These rhythms are... out of this world 👽
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- čas přidán 24. 08. 2021
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A deep-dive into the rhythms of Dream Theater's new single, "The Alien". This song is loaded with time signature changes, odd meters, polyrhythms and some insane drumming from Mike Mangini. Thought it'd be fun to listen through and analyze the music theory (at least the rhythmic aspects) of this tune.
Check out "The Alien": • Dream Theater - The Al... - Hudba
"..- ..-. --- " morse code for "UFO" is the main riff.
Oh shiiiit. Yeah, that tracks with their pedantic particularities.
I don't see the real correlation...
@@MeshuggahDave. czcams.com/video/ToOhM1wi0fw/video.html
Big if true and intentional (which it probably is)
Makes sense, they've done morse before. In the Name of God had a hidden morse code in it with a very crude message. Since it was found, La Brie actually sung it out loud Live on tour.
I don’t listen to prog as much as I used to, because it was destroying my self-esteem as a mathematician.
Hahahaha my head is exploding.
i listen to it
Haha, I know this is a joke but it's more about pattern recognition than mathematics. Sure everybody can count to 5 or 7 but how many of those people know what a pulse dived equally into 5 or 7 parts FEELS like? Everybody can divide 3 by 4, but what does that FEEL (or sound) like rhythmically? You can learn all the real analysis and advanced topology in the world, but until you actually sit down and deeply learn these patterns, your brain won't recognise them in the same way that musician's brains do.
@@beanzthumbz I'm a mathematician with a degree in differential geometry and I still suck at feeling rhythms.. :/
It's my first year this October. Is it worth it?
The Alien just won a Grammy for best metal performance! Happy for them!
It feels like Mangini is really getting a chance to shine on this new album, which is all I've wanted for years haha
He shines in other album 🤨
It hurts
@@asabovesobelow2299 In that sense, he shines on every album he's on - but this feels like the music itself has his DNA in it more than previous DT records
He shines in album “Dream Theater” and many others
I agree. Manginis playing seemed to be more upfront on the last album, compared to the first two, so this seems to be the trend.
Look, I'm just impressed that Shawn can count faster than he can count.
Wut
Never expected a Dream Theater breakdown on this channel, this is really cool to see! Would love to see some other proggy / mathy bands from Invalids to TTNG to Leprous to Animals as Leaders, there's too many bands to name nowadays!
I'd absolutely love to see an analysis/explanation of "Captive" by Leprous.
Hey man, try to listen to some Wormhole Experience. You'll be surprised
Haken - Nil by Mouth.
Car Bomb!!
I agree! Let's see some prog breakdowns
Understanding the drum parts to this degree makes Mike's drumming more impressive cause he makes it look effortless
Thank you for this video and for not calling it 'jazz drummer reacts to stuff' or something like that :)
Mike Mangini: Algebra, Calculus, Geometry, Physics, and Chemistry combined with sheer musicality. 'Nuff said. Jorden Rudess remarked after Mike joined, " Now we can play anything we want." He wasn't kidding.
Jordan rudess said that?😳😳
I play drums, i studied more of 3 years and i have 14 years, now i can play DT songs, with practice, listening and more, when i learned metropolis or the dance of eternity i thought that these two songs were the most difficult ones. And now i listen to this... Holy mother of god. THIS is my new challenge.
Ye Mangini is a level above
try to play the black page :)
good luck
get that 19 down lol
@@momelstn4533 don't hate, lame.
Only Dream Theater can play odd times with the feel of extremely regular times.
Rush were the masters of this. Best example: Limelight
Meshuggah would like a word with you
You should check porcupine tree then, gavin is the master of playing odd time with the sense of regular time
Bill Bruford is the master of this.
Nothing feels extremely regular at all.
Just when I think I can figure out all the polyrhythms and time signatures in songs bands like this make me shut the hell up
Great breakdown of these rhythms!
I also think this is the best Mangini has sounded with DT, and the production sounds a lot better than the last few albums.
Very cool rhythmic review of the song! I programmed the whole thing (drums, bass, keys) for a guitar backing track, and man those drums had me busy! Cheers, great work.
I only saw the intro. Did you do the whole song? I'd love to see that guitar solo in the middle breakdown.
To say that there’s quite a lot of polyrhythmic grooves in this song is a big understatement 😂
This kind of breakdown make me even more amazed by this song, especially with Mangini's work. You've also explained it very well
Looking forward to MP attempting this, and anything else MM recorded. 🍻
Great analysis! And the song is great, too!
I will say that I hear the finale as 5 5 5 5 7 bah bah instead of 5 5 5 4 8 bah bah. In each of the 5s, the snare lands on the 2nd and 5th tuplets (. S . . S), and so I think that what you interpret to be the snare on the 1st tuplet of the 8 (S . . . . . . .) is actually just the snare of the 5th tuplet of the fourth 5 (. S . . S), which is consistent with the previous three 5s.
Rhythms be complicated 😂
That makes a lot more sense! I bet you're right that they're feeling it as four 5's. It's all the same notes I guess...
Yeah I felt the same way. They've been giving you 5 5 7's throughout the song, and that finale feels like they're delaying the satisfaction of getting that 7 by just a bit!
Very few people pick up on time signatures. Great analysis
You did an amazing job of breaking down the song with all the different time signatures.
I'm a lifelong amateur drummer who plays just for fun. Can't read music, and really never understood time signatures. However, I can play along to some difficult music sometimes on a good day. But, this is some complicated stuff. It is truly amazing how accomplished some drummers are, and how they make it look and sound so easy.
2:08 Shawn mimicing Petruccis chunky guitar part like 'john john j john john' :D
Best line I've heard is by JP: It's in 17/8 so try to tap your foot to that
Love it. Thanks for the explanation of 17 but with the 4 feel. That part had me scratching my head trying to figure out where it actually was grounded.
Wow, great detail! Learned a lot man. Can’t wait for the rest of this album!
6:36 This section can also be interpreted as 17/16 17/16 14/16 6/8 6/8! The other instruments continue playing the 17/16 pattern before "joining up" with the drums' 6/8 feel.
How could anyone possibly thumbs down this video??
The production of this song is so good that it sounds... uncanny, like it can't be quite real.
Really cool breakdown, there's some pretty intricate rhythmic stuff going on in this track! Mangini seems like he's really letting loose, which is great. Can't wait to hear the rest of the album!
I like how you muted it immediately when Labrie came in. "yeah yeah ok"
lmaoo
Hhhhh
DEADDDDDD
You're out of touch with reality, he let it play and said ya ya ok happily because he figured out the time signatures
@@ejRecording i prefer Kevin's version 😊
Great breakdown! I noticed the 557 motif when listening to the song originally, but the grooves that cross on top of it are really tricky. The only part I would personally notate differently is at 11:29, as 4 bars of 5/16 then 7/16 (55557 being an extension of the 557 motif)
We really need more of these kind of breakdown videos. Loved it! ❤
Shawn some one who really studied Mike's Rythem knowledge books and always loved Mike's ideas thank you so much for really helping to de mystify and really help even advanced musicians really understand some advanced concepts polyrhythms and polymeter and the amazing feeling nested tablets can take your rythems to a whole new level. Please continue this type of teaching and even if you can go back to posting more advanced concepts that you learning from Mike when you studied with him. Ty
You did an amazing job of breaking it down. Thanks so much.
Love your page. A science , math to great music . You explain this clear,perscie and great. Many thanks.!
Absolutely loved your video Shawn! You're an aspiration for every student to understand his teacher so well!
Great analysis! Really enjoyed watching this one.
Thanks for the breakdown!
Super stoked on this album...
La Brie starts signing and then it's dismissed as "yeah yeah yeah". I love it :)
😂
Really cool breakdown, thanks for this!
Part of my brain tells me this must be good because I don't understand it, the other part just feels tired listening to it.
Seriously, good job and good way to explain it!
I'd love to see more videos like this that just quickly run through an entire song and point out all the rhythmic twists and turns, in-depth analysis of a single groove can be great but it's also strangely satisfying to just have "ok, here are all of the time signatures in order" along with examples.
Great video! Thanks, Shawn!
Absolutely loved this format! Maybe do something like this with a Planet X tune?
i second that!!!!!!!!!!
I third that!!
FOURTH!!
I fifth!!!!
SIXTH!!!! hahaha GROUND ZERO by Planet X please!!!!
Great analysis and breakdown!
My brain slowly turning into goo and overheating as I listen to this.
Great video Shawn!!! I think this type of break down videos are extremely useful and entertaining. In my opinion many people are nostalgic and prefer Mike Portnoy, they think that Manginni is just a very technical player and he lacks creativity and obviously that's not the case. I hope by watching this video people change their minds and give a little respect for this guy.
Beautifully done my dude
More of this please!!! Awesome video
Please do more videos like this. This was excellent!
Great work explaining this song. Congrats
It's just amazing. I think they named the song after Mangini.
They named a song after Myung too, "The Silent Man"
They named a song after Portnoy too. “Barstool Warrior”
@@69thmuse72lmao
negative, ghost rider
The super long 17/4 but phrased as 4/4 part is just like a way more complicated Bleed
Great video and analysis! Don't let this song fool you though, you could've done this analysis with any previous DT composition and would be just as (or even more) amazed!
i actually thought of that 5+5+7 thing, very fun rhythm when subdividing further into 2+3+2+3+2+2+3
Just found your channel, amazing knowledge! Instantly subscribed.
Amazing and precise job breaking this song down!
Excellent teaching work, thanks!
Funny when the music guy goes: WOO !
Man ! I smile the entire video ! My head was boooooom 🦧
Holy sh*t I LOVE Dream Theater but after your analysis I ADORE them.
You are very skilled if you can explain this all to us, thank you!
A masterpiece masterclass!❤🙌🏻
Well explained Shawn... Damn good job 💪🥁👏👏
You deserve so much more subscribers!
i love your videos and band. great job.
Sweet! Love the analysis and the song itself. Would love to see more of this content - perhaps do a Haken song next? Ray Hearne and the boys have some great stuff ;)
Cool breakdown🤘
2 minutes in and I subbed. Thanks for this.
Loved this! Would love to hear you do something similar for a Tesseract song like Exile.
Reminds me to The Mirror, a 4/4 where Portnoy just changed the way he played and changed the feeling despite Petrucci playing the exact same thing the whole time
This video was great. Maybe do similar breakdowns of other songs. Or maybe viewer submunitions?
Excellent vid!! 👍🤘
Awesome explanation!
I just don't know what to make of it :) It's a bit like a drum clinic, maybe less of a heavy metal tune. Very impressive and original, props to that.
Your breakdown is as amazing as the writing here.
Im impressed Man! Great!
This is Great man
Niiice, thanks for breaking it down for us!
Muy didáctico! Muchas gracias!
Great explanation!
We need you to analyze more prog drums!
Mega job. What a metronome man.
more rhythm breakdown like this.
Great video! The intro riff is a Petrucci trademark...🎸🎸
Shawn, you're great.
I can never be a drummer. odd time signatures will destroy me.
It does sound like Mangini is able to do a bit of his own thing here. Everything before that, it was so stiff and robotic, like the band wanted a human drum machine to hit all the notes for all the songs. This seems more like he is hitting the notes he wants, and that's a good thing. Lately, when I hear the prog approach to odd time signatures, I can't help but comparing them to Turkish, Balkan and other Middle Eastern approaches in which the dance influences are really clear.
I often thought about metric perception and how it is influenced by our western music traditions. you have any sources for me, which deal with Turkish/Balkan/etc dances, that are in odd rhythmic groups?
I agree for A Dramatic Turn of Events (2011), Dream Theater (2013), The Astonishing (2016), but Distance over Time (2019) was already a crazy improvement on drum sounds and arrangement creativity. Very curious to hear the new record, but it seems it comes out at the end of October.
Responses to advanced time signatures:
Berklee educated prog fans: “Mind blowing!”
Balkan wedding attendees: everyone from 4 to 95 dancing 💃 🕺
@@fabiofsumi there definitely was something about that on Adam Neely's channel some three-four years ago, more or less, although I couldn't instantly find it!
Can you do a breakdown on how you hear/figure out these rhythms? I can hear simpler odd time signatures but I have no idea where to start when it comes to stuff like this, especially with all the modulations.
Mike Mangini has VODs published on his Vimeo site that explain a few of his rhythmic systems, one of which is about how to count and feel every odd time signature. It’s really easy to understand and cheap to rent the videos as well.
Thanks for explaination..
This is a very cool analysis, you mentioned you took some lessons from Mangini, can you explain his stick grip?
4:30 the separation is so impressive!
Shawn, the reason they used this 5+5+7 pattern is most likely a reference to Steve Vai’s song “Little Green Men”!
Oh that's clever
this song inspired by Mangini groove.. i dont think it has anything to do with Vai's..
@@meshuggahman3225 Are you even familiar with “Little Green Men”? It seems like you have no basis for this dismissive response other than what Shawn says in the video. There may or may not be some connection to Mangini’s predilections to play similar grooves, but the exact correspondence in subject matter along with the 5+5+7 groove is pretty compelling.
@@sagittila Mangini himself talked about it, before Shawn made this video.. do you think Vai's is the only one knows about 5 5 7?.. so every 5 5 7 remotely reference to little green men?
@@meshuggahman3225 what I’m saying is, I GUARANTEE that Mangini submitted that rhythmic pattern but did not come up with the lyrics or write the whole rest of the song. So what most likely happened is, Petrucci et al. said, ‘Cool riff - reminds me of Vai’s “Little Green Men”….. let’s write a song about an “Alien”!’
I’m not just talking out of my ass; that is how band songwriting works. It’s not just the 5+5+7 correlation on its own - of course there’s plenty of other songs with that pattern - just not ones that are ALSO about aliens AND by a guy that was EXTREMELY influential to guitarists of Petrucci’s age and background.
mind blowing.. thanks
I don't know how people like them can count on complicated time signature like maybe they feel like time has slow down in their perspective. While I still having hard time counting 4/4 and 3/4 correctly
Wooow AMAZING!!!
7:25 Yes. Finally they have a nice drum sound. On the past three albums they went from weirdly overcompressed over Reverb that just kills the mix to a sound that's mostly fine, but somehow the high end transients went lost somewhere on the way. But on this one it's just great!
MATE! Incredible video
I'd love to see some Jinjer drum breakdown
Just found this channel. Would love a discussion on metric modulation in DT. Something I notice -- but haven't heard others talk about.
it was in 17/8 in 220 BPM, confirmed from mangini's playthrough video.