The Biggest PROBLEM with Modern Rain Gear
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- čas přidán 11. 04. 2023
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Great video! New subscriber! Don't sleep on the poncho, though. I find they optimize rain protection and ventilation.
when I switched to carnivore way of eating I reduced sweating by A LOT. Beside impressively huge health improvements this was one of unexpected side-effects.
What kind of helmet are you wearing on the ebike?
in that respect, what about using a disposable plastic apron then.. easy to use, replaceable, light weight, protects top, bottom, behind relatively, breaths better then full rain gear, and doesn't break the bank
I'm surprised no one has mentioned that a rain jacket also protects you from the wind, reducing wind chill and hopefully not getting cold.
It depends on the temperature. Is it hot? Umbrella. Is it cold? Jacket.
@@DoctorDinosaur but if it's hot, why not just get wet. Wear something that'll dry quickly and embrace the wet
@@blaise3004yeah that's what I was thinking 🤔
A softshell jacket does the same job and has way better ventilation IMO.
I only wear a goretex here in Canada when it's like -5 Celsius or colder and for that it is awesome. It blocks 100% of wind, breathes better the colder it gets outside, and makes insulated under layers much more effective and allows to be much less bulky. Good too about -20 Celsius. If it's warmer outside just wear a cotton smock and a poncho for that 0.01% of the time it rains. You'll be way more comfortable
Funny how goretex is only awesome for the exact opposite of its intended use
This is pretty specific to covered trails in moderate to warm weather. I'm sure umbrellas are great when you have enough clearance and coverage from trees. Even a moderate wind would make you question that choice, even more when you are in an open clearing. When I lived in Ireland I learned really quick why nobody owns umbrellas.
Same here in the Scottish highlands.
There’s definitely a limit beyond which you can’t use an umbrella, but it’s way higher than people imagine. Especially if you use a super burly compact umbrella. This isn’t necessarily a purpose built hiking umbrella.
So I'm not touting this umbrella as an actual alternative while hiking, that would just be silly, but if you're in need of an umbrella that can survive even the unruliest winds of the UK, the gustbuster brand is the only one I've found that will not break after 5 seconds.
All other 'windproof' umbrellas get buggered in a proper gust, but I've got 3 gustbusters that have all been going for years.
P.s. I'm not getting paid for this advert lol. But gustbuster, if want to throw a fiver my way I'll take it :p
Here in Tennessee in the USA, I have exactly the opposite problem: the trails look more like green tunnels, with rhododendron and mountain laurel close packed and arching overhead. I can't imagine trying to maneuver an umbrella through that sort of tangled mess, particularly with all the blow-downs. It would be snagged, ripped, torn, and shredded into uselessness within the first 10 miles!
I've bought a hiking umbrella (ShedRain WindPro Mini) 10 years ago for a month-long hike on the Camino de Santiago. It's very cleverly designed to not lock up but change shape with the wind, and it works surprisingly well. It can be used as a "shield" against almost horizontal rain and strong winds. Protects against rain AND wind chill. It's extremely sturdy and can be used for shade in the sun too. So don't be too quick to say no to umbrellas for hiking even in rough weather, I'd recommend trying it out.
I'd use it together with rainpants though, because it can't protect your legs and feet.
The umbrella's greatest weakness is wind, which can make it practically unusable. Personally, I carry both. Umbrella provides better ventilation, jacket provides better coverage and hands-free use.
Exactly, umbrella doesnt work vs sideways rain
Which means umbrella doesn't work where I live.
Love my blunt umbrella! It’s a tank but works like a charm in the wind. Also works reasonably well in the snow (as long as you don’t let it pile on top too much)
I did a 96 mile walk with an umbrella and found you develop skills in using it at different angles making the wind less of an issue, in fact it often became a great windbreak esp at break times!
@@rubke2 You hold the stick part by both ends and use it like a shield. I live in a very windy city.
I was once based in the Philippines. During the rainy season, I tried increasing impenetrable rain gear to keep dry. Finally, I found something that worked. The problem was, it's so hot there that I arrived soaked with sweat instead of rain.
At that point I gave up on keeping dry. Instead, I carried extra clothes and just got wet. 😅
I will be living in the Philippines next month which is why I am here XD
my thoughts exactly you won't melt if you get wet and if you're wet so is everyone else
If it's hot is not even a bad way to deal with it
The trick is using natural fibers and not using plastic based clothes. My waxed wool coat, keeps me warm in winter, dry in rain and im not soaking wet from sweat in the summer.
@@MrEatSomeBrains The humidity in the Philippines will make that wool unbearable. Even a cotton tshirt is unbearable when the humidity is very high. The only real solution is to do what the locals do which is to bring extra clothes, and to keep your office shoes at the office, or bring it with you, and wear waterproof shoes. Or get yourself a car if you can afford it. Even when it's not raining, you still need to bring extra clothes, at least an extra undershirt, because the humidity for most of the year is really very extreme. There is some relief from November to February though.
As a bike courier in Vancouver, I soon realised that Gore-tex is neither waterproof or breathable when you're riding hard all day. After much experimenting my approach could be summed up as "since I can't avoid getting wet, I need to stay warm when wet and speed up drying time". The colder months of December and January (which are mild by canadian standards) where it's 2 degrees and raining, were the only time I wore a Gore-tex rain jacket, though it was a must to stay warm. Throughout the spring and fall months, wicking long sleeve shirts, a very thin fleece and the MEC Samurai Vest made entirely out of Cordura was the way to go. The setup would keep my warm and not overheated. Even when I'd get soaked, which is unavoidable, I would be mostly dry within 10-15 minutes during lunch. Polypropylene, cordura, fleece and wool socks were essentials while rain gear was practically the worst thing to wear until you got to April where it would be 6 degrees and rain for 33 straight days.
I'm one of the few strange people who got those 5 toed Gore-Tex Vibram shoes... I quickly found that out too, even though I'm on the other side of Canada. I've had better luck with a pair of canvas boots from Xero Shoes that I soaked in waterproof treatment. Usually when it's warm enough, I wear water shoes or crocs, with clothes made of swim shorts material since it gets wet, but will dry off in about 10-20 minutes. On colder days, I have a slightly oversized traditional raincoat that apparently was made in BC (I can't remember the brand off the top of my head, but traditional, fairly heavy, but good), and sometimes I use a thinner windbreaker type thing. I like the thicker one for being in the garden too, as the sleeves have elastic, something I don't see too often, so I can tuck my gloves inside and not get my arms full of mud. It's also long enough to sit on which helps, even if it's cold enough to wear rain pants.
Isn't wool or fleece good for keeping warm when wet? Cotton is terrible wet for sure.
As a Calgarian with so much sun, the idea of 33 days straight rain makes me want to cry. Yah, yah ok, so it's snowing end of April ...whatever.... ;P but I got sunshine most days.
While biking in new Westminster I passed a kid on a bike who had an umbrella 😂 😂😂
I’m still trying to figure out optimal rain commuting gear. It’s not a long commute and I’ve found less is better.
Probably something that can only be done in 55-70 temp (typical socal weather in the fall/winter) and being a wimp to even mild chilly weather, but I've found that wearing a base layer + jersey + gore-tex shake dry to be my go to. It doesn't rain much here but where I live, it is very windy so the shake-dry still does help a lot. When I'm riding hard and I break a sweat enough to drench me, I'll unzip a part of my shake-dry and usually it is enough to dry me out enough for me to feel comfortable again. Essentially, my base layer will get soaked, my jersey will pull that and dry it when I've partially unzipped the shakedry.
I think more people should consider an umbrella as a solution for sunburn while hiking as well.
As long as you don't need your hands for climbing, I prefer an umbrella over coating myself in sunblock as suntan lotion on your face and arms gets gross feeling on a hot day as well, and the umbrella keeps direct sun off your face and arms, so you are cooler.
Could you put something to hold your umbrella on your pack? Back to hands-free
Many companies that offer hiking umbrellas also offer ways to attach them to your shoulder straps, so you can go hands-free and continue using your trekking poles.
I think a sun hoodie and hat would be just as good as the umbrella but if it was crazy hot and i was hiking somewhere super exposed like the desert section of pct i would definitely use a sun umbrella
@@brycetheshredder wide brimmed hats are great for rain as well, assuming it was made to be water resistant/proof.
That plus a lightweight water resistant jacket or shirt have usually kept me dry in anything except for a torrential downpour.
In Germany I have seen people biking with and umbrella.
Poncho, kilt, wool cape. That was always the point of these items in ancient/ye olde times. The idea was that the mass and natural water resistance of wool lanolin would keep the traveler dry enough to prevent them from becoming soaked, and possibly keep them completely dry. They also are loose-fitting and allow evaporated sweat to escape and are naturally breathable. They also don't hold condensation well because of the massive surface area of wool. When people think wool, they think warm, and that's true to a point. However, the different thicknesses of cloaks, kilts, ponchos, etc. would keep the wearer cooler or warmer in different climates. I'd highly recommend giving one a try, at the risk of looking like a Jacobite rebel or a hobbit taking a ring to Mordor.
Let's be honest, just about everyone would want to look like a hobbit taking the ring to Mordor while backpacking.
I use the Poncho from Sea To Summit. Light, small package and really good protection. Bonus, it also protects your backpack.
Layering is always the key and a Ponch is a great top layer.
its almost like 5000 years of walking outdoor has already figured out best way for different situation.
Why did cape went out of style?!
I do reenactment and Larp. And when the weather gets too bad outside, the period clothes come out, and I stop caring about wether people look at me funnily.
Wool lined with linnen is simply the best.
A lot of expensive outdoor hunting gear is made out of wool for a reason. It insulates even when wet if it ever gets wet
I agree with the poncho. It took a long time for me to appreciate it. I spent years in combat units and a couple years overseas. It was when I came home and used traditional rain gear while being outdoorsy... that I realized how much the poncho did for me. Its a transformer. Having a tent like place to tuck into to perform tasks is invaluable. You ever try to use a smartphone with wet hands? Tuck into your poncho, dry your hands, then pull your phone out and use it while inside of the poncho. Or taking a break, setting up a small stove... having the ponch to go from rain jacket to tarp like mini tent is just the way to go. Its always in my EDC bag.
This guy understands. Army surplus poncho is a wet weather life saver. It can be buttoned up or worn loose. Build a fire and huddle close and it functions like a greenhouse. Anything you can do with a tarp you can do with that style of poncho, ie Converts into an A frame shelter, lean to, teepee style, ground cover or a water proof cover for all your gear. Multiple ponchos can be snapped together, if you are hiking with others and you guys bought the same style. They are a bit on the heavy side, if you are an ultra light hiker, but I'm the type of guy that hikes a full back camp chair, 60lb pack be damned, I want to be comfortable when I get to camp.
Just a fun idea: your skin is mostly waterproof and dries alot faster than wet clothing. If you are hiking in summer, try stripping down when it starts to rain. I remember as a kid that we were out on a hike with friends and my best friend stripped down to his underwear when it started to rain. While everyone of us got really wet and drenched, his clothes stayed dry. It was the peak of august, so 30°, thus cooling out was no worry.
Smart guy. Hope he had good taste in undies.
I worked as a summer camp counselor for many years. One super rainy summer I just had my bathing suit on most of the time with maybe some quick dry shorts.
My mom used to yell at me for doing that, I'd strip down to bare essentials cause a tank top and shorts dries a lot better than a jacket and pants.
30c plus water can still give you hypothermia because your core temperature is 36C.
@@maudbrewster9413 Only if it rains hard enough to get soaked and there is a moderate to strong wind. And even that is up for debate. People can swim for hours in 20C or 25C water without having to worry about hypothermia. Worst case scenario, just grab an umbrella if the rain lasts for more than half an hour.
Capes were made for a reason. I've got a 70s era German rain cloak, and it works wonders. And being a cloak, it can also double as a tarp when camping.
What’s it made out of
Go poncho worked great for me on field stuff in always raining Hawaii
I have it too
@@b22chris rubber
@@b22chris I couldn't tell you. Maybe rubber? Maybe fabric coated with plastic?
Nice experiment, and I guess the umbrella and rain kilt can work for you in these circumstances. But there's another factor that needs consideration: terrain. If I'm in (high) mountains and on steep trails, I want to have my hands free for balance. So a rain jacket, on top of the aforementioned wind protection, also provides maximum mobility.
Make a head-band attachment your umbrella to wear as a giant hat. I have seen them. 😅
Maybe for those circumstances you can attach the umbrella to the backpack in some way, so that it keeps you dry while having your hands free
And then some wind come and both fly away
A lot of (mountain) hikes in Japan end up having you climb over/squeeze through rocks. Also, many times you go through dense vegetation, and tight areas. For most of the hikes I’ve been on here, an umbrella would be very cumbersome and overall would get in the way.
But I know exactly how you feel! When it starts drizzling, I always hope, “Ah it will probably stop soon.” I just put my rain over over my pack and keep on going. I dread putting my rain jacket on, just because I get so sweaty. However, I absolutely love my rainjacket when I reach peaks/summits, just because it keeps me warm by blocking off all the wind.
Umbrellas are super light, and don't take up any space, when you pack them up. I don't think in any scenario's umbrellas are "very cumbersome"
@@GummBo3 no he means when you have them opened and have to hold it over your head. that can be kind of cumbersome when you're going through dense vegetation or need to have your hands free to do stuff.
just having to hold this thing up all day can get kind of annoying.
@@zwenkwiel816 Yeah, pack it up and use your hand, but having an umbrella on your person, to use if convenient is not problem.
I'm not a really experienced hiker but I found that using a cheap rain poncho was the best. It has open sides so I can air out on the sides and I can place it over my backpack as well so it covers me and the backpack but lets me remain cool.
Exactly! Poncho is the best deal. Here I can get a nice one for less than USD 10. And it works wonders.
@@gesangmanggala9966 here you can get 1 for $2.50. THIS IS THE WAY!
And it's really tiny when wrapped up.
I’ve thought the same thing. Growing up in Boy Scouts many years ago, we all used ponchos. No one had goretex back then. The ponchos worked great.
2nd this. Spent a lot of time in the field as a soldier. I lived and died by a smuggled multicam goretex poncho in wet field conditions. Also its superversetile, can be rigged up as a shelter, laid on the ground, and is big enough go cover our ruck on the go or in a halt.
A over clothing rain poncho is amazing, like those old military ones. It goes over you, your pack and gear. And since it has plenty of space between your body as it’s not something you wear per say, but drape over yourself, has proven to solves all this problems and more. Old Surplus Military gear can be and effective gear setup, I recommend
Yes!
I just rediscovered my nice camping poncho that my mum gave me when I was a boy (teenager) scout. It still fits fine, and is so drafty that I've had none of the problems biking with it like with 'breathable' rain coats . A poncho over a hoodie, rain pants over my legs, and I am all good for our summer rain storms in Montreal.
I will see how this setup can hold up come fall and winter.
Yeah, poncho is the way to go. Stuffed into its own separate bag carabinered to your pack for easy access.
I live in a very rainy area and have been using ponchos since I was a kid. I’ve experimented with other gear, but I always return to the poncho.
Right? People don't realize how how good it is. It might not look as good by is far more useful
Problem: Rain plus strong wind.
@@gottfriedmayrock1967 waterproof pants and a poncho that clips under the crotch
I see a lot of people discussing umbrellas and wind. Surprised no one has mentioned the Storm Umbrella. Developed by a University student in the Netherlands (TU Delft). It works really well, obviously in the Netherlands we get a LOT of wind but this one is undeterred and you can even cycle with it just fine. Think the original is by Senz company but probably a lot more out there these days.
Here in Norway we use wet equipment and dry equipment. Wet is for walking dry or wet, typically Goretex jacket with wool shirt and trousers if it’s cold. Then we have a set dry wool and dry wind protection jacket. Not much weight. For protection when eating from rain and wind we use a 6x4 feet tarp that’s rain protected with a layer aluminum on the inside to sit under to shield ourself from wind and rain. Once inside body temperature quickly dry wet wool shirt on body, and we are warm. The tarp can be used as a poncho aswell, or used over the tent as an extra layer on top if there’s a lot of rain. Easy.
Too much wind here for me to try that. If the umbrella doesn't turn inside out the wind will just blow the rain all over me anyway
I relate, it’s easy to spot tourists in my city whenever you see them chasing their umbrella. And that’s down at sea level, hiking here is almost exclusively above the tree line
It is trip dependent.
That's why combo umbrella and jacket is the best, jacket will be wet but not completely soaked through. Otherwise you need to hide in shelter anyway 😅
Ditto. I live in Scotland and our backcountry areas are really exposed to the wind so wind gusts of 60 or 70 MPH are common. The umbrella would last five minutes.
Same here in Ireland - there's always wind...always! So holding an umbrella steady in a gale isn't going to work.
And the rain is never far away either
My dad hiked the E5 long distance trail through the Alps like 20 years ago. It rained and they wore jackets etc, then they met a guy that was painting the trail markers. He wore t-shirt, shorts, and had an umbrella. He said its the only way to truly stay dry.
How did he paint the wet trail markers 🧐
@@garrethtinsley2435 The E5 trail markers are just a red, a white, and then another red line on random rocks / trees along the path, you can do that on wet rocks/ trees too.
@@y0uRF4t3 R/TiL lol
@@y0uRF4t3haha, I would not trust that. Especially in the alps or any mountains. Why? Because of wind, your umbrella will fold and or you get wet from the side and from the top 😅
CAN U SHEEP WAKE UP.... hes literally AFF marketing linking all this shit to get commission hes a sellout...... STOP ROBBING URSELF...omg
The umbrella idea is definitely interesting. It would really depend on your hike, those trails were pretty wide. From my experience there's a number of times where I'm digging my way threw trees so it wouldnt work. But on the other hand set up is super easy and I could use that for lunch and if you do get it big enough it would help to keep your pack dry. I definitely will consider it!
Here is a secret: GoreTex is water tight OR breathable. Not water tight AND breathable. When the GoreTex surface is covered by water, it won't breathe anymore.
"Only one solution." I've provide another alternative that I used during my decades working in MT/WY large wildernesses. Note: this is for the physically intense labor of clearing trails, digging trails, and hard hiking while leading pack stock. I knew I was going to get wet from sweat regardless of wearing rain gear and an umbrella was completely impractical. So I would wear wool layers on my upper body and rain pants for the the constant brushing against wet brush. I would get wet, but the warmth I generated by hard work kept me sufficiently warm and more comfortable than clammy rain gear. I would have a dry change of clothes for when I hit camp with rain gear to wear during the low activity part of the day. This would work well for the PNW were you were hiking and the warmer months in the intermountain west. If I was inactive, e.g. riding I would wear rain gear as an umbrella and pack stock aren't really compatible. I do own both a Golite umbrella and CF rain skirt for simple back packing.
Exactly what I thought. People have been using wool for weather protection for centuries. For outer wear you would usually use "unwashed" wool though, which still has a lot of its natural wool fat. While modern garments usually have their wool fat stripped off, you can add it back in. You can buy a jar of lanolin and dissolve it in warm water and a little detergeant, then soak your garments in this to weatherproof them. While this wa of wheatherproofing also works with other natural fibres (oilskins, waxed canvas), wool is by far the best at regulating body temperature and the only one that still keeps you warm even if it does get wet.
totally agree on the wool part is cool when weather is warm is warm when weather is cold its takes a good time to get wet but when wet it still gives you insulation and you stay warm
Lmao this reminds of my mom telling me about how how great great grandpa was the captain of ship and all the sailors would wear woolen sweaters to deal with the cold ocean where they’d obviously get wet being fishermen
This my preferred method for the summer. Just sacrifice a t-shirt to the rain while on the move. Hang it up at camp. Maybe it will dry, maybe you'll have to put on a wet shirt the next day before heading out again. Oh well, it's summer!
As others have said, the kilt and umbrella combo works in some situations, but it really doesn’t work outside of a gentle walk on a wide and well-maintained trail in the woods. Though traditional rain gear has plenty of issues, I’m sticking with it as every single hike I go on involves at least one of either rock scrambling, off-track walking through scrub, scrubby and narrow trails, or windy mountains. The rain where I live is usually sideways. The umbrella is pretty useless in all of these situations and the kilt is definitely not suited to rock scrambling or any situation with scrub that will brush against my lower legs.
Yeah, the umbrella isn't the right tool in hard, driving sleet, or in very dense forest. But it's useful surprisingly often. We have dense forest and alpine rocky ground in NZ (often a mere 15 minute walk apart), and rocky riverbeds too, and I can use the umbrella in most places I've been.
The Zpacks umbrella is also robust, mine has been going for about five years, and it's great as a wind break in conditions that aren't too cold (both for walking and while resting, or even if the wind changes while you're under a tarp at night), and it's awesome as a sunshade--much better than a hat on hot sunny days. When it's not in use, it straps to a trekking pole and I don't notice it.
So, why not add one? It's minimal extra weight and you may be surprised how useful it is. Keep your raingear, though: we always carry both. Sometimes we use everything. 🙂
@@gregvanpaassen Interesting! Maybe one day. I’m in Tasmania so fairly similar terrain :)
Couldn't agree more. An umbrella might be OK if walking on garden paths like this, but cmon, if pushing through thick scrub or climbing up steep rock/shingle slopes and especially above the treeline ie. real hiking not trail walking, it would be as useful as tits on a bull. I never wear long pants hiking, always shorts and gaiters. Wet legs dry in no time at all. If its especially cold I have a pair of cut off merino leggings. They'll keep you warm when wet whilst never getting saturated despite heavy rain. Have had umpteen rain jackets over the years and the only one that has ever come close to keeping me dry inside is an Arcteryx Beta AR.
Could tell you're in Tasmania just from this comment hahaha. Truth is these types of videos do not cater to us. The weather here is cooked and most people from overseas have no idea what they are talking about
Ya I wondering about the usefulness of an umbrella in dense forests and low hanging branches, and the rain kilt seems to restrict movement of your legs so if your going up a steep incline or climbing big rocks it seems too restrictive. Most of my hiking experience is in Canada and it’s usually cold when it’s raining like 10-15 degrees so I never really get hot, I’m also not a big sweater so I guess that’s a bonus.
When I was hiking the Appalachian trail, I tried fully covering up the first time it rained. I ended up soaked with sweat after a few minutes. From then on I would just take rain as a chance for a free shower, and only use my jacket when it was windy or cold. This was mostly in the summer, so hypothermia was less of an issue. When we got cold rain in the fall, the only thing to do was cover up and move slowly enough that we didn’t sweat much.
Umbrellas only have one mortal enemy: Wind. If it's windy and an umbrella catches some wind, it's instantly useless.
Historically, wool was great for outerwear because it’s somewhat water-repellent, but it also can absorb a truly stupid amount of water before feeling wet. It can get heavy from this, but you are drier than you’d be with plastic. Also, combining that with a linen underlayer, which is great at wicking away sweat while also being antimicrobial, helps a lot too. It’s maybe not perfect, but out ancestors would have looked askance at the plastic raincoat hotbox approach, too.
Exactly. I came here to say this.
Id rather wear poly than have the feeling of wet wool against my skin.
@@DBZHGWgamer yeah man, that’s why you use a lining like linen lol.
@@DBZHGWgamermerino wool can be as soft as cotton. If the wool you are wearing against your body feels terrible, it’s cheap
IIRC there was a UK (probably BBC?) non-fiction TV show in which they took a number of modern pro mountaineers out in Victorian woollen mountaineering gear. The wool took a while to soak through and performed very well until then, but when it finally did saturate the wearers would have been in serious trouble.
Another good technique is having a a wet outfit and dry outfit. Sounds crazy but it’s what was taught to me in Ranger school and works quite well. Because you can easily overheat or get soaked from sweat while moving with waterproof outer layers (granted this assumes you have a heavy pack and/or moving briskly) you instead have one outfit that you wear while moving that is warm, breathable, and not waterproof. It gets wet and unless it dries stays wet. Your movement and body heat keeps you warm and can also even dry it if the rain ceases. Then when you’ve gotten to your next base camp, patrol base etc and are stationary you switch into your dry clothes with your waterproof shit on. It can make for some extremely uncomfortable moments during cold mornings when you have to change back into the semi-frozen, damp wet outfit at the beginning of your movement tho lol.
Yep this is the way. Multi day backpacking and bushwhacking in temperate rainforests I found I could not stay dry no matter what I tried. Having a dry set of clothes to change into made it tolerable. But yeah it took some self convincing to put on the wet clothes in the morning. I found it was best to stay in the dry clothes until the last minute and put on the wet stuff only when I was about to be moving around so I could warm up the clothes with my body heat.
Basically pack a good sweatshirt? That's what I do as they're great as kind of a towel against sweat and excellent at building heat when there's not much in terms of weather problems.
This is very much my approach as a horseman, and yes, likewise taught to me by the military (in my case, British Army). This is the way.
couldn't agree more.. at least for me, I'll wear my rain gear in the elements exclusively and make sure I have dry clothes to switch into out of elements. Plus my feet blister in moisture at the sight of water so no way around bringing extra wool or blended socks, flip flops to dry them. I just switch between rain gear and dry depending.
Camp discipline is life: there are different requirements for staying still in camp vs moving actively. The reality is that there is NOTHING that will keep you dry for 3-4 days of rain while hiking in the underbrush at just-above-freezing temepratures. But the goal isn't to be dry, it's to be warm. Baselayer+fleece will keep you comfortable even when continuously being wetted by a drizzle as long as you're moving. Add a gortex and you'll be good even in a downpour. The problem is that when you stop, you NEED something dry to give you enugh warmth and it needs to stay dry day-in-day-out (especially when you get sub-zero temps at night). Cold mornings suck, but better than having hypothermia.
That said, ponchos/umbrellas are GREAT, but the real tradeoff is in safety/versatility for comfort. If you have a goretex jacket and a down undersuit you can pretty much stay in camp indefinitey and be safe. Not so much with an umbrella. A good poncho is ALMOST as good as gortex, unless you have to bushwack, then you're gonna get wet (and it's gonna get ripped). If you know the weather and terrain these are acceptable tradeoffs: west coast trail in summertime I'd never both bringing a gortex jacket, and high mountains in dry season an umbrella is probably fine (if you have a good windshirt and some warm layers). But the reason gortex is preferred is that it represents an "oh shit" backstop for the worst case scenario: subzero nights with barely above zero heavy rain in the daytime. Obviously you won't be comfortable, but if you have to spend a few weeks in those conditions while maintaining mobility, comfort was never really an option.
What a coincidence, me and my friend just had a 10km hike across a rainy swamp. I had my poncho (a full one, not a openable jacket) and my friend was toting an umbrella.
What I noticed is that while I did get sweaty a little, flapping and slowing the pace helped fast, plus I could push through the foliage without a second thought. My friend was well ventilated and could adjust easily in the erratic weather, but she had to close the thing to get through wet brush and when the wind picked up she had the option of either not seeing where she was going or getting soaked.
Basically pick your poison kinda deal, both options slowed us down a bit in their own way.
Just did a quick 10km training walk in the rain with a 24kg sandbag. Didn’t want to sweat in gortex so decided to just get drenched. Then I remembered this video and took a small umbrella. Sensational!! Sweated like crazy but stayed dry from rain. Could easily take phone out to check distance and time. Dry to drink water under the brolly. Great idea.
The condensation issue in breathable jackets is not just an issue in cold weather, it's an even bigger one in warm weather. You very rapidly completely overpower whatever level of breathability it has. I've spent a lot of time in cold climates and hot, humid tropical climates, and things like GoreTex works *much* better in the colder climates than in the warmer ones.
In warmer weather I tend to use an umbrella and a poncho (an actual poncho, not that silly unzipped jacket, when I can, or just get wet. Sometimes that latter is the best option in terms of comfort and practicality (an umbrella does not at all work when you're dealing with fieldwork in a secondary growth hilly jungle).
A proper rain poncho has a few key advantages. It can cover your pack (which also means more ventilation for you), and you can quickly turn it into an impromptu tarp to cover a sitting area when you're taking a break.
I agree. In colder climates it works surprisingly well, especially if there is a heavy wind to cool you down and incentivize vaporization overall.
My overall favourite hiking weather is 5-10°C with a heavy wind. 😅 Not super cold, but cold enough to keep cool with a hard shell.
Exactly. Breathable fabric works best when there's a big difference between the inside and outside temperature.
I love my umbrella and use it frequently, with and without a rain shell (frogg toggs Extreme lite) depending on the conditions. But there is an alternative you didn't mention.
Growing up in Hilo Hawaii, people would visit and when they realize how often it rains they would ask "what do you do when it rains?" To which we answer: "Get wet." If you change your plans because it is raining you would never do anything.
In the tropics and even in other areas (e.g. just did the Trans Catalina Trail 50F and rain/fog, and I live in the PNW), in the right conditions, wearing material that dries quickly I can simply get wet without care. I do carry a dry base layer for sleeping in, but that is part of my normal gear anyway.
If as an adult, you haven't spent the day walking in the rain, soaked to the bone, and splashing in the puddles like a 5 year old...I feel sorry for you. You have no idea what you are missing. ;-D
So true :) I can personally attest that this works in colder weather too, if you're willing to wear a wool outer layer in the rain. Good temperature control, breathability, majority of water shed, and a warm fire at camp dries you off in minutes. LindyBeige and Fandabi Dozi have also experimented with this.
I currently live on Oahu and my problem is always, no matter if it's raining or not, if I put on a rain jacket I will be wet from sweat because it's so hot. But up on the Ko'olau ridge you dry off so quick with the constant wind that once it stops raining you're dry not long after.
You reminded me of one of my favorite memories: Buddy and I did a charity run, but they canceled and turned it into a walk around the block with umbrellas but the course was still setup. So my buddy and I decided to run it in the dumping rain anyway. I don't even recall if I had blisters it was so fun.
Polypropylene is a nice material/fabric to wear in the rain. Silicone coated polyester is pretty good too (though doesn't wick). Wool is ok. My ancestors (Highland Scots) probably used a more ideal form of wool i.e. more lanolin rich/soaked, which would have really increased the water resistance. Modern wool, once it is wet, it stays wet for a long time, and while it is slightly warmer when wet as compared to many other fabrics--it is not ideal.
@@justinw1765 And soaked wool is heavy! Fisherman's wool (that you re-lanolin after washing) is a good choice for mild rain.
That was sooo good. My husband and I laughed as we visualised crawling through Tasmanian horizontal with a kilt on.
Great videos so informative and helpful.
I agree with your assessment of rain jackets.
I did not know there was such an item as a "rain kilt". Thank you! I will put it on my list of items to get ahead of my next hiking vacation.
As a mountain biker watching your channel, please make sure you are careful when riding motor bikes on Mountain bike trails. Most often they are not accepted on sanctioned mtb trails because they destroy the work that the builders spent a lot of time and money on
100% agree
There are plenty of shared use moto MTB trails in my area. Usually it's the easier trails that get torn up in the rain by novice dirt bike riders digging holes with their rear tire.
I suppose it depends on who owns that land.
Perhaps it is public land
I didn't see him destroying anything. I probably cause more damage on my mountain bike just from braking. I really think this kind of attitude is more damaging than any minor trail erosion an ebike may cause...
After trying out many different set-ups in my very rainy home country Germany, I ended up with:
- Umbrella (Doppler Zero at 99 grams)
- Rain Kilt Vertice (Zpacks at 68 grams)
- Calve Gaiters Vertice (Zpacks modified at 51 grams) - unfortunately the vertice version is no longer available
and a
- Rain jacket (Berghaus Hyper 100 XL at 111 grams)
Rain Kilt and Calve Gaiters together are nearly as protective as rain pants.
In total 329 grams (11.61 oz), but I have all the possibilities for all kinds of weather situations 😎
I don't swear by ponchos because they keep me dry, but because they keep my pack dry. Sounds like a sweet kit though.
I am similar to you except I add rain socks + no umbrella because its ALWAYS too darn windy
An umbrella which was light, a sun shade, waterproof and did not turn inside out in the wind - that’s what I’m after! Rain dripping off your rain jacket onto your legs - sucks. Perhaps lightweight waterproof chaps / long gaiters instead of a rain kilt?
I hiked twice for 2 weeks since I'm back in Germany. I'm working for a hotel with golf course so taking vacation in summer is a bit difficult. The 2 hikes took place in December and November. I took my umbrella with me for rain protection. My jacket kept me warm and is waterproof, too. Additionally I brought waterproof pants for additional protection and warmth. In my opinion an umbrella makes sense because theoretically you don't get wet from above. It worked pretty well for me. For the next hike I will make a holder for the umbrella and need to get different shoes because my feet did hurt at camp.
Who would had ever thought an umbrella is good at protecting you from the rain? Lol
Before a pilgrimage, my wife and I were faced with a similar question. After some research, we decided on an umbrella with UV protection (Swing liteflex trekking umbrella). This experience completely changed my view on the subject and I have been totally enthusiastic about it ever since! On hot days, you can use the umbrella as an absolutely solid source of shade. When it rains, the umbrella is big enough to keep you almost completely dry. You can also attach it securely to your rucksack and have your hands free.
The umbrella in your video seems a bit too small to really do its job when hiking! Try a bigger one. It's fantastic.
I grew up in the south west of the UK. It's rarely raining with no wind and so even if it's not cold (which it often is as well) with the rain coming in at acute angles you'll find it hard to keep dry. For me a large poncho (modern materials but like the military style works best. It can cover me and the pack and can also work as a tarp if I needed, when combined with a liner I've got a sleep system too.
My partner and I attached an umbrella to a hiking pole. The extended pole allows us to hold it more easily when the umbrella is open while also doubling up as a hiking pole when closed. The wind can make the umbrella more challenging to use but can be managed if you actively angle it in the right direction. The other thing I wanted to mention is that an umbrella is helpful in the sun as well as the rain. We make sure to bring our umbrella-hiking pole when we're in the desert and any trail that has little to no tree cover.
Can you share how you did this modification? Can you stake it into the ground as some use their trekking poles as tent stakes, but use only the pole-umbrella as standing shelter for a short time?
try a golfer's umbrella they're usually big enough for 2 plus your packs
your partner? like someone you work with?...if not then dont be generic
@@granitejeepc3651what
@@granitejeepc3651lover, colleague, walking buddy... How does knowledge of that affect the commentary on rain gear? Doesn't seem like it's our business, or relevant.
I think it'd be difficult using an umbrella in the locations I usually hike in. Too much wind on open moorland, generally. Might think about a kilt, but generally in the seasons I'd use one I wear shorts anyway, and skin is waterproof. I only really wear waterproof over trousers when it's windy in summer.
I struggle with sweating in rain gear nowadays (well, sweating in general tbh; I'd like to say it's age but it's definitely lack of fitness & increased weight over the last two and half years). I have to make a mental note to just slow down and try to exert myself less if I'm clobbering up for rain. Which I generally fail to do, especially on ascents.
When it's windy and the rain is coming in sideways an umbrella doesn't really do much anyway. Otoh you usually sweat less in windy conditions...
My wife and I regularly use our Zpacks umbrellas as wind breaks. The Zpacks is by far the best we have found for standing up to the wind. We're in New Zealand, which is in the "roaring forties": we know a little about wind. I have her original one (five years old), she has one, and she's bought another for "Sunday best". 🙂
They're also parasols in the hot sun. The shading you get on a hot day is sooo good. Much cooler than having to wear a hat. We use velcro ties to strap the Zpacks to our trekking poles, so they're out of the way when we don't need them. They are standard equipment on every hike for us. Give one a try - you might like it!
@@gregvanpaassen what other umbrellas have you used that makes you say the zpacks is best in wind. Just curious as ive been looking into getting an umbrella and a few other companies have good options(six moons designs, gossamer gear)
Totally agree with your conclusions and have been walking with a largish umbrella (no kilt) with some desirable results, until the wind picked up! Then the umbrella morphs into a sail and sails need to be reefed when the wind gets up and the only reef available with an umbrella is 'fold-down'! Thanks for your work.
I do that for years and love it. Cool to see that somebody else uses an umbrella
My wife and I did Four Pass Loop last August. We took all rain gear but mostly used the umbrellas. It was way more convenient to grab during the small drizzles and helped with the sun exposure
I've used an umbrella for 6-7 years on many backpacking trips in Alaska, JMT, Oregon and the French alps. An added benefit is keeping your glasses dry, not having to rely on a hat or hood to keep your head dry in the rain, and protecting a camera or binoculars in a light rain. I also carry/use a rain jacket, rain pants or chaps, and a home made rain kilt, and rain mitts depending on conditions. I almost always attach the umbrella to my pack so my hands are free. Sure the wind is too strong at times, but don't diss it until you try one. Only a sturdy full size lightweight umbrella with fiberglass or carbon fiber struts, not a folding "travel" umbrella. Zpacks, Six moon Designs, Gossamer gear all have good ones. 6.5-8 oz. And they are also great for shade on hot sunny hikes.
Thanks for the very informative video. I'm a big fan of using a poncho and have been doing so for at least 35 years. Many years ago I got a North Face Gortex rain jacket and never liked it while hiking. It trapped sweat and was always hot and clammy. These days I use a poncho while hiking. I use the ultra-light Frogg Togg rain jacket in camp. The poncho also has the advantage of being used as an emergency shelter. I'll have to try an umbrella but they seem to be hard to use if it is windy and difficult to use if you are using trekking poles.
I walked the Kokoda track many years ago. We experienced rain that you could walk on. My veteran guide popped a golf umbrella and walked 120km and came out bone dry from the jungle. I was converted since that day.
As someone who has traveled /hiked solo for decades and just couldn't carry everything, I find that a rain jacket is absolutely important unless it's never ever dropping below 22C (72F). Any cool wind can chill you fast, even to hypothermia especially when stopped. I tend to travel longer term also, rather than short hikes - so that rain jacket is just good all round warmth that I can layer. BUT I find my most important thing is NOT using the rainjacket hat and using a separate one. So much more comfort but also a lot more breathability.
And then if it's really coming down I throw the rain hood over a small hat and it helps hold the jacket hood in a better position.
I bought an umbrella for my last trip with the idea of protection from the sun in high heat places (egypt, jordan etc) as well as super rain (Georgia in the caucasus would have been a bit nice) but ended up not bothering bringing it.
You don't really need a hardshell for 21C, even when there's some rain a windshirt over a fleece will do the job as long as you keep moving. It's 10C and POURING will screw you when you skimp on raingear, but lots of places just don't get that combo.
@Graeme Hill well I think you are missing important thinking about risks and nature then . Maybe spent less time outdoors.
If you get sweaty and have to stop you get cold. If theres any wind, even much much warmer than 21, its easy to get a chill. Shivering from adrenaline and pain sucks with extra cold. Also if you just simply stop for lunch. Mountains and high elevation breeze are much colder also than the day seems when walking. A shell is just smart to have. PLUS you need to remember that bigger people and men tend to produce more heat so maybe you don't need one in a chill but they're very smart to have. When i say "unless its never dropping below 22" i mean at NIGHT.
@@AdventuressAli I think we're probably agreeing on principle and may just have different personal experiences/expectations; you're quite right to point out I'm a big dude who runs hot. And to be fair, when I am talking about "need" I am usually talking about "at risk of dying/hypothermia without", not a risk of (severe) discomfort. My knees and back are not good, so keeping pack weight down for me is usually worth a lot of discomfort for the odd day of bad weather!
That said, no argument with your point that you need something to stop wind from freezing you, even at warm-ish temperatures, and especially at altitude. My only quibble is that for me that's probably a windshirt/DWR pants, with a silnylon poncho as my rain gear, and that together they weigh less than my gortex and offer more comfort/versatility for everything outside of winter (under 5C and raining/snowing) or shoulder season bushwacking (15C and pouring).
Regarding night time, I find that if it's not SUSTAINED rain, my poncho+down undersuit is good to around zero C, but you can't keep it dry for 3-4 nights of evening rain if you're setting up camp each time. In those conditions, I want a hard shell to protect it anyway, so I'll leave my shirt/poncho at home. And honestly, if you're dealing with several days of near freezing nights and windy days with driving rain, I'm probably going to just bail early, because the effort necessary to make that trip comfortable is just not worth it.
YMMV, and a lot is going to be dependent on your route, climate, and personal tolerances.
@Graeme Hill it keeps looking like you're actually in full agreement with me but quibbling about the word rain jacket. When talking about having Any outter cover vs only an umbrella, I am saying a jacket is needed and for good reason.... arguing semantics on what a jacket may be is cool but you're actually in agreement with me. a poncho being a great example. An ultralight option is fine as long as it holds to emergency needs. Ponchos are a great lightweight option rainjacket.
And can double as a lot of other things, far more than classic jackets.
I have used umbrellas for 40 years now even in the foothills in the Himalayas (where all the locals use them). For $10 they deal with most sun and rain problems. They are very easy to attach to the rucksack shoulder strap, if you're practically minded. Most of my treks are 3 weeks or more and I would never go without a lightweight umbrella/parasol.
CAN U SHEEP WAKE UP.... hes literally AFF marketing linking all this shit to get commission hes a sellout...... STOP ROBBING URSELF...omg
I finally tried an umbrella and I will never be without one. It is pretty easy to attach an umbrella to a pack. Even around camp I found it was so handy to quickly keep the rain off of something I didn't want to get wet. It bought me time and I could just set it down if the rain stops.
I did this that umbrella and kilt through Philmont. Worked great. Even at camp it was easy. Plus entry into the tent while raining was so much less problematic.
Tried everything mentioned. Great point on the umbrella at camp!👍 IMO, the ultimate solution, yet, is a Dyneema poncho with straps and an inner fabric/mesh layer. Waterproof + stable in wind + warm at camp + ventilation + cover backpack + whatever you ask for, BUT, likely very expensive😂
Any recommendations on brands that make the dyneema ponchos?
@@ZachSprowls Zpacks sells dyneema Ponchos, expensive for a poncho as usual for the obvious reason. But with no inner comfortable layer. While backpacking in Philmont for 11 days during the monsoon season with rains every day, all Nylon based rain gears, no matter cheap/expensive, got soaked through after hours of rains. Eventually, widely cutting out a large plastic trash bag into a poncho won 😂😂😂
I learned this the hard way trekking in N. Vietnam . The heat and humidity had me soaked to the bone in my goretex and hiking boots. Luckily I'm a quick learner and I quickly adopted the local garb, shorts, tee shirt, flip-flops and an umbrella. Lesson learned.
And when the killer vietnamese sun comes out remember to protect your skin, either by applying sunscreen, dressing up with light, long clothing or staying under the umbrella after the rain too
@kevinw.weiser9820 you are not a quick learner
Been to Vietnam twice. Fully agree. Umbrellas aren't even that common unless you plan to be in the rain for a long time. Most just wait it out or use a plastic poncho if they need to use a scooter.
@@mustardofdoom I call them water burqas
Have you ever heard about ankles-length rain poncho ?
I own one over 15 years. Heavy rain + wind in mountains = no problem.
It cost me 1/10 of price of gore-tex gear. 👍👍
Could you share brand?
I took a poncho and an umbrella on the Camino a few years back. It rained a lot that month. The beginning I relied on the poncho to stay dry but as the month went on I found myself using the umbrella more and more until I didn't need the poncho until the rain started flying sideways. I'm sold on the umbrella idea. To me it's worth the extra weight.. I would also like to mention that my poncho has a zipper on the front and it can be left wide open for ventilation.
I really like my poncho. For the most part if it's done up properly it provides great coverage for me and my pack, it's really light and very breathable, and it works around camp too Seems to me the umbrella/kilt system would be cumbersome, and I like walking with poles, so I would have to secure the umbrella somehow to my pack.
what poncho do you use?
I use the helicon poncho and swagman roll as I can use them as a tarp and sleeping back system in fair weather 👍
Ponchos are an excellent choice 👌🏻
Ponchos are great because you can do so much more with it than a rain coat. Depending on the kind you have you can even tie each corner to the trees to create a nice dry space like a light duty tarp during camp. I don't think I can just toss my poncho for an umbrella during a hike. I like to grab the trees around me to keep me stable when by the cliff side and I think the umbrella will just cause more problems than being more helpful.
I use a poncho too. Sometimes if it’s windy it’s a pain but it gas so much flexibility for other uses.
I gave up on breathable rain gear years ago. While on 80 mile bike ride in a heavy rain and the temperature just above freezing and traveling fast, my jacket totally delaminated. The warm body vapor passing through the fabric hitting the cold rain caused the fabric to fail. This has also happened to my son on a trip he was on. I have found a better solution is to forgo rain gear and only use it in camp. I now use Wool that I lanolize. I wear a wide brim felted wool, Western style hat, sometimes called a cowboy hat. Sometimes I carry a traditional Crusher hat, made of felted wool that folds and easy to carry. A good European felted wool will get damp, but never leaks and keeps the head warm and water out of the face. On my upper body I wear a tight weave wool shirt. Wool when wet retains 80% of its insolation value. Did you ever see a sheep shivering? While bike touring, or hiking, in warmish weather I sometimes I wear a short sleeve loose weave wool shirt. I would rather be wet and warm in wool than sweaty and clammy in raingear. While kayaking in S.E. Alaska it sometimes rains for nonstop for days. After a while you don't realize when it is raining or has stopped raining, strange as that sounds. But my Woolrich tight weave wool shirt never fails me. There is rain and then there is rain so heavy, ice cold and wind driven you are forced to stop because you can't see six ahead. That is why I carry my tent rain fly on any type of trip where it is easy to reach to protect myself. Studies show that a double layer of wool triples the rain protection and warmth.
I used to work in the oil and gas industry. We had the PVC rain suits which made you sweat as if you was not wearing it at all. Great video!
I carry a compact umbrella in my pack in addition to my rain gear. It's also nice for short or lighter rain showers when I don't necessarily need to mess with putting rain gear on and taking it back off. I have found it handy and recommend both. Haven't tried the kilt idea yet but I like it, will have to test that when I'm out next.
Very informative and helpful video . I have pretty much always known most of this from my Military days and hiking and camping trips . That is why I tended to use a German Hooded Military poncho a lot over me not a rain jacket so much and a waterproof Poncho can cover your gun also . Although I live in a warm climate and I do realize it gets more complicated in cold conditions . The main thing is if you get sweaty in cold conditions you must dry off and change cloths as soon as you stop exercising and before night fall when it gets even colder . I agree with Pneumaticcannon that fighting wind chill especially when you are all sweaty is important to fend of hypothermia . Sometimes in freezing conditions it's better to go slow and don't build up a sweat as much as possible . Have spare dry clothing and stop , light a fire warm up and dry out you sweaty garments . Spending all day in sweaty underclothing in freezing conditions can make you ill. Umbrellas don't work in the Jungle very well but big banana leave do . In my day I used a pack liner and a built in cover and spare clothes in zip sealed plastic bags , the Poncho also covers the pack and if you sit down , you , your gun and the pack are fully covered . In the jungle it's common to fall over fording creeks and rivers so you don't want your stuff inside the pack getting wet and it supplies buoyancy so you can swim a river using the pack as a floaty .
I'm a road and trail runner, and I honestly prefer just getting wet. In winter though I've found that windlayers are just as good if not better. I wear the adidas wind rdy line, and haven't had any issue with them wetting through or getting muggy. I kinda feel like mountain brands are overthinking what track and soccer brands already have figured out.
There's stuff that is designed for when you're moving and stuff that's designed for when you are not. If I am running or cross country skiing in winter, I am usually doing fine at 20 F with a wool baselayer and not much else. This is very far outside of what most outdoor apparel companies design for in their outer shells (and possibly why I see a lot of ski mountaineer youtubers leaving their absurdly expensive 3 layer goretex gear at home more often than not).
If I am hiking, I find that nothing beats an umbrella in the rain protection vs breathability tradeoff, but also that I can wear warmer stuff when its cold without having problems with fogging up.
Yeah if it's cold and wet I just throw on my thermals...im wet but nice and warm and it's a uniform feeling of warmth and wetness
An extremely thorough video, meticulously crafted with excellent composition and captivating content! It's a rare gem to come across on CZcams these days. Kudos from BeyondEclipseProduction! Well done!
Your videoes are so well made and produced!
This was an informative Q and A on the different gear and problems. It comes down to an accurate evaluation of the environment you are going to be in and its possible extremes. There will always be drawbacks to some of these but that's part of the outdoor adventure, A little Wet, A little Hot or Cold, Windy, Dirty Etc...
One method from history was a treated cloak. You get a breathable thick fabric that keeps the rain off and keeps you a relatively ok temp. The cloak eventually gets a bit damp, but it depends on the exact situation you get put in.
Poncho and cloak are kinda the same thing aren’t they?
@@youtubecopyrights Slightly different design, but you do have a good point
I originally made myself a hooded cloak for Halloween with dirt cheap jute fabric sold to protect topiary...
One, it was way way warmer then I ever expected a fabric with a single digit thread count to be!
Second, it takes to rain like wool. Meaning it keeps you warm even when wet!
Third it is very very breathable, I meat it’s nearly a net it’s so roughly spun!
Finally it was very cheap (less then 15can$ for the bolt, and 20min with a knife and needle.
I’ve been in ice rain with it, it did go a bit stiff, but it held admirably.
I actually used this growing up in the sticks of the usa! Had a cheap cathartic coat with a shell, when i got hot I'd zip it open.
Umbrellas have a few drawbacks too though. Firstly they're cumbersome -- you either lose the mobility of one arm or you have to hope your backback can keep them steady, which isn't a given when moving through brush, high winds, etc. They're also mechanical and can fail at any time due to wind, branches, etc. They also provide little horizontal rain protection, and of course, don't block the wind. Granted if conditions are calm an umbrella can be a nice choice. I sometimes use both, leaving the jacket fully unzipped to provide enough airflow but also decent horizontal protection
Very interesting video!
I use a 1950's British military rain cape with a waterproof hat.
I love it because I get ventilation through the bottom and it doubles as rain protection for my backpack! :)
Damn, i believe you need this in the uk 😅
Try wool jackets - they are surprisingly water resistant, breath well and warm even when damp. I found that the problem with Goretex is when it wears (old age) the water comes through with none of the benefits of wool.
Just for my dail bike commuting I've actually been using a semi-waterproof soft shell jacket that has a bit of fleece on the inside. It works wonders. It prevents a little rain from getting you wet at all and even though it soaks when it pours it still keeps you warm and is windproof. Idk if I'd want it when I go hiking overnight, but for daily use it's absolutley great.
Gortex needs to be reconditioned in a hot dryer to keep working at maximum.
I find umbrellas work well until the conditions get windy enough. Either the umbrella catches the wind and eventually breaks, or the rain ends up at an angle difficult to block with the umbrella. Not as ventilated as a poncho, but a rain jacket with pit zips helps with ventilation as well.
had to sub, what an interesting video you had me hooked watched the whole video thanks for providing excellent knowledge to the public, big respect.
I do frogg toggs poncho with large hood (fits over a large pack) for hiking. Then I have extra rain gear for camp or if the temperature drops.
Sometimes I leave the extra rain gear behind and just bring the poncho if it’s a heat wave and the nights are equally hot. The poncho is enough in those climates.
I hike regularly for around 20-25 years now, and I learned a lot. I live in a temperate continental/oceanic climate region. When hiking, I never use any rain coat or jacket. I know that I sweat excessively, so I will be soaking wet under the jacket anyway. If it's summertime and warm, it is not really a problem - change the shirt after the rain, and I am good to go. If the weather is cold, I put on a wool sweather. It will be wet, but it is able to keep me warm enough to avoid getting a cold. If it is cold winter time, I put on a plain thin polyesther jacket with rolled-up sleeves to keep my core wind-free.
I agree that carrying both rain setups would probably be the best way to go, unless you're in cold or windy conditions, in which case, the traditional stuff works best. I poo-pooed the umbrella for a long time, but finally got it to use in very exposed conditions, and I was SO glad to have it this last summer! I haven't used it in the rain yet, but that's coming, I'm sure!
Fully agree. Even the very expensive so called waterproof jackets are just good enough for a short time in the rain.
But if it rains heavily for a long time, then you will be wet. The best I found was to put a poncho on, on top over my expensive jacket.
Great video once again and definitely a good question whether you should try the kilt and umbrella vs your typical raingear. I've been caught in some hardcore rainshowers in plenty of hikes and I always wore my poncho. I don't mind if my pants get wet from the knee down as long as my torso and upper leg region remain (fairly) dry due to the chance of hypothermia. So for rain I always went with the poncho.
But on my last winter hike in the German Black Forest with -9 degrees celsius and lots of snow I would really loved to have an umbrella with me. Even though I had a great warm jacket that protected me from the snow, my hat, buff and pants got soaked with snow/sleet and it did cool me down alot (and it was not pleasant). So for very snowy winter hikes I might switch to an umbrella and kilt. When I'm at camp I always try to use my poncho as a tarp over my tent just to keep the freezing winds and snow out of my way. I'm actually thinking to get an umbrella and kilt for these particular hikes as I'm typing this comment haha. Thanks for putting the real questions out there!
Cheers!
I started backpacking with an umbrella about 20 yrs ago. A large carbon fibre golf umbrella works great. I have one modified with a metal spike at the handle to anchor it in the ground. It’s big enough to sit under for a trail side snack. Once at camp it can serve as one pole for a tarp tent. It’s overall much more comfortable when hiking. Pack fits better and clothing stays drier.
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I thought about trying to attach an umbrella to a backpack, carrying one in my hands is just an absolute no go.
I would definitely advocate for a short cape such as the Varusteleka Luhka - throw it on over your normal clothes, T-shirt, fleece, whatever and it's like wearing a hands-free umbrella, plus you can wear your backpack underneath so it protects that as well.
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Nice solution! I can recommend Senz storm umbrellas. Senz is a wonderful umbrella and I love mine. I have yet to try it on a hike, but I will do that after seeing this! 👍😊 A rain poncho is another god alternativ that also protects the backpack. And an alternative I like is the Hilleberg Bivanorak. Larger than a normal rain jacket and as so more ventilating. It covers the backpack and can also be used to protect the sleeping bag.
The main hurdle with anything besides neoprene raingear is that in many situations you are hiking through wet Alders which slap against you and permeate any breathable gear or go under the umbrella. Also many high altitude locations hold 50-60 mph winds in fall
For me, I think the umbrella would get destroyed moving through brambles and brush, undergrowth, and dense woods; but on trail, might be a good fit. The best setup I used was a "ranger blanket" which is basically a military issue poncho with snaps and tassels. You can make it into a loose poncho, a snugged up poncho, a ground sheet, a small shelter, rain water catcher... I'm thinking a rain kilt and a ranger blanket are going to be a good pairing, just too bad it only came in cadpat camo lol
I'm living in northern Germany, we got wet windy weather. My favorite are rain jackets for hikes where it might rain or my long horse riding rain coat and neoprene rainboots for walking the dog through the woods when it rains all day. Yes I do sweat, but you can enlarge the lower half of the coat and while the rain comes from behind you open the front and it vents quite a bit. Only problem the thing is at 4lbs.
This is why I have a hard time with rain jackets. I like the soft shells that have fleece and water resistance. I find I keeps me pretty dry, and the fleece gets my sweat, but I don't feel it. But I haven't tried that in a downpour. It work s really well when I gotta shovel my driveway. Works good for an hour-two hours.
Thanks for sharing your insights on rain gear. For me personally a big poncho is the way to go. Because it‘s airy enough for me to not start sweating while hiking, gives me perfect protection in all circumstances no matter how hard the rain is and it‘s super easy to set up (when the weather is changing every hour for example, i just let the poncho hang over my backpack so i can pull it over my head whenever it starts raining again. I haven‘t seen a quicker system than this so far). Also i‘d prefer the poncho over an umbrella because i like to have two free hands for moving over obstacles or catch me in case i slip.
Silver Moon does make a kit to attach umbrella to backpack strap though🙂
As a hiker in the tropics, going through dense jungle greatly inhibits umbrella use. While I definitely prefer umbrellas over rain jackets so my arms aren't soaking wet, there's also the problem of extremely cold winds that come around the 2000 masl mark here in the mountains I've hiked in. Rain while on the trail is just a bad time here because it results in being cold AND wet. Perhaps a poncho could work but I'm afraid it would tear against the vegetation along the trail.. I've actually considered layering both breathable and non-breathable rain jackets for this reason, but I've yet to try it
I think thin layers are the way to go. If you can use it to manage the heat you generate underneath it. And how fast you can get what's wet to dry again. But that latter could be difficult in humid areas since you specifically mentioned the tropics.
For me, the main problem with both umbrella and goretex is higher weight and space in backpack it will take. Usually I like to hike a few days (3-7 days) from one mountain hostel to another and then it's really important to reduce weight and space of different gear, especially when it's winter and I have to take warm clothes, crampons, ice axe etc. And I can fit it into 38L backpack ;)
Thanks so much over this video, no matter what jackets i have had in my long distance hiking and adventures have always been wet inside . In bad weather hate wearing a jacket . I am a person who wears a long arm tshirt temo depends on weather. Learned also in my 24 hours 100kms walks in very bad weather a jacket is useless, and i have found your body drys your clothing while moving fast .
I use old school Helly Hansen from Norway. It is the best rain gear by a far amount. Kinda stiff with double walls, and it rests solely on your shoulders with plenty of room for evaporation. Use wool longsleeve when it's cold and use synthetic T-shirt for summer and you are golden.
I would add that it depends on a terrain, climate and general geographical region where you hike. I'm a hiking guide in Balkans and Dinaric Alps, and from my experience, depending on different factors all three options work in a way. Maybe for me, poncho is the best for rain overall, but in general I always carry my jacket because it's more versatile.
Poncho: I carry it only when I know there will be heavy rain. In general I share everything you said about poncho, it's breathable, lightweight, your hands are free etc. The downside is when you are using your hands while climbing (or cable or you are on via-ferata) because it just gets in the way and it's not safe. Also poncho has to be used with hiking poles, otherwise it has the same effect as a goretex jacket. I found it better in forest than jacket, just because that excess moisture that can escape (especially when you have to stand for a longer time to wait a thunder storm to pass). Also I found it difficult to wear poncho on a heavy wind without natural shelter because all the heat will escape from underneath. While this is great during the summer, during the winter it can be a terrible decision to loose all your heat on -20 celsius and be left with a wet and cold under layer. During balkan summer/autumn period, when the temperature is good enough for a t-shirt but it can rain like hell for 10 minute intervals, poncho is the guy because you can just pack and unpack it in a matter of seconds.
Jacket: I carry it all the time. It's just more versatile than poncho, but it's not better than poncho on a rain day for the same reasons you mentioned. Again I will always prefer jacket if I'm climbing or if I'm on a ridge during the rain and wind. During winter jacket is waaay preferable and I always leave poncho at home during winter.
Umbrella: In Dalmatia and Herzegovina, umbrella is better during hot summer days than during the rain. While rain can seem refreshing, beware of bura winds. Believe me, you don't want to be in Dalmatia during the rain/wind of bura, but if you do, an Iron Man suit isn't enough. I found out that umbrella doesn't work with European forests, mostly because our forests are much younger and trees are shorter, more often than not, you hit your head on a branch, so umbrella just gets in a way and shortens your view and it can get ripped. Also when you get out of the forest in Europe, you are mostly on a flat open field which doesn't have a forest for a reason - it's too much windy for trees.
great video, i stick to a traditional kathmandu gortex jacket, i find when its cold and windy and im out on a good walk or hike i can stay toasty, and when its torrential and raining sideways i know i can go out and use my hands to fix something or do a task and that handsfree waterproofing is great. Also the hood is nice to keep the ears warm in the cold, and the head dry in the rain. Cheers from Australia
Great video! I really appreciate your thinking on this issue. I think it could have saved my phone on the AT if i could have checked it under unbrella protection. Live and learn lol. Thanks again :)
It’s better to “get dry” rather than try to “stay dry”
set up a tarp when you get to your campsite, and change into dry clothes. When you’re at your campsite you can wear something cheap and impermeable
I use umbrella and rain gear for years. Depend on terrain i'm on and overall situation. It works perfectly. Umbrella also gives you a chance to hide inna shadow when its hot and sunny.
I carry a poncho that can be used as a ground tarp, shelter, and covers my 65L pack(as well as myself) Its a bit heavy, but has been well worth it and durable.
As scouts we all have the same poncho and it works great. It also doubles as our ground tarp since we don't use modern plastic tents, but tents that look kinda like tipis with canvas that you knot together to create a tent , so we have to lay something down to protect our gear from the wet ground
Ya, I use a poncho and a real hat. If you want the best gear, look closely at how the Cowboys did it.
That sounds very impractical.
Especially in cold climates.
@@nunya___
I don't recall cowboys climbing mountains.
@@MrCmon113 nah, it works pretty great. You can put up the Kothe in under 5 minutes and the problem is that they usually don't sell round tarps, which is why we have to use our ponchos.
(I live in Germany. Dunno if you'd already consider this cold climate, but we definitely do winter camps as well)
@@MrCmon113 They did. Though the actual point is they spend long days outside in all weather conditions. Wind, rain, snow and sun but their boots were for saddle use, not best for hiking.
I consider my rain jacket as my wind jacket and as an extra layer for warmth. I’ve never really used rain pants. I could see adding an umbrella though!
I have one of those poncho/tarp combos, very thin & light, worn draped over my backpack. I also have that head band umbrella hat so both my hands are free.
interesting video! I love your determination to experiment
An umbrella also protects you from the sun, say hiking on a glacier. But it requires low wind, and easy hiking. If you get into hikes where you scramble and need to use your hands from time to time an umbrella is a pain. Or if there are low branches, close together trees. So an umbrella is really an item that works well in a limited set of situations.
A kinda thick woollen shirt (and hat) is the best thing whilst hiking. Keeps you warm even when soaking wet, allows your own sweat to dissapate and allows air to pass. It is the most comfortable thing ever. And even though it is quite heavy, I use it on the trail continuosly so I never regretted bringing it. I do have a lightweight rain jacket with me when I am not moving that much, but I nearly never use it and I think I will not be bringing it with me any more.
That gave me an idea. In olden times wool still had loads of animal oils making them water repellent. This is not the case anymore. My big fear with wearing something thick when raining is that it will absorb tons of water making it very heavy after a while. But we have modern ways of making just about anything water repellent. I might have to try
@@timonix2 modern wool is still good in the rain; retaining 70% of the warmth, wicking away sweat and allowing airflow
If it's Merino, it won't itch either
Umbrellas have saved my life in the rainy PNW and brutally sunny Grand Canyon. I always carry one. Bought a 8 ounce wind-busting one and spray painted the outside with silver fabric paint. Use a ultralight SD rain jacket at camp.
Thanks for this. Very interesting and generates some good debate here. I think all this gear has a time, a place and a wind speed. I tried a kilt and poncho in Scotland last year and gave up on them due to the strong winds. If using an umbrella, it or I would have flown over the mountains like something from the Wizard of Oz!
Just cinch the poncho with a belt enough to keep it from flying but not enough to hold humidity.