Hair Loss Treatments That KEEP WORKING, Even After Quitting?
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- čas přidán 9. 06. 2024
- The "holy grail" of hair loss treatments would be a pill, topical, or therapy that keeps working... even after stopping treatment.
Unfortunately, this therapy doesn't exist (yet). However, results from a 2020 study suggest that some treatments - like microneedling - might enhance the length of time new hair growth sticks around after quitting conventional treatments, such as minoxidil.
In fact, that same study showed that microneedling by itself might produce longer-lasting hair gains versus minoxidil, even after withdrawing from treatment for six months.
But don't get too excited! This video dives into the details about why we should consider these results to be VERY preliminary... and why nobody should quit any treatments in light of this information (until replication studies are done).
--
0:00 - Intro
1:50 - New study (analysis)
3:45 - Quitting treatments: how long until all new hair is lost?
5:02 - Explanation #1: results aren't real
7:42 - Explanation #2: results are real
12:35 - Outro
//Get A Free Course On Achieving Hair Regrowth, On Your Terms//
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About Rob English:
-Editorial board member of Dermatology and Therapy
-Medical editor specializing in hair loss disorders
-Peer-reviewed publications: perfecthairhealth.com/publica...
Get a free course on strategies for hair regrowth, naturally and conventionally: perfecthairhealth.com/email-course/
You have a ton of hair and very low hairline, so curious why this is your work.
What’s your take on lasers
Is nutrition play and role in androgenatic alopecia
I’m so relieved that your CZcams account exists. Thank you.
Very well made, fair and sober analysis of the study. I wish everybody would be doing it in this manner.
So cool! I can't wait for the next video!
This information is amazing! Thank you so much!
Hey Rob, would you consider making a video specifically about Minoxidil and also its side effects?
Thanks so much for this video. Gives me hope that if I decide to go with something like rogain, I can use microneedling in tandem to support it. Even if the studies aren't entirely correct due to small samples, I'm sure doing both would be beneficial.
ive just recently heard about this wnt beta catenin thing. its such a relief to see that some real science is gettin done on this.
Can u pls make a video on what vegeterians should take care in their diet to prevent hair related issues
I stopped Fin in december 2021 and I was like: OK one year and your hair is gone (dad and grandpa had almost no hair at my age so the threat is real)... I started using some vitamins until july and my hair really got a bit less, but not drastic. I started adding microneedling with castor oil/rosemary oil (1week/every 3 days), saw palmetto, pumpkin seed oil, biotin/zinc/selen, spermidine and barley grass powder. Also doing scalp massages every now and then. My temples and crown area are really filling good. I am even confident enough to go out without covering my temples (they weren't actually THAT bad). IMO those things are really working wonders. I will continue with this routine until I'm happy with my results and reduce the amount of capsules at that point to see how it works out. Definately better than taking FIN, even if it's more time consuming.
whats bad about fin to you? Been taking mine for a month
@@deanxwhite I got very dry eyes, less and less power in the gym and no "morning wood"(funny word for a non english speaker) lately... I also felt kinda powerless, no drive and I found less things funny. Could be due to the whole covid bs but I decided to stop FIN so I won't be having problems in planning a family. Had some weird mental problems after stopping it which are almost gone since then. Even my problems I wrote above got way less. I am trying the natural route for now on.
@@Pash091 WOW I HAD SUPER DRY EYES ALSO
@@deanxwhite I never thought about FIN causing the dry eyes. It's your health but I the natural way is working if you don't have an aggressive hairloss problem. Both my father and grandfather had no hair in their 30s and I am 31 soon, almost 9 months after stopping FIN and my scalp is way healthier without FIN and also my dandruff problem got better (waiting for winter when we have dry weather conditions, mostly it gets worse during that time)
@@Pash091 what vitamins did you intake
Combine Moro needling with my scalp soothing mist or organic hair growth oil… I had a client who did this and her hair flourished 💜
@@AlexM-up2hw how are you treating your hair right now?
What about if you used minoxidil, didn't see much regrowth on the applied zone (bc dead zone, no hair to be found), then hopped on finasteride and again didn't see regrowth (deadzone) but then got a hair transplant. Wouldn't that mean minoxidil is no longer needed, and finasteride by itself would be enough to protect against more loss? Also could minoxidil strengthen weakened areas and then only finasteride maintain? I have never seen an exact answer for the last scenario, as the root cause of hairloss is treated with finasteride, so shouldn't it not matter if minoxidil is stopped? Minoxidil is just bringing blood flow to shrinking hair follicles, but if the cause of the shrinkage (DHT sensitivity) is being treated by finasteride...it would seem in theory it should work (or microneedle once a week and that replacing minoxidil). I'm too scared to try to see what would happen, but I do know people have had great minoxidil like results from occasional once every week or two microneedling alone
Hey, Rob , what a great informations there,
I want to make sure is a topical combination of finasteride mix with minoxidil truely more effective than the conventional topical minox and oral finasteride separately ..??
Is this for real or just another hoax?
Thanks for your enlightened..
Can you make a video how proper microneedling should be done? I have too much shedding while doing it
Hi Rob, do you know anything about fat stem cell prior transplant to get better results to the crown area? Cost is high 3500 to a small area
Love your channel man. Thank you
Peter
Hello Rob, how are you? What you think about such serums with these ingredients all toghether: Redensyl, AnaGain, Procapil and Capilia Longa. Are they legit for hair growth? i have noticed hair loss since after covid 19, from the top of head (tellogen efluvium as trichologist have diagnosed me.) This year went to gym, taking required vitamins/suplements, diet, lost 5kg but since 1 month hair loosing is getting worse, never seen that before, hope it will grow again, think it's from the stress. just want to ask you by using such serums i've mentioned above would be of help to speed up the process + microneedling.Thank you!
great video
You have great hair my friend !
Hey Rob, what would you think would happen if you had good results using Minoxidil + Microneedling and then stopped only the Minoxidil (kept microneedling forever)? Do you have a better chance of maintaining the gains?
I’m not sure! According to the study, your gains from minoxidil might stick around for longer than if you were to withdraw from the drug as a monotherapy. So, that’s encouraging. But we need more data!
I believe Dr. Donovan recently said, “Microneedling research is still in its infancy. It hasn’t it made it to preschool yet.” I tend to agree!
Rod so whats your current hairloss protocol ? Answer plz
Thanks but PLEASE put links to the studies you present!
These are great news for microneedling, but I have started microneedling and I think I am seeing some very early results, but I am wondering to add topical minoxidil into the regime to have a better results for maybe 6 months. What is it safe to assume that I can keep the new hairs afterwards if I stop minoxidil but still do weekly microneedling? And also is microneedleing safe and effective in the long run - doing it weekly or maybe twice a month for years to come?
Used minoxidil 2%, finasteride, and micronedling, literally regrew all my hair back, then had side effects had to stop everything, 1.5 years later lost all my gains
Try minox once a day and see how you feel. Then add finasteride. Im assuming you did them together without stepping up? Perhaps even try finasteride for a few months then try minox once per day
@@wellutopia2237 stardted with fin added minoxidil 3 months later, side effects started one year later, had heart palpitations, blured vission, ED, was rushed to the hospital, iam 26 btw, at the time i was 24, now everything is ok, although it a year had to pass for everything to normalise
How long was the minoxidil study? I want to propose possibility #3. What if solely using minoxidil for the duration of the study wasn't long enough for most participants to let the new hair growth turn into terminal hairs, whereas the group with minoxidil + micro needling accelerated the terminal hair turnover rate, thus keeping more.
I'm in my thirties now but in my early to mid twenties I used minoxidil + micro needling on my face and I went from a weak mustache and no hairs on my chin to a full beard. If I remember correctly I kept that up for around 16-20 months and that was well over 7-8 years ago and I have since kept all my beard growth, at the very least all the hairs that turned terminal. And the males on my mother and my fathers side have had terrible facial hair.
It’s all about trial and error. another method could be use finesteride , mixoxile, rosemary oil and dermroller 1.5 once per week. After one year cut down on minoxile and use rosemary and finerstaide to maintain the growth with dermroller
hi,what is the best dosage for oral minoxidil, which minimize the side effects and also has decent effect on regrowing hair.
still too many topics , I am excited to know your view....prostate and it's impact on hair loss .... the same about thyroid
Thanks 👍 for your great knowledge. You helped me a lot tbh ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Does medical needling hurt the hair you have if it's long?
Hey rob been massaging.... also did a crazy deep massage on my scalp yesterday it felt loose and felt minty and just felt good. then i microneedled... how long shold i wait to massage? i didnt a bit today as well.
Hey Rob, what do you think about Kintor's new hairloss drug, pyrilutamide? Currently in it's phase 3 trials. It has been getting a lot of attraction lately. Apparently, it blocks DHT and testoterone from binding to androgen receptors, and it doesn't reduce serum DHT levels at all. It has 4 x greater binding affinity, than RU-58841. So in theory, it could stop the mechanism of androgenic alopecia, and you wouldn't have the side effect profiles that an anti androgen like finasteride or dutasteride would give somebody . Looks like it could be a ground breaking hairloss treatment option. Would be awesome if you did an in depth video on this pyrilutamide, and to see your opinion on it.
FR?
@@rockyp32 Yes. It is legit. It has been starting to get a lot of traction. I think with Rob being a medical director and very knowledgeable in hairloss, while being able to break down studies, it would be awesome for him to talk about Pyrilutamide.
Wow never heard of it thanks for the input ! This looks so promising
Thank you
There’s a CZcamsr named “Wavy Shad” that used a dermaroller and minoxidil for months to restore his hairline. He claims he has stopped both and retained all of his hair - haven’t used either forms of therapy for months. That supports this speculation. He even said that he used the .5mm dermaroller every day when doing it
he ll eventully lose his gains he made from minoxidil!
Can you make a video on oral castor oil?
Hello Rob, to increase the blood flow do you think the use of cold or ice pads can help? Thanks
Try balayam
Can dermoroller, monoxille and saw palmetto be sufficient for regrowth
Hi Rob!
Fan and subscriber here! Any comments on oral minoxidil + dermarolling? If oral minoxidil increases sulfotransferase activity do you think dermarolling will add better results? I had no results derma rolling with topical minoxidil for 6 months so I gave up. It's been 5 months that I'm on 5 mg oral minoxidil and some hairs are coming, only thing is they're still not really thickening.
Hey , even i am prescribed with 2.5mg minoxidil , do you see any results ?
What other regime have you implemented to grow?
I have applied 5%menoxidil overnight on scalp and after 1.5 years I felt dizziness, irregular heart beats, sexual health detoriation. Please I wouldn't personally suggest lab rat slowmo poisons. Western science is for money and short term gains only. Go natural prefer ayurveda... I am getting back naturally now.
can anyone recommend medical grade needle roller for scalp that is available in the eu region? something below $40
Monoxidil foam or the liquid which one is best?
Rob, do you recommend MicroNeedling+Minoxidill for Alopecia Areata ???
The studies on microneedling for alopecia areata are incredibly limited, and they're not necessarily evoking responses better than what we see in untreated groups who experience spontaneous recovery. I'm open to this working, but I think microneedling's mechanisms more so target features related to AGA.
I regrew lot of hair , almost 80% using MinFin 0.1% topical once , Min once daily , I got sides, so just to give a bit rest I discontinues things for 2 months and I lost almost all gains . I decided to use MinFin 0.05% morning, Fin + Microneedle evening . I am also going to try Ketoconazole ZPTO lotion .
Not sure if it’s mentioned in the video. What was micro needling device length? How many times per week? How long was each session?
What size of needle would u suggest?
Hey Rob
Quick question - is it safe to combine microneedling (weekly 1.5mm) with scalp massages twice daily? I mean wouldn’t it be too much acute inflammation or it’s ok?
There’s definitely an upper limit. I wouldn’t start massaging again until your scalp feels nearly fully recovered from microneedling.
Once a week micro needling minoxidil 2 x a day and massaging with a silicone massager .
Does massages help regrowth?
Plz tell.
any info on CosmeRNA, and when available in US?
Hey Rob
Perfect hair news for me.
That's exactly the treatment i use. Min 5% twice per day + microneedling (dermapen, 1.5 mm) every 7-14 days.
i'm 3 months in and the results are very good.
I've been taking photos of my scalp regularly with constant angles and lighting. I'll probably do a video after 6 months.
On a different note:
Do you have any thoughts on the study from 11 oct about topical finasteride?
"Efficacy and safety of topical finasteride spray solution for male androgenetic alopecia"
Also:
Considering Dutasteride's molecular wheight of around 500 daltons would it be a prime candidate for a topical 5AR inhibitor that wouldn't go systemic?
Any studies on this?
Thank you for all the work you put in these videos
Faci și masajele ?
Moledcular weight argument is moot. I personally have been using different concentration of topical finasteride and dutasteride over past 5 months. Both give you side effects even at lower doses and especially when they accumulate in the system. Everyone however is different. The best middle ground i found is to use dutasteride 0.025-0.05% once or max twice per week and all the other 5 days 0.25mg of finasteride a day. Ofcourse once daily 5% topical minoxidil and weekly needling. Nizoral shampoo also helps with dandruff issues with minox. Castor oil and aloe vera gel after needling i recommend for soothing the itch.
Congrats on the results! That’s great.
We will have a video about microneedling soon (a few weeks). I can answer your questions there. In the meantime, here is our latest paper:
link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs13555-021-00653-2
I liked the data from the topical finasteride study. It demonstrated reduced systemic absorption. However, for diffuse thinners, topical is probably less superior than oral due to application difficulties.
As far as dutasteride - we’re in the process of writing a case report about this. If it gets accepted, I’ll have more information to share.
Topical dutas may not get absorbed at all due to its size
@@jss.2020 DHT from our members are showing a 10-15% decline in serum DHT when 0.02-0.06% topical dutasteride is applied once per week. Interestingly, mesotherapy dutasteride may change dutasteride's pharmacokinetics to more slowly release into the serum. I should have more information on this soon. Regardless, if anyone decides to go with topical dutasteride, and if they're concerned about systemic absorption, a great investment is just to order DHT tests before and after one month of consistent application. Not everyone sees a drop in DHT; some people see a big drop.
What happens is i use microneedeling and topical finasteride? Not in the same session i use dermastamp once a week and finasteride everyday with 3 applications
What is the best needle size for micro needling?
hey rob former member of your online community, What is the recommended length in millimetres for the dermaroller and at what time intervals do you recommend to use it? I do 0.5 mm once every three weeks and that seems to give the best results.
We've got a video coming out about this soon! If you check the comments section of this video, I discuss the details a bit more: czcams.com/video/UGBamyyJLOk/video.html
You can also see our recent literature review for more information: link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13555-021-00653-2
Only microneedling?
@@PerfectHairHealth unfortunately that study doesn't specify whether, along the range of, "once weekly" or "once monthly", which time interval was most beneficial. That i think would be valuable knowledge regarding MN for hair growth.
Hello! Love the chanel! I have a question. I hope you have time to answer. When I microneedle for hair growth at home; do I have to do it only to affected thinning areas or all of my head? I use Dr Pen. Another question: how long do I need to wait to apply topical products such as minoxidil after the microneedling? Cheers :))
Rob what roller length and how many times a week did the study show?
Is it possible that this was achieved with daily microneedling with 0.5 lower rather than 1.5 weekly or 2 weekly. Thanks
Bao et al stated that they used an automatic needling device inserted to a depth of 1-2mm into the skin. So, we can presume 1-2mm needle lengths. Their sessions were once every 3 weeks. This is slightly different than the needle lengths they used in their 2020 study which got similar results.
We actually summarized all of this data in a table inside our latest literature review: link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13555-021-00653-2/tables/3
So, if you're curious about how other AGA microneedling studies conducted their designs and sessions, that's a great resource.
We don't yet know if 0.5mm needle lengths used daily are equivalent to 1.5mm needle lengths used weekly. We'll make a video diving into everything soon! Probably the next few weeks.
@@PerfectHairHealth but is there a difference in the type of devices being used I e are dermapens more effective than manual dermarollers ? Even though they have the same mechanism
Thanks
@@prabshiro I wish I could give you a better answer, but it's still unknown. We do know that rollers are suspected to penetrate just 50-75% of their actual needle depth due to needle angulation and user pressure variability. We also know that up to 1.5mm, automated pens nearly perfectly match skin penetration depth and needle length. Beyond that, device comparisons haven't been well studied. I'm hoping we'll have some better answers in 2022.
She says I’ve been using .5 and 1m micro needling with limited success. Should I use longer ones (scary!)
Does micro needling becomes tolerant by our body?
i do my micro every 2 weeks and during my fasting period and a next day rinse massage of rosemary, caffeine, oregano, and fennel water [ oil as well] as well as taking saw palmetto supps... for the last year and have seen great results
Facing any side effects with saw palmetto?
Btw how's the result now?
Fighting hair loss? 🤣🤣🤣. It’s my best friend 🥰. Number 1 buzzer over the remnants once a week or so and away I go. Essentially zero cost 💲 per annum. I’d never go back to copious hair if you paid me. Life is fantastic at the shiny end of the spectrum guys 😊
Can intermittent fasting works for hair loss??
wait so, when you micro needle your scalp changes? Which then allows for hair to stay and not be effected by DHT? Confused.
I think the effects are inspite of DHT, different mechanism
I have a small area on the top of my head that I think has been too long without any activity (not been growing for a long time), I guess there is a timelimit here where the hair forget how to reproduce, anyone that have any experience ?
Could I keep my gains of minoxidil/finasteride if I stop taking them and continue with just massages and microneedling -using the appropriate technique and frequency?
no lol, you can’t, that’s not how it works
Just get a transplant for glides sake
No
Topical 5% Minoxidil made me extremely drowsy and irregular heart beat. Is there any hope or I just have to accept going bald?
In me it did a permanent demage, so be careful
Some guys successfully cut down Minox from once a day to 3 times a week due to microneedling.
Interesting!
So using microneedle alone will regrowth hair in men?
@@ayadhussin6771 According to a regression model across six study subgroups, yes. But we still need more data with longer study durations.
@@PerfectHairHealthBy the way, I have been using dermapen with lenght 1,mm and then I applied copper peptides serum in 4 times in week . Surprisely I noticed my new hair starting to grow on my top of the scalp. I have been doing this 2 weeks now and I will continue because I see alot of improvement result. Copper peptides is proven to block DHT also. So Im living in proof that this work. But everyone is different.
Can’t be bothered saving my hair anymore…..
I’m about to order 1mm derma rollers…already have finasteride. Would you micro first then apply the liquid?
i’d maybe look into 1,5mm length at least for the crown, temples too if you can tolerate it
I fought and won by maintenaning hygiene in my body and environment eating salmon fishing once a week and taking zinc syrup and tablet zinc help in protein synthesis and cell division and minising by friend circle with positive people only cleaning my room and accomodating painting my room after 1 . 5 year and And reducing nuisance sound as much as possible by accomodating sound proofing windows and placing a Good Exhaust for throwing out our exhaled air by it And A vent for clean Air in room from where there is no nuisance just fresh natural Air which very essential I think this will help definitely
Another kind of study would be interesting : what if we stop minoxidil + dermarolling, but we keep going on with finasteride…
Interesting! I’m not quite sure what would happen. I think it might depend on the magnitude of effect from withdrawal on both those short-term and long-term effects discussed in the video.
Ask your dermatologist his or her advice about that plan. If you're already on Finasteride, you'll save some hair as that is what the pill is meant to do primarily.
Could someone advise similar channel about eyesight?
I don't think eyes are that adaptable, maybe laser surgery
My scalp is thinning and hair thinning and hairline moving backwards I'm only 26 years old in about to order a dermaroller and using onion juice right now and maybe order a serum not sure
Minoxidil
Update??
the enemy of hair growth is dht so once treatment ceases dht comes back and hair loss begins again ergo we have to take for eg biotin to suppress dht and preserve the hair gains to maintain our hair gain
Wonder if micro needling works for scarring alopecia 🤔
It worked for my beard when I was 12 I had a ice skating accident n busted my chin open when I started getting facial hair about 17 I used to just cut it but I did some microneddling on my chin when I was 19 bc I wanted to start growing out my beard now it is filled in 20 now
Hey Rob, I had a question. Should you immediately apply minoxidil after micro needling? Or is there a waiting period?
It says to give it 24 hours or at least 12 .. but some people apply anyways.
It may have benefits like helping with minoxdil absorption
But can have many bad affects too. Especially when you have alcohol in that minoxdil
Can you put subtitles for the videos into Arabic?
I can't use dermaroller due to psiorasis sad times
Have you identified what provokes the psoriasis? Is it controllable?
2:12 🤣
11:15 you totally burped
Man finds effective treatment for hair loss. Pharma makes their own studies. *finds man’s treatment to be INEFFECTIVE*
Riiiiight, like I’m gonna beLIEve big pharma 😂 thanks for the content brother - you’re a genius and a humble one at that 🙏🏼
Just me or does he look like the actor from lost? Jack shepherd I think was his name.
HE REALLY DOES
I think micro needling is the winner because it's not a drug we can somehow keep up the routine with zero hustle and have good results as a monotherapy and is cost effective and have zero side effects
Have you had good results with it?
@@brandongordon2521 somewhat good 👍
Why dont you respond to haircafe? He reacted to your video with good arguments.
He did. He did a very good response video ! Go and look at his video history
Trying to have a good faith discussion with Kevin Mann (Haircafe) is like trying to handhold a film critic who is incapable of summarizing the plot of your movie.
Why does he need to respond when Rob proved that he was wrong about him actually suffering from androgenetic alopecia?
@@PerfectHairHealth 😂 this is brilliant. Got to love all of these self taught experts who believe they are better informed than the actual medical professionals who are trained to parse the data correctly. Great vids by the way, just recently found your channel. Keep it up
Rob wearing hoody. 👍
Hi rob. You look alike Jim Karry from dumb n dumber movie 😅
Maybe there is a psychological aspect to this also?
just stay far far away from minoxidil.
Not very sensitive to show the video of the exploding barrel.
There might have been woman hurt in that
Blødflû
You don't understand fucking nothing, LOL 😂
This report is bordering on reckless advice. Your whole presentation had countless, maybe's, perhaps and disclaimers. Clearly, this is a minimal study, with a small percentage of participants and a timeline that isn't nearly long enough to fully determine the outcome of its subjects. Hair therapy, in one form of another, is a life long journey. If one chooses that path, of course.
Light switches MY ASS
Shuddap!