How To Play Kill Team: Line of Sight, Cover, and Orders!
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- čas přidán 23. 07. 2024
- Kill Team Octarius has just dropped and with it comes a whole host of brand new rules to confuse us all. One of the most important changes is line of sight, orders, and cover! Here, I break it all down for everyone to easily understand!
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0:00 Intro
2:25 Visibility
3:25 Cover Lines
4:09 Obscurity
5:35 Cover
6:48 LIVE FIRE TRAINING (Examples)
11:28 Stand Down, Soldier!
#warhammer #beginner #rules - Hry
This is the ONLY video you will need to fully understand the rules for Line of Sight, cover, and orders in the new Kill Team. Enjoy!
9:16 change the word "can't" for "can". Oopsy
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If you want more of the Kill Team community, try my Discord: discord.gg/wAPqR8U
And for more of my channel try my FB page: facebook.com/groups/glasshalfdead
A podcast I do about 40k: anchor.fm/andrew-lynch0
Do guardsmen not also give out orders? Which are distinct from the engage or conceal status.
Man I just got to say that your content is starting to get on another level. You probably won't see this but I gotta send you some love you're doing awesome.
@@jordanlane9758 I read all my comments! I don't always respond, but if YT sends me a notification, I check it. So hi, thanks :)
Could you explain why a model gives a cover to another model? I cant find an explanation for that in rulebook.
@@user-fg5cn2re5s Pg. 70. Cover. Second bullet point. It clearly mentions being within 1" of another operator's base OR terrain that provides cover :)
"I'm not really into narrative play", proceeds to create a whole personality for Dakka Boy
The adventures of Dakka Boy! Core Rules!
Yes
9:00 Just so people of the future know, there's an errata that prevents chaining cover like this. Operatives not in the LoS (the first one is obscured) don't provide cover.
A rule I like is, if you're using an operative as cover then that operative needs to make their damage save to earn the free hit off the actual target.
your house rule is brilliant
This is exactly the kind of video that we should be hoping for when content creators get early access. Digesting the tough stuff, and doing examples.
Seems simple - but I learned LOS by playing Advanced Squad Leader back in the day (a whole chapter on terrain - including different modifiers for different densities of woods, and weather effects). 'Dakka boy learns about _______' needs to become a regular series
Just started learning ASL this month. I love it!
Ahhh ASL. A great game.
That example with the daisy chain still confuses me a bit... I feel like a Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal who has just seen a Imperial Guardsmen put a towel over his head.
Always great to see random H2G2 references!
This makes sense for miniatures with an Engage order but not for ones with a Conceal order. Otherwise this basically allows creation of invisible flesh walls...
@@yurithebrave A playtester got back to me about that and said they will errata it!
@@GlassHalfDead Very cool!
@@GlassHalfDead yeah clearly you should ignore models concealed for determining cover lines at least.
I'll be honest with you - it got very very confusing for me in the middle and then turned out to be quite well explained as soon as dakka boys training started! Good video, cheers!
It does very much feel like GW has made things more confusing with this change.
The examples at the end were great, but seemed to lend themselves towards the idea that the new design will be able to be heavily exploited in way which wouldn't make sense to most players from a "common sense" perspective.
So the terrain itself complicates the situation… this is indeed the new injury roll lol damn
I never found the Injury Roll to be that complicated tbh, this is a little more finicky.
That said, like Glass says, it looks like it becomes easier to understand when you play it.
I feel the injury roll was straight forward, it just sucked. This Seems more confusing, but that doesn’t have to mean it is bad, might be engaging but think I’ll need to wrap my head properly around it.
The only things I need in life is the destruction of my enemies, to hear the lamentation of their women and double hello’s.
This is the best KT rule video on CZcams.
I'm pretty self depreciating, but on this I agree. I nailed it day 1
I bought the Tau/Space wolves starter set 2 months ago, it sat in my pile of shame as I finished up other projects. Checked w/ my shop & was able to drop it off this morning and get credit for the new one. So hyped for the new Octarius.
That is a nice store.
Gw official store?
The whole "2" is to represent a model dashing in past" was such a penny drop moment for me. Thank you. So easy to explain to my friends now.
So glad I was still up for this!
Thank you for these uploads! Helpful resources aswell as getting the feeling of "reading it with a friend", I like it!
I love your narration in this video: some very inventive turns of phrase.
The squig worms in my fungal brain also hurt, but I guess I'll have to watch this video again just to get things clear from a new-to-gaming point of view. Your ability to draw parallels between models on a board with their thematic actions is very helpful. Cheers!
Yes. I'll settle down a bit and then rewatch.
And then again.
And probably again.
Dude you are like a machine of kill team content. Love it! thanks for all the reviews
THANK YOU! I was about to have an aneurysm trying to figure out this mechanic, but you explained it in a way that finally made sense.
Coming over from warmahordes this feels pretty familiar. You’re 99% concerned with the models base, you draw your lines from it, you measure from it, etc. it’s a little strange at first that being farther away from obstacles seems to provide more cover than being close, but that’s because we didn’t have any of the “duh he has line of sight” examples - if your operative is far from an obstacle, it has a better chance of not being in “line of sight” of ONE enemy model, but more likely to being in line of sight for the rest since it’ll be out in the open. This will be interesting to play with and figure out as we go
This was an excellent video and explanation! This was indeed very difficult, but you did great!
This is all great content man was pleased to see you got review copies!
That's a great tutorial vid. Certainly helps seeing it as well as it being explained. Thanks GHD
Woot! Love the break down.
No more open questions. Thank you very much!
Hi mate I subscribed a few days ago due to the constant kill team news and info you were posting (great job).I've watched this video 3 times and now get it (I think lol) and really like how it works great video.
I Just want to say your videos are hilarious yet very helpful and enjoyable! I only just found your channel but you have gotten another subscriber from me easily :)
Honestly, this is the first thing I do not like from KT21, feels very fiddly. Without trying it, I prefer KT18s "Can you see the model, can you see the whole model?" rules for cover.
Two thumbs up, we might just use the old LoS and forget this exists for our casual play and community rule. GW could've just let the model have some crouch action token and moved on with it...
KT18'S LOS rules favoured physically smaller models, you could cut bits off your models (horns/spikes/antenna) for an unfair advantage.
This new system is far more thematic and allows you to imagine your operative is actually sensibly using cover through the conceal/engage mechanic.
This new system is overall much less open for abuse than the old one was.
KT18 los rules was a bit of a mess too. Hiding my harlequins was painful because you could shoot the ribbon that was floating far from the body... At least here it makes interesting positioning choices
This a really well done tutorial. Very helpful!
the Dakka Boy training examples were very useful! thanks for the vid
Very well done.
I am pretty excited to try the new edition!
Your content spree has been amazing.
Great video, only thing that is going to keep confusing me is drawing the line of sights from the bases. Will have to re watch this a few times I reckon!
Thanks a lot for this video, i had a lot of fun training with Dakka boy ;)
Great video, very helpful! I must say, I do already miss the old line of sight/obscuring system. For me it was all about the physical spacing and visibility of the miniatures themselves, which I enjoy both for ease of play and pure interaction between models and environment without rules interference. Overall still excited for new KT!
This system wins out in ease of play by an absurd amount. It was such a pain to constantly bend over your minis to check their LoS, and it was a tediours proccess when you had to make sure that your model is well hidden from the enemy. LoS was cool for a good 4 years of playing killteam, now i've tried this sytem and understood that pure LoS system is subpar. You spend more time planning out your turn, rather than bending over minies to check LoS.
Loving the paint job on your death corps. Those maroon trench coats are great!
Amazing video. Very educational.
Thanks, this helps a lot!
I think I understood about two thirds of this; well presented though, so I can see myself watching it again!
Well, I'm going to have to watch this a few more times, thanks for the explanation.
Hey Andy, thanks so much for explaining this in a more easy to digest way. It'll still take some time for me to understand but i find it 100x more useful than the other videos where they're literally just reading the rule book word for word on video 😢
The line of sight rules are a tough one! And you know how it is for creators, whoever gets a how to play video out first gets the most views, so at the start of a brand new game it's a real scramble!
@@GlassHalfDead literally everything else is just jargon for me (I'm basically Dakka boi) thanks again man! You're great 👍
Fantastic video.
I finally understood these damn line of sight rules, they really aren't that hard once you get the idea
True!
Please correct if I'm wrong, in struggling here. In the example that ends around 9:18, I get that the plasma gun krieg gets cover, because he's within 1" of the other krieg that provides cover. But surely because the plasma gunner has an engage order, him being in cover means he can still be shot. Whereas if plasma gunner krieg had a conceal order, him being in cover would mean he can't be shot. Unless plasma gunner krieg is obscured? But the other krieg that's blocking line of sight isn't more than 2" away, so surely he's not obscured.
Please help, I simply can't grasp this for some reason
Yup, you're right. He can be shot. No idea why I said can't be shot! oh gosh. Luckily it was clear that I was wrong, so congratulations on understanding the rules well enough. My video is a success! :D
@@GlassHalfDead Really appreciate that! I've been very much struggling to comprehend the new system but I think I'm about there now!
@@GlassHalfDead It wasn't clear you were wrong haha! Oh man these rules.
This sounds great and not too hard... Thanks for the video
Thank you, Dakka Boy! We did it !
Love the video, great way to simplify things. That intro though, that confused me, it doesn't feel like you're addressing me, feels more like you're addressing the person on my spare sofa (I live alone, so its kinda creepy😂)
Yeah unfortunately I only just got a promoter like a month ago. So everything for the last 5 years that need precise wording has me reading from a screen off to the side. I comfort myself by accepting that most people consume my content like it's a podcast
That double hello is a breath of fresh air I gotta say
I am still coming back to this video regularly. I suck at greping this
Watched this 3 times now, still don't get it.
Think it would be good to see how this works with multiple models all trying to shoot at the same target with varying terrain scenarios in the way.
What a wholesome subscriber benefit!
This helped some but clearly I need to get some more games under my belt
I simply adore that color scheme you've employed for our hero Dakka Boy here. I'm going to be forced to nick it for... I don't know yet, something. It's just great visual eye candy. Care to share the recipe? The blue-green and yellow in particular would be helpful. Thanks in advance and keep up the great content.
Such a great video. Loving your content for KT 2.0 keep it up, GHD.
Thanks! You should do some content too ;)
Hey, you look like you have worked a lot these last days. Make sure to take a break in between.
Breakfast with Dakka boy. He makes learning fun.
Haha, Im so confused! I'd need to rewatch it 3 more times (already did twice!)
I came for the kill team insight but stayed for the double hello
Excellent video. Seems like a pretty intuitive system overall. Thanks for pointing out those cool terrain tricks with regard to angles and team members extending cover.
Very goof video. Thanks to Mr. Dakka for the clear example. I forsee that this is going to be hotly discussed in the first months of the game. I do not like the "grey" zone between more than 1 and less than 2 this is going to trap a lot of casual players...
I think he';s technically Mr. Boy. First name Dakka
Another brilliant video. Cant wait to get my hands on the new box! Does anyone know where a newbie can get started in London when the new killteam drops? Other then trying to convince all my friends to play ofc
Edit: also need to add that Dakka boy makes a great learning aid!
This feels complicated but I’m sure we’ll get used to it. I imagine a lot of Qs in the first tournaments for TOs though!
Please let me know, if I got everything right.
An enemy operative is shootable IF:
- They're completely out in the open and the cover-lines don't cross anything, order doesn't matter
- They're in the open and the cover-lines of your operative cross cover that is 1 inch close to them
- They're visible behind heavy/light cover, at least 1 inch close to it and have the engage order
- Your operative has the high ground versus light cover, cancelling the effect of conceil order
Their defense bonus for being in cover doesn't apply IF:
- Your operative and their operative are on the opposite sides of light cover, visible, 2 inches apart from each other but not as close as 1 inch, that would be melee range.
- Grenades are chosen as a ranged weapon
- Other tactical/strategic ploys that do that
An enemy operative is not shootable IF:
- They're not visible, period. (Except with the Auspex scan ability, right?)
- They're visible behind heavy/light cover, at least 1 inch close to it and have the conceil order
- They're visible behind heavy cover, cover lines cross through it, but are 2+ inches away (obscured)
Other enemy operatives, in front of the targeted one, count straight up as light cover.
Now we need a video about how all the special rules that interact with line of sight and cover work in this system. Like Indirect which in my reading allows you to target models who are concealed behind cover but not models that are obscured. And blast which measures cover from attack point but is a very short distance such that both models will likely be with 1 inch of the cover, and no cover which just removes the auto success die. I am sure their are also ploys and other special rules to worry about here.
Also what about the debris piles. Are they light or heavy terrain? If they are light, what happens when two operatives are within 1 inch of them but more than say 3 inches apart say on opposite sides. Would you then get to ignore it and be able to target the other model if they were trying to conceal.
This is the good stuff.
I think you've got a star in the making on your hands with Dakkaboy. :-)
Hello! Thanks for your videos as always.
I have a question: When determining obscuring, is it enough if even one of the cover lines is obscured? More specifically, if there is Heavy ruins with windows, and the closes point of the model would-be-getting shot is within 2" of the ruins, but the left-and-right points of the base are more than 2" from the ruins via fire lines?
*Whooosh*
Rules going over my head. 😂
I sure you’ll get to it. But could you make a video about the group actions
Holy squig brains those are some convoluted rules. That's nuts that a dude can stand out in the open (just slightly behind a friend) and still get cover.
To be fair you can use friendly models as cover in Kill Team 2018 as well. It is overall confusing though.
@@mata218 and those friendlies you're hiding behind can't be shot? That's weird.
@@dirtybirdsf They can still be shot, they just provide cover to the person behind them. it's a somewhat common strategy with my friends to place a couple basic troops like Battle Sisters in front of a Specialist as Human Shields.
Ooff.. that makes my brain hurt. But really nice video! Helps a lot :)
11:43 The training lesson seems to have been quite successful ^^
I wonder if custodes running ahead with sneaky sisters behind them (using the custodes as a shield) is gonna be a thing that is hard to deal with.
My squigbrain hurts too
The obscuring rule is only confusing until you realize it will only come into play if a targeted operative is seen through a window or just peeking around the side of the terrain from the attacking model’s perspective. If they are completely behind obscuring terrain they are most likely not visible. Makes understanding easier when you get that the obscuring rules won’t come up super often.
I think this is why i prefer deadzone. You are just classed as been in cover at all times UNLESS your fully exposed. So you only get bonus dice when your shooting at somebody out of cover. If teh cover obscure the models by a certain amount based on its base upwards (not parts extending over the base) you can't shot em. Its just nice and straightforward unlike Killteams.
Why do GW employ solicitor rule like creators with all their law jargon to completely baffle us with words that means the explanations already in the book of which I have read, now make it so difficult for me to follow your seemingly simple explanation.
God I wish I had of just watched this and not read pages 70 - 71 at all. I'm now going to re watch this again without any distractions, pausing between the various sections and soak up all of your double hello niceties as I tell myself... "I'll bloody get this if it kill Teams me", did you see what I did there :-)) Thanks millions for the many hundreds of hours of expertise that you share with us along the road to killing everything in sight UPDATE... watched 3 times now and it's slowly sinking in
Wow that sounds pretty complex. I like how they have put alot of time into cover rules though so I'll give it a try.
I agree. Sadly one main player in our group will NOT be able to handle this. (Hes over 50 and must have some underlying issues)
I respect your knowledge and would therefore like your opinion on the following four questions.
What was wrong with Kill Team?
Is this now fixed?
What were the best parts of Kill Team?
Are they still as good now?
Cheers!!
Serious question - if the cover is granted by another model and you're "concealed" so get the 1 auto success for defence, what happens to the mini in front who just got pinged? Do they lose a wound? Surely you can just daisy chain models in cover, conceal them, and your whole lot at the back can shoot but not get shot?
I spoke to a playtester, and they sent it to the dev and confirmed that's going to be errated. Exactly how, not sure, but presumably a simple "models with a conceal order do not grant cover"
So it is a true line of sight system with an abstract filter placed after. To shoot at all you have to have true line of sight but that is not sufficient. Then followed like a 4 step abstract check of heavy terrain, concealment state, and cover to determine if they can be shot and are in cover. Yeah, I think I could apply that based on your video. Not sure if I dig it.
I felt the same initially. But once you play it a few times, it's so cool. The mix of abstract and actual line of sight makes for a very tactically engaging game.
I hope give it a go and enjoy it too 😁
@@D6Evolution I think the rules should say you ignore concealed operatives for checking covering lanes. This would remove the offensive daisy chain.
Sorry for jumping back to this. I have a question about DakkaBoy shooting. So.... 'Live fire training' portion of the video, timestamp 9:50. Can the DakkaBoy shoot the very first guardsman, that is hugging the corner of that heavy terrain? Thanks in advance.
He defnitely can as that first model is on an engage order :)
Cool videos! Still have questions even after Dakka boy... this invisible cover and still can't understand why i can't shoot at third krieg in a row...
So let me clear, if Krieg at 7:52 would be at 2 inches away from terrain from dakkas perspective, dakka couldn't have a shot because of little part of terrain between them?
at 7:52 it is a cover terrain, which you need to be within 1 inch to gain benefit. The third Krieg couldn't be shoot because he is behind an obscuring terrain further than 2 inches from the obscuring terrain
@@47slogra i clearly see all it's model, but i didn't see only a small part of his base and i can't shoot? wtf? Or other two kriegs provides cover two?
love the blue orks. blorks?
I lost it at "and needs your help"
Truly is the new Injury roll system level of complexity.
Great video! Ignore any other comment from me (I deleted it), I didn't see your wording fix in the pinned comment!
That was actually just really poor wording from me in the video. I didn't get it wrong, but the way I said it implied I was talking about the wrong operative do it was super confusing :O
Alright, so my question is about guns that have a range of 'red, pentagon, 6" '.
Is range from vantage point to ground level an angled base to base measure or flat overhead measure of the distance?
It's measured base to base, so diagonally :)
Dakka Boy is apparently smarter than me, because I still have no grasp of this lol
Hey Glass!
Let's say we have a heavy cover terrain (like sector fronteris large wall). Both operatives are two inches away from it's sides, so they both have true line of sight of the enemy. Are they obscured?
Poor graphics for reference
X operative
2 inches gap
| wall
| wall
| wall
| wall
| wall
2 inches gap
X operative
Yes, because the intended target is over 2" from heavy cover, with the coverline drawn through that heavy terrain, they are obscured so you cannot draw line of sight to them.
I need a drink after that...
If you have a concealed older and are out of line of sight, you cannot be shot at, but can you be charged?
Point of confusion: If Dakka Boy is shooting at a Guardsmen with a conceal OR an engage order who is more than 1 Triangle away from terrain but less than 1 Circle away from the terrain, that is a valid target for some reason?
10:20 having the Dakka Boy's LOS cross through it ... What is IT? The model? The obscuring terrain? After watching this video 4 times over 10 days or so this is the only part I don't understand.
3 seconds earlier I say "Obscuring terrain". That's what I meant by IT, sorry!
@Glass Half Dead 9:24 wouldn’t the Dakka boy be able to shoot at the second Krieg? He has visibility due to seeing his head, the krieg isn’t more than 2 inches back from the heavy terrain so he isn’t obscured and has the engage token but will gain the benefits from cover. Still trying to figure it all out
Assuming you mean the 3 krieg at 9:43 then yes he would be able to shoot at the second krieg. I say this in the dialog, in fact! The Krieg would be receiving the benefit of cover (from the krieg in front of him) but is still within line of sight. So, he can be shot, but he gets to retain 1 DF dice.
@@GlassHalfDead ahhh! Thank you, I might have missed that! Thank you for this video, somehow reading it on paper and playing 40k / old kill team still gets a little confusing
Wow, this is really cluncky. Your video is very well maid and thanks for the effort but they have made it so much more difficult than it should have been...
I don't understand the last example (with the 3 daisy chained models) I understand the fact that the last model in the chain cannot be shot at due to the "more than 2 inches" rule. But I am unclear as to why the first and second models cannot be targeted. It seems to me that they should have the cover bonus (the free success on defense) but why can they not be shot at at all?
It seems to me (based on my current understanding) that shooting is VERY situational and, given the amount of terrain in the examples, will almost never happen. You basically have to be precisely positioned between 1.01 Inches and 1.99 inches from a terrain piece AND have an engage order in order to be shot at. This seems wrong so I get the impression that I am misunderstanding. Can you please clarify?
Wait, the second model at 9:18ish has an engage order and is less than 2" from cover...why can't he be shot?
Ok so what if the Dakka boy was stood on a vantage point, how does this effect line of sight shooting down to ground level?
If the model is on a conceal order and behind light cover, you treat it as if it was on an engage order - i.e. if you're above the target, and it's behind light cover, you can shoot it.
Where in the rules does it say other operatives count as cover? I can't find it anywhere
It's in the line of sight rules, right there in the paragraph defining cover :)
Go Dakka boy!!!!
Min 9.19.
Why cant the second guard (the one behind the concealed) be the target ? Wouldnt he be shot but with light cover?
Did you say "can" or "cant" be shot?
he said can't but messed up and wanted to say can. Explained on another comment but you are right: he is in light cover
@@47slogra Thank you