Noisy Gears Update - New Ring & Pinion
Vložit
- čas přidán 13. 07. 2024
- After nearly 2 years of running a noisy US Gear Lightning Series 3.91 Ring and Pinion in my Moser 12 bolt, I finally got to install my replacement gears to see if that fixes the noise.
- Auta a dopravní prostředky
I’ve got 4.88 US gears in my tundra make a mild howl at speed above 65 my patterns were good too. Took it apart 3x no change still drives fine maybe even a little quiter after 3 months
When I changed my ring and pinion it howled for around 3000 kms till it broke in. Now it's fine. I guess this is normal
I have a 12 bolt chevy rearend in my cutlass. I installed a set of 3:73's from us-gear. Set them up by reusing original shim. Replaced crush sleeve with shim set. Adjusted thickness to get proper rotational torque. After a few attempts, got a great contact pattern while rotating gears with brakes applying resistance.
Drove car. It was quiet until it warmed up. Went back into it and moved pinion .003. Drove again. It howled. Adjusted pinion several more time both in and out over course of 1 month. It got a bit quieter but still obnoxious. Called a local diff builder. He said its probably the gears and that he had highest success using motive gears.
I like motive gears. Recently installed a set of 4.10s in my 98 ram 1500 (my 1st time replacing gears) and the rear is dead quiet
If your rear differential is solid mounted or has very stiff bushings then I will say without a doubt that it's a big contribution to the noise. Considering everything you've done so far. Bcuz my Miatas diff is absolutely stock and never made any gear noise prior to me swapping in delrin bushings. Now there diff is mounted basically solid and there's enough gear noise to make it's way into the cabin.
I don't mind it though bcuz It's not a daily and the performance benefits of what I did does aid in shifting by a lot. Makes it way less easy to miss-shift when in WOT going from 2ND-3RD.
With the old rubber engine&diff mounts, it would be a miracle to hit 3rd gear while giving it the full beans lol
The extra NVH is a downside but it's a compromise that's pretty much unavoidable for these little cars when you decide to get 3x the factory HP from them hehehe
At 2:15 mark you show a dial indicator to measure backlash. The dial must be tangent to the radius of the gear. You have it square to the tooth face. Place a magnet on the perimeter of the gear and measure to it or clamp an object to the perimeter so you can get the dial indicator tangent. Makes quite a difference in the backlash reading.
Damn .. hope you can get this figured out . My new moser 9” . I can’t hear any howling . But then again all I hear is my engine and exhaust.
If you Decide to redo the ring and pinion I would discard the checking distance and use only pattern in my opinion its the best way . Also looks like you don’t load the pinion enough to set a good pattern run the pattern with a drill and put drag on it
Maybe it's the diff bushings. I have a Miata and when I went from the stock rubber bushings to very stiff poly(&delrin) diff mount bushings, you can hear soooo much noise now from the differential. It now has like that touch of dogbox straight cut gear sound.
The only quiet gear Ive owned in a 12 bolt is an oem 3.08 when I had the richmond 4+1 5speed, every other brand will make noise at around 50-60 m/hr even with a perfect pattern.
Maybe try Richmond Gear? I use their axles in my 12 bolt truck rear they are awesome! I just bought a set of 3.73 richmond gears for the rear and a posi carrier to replace my 3.08 oem setup, when i finish i will let you know how they sound. Also have you been using the GM limited slip additive in your gear oil? That may help.
OK....I have installed between 1000 and 2000 sets of gears.....and your patterns look great....they have good symmetry from face to flank. So if you had no noise in the beginning and then a noise started some time after then it sounds like something shifted. Perhaps the pinion bearings were not fully 100% seated down? Same applies to the carrier bearings. Although you might not have been happy with the REM super polishing your gears had the fact is they are still super smooth so No Break-in period needed. Big thumbs up from me that you went the extra step and had them REM'd 👌 ALL aftermarket gears need something like that.
In any event, check the condition of the gear oil now. It should be like brand new with no metal soup in it.
Driveshafts can also cause noise so check that out also.
Agreed
Hi Need contact you i had same issue
its the gears. they are sheet. The noise comes from the oil getting thinner as it warms up. If he put a heater in the gear oil and heated to operating temp before the first drive they would sound just as bad from the get go.
Stupid questions, did you check the runout of the new gears and carrier? Excessive runout will cause a whine/howl which no amount of shimming will correct. Is it quite until it warms up then gets noisy? How much preload on the carrier? I have always used Richmond gears which have a reputation for being noisy and have never encountered any noise. I always measure the pinion depth from the axle centerline, it's the most accurate method of measurement.
I did check the runout of the gears. I can't remember what it was, but I am sure it was .003 or less.
Theres noisy gearsets going around right now. Quality control has gone out the window apparently.
The ring gear looks oddball. That is the first one I have seen with such top taper at the toe and taper abnormal at heel also. Is that a weight reduction measure for a competition set or some cheap out factory job to reduce metal usage/shipping weight? Don't know if that is a contributor to the howl. Also why the imprint on the pattern is not smooth but streaked.?
Also I notice the pinion crown of the teeth are very wide while the roots between are narrow channeled. I am comparing with my 3.73 Yukon set here and also internet photos. My pinion crowns are narrower and roots wider than yours also my pinion crowns are wider than my ring gear crowns but the root widths seem about same. So I don't know if your differences are due to a different ratio or not.
I recently had a lenghty conversation with a Yukon service tech. He said they get about two a week of those who swear they got the pattern right but actually they were perhaps close but not. So I am extensively learning what I am going to encounter before I start my rebuild.
Also there is a critical break in procedure and a 500 mile oil change. Not suppose to go above 60 mph during the break in steps.
Koyo is Timkin now, which is what I used in my 10 bolt. Works great and quiet as a mouse.
I didn't know that. I thought Timken was made in USA while these Koyo's say Japan on them.
@@SS454LS6 yep koyo bought them out about a year or two ago. Same quality bearings
@@75zl1 Good to know, I was a bit worried. Thanks!
@@SS454LS6 They are all made in China. Timken, SKF, National, all China.
@@Thirdgen83 No some may use materials sourced from china, but they are manufactured in their respective countries labeled on the races and bearings.
I replaced my 12 bolt 69 Chevy Elco, rear end...complete gears,axle,bearings,seals, oil/additive with an Eaton Posi new unit, all to specs.
Took it apart 2X and still making noise on decel.
Took it to two local reputable shops...both said patterns were dead on... Some of my GearHead friends say Eaton are noisy. Like you...I am living with the noise, but for now.
Very frustrating...
Any feed back would be appreciated.
You are running a truetrac?
Did you get it fixed
What your preload on the pinion?
That is what made my noise before. Went to a crush sleeve eliminator and haven't had an issue since.
Does the moser set up use a crush sleeve?
20 inch pounds of preload. Moser uses a solid spacer. Why would a crush sleeve have any affect on noise?
@@SS454LS6 lack of preload can cause whine.
@@75zl1 US Gear recommended 19-22 inch pounds. On paper, i should be good.
@@SS454LS6 Interesting, I wonder what it could be from then! Hope you find it!
@@SS454LS6 I recently replaced the gears in a 99 Yukon’s rear end. I knowledgeable friend told me to over torque the pinion nut by about 6 to 9 foot lbs if the gears are new. When it breaks in it will loosen up and then your preload will be close to spec. That worked on my old Yukon. Not sure if you needed to do that or not to be honest.
Try east coast gear supply they sell OEM gears....most aftermarket gears now are made in china unfortunately.
hard to check a pattern when you aint got much paint left on the gear
Will you continue with the ferrari f1 evolution videos? Pls yes
Yes I will be! There are so many great cars to showcase. Once the summer season slows down, I'll film some more videos. Thanks
DUDE I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM! Professional rebuild in my 72 Chevelle with Yukon gears 4.11's and I get noise. Took it back to the shop for warranty work. Rebuilt with US Gear, same noise on the ride home. US Gear and Yukon use the same gears btw. Took it to another shop because I figured the shop was a bunch of hacks. Rebuilt rearend again and added a new posi carrier. SAME NOISE. Yukon gears AGAIN. Awaiting on Richmond gears now. Once they come in Ill have the 12 bolt rebuilt for the 4th time due to noise.... lol.....
please keep us updated if it fixes your issues.
@@SS454LS6 I will
Update?
I haven't taken it in yet. I need to
It's running back & forth drive line to trans try another drive shaft change trans oil see if that works
oh no your telling me US gears are crap?, I have new install of US gears and nothing but howling, I just removed the diff for a second time adjustment, I hope its not bad defective gear set from US gear, oh my god its a lot of work to replace gears let alone get JUNK PARTS!
yours too? Dang. :/
@@SS454LS6 actaully I was wrong, I have Richmond Excel gears which are the budget version of richmond, and not sure yet if howling is from gears or just a bad pinion depth and backlash adjustment, Im re-adjusting everything as we speak, hope I work it all out.
I would just turn up the radio and enjoy the ride.
got rid of the radio long ago haha.
@@SS454LS6 I was just messing with you. That would aggravate the shit out of me too. Especially after doing it over and over again. I put an Eaton posi unit in mine. Reused the factory 3:31 gears and lucked out with no whine. I also own a 70 Chevelle SS with a 468 and M20. Lots of fun brother.
Run open headers all the time and the howl will go away.
haha, facts right there.
Try a heavier gear oil !
I did. I think it made it worse
Koyo Bearings are better, Japanese steel is better than Chinese or wherever Timken Manufactures them, which is not in the US anymore.
The quality of everything sucks nowadays. I've had 2 sets of Motive gears that were noisey.
Get a motive gear
Kph🤦♂️