MTB Tech Trends We Don't Want To See In 2024 | GMBN Tech Show 317
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- čas přidán 16. 05. 2024
- In this week's GMBN Tech Show, Anna Cipullo is joined by Owen Coutts to discuss trends we don't want to see in 2024! Plus your usual favourites including this week’s Quiz question and much more!
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⏱️ Timestamps ⏱️
00:00 - Intro
00:21 - Topic | Trends we don't want to see anymore
08:41 - News
13:38 - Quiz
15:00 - Rewind
16:55 - Comments
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What trends have you seen in mountain bike tech that you would like to end now? Let us know why 👇
Quiz Question:
One of the Atherton Bikes' co-founders was previously a co-founder of a different company that specialised in additive manufacturing. What was it called?
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What trends have you seen in mountain bike tech that you would like to end now? Let us know why 👇
Tubeless tyres and sealant R.I.P.
Internal Headset Routing (no benefit other that aesthetics and ultimately the design creates more work) and proprietary hardware of any description (standards are a good thing for the industry and the rider)
Cycling is losing its soul with all the electronics. KISS (keep it simple stupid)
I may be a retro grouch but I like the mechanical feel of anolog. I want to be able to just grab a bike and go and not worry if it's charged up or not. Plus, AXS is not lighter and it's not a faster shift. It's just a smoother shift. So what?
Where is Doddy ?
Any completely Internal routed cables or cable paths that if, for example, the owner wants to raise his bars 5mm the mechanic has to completely disassemble the bike. (There is a little hyperbole in there - Wink) Great Show Anna & Owen, Cheers - M
routing cables through headsets should end. I'm not actually that bothered about the maintenance problems, for me it's just really ugly! Neat cable entry points in the downtube are far more elegant
Ngl, the headset cable routing on my Scott looks 🤌 but any sort of maintenance is 🤬
It's the incarnation of designer engineering to me. It's supposed to be pretty but it truly looks like ish, and even less enticing what they really want is Bluetooth or wireless everything, this is just a useless stepping stone...
Frankly, I never had a problem with external routing. Kind of effete to worry about visible cables
My road and gravel bikes look just neat using headset cable routing. But my mountain bikes just look much better using the cable entry points on the down tubes. For gains, and maybe for looks, it just sounds good on road bikes, not for MTBs...
The only tech that everyone would want is a self cleaning MTB
I'm looking at my 3 filthy mud encrusted rides. Yep, I'd be first in line.
😂😂
haha very true, just struggling with it atm
You need a clean & fresh water swampy area to ride through.
No
Numerous chainring standards... Shimano has one, Sram has one, Race Face has... No please, make something standardized!
yeah, tell me about it :/
I have lots of perfectly good Race Face chainring but they can't make a decent crankset that won't bend of break...after tasting their ishy hub & crankset engineering I choosed to boycott RF since they don't care about durability...
I really don't like sram either but at least their standard makes sense with variable rings offsets...
@@LaurentiusTriariusand that is why we need a universal standart in order to match best chainrings with best cranks. And it wouldn't interfere best BBs. Or good enough in each category
Trend to die in 2024? Bike shame.
Every bike is absolutely awesome as long as someone's having a great time riding it. No more ego (or otherwise)-measuring contests around travel numbers, what you've spent, carbon/alloy, Kashima, etc.. Get bike. Ride bike. Be stoked other people ride bikes, too.
I often take my son old 24" bike to the local pump track, you should hear the vitriolic comments 😂 enjoying every second of it 🎉
I couldn't of said it better myself!
@@davidmalakoff147 couldn't have*
Putting one more gear on becuase its better seems like having your guitar amp go to 11 because its louder
Cheers guys for putting my Ridgeback up!! 😁 Still with me, brought it to Spain with me almost 30 years ago!! Now rarely seen in Madrid's Casa de Campo!!
My Norco Fluid came with frame protection on the bottom tube. It would be cool if all companies did at least that
Yep. And a chainstay protector too...
@@zethjugos1250 that's true but I just meant the clear frame protection
Just buy 3M film for $20 ya baby
@@dystopiaisutopia an entire role 24" x 50 foot vinyl cost $10-50 Canadian depending on colour and weather it's removable or not. Everyone has or knows someone with a cricket. I'm not complaining but it's a simple add on that makes a big difference
10:29 Definitely a great idea with the Mudhugger I too do that, but mine is longer. It definitely works well for protecting the sensitive bits. But never tried screws in tyres, I always used regular studded tyres.
XC=12 Speed
DH=7 speed (You can go 5 speed for lower unsprung mass)
Trail/Enduro=10-11 speed
I'll second, that routing cables through the headstock should end. I don't think I've heard anyone actually saying they preferred it.
Regarding the gears: I used Shimano SLX for a couple of years and absolutely hated the 12 speeds: weak chain, constant adjustments and most importantly: the range was too close! always shifting 3-4 gears at a time is ridiculous
Went back to 10 speeds and am as happy as can be 😎
My first biky was a cheap used one (B-Twin 1999) with 3 cables (partly open) directed over the main frame tube.
I didn't know that the brake was being pulled and even the front deraillieur changed when your pants get caught underneath.
It has tiny little plastic marbles to prevent that but I didn't know what they were for.
You could actually brake for a small bit just pulling the inner cable but you could also hurt yourself this way very easily.
Mind you that they cut cheese this way, so.. ;)
17:35 I agree. of course with quality paint, that won't peel off once you need to replace the protection.
Dis-assemble and get it powder coated.....It makes the bike uniquely yours, considering the thousands of color combinations, metal flake clears, "chrome" colors, metallics, etc...And powder coat is far harder than paint and far more durable as well.......I just finished a build, after getting it powder coated, and the bike looks incredible.....Literally stunning....
The best part of the video was Anna saying "fit AF" 😆 Outrageous prices need to go away as others have said.
@gmbntech I'd like to do the C2C in the summer and I'm wondering which of my 2 bikes to use. I have a polygon Sisku T8 (2022) and a Trek X-caliber 9 (2022). T8 is full sus, slacker and rolling resistance is pretty bad. The X-caliber is a hardtail, quicker but is harsher and feels way more skittish coming down steeper terrain. I think either bike could be improved with some upgrades. Which would you choose and what upgrades would you do? Thanks
Quiz Question:
One of the Atherton Bikes' co-founders was previously a co-founder of a different company that specialised in additive manufacturing. What was it called?
Robot Bike Co. - Good old Ed Haythornthwaite - the R160 came first (in 650B ) and then the R130 (in 29").
The guy who implimented the 3D printing of the titanium frame joints.
I seem to remember Doddy covering this weeks' Quiz Question in a previous episode!
Robot Bike Co from the FoD. Their launch event was at their 3D printer supplier - Renishaw in Gloucestershire. Renishaw printers are now used by the Atherton brand too.
Robot Bikes, I think they released a R160 around 2016
The brand that Atherton bike were derived from was called Robot-Bike Co. (or RBC) Based down in Monmouth. :-)
yep, came here to put this in. Robot Bike Co.
With you Owen. Wide range 11 please. 12 is a pain in the arse to dial in.
The trend of bike prices going up. Yeah, that would be good if it stopped.
On the point about cassettes, I barely use a third of the gears on my Eagle 12-speed cassette - I mostly use gears 1, 2, 3, 4, 7, 8, 11 & 12 - the inbetween gears rarely get used. 5 and 6 are too close and 9 and 10 as well.....I usually skip straight from 6 or 7 to 11 or 12...as riding most trails does not call for the inbetween gears
We really need some common standards for EMTBs. At the very least make them all compatible with a standard charger. Following on from that 2 or 3 standard mounting bolt arrangements, and perhaps 2 or 3 internal battery form factors... ideally with the ability to snap the packs together in 100wh increments... a bit like putting multiple AA batteries in a household device. Finally some kind of standard interface for the electronics that hopefully only needs an upgrade every 10 years or so.
I know a lot of folk like internal cable routing but it is very hard to find anyone offering external - Bird, Cotic or Airdrop are the few boutique brands I found. Give us options!
I'd really like to have both routing options om every bike, of course as a home mechanic I'd always choose external 😎
11:56 please explain why you’d want an integrated cassette? Just sounds like an expensive problem when you inevitably wear out the gears waaay before the hub goes bad
Alloy doesn't necessarily indicate aluminium. Steel is an alloy as well.
Wow you're smart
Did you knew that you can buy iron and carbon for the price of just one alloy?
Smoking deal 😂
I find myself double shifting a lot with 12 speed. Arguably 10 speed gave adequate range and steps.
Great show. # Quiz Answer: That would be Evil Bikes in 1999 (Dave Weagle)
#askgmbntech Are there any tricks to putting sealant in a tyre with an insert? I recently installed a Cushcore insert following their online video however when it came to squeezing the sealant in via the valve (new Muck Off valve with core removed) the sealant was struggling to get past/around the insert. Ended up having to use a tyre leaver to lift the tyre bead and squeeze the sealant in at various locations around the wheel… messy nightmare.
There has to be a limit on how much tech we put on our bikes, or pretty soon our “bicycles” will just be weird little motorcycles. For me, no electronics and no motors. If there’s a motor, it’s not a bicycle
Not directly related but I did a fun mental exercise of "how many batteries can I put on an "analog" bike":
2: derailleur& shifter
2: shock/fork
2: tirewiz
2: front/rear lights
1: garmin/other head unit
1: power meter
I think I'll continue rattling out my fillings out on my fully rigid single speed (I do actually love that bike).
For some years now i have been using shimano 12 speed xt rear mech paird with 10/11 speed casset and shifter,much more reliable.
rs judy forks should be on the list,1x12, unservicable emtb with undersized pivot bearings
10 speed XT is all you need for MTB or even gravel riding.
I held out for years before going 10 speed, no need for more gears. If you have steep hills use a 2x system!
I had 2x10 on my XC hardtail and eventually went 1x. Kept the FD and mount in a box for a while before getting rid of it. Now I want to go back to 2x. Eh, live & learn I suppose.
@GMBN Tech, Owen busting out the Orange pun's was a seriously under rated segment of the show.....
#quiz it was robot bikes
Also additively manufactured bikes
@gmbntech #askgmbntech I'm relatively new to the sport and enjoy my Laufey hardtail, but now looking at something a bit more capable for those all day rides. Should I get a high spec bike like the Rallon, or a lower spec emtb like the Rise or Wild? I feel that the price variance isn't massive, but I imagine they're very different bikes to ride. Especially on the climbs. Thanks!!
Robot Bikes, I think it was called the R160 came out around 2015/2016.
Yeti did a carbon tube epoxied to alloy lugs. Tomas’s bike Doddy showed.
Off road bikes or ebikes coming with suntour forks that clearly say not for off-road and heavy use or off brand brakes
What I don't want to see:
Internal headset routing.
Proprietary suspension systems
Multi shock suspension systems.
Linkage front end, with steering pivots and linkage fork with shock in the front end of the frame. That never cough on.
I'm not against big wheels if it's for super tall riders. Like people way over 2 meters tall. you have to make sure the size suits the size of the rider, not go way too big.
Things I would like to see:
More wide MTB shoes, most shoes don't fit me, as I need 43 with a bit more than 44 in width. But I compromise on 44. Anamoly is more my size, so I use 43, but could be slightly wider, they are about the width of 44 RideConcepts and Five Ten.
More winter shoes, waterproof shoes with gaiter.
Easier to get clothing that fits in online retailers.
Bike industry needs to face bottom bracket shells, head tube, brake mounts, cover the threads properly in BB. Many brands skip the last step.
Bike brands offering too few sizes should not be a thing.
Scammers on Instagram targeting mountain bikers should be no more. Fake giveaways and more.
I think modern MTBs are missing the higher gears which the old 3x systems had.
That prototype looks trippy, but that would be an absolute nightmare to clean. It might be better as a road bike where your chosen trail isn't mud and nature debris.
I hope XC goes up to 180mm, maybe when we ride the same travel, higher travels suspension would be more affordable.
Robot bikes, I work for Renishaw and we still have one of their bikes in our demo area. Same principle of 3D printing and tubes
Die:
Using the words “Aluminum” and “Alloy” interchangeably. Yes, aluminum mtb frames are an alloy, but not all alloy bike frames are aluminum alloys.
Alloy is not a nickname or short version of the word Aluminum. “Alloy” means a metal made by combining two or more metals. So steel frames, Chromoly frames (a type of steel alloy), and aluminum frames are all “alloy” frames.
Also Die:
Integration. Integrated bars and stems, integrated shocks, apparently from this vid now integrated cassettes and hub. 1. I want to be able to customize my bike either with different parts or sometimes just different adjustments; giving me a fixed bar and stem prevents both. We’re not all the same. F off trying to make us all the same. 2. I like to see the parts of my bike. There is beauty in the industrial workings. And they are easier to adjust, work on etc. F off with your OCD about “a clean look.” 3. An integrated hub and cassette? Seriously? Great, once again, like bars and stem, if I want or need to replace one part I have to replace both making it more cumbersome and expensive. F off.
Parts of the "trends that need to die" segment felt a bit like a self-fulfilling prophecy. "We don't need 29 when 26 works perfectly fine", "we don't need more gears, but we used to run 24 gears", "too much suspension is too much" when I remember a time when 100mm was ludicrous. Granted, geometries have changed, but.... We talk again in 3-5 years, I guess
120mm xc for tall guys is great, Super enduro over 160/160 i cant see adventage. More important is geometry. 38mm forks only for very heavy riders (90kg+)
I think that most of the electronic stuff can die off. ABS, auto shift, auto suspension setup and wireless shifing and dropper can die off
Campy makes a 13sp cassette but it’s a bit finicky IMO
I would like to say that I am missing my old bike gear range of 618%, because I tow my kids on my bike tours and I appreciated wide gear range for different speed. My new Canyon Neuron has only 510% which seems to by enough, but I feel it very limited in extremes. Smaller chainring can solve the issue with light gears, but on road I will be cranking like crazy! I would like to see wider ranges. 12speed is enough.
#askgmbntech I just seen something about a Trek Y and remember how much I loved the design... so I came to wonder what would happen if I swap out the rear triangle to something else and build up a "neo retro" Trek Y 29/27,5 mullet thingy... it would have extreme short reach compared to height and wheelbase, but other than that sounds fine to me... am I missing something?
Simplon bikes has a good motor e12 velt driven
As long as tech is by choice and does not render you current ride obsolete. Keep pushing the envelope.
imho 1X is the future, even for road. You have bikes like the Canyon Roadlite 6 (2023 model) which is 1X, 46T chainring and a 12 gears 10-51T cassette, which imho is a killer combination, it's a speed demon and also it can climb almost anything (you can maybe even take it to light paths)
Could you please review the Shimano Cues components. I'm thinking of replacing my SLX groupset with Cues U8000 but I haven't really seen any good reviews of the components which is weird considering it's going to be the new standard for Shimano groupsets.
Not sure what rattle dude was talking about with narrow dropper posts. Both of my bikes have a 30.9 diameter seat tube and ive never had any rattle come from my 3 droppers ive owned. I even have the OneUp V2 240 in my trail bike. 🤷🏻♂️
Piers Linney is the Atherton bike co founder of a different company specialising in additive manufacturering Making titanium Lugs. Renishaw
I don't think people care about HOW their suspension works, as long as it does work.
I couldn't wait until Friday to get my bike. So I got it on my way to work yesterday.
What bike have you chosen?
Wow, if Owen's against 12 speed, I bet he'd be real enthusiastic about Campagnolo and Rotor's 13 speed!!
I ride a GX 1x12 on my big enduro and probably use only 5 gears on it (2 biggest cogs 1 pedal friendly cog and the smallest one going dh) if you're not racing, it only gives me problems. My old xc bike rides trusty shimano 2x11 and I absolutely love it for big climbs or long rides when your legs are actually burning.
I'm more skateboarder than mountainbiker and I love how little boards have changed the last 30 or 40 years. You don't really have to worry about the price, unless you're really poor. Same for BMX, I have 2 bikes that are 7 years apart and they look almost the same (tech wise). Imagine showing up at a skatepark with a 1000 dollar Ai driven skateboard. It's a question of culture and partly the fault of youtube influencers that shame you into buying expensive stuff.
I'm just curious, why don't we see mountain specific cassettes? Something like a 28-50 10spd. If I only use my 11t cog 2% of the time when riding, then why do I have it? Wouldn't it save weight to have only the gears I use?
Because purely climbing gear is actually very rare, most people rather use 11..15t on the tarmac to get to the woods and something in range of 15-21 on the fire roads. And why have 28-50 cassette when it is the same range as 11-20 but with much smaller chainring and muuuuch simpler derailleur - now *that* would save weight.
Idk how that would play with your sponsor but what I'd really like to see is the Bullsh*t awards. There's a lot of contenders...😂
Another thing I don’t want to see in 2024 is half-assed mechanics! Lol 🧰💪🏽😎
internal headset cable rooting can die
Shorter cranks!
More shorter cranks? Or less?
I hate the trend towards heavier "more capable" trail bikes and ridiculously expensive XC only bikes --- downcountry almost solved the problem BUT then everyone's "downcountry bike" started becoming "heavier and more capable AND more expensive" --- wheer I ride I just don't need the extra suspension / more capability --- AND I remember the days when a sub 25lb mtb did everything I wanted (26 incher) -- could be bought for the price of the forks and brakes on my new bikes...
In my opinion, mountain bikes do not need hidden cables and hoses that run through the stem and headset. This is a mechanics nightmare.
No more electronics, no more suspension increases and no more stupid price increases for no real change “up-dated” models
@quiz answer = Robot Bikes
HI WILL THEY RESPOND?
#quizquestion. The answer is Robot Bikes.
I don't ever want to ride a bike connected to Skynet.
There is no H in SRAM.
32" is extreme but trying 30.5" for XL+ riders might be the sweet spot
32" wheels are a good middle ground between 29 and 36. There are riders who would really benefit from developing these larger wheel sizes. As for the 30.5 idea I think that Moots and WTB have gone that direction with their 750D wheel size.
Robot bikes? I don’t know if it’s trend, but I hope press fit bbs die out eventually. Headset cable routing also seems unnecessary in my opinion. But a big on is unguided internal cable routing. I Got my first bike with tube in tube routing, game changer. I would also like to see more brands put more appropriate casing tires on bikes. Have a mega tower that came with exo+ tires rather than double down or other dual ply options. 180 mm post mount frames for enduro bikes and 38 mm forks.
We used to say 29” wheels should go away. While I don’t want 36 I dunno… maybe eventually they will force it on us.
I don't think anyone is 'forcing' 36ers on the public. It is simply an option for very very tall people. That's it. There is no conspiracy and I don't see why people are so vehement about a wheel size that works for tall people.
Since I got my 12by system I have definitely become weaker with all the perfectly light gears. I used to be like a rhino pushing up the hills on those tiny cogs.
Mullets, both wheel setup and haircuts, 165mm cranks, full face helmets for everything, massive pickup trucks in the carpark, any article on mtbs focussing on eMTBs
Mixed wheel
Atherton comes from Robot Bikes
Stop AI controlled suspension before it comes mainstream.
What about a 100$ derailleur hanger designed by AI?!
Nip it in the bud? I'd be inclined not to buy it that's for sure...
😅
The trend I'd really like to see die is making every bike that's not XC an aggressive beast of an enduro clone. I miss trail bikes actually being good all around bikes, and not just short travel enduro numbers
2 xt 10, 11-42T is enough! road or MTB
There is no 2x10 speed 11-42 except aftermarket chinesium cassettes that fit derailleurs that could fit bigger cassettes anyway. So either 2x10 11-36 or 1x11 11-46
@@feedbackzaloop I run11-32 on road and 36 MTB! Thank you for correcting 👍
@@THEGEEK2001 ah, the classics.
But I just remembered there is one Microshift setup, specifically 2x10 11-42, so gotta be corrected myself.
Headset routing has to go
100mm for xc is really no longer sufficient, when you look at modern xc courses.
The trend I'd enjoy to see dying the most would be marketers in charge, put the engineering team on top, marketers needs to adapt not the opposite..
The trend of new „bike categories“ can please finally die. Just tell me how much travel it has and the geometry, I can decide myself where I want to ride it.
Yo - remember everyone saying 29ers? What? Why would You need a wheel that big that's crazy! Let's give 32's, 36's, or whatever else a shot k?
Having options is what the bike industry should be about. There are very tall people that don't fit comfortably on 29ers. They should be able to buy bike with proportionally sized wheels like anyone else.
I don't get the appeal of being able to just plough through everything with big wheeled bikes (even 29ers). Why not just get a motorbike if that's what you want? Surely the point of riding tech trails is to improve skills to enable you to ride them - not just get a ogget bike wheel (imho).
Because they have no skills
I own bikes with 1x10, 1x11, and 1x12 speeds! I see no advantage to 12 speeds, and components wear out faster!
"Look in the mirror, tell me, do you think you life's in danger"
No more gears
No more gears
No more gears
No more gears
...
Oh yes, less proprietary and integrated cassettes too. And please tidy up that mess with HG/XD/MS
The trend i would like to stop...increasing bike prices! We don't need all this tech that comes faster and faster. I understand that manufactures want to sell new bikes but I think that the would sell more if bikes would have better prices. The bike industry is in a crisis now. They will not get out of it with more tech and higher prices.
Let's definitely kill the "acoustic" bike term. It makes no sense, since acoustic is referring to sound and it's used just the opposite of what it should. emtbs make more sound than mtbs. Just emtb and non-emtb (or just mtb).
End headset cable routing right now
Tubeless tyres and sealant R.I.P.
32 and 36 inch wheels, a HUUGE increase in the unsprung weight. A massive no no, suspension 101 (see Colin Chapman, Lotus inventor, knew a thing or two about suspension), and just think about the gyroscopic effect of the wheels on steering. I can remember the 90s (yup, I'm that old) when factory teams were running 24 inch rear wheels on their downhill bikes to reduce the rolling resistance. Never really caught on😅
Mike Birkett, nobody is really making full suspension 36ers. There are lots of extra tall riders who would benefit from developing the wheel size but for the most part the frames and forks are rigid. I don't see why everyone is so opposed to having options for extra tall people.
To be honest.. if you have a hardtail or fullsus it's a good bike just ride it . Who cares about industry that's just for rich people. I have both . 2022 trek marlin 6 hardtail and a 2016 cube stereo HTC 160 fullsus tricked out with hope stuff 🤘🤘🤘😎
Dedicated followers of fashion.
Headset cable routing .... zero benefits ... maybe for aero road .... but otherwise stick it in the bin...