Anvil 088: Shotgun Rib Soldering
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- čas přidán 25. 08. 2024
- Hosed side by side barrels caused by hot dip bluing, and other circumstances. BOTH ribs prepped and re-soldered
Remember, what we show here is what you need to go learn, not a tutorial. If you do not posses the skills to perform at this level, do NOT attempt.
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Amateur hour here for sure. I worked on more weapons with the military than I care to remember. This included building custom one of kind pistols for retiring flag officers. I made more pistols and rifles than I care to even think of. But I made the barrels and I have a gun drill. What a mess but thats what happens in back yard workshops.
Then the whole room clapped.
@@marknovak8255 Really generous and charitable for you to try to work with the disabled like this.
Where’s your video? Before and after pictures?
Talk is real cheap.
Pray tell oh learned one, what is the name of your channel? You don’t have time for such nonsense? Pictures of your accomplishments, if not, then show your majesty.
51 minute rabbit hole with Mark. It's going to be a relaxing evening.
Seriously I love watching Mark work. He reminds me of my old wood shop teacher who used to let us cast molten lead chess pieces. He was the first shop teacher that treated us like adults so I loved his class
Watching Mark work is the best thing to relieve stress and lower high blood pressure
Definitely brings peace to my evening when I see his vids pop up.
😅
@@samuel88andrews you 800 sexy see I u 800 0 x. X dvd
The difference between a good craftsman and a bad one is not that the good one never makes a mistake. It's that he/she doesn't let that mistake make it to the customer so if one happens, analyze, correct and finish the job successfully. You are a great teacher Mark....anyone lucky enough to apprentice under you is a fortunate person. Great video and entertaining as always. Thanks!
I'm totally with you on the acid core solder. It may have worked 50 years ago on automotive radiators, (I'm in the vintage auto restoration business) but there's no place for ACID anywhere near a firearm! Great video, as always, Mark! Thanks!
ETA: I sometimes am called upon to solder "difficult" antique items at work, and have found that Eastwood's "Tinning Butter" has been a life saver for me. No substitute for cleanliness, but it does work miracles when properly used!
Just ordered a pound of the stuff. Thanks for the tip, I'm still using the stained glass window supply chain
@@marknovak8255 I'd be interested in your experience with, and opinion of, the Tinning Butter.
Wilco, will let everyone know
Reminded me of a sign I saw in an old gunsmith’s shop 30 years ago.
Gunsmith services. $10 / hour
If you watch. $20 / hour
If you help. $50 / hour
If you worked on it first. $100 / hour
Add a zero.......inflation you know!
Nice to see that type of channel was still around. I used to watch one very good gunsmith channel, but this gunsmith stopped doing videos about gun repairs and the sad part all his videos he did were removed. Gun repairs and gun smithing is a noble trade, and even for a machinist I learned a few tricks that could be used for jiggs on milling and lathe turning conventional oreven CNC. I'm sure that I will learn more tip that can be use in my trade. And it's by keeping an open mind you learn new trick everyday. finding your channel made my day, great job.
Great to have you aboard. Please help spread the word.....
Thanks for the video, Mark. Not exactly the same, but I just soldered the vented rib back onto my Mossberg 5500 with the help of this video. Never soldered before and the joint came out great, the sharpie tip really helped out. Just had to touch up the bluing that got ruined in the process with some cold blue. Couldn't get an exact color match, but doesn't really stand out from the rest of the wear and tear on the finish. All said and done, I'm in the project for about $80 to do something the local gunsmiths were quoting me at least a few hundred to do (more than the value of the shotgun).
I've watched a gunsmith do this before. It was a lot smokier than the way it was done here. I think he had used a different solder and an oxy acetylene torch. Thanks for doing it on the Anvil Mark. I know it's a big job and no easier recording it. Thanks
I don't think he would have been using an oxy acetylene torch.. too hot and too concentrated for this type of work, even with a rich mix.. possibly an air - propane, but usually a normal propane torch is what is used.. You can use stick tinman solder and rosin flux. In the UK traditional gun trade they used ground up rosin powder..
you are right Mark, all the credentials in the world means nothing if you don't have the know how. I have been a professional transmission rebuilder for 40 years, just retired. I have never been to a school in my life. I don't have to brag my work speaks for itself, love your videos, i am a back yard gunsmith also, ha ha,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
If you can rebuild a hydraulic computer....I mean a "transmission"....you can probably make it in the gun world....just sayin..
Wow. Someone who knows how to solder! I salute you, sir!
Definitely an art to doing that.
Burning a Fossil Fuel produces water vapor. We all know what water vapor does to metal while heat is a catalyst. I really enjoyed watching, listening and learning. But we truly learn by doing. As an auto ASE Master Tech since 1978, I was tickled by a comment you made. As an apprentice in a two man shop, the owner taught me invaluable skills and lessons. He had a double off-set u-joint on a drive shaft that needed shortened. In the city we where told by the owner that he would do it, but said he had never made a mistake. My boss, like right at him, picked up the driveshaft and turned to walk out. The machine shop owner yelled something, my boss turn around and said “If you have made a mistake, you have never done anything”. He softly told me, “Or he’s lying... Either way, he not working on this”.
RIP Mr. Whitcomb. Great video, I truly did enjoy the content!
"We're all allowed to hunt over here so that's pretty cool". Haha damn right, tell em Mark! Great video!
"gunsmithing is an event driven process not a time driven process" pure gold advice there
It's good to finally know how to solder together a couple of shotgun barrels.
It's good to know that I should never try, as well.
I worked with both Navy and Air Force vets and they were talking about their abilities and experiences over their careers and how it was dealing with a problems while flying and in the middle of the ocean. While discussing a ground based problem they got into a boisterous discussion on how to best deal with a problem they both shared and the correct way to do it. It finally boiled down to the Air Force guy stating that "my way is best and I have 20 years experience!". The Navy guy said" no, you have 1 years experience 20 times!". I still remember how this stopped the discussion cold and how the room laughed. I state this with apologies to all the guys who have had to make critical decisions on the with only the information and experiences that have touched them up to that point in their life. Mark you are a true craft person and what you show is pure gold!
As always Mark, its a pleasure to watch you work. Outstanding.
O. M. G. But even more than the actual topic of this video (the barrels) is the discussion at the end. My son wants to be an engineer. I need to show him just that last bit to give him the best lesson I can from you.
Thank you, Mark.
Some people screw up just to hear the sound it makes....
Only 30 seconds into this and Mark looks really pissed. Oh boy, this is going to be a good one.
I'm a plumber and when we used to wipe lead joint we used a black pigment we called plumbers black (original name eh.) for the same reason. I don't have guns (well, I have a 1911 BB gun) or know really anything about guns, I just love to watch skilled people do proper craftsmanship and you sir are in the very top echelon. Love the videos and the information you give when performing your art! Thank you Mark.
If that paste flux was for plumbing and not specifically electronics its probably loaded with a chloride compound of some flavor that reduces to hydrochloric acid under heat just like the liquid stuff. Probably doesn't matter here but it's a frequent trap for young players in electronics, the residue is aggressive enough to slowly eat the thin copper traces off a circuit board.
Ididn't mention that, good catch. It wouldn't really hurt in this application, but good for others to know. Thanks.
@@marknovak8255 And thank you for showing this repair, they always tell ya to make sure the barrels ring when buying one, but not how to fix them. Also, another trick from the electronics side. You can avoid that whole cold joint problem with 63/37 as it's a eutectic alloy, no plastic range, at some point in the great race to the bottom they figured out one could make due without that 3% extra tin, but the nice stuff is still made.
@@Broken_Yugo Far from "race to the bottom" 63/37 is newer in frequent application than 60/40 and the change therefore represents more a shift in typical application from large joints (where the better thermal conductivity and wider working range of 60/40 makes it easier to flow) to small electrical connections (where both migration and dry joints are a major concern, and melting 5 degrees sooner can reduce stress on components) than it does skimping on materials.. especially as the lead is actually worth more per volume than the tin. Indeed more recently most employers have been forced to switch to lead free solder blends that are none of the above due to the concerns of long duration buildup health impacts on workers, so the 63/37 vs 60/40 is more in enthusiast spaces that are almost entirely removed from cost pressures.
Hamish McGregor Lead bearing solders are getting rare. Thanks to the EU most are now silver / copper based and have a higher melting point. Lead containing solders were banned for plumbing use in the 1970’s.
I’m a master diesel mechanic and I can say I have made some mistakes some were minor but others were not . Thanks for the videos I love to watch the guns of years passed being brought back to life again
"The master has failed more times than the apprentice has ever tried"
I Tell that to any apprentice in any trade when they say "i messed up"
Loved watching this one Thank you Mark and team !
@Steven GENNERO Bootz automotive
Best bit of advice Mark gave to amateurs is you do not melt solder with the torch ,it's the heat from the metal does the work ,.also with any soldering or brazing it is impossible to be overly clean .Finally if tinned correctly the solder will flow like butter . Regards from the UK .
It was my intention to show exactly that. This was not a job we could dump thousands into, to be technically correct. The whole job had turned into a hot mess from a time, materials, effort, craftmanship standpoint. It was a teachable moment for everyone involved, as I pulled their collective bums out of the fire.
Nothing more satisfying than a nice file and deburr. I feel it in my soul...
I've now seen why my favorite shotguns cost so dang much money. That's a lot of exacting tolerances to make a double barrel look good. Thanks for showing that. I won't be doing that, but I may ring a double barrel to make sure it's tight and won't have a cartoon outcome if I shoot an unknown sears and roebuck double barrel when I find one.
As an automotive tech my last employer always said "Make all the Mistakes you want, just never repeat them". In simple terms learn from them.
Best gun repair channel I have ever wached! Mark has the talent we all wish we had. Mark another great job Sir!
Your wisdom at the end really struck home for me, thank you.
Outstanding.
Brilliant, patient, ballsy, practical. Everything you want in a teacher.
Beautiful work bro. 👍
I love the long vids. Waaay better then cable tv. I would like to see more of these hour long vids.
"You don't need thousands of dollars of high-speed kit to pull this off". Larry Potterfield was offended by that...
Been in the trades my for most of my adult life. I have heard that saying a thousand times and it still rings true. " If you aren't making mistakes, you aren't learning anything."
Love the end speech! Cant wait for the next video, great stuff as always!
That’s a special gun to an old fellow. A real ship of Theseus. Not the finest gun but definitely loved. I would rather have a loved gun with an amazing history then a perfect H&H.
Also, if the history is special enough, I definitely don’t want it, (the gun who shot Franz Ferdinand for example). But a family gun, a little rough and ready warms my heart.
When I'm attempting to do something new to me, I ask myself a lot of questions before I begin, or while I'm working on it. The problem is, I'm often not smart enough, to give myself the correct answers. Lol. Great video as always, Mark.
It’s hard to think about your problems when you are waiting for solder to melt. Cheers. Another great episode.
Mistakes are easy. It's finding the way back out of the rabbit hole that takes thought, perseverance, and generates experience. Great video.
nice job, I learned from an english gunsmith, Rosin, tin and soapstone. I never thought of using a sharpie. I was also taught to use wire wraps and wedges to keep the ribs on while soldering. I love learning different techniques, thanks for sharing.
I love your videos Mark. No one that I know does such a good job taping the step by step process as well as you. Thanks!
That's an awesome episode, thank you Mark.
I used to work in infrastructure grade electronics manufacturing and I can confidently say that flux is your best friend. When in doubt, add more flux.
After 50+ years of working on guns I'm still learning, This was so informative I wish I had an instructor like Mark when I started.
That was a fantastic video especially with the back story. As always it's been my pleasure to watch. Thanks again for posting such a great video.
I enjoyed this one as much as any you have done. Including the point at the end about learning, Thanks Mark.
Hell yeah. I have 45 minutes to kill and then BAM! New Rabbit hole. Hell yeah boys and girls! I've been waiting on this 'sode since you teased us with those ribless barrels in a previous video.
51 minutes of learning and a nice bourbon !! Excellent Saturday evening !! Thanks for sharing your knowledge .
Outstanding work! Thank you for taking the time to show us so this art so it doesn't die.
I have been interested in the art for a while. I cannot tell you how much I appreciate this look into the art of gunsmiths. I am delighted to have found your channel. Thanks again.
Last 3" of my btm rib on 12g muzzle loader popped. £60 At local Gunsmith.1st shot it popped again.Complained.No guarantee on rib resolders!!
Read up and did it myself.
Checked under rib Filthy so cleaned and soldered still good 10 yrs later!
Some "Gunsmiths" Huh!!
I’m a tradesman. I build beautiful mansions for very wealthy people. My cheap builds are well north of 1.2 million dollars typically on 2.2-2.5 million dollar dirt. I’m there from knock down to handing over the keys. I still tell customers that they have 70% of what’s needed to be on the job. Simply care about what you are doing and you are well past most builders. I don’t know this for sure but imagine it’s true for most trades and crafts.
Myself, I simply lie about my love for that particular job until I actually believe it and receive that free 70% boost to my skill. I think it makes me that much better even though I have to do so many different jobs it’s hard to be a true expert at what I do. (Construction Superintendant, General Contractor, and frankly guy with a broom or a trash bin cleaning up after everyone else and getting none of the glory.)
Also, I’d like to point out. The boss sees you caring. Even if you are complete crap, he’s watching and can see that enthusiasm. I have a long list of now master tradesmen who still call on me for advice even though they have long surpassed my general skills.
@@john-paulsilke893 6 phases of a project....
1. Enthusiasm
2. Disillusionment
3. Panic
4. Search for the guilty
5. Punishment of the innocent
6. Praise and honors for the non-participants!
There is a real reason why we shoot all barrel work before it gets out of here
@@marknovak8255 don’t I know it. 😳
I love the "Sharpie" trick!!! I needed to know that about 5 years ago.. What a P I T A that was to clean up!!! Excellent sir!!!
This man is such a treasure. Thank you!
Finally somebody who knows what a deburring tool is and how to use it
سلام خسته نباشید کارتون عالی بود منم تفنگ دولولم دقیقا همین مشکل داره کاشکی ایران بودی بردم درست میکردی 😊بههر حاد موفق باشین🤗🤗
I like the iron bar idea. Lol
Keep up the good work boss.
Thumbs up. Mistakes is how we learn. Best learning is on an old junker with missing or broken parts that you own. 'Tis better to destroy your own parts than destroy parts on a customer's gun. You can build an impressive collection as you restore beater shotguns with issues, rifles with weirdly bent bolts, revolvers out of time, miscellany with broken V springs or stripped screws, etc. It is all fun and a learning process as well.
Absolutely loved watching you work on this one Mark, your former career as an Electrician really showed in the prep and quality of soldering (former Electrician myself).
Always a pleasure to watch a craftsman work.
I haven’t soldered in a long time... Nice to see you getting a big job done!
Thanks for taking the time to make and edit the videos! This content is gold!
"Unless you got a pair of stones, a crane and a big cargo net, I don't recommend you do it" ... priceless!
To avoid heat sinking by the steel clamps, I use Nomax sheets to isolate the clamps from the barrels so they heat and solder cleanly!
Love these longer videos! Thank you for your time and effort.
Completely under-appreciated channel
Sharpie stops solder? Oh that is going to be so useful!
And hugs to Kant twist clamps.
@David Burgin I rember using it to touch up circuit board resists before etching them in high school mumble, mumble years ago!
I've been hunting for a side by side to form 1 cut down looking for one with no sentimental or historic value. Your videos are a joy to watch and the bits of advice and hard won wisdom are truly great. Thank you for sharing your time and work with us.
I look forward to all of your videos. But I've been waiting for this, I have a passion for vintage side by side shotguns.
Been a welder/fabricator since I did my apprenticeship in the early 90s, but today I learned as much in 51 minutes as what I did in the 6 months of my apprenticeship in college. Not that my whole apprenticeship was in college as I went into a work-based apprenticeship in a fab-shop, & mainly the theory & exams were taken there.
Thanks for the video & clear, understandable explanation.
New sub.👍
Thanks for the sub and the compliment. Help spread the word
I really appreciate the ending thoughts, very Bob Ross..
no mistakes, only negative outcomes and learning opportunities
I have no real experience as a gunsmith, but I've soldered a lot of copper pipe fittings. Kind of funny, I learned how to solder pipes (braze radiators) from my dad when I was 11 or 12, approximately 40 years ago. He passed away 4 years ago last month.
All that to say, a huge rookie mistake (that can be kind of funny sometimes) is not heating the parts to be soldered and trying to melt the solder itself to connect things.
Um... added side note. I learned how to wire a house, do sheet rocking, and fix cars from my dad. It helped, because in my late teens I worked in a medium sized hospital, in "Facility/Plant Services" (IE maintenance department). Then went to a career in heavy equipment repair. Both jobs, for their time paid really decent money. Now retired. It just seems today kids don't seem to want to be in blue collar jobs. Love the videos, and have actually been subbed since early in your association with C&Rsenal..
The education system has succeeded in the commie utopia of 2 entire generations of untrained, useless youngsters.....
@@marknovak8255 It is very sad, and absolutely terrifying if you spend too much time thinking about it.
Since you happened to reply I have a fairly easy question. Were/are you an instructor at some point? Your way of explaining is so well done. Never boring, and not talking down to us your audience. I know these are not tutorials, and I don't have the tools or experience etcetera, but I learn so much from your videos. Thank you very much for taking the time to make them.
@@Dsdcain Been teaching my whole life. In the Navy, and I taught high school Mechatronics for a few years, so I get the lack of skills/common sense thing. "The first thing I will teach you is that you CAN count to 21 without your fly open"........
@@marknovak8255 That answers that. *:-)*
Thank you for answering.
@@marknovak8255 "commie utopia" ? the college system present in the US is the epitome of a system perverted by capitalist processes.
Great vid, its a demanding fix, I'm very impressed with your skills , you almost make it look easy lol, I have an old exposed hammer shot gun that was given to me ,its sloppy and the rib is coming off it, I was going to hand it into the police to have it destroyed, You have inspired me to give it a new life, it has no value other than as a vehicle to try my hand at restoring it, Thankyou, Cheers Brent
Thank You, I believe I could do that after having seen your video. You are doing the younger generation a great service as this information is not readily available, in limited quantity and of questionable quality.
I absolutely love your videos. I watch them 2 & 3 times. When i wsnt to chill and watch something being fixed or created i turn to the "Rabbit Hole"
you are the main man, what a great outlook on life, i too have 7 apprentices working for me at the moment, you cant take knowledge with you... keep fighting the good fight.....
You are correct about just getting in there and doing it. Some people think a project to death, only to find out when they finally dive into it; it's a piece of cake. Thanks Mark for a very ambitious project. This one is a job that a lot of gunsmiths might turn down.
Thanks Mark. Always looking to expand my knowledge through new negative outcomes!
51:19 of pure pleasure and entertainment! Thanks for this. Wish I was your neighbour so I could come over and learn with my eyes. Thanks a lot.
God, that was a great video. thank you.
Thanks. Help spread the word please
Another excellent demonstration that I'll never attempt.
Thanks for the demonstration.
39:46 "We are all allowed to hunt over here, so that's pretty cool" Hahaha, the buuuurn!
Nice trick with the sharpie marker. I’ll definitely remember that one 👍🏻
Graphite works better in my experience.
Something on the order of fifty five years ago, a Great Uncle of mine who owned exactly two firearms: A) a five shot break top S&W .38S&W identical to one owned by my Maternal Grandfather and B) a "store brand" mule ear, double trigger, double barrel 12gauge, found that the rib on his shotgun had "come loose from the barrels in a couple of places". My uncle "fixed it" utilizing two rusty vises, a couple of, very possibly even then, antique pipe wrenches, and a couple of tubes of what to me at the time seemed to be a "super thing"....J.B. Weld. Please bear in mind that my uncle was a classic bred, born, and raised South Carolina dirt farmer, WWI combat veteran who had managed to make it back home, survived the Great Depression, and fathered the fathers of some of my closest and dearest living blood kin. Did the J.B work?....Well yeah....But I STRONGLY suspect it worked ONLY because that shotgun was rarely fired except during deer and bird season (quail for the most part) and the fact that my uncle was not the person you would want shooting at you during a gunfight with ANY firearm of the day. Because that old shotgun worked as well as it did after my uncle "fixed it", I was more than a little convinced that the ONLY use for J.B. Weld was in the repair of old, broken, double barrel shotguns.....But then there were friends of the family and family members who also had bets going that I would not make it much past six years old. Watching this video brought back yet another childhood memory thanks to an old gun and the realization that it was only by the grace of God that we didn't kill or maim ourselves by fixin' our guns our own selves back then. Keep up the great work you do and keep the videos comin'!!!
I fixed my freebie 20ga with jb weld on a loose rib
After watching this i may try soldering it....maybe not
Great video on soldering, one thing I learned doing body work with lead solder is if you use acid Flux you have to get every last bit of acid off the metal or it will rust. Some areas you can't get to , so in a year you have rust holes.
Good to know. I made a belt buckle and used acid core flux in the process and it rusted. Never thought about changing the flux. Thanks!
im trying to get into many various repairs and this has tought me a bunch of stuff!! also, i think you have an amazing attitude about how mistakes are made, and how you learn from them!
If you are ever in UK, visit the Royal Armouries in Leeds... there is an interesting display on how double rifles and shotguns were soldered up and regulated using copper wire wraps and cut nail wedges. An extremely skilful, if not expensive process..!
There are lots of interesting things to see there, particularly if you can get permission to visit the Pattern Room collection!
I can imagine, as British small arms development over the past 400 years has absolutely nothing to offer...................!!!!
@@marknovak8255 I was told that Kalashnikov visited the Pattern Room collection and remarked that they had more examples of his rifle than he did. When shown the L85 he was reported as saying "...you must have very clever soldiers!".. But yes, we did seem to make some not too shabby stuff in the old days...!
Absolutely vital information! I learned this the hard way when I did my very first refurbishment on an old Crescent double. The gun had ridden in a pickup, muzzle down and the barrels were no longer even. I thought that I could just square up the muzzle end on my disc sander and before I knew what I did to myself, I had broken through the dam of solder at the ends of the ribs. Panic led to learning, because no way was I going to continue to mess it up even more. I studied for a long time before attempting to fix it. The bigger the glob, the better the job was just not going to work. I went to ETMS after all, and my pride wouldn't let me.
Just resoldered the barrel wedge lug onto a set of 1870's English percussion barrels and I have to say spending way too long on the prep to make sure it was done right paid off. My advice: clean everything until you think it's perfect, then spend about ten more minutes making sure it really is.
Not a gunsmith, but a long time electronic tech. Your comment regarding cold solder joints is true, and a question I have is why you don't use eutectic (63/37 vs 60/40) solder? Eutectic solder has no paste state making it almost impossible to produce a "cold" solder joint. Price difference is insignificant.
Found some 63/37 and did a rib. It made a difference, enough to make me switch. Also correct about price not a factor. Thanks
Sub-freaken-scribed...Not a gunsmith, but a metal worker/blacksmith/welder...and from what I can sus out, with the knowledge I have. . .Mark knows his shiz. . .And I'm here to learn.
Great video! I currently have a side lock hammered 410 I have been tinkering with on and off for years. The plates don't fit correctly, the battels had a dent about 3" from the end, the stock was improperly replaced, and it had been nothing but learning and headaches tinkering with this damn thing. I have learned a lot, and spent several hours correcting whoever was in it before me's mistakes. If it wasn't a passion project, would never have been worth it to fix, kinda like working on an old 22, you have to be doing it because you are learning or sentimental reasons. Always love your videos mark, keep up the good work.
A pleasure to watch you work, as ever.
I learn so much, and he is so down to earth.
"Gunsmithing is an event driven process. Not a time driven process.". Love what you said. I'm gonna use that! We could apply this saying to so many aspects of life.
that last part about the mistakes! I love resto-modding old gats!
Always a pleasure ! Thank you!
I was hoping that I would see my Parker getting fixed. For the record, I inherited it that screwed up.
I had a dentist tell me that the guy or gal in dentistry school with the best grade was not necessary the best dentist. Some people just don't the hand skills. You prove this in your repairs.
Mark, I will shortly be soldering a tin box to fit inside inside a repro 1840s cartridge box. (A new accessory to a certain musket/lock you may recall). The sharpie trick will be VERY useful. Thank you.
We are re lining an 11mm Gras chamber in the shop now, fyi
By far my new favorite channel.
Thanks. Help spread the word please.
Just a humble tip from someone who doesn't do cool stuff like you but it helps to clean your solder using some acetone on a rag before using it, make a big difference.
PS awesome channel subbed
Noted, for action. Thanks.....this is how I learn
You’re the man Mr Novak. Big stones run in my family, as always it has been a pleasure.
It’s been a pleasure watching you work!