Students Beware - UCAS and universities
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- čas přidán 6. 03. 2013
- Advice and a warning from Professor Michael Merrifield - admissions tutor for physics and astronomy at the University of Nottingham.
Test Tube is a project by video journalist Brady Haran for the University of Nottingham.
More at www.test-tube.org.uk/
Atlas of Creation explained: periodicvideos.blogspot.co.uk/...
Why is half of this filmed like the office and the other half like CSI 😂
Law & Disorder: Special Relativity Unit
they tried to use black and white to indicate footage from older videos but it ended up like CSI xD
I'm in uni already, why am I watching this
Matthew McNulty
...I'VE GRADUATED ALREADY! And i'm watching this.
But seeing as i did an arts degree, almost the normal thing is either an unconditional, or a bear minimum 3 C's in A-Levels (or equivalent qualification)
+Matthew McNulty I don't even plan on going to college and i'm watching this.
I'm sleeping why am I watching this
For me, I watched one video about viva preparation and now it seems to be a staple in my feed.
Matthew McNulty I live in The United States, why am I watching this?
this man is a rare thing in this world - someone who goes against the bureaucracy and is truly honest.
+pepe6666 people like that aren't that rare. In fact they are more common than the game players. But honest and straightforward people are usually at a disadvantage to the game players, so game players will come to dominate in the decision making process. Remember anything that involves people is by very definition political.
This is filmed like a mockumentary lool
'University of XXX' ooo I wanna go there ;)
+imatroll147 lol
University of YYY - to do Philosophy???
University of ZZZ - 'nuff said...
LOL
Top bants!
I just graduated from my university in London and have to say, this chap is absolutely right. Don’t base your decision on where to go on just the offer; look at the location, look at how much you like the campus, look at the accommodation, look at the student satisfaction rates with the course you’re applying to. You’re going to be living on your campus for 3, maybe 4 years. And they’ll likely be the best years of your life. So, make sure that you spend them at the place that ticks all of your boxes
@@helinmehmed3037 honestly if I was going into UCAS this year I’d defer entry or skip entirely. Spend a year working then go for it in 2022. Spending your freshers week locked up in your halls is NOT what you’re supposed to do!!
Thanks.
I have a huge amount of respect for this man.
Man, I wish I'd seen this before going to university. My firm choice offered ABB, so ended up going there, only to discover later that most people on my course got C's and one student even had DDC.
Eleven years later, and I still think it's the biggest mistake I've ever made. I didn't even bother applying for AAA universities because I didn't think I had a chance.
That admission officer must've seen me coming a mile off.
I am in your position but I still have a chance I’m in year 13. I applied and firmed an ABB offer but I know within me I can achieve atleast A*AA and although my teachers and parents are not supportive in me reapplying, I’m following my dream and reapplying for next year to a better uni at Durham. Thanks for this comment to support my choice :)
@@johnmission586 how did it go?
grade offers doesn't always = quality of course
This is very true, Candidates PAY ATTENTION!. My college did this with me, i wanted to go to my university of choice and they bullied me into putting the higher offer as my firm choice, In the end i decided not to go to university because it was more trouble than its worth (Worst decision i ever made) Dont let them bully you into this. In the end they want their students going to the best universities so they look good. Its your own choice. Make it or regret it.
A*A*B - a stupefying three years ago... yet the day after my results, I was bawling over missing my offer.
How short sighted did sobbing over A-levels seem now? They really don't matter...
Completely agree that the feel, quality of living, and teaching of a university matters so much more than pesky letters they want from you!
Failure
@@ralphcotton7119 bro
@@ralphcotton7119 ?
@@ramanman9792 i was only joking. Sorry if i offended you
@@ralphcotton7119 oh no worries
CZcams why are you suggesting this NOW? I literally just sent mine in today >:(
This man is so good at talking.
This video makes a lot of sense. I was encouraged by my college to put my lowest offer as my insurance, but I decided against that and put one of my higher offers in its place.
My firm choice is the university I have my heart set on and asked for AAB. Two of my other offers asked for AAA, but their research departments didn't focus on the field I wish to go into.
My lowest offer was CCC, the university's Psychology department wasn't very strong and they had much better departments for History.
My insurance choice university is asking for BBB and have everything I want in a course. I would rather get into one of my two offers or do re-sits.
It is not just about going into university for the sake of getting a degree, it is about going there for the right reasons and achieving what you set out to do. If you don't succeed the first time, there is no shame in trying again. It shows determination, passion and courage.
The last point you made really helped me in my decision. The course I really wanted to do gave me a lowered offer due to the subjects I studied so it was my lowest offer anyway (BBC). My teacher took the head clean off me because my insurance was higher (AAB) but it didn’t matter that I didn’t have it the other way around cause if I didn’t get the grades BBC I wouldn’t qualify for any of the other courses I applied for.
Great video. I’ve just finished my post grad in a STEM subject, not at Nottingham, but another top Uni, and I believe this should be publicised much more widely.When I was applying for my undergrad degree Leeds uni asked for BCC entry grades, now they ask A*AA! That’s a massive change and can not be justified until you realise the reasons behind that decision, as exposed in this video.
sam clarke wow that’s unbelievable. I’m thinking about applying to Leeds for mechanics eng this year and they want A*AA. I wish I was asked for BCC
Interesting points. Thanks for sharing this insight. I especially liked the logic of the last bit: it's the way either way.
When the horror film students have to film an interview
His brains too fast for his body.
why’s this sup true 🤣🤣🤣🤣
I made this mistake. I applied in 2011 and had to purposefully flunk one of my exams to get into my insurance (Nottingham) because I decided I would rather go there than my firm. So glad I did!
Wow, you were really walking a tightrope there. Respect to you, not many people can "flunk" their way into Nottingham!
I don’t know if the system has changed, but you can reject your firm offer, so you didn’t need to flunk it
Henry Ginn yeah I was gonna say, pretty sure you can just reject your firm and accept your safe if you want to
I thought you could email both unis , explain and they'd sort it out? It would seem to be in everyones interest that you got to where you wanted if you had the grades already?
@@jeffrey8770 applications are actually legal contracts so it more difficult than that and you use to be able to get forced into situations, but they decided to change this (but I don't know when it has/will be implemented)
For my physics undergrad at Exeter my offer was A*AA but my friend's was AAB which I was always quite annoyed at. Furthermore, I got A*AB at A-Level but I was still accepted so I've wondered for quite a while why they bothered making my offer so high if they were accepting students with much lower grades anyway.
UCAS : exposed
"If in doubt, leave it out", excellent advice to redo the entrance exams in your own time and manner with a particular University and course intended. It's possibly better than stepping out of one school into another without real world experience. Ask.
I've got an offer at Nottingham, looking forward to going!
I don't really have anything to add to the conversation, but I really want to thank the faculty of the University of Nottingham (Michael Merrifield and James Hamilton in particular) for engaging in discussion.
You guys are adding enormous value to these channels by your participation.
Thank you!
Turns out, you need a PhD to figure out how to even APPLY get into university in the first place!
It's interesting to see how different the systems are in other countries. Here there's no gaming as you are accepted (or rejected) after you get your grades. No conditional "offers". I as a student check all the things I want in an ordered list and wait until I am accepted. I then confirm and that's final but I can still get a higher choice if enough people do not confirm (not confirming is the same as rejecting). If I'm still not in when the semester has started I can still get in if enough people did not show up/register by the first day.
sorry, I definitely lost it at the start when Mike lowered his head to the radio mike (my fault) but after that I thought it was okay?
Here we do have two main nationwide tests, the SAT and the ACT. Each is divided into several parts (math, science, reading comprehension, writing, etc. ) We also have the SAT 2, which is more subject specific. You usually take these fall of your senior (last) year of high school, get the results in early winter, and mail them out with the rest of your application. You can get in a lot of places if you score decently, but many universities offer extra scholarships if you scored higher.
This is really good advice. As a physics applicant this year, I've definitely had experience of this offer game.
this is so true i know so many people who have got in unis they didn’t get anywhere near the grades for
Got accepted to my first and only choice last week :D Though paying £9000 a year I think they would take most people..
That last point really checkmates the logic behind the UCAS system. This isn't even something that can be debated.
Took your advice! The school had a field day. I did it, then told them after - no regrets as of yet (y)
5:45 I had exactly that, three years ago. I'm glad I put a low offer that I really wanted a a backup 'prestigious' university. (Despite what my careers counselor kept telling me: why is your high offer below!?)
This video is so useful to me
I'm currently going through this process of choosing unis to go to and I'm in the position of putting St Andrew's ahead of Oxford and Manchester even though St Andrew's only want AAA whereas both the others want A*AA (I'm studying physics btw)
This video gave me the confidence to put a university I want to go to ahead of a university with higher requirements
Gosh he is amazing! Exactly what a pre-med needs to hear :')
I truly admire your honesty sir.
Awesome, hope you enjoy it. I'm yet to go through the process myself actually but I've seen friends of mine get straight rejections, which is a little intimidating.
Someone give this man a cookie!
✋🍪
🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪
Bear in mind accommodation. Usually if the university that you put down as a firm choice will more or less guarantee you a roof over your head usually in Halls of Residence. But with the tuition fees the price that they are and maintenance money that will be spent on university resources both for academic (Printing, Books) and pleasure (Alcohol and Haribo) It is still worth the university looking for private accommodation for their students.
Going to your Insurance choice university. If you are quick you can swipe the accommodation that was assigned to a student who then failed to meet the grade conditions of their offer. If not you are kind of on your own in terms of arranging it and the help that offered in arranging accommodation for insurance choice applicants varies widely between universities. Some will operate their own internal letting agency with approved landlords. Some will just have a hastily updated websites of letting agencies within the city and outskirts and say youre classes start in September deal with it. (Maybe not the deal with it part exactly)
I close my eyes and listen to your voice and think of Dufrais from Facejacker
haha
Wish I knew this before I applied!
Luckily I’ve got a place exactly where I want to go, but I would’ve been much less stressed out if I knew this earlier.
I've already graduated and now doing a phd in chemistry but I wish I had these videos when I did my a levels.
I so have a friend who has retaken year 12 and he went to a university that he wants to go, which is the right level of uni that his grades can go to. It also depends on what your reason is for doing one more year of A-level, it should be perfectly fine for reasons that are not academic related, such as health, family and others. But make sure you ask the uni before applying to them.
so some unis need A*AA and then there's manchester which wants A*A*A sigh
I'm applying for Oxford and they'll let you in with AAA or AAB in some instances - shows how much A levels actually represent your ability.
@@karlosbricks2413 did you get in?
@@ralphcotton7119 They say they'll give responses by the 12th of January. Don't have it yet, I did feel the interview went quite well, but my feelings are probably a bad representation of what they thought....
@@karlosbricks2413 im sure you did great! even if you don't get in don't be too bummed about it but im sure you've done well
@@sam6719 replying to a 6 years old comment, did you also get recommended this by CZcams? 🤣
I agree completely.
In my case, though, the "better offer" didn't actually have the program of study I wanted.
They had enough of a program so that it looked good to a casual observer, but for someone who researched the matter heavily, there was no comparison.
(but I made it through without borrowing... so there's that.)
I did this, I had an AAA offer from the University of Durham for CS, and an ABB for the University of Kent - I put Kent as my Firm choice for various reasons. I'm at Kent and very happy.
This is actually very helpful thank you for making such videos
In Brazil you either have to take a test to enter universities (the grade you have to get on it and, at times, the contents of the test itself depends on your course of choice - the test is different for each instituition, it's made by the university itself) or take what we call ENEM (Portuguese for "National High School Exam") and, if your grade on it is good enough, use it to enter your university of choice.
In Ontario you rank your choices before you get offers and you never have to narrow it down and you aren't even bound to your higher choices. I just applied to a bunch, got accepted to a bunch and picked the one I wanted at the end. A lot simpler than the UK, though we don't have the complication of standardized tests (other than optional AP exams)
Next year I shall be starting the whole UCAS rollercoaster: this is an extremely comforting video.
Latter, doing Maths/Further maths at College, going to uni next year - Doing a lot of calculus, second order differential equations, integration techniques etc
I genuinely believe if your an optimistic person and are willing to make the best of uni you will find wherever you go just happens to be the best uni in the country I know I'm at the best uni in the country and when I put it on my form I didn't expect to firm it.
Wow thanks for that information, i didn't know that. honesty like this is what we need more often.
I appreciate that and obviously you have been an example who in high school just didn't show your full potential, so in this case the gamble paid off. Most of the time though, it wouldn't. Taking students at lower grades usually means you get less intelligent/dedicated students. With you that wasn't the case but, with limited places available, it's still sensible to offer the places to the candidates with the best grades, because it's at least an indication that they are suited to further study.
Man, I really wish I had access to 1st world countries education. Despite the difficulties, you all should be thankful for what you have. *I could listen to this professor for hours*
Yes you can. That's what I did as Nottingham gave me a surprisingly low offer and it was the place I really wanted to go.
All very well, but Nottingham has been handing out unconditional offers (in some subjects) if you put them as your first choice, for at least the last 3 years.
I wish there was a system like this in the US, because at least then there would be a system. Here each university/college has its own application system that can vary wildly in what you need to send in, what you need, etc. It was incredibly confusing trying to move through some of the stuff.
And just as a side note, I am planning a semester abroad. University of Nottingham would be interesting to go to for a time.
I think that not only this helps students with making their choice in universities, but it is also a bit of an advertisement for the university of Nottingham (the videos in general being the advertisement), because though I don't live in the UK, I would like to go to the university of Nottingham, and I felt this way even before I saw this video, because I got the impression that the university was a very interesting place where a lot of amazing work is being done.
My Nottingham physics offer is AAA which I'm pretty confident for, but it's always good to know they'll accept slightly lower. Kind of takes the pressure off a little that they'll probably take you with a B anyway.
In Sweden you just go to a website, put the educations you want to apply to (max 15, if I recall correctly (in order)) and eventually you'll get an e-mail letting you know if you got into any or not. There are 2 rounds of selections, first the primary and then the secondary (if people choose not to go in the primary, you get 1 higher spot/chance in the secondary). If this fails, there's also last minute applications, if people choose not to go last minute. Good luck finding apartment then tho...
Thanks for sharing this! I didn't know about this problem with the UCAS system.
Here where I live, in Mexico. Its your grade average + uni admission exam (SAT) average. Then, in my case: There is 200 available spots for Comp. Eng., the top 200 students who applied to that career and scored the highest are admitted. The highest is medicine (no surprise) and usually scoring 180 guarantees your admission (90 school avg + 90 on SAT). The last person admitted into medicine usually has a score of 177-ish. Lots of people don't make it and there isn't really an option B w/o $_$.
I think some fellow student might even try to get to uni with Bs and Cs and still get in, but if you could only get "lower" results on a lower qualification such as Level 3s etc then going to Uni with your level of educational foundation would've been a mistake since you'll likely understand less of what they'll teach you there and basically waste more time in Uni while also being in debt for something you may not be able to complete. It'll be alot better to do resits or learn more and take a gap year than risk getting into Uni unprepared. I myself am only just accepted for my uni.
I said they were quite common when I went through UCAS, nothing about the time before that.
It is a long time since I went to uni, but you don't HAVE to go to any uni. I didn't get my first choice first time and turned down my second choice. I took a year off, did 1 re-take and re-applied. Due to the vagaries of the system at the time I got a confirmed offer before I even did my re-take and then went to where I wanted to go in the first place. Don't go somewhere you don't want to go, ever. I am very glad I went to the place I wanted to.
This is exactly what I was thinking of doing 5 years ago - The typical offer of the uni I wanted to go to was BBB compared with AAB for most of the others. It didn't end up mattering as only 1 uni gave me an offer (very competative course) and their offer was AAB so naturally I put them down as my firm and had no insurance - I got in.
I wasn’t expecting Brady’s voice at the end
I surprisingly got accepted to a really high offer I applied to, but declined it and went to my second choice because it suited me better. I missed the mark by a huge amount, but already picked the A-Levels directly asked for in the Uni application, so I'd imagine they're really flexible on what they would actually take.
You don't have to know. You can apply to up to 5 universities, so if grades are your issue, you can put down universities with a range of average offers. Or, if you don't know what you want to do subject-wise, many universities offer general arts/science degrees; Glasgow comes to mind. The vast majority of universities offer things like Natural Science to cover a wide range of topics. I'm sure others offer general degrees where you choose modules, much like america.
Wow... Interesting, I hadn't considered this competitive aspect to conditional offers...
I made the mistake of going for the better offer... In the US we have "in-state" and "out of state" tuition, depending on the location of the school and your state of residency.
I had a four year offer of tuition, room and board, books, and meals at an in state school.
I also got accepted to another school but would have had to pay a large amount of tuition.
My guidance counselor and parents talked me into going for the free school. It made sense at the time.
*Cheque* In Australia, its quite similar to the UK. But less complicated, there's no A levels but overall grades from your last two years of High School and your OP (Overall Position) within your school. Makes it more even =] (And uni is basically free here =D)
Being from Germany, this doesn't apply to me at all (and I'm almost through uni anyways). But I find it very interesting to see, how other countries do this stuff.
Over here, it is all federal and convoluted. Some unis take EVERYONE that applies, at some, they take a specific amount, so they set the entry barrier, some take everyone above some grade and some are centrally distributed (teachers, medicine, law, I think).
I'm not sure if I like the UK system either, because you only have2 choices
The advise about always putting a higher grade offer first was advice I certainly got, in the long run it hasn't mattered at all but it is a flaw
Well, I'm not too sure about this, but from what I remember there's a certain amount of Students, that gets picked because they have the best grades (Its about 20%, I think), another 20% are chosen based on the time they have been "waiting" for the university place. The other 60% are chosen by the universitys own process. One reason for this process may be, that grades alone don't neccesarily tell much about a student, so the universitys may also consider things like the students interest etc.
Around here we have the weighted average of the lowest grade of the last student to get in a course in the last year as a guideline. Basically, the students select several course choices based on that, and the universities accept their candidatures by ordering them in weighted averages of the grades (instead of letters we have 0 to 20), filling the available vacancies of the courses. The more students apply or the scarcer the number of vacancies, the higher the averages will get.
In Belgium you simply have to finish highschool, doesn't really matter what your grades were, as a matter of fact you can put your own sort of schedule together.
In highschool i studied agro-techniques (basically farming) so i only learned rather simple mathematics, it was easy, now i'm doing my first year in biology at university and i was able to drop a bunch of classes so i could catch up on the maths, i'm struggling though, doing calculus now and didn't even see logarithms in highschool :l
Same stuff in Norway.
Still didn't prevent me from getting shafted hard on exams. I failed one of my exams in a class I normally have an A. I asked why they had failed me, and they listed a criteria that wasn't part of the assignment at all. Next time I did the exam, I passed, but by then a new school reform had been implemented, and the classes I had passed were changed for the new reform, so in order to get my diploma I would have to do 3 more years of school, most likely. Not a chance.
True but IIRC if you get the grades for your first choice you can either take it or not but you can't then choose your insurance uni - you would have to re-apply.
why? its all there if you are interested. I'm learning vector calculus now in preparation for studying electromagnetism. It takes a bit longer, part time, but hey I enjoy it ;)
Very informative! thanks for uploading this ! ! !
I must thank you guys for making this video. It really is a public service to inform us of the behind the scenes politics that take place. So thank you.
You have opened my eyes
I like this man, I genuinely do
I actually did something like when I applied for uni where my insurance choice had the higher offer.
There is a subtlety here, though, Professor Dave: even if the Unistat site shows fairly low actual grades, a university may well have filled its quota with students who put them as firm choice, so someone who makes similar grades as an insurance choice, but below the stated offer, is quite likely not to get a place. For insurance choices, the offer level may well dictate whether you get a place, not the Unistat typical grades for that insutution.
As a FY student in Canada, I am really pro for this system and want to see this in Canada.
Speaking anecdotally. I applied for Computer Science to 5 universities and got 5 offers.
Firm conditional: University of Bristol with A*AA offer.
Firm insurance: University of Southampton with A*AA offer.
I achieved grades AAA. Bristol rejected me and Southampton took me on.
I think whether the University plays "the game" or not depends on how oversubscribed the course is - so don't gamble on it being the case.
Hopefully I'll see you both in September :)
I didnt think about the last bit he said, that's some really great advice!
This sounds very true. I didn't make my first choice so I called my second choice they said "I shouldn't be telling you this but you've been excepted in to...." I was actually no where near the grades for my first choice it was wishful thinking. On the flip side schools know this so give you a higher predicted grade so that uni's will consider you. Also some subjects have far fewer applicants so they kinda need to fill the spaces. Thank you it's been 10 years since I went to uni and now I finally understand it.
+Heliumcool schools give you higher predicted grades? i'm applying now-i go to a state school (grade wise worst in my borough), and i got a B in physics AS and a C in chemAS- with A*'s at GCSE in both. My predicted grades are a B and a C in those 2 subjects. no argueing could persuade my teachers-even though i hope to increase both grades of A/B during A2. State schools really do put students at a disadvantage.
I think Dr. Merrifield makes one really solid piece of advice. Decide where you want to go to college first..
Thanks! I would be ready then. I might apply international!
over here everyone in the country takes the same exams (for a given subject), so grades are definitely not subjective. you apply around 6 month in advance here, and you ger offers before you recieve your grades since there's only like a month/ a few weeks between when you get your grades and when uni starts.
This was brilliant, thank you!
04:01 That green book on the lower shelf, near the left edge. I wondered what "Atlas of Creation" is, so I googled it up. Now I'm wondering what it's doing on the Prof's bookshelf. Maybe he keeps it around just for laughs.
Sorry this is more one for our UK viewers - but interested to hear from others!