrosimone, both are still with Detroit. The third was packaged with the rights for Jonathon Bernier to Carolina for Alex Nedeljkovic. And that is where Detroit sits for the Tatar trade tree
That 94th overall pick as part of the trade was used to select Aidan Hreschuk, who was traded to Columbus for Max Domi and Tyler Inamoto.
Well actually Steve, while Fluery was traded for a person, that person had his contact terminated like 2 days later so saying nothing would be accurate.
@@kokocaptainqc lol
Fun fact, Montreal may end up gaining two different captains from the Craig Riverett trade.
And to think back in 2012, Gorges was supposed to be the captain.
@@lankancheetah he should have been or Gally
@@xavierdube6520 you're jumping ahead, Gally wasn't even on the Habs until 2013
@@krog21 when they nominated pacioretty
Say no more
It’s okay, bc while they’ve traded literally all their players besides the misfits line, they now they have Jack Eichel who is the best player of all time ever definitely without a doubt and he will score 200 points
i heard also he is the best guy to have around in a lockeroom.
@@Patriarchy2022 100% not a cap
also i heard that he has never had an injury, and is not currently recovering from a surgery that has never been done before in the game, can’t see how this doesnt work out
Jack Eichel is about to show us all why he should have gone first overall.
Obviously not this year or even the next couple of years, but one day if the current way players are playing continues I can see a trade tree video being titled: How the Chicago Blackhawks Lost the Ryan Johansen for Seth Jones trade
How can Chicago lose a trade they didn’t make?
By signing one of those traded dudes to maybe the worst contract in NHL history 😂, it’s not a true connection but it’s so bad it deserves attention
Jones from Nashville to Columbus for Ryan Johanson; Jones from Columbus to Chicago for Boqvist, CHI 1st 2021 [Cole Sillinger], a 2nd (to CAR [Aleksi Heimosalmi] for Jake Bean), and CHI 1st 2022 [RHD David Jiricek]; CHI also got TBL 1st 2021 [LHD Nolan James] and CBJ 6th [LW/C Dominic James].
In the first season of the trade, Columbus got 0.39 points per game over 198 games (34-44-78) & Chicago got 0.65 points per game over 78 games (5-46-51).
Before everyone gets too excited about Jones only having 5 goals, he shot at 2.6% on the year. When he was traded from Nashville to Columbus, he shot 2.4%, but rebounded to a respectable 7.9% shooting the next year. If he takes 194 shots at his NHL-average of 4.9%, that’s 9.5 goals; one happy bounce and he scores 10 goals. Not bad. At his average for the years when he wasn’t traded (5.7%), that’s 11 goals. He’s going to be better next year than he was last year.
Still, I’d rather have Sillinger & Boqvist on the ice and Jiricek in the system, all getting better, than Jones, who should start declining in a couple of seasons from now.
@@TheCman556 you didn’t watch Seth Jones play hockey last season if you still think it’s the worst contract ever. He’s a 7M dollar defenseman making 9.5, and that’s actually backed up by the analytics as Seth Jones had one of his better seasons last year according to analytics. Despite being overpaid and overvalued in the trade, Seth Jones was not and will never be the problem in the Seth Jones trade, everything surrounding him was, his contract, what they gave and the misguided idea of what the organizations direction and contending timeline really was.
@@TylerAven10 He is CURRENTLY a 7M dollar defenseman making 9.5. They really, really hope he's still on that level eight years after the contract is signed.
I miss future considerations. He was always a fan favorite
His brother Cash Considerations was a more consistent presence in the crease until the post-lockout rule changes.
Hey Steve! Love the trade trees. Did one of my own on the 1991 Ron Francis trade, really made me appreciate the work that goes into these. Thanks and keep them coming!
I love these trade tree videos/analysis. Thanks for the great work Steve and SN.
My favourite series on CZcams! Great work again!
Keep these up!! Makes me work days so much more enjoyable
It was the western conference final, Montreal won the western trophey and Tampa won the Eastern one. Fun Fact, that win gave Montreal the only trophy that the team or it’s players never had because they weren’t in the western conference since that trophy was introduced.
At least one somewhat good thing to come out of the pandemic!
@@Pierreboro i don't know if it's good but it's funny for sure
Well technically the Habs don't have a President's Trophy since is was introduced so late in the league.
@@robrick9361 damn I didn’t even think about that. In my mind I thought they had because they’ve been first in the league for points a bunch of times.
My top 2 trade tree requests
-Erik Karlsson trade revisited
-Marian Gaborik Columbus deal (aka how every team in the league got Derick Brassard)
The best part of the offseason... trade trees!! You should do the Erik Karlsson trade tree, many said Ottawa got fleeced. In reality Ottawa got 2 top 6 players currently under 23, a solid goalie prospect (later trade) and a prospect currently playing for Canada in the WJC.
This trade will only get worse for Vegas once Suzuki gets the C for MTL
Suzuki is overrated. Let's be honest, did have the year everyone expected.
@@dmannevada5981 he’s not overrated he was playing with 3rd liners 65% of the year and when Caufield was called up and Ducharme fired and replaced by St Louis he was a point per game in the last 35 games of the season .Everyone on the habs had an off year and was on average -20.He had a different line mate every game it’s impossible to be consistent when playing with different players every game.Stats mean nothing certainly his point total under Ducharme.27 points in 45 games under Ducharme.34 in 37 games under St louis.Caufield 8 points 28 games under Ducharme and 35 points in 37 games under st Louis.Also Caufield was 2nd in goals from March 7th to last game of the season.Also he led rookie in points from March 4th to the end of the season from March 4th to the end of the season he was first in rookie scoring during that period and won rookie of the month of March thanks to Suzuki and St. Louis .Other from those 2 no other player had 40 points witch is crazy.Suzuki is underrated yes he could of had a better year but it isn’t his fault the Canadiens everyone except him and Caufield were awful. I think he would of max scored 75 I personally think 72-73 if he was playing with better players and a better team last season. I know he won’t ever be as good as Mackinnon but Mackinnon when his team was last he only scored 56 points and when Rantanen and Landeskog became his linemates he went from 50pts to 90
Now we are going to be seeing a Marchessault-Raanta swap as the future considerations.
I loved what Vegas did that first year and gave them respect for that. Now...they are just dumb. They just get the big names and throw guys out and how's that going? And while I feel for Robin Lehner right now, I have no sympathy for the organization. Poor Eichel....
On the contrary (in relation to Eichel), he has an opportunity to improve his trade value, so he can get out if he needs to. But by getting the surgery he _needed,_ his career will continue.
@@TheEDFLegacy there’s a huge list of NHL players and other athletes who have gotten the standard surgery. He didn’t *need* the surgery he got…..he wanted it.
@Torik Redguard I’ll say again…….
There’s a huge list of NHL players that went on to play hundreds and hundreds of games in the NHL who had the standard surgery. Peyton Manning had two fusions and went on to have the greatest single season by an NFL quarterback…….ever.
I think you’ve taken the rare occurrence of the surgery back firing as common.
@@danevertt3210 Regardless, the risk of constant pain, even being 1% may not have been a risk he was willing to take.
You arguing it away with one example doesn't make a case.
@@KMMHL2012 right right so let’s go with the totally unproven and unprecedented procedure.
Lots of logic used there
You do great work Steve. I love these trade tree videos! 👍🏻
the “ohhh..” after “future considerations” killed me, love u steve & producer drew
Finally. !!!! I’ve watched all these been waiting!
So the Habs traded away their captain to get their now captain.
I really do wish you had included Detroits part more in this. We got a really good haul for Tatar, including Alex Nedeljkovic who we got with the 3rd rounder.
Feeling the love on my 23rd birthday Steve, thanks.
Fleury was traded for Mikael Hakkarainen instead of future considerations because Blackhawks needed to offload 1 contract to make the roster spot available for Fleury. Vegas then said to Hakkarainen that he shouldnt bother moving since they didnt want him. He would have stayed with Blackhawks AHL affiliate werent he to make contract with TPS in Liiga.
20-23 is early, 24-26 is mid, and 27-29 is late.
Found the 23 year old
@@dabnad not yet.
This is basically just a 16 minute roast of the worst run organization in the NHL.
How can that be, they've made the playoffs 4 of the 5 years they've existed. Not many others can say that.
This isn’t a Buffalo trade tree?
Watching these has gotten me looking into trades that have interesting trees afterwards. Two that could be quite interesting is Alexander Mogilny going from Buffalo to Vancouver, the other being Pavel Bure going to Florida.
The Mogilny Tree is massive
The Mogilny Tree is massive
I love these Trade Trees, can you do the Montreal Canadiens trade of John Leclair, Eric Desjardins and Gilbert Dionne to the Philadelphia Flyers for Mark Recchi and a third round draft pick.
@@curmudgeonaf The trade gets even funnier when Recchi was traded back to the Flyers for Zubrus and picks.
Making of the Legion of Doom, would love to see.
Please do the Sharks-Lightning Dan Boyle trade tree!
The Sharks got Dan Boyle and Erik Karlsson, while the Lightning got Matt Carle, Steve Downie, and the draft pick for Andrei Vasilevskiy.
EK65 and Vasilevskiy are one of their best players currently on each team, so it might be interesting.
I only just started following these Trade Trees videos, so I don't know if this one has been suggested but... then infamous Flames/Leafs trade in the early 90s that sent Doug Gilmour to the Leafs.
Please consider the Cam Neely/Barry Pederson trade tree. Since June 6, 1986 and still active.
This is the only reason I subscribed!
I think you should do a trade tree about the first time Brent Burns was traded. Burns was not just on the Sharks he played for Minnesota as well, that Trade Tree has grown and I'm not going to spoil it but the Wild have some great prospects and a few other names from this trade. It ended up working for both teams.
"They're probably a playoff team, maybe even a contender."
Not without Lehner, they ain't.
Steve, have you done the Miikka Kiprusoff trade tree yet? Sharks gave the Flames Kiprusoff for a draft pick, which the Sharks used to get Marc-Edouard Vlasic. That would be interesting, methinks. Even though now I realize the video wouldn't be very long since both players never got traded again
If we are doing Golden Knights trade trees, than is it too early to revisit The Mantha/Vrana trade tree since that thing has QUICKLY blossomed into some interesting branches for Detroit
Nice! Please do one about the best and worst results that came from "future considerations."
I had no idea Norlinder was a result of the Patches trade, and with the rookie camp hes been having and Suzuki being named captain this trade just keeps aging like fine wine
well this aged well.... right at the 13:40 mark.
laughing at Steve yelling that Vegas should act like a real team a year after this video was posted and Vegas just won the cup
Steve please do the Trevor linden trade tree from when the Canucks traded him in 1998. It goes on for 22 years and was key in the Canucks getting so many players
We traded Pachioretti because mainly, the guys almost hurt every 6-7th game and then he will be day to day, only to get hurt again and again. He returned for one game this season, scored a goal, then somehow injured himself. Players that get injuries like Pachie does is not reliable.
Have you done the trade tree for Messier to the Rangers? If I remember correctly that tree ended just before COVID hit
Hey I remembered Mikael Hakkarainen, but I'm a Finn. Although I had never heard about him before the trade.
I missed you so much Steeve!!🤩🤩
Love the new trade tree graphic style, should look into the Ryan McDonagh trade tree for the Rangers and Tampa if it hasn't been covered yet
It has... believe it's still active
As a 23 year old, I’m hurt
welcome back Steve
I have seen Future play, in Junior. He's a stud. All the best to Mr. Considerations with Vegas.
For a stretch there, every offseason the Blue Jackets would get rid of the players who led them in zone transitions. Hartnell, Gagner, Wild Bill (Karlsson), Saad (although the return was pretty good for Saad).
A fun trade tree might be the Rangers trading for Martin St Louis. Rangers got close to the cup in the with St Louis but the price they paid was large. Also it's got another trade in there as well.
steve: 23 is mid twenties
me, 23: *having an existential crisis*
the guy vegas traded fleury for, they bought out 3 days later. so it literally was less than nothing
Solid video, with numerous zingers. Kudos!
Great video, glad it was done. But the audio imbalance for the flourish sounds on the trade tree almost gave me a heart attack. As a fellow editor, please check the audio balance as a little piece of advice. Again, great video otherwise :)
I have a few trade tree ideas:
Martin St. Louis from TBL to NYR
Scott Hartnell from NSH to PHI
James Neal from DAL to PIT
Andrej Sekera from BUF to CAR
Thomas Vanek from BUF to NYI
The kings offer for pacioretty was toffoli/vilardi and the pick that became rasmus kupari but the habs would’ve pick joe veleno with that pick if the deal did happen at the draft
one could argue they traded patches for cap space, they didn't get a draft pick or player or anything like that, but cap space is valuable on it's own
I remember when this trade happened my co worker is a habs fan went up to him and said congrats you won that trade may take a few years but you got a stud in Suzuki
Suzuki hasn't even come close to looking like a stud.
One Great Sport
Always loved Patches!
2:02 it kinda looks like Engelland headbutts Holtby when shaking hands 😂
You need to do the Erik Karlsson trade tree. Pretty crazy to think that Ottawa pulled it off just fine with that trade.
What do you think about Campbell going to the oilers? As an oilers fan I'm stoked lol
Idk if it’s in the plans, but if it isn’t y’all should really do the Erik Johnson for Kevin Shattenkirk trade tree. Insane stuff for both the Blues and Avs there
It's a major up and down one. Erik Johnson perpetually never lives up to potential but is Solid and a good locker room guy, Shattenkirk had some top tier seasons but not the longevity of Johnson.
@@justinlast2lastharder749 ah yes, it’s true. But grasshopper, Shattenkirk was traded. *flood gates open exposing tidal wave*
Vegas traded for Eichel because they lacked impactful Center depth, which they would've had if they kept Suzuki
They'd definitely atleast HAVE 1 of those
No way, there is nothing at the moment that shows Suzuki would be impactful. Suzuki at this moment has had some flash in the pan moments, and maybe he'll become an elite #1 center(doubt it), but please, don't over state it.
I wanna say Huskvarna was the guy who got traded for Fleury, but that's the name of a line of power tools, and also spelled wrong.
Have you ever done historical trade trees like Rick Martin or Alex Mogilny?
Anybody else watching this after Vegas won the cup?
AAAAANNNNDDDDDDD now they have to rely on Thompson and Hutchinson* in net because Robin is out for the entire season. That's a big oof.
*had to go back and look because I honestly forgot they have hutch as well.
And 10 minutes after this was posted Carolina announces Paccioretty has a blown Achilles tendon and will miss most (if not all) of the season. In fact with that injury and his age he may never play again.
With Lehner out for the year it's entirely possible Vegas miss the playoffs again
Logan Thompson will be just fine.
@@derekashworth5884 trusting a goalie who didn’t even play 20 games last year to be your starter as well as not having anyone good behind him is tremendously stupid. If you think they can make the playoffs with a tandem of Thompson and Hutchinson then I just don’t trust that you’re non-biased. You might say “but they can trade for a backup”, I counter with did you see that I report that there was nothing in return for Pacioretty’s even when they could’ve thrown in like a seventh or sixth because of spite? Knowing that information do you think any team is going to give them a good back up or go away without asking for something ridiculous? Like, Jake Allen might be on the table. Do you think Montreal is gonna help them out or are they gonna ask for an unprotected first and hope Vegas has no other options?
@@slipperynodd578 Dumb analysis. Talk about speculative.
I'm still waiting for Heatley for Hossa... I'm waiting Steve... I'm still waiting Steve... Give me now Steve!!
Yes yes Vegas fans, we’re all jealous of the instant success you had and the running of the team isn’t a train wreck. All of the other fans just don’t appreciate how great Eichel can be if we would all just believe in him. Welcome to draft lottery ville, the playoffs are over their for winners.
This future considerations guy sounds pretty good everyone wants him
I remember thinking out loud in my car earlier this week: "Hey, Pacioretty trade tree would be cool". So Steve, wheres the mic hidden?
Since Lehner was hurt since last year, was there no possibility of him going on LTIR to keep Pacrioretty?
It doesn't look that way. Even with the players who might be starting the season on LTIR, Pacioretty's contract would have pushed Vegas well over the cap.
Do the linden trade tree already
Patches got that achilles injury and this trade is still a huge win for us Canes fans.
Also, Steve I am begging you for the Brendan Shanahan trade tree.
Def should reference how he couldn't stop sleeping around with teammate's wives and that's why he was traded so much.
@@IHateMyAccountName that sounds like extreme slander I’m not gonna lie.
What's the best "future considerations" return you have ever seen in a trade?
You should do the Esa Tikkanen for Doug Weight trade there is other hall of famers involved
Just so those 23 year olds know, its "whats my age again"
Tatar was mostly a really good player in Detroit. He was always tougher to knock off the puck than Nyquist and frequently outshone Goose offensively.
Do the Mike Richards to LA trade tree
Pat LaFontaine Peter turgeon trade tree also nice Blink-182 reference what's My Age Again
Um......a 16 minute video is a snack? Lol
I remember the day the trade happened I was upset we got Suzuki instead of Glass, glad I was wrong lol
I think if Steve made a video about the joys of watching grass grow, I'd watch it.
LeGuerrier went unqualified by the Habs and I think he's currently on the Indy Fuel. As far as the Habs are concerned, it's really just Norlinder left for that 2nd rounder.
Vegas should have not broken up that 2018 team. The only moves they made that were particularly spot on were the additions of Mark Stone and Robin Lehner.
Stone has a lingering injury that is hush
I do love Stevie going “the Rivet trade tree is 19 minutes long. Here’s a little snack” on a 16-minute video.
Babe wake up a new Trade Trees is out
Andreas Athanasiou trade tree would be an interesting one
Dangle don’t miss 💯
Well this aged well
If you think of it like a rental it’s less OMG! I mean they got more out of him then Florida did with Chiarot if you consider the second payment to take Tatar.
First and a #6 right D for 3 years of Pacoretti.
Had Vegas one does anyone complain?
Niewndyk for Ignila whose in the hall of fame
But Dallas won the cup from that trade….
Rentals are always a risk and very rarely ever work out.
Jacob Leguerrier was already not a habs prospect when your Rivet video came out
Do the Hasek / Beauregard trade, pretty please !
Dumping Patches was a good move. I liked Patches, but forget the stats, Patches didn't have the Justin Williams effect. There are players who aren't able to perform when it matters most, and Patches was one of those players. Lots of players in all sports have this issue, hell, look at the Dodgers Clayton Kershaw. Going to the hall of fame for sure, sucked when his team needed him in two playoff years. The dodgers would have won 2 more championships had Kershaw even remotely performed like in the regular season. This was the best reason to dump his contract. Look at his history with the Knights in the playoffs. He just didn't have the ability to carry the team when it really mattered in his 3 playoff years. Patches just couldn't produce at the exact times he was needed most in any of the 3 years the Knights were in the playoffs. The most glaring, against Montreal. He had zero impact on that series, couldn't carry the team and show everyone Montreal should of regretted the trade. In fact, Montreal was gleeful over the fact that he couldn't produce in the series. It validated the trade for Montreal fans. Love watching him. Patches has sniper skills. No doubt can put the puck in the net. Unfortunately, patches couldn't put the puck in the net when it mattered. Good dump for the Knights, might as well walk away now and keep looking for the type of player who can produce. Eichel is up next...let's see.