Game Theory: Until Dawn's TRAGIC Hero
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- čas přidán 23. 11. 2015
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Until Dawn is all about making sure you make the right choices to make it out alive... But what if the most important character in the game is the only one who gets NO CHOICE in whether they live or die. What does that mean for you playing the game? What does that say about the game itself? Get ready for a completely new understanding of Until Dawn! (plus a few spoilers!)
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actually Sam IS a good person because she tried to stop the prank
kawaii kitty So is Chris, he passed out with Josh in the kitchen.
VoltageOverkill but still Chris is tortured the most by josh even though he had nothing to do with the death of Hannah and Beth. So I ask myself why?
Josh may not have known that or have just forgotten, his mind clouded by his illness he might have just automatically assumed they were all to blame
Chris was most tortured because it was Josh's way for Chris to make a move on Ashley. Earlier in the game, he says the only way you two would get together is through a traumatic experience. Which is exactly what happened (if you don't piss off Ashley that is)
I think that's shown through by the fact that Sam can only be killed at the very end with the Hannah-Wendigo encounter.
It was just a hank, pran.
I sell propain & propain accessories
-displays knives for the propain- i am all propain
IIM SORRYYYYY
+SyKi That boy ain't right.
+SyKi {TORTURE PRANK} {ALMOST SHOT} {GONE SEXUAL}
+SyKi
I found that specially funny cuz I play Evolve a lot, and "Hank" is great character there, that can destroy a monster in a couple of seconds.
Sam is actually the most innocent of the group. She outwardly tried to connect and help Josh after Hannah and Beth disappear. She also knew about the prank on Hannah and tried to find her to stop her.
I love Sam too, bu what about Chris?
They have been friends since school and Chris is aware that Josh is taking medication. Sure, later he helps Mike to tie up Josh, but in his defense: He went through hell that night. Seeing his best friend die and having to choose wether to take his own life or the life of his crush.
Well, Sam sends those cops to their death at the end. So I think Chris is the most innocent.
Sauce of your pfp?
@@flufflewarrior Also Chris was never apart of the prank. He was there that night, but was passed out across from Josh. Sam realized it was cruel, yet she also was the one that initiated the prank on Hannah, which I assume is her best friend, hence the hesitation and the immediate attempt to comfort.
Yeah Sam is the best
“Don’t let beth’s yoga pants distract you from the truth” still a brilliant line
Those pants are shiny
Sam's yoga pants are fine too
Pants?
Dude I got an ad for yoga pants after reading this comment
@@xXDunceBoyXx Pants.
Can we take a second to talk about how a random CZcamsr knows that a fictional character has schizophrenia yet half of the time psychiatrists can't prescribe the right medicine...?
Now I understand where you are coming from and I see very valid points in your argument. But I'm talking about all the stories I've heard from friends, family, and even my own personal experiences. Once I was prescribed some Lexapro and after my first dose I was informed that it was all a mental practice for the first week. Obviously, that totally ruined the medicine for me. It's simple things like that that totally mess up what psychiatrists are trying to figure out.
Well, not quite random but that doesn't make it any different. Doctors should tet their crap together
josh is fictional character, we can see everything and we can repeat the game to analyze it again. also google and theorys from other people can help. real people just came to your cabinet and pretending to be a normal. that's a gigantic difference.
also met in older videos have said that he had a degree in psychology
+RANDOMASIANGUY1 mat*
"The true victim is Josh."
And the parents who have now lost their son and their twin daughters. That must be agony.
Synthra Official the parents knew about the wendigos though
Josh Kimbrough what?
they did not
@@JoshuaKimbrough
No they didn't. They wouldn't have been that much stupid to send their own children there if they did.
Unless they sent them there on purpose... theory!!!!!!!!
“The true villain is a system that doesn’t know enough or doesn’t care enough” that hit home. I for one felt this way about josh and the story from my very first play through. Mental illness is a real thing and instead of helping most ppl including those in doctor positions, just write them off as “crazy” it’s so sad
I'd say instead of helping most people cave in and give them whatever they want to "feel better". Instead of actually helping people we just throw medication and irreversible surgeries and slap them on the back telling them they're better. Sad stuff
@@tylerlackey1175 well sometimes medication and surgeries is exactly the thing people need to get better, having a society that accepts open feelings for EVERYONE and that doesn’t stigmatize conditions would also help tremendously
So innocents deserve to die bc of a crazy guy who didnt get help, even though that is no one else’s problem
@@Tw0Dots I’m talking about real life dude not this game😒….. but since u mention it, there are too many ppl out here with a “not my problem” attitude. The same attitude that sees someone in trouble and won’t help
The three words used to describe Joshs character.
Loving: he loved his sisters
Thoughtful: meticulously planned this “prank”
Complex: you know why
Well... he did love them but their death was accidental and torturing their friends for that is probably not what they would have wanted.
@@kevinhoskins9320 from joshs perspective it was less about their deaths and more about how they felt before dying, when josh asks them how they felt he didnt go "how did it feel thinking you were going to die?" he asks "how does it feel to be humiliated and betrayed?"
@@kevinhoskins9320 all of you saying that
But if you were Josh and you had that kinda of love for your sister that the people that you thought were your friends caused your sisters to die yeah you would look for revenge and traumatized them
Josh had a psychologist who talk him I to that and made his condition much worse
You can't blame Josh blame the others and the psychologist
@@kevinhoskins9320 Remember when he was hallucinating in chapter 10 and he kept saying "you can't tell me what to do", then later gave in and started saying "I trust you"? Maybe his sisters' ghosts in his head guilt tripped him into doing the prank to avenge them... coz he also said "not again"
Yes because you wouldn’t do something that a mentally ill person did that means they’re unreasonable and don’t think of others
The true meaning of Until Dawn is Dr. Hill is a terrible doctor.
Greg Lenoce he wasn't on a hill so he couldn't be a good Dr.
Yeah reminds me too much of Doctor Phil
Greg Lenoce but Chris was asleep during the prank so he wasn't a bad person
Greg Lenoce HE IS THIS KILLER
CASE CLOSED
IM OUT CYA
Chris?
I'm so glad I am not the only one who felt sorry for Josh.
DAY-V Entertainment™ Same T^T
DAY-V Entertainment™ i keep seeing here in game theorists and vikan gaming repeatedly
DAY-V Entertainment™ no i feel bad for him it's not his fault
DAY-V Entertainment™ I hate Josh
If you hate Josh I hate you all
Josh was my favourite character from the start and it angered me so much when CZcamsrs would always give him the awful scenarios. I always wanted him and Sam to get together so badly and I was so upset when he died but I could tell he was mentally ill and it wasn’t his fault about what happened. I’m glad I found this video because I just thought everyone else hated him.
@Marissa Burks You're definitely not, I ship them too.
wish to unsee this thread
Same
Sameee
@Marissa Burks Quite a few people do (including me). You just need to find the right comment section. :)
This game is what made me fall in love with Rami Malek
I fell in love with him in Night at the Museum
Your gonna love my profile picture 😂
He's the best in The Pacific it's a HBO miniseries he's fucked up
wait thats actually him?
It restarted my childhood obsession with him... still haven’t recovered
18-20 is legal age everywhere. most places it is actually lower.
earlier in the game some are 17
+VengfulDarkness There are places where consent age is 19. Others where consent doesn't exist unless there is marriage. I believe there is a few places where it is 21 as well, but I can't find them again after a cursory search. However, in Canada where the game is set, it is perfectly legal.
+TheOnlyAlchimous in japan the age is 13
Their trying , prevent arranged marriages
christian mcgregor And that's not relevant. Good job.
Thank you for clarifying that people with schizophrenia aren’t socio or psychopaths.
I know this is one years ago but why would he have to?
@@maxy6749 Many people get them confused
Okay, I'm a young child and don't use social media and stuffz, so I didn't know people even got those confused, wow.
@seth choi Yeah, Sherlock Holmes is a sociopath. He is one of my favorite fictional characters.
@@maxy6749 I think a lot of people have learned that any mental illness that results in violent behavior is a result of being a socio/psychopath. And it's kind of sad how many use socio- and psychopathy interchangeably.
3:27 Man, Mike's beartrap is a trap for Wendigos. Josh wouldn't attach a literal limb to a trap just to attract friends.
Also, Josh didn't set up any scares in the sanatorium
Yup that was flamethrower guys trap for catching the wendigos you learn that he used a lot of those to lure them into the sanetorium during the story. It's a pretty genius trap the one thing wendigos are intrested in eating moving specifically because they can't see it otherwise.
Josh was the only character there who actually deserved a happy ending. Obviously Hannah and Beth deserved one too but they died and kicked off the game. And I think Ashley wasn't there when Hannah and Beth went missing. One of the girls wasn't there when she went missing but as for everyone else they most certainly did not deserve a happy ending. Nothing Josh did was as bad as what they did as a "prank" to Hannah. Legit. What they did to her....it's completely unforgivable I'm pretty sure it's s a and illegal as well. They secretly filmed someone undressing without their consent under false pretenses. That's so beyond f***** up. And I really didn't like how Josh was painted as a psychopath and crazy to pull all of these elaborate pranks when that's exactly what those douchebags deserved. Honestly they deserved a lot f****** worse than what he did to them. So it really frustrated me how the devs so clearly painted him as the bad guy who didn't deserve a happy ending.
@@WhitneyDahlin ashley was there, when watching the video from the night a year ago, chris says "i forgot you were such a willing participant." the only one not involved in the prank was sam lol
@@SaraAson so the flamethrower guy had the wolves and was smoking? I didnt know who it was but seems like him
Josh's story is so heartbreaking, and something I can relate to. I have BPD and mental health professionals don't like treating patients with borderline personality disorder. We're seen as too difficult, too hard to change. Some doctors plain out think it's either us "just wanting attention" or it plain out is dismissed as existing. BPD is real in my life, it is a hard disease to deal with, and no medicine can fix it like my bipolar can be treated. But I'm not impossible to fix. I've made a lot of progress on my own. In a system where diseases outside of the simple idea of how mental health should like, people with more complicated disorders get shoved to the side or shoved out completely. All my life all they told me I had was depression. But after many suicide attempts they finally determined I had BPD and bipolar along with my PTSD. I've been getting better with the right meds because of it, sadly Josh never got that. And it's so heartbreaking to see unfold 💔
Im rooting for u :)
@@nate4621 aw thank you :)
@@palmyra_is_cherubic I had a baby brother that died and I also have OCD, so I can relate with Josh as well. Stay strong, my friend.
@@rattlesnakejake956 you too 🥀
It's so sad how people with BPD are treated badly. Do you feel like talking about it? Do you need to talk? I'm willing to listen.
Plot Twist: Josh is actually an Oscar winning actor and this is just a new movie project...
I was shocked when I saw his Oscar
I didn’t think that bohemian raspody won
The Hamburgler no but Rami won for best actor
@@rain9463 same
In this game, you're the latest director to work with Glass Eye Pix, the production company of Larry Fessenden (who is the co-writer of the game's story and the actor of the Flamethrower Guy). Essentially, the game play through is you making the final cut of a feature film.
One thing that I think a lot of people in the comments section seem to overlook is that Josh's actions were probably inspired by his parents' movies. They specialised in gritty horror movies with all manner of special effects. It's hard to say how much of it he came up with on his own, and whether he was capable of seeing the damaging effects of his actions when he grew up around horror movie sets.
Woah, nice observation
@@joesubel This comment does not get enough credit.
I mean to be fair if they were good parents, they should have tried to keep their children to an appropriate level of creepy. Not doing that could lead to nightmares/yes eventual desensitization. Then again they are absentee for the entire game and raised 3 kids two of which seem maladjusted socially. So you could be right.
doomed from the start
Cool
As someone with systematic schizophrenia, I really appreciate that the game devs put him in as a character, so many people just tell me to back off or that I’m insane and I should be locked up but I’m content that there’s people like that out there. I just wanted to say thanks to the game devs and to matpat for spreading awareness for psychosis, and for the cool theory keep it up and I’ll try to as well
That's awful. Some people don't understand that the brain is complex, and that just because someone's brain works very different doesn't make them crazy or something. Sorry you had/have to go through that, dude.
your a craz
ily nice person
You don't have to answer if this is rude or anything, but I've always wondered about if theres anything thatll seem fake about your hallucinations (like if a visual hallucination is blurry or if an audio hallucination is echoey) or if your brain ignores that stuff?
@@memelescream4796 as someone who has both hallucinated and heard many a testimony from people with schizophrenia, hallucinations seem very real and scary, the only clues you can get that they’re hallucinations is the fact that nobody else hears, sees, or remembers these things, and if you have a low self image or deteriorated mind set then you probably won’t notice if something you’re hallucinating is unrealistic (low self image because I’ve known a lot of people to hallucinate that their friends are insulting them)
@@octosimp1717 question, ive heard some people say that if someone suspects theyre hallucinating, they should take out their phone and try to record it to see if its real. would you say thats a good method? or do you believe it wouldnt work in most cases?
" *Hello friends* and fans"
There's no Rami Malek without "Hello friend"
Dead this comment is perfect
4 years later, and still no theory on Sam’s Towel, I mean c’mon??
It secretly was a synthetic fiber sauna towel with a very strong Velcro fastener made of recycled trash bags that was proofed.
Sam's towel is currently locked up in the SCP Foundation.
4 years later and this game is still one of my favorite horror games. Sam and Josh were my favorite characters of the bunch. All the others excluding Matt could've died and I wouldn't have cared. (Off-topic.... but isn't it crazy how much the logo has changed? Wow)
The true about the towel is that it was a hologram thus it defines all logic as it is just light.you are welcomed for thanking me for not making another simple filled video matpat (now you have to make good theory and not some filler)
We still never got that slender theory..
IT WAS JUST A PRANK, HAN!
Defenetly just a prank
Just a prank... that murdered her and turned her sister into a windigo
Lol
LOOK BRO THERE'S A CAMERA, IT'S JUST A PRANK
+Dawko *Getting attacked by wendigo" IT'S A PRANK, STOP, IT'S JUST A PRANK
I so wanted an Unitl Dawn 2 with Josh as the half wendigo. It would have been cool with you'd be able to save him, somehow.
I heard there was a AU or something based on that
@@errorbirdesther where?
@@kl-ni6fm can't remember where I found it
@@errorbirdestherI think it was called Exor!Josh au or something like that?
Josh was my favorite character in the game I’m sad he never got a happy ending I just want to give him a hug
I mean, not right now. He'd eat ur face. But, maybe if he wasn't a wendigo. 👍🏽
@@PxndaCakes yeAh but I have a helmet so I’ll be fine oh no I no longer have a helmet shig
Everyone: involved in a prank that kills two girls
Everyone: lol it’s fine it was just a prank
Josh:pranks the people who killed his sisters, pranks don’t cause anyone’s death
Everyone: JOSH IS THE CRAZY ONE HERE!
ok. but he purposely traumatized his friends. mental illness doesn't excuse actions.
One is manslaughter ( "accidentally killing someone" ) but the other is straight up psychological torture/ murder.
@@el9250 But, it kinda does in the case of Schizophrenia, as mistreatment can lead to horrific effect, and cause the inability to distinguish reality from delusion. Many people who suffer from the effects are paranoid, and attack or harm people for fear of their own safety, as they falsely believe that they're in danger. In this case, he was deluded that what he did was a harmless prank with no real problems, when clearly, it was not. In this case, if he were to have lived, the best thing to have done was to send him to get help, put him on rehabilitation, and then properly treat him. His pranks did lead to indirect deaths, but I don't know how direct you could call them. On the other hand, the others have no excuse for what they did. The death of two people, even by accident, would be counted as first degree manslaughter.
@@Endershock1678 Yes he did have that but that still doesn't excuse his actions. You could say he thought it was harmless but that does not change the fact that he probably gave at least 6 people varying levels of PTSD. Just because you are mentally ill doesn't mean that you are free from every wrong thing you've done. I do not think he is a particularly bad person, but I'm tired of people painting him as a hero when in reality he was a tragedy.
@@el9250 I'm not saying he's free, I'm just saying a lot of it can't be viewed in the same way. As I said earlier, he won't get away scott free, but he should be reformed and put in prohibition. The rest meanwhile don't deserve that luxuary. I don't think my issue with your comment was that you said he has blame (he does), but the comment gives the feeling of he is equal in blame to everyone else, which I don't think he is.
When Kylo Ren stabs his father: "IT WAS JUST A PRANK HAN!"
Lol
IT WAS JUST A PRANK HAN!
HAN PRANK A JUST WAS IT
omfg
Is it bad that I laughed?
But also in Josh's wikia, as well as somewhere in the game it's said that Josh's greatest fear is being absolutely alone. And when Hannah leaves him alive in the caves, he's left alone with absolutly nothing but a corpse and mental health issues, still suffering a lot. And in all of that, with the multiple spirits of Wendigos surrounding him, he went cannibalistic like his sister. And turned into a wendigo, which is sad because he can't be with his sisters in death until someone frees him
12:45 “The true monster is pyschological disorder. It strikes randomly, has no mercy and gives you no chance to escape. No chance to run and hide.”
damn.... that really hits different.
It does
Go watch his joker theories on film theory
There is a quote I think you will understand
Hmm, honestly my money is on the Wendigo's as the true monsters here.
@@talyn7448 the spirit of the wendigo at least
If you stretch it far enough, every villain has a psychological disorder to some degree
@@madensmith7014or just plain evil or psychopaths
Perfect description of Josh's schizophrenia. Until Dawn has one of the most beautiful depictions of untreated schizophrenia that I have ever seen in a video game. That said, nothing about what you said is a theory. The game makes it pretty clear that Josh has untreated schizophrenia if you pick up all the clues
Yeah i caught that in the first play-through
I actually looked it up and found nothing on the internet about it when it came out
Keifer Weiland Facts
As someone who is related to a person suffering from schizophrenia, I must say Until Dawn's depiction of it is quite accurate
Besides the scene where josh is tripping and seeing his sisters. What other times does it hint he has schizophrenia?
A fact. A GAME FACT!
Finally someone else feels the way I do about Until Dawn. I hated that you couldn't save Josh. There was always obviously something wrong with him. Josh's whole part in the storyline is sad. I always felt sad for his outcome, and the fact that his sisters death made it worse.
Also everyone else in the game is a bunch of douchebags. Except maybe Sam and Chris. Maybe.
You would get fucked up if your loved ones died
I feel so sorry for Josh because I have a cousin who has skiptofrinia.
Chianti Wilson
Amazon McLeod Why Do You Capitalize Every First Letter In Every Word.
Chianti Wilson I know they try shoving mike as the hero of the story when in reality he is the biggest asshole
You know, if you think about it, Chris is kind of innocent. He didn’t take part in the prank as he was seen passed out with Josh. Also, depending on your choices, I would argue that Chris is the nicest guy in the group
Chris and Sam are innocent, Chris was passed out and Sam was trying to warn Hannah about the prank
Josh was my favorite character from start to finish. he's charismatic, hilarious, great story arch, and just seems like a cool guy to hang with..
Yeah...?
#joshdeservedbetter
This is 2 years ago video! wtf!!!!!!!!
Rainbow Pepe I SAID #JOSHDESERVEDBETTER
WHO CARES!>???????????!!!
Rainbow Pepe better question is why do YOU care. Geez. Chill.
God Pepe and u still comment on it
As a Paranoid Schizophrenic- as I know to believe when on my medications- this made me cry. Finally, someone who understands that I’m not a psychopath at heart. Someone who finally understands the value of love and care. I’m so done with people telling me to rot in an Asylum and to be treated by doctors like Doctor Hill. Josh was the only true character who I understand. The hallucinations (Psychosis), the behavior that I never remember doing... all of it.
Thank you.
Hi, hope you're doing well. Just thought about you. Sending love xx
im so glad you found something to relate to. this game is genuinely amazing. i hope youve been doing well, i wish you all the best!!
Hey man we all have our demons I hope you see this, everything will be alright bro, be at peace with yourself
I hope you’re doing well!
Morgan Bathgate hope you’re doing good, you’re an awesome person with a big heart and an intelligent mind. People who don’t see that aren’t worth any of your time.
I've ALWAYS felt this way about Josh!! And the other characters are so incredibly quick to blame him but NO ONE talks about how responsible they are for the deaths of Hannah and Beth! I feel extremely bad for Josh... As a matter of fact, he's my favorite character.
Felt like you missed a bit with how Josh wanted some of the things he planned out to help get Chris and Ashley together.
Glad someone else noticed it! When Sam and Josh go down the basement, depanding on which option you choose, Josh will say somethinh like this: "They need some sort of traumatic experience to get together. ... "
Well I mean Chris was passed out drunk and Sam tried to stop it. They weren't really to blame for the prank.
yes they were it wasn't a prank it was hazing Hannah its so clear shes only friends with them cause of her brother and sister other then that they don't like her. plus how you tell an older brother we prank'd you sister and we lost them sorry
garnet terra actually, Sam is Hannah's best friend, says so in her description
I'm gonna throw something else into this. Mike and Jess, the two people most responsible for the prank, are sent to the guest cabin while the rest of this goes down. if not for the wendigos, those two would have spent a quiet night together while the rest were tortured.
Ree maybe he was trying to torture them but he couldnt find them because they left the cabin so early
WalkthroughHorde There is a theory Josh was trying to hook Chris up with Ashley, also Josh had no idea, he couldn't know who helped and who didn't, why would you say "I murdered your sisters" Sam probably would be linked to it no matter what, because she wasn't good enough to stop it anyway.
"Until dawn aint getting to me"
*JUMPSCARE*
*SHITS PANTS*
I think it got to him.
*****
im not sure :/
+CurriePlays It sure got to me
Scarycat
Before it happened, I accidentally scrolled down and missed it, but still heard it so i expected it.
+Blake Blast more like scaredymat
I also found it very interesting that everytime you "visit" the psychiatrist the atmosphere gets more threatening and darker. The doc also seams to get more aggressive and the building looks more and more broken.
Maybe Josh felt threatened when going to the doctor and feels unsafe when he is there. I know it's just a minor little detail but when the doctor asks you questions for example: "What are you more afraid of?" and you always answer with "Snakes", on your next visit there will be a snake in a glass on the table. Maybe Josh was trying to open up, but then was scared to get confronted by the doctor and felt helpless in his hands.
Also I noticed that it always feels like Dr. Hill ends the session in the middle of a question. It always made me feel like he wants to get rid of you as fast as possible.
I also think Josh particularly chose Chris and Ashley for his game to get them together. When Josh and Sam go down the basement, depanding on which option you choose, Josh says something like this, regarding Chris and Ashley: "Maybe they need some sort of traumatic experience to get together...."
As you said: He is delusional so maybe he truly thought to help Chris to get with Ashley.
What I also thought was kinda strange that Hannah, as Wendigo doesn't seam to be as beastly as the others. When Mike and Jess are in the cabin and well... starting to have a fun time we see that the Wendigo is watching them. It could easily break the window but it watches them. Also it places Jessica's phone right on the doorstep for her to come out. The Wendigo could easily kill Jessica and then go after Mike, but it just draggs her away. I'm not a 100% sure if it is really Hannah, but if it is her she might be jealous and wanted to get Jessica.But this "theory" kinda outplays itself when we clearly see that Hannah (as Wendigo) can crush Josh's head... So yeah
I just recently replayed the game and now I'm obsessed again. xD
The psychiatrist is Josh's externalized normality. He went to several different shrinks, last one genuinely tried to help him, but blabla misdiagnosis.
Then his sisters died and *Josh rejected what the Doc represented: Compassion, conformity, consequences.* He went YOLO in the worst way. Which you can see when his prank delusion collapses.
"They‘re 18 and 19 years old"
"Under the age of consent"
no dawg that’s not how that works
Exactly, that above the age of consent. Maybe his fake reactions messed up his judgment
Inconsistent Content I like your channel name
The living characters in the game are 18/19, but Josh's sisters were younger than him. Plus the prank that got the twins killed was the year before the game takes place, so the girls were only 16 or 17 years old when they died.
Sasha Denae the statement wasn‘t about them dying so that was entirely irrelevant I must say
@@HeroKings not the deaths themselves but the CAUSE of their deaths, the prank where one of the girls was tricked into stripping on camera and in front of all of her "friends" - at age 16 or 17. Sorry, I should've been more clear as to why I was referencing that scene.
Chris was unconscious as well, out cold with Josh.
+Hunter Plaskon And Sam wasn't in on the prank either. She comes in at the end. BUT none of the characters help Beth look for Hannah.
+Hunter Plaskon Sam didn't warn Hannah about the prank. Chris chooses to kill Josh, his best friend, just because he wants to bang Ashley.
+Eric Moreira not entirely. you can select save josh but either way josh rigged it so he'd 'die'.
Eric Moreira Actually Sam was on her way to stop it, it looks like. Also, you can choose to save Josh as Chris, but the saw blade always goes towards Josh, no matter your choice.
+Eric Moreira No I'm pretty sure Sam was trying to warn Hannah but couldn't find her in time
Emily: It was just a prank, Han.
Matt: **Doesn't grab Emily's hand** It was just a prank, Emily.
DEEP
SO DEEP
SO SO DEEP
Deeper than the Mariana Trench.
@@cionib17 deepthr...
I believe there's more to josh than being the villain here, imagine having friends, some known long enough to be considered family and because of them he lost two sisters in one night completely taking his quality of life away where he has to be medicated probably way more than before to just barely scrape the surface. What he did wasn't right and they weren't in the right either. He was ill and the trauma made it way worse and i feel so sorry for him because i can't imagine that feeling and i understand where he comes from but what he did to counter his feelings wasn't right and should've stayed on the medication, but overall he was never a bad character or villain. Trauma and him being ill as it is, he couldn't think for himself anymore
Rage pushing him on a warped path.
It's been six years. Did anyone finally tell this guy he's😮😢 completely wrong?
Play the game as an insane wendigo who made Hannah eat Beth then revealed himself as Josh before she died.
Yeah I'd say she's mad about more than the prank.
Fun Fact: This episode is the highest rated episode of Game Theory on IMDB with a 9.4/10 just beating “FNAF Sister Location DECODED” which has a 9.1/10
The bear trap trap was not for the teens, it was set by the flamethrower man, he set it for the wendigo
Hmmm ur pretty smart
@@has-pingu7862
It's not hard to guess that trap wasn't Josh's, so no not smart for just saying that.
@@frozenfoxgames5300 I thought it was smart
@@jazzyangelflower3344
You have your opinion and I have mine, so both get canceled out.
Who, Jack?
Hanna gets severely injured and beth dies
"ITS JUST A PRANK HAN"
Yay wendigo time
it was just a prank bro
Emily after humiliating hannah to her death: “It was just a prank, Han!”
Wendigo Hannah after Ripping Emily’s eyes out: “it was just a prank, em!”
ELITE SAVAGE I mean the prank wasn’t to have them walk out in the cold and fall off a cliff. Hannah overreacted and ran out which led to Beth following her
@@datboisus3981 I don't think she overreacted. She was in a state of shock and just wanted to be away from them and instead of giving her space they ran towards her laughing. No one but Beth cared enough about her feelings to try to go and make her feel better. Also them mocking her by saying she can't take a joke when they had intent to record her getting undressed to hook up with some guy. The prank was to make her feel bad and record her embarrassment. Her running away to a place that they couldn't embarrass her any further isn't over reacting
The prank they pulled on Hannah was especially cruel when you consider that she was the "shy girl" who was a bit sheltered, sensitive and very nervous. That trip to the cabin was the FIRST TIME she went out there! Imagine if you went to a high school party for the first time as a shy, socially-awkward bean and got ruthlessly mocked by someone you had a crush on, while everyone else laughed. That trip to the cabin was her first time coming out of her shell, and everyone knew that...
"It wAs jUSt a pRANk hAaAAaaAnnnN!"
I've always felt bad for Josh. It was obvious to me that he was mentally ill and he was already suffering from the loss of both his sisters, but apparently some folks missed this. I think it's easy to not take Josh's illness seriously because this game is so campy (in the best ways! Still a great game!), but it really can hit home when you look past the camp.
I don't believe his illness excuses his actions, but it definitely explains them and it's sad to imagine that he went undiagnosed. I wonder if his symptoms started to hit home right around the death of his sisters... That might have been so hard to catch, especially when you have a grieving family at the same time.
Welp, now that family has no children. I wonder if we could get an Until Dawn sequel starring Josh's parents in some way... Maybe they'd confront all of the kids that went to the cabin. I mean, seriously, TWICE they went to the cabin and got their kids killed. First the twins, then their surviving son. There is a lot of potential here... Especially if Josh remains alive as a wendigo.
I want a sequel we’re we get to return josh back to normal
(OBVIOUS SPOILER) ...
Did anyone else realized how the wendigo Hannah protects Mike many times? I bet yes, it's pretty damn obvious. I've thinking of that since the beginning of the game.
When Mike is going to the cabin with Jessica they are being followed by a wendigo, and that wendigo doesn't attack them (it just keep stalking through the woods). When they come to the cabin, the 'mysterious' wendigo is still stalking them, this time through the windows, so when Jessica asks Mike to close the window the mysterious (hannah) wendigo gets upset/jealous and throw Jessica's lost phone through another window to call their attention. Until that part, the wendigo is peacefully following them (because of Mike, of course??), but when Jessica screams that they'll have sex and all that crap, the wendigo gets mad, which can actually confirm that the wendigo is really Hannah, since she was in a platonic love with Mike all the time. The wendigo hannah gets Jessica and leave her to the mines, but doesn't kill her (!), another point that confirms that the wendigo is hannah. Wendigos have a uncontrollable desire for human meat but that one keep Jessica alive, meaning that the wendigo Hannah doesn't have enough courage to kill her friend. Another time is when Mike finds Josh in the mines and they are trying to return from it, then they go through the water and the wendigo Hannah gets Mike first, but let him out, then gets Josh and bring him back. And finally, when everyone returns to Josh's house, many wendigos are inside of it trying to kill them all, but the wendigo Hannah is trying to protect them (especially Mike, again). If you choose to make Mike the last one alive, there'll be a scene when the wendigo Hannah sees him and try to approach, that time Mike blows everything, and in a couple frames you can see a sad/surprised/disappointed face on the wendigo Hannah that was trying to touch Mike. Man that's just sick, disturbing!
+Gabriel Azevedo Your theory is pretty believable but I found a flaw. Fail too many QTE's and take all of the long routes around when chasing the Wendigo that grabbed Jessica and you'll find her with her jaw ripped off.
Theshadow34 All right I didn't know that Jessica could die that part. But anyway, how about the other ones? When Mike got drowned by the Hannan wendigo and when Hannan wendigo attacks the other wendigo to prevent it to killing Mike? I think the game is trying to show this for us by these scenes, how Hanna is suffering and how she can recognize him and still she will try to reach him (at the last part in Josh's house) (which I found very sad/disturbing).
I just pointed out that Hannah Wendigo could kill her "friends". Your theory however is possible due to how near the final part of the game, Mike goes underwater while traveling with Josh and boom Hannah Wendigo pops up and, depending on how the game played out, kills or drags Josh away, leaving Mike alive.
Yeah that part nearly confirmed that this theory is true. This game has many hidden messages tho
hey now I figured out THIS IS TOTALLY TRUE! OOMG lool
Really dude, just get a job as a profiler for the FBI
lol
but that's just a theory....
+Taz Olson A GOVERNMENT THEORY
+JustinTheGamer so... just everything the Government says in general?
and you know what that means.........Blame the islams
The og theme never gets old.
I think Dr. Hill was actually good. In most of Josh's hallucinated therapy sessions, Hill came through to me as the "voice of sanity" in Josh's psyche, telling him he need to stop because the prank bad for him. Also, he got more and more injured as Josh deteriorated into madness
If only he is smart enough to treat his medication right.
I think that was what Josh believed Dr. Hill to be-I mean, that is what a psychiatrist should be-and yet it doesn't change the fact that he had made such a crucial error in Josh's diagnosis and left him untreated for almost 10 years.
I think the hallucination version of Dr Hill was good, and indeed Josh's voice of reason. The real Dr Hill who we never meet was clearly a bad psychiatrist.
He always felt way too hostile to me tbh
As someone who takes both antidepressants and antipsychotics let me just say that antidepressants can aggravate schizotypal symptoms if they aren't being countered by an appropriate dose of antipsychotics so not only was Josh being treated for an illness he didn't have, the one he did have was being worsened by the wrong treatment
Same
Jaelene nice nico avatar
Mind. Blown.
Game theory made a CinemaSins reference.
My life is now complete.
lol wut about 50 shades eppisode
He did that multiple times.
One that sticks out is when princess peach kisses Mario on his nose, he used the "this scene does not contain a lap dance" reference
CinemaSins is the definition of cancer.
+OrangeBurrito You did NOT just say that.
***** I did.
So what?
(btw sorry for making you scroll down forever)
Thank you for covering and speaking on his behalf! I've loved this character so much, it made me so upset when I found out no matter what choice was made that he'll always wind up dead or undead. It's nice to hear someone speak kindly of him instead of berating him for his "childish revenge".
12:53
Honestly this is a really sad truth, like... The system isn't good enough at the minute, people aren't getting the help they need (some are and to them I'm happy for) but some people just aren't
I really like this analysis, but I'd have to disagree. The true TRUE hero is clearly flamethrower guy
The flamethrower guy is the writer of the game.. He has also directed a movie called The Wendigo.. He died in the game because of Chris.. During the scene, Chris comes in between him and Hannah.. So he stops the flames allowing Hannah to get the upper hand..
Really? Kind of feel the opposite. He saw the two fall down into the mines and never went down to check and see if they survived. He couldn't have been afraid to go down there as he saved Emily down in the mines a year later, when there was actually a windego threat (the girl he DIDN'T save a year ago). I'd assume he had the miners all locked up by then as he only mentions going after one of them that had eluded him in that tape. He kills it and then. . . leaves?.
@@kittymagica6408 He probably thought that Hannah and Beth died in the fall, Hannah was extremely lucky/unlucky to survive the fall
@@jsjeshwjufuwugduwudwie2052 Assuming that is the case, he should still have reported it, to the local police. Even if he is a wanted man, what can they do to arrest him for murder without any evidence?
Now assuming he would have been arrested .In this case, he should have a left a note in the nearby police station. is that really hard. He is usually seen hanging around cable car situation without any reason than to stalk the teens. He should instead have used the stealthiness to good use and reported the case through some sort of message to the local authorities .
Nah he is, in fact, the villain. he could have clearly avoided this entire fiasco.
Chris never did anything wrong; he was blackout drunk along with Josh. He never contributed to Hannah/Beth ultimate death.
Which is crazy because Josh fucks with him and Ashley the most with his "pranks" while the others are actually being terrorized by the wendigos. Makes Josh seem more like a douche for messing with his only one true friend who didn't even take part in the prank...
I luv Chris shsjskkakakak
Yami Wolf just theorizing but I think that was Josh's messed up way of trying to help Chris. When they first meet up at the cabin Josh tells Chris to act on his feelings for Ashley and make a move already; when Sam is helping Josh with the boiler he flat out says he thinks a tragic/traumatic event would be needed to bring Chris and Ashley together. Since he doesn’t intend to kill or seriously injure anyone, and he thinks his psycho games are ultimately just a prank, he uses his plans to give Chris chances to look good/prove his love for Ashley. He goes too far of course, but with his condition he couldn’t really see that.
WarriorAuranae yeah i noticed that too, after the comment about chris not making a move without a gun to his head and then acting out the scenario literally djwjd, wingman of the century
Josh chose his friends that could ''laugh off the prank''. He purposefully chose the people closest to him because he thought they would forgive him (easily) for the little prank he made for them. also yes Josh is wingmanning for Chris. they just need a life-death situation that brings them together.
me: **sees fluoxetine**
also me : *"haha i take that"*
Josh didn't try to harm anyone but indirectly did effect them. Josh isn't a bad guy. He actually one of my most favourite characters in the game. I rlly hate it when ppl give Josh a bad name without understanding the full context of the story.
Uh.
Yes he did.
His callousness can't be disregarded. He was 'giving his friends a taste of their own medicine' from his own warped perpsective, but he was _not_ harmless or blameless.
I never got Jess in her underwear because I was gentleman and she shared her insecurities with me. Chivalry my friends.
How do you get that? I would much rather have that.
Green Storm I accidently skipped two instances of conversation with her, I didn't take a picture with her and I didn't talk to her about the fight with Emily. (From what I learned, though, is that if you just mess up in two conversations with her by saying something she doesn't agree with also works e.g. scaring her with the gun or mask, or asking her to lay off of Emily, etc.) Then when you (Mike) light the fire and turn on the lights she'll be reluctant saying something about wishing they had booze. Then she'll say you're different then what she thought. She'll then say that she feels like she's being watched and asks if you could close the shutters. Afterward she'll say she can't keep up the façade anymore and that she is actually insecure. As long as you aren't a dick to her (by choosing the "seduce" option and then the "sounds complicated" option) she will wind up in just a t-shirt and jeans and instead of the butterfly effect "Jess was a pushover!" you'll get "Jess resisted Mike's advances." Also, just so you know, if you *are* a dick to her she will not take *any* of her clothes off and... calls you a dick.
Thanks.
Now she won't be barren and freezing during the last bits.
Boom, Butterfly Effect
I'm here after Rami Malek won his well-deserved Oscar
Potage Potage glad i’m not the only one
One thing which I also like to say is that you are also the villan in this story I’m some ways. You can make them do the horrible actions and get them killed. You are the one who is causing them to live or die either purposely or by doing mistakes. Heck you can even do stuff like improve Emily’s relationship with Matt by doing certain choices, you are the one deciding the character’s fates
Josh is the only one who dies by the game itself
Well Sam AKA Kirby is the only person who wasn’t in on the prank and she was looking for Hannah
I KNEW I LIKED JOSH FOR A GOOD REASON
:^>
I still think he's a creepy killer... #neverforgivejosh
I still think he's a creepy killer... #neverforgivejosh
Ok
Ok
Can I just mention that any horror game with the suggestion to NOT MOVE is almost as cool as one telling you to not make a sound when you're wearing a headset because then that means even the slightest movement will kill you and this is a realistic thing. if a monster or even animal that bases it's hunting skills from movement senses you moving, you are dead and to think people are criticizing this mechanic is kind of sad because this is probably as close to said "Don't make a sound" mechanic we'll ever get and it's also very realistic because if you are scared and holding a controller, there's a good chance you'll be shaking so this tests your ability of willpower at the same time....
continue on.
True.
Hell, I don't even think I'd survive in their situation. I probably would have.lots of sudden movement.
true, but I think the complaints come from the mechanic not always working properly. It's a great idea that just needed to be fine tuned a bit more
Ace19444 It actually does work properly, but most people don't know how it works. Here's what happens: If the don't move segment is really long, like at the end of the game with Sam, then the little blue shape will slowly move toward the white edge on its own and you have to slightly move the controller in the opposite direction to keep it inside. I know that sounds dumb but it's the only way to make sure people don't cheat by putting the controller on the ground.
+Faizaan lastname How could you cheat by putting the remote on the ground? It vibrates too so it would move. It can't stay still unless you hold it.
I come here after playing The Quarry. I miss this game and the characters sm.
Still waiting a theory about Sam’s towel.
I need a remastered version within the next 5 years, with josh getting a happy ending
And by happy ending I mean josh confessing his feelings to Sam (come on guys we all know this ship’s a thing) and then being arrested, going to jail or a mental asylum. The end :))
ANGSTY TEEN yeah but I think they would accept everything except for the Josh and Sam part.
Conner RK800 duuuudddeeee im literally playing Detroit become human right now 😂😂
ANGSTY TEEN here's a tip if you want Todd to die then get the gun and going to Alice's room.
Also if you just wait downstairs what Alice gets her butt whooped then she will die
hey matpat, this video is suuuper old, but i guess i never got around to seeing it. from the point of someone who suffers from abulatory schizophrenia, the way you put my mental illness made me really happy. most schizophrenics like me are seen as monsters and crazy killers. im literally just a 17 year old kid on a ton of meds, that's all!! i do have delutions and episodes where i simply can't function, but i would never be lead to hurt anyone. this video is amazing! thanks for not showing the holywood version of something that affects my life everyday.
Thanks for sharing your story. Hope you're still doing well!
Hey, wanna hear what else MatPat here said? He says that having mental illness excuses you from the crime of psychologically torturing teens! Ain't that wonderful?
@@NeroCM You're part of the problem. People like you, who neither listen to others nor care about people in difficulties.
@@Contevent if you consider helding people accountable for their actions a problem, then I'm glad to be a part of it.
@@NeroCM You just said to a real person, with real struggles, that he could become like a character who tortured his friends. You insulted a 17 years old based on his mental state, and you still think you're one of the good guys?
That’s what was the most haunting thing about this game for me, that Josh can never have a happy ending.
Just wanted to say that it is also possible Josh could've had a little known mental health disorder know as Schizoaffective Disorder.
Schizoaffective Disorder is a combination of both Schizophrenic symptoms and symptoms of a Mood Disorder like Depression or Bipolar Depression. However if this is the case, MatPat is still technically right about how Josh's doctors are failing him. For treatment of Schizoaffective Disorder to be effective both the Schizophrenic and the Mood Disorder symptoms need to be addressed with the proper medications and therapy for both of these disorders.
By only medicating Josh for Depression and not his Schizophrenic symptoms and not addressing Josh's Schizophrenic symptoms while he's in therapy his doctors all failed him.
I think it’s something different from this and it may be PTSD and Psychosis. If you look both of them up it seems to be close to how Josh acts. His trauma could have formed these and made him act irrationally. But the only thing is he might have another disorder at a younger age that already affected him or he suffered trauma in his childhood and this was the thing that pushed him over
I think the bear trap the caught Mike wasn't a trap set by the psycho (aka Josh) but instead a trap set by the flamethrower guy to catch a Wendigo. It said in his journal that he would set traps in the mountains with human limbs (which he said were not needed anymore by the dead corpses in the mourge) to catch the Wendigo monsters so he wouldn't have to kill them and set their spirits free to possess another victim.
How exactly did they possess another victim? I know that was stated in the game but we never saw it happen.
According to the lore of the game there are only a set amount of Wendigo 'allowed.' As long as no one else takes up cannibalism on the mountain then it would all be fine, but as seen in the Josh lives ending Josh has become possessed and it implies he killed the police in the mines, so the problem is going to start right back up again with no Flamethrower Guy to contain them.
And it's implied that after he killed the Alpha Wendigo that it then possessed Hannah when she ate Beth.
That's why he locked them up rather than killed them the majority of the time.
Smart
@@cartergirl3of3 According to the flamethrower guy's diary the spirit(curse)of the wendigo was first unleashed when the miners came to mine the mountain,when those 30 miners got trapped and 12-15 of them eventually escaped they were already possessed because hunger and desperation drove them to cannibalism.When these 12-15 miners went to the sanatorium they were already on the changing phase,that's why the doctor there locked them up and wanted to study them,eventually those miners escaped from their cells and killed all the others except the doctor who commited suicide(kinda).ALTHOUGH there is something that most of you forget.If you see the ''events of the past'' video,the flamethrower dude speaks off that the original wendigo spirit called ''makkapitew'' existed all along and he finally killed it the night hannah and beth died(from the looks of it i believe he possessed one of the tribe member that existed even before the miners went to the mountain so it was centuries old).In conclusion the curse of the wendigo was on the mountain all along,the miners triggered it and continued to exist even after the events of until dawn(well possibly,it depends if josh survives or not)
@@perfection2781 thanks for the lore I need that
This is in my opinion probably the most plausible theory yet.
its possible but is it plausible
do u mean pause able or possible?
josh having mental issues was supposed to be obvious. there is no "theory" here.
and you should try googling before asking ignorant questions.
josh has always been my favorite character, he commits unforgiveable actions, but he needs help more than anything
Schizophrenia is one of the hardest mental disorders to diagnose because of how the diagnosis path treats it. The Rorschach test was one of the most effective ways to reach a diagnosis of schizophrenia but it fell out of practice due it being so prevalent in media.
Josh is actually my favourite character, second favourite is Sam
AnnaWonderland same
Holy crap me too
He's up there for me too. Right next to Sam and Chris.
AnnaWonderland mine is wolfie.
josh is my fourth favirote cause you can't forget about Ashley and Chris
I don't really agree that all of the teenagers were 'evil' or actively murderous (with the exception of Ashley, who I kinda think was just sorta dazed by the whole situation and wasn't actively motivated to do anything because of the lack of Chris' affection, but I'm getting off track)
1. Chris was not a part of the original prank, along with Sam, who knew about it but didn't stop her in time.
2. When given the option to shoot Ashley or himself, Chris points at himself first, and Ashley says "Please, if there's one last thing I can do in my life let me do this!" (Following which she doesn't open the door if you do so lol. #AshleyLogic)
3. Matt, when you say he 'abandons' Emily, he doesn't really. If you hear the dialogue, he was simply trying to find another way to get to Emily (Who btw could have easily jumped off herself), and is actively concerned for her after the fact.
4. Mike believed that Emily was going to turn into a Wendigo, maybe not based off of much, but that was highly influenced by adrenaline.
Purely opinion on my part. Argue with me if you wish.
completely agree, he doesn't realize that all of these were based on flaws and survival instincts of the characters.
Would like to add that all of them were very sorry for what happen and did care about Josh, as Mat said himself, so to say these aren't good people is a huge fallacy IMO. Also to say Dr. Hill (the real one) is the real villain because he didn't properly diagnose Josh is a stretch. Dr. Hill could of cared alot, perhaps Josh didn't display the symptoms of schizophrenia while under Dr Hills care. I think Mat put to much of his own bias in this theroy and I think it's the weakest of his theories. That's my two cents.
+Peace Walker he's too black and white, but reality is that everyone has flaws.
+TheChriskilla100 Or maybe he's focusing on it to make people think in a way he deems more to his style. Propaganda has many forms...
+Peace Walker I mean, Matt does end his videos with "That's just a theory." It's not like he's calling these facts of life or anything crazy like that. He puts his opinion out there and for the most part they are usually unique underlying messages that he seems to extract out of all these games. Is he wrong sometimes, sure, but like I said before, "That's juts a theory, a game theory" pretty much tells you as the viewer that this is his own thoughts and findings.
Basically what I'm trying to say is that, in my opinion, he doesn't need to change anything. Does he make stretches to fit his own idea's and bias sometimes, sure, but for the scope of these videos I believe that is 100% fine.
“Until dawn ain’t getting to me.”
...let’s put that on the ‘famous last words’ board.
Some of my family is schizophrenic (one is severely) and just watching the gameplay hurts watching josh because it makes me think that this is what sometimes goes through my families MINDS. I seriously have sympathy for josh...
Just want to point out that the bear trap was not Josh's prank.
Andy Gong yes, it was actually set up by the hunter to lure wendigos and imobilize them
Too bad it lured in Mike..
sabinlord I never knew
Andy Gong It didn't lure him in my playtrough cuz u can clearly see that it's a fcking trap...movin' hand? really?
Andy Gong It was a trap, set by the flamethrower guy.
The ending to this video actually made me tear up a bit.
My brother passed away April 22nd, 2014. From a unique seizure that caused him not to be in his right mind and caused an accidental unaware suicide.
But prior to it all, he had passed out in the bathroom roughing up his face pretty bad on the floor vent.
After seeing a doctor and being told everything was fine, the next day he went to work and crashed his car through a metal rail and landed in an embankment. Nobody was hurt, however he had some bruises and the car was ruined.
But again... he was given the all clear sign from doctors.
And the next day at work he passed out and was rushed to a hospital by ambulance.
And of course... no help was given. The next day would be his last. It all struck so suddenly, and he was vigilant about trying to get help. And he was scared. And nobody did anything for him... he didn't get a choice.
I miss him so damn much it hurts. After he passed I met 3 females with the exact same type of seizures. Who were getting sufficient care. I took it as a sign, and have been currently trying to start a charity in his name for that specific type of seizure.
Anyway, this video was really REALLY great. Not only did I love the game, but this theory really shines a great message on the villain of mental illness and other issues in the like. Thanks Mattpatt!
We know what it chronic lyme disease ur not alone wake up research and avenge ur brother our govt made this monster even stronger and condolences
dude I'm sorry to hear about your brother. definitely raise awareness for those seizures. I hope you are able to.
I'm sorry man.
Alphayak Thank you so much.
Crystal The Blaziken I really appreciate it, thank you.
I think the reason Josh isn’t redeemable is that he tortured Chris, who had nothing to do with the prank.
He deserved better.
He was always my favorite character, and the reason i fell in love with Rami.
Josh. Deserved. Better.
I think it's also worth mentioning that the Wendigo is symbolic of Josh's inability to escape his disorder. Josh is killed directly by a monster that is born from desperation. The Wendigo was unleashed when humans were forced to eat their fellow humans because they had no other options. Josh was forced to endure the results of misguided medication. I think that makes this story all the more interesting.
josh was killed by his own wendigo sister
@@arielx60Or baptized as a fellow Wendigo.
Okay just to be clear, Sam and Chris had NOTHING to do with the prank. Sam refused and Chris was passed out
Syrus Angi and yet he gave them the hardest time
Syrus Angi josh was passed out, not chris
Keithixix 197
They where both passed out.
Gaming Frenzy Chris and Josh were both passed out, Chris was Josh’s best friend, Sam was Hannah’s best friend and she went to go look for Hannah instead of participate in the prank
As he said, Josh was delusional. If he can blame himself for his sister's deaths, he could think anybody else was responsible too.
“He tortured his friends and yes, that’s really bad”
*Spoiler alert*
His friends got both of his sisters killed...
It's still really bad to torture them. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Not all of them.
Yes because the big spoiler in that message is the thing that happens in the prologue and not the thing that happened much later in the story
Hmm, think thats supposed to be in reverse
It was never intended for them to die it was a stupid prank and they all obviously felt guilty, also Chris was never apart of the prank
@styletheory still waiting on that "Sam's towel theory"
"Until Dawn ain't getting to me"
-Famous last words
"It was just a prank, Han!"
- Famous Last Words
+Shae Shae "It's just a prank, bro" famous last words
"turn off your Xbox" - famous last words.
not the bee's-famous last words
"i think im good"- famous last words
I like sam and chris.And i also feel sorry for josh.He doesnt deserve this at all.
also kinda like Jess.
fewpolecat93- jay I know it's your opinion but no because I mean because of his "friends" he lost his sisters he pranked them just to scare them they deserved it Josh didn't he was mental he couldn't save his sisters I mean think about it but eh
fewpolecat93- jay only because she STABBED him
lilysworld25 What ?
+lilysworld25 By that logic, you yourself cannot be old enough to watch the contents of this game. After all, you did not utilize capital letters for your username. An older individual would know to always capitalize any written name. That must be correct, because the statistic "Most people do not utilize capitals or proper grammar, spelling, and punctuation outside informal settings," is definitely not true. You also judged a random person on the internet that you do not know in a way you could not possibly deduce, especially in relation to something the majority of the civilized world above the age of 18 falls victim to. Also, when quoting a word someone else stated such as 'and', you put quotation marks (") around it. When just saying a specific word or letter, you put apostrophes around it, such as the letter 'A'. Additionally, you should have used the word 'those' instead of 'that' in your final sentence because you are referring to a plural, you shouldn't have utilized the word 'this' in the final sentence because it's redundant, and you can, in fact, start a sentence with the word 'and' if it brings an additional topic into whatever discussion or text-based setting you are engaging in, so long as it relates to the previous point. And you forgot to put a comma after "First of all", because that is not part of the idea and is added on for emphasis or transition.
Edit: Oh, and your first comment, "I feel sad that you watched this but you don't even go or listen to school," should be rewritten to "I felt sad reading about the original poster having watched this video whilst they don't even attend school or try to be educated." You are talking about a past thought that you had and you also said that a person must "listen to school", which they cannot do unless the school medium is purely auditory, and even then that is not listening to school, but listening to a lecture or some other word for auditory transmittance of ideals specific to a school setting. The only way a person can "listen to school" would be to sit outside or around a school and listening to the ambient sounds of the grounds or constructs within, which do not provide or boost an individual's already existing education.
I loved Josh, learning more and more about him through the game made my heart break for him seeing how his story ended 💔
I don't know why but this video is to me my favorite yet. I always come back to this one just because of how much it intrigued me
Maybe Josh goes after Chris a lot because he feels he betrayed him most cause they were both passed out but Josh didn't know that. They were best friends and he thinks he contributed to his sisters death. For Sam, he also doesn't know she didn't contribute. It's kind of obvious that Josh liked Sam so he feels she also betrayed him more than the others... He's closest to them and even though they're the two good characters, they "betrayed" him the most.
Edit: If you're someone who thinks Josh doesn't like Sam, then another addition to my comment is this: Sam and Hannah were best friends. So Josh may also of gone after her FOR his sister.
Haylei chocolateraisinlookinass
yeah I agree but at the end credits she stated that after Hannah's and Beth's disappearance he'd only talk to Sam, And said they had a connection. She probably would've told him what happen. That's why he didn't put her apart of his games. He only chased her, and tied her up in a completely separate room.
Haylei chocolateraisinlookinass
yeah I agree but at the end credits she stated that after Hannah's and Beth's disappearance he'd only talk to Sam, And said they had a connection. She probably would've told him what happen. That's why he didn't put her apart of his games. He only chased her, and tied her up in a completely separate room.
He must've known that Chris was passed out because they had video footage of the prank. I'm thinking either it was Chris's idea to get that drunk that Josh passed out or Josh is just trying to get Ashley to see how much Chris cares about her that he'd die to save her.
Rachel Blossom Queen Katara Very true! I didn't think of that XD
Haylei chocolateraisinlookinass Maybe Josh was just trying to create a bonding experience for Chris and Ashley. Hero wingman.
“The village bicycle were everyone gets his ride”
I CANT BREATHE
LMAO
Who cares if its a common expression? People aren't allowed to laugh?
THE1NONLY1 it's still funny
I feel like him being worried and confused when he hears Jessica is dead adds to the fact he’s not entirely lost or psychotic at all
the fact that matt gave a better description and look on schitzophrenia that actual medical shows is amazing
It was really sad to see majority of players hate Josh throughout the entire game. I can understand towards the beginning, but it’s even sadder when people still hate him after discovering his mental illness. The poor guy truly can’t help it. Like Matt said, the best decision you can make is to forgive Josh.
j h
I'm sorry, but I disagree. I have mental illnesses, but it's not an excuse for being an asshole. I don't hate Josh, but he's still responsible for his actions and his irresponsibility and sadism, both characteristics which make me dislike him.
I don't really hate him, because I thought it was just because of his sisters that's why he did those things, and he also didn't have any connections with the wendigos. And also the fact that it's Rami Malek, I can't hate him.
Red Firefly
oh, so you're schizophrenic and recently stopped taking your meds? Because that's what Josh is.
If you really had a mental illness you'd realise they're not really similar to each other, and that the withdrawal from your meds can throw you through one hell of a god damn loop.
And if you want to talk about responsibility for our actions; He didn't kill anyone. He was never going to. Sure it's fucked up to put your "friends" through psychological torture but that's exactly what those "friends" did to his sister.
He might not be the "good guy" but he's definitely not the "bad guy"
It's a gross exaggeration to refer to the other characters' mean joke as "torture." Am I excusing the fact that they did it? No. But it's just the kind of mean-spirited, dumb, poorly planned stuff that vapid teenagers do. It did result in death, but that wasn't the intended outcome, nor was it something I imagine they could possibly have foreseen happening. It's funny, though, that you choose to ignore that and instead emphasize how *Josh* didn't meant for anyone to die.
What Josh ultimately set out to do, though, was nothing short of monstrous. And medication withdrawal does not even begin to justify an extremely involved, premeditated plan to horrifically traumatize people. Schizophrenia does not justify cruelty. Nothing justifies that level of inhumane behavior. He's just a sadist, which is why he chose to punish people who weren't even involved in the prank. The added factor of his mental illness makes him pitiable, sure, but it's not what makes him so depraved.
Part-Time Party Time Sure withdrawal is painful. Sure my mental illness isn't as bad as his. Sure being given the wrong medication does suck. But you're still responsible for your own actions. If you keep experiencing mental illness, shouldn't you try seeing another professional or communicate to them how badly the treatment is going? Josh comes from a very rich family, so surely all this is within his means. However he instead chooses to create an extremely expensive and sadistically torture arena for his former friends.
Furthermore, even though he didn't kill anyone, the stress he put his friends through could have resulted in a panic attack or worse. It will certainly leave them with emotional scars. To conclude, Josh is an interesting and well written character, but still a bad guy for what he did.
The weirdest part about Josh's plan was his attacks on Chris, who was also passed out next to him during the opening of the game. Many of Josh's traps revolve around forcing Chris to choose between life and death. The best explanation for this is that Josh blames Chris just as much as he blames himself for not being their to protect his sisters. Josh uses Chris as a representation/proxy of himself. Thus he forces Chris to make the choices he couldn't the year before.
+Matthew Donahue That's interesting,I actually never thought about this.Someone mentioned it in a comment above,but I also think that Josh did that stuff to Chris because of his paranoia and because he thought it would bring Ashley and Chris together (at the beginning of the game when talking to Sam,he says that they need a traumatic experience to bring them together).Well,he is delusional,after all.
But your interpretation,with him having to make choices he couldn't the year before sounds logical.That could actually be it!
+Lara Machi thank you for your reply and the additional information. I hadn't remembered Josh's comment about a traumatic event.
+Matthew Donahue There's another idea that's been tossed around. Josh's main delusion of excuse for his return pranks is that it'll make them all famous online. He was filming the whole thing... now keep in mind Josh and Chris are definitely best friends and have been since they were in elementary school. Yes he puts Chris through hell, but in his mind? He's putting him in the SPOTLIGHT. He is making Chris the hero of this terrible event that he is orchestrating. Again, to try to push him and Ashley together.
+Jessica Carter that does make alot of sense in regards to how he communicates with the others. And you do get the feeling Chris is the protagonist during the psycho killer attacks.
+Jessica Carter Wow,this makes a lot of sense,I never ever thought of this!
I have Bipolar/Schizoaffective Disorder. It's nice to see some good coverage of these types of illnesses. Psychosis is a really bizarre and isolating experience. With the right help, you can live a normal life. Since diagnosis (a couple years ago), I've come so far, gotten a diploma in software development and built up a strong social support network.
Medication and treatment are so important in helping to mitigate these issues. Society tends to demonize our conditions, but it is mostly out of ignorance.
For anyone suffering out there with ANY mental health problems, from depression to schizophrenia, please; reach out. There are so many people who want to help you. And your life will get better. You can go on to do great things!
Mat we're STILL WAITING on the Sam's towel theory