HOI4 Air Doctrine Guide (Hearts of iron 4 Air Doctrine Tutorial and Tips)
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 2. 10. 2018
- in this hoi4 air doctrine guide we are examining the different air doctrines in hearts of iron 4 and deciding which is the best air doctrine for bombing, shooting down enemy fighters and cas missions in hoi4. in this tips video we go over the bonuses what they do, what air doctrine in for what and when to use the air doctrine and the strategy behind them teaching you how to play.
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Going full on Battlefield Support.
*Stuka siren intensifies*
intensifies is a understatement with full battlefield support
Everybody on the ground may think that an army of Angels is attacking because of all the Jericho sirens.
Strat Destruction: Split buffs for the first half, bombs come in in the second half.
Ground Support: CAS buffs, but you get the worst fighters out of the lot.
Operational Integrity: Balanced. Best fighters, apparently.
I don't actually have much experience with air doctrines - I tend to neglect them for other research.
Thx for making a visual reminder of the differences in the doctrines đ, now I can take a picture of it and use it as a reminder if I want to do a air doctrine(I neglect it too most of the time, but there are times when you really need the air power)
Strat destruction: A specific build for America.
Ground Support: for minor nations that want to help out their major buddies with good CAS.
Operational Integrity: For majors that need to win the air war.
When i played as a germany i focused more on researching military and naval doctrine to be able to defeat the brithish navy. I neglected the air doctrine
@@maharlika9809 But you can just smash the British navy from the air, build up a navy all game and when its time to beat Britain win the channel air battle and dump 1000 naval bombers into the channel.
@@jacobgriffiths8448 Don't forget about murica, naval bombers only had a limited range.
Do a battle of 1000 planes on both sides, one with one doctrine and one with another and compare losses over a year
hmm ill look into it
nice idea
Do it yourself weeaboo
Well done. I really appreciate the numbers that u put on the screen for the percentages
thanks :)
I think its more about which planes your gonna build the most...
Strat Destruction: Strat bombers
Ground Support: CAS
Operational Integrity: (Heavy) fighters & Tactical bombers
I was looking for this video last night after watching the land doctrine vid, thanks for all the great content!!!
thanks for watching :)
You are making alot of great videos, keep up the great work!!
Thx i try đ
You have a lot of fun making your video thumbnails, donât you?
sometimes i feel happy correcting the world to what it should be like roosevelt with hair and stalin bald đ
the 3rd air related video in a row....... i like it
huh i didnt even realize that
Great video! You really got into the numbers which I like
Thanks :)
Thanks for the heads up. I doubt many people knew what detection meant in that context. I found that air doctrine is second most important after land doctrine. Sea battles aren't necessarily important of you have limited or no coast. I've countered an entire enemy navy with just naval bombers.
agreed with litarly everything you just said and your welcome :)
Hungary with battlefield support is really a good combo (its important to size romania s oil)
Dustin could you make a video on which is better; submarines or naval bombers to destroy navies, depending on the resources, amount of either submarines or naval bombers you need to effective etc. Just something I still am not quite sure about after my 80 hours of hoi4 so far
phil the finadelphian I am not Dustin but i would defenetly go for naval bombers because after the new update they got buffed way up high und if you are too lazy to produce naval bombers like me you can also use CAS which is also very good at killing ships
@le_zitron_foufou well if you have a thousand of them it doesn't matter
naval bombers, unless the battleships are un escorted your subs will have litarly no chance what so ever to destroy and escort ships like destroyers. one time in mp germany somehow rushed sub 4's by ww2 and lost all 40 in 1 battle against 5 us destroyer 1's and rage quit
Naval battles are still needing fixed, subs if caught as Dustin says by escorts you can lose them all. If vs AI and you get them into a narrow sea or choke point they can massacre merchants.
â@@dustinl796 Thanks for the info! Will remember for my French game to get the Viva la France achievement.
Video is great and all, BUT there is something you need to understand as well. AS A WHOLE, yes your numbers do add up, but the amount of time and research you have to devote to completing the entire air doctrine tree is really high when your research should be in more important areas. In this game, how well you're going to play comes down to what happens in the initial part of WWII which to me is right before 1941. So thinking along those lines I would say you should look at the first 4-5 slots on each doctrine and compare them with what bonuses they get from those first 4-5. Due to this, as Germany I found that Strategic Destruction gives me the most benefits because the fighter detection is one of the first things I get and more importantly to me (Especially when I have to invade the UK before '41 with a very small navy like Germany's) is the Naval Mission Efficiency slot which definitely helps out against taking out the enemy ships in the English Channel.
Everything else down the doctrine trees could sometimes not matter because by the time you get there, it may be late game and you either already have won the game and you're just mopping up or you are about to lose everything and those bonuses will be done too late.
well depending how serious you take air you may be able to get it all. if you do the strat in my usa video and get 34% bonus research then a air adviser thats 10% for doctrines so for docs you could be running a 34% research bonus on it. then if you get doctrine bonuses boom
Definitely! I generally neglect my air force, as I need every gun possible
I'll go take a look at that tonight. Going to see if I can FINALLY win a game on iron man regular difficulty without the saved file getting corrupt.
*Crosses his fingers*
While we're on the subject of air forces, when it comes to your fighters, do you generally only put them on air superiority mission or do you put both that and interception missions?
Another great explanation
thanks!
Could we get a minor nation guide? Like offer general advice for playing as minor countries, and play as a few and apply what you went over.
i have it written down but i havent gotten around to it. srry ill try to soon
@@dustinl796 No worries, I'm sure you'll get around to it soon enough.
Thank you for these guides. These help me out so much because I just don't have the time to figure them out doing trial and error like I prefer to. HAHAHA!!!
Glad to help đ
From a fellow Dusty boy, I â€ïž your vids.
Thank đ
Dustin, thanks for clarifying a game misidentification of the Operational Integrity Branch. Kind of wish Paradox would correct the description. And it never occurred to me to add up the bonuses although you had to clarify what the bonuses actually mean. Again, thought I would skip this video and am glad I didn't. Big Thanks.....
thanks and yea i agree. when i first saw it talking about tac bombers i thought it would give mostly bonuses to tacs when in reality only gives 1 tac bomber bonus
Thank you again
and thank you for watching :)
I like cas. just the idea of it
Now we need naval doctrine tips.
Working on it today âș
I know this is a super broad question but it seems like most of your videos are for nations given 'optimal' circumstances, ie; Germany, UK, USA, ect.
I enjoy playing China a lot and have recently been wondering how to min-max it against competent Japan players. Unfortunately I don't get to play that often so I can't experiment too much (not to mention that no multiplayer game ever really goes according to plan...) -my goal in most multiplayer games is to defeat Japan and then join whoever looks like they're gonna lose (Axis or Allies), taking back Hong Kong and other core territory either by force or in a deal. This sort of thing requires planning beyond just pushing out the Japanese, so....
I have a few questions;
What techs do you focus on if you only have 2-3 research slots? I'm beginning to think that with so few slots, the time you spend researching stuff in electronics tab will never pay for itself (aside from radio) ...should you always reserve a slot for a land doctrine or only go a little way down the tree? Can you afford to go for a doctrine at all? I'm torn between staying with Mass Assault and switching to Grand Battleplan. What techs would you go for, given you have so limited options and war will come at you as soon as summer 1937?
Would you ever consider spending XP on improving division templates instead of removing the Chinese Army's penalty? Would you do it immediately or wait until some of the penalty has been reduced?
Should any attempt be made to modernize a large but backwards military? If so, how? If it is 1939 and you still have Great War Tanks, Great War Artillery, and Interwar Fighters/Bombers... what's the FIRST thing to start incorporating into your military? I would assume aircraft, but what's the second and third?
What do you spend your PP on? Is it better to do Improved Working Conditions or Workhorse first? Neither? My current order usually lets me get Total Mobilization/Women in the Workforce on day 1 of the war with Japan but it leaves me with no theorist or military staffers (Workhorse, Old Guard, Improv. Workers, Backstabber, First Lady, Total Mob, Women)
with less than 4 research slots electronics never pay for themselves, xp for china make full infantry but get rid of pennaltees first. for china you dont need to modernize concentrate on infantry spam and mass assault doctinre. pp get stability and then total mobm you dont really need women in the workforce as china
I don't even bother with cas and stuff, I go for air superiority all the time. Unless the enemy are cas focused
Any tips to increase cas attack is to deploy a dozen of cas or split the cas wings to small groups ?
split because cas takes 1 combat width per plane in battle
ok but when i activate the wings i activate them together or wing by wing or it don't matter also in KR mod you have a cas designer as Germany that give attack enemy factor + % 3 this make cas attack faster
Strategic bombing is needed if you do not fight ground war right now, and if you plan to defeat your enemy by getting him out of supply and out of factories. It's also the ONLY one real way to safely bypass ground forts. So it's the best choice for the late game possible if you have enough resources of course.
CAS is the only choice if you fight ground war to survive, especially at the large front, it's Obvious. But you have to have 1000s of CAS and Tactics. 1000s of Tacs can also bring down infrastructure and factories at close regions.
Op. integrity is a pour man choice, if you don't have enough mils to build good amount of planes and form sizable Air Force, if you need to defend, and if you can't spare enough mils on planes.
So strategic one is the best and only one for the late game at all.
If you have industry and manpower and you know the war you are fighting won't end soon because you are stuck and not being able to advance then go with the strategic doctrine but if you are aiming for a quick victory go for battlefield support
yea but if the enemy has a good airforce neither one will help sense all those planes will get shot down
@@dustinl796 yes. If he does then it's difficult but this works great if you have air superiority , if you can't match him in the air go then go with operetional
Great video, it explains perfect what the hoi IV players should now (except my friends :P) And as always ____ (fill the gap)
thanks, kinda late arent ya?
me or you?
ground support OP
right?
I love the sound of air raid horns in the morning.
Did you just try to make a apocalypse now referance đ
@@dustinl796 key word is tried.
Key word is napalm đ
What doctrine would you suggest to use as Japan?
either battlefield support or operational integrity
ALEXANDER THOMPSON Ok yeah thatâs what I was thinking. Iâm trying to get better as Japan, so what composition of planes do you think I should be putting in my carriers?
ALEXANDER THOMPSON Cool, now I just have to find a mp game that actually lasts long enough to have a war with USA in the first place.
What do "mission efficiency" bonuses do?
just improves various bonuses like under air superiority increases tactic bonuses and things like that
You can not take both Day Bombing and Massed Formations, only one of them.
Eeeeh.. I have to say it.
You are creating amazing videos, but mistakes like this one nullifies all good impression.
It feels you are trying to make as much videos as you can in a limited period of time. But by doing it you actually sacrifice quality of the content.
thats why i corrected myself saying you can get a max of 50% but still said 70% because thats what all bonuses add up to. thanks for the complement. also im not trying to make as many videos as possible but i have a ton of request from people to make videos and im trying to get them out as fast as possi....... i see your point -_-
Dustinl796 Videos speaking of that, if you are going down the strategic destruction path, should you take night or day bombing?
Could you do a heavy fighter v fighter vid?
ill write it down :)
Do the CAS buffs also apply to tactical bombers?
Unfortunatly no, only dive bombers
Operational Integrity is just op, you always have air superiority so you can do whatever missions you want and wreck any air missions with your stupid agility fighters.
agreed
That's funny, I almost always go Operational Integrity, but I didn't even really look at the bonuses. It just said it worked well with tactical bombers, which I use heavily since actually reaching and mission efficiency are more decisive in my experience. Also you don't have to make any other choice in the tree.
Are jet fighters better than conventional?
Unless vs jets no. They are kinda broken where engadging slower aircraft they take out fewer. I guess paradox couns speed in the air battles being a factor
Air doc was extremely straight forward but land doc was hard for me to understand at first. I'm just here to see if I can learn anything more.
Edit: *BOONUS*
I'm glad to help :-)
*That's alotta DAMAGE!*
Yea 50% is kinda nuts
Is SUPERB video
thanks donkey ;)
Well, I've noticed I tend to use Operational Intergrity the most, I generally find it the most versatile while of course being fantastic for the fighters. I think I need to try Battlefield Support more and use the CAS and think about it since that is the doctrine I've used the least overall
oi topgun wheres that japan video coming? im gonna get phil swift to come if you dont answer hoi hoi
i keep trying to get to it but havent had time to do one of those kind of tutorials sense they take a couple hours to record
@@dustinl796 OK I'm mainly joking rn take your time
how do i air recon? that button never works and i have all the planes in action,,?
You need scout planes, these are a in a'other tech branch than the other
thx mate im trying to destroy UK with fighter jets as netherlands. i really want them to make advanced plane editing like with tanks
You should update this guide.
Wow I really should LOL
@@dustinl796 Operational Integrity got nerfed, and other two buffed. For bombing you want SD, for CAS BS, and for fighters SD actually provides more bonuses than OI. Op. Int. is kinda strange now, it doesn't provide that big of a bonus to fighters and sucks for CAS and bombing.
Yeah I'm going to update it very soon
I am not sure your assessment is totally accurate at least as of today's date March 2019. Just a quick note about some of these values, air superiority bonus just give planes an increase in their air superiority rating which isn't very large. Air superiority mission effiecncy does nothing to increase your air superiority rating it increases your agility, attack and defence of the wing during Air superiority missions. So it makes the FTRs doing air superiority missions more deadly but doesn't help in determining which side has air superiority. Operational integrity seems to have the lowest air superiority rating at +15% and a +20% air superiority mission rating which isn't the same thing. Battlefield support has a +30% air superiority and a +15% air superiority mission efficiency. This means Operational integrity requires 13% more planes to match a battlefield supports air superiority value. Remember most planes give a simple 1.00 air superiority rating regardless of the plane or tech level, so long as it is actively performing a mission. Strategic bombers give almost no air superiority rating at 0.01 and a Heavy fighter gives 1.25. Nav, Tac, CAS, and FTRs all give 1.0 so an operational integrity player will have to out produce the enemy in planes by 13% which doesn't sound that significant but becomes a lot of production as the war progresses and having air superiority is important and thus a Operational integrity player is more effective at air superiority and intercept missions there is a cost. Escort missions are air superiority missions but interception missions are a separate mission. This means that an operational Integrity player needs two sets of fighters, if the operational player just has interceptors these FTRs only engage if enemy bombers or transport plans are detected, so if the enemy just sends in FTRs no Bombers they automatically win Air superiority and give your units attrition. So you have to send up FTRs in an air superiority mission which reduces the available FTRs for interception. And because your air superiority is inferior you need to have 13% more planes. Now this is mitigated in that you need more planes but your planes are 5% more efficient in the air superiority mission and have a 20% mission efficiency for interceptions and has an additional 5% advantage to interception and fighter detection rates which means you will have superior planes from agility and more of your FTRs will engage the enemy in a given battle. But you NEED the production for this to work, if you are being out produced by the enemy in aircraft you could see all your attempts to win the air war fail because you need significant more aircraft than the enemy, 13% more planes adds up in terms of production a single 1936 light tank cost 9 production while a single 1936 FTR costs 24, over two and a 1/2 times the cost. So matching other doctrines with air superiority values isn't cheap when you need 13% more planes as planes are expensive so your ground forces WILL suffer with less production able to be dedicated to ground units.
Strategic destruction is nasty it provides the same 30% air superiority bonus as Battlefield support and either a +20% air superiority mission bonus or a +20% interception bonus, AND it can have a +25% escort mission Efficiency!! It also has an agility bonus matching operational integrity. What does this mean? for Operational integrity doctrine players they still need 13% more planes in operations to maintain air superiority parity and when they do engage the enemy, the enemy planes are not inferior like those of Battlefield support. When an operational integrity player does an interception mission they get hit hard as escorts will likely be 25% more effective cause significantly more casualties to enemy fighters. This means the Operational integrity player needs to build even MORE planes. There is a mitigating factor in that strategic destruction players have the worse fighter and interceptor detection rates at a mere +10% so fewer of their fighters actually engage in a given sortie but still that +25% escort mission bonus really is going to hurt. It is VERY hard to defend against strategic destruction doctrine air superiority advantages as their bombing attacks/ be they CAS, TAC or NAV all can use the escort bonus. Also don't be blinded by the huge bonus to Strategic bombing, an offensive Naval & CAS/TAC centric strategic destruction player will be a difficult player to wrestle air superiority from. Sure their ground attacks are the weak but their naval bombing attacks are strong and when on the offense their FTRs are very nasty. So you will constantly take more FTR losses when you intercept these attacks, sure the CAS, & TAC bombing missions are not as effective as other doctrines but the ability to sweep enemy FTRs from a zone is impressive, as both the +20 air superiority mission efficiency and the +25% escort efficiency stacks as escort missions are automatically air superiority missions, they are one in the same.
I am simply pointing out that you made a gross over simplification of what air doctrine is the best for fighters as if you are unable to out produce the enemy in aircraft you could find operational integrity doesn't save you as you struggle to gain air superiority all the while suffering equipment and manpower losses on the ground. It is not a magic bullet that players should automatically take if they want the best Fighter coverage. There appears to be multiple factors that you can't simply say X doctrine is the best for FTRs, while it is pretty easy to say which is the best for Nav, Cas or Strat bombers. Tac bombers are a bit different Battlefield support for ground support and Operational integrity for Tac strategic bombing. FTRs? That is the most difficult to point to a doctrine and say X is the hands down leader. Anyway that is my 2 cents.
Well to be honest this was done before man the guns by far, before man the guns we did some of the air doctor and stats this was the ultimate side since most of my guides were 4 multiplayer and it was a total who had more Fighters kind of experience in almost every single game to the point where if there was a hungry or Canada air controller one question of vetting was what air Doctrine you went in the answer in every server was always operational Integrity because of the bonuses you got for Fighters and carrier Fighters
HELP IM GETTING BOMBED, I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO PICK
strategic destruction..... oh the irony
Hi
hello
Link your discord
its on my main channel page in the bottom right of the banner :)
Excuse me but it really irritates me how you apparently don't know how percentages work. 10%+10%+20% equates 145.2% of the first value so an increase of about 45%
Wut?
@@dustinl796 ((100x1.1) x1.2)x1.1=145.2 it's not really 1946 rocket science
MultiPerryPlatypus the percentages work on the base values ... but hey better be unpleasent for no reason
No. Paradox just adds them up to the base value.
I never understood why they do it like this, having a plus 700% defense seems a little bit op đ
Fourth to comment
im like 43rd -_-
Oh hi there.
First
man im late im like 40th -_-
Second to comment
hey second to comment :)
Yay I been noticed đ(even though it âs not the first time)
I joined your Discord as Kuro Mori Mine đđđđđđđđđđđđ
these trees makes no sense....wtf where these devs where thinking....
Kinda agree, operation intergrity is pretty realistic but i think % should be lowered.