Prototyping The Marble Machine Programming Wheel
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- čas přidán 7. 11. 2023
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Martin, in trying to find a reason to quit the marble machine, keeps accidentally discovering the perfect solution to his problems.
Martin keeps discovering everything taught in mechanical engineering school, the hard way.
On the plus side, doing it this way means he'll retain all the lessons. When he's done with this project, he should consider fast-tracking a degree from a technical college.
@@peterjohnson9438 Press 'X' to doubt.
In a way, this is raw science. He’s discovering fundamental principles through experimentation.
@@peterjohnson9438 I guess the difference will have been between learning and understanding. Having experienced the pain for each and every principle, Martin would have pretty much grokked mechanical engineering by the time he is done.
@@Tsaganlearning the 'hard way' usually means you truly understand, vs superficially studying for exams.
As a musician myself: It's always a bit painful to hear him say the first Marble Machines "failed". They did not. Especially the first one. It did everything it needed to. It played music, it felt authentic because it wasn't perfect. It had a lot of charm, it had a lot of passion and you could feel it. It wasn't perfect by any means and it never had to be. Just one instrument has caught so much attention, so many fans, and to this day, it is one of the most watched and most genuinely liked videos on the internet. Basically the whole internet knows the Marble Machine song. It moved people, made them think, feel. THAT is music. That's what it is all about.
Then came MMX, which was started with a vision, and sparked a lot of hope in the fans for more marble machine music. And that hope is still there.
In my eyes, the marble machines did not fail at all.
I have struggled with this too. It may be true to say that neither earlier machine could perform in the way he imagined (consistent, live), and perhaps (?) required a fair bit of post-processing to sound good, but as a viewer it's jarring to hear him criticize the carrot that drew us here in the first place. And frustrating that he’d (a videographer) imply this with blanket criticism instead of showing it. Listening, I feel a bit like I’ve stumbled into a cult where I’m repeatedly told to leave my past behind, haha.
Maybe others have this same experience, but I catch myself thinking things like “there’s a better way to tell this story” and then remembering this is largely someone’s real life, without the benefit of a known narrative arc. Despite the present focus and goals Martin forefronts, the real “story” - as it is - is only visible in retrospect.
The change from "i believe" to "i verify" is symbolic of martin learning to be a true engineer. Mm3 will be successful
He's nowhere even close to being an engineer. MM3 will most likely *not* be successful, unless the goalposts move to make it so.
@@thomasbecker9676 Did you forget to include the motivation behind this assertion or was it deliberately meant to be read as meaningless opinion?
@@thomasbecker9676wow you are truely a negative person wtf haha
@@Josh_728 Martin isn't going to sleep with you, just because you simp for him.
@@notead Please see all of MMX through the eyes of an actual, experienced engineer.
I think you're going to find that your timing mechanism will not hold up under load. You really need to make an oscillating escapement to keep tight time or you will always be fighting against the influence of the mechanism drag effecting your timing. If you want your machine to run like a clock you need to make a clock.
excellent point, my metronome I practice with agrees with you.
You will definitely want to test the machining of that long slot it may be a lot more challenging than you think. Chip evacuation will be very important if you intend on using a spherical tip mill. The type of cutter that you showed is not designed to cut plastic at all and will likely clog and break either the cutter or the work piece. The cutter shown is called a rotary bur and is used to contour metal by hand and is notorious for clogging. You would be far better off cutting a groove with a ball nose end mill and then gluing the bar in place. Pressing in a very long and thin metal rod into a long hole will be VERY challenging to get right with a press fit. Most press fits do not go longer than about 10:1 aspect ratio of length to diameter, or you will have problems of bending the "pin" due to every increasing friction of the press fit. Too loose, and it will slide in easy, but you will have to secure it with glue anyway. That would be preferable to the press fit in my book.
Yeah a slot with a ball mill is a much more feasible idea. Chip clearing will be near impossible unless there is a pre cut slot like when machining a dovetail. The proposed machining steps should also be reversed so there's more room for chip clearing between programming profile slots.
Instead of glue, he could clamp the bars down with a bunch of printed straps or saddle clamps.
I suspect that he will need to insert the rod longways and not click it into place, because you will have two plastic pieces playing tug-o-war and if the slot on the wheel "loses" the rod can be pulled out of position. In addition, the slots on the wheel will face degradation over time, due to repeated programming changes, and loose their solid grip on the rod
@@NPerilloI think it's the best way, just cut a grooves to hold the rods in place and secure them with metal straps that go around the wheel
The press fit thing felt weird to me, too. Over time, clipping the profile parts in and out is likely to expose an imperfect fitment on at least _one_ of the bars, having the thing pop out when trying to remove one of the profiles.
I want to see the design work, but I'm not sure about a press fit.
I like your idea for the new wheel but I have one suggestion, either use a regular endmill or a slitting saw to cut a small section from the bottom of the circular groove. The ball endmill will have trouble cutting at the bottom of the ball because the radius of the cutter goes to zero with respect to the rotating axis, meaning that point on the ball will essentially drag across the material and cut poorly leaving a bad surface finish.
If it's mechanically possible on the CNC, he could maybe also angle the spindle so that it leans away from it's direction of movement. That way the point where the ball would drag would be a bit in front where the material will be removed anyway.
Up
At this point, Martin is going to just end up building a clock with some instruments lmao
The amount of force needed to push the rods in seems like the hardest (ha) part of this new design.
yeah, I have concerns with how much force that is going to take, that's gonna add up to be a lot of friction
Why not slot them in from the side?
@@FloLedermann the further it's pushed in, the more resistance there will be. And in order to keep the position accurate (and thus tight timing), it will need a fairly tight fit. We'll see what he comes up with :) Hopefully does a test-run of a slice of the programming wheel before committing to whole thing
@@twardnw if they’re hard to push in sideways, he can break the rods and do it in pieces. The accuracy should still be there since that’s driven by the holes’ accuracies
Could he not use many smaller rods instead of one long rod across the whole length of the wheel? Each small rod could have a tight fit without having to apply a colossal force. Might take a while to assemble
The design of every piece of this has been stunning, and seeing it assembled is probably going to be one of the most wonderful things I witness.
You need to get out more.
We all know that this will most likely never be assembled and fully functioning. 😅 But at least the content is entertaining.
@@thomasbecker9676says the person who’s whole idea is to write negative comments under every wintergatan upload lmao
Yeah, I thought that about the last one.
@@MikeKrasnenkov Simp for Martin all you want, he's not going to sleep with you, and MM3 isn't going to meet his current expectations and promises.
Keep in mind at 8:46 that the cutter moves along the axis of the cnc but the cutter itself will be rotating and cutting on one edge, causing force to be put in the direction of your rotation axis. Something that will help with that is always starting the cut from the same side. This way the rotation axis isn't pushed one direction during a cut and the other direction on the back cut. If there is an offset due to the cutting edge it will be the same for all slots this way.
I'm hoping he goes with aluminum for the cylinder... much easier to cut and would limit axial loading.
@@MacroAggressor Yeah and depending on how it's secured there could be a large amount of deflection and chattering. Hopefully he does lots of test cuts first.
MARTIN, don't forget, that varying marble troughput trough instruments will put varying load on marble lifting mechanism, which will deviate marble machine speed since you will be inputing constant force via huygen drive. Less marble troughput, smaller load on the machine, machine speeds up. Loads of marbles to lift, heavy load on the machine, machine slows down
That's what I'm thinking ever since Martin told the first time he discovered the huygen drive. The drive inputs mostly a constant force and the speed results from the force balance. However, the governor adds a bit of a speed regulation since its breaking force is quadratic proportional to the speed. But I don't think it can keep up with such dynamic loads and precision Martin asks for!
He can always just use another power source for the marbles. Or not at all. Just have enough of them and let gravity do all the work.
Honestly there was an electric motor on the mmx, personally I'd do away with all that complexity and just brute force it with a motor and gearbox, no need for a dangerous flywheel, governor etc and it'll be laser accurate because geared down enough they'll be more torque than you'd ever need
@@RobFarley74It’s simply a “dumb design requirement” for this thing to be mechanically/human powered, instead of using a motor.
To solve that is to mangage a gear ratio
Every time I started to worry he was returning to his old mistakes, he throws in a "but this would be a bad idea for of exactly what you were thinking"
Take a drink every time Martin says "tight".
Careful! That's how you get alcohol poisoning! lol
I really hope the marble machine still has some hand crank/foot crank for you to choose the speed. I know its less precise but the appeal of the marble machine for me has always been that it felt like an instrument not an automaton
Hoping the final machine has both, so he can play with manual (imperfect) timing for a few songs but not have to stomp a lever for an hour concert
That's interesting. I'm a bit different. I definitely want it to be manually powered (not electric), but watching someone rotate a crank is boring. What's interesting to me is watching him flip levers and play the manual part of the instruments. I want to see his arms (and maybe feet) control different aspects of the music like some crazy conductor / one man band. That gives more opportunity for improvisation as well. If we get more beautiful chaos from that at the expense of not watching him do something anyone in the world can do I'm on board 100%
@@Izrun Literally every single person in this fucking community needs to understand this. Guys, stop overglorifying the hand crank, it's fucking stupid actually. There are other aspects of the music that all of the marble machines have had the ability to control manually, that are far more important than "change tempo by cranking faster".
I mean, I miss the music, but EVERY engineering student should be following this. Just fantastic information, walking through the problems and the process to address them, etc.
Negative examples are important, yes.
I am an engineer and MM3 will fail as well.
Martin keeps increasing his requirements every episode.
He did it in the past and he still keeps doing so.
He eventually will find a way not to go on tour.
MMX failed because he kept putting esthetics before function and now it's about tight music in every second sentence.
So far I never heard any difference between tight and not tight music.
@@RubyRhod Seems overly pessimistic, and a tad bit elitist. I haven't seen much feature creep of particular note. As far as I can tell he seems to be approaching this from a methodical and sane perspective, and is making steady progress toward a solid design. He certainly isn't an engineer, but he's coming at this with an engineering mindset.
@@RubyRhodShitting all over other peoples project, and nay-saying those with kind words is not "constructive criticism" no matter how much you tell yourself it is.
@@RubyRhod I think we need to keep in mind that he edits the audio quite heavily for a lot of the actual music he posts
From the way he describes his experiences with the other machines, he had to actively fight them to get any semblance of tempo out of them.
As a musician, you NEVER want to be fighting your instrument. Especially if it is primarily a rhythm instrument.
His definition of tight appears to me to be under 1ms standard deviation. Of course he's not factoring in how that'll scale up from prototype to full design, but it's still a pretty solid goal.
You'll notice he has accepted every design he's created up to this point as being good enough.
I like this idea! Using a single, known-consistent metal bar for your precision is clever. As long as you can get the rotary CNC to cut channels which are precise distances from one another, sounds awesome. My only hesitancy would be destroying a large/expensive wheel if you get your machining operation wrong, but small scale tests can hopefully help avoid that. :)
Unfortunately a long bar like that is far from consistent and will be nearly impossible to fit along the whole length.
There is something special about watching someone learn true design engineering and implement it. These videos also demonstrate design thinking very well and is a great tool to show the difference between an idea and a design.
CRAZY IDEA:
What if instead of having a programing wheel that activates the gates mechanically, with the pins or prophiles, you had one that activated them electrically?
One option is that you could print a board with electrodes and a small battery on the wheel, that would make contact with a loose wire instead of a lever.
Another option is to use optical sensors with infrared LEDs in the place of the lever, lke those robots that follow a black line on the floor, having the wheel be printed with the notes
Both things would be incredibly precise, but maybe the machine would lose part of it's magic, since the mechanical activation is so pleasing to see
I think an important idea to ponder is why a programming wheel. If you want to design form from function maybe consider a different approach than just assuming the programming wheel is the way to go.
My thoughts exactly as soon as I saw the double gear again.
As my previous worries weren't dissolved, I'll just re-post the comment I wrote in a previous video.
The programming wheel don't seems rigid enough to avoid deformation between both ends, the lack of diagonals or structural parts may cause a problem, moreover the driving force is applied to one end and there is resistance all the way whit the gates.
One other overlooked requirement is the need to play notes in fast succession, cause you can place a pin every 2 holes at minimum, holes that are worth 1 quarter note each in your design.
Some will say that the profile could have multiple edges to play multiple notes but you'd have to redesign the gate, as it is right now, it's way to flat and will be sitting on top of the multiple edges, thus merging everything into a single long note.
This programming wheel is brilliant. At last, it seems, a wheel that is machineable and foolproof!
Famous last words
Just a technical comment here. You talked about the cutting forces only being in the "rigid direction" on the programming wheel for version 3. There is actually also a force in the "not rigid" direction. As a plunging cutting tool engaged with material on 3 sides. On 2 of the sides the forces cancel out, but the last side creates a sideways force that actually tries to "turn" the programming wheel. Just something to keep in mind, not critical :)
Have taken account of thermal expansion of the different materials, brass bar and 3d printed plastic under the lights on stage I would guess it will be warmer than your workshop
imagine martin demanding this kind of precision from his human band-mates.
@@WartornNOROr because they no longer exist?
Oh boy, not again! This has nothing to do whatsoever with removing the human imperfection characteristic from music. I find it amazing how this fucking community can't understand this.
Now this is promising! I hope the tests with the prototypes are successful and you learn a lot from them!
You've been doing a great job, love how much the marble machine has been improving over the years
Design number two makes me think that you could look to bike wheel parts and wheel building techniques to save design effort.
just use bike rims , head back yo your bike place
Love it!
That is such a nice and forgiving design.
It WILL play tight music, for sure.
9:28 Wait, that seems like a lot of metal-to-metal surface area that needs to slide across each other while being tight enough to "press-fit". After you get a few centimeters in, are you going to attempt hammering at the end of a meter-long, thin rod? I highly recommend prototyping this before you construct a whole wheel with it. Maybe consider making the rods thinner, and adding rings on both sides to hold them in?
Martin, you can change bpm on the go precisely by adding a attack angle rod to the governor. With this rod, you can manipulate drag coefficient of the governor propeller like in helicopters thus changing the rpm that the flywheel rotates at. This method does not effect precision of the system and might be a good addition possibly. With this flexibility on the BPM, you can use the programming wheel much more efficient for varying tempo of different music tracks.
I do not know why, but your videos seem to be so cozy and atmospheric. Keep it up, Martin!
Finding all these solutions while trying to quit is hillarious, when we're on our lowest the mind becomes free of its shackles after all. I'm happy you are getting better and better at the marble machine, no matter the outcome I'm just glad i get to experience this journey in real time. Best of luck!
What a cliffhanger!
Your videos make me so happy. It is going to be bitter sweet once you nail this design. I have LOVED watching this evolve from the first machine. It has been a pleasure to learn with you, you are a wonderful educator, and an equally wonderful person.
I really like how you're not just using 3D printing to create parts for the machine but also tools to improve the creation process itself, that's really cool!
I love this channel. I've learned so much about engineering, prototyping, materials, etc., all while being entertained. Thank you!
I'm not sure about "design three", I suspect you might have some addition DFM (design for manufacturability) work to do there. Getting a press of a 3' long metal bar is going to be tough -- meaning even if you find the perfect ball mill that exactly matches the right press fit tolerances of your metal rod, (a) how will that change as the ball mill wears down, and (b) how much physical force will it take to push that rod three feet through tight tolerances?
I think you'd be better off tightly constraining the ends of the rod, or maybe a small area on each side of each slot, and then leaving more of the center free in order to avoid an impossible push fit. Similarly, I'm worried that the outer programming skin is responsible for so much of the structural stiffness of the assembly. That outer skin seems to be trying to do too much.
Plastic is the answer. There are different types of plastic obviously, so choosing the right one for this application is the tricky part. A brass rod would go well with a delrin or uhmw plastic. Tooling doesn't wear near as bad when machining plastic. A little heat can be applied to the plastic and the rod can easily be pushed in. There are companies that do this very sort of thing with great accuracy and consistency, and have been for years. Martin is on the right track. Hope this helps.
Sourcing that tube of plastic is going to be an absolute bear too... I think his "design 2" could be optimized into self-spacing laminar rings; or maybe half / third / quarter sections. The inner rings could have slip fit tolerances on the pins, with the outer spoked wheels entrapping the pins in blind holes at assembly. Each ring could have a pattern of radially spaced tapped holes and countersunk holes (since flat head screws naturally self locate when tightened) for accurate / easy assembly. The double helical gear also becomes a set of individual rings in this example.
Having semicircular slots, and then having some elastic bands to hold the rods in place would seem much easier, especially if one had some extra slots that could be used with a jig that could use hooks to pull out on the bands so the drum could be slid into or out of the jig.
4 years from now.
"Prototyping The Marble Machine Programming Wheel"
Dang in at only 347 views! I think this is the earliest I've ever noticed a Wintergatan video! Hyped for the programming wheel and hyped for the world tour!
Awesome video, once again. When this is all over it would be fun to have a video of everything you've done so far. Like a timelapse or something. Or maybe just a 40 hour video consisting of all your Marblemachine video's back to back. I often just have you talking about your machine in the background while i'm working on my on shenanigans
I am so proud of your new approach and the storytelling is amazing!
So intense! Can't wait for the next video! It almost feel like watching a series and being at the end of a season, waiting for the conclusion to know if there will be a season 3 or not
Fantastic video and I love how we are seeing the evolution of the designs. Those programming wheels will not be easy to move around but I guess that goes for the whole machine too.
I always love seeing you problem solve and innovate.
Man this is one of the greatest youtube cliffhanger ever, will Martin end up continuing marble machine 3 or will he drop the project? can't wait for the next video
This whole astounding ride from 1 to 3 continues to amaze me!!!
I love the storytelling and video editing in this episode ❤
Please note that a full plastic wheel will be prone to a lot of thermal expansion on the world tour. This could result in centimeters of variation in programming wheel diameter. Also, plastic is prone to creeping over time. I would recommend a steel basis for the wheel with small, replaceable, plastic parts.
I so love how this project is turning out! From "I believe" to "I verify" - wonderful!
Wow, what a great project! I can't wait to see it finished. My sincere compliments.😃
Always incredible to watch your videos, Martin! Much love! Stay awesome!
Buckling up! This will be awesome!
I really love how 3d printing has allowed the creative process to flourish! Keep up the great work! I'm excited for what the future holds, and am enjoying seeing the progress being made.
What I got out of this video is how to 3d print a very cool wheel. Got some GREAT ideas from your version 2 wheel. Love your videos!
You might want to consider adding a thin “backstop” in the programming wheel for when you’re inserting the rods. You could either stop the circular bit just before exiting the far side, or just attach a ring of sheet metal to the outside. It’d at least help with assembly, but if you did it on both sides it could also help with preventing the rods from drifting out over time. Potentially not a problem, but it should be an easy enough fix that it might be worth doing preventatively.
I think it's gonna be the inverse, if the slut is somewhat tight, he will never be able to drive 3ft rod in there.
I hope it plays the right music because we all need to get the marble machine on stage with you guys when you go on your. Plus I imagine it opens up what music you can make by having the marble machine be a multi instrument leaving band meme era to play other instruments for the songs that otherwise wouldn’t be possible with the number of people on stage.
Is there even a band anymore?
great video! what a journey. I have absolutely no engineering background, but i'm still here since Day1. Having some cliffhanger vibes rn.
martin is not only getting better at designing this monstrousity, even his storytelling skills are blooming!
fingers crossed ❤🎉❤
Awesome to see new ideas. I still listen to the songs
Martin is literally reinventing the wheel!
As soon as I saw design requirements, you got my full attention ❤
Chasing "tight" specs is nice and all, but remember that the original captured hearts and was barely holding together. If it's not perfect, that doesn't mean it's not perfect. The *goal* here is to make music, to spread joy, to create wonder. You don't always need millisecond accuracy to do that.
Im no engenier, but im a mechanic and i can tell you, depending on the material you use, V3 will be a pain in the ass. 1) the entire ball part of the mill bit is in use. That will most likely mess up the bit pretty fast and you will burn throu them like cracy. You have to use a pretty soft material for the wheel or take it incredebly slow, orherwise the wobble you create by full contact milling will mess up your meassurments. 2) you have a lot of different cuts. If you use a soft material like PE, as soon as your milling bits gets dull your edges start to look like chewed.
Its doable, no doubt but if you do, do yourself a favor and outsorce it to a professional. You get your money double back in safed lifetime.
i get so happy when i see an upload from you Martin! I hope it all works so we can finally see your vision come to life! :D
really cool to see the exact methods i'm learning in my mechanical engineering classes being used in this video
Martin, can I challenge your assumption that the programming wheel needs to be a wheel? What if it was a chain drive? You could make your music loop of arbitrary length by using larger chains (and adjusting your idler gears).
Look into compressionless brake housing for transferring the movement at the programming wheel to the marble gate. Bikes with mechanical brake systems use brake housing to route the movement of the brake lever to the brake calipers. Compressionless housing is specifically made to be stiffer and less squishy, possibly letting it play tighter.
I imagine that press fitting those LONG metal bars into LONG slots will be quite difficult. I think the amount of friction building up will quickly overcome your ability to push them into the slots. You might consider splitting the programming wheel into several narrower drums with shorter slots for ease of assembly. You could even align the narrow drums using the metal bars provided you leave some overlap.
The video are always so much incredible, SO happy when i see a new one
I do like the metal bar idea
You could easily get *TIGHT MUSIC* from imprecise _slow moving_ programming wheel, if the programming wheel only register *WHICH* note should be played next, but actual actuation force comes from _fast moving_ flywheel telling *WHEN* the note shall be played.
THIS HAS TO PLAY TIGHT MUSIC. YOU CAN NOT GIVE UP ON THE MARBLE MACHINE. You've come so far.
Fiiine! Your perseverance, passion, and love for efficiency made me resubscribe.
Martin let be short and simple on Point!!! You're nailed it once again❤ Love it🫠
I'm here for that good designing and crafting, absolutely lovely! XD
Good vibes. You got this Martin 🎉
8:48 it WILL add pressure in the rotary direction since the tool is rotating it pushes to the side when doing a slot cut
I can't comprehend the level of genius behind designing these music machines.
That's because there is none.
I love the "Previously on, Wintergatan" introduction that starts off every video.
Gives off TV show vibes.
It's groundhog day.
🤣 almost, never prototyped the Wheel before just went straight to building the final versions so its not exactly the same (i Hope 🙈)
@@WintergatanJust keep doing what gives you joy :)
The dedication of this guy, it's rare to find professional engineers as thorough!
Building that printed wheel from segments looks like torture.
If you replace the programming wheel with an electronic controller and replace the marbles with speakers, the whole system would be simplified and the timing/sound would be near perfect.
"Will this new wheel be hard to manufacture?"
"It will be easy, barely an inconvenience and it will play very tight."
"Ohh tight marble music is TIGHT."
Certainly that design with the massive amount of pieces could be printed by anyone on even a really small printer. So it's not without its merits too. The jig for hammering in the pins is good too. I can't wait to see this machine finished, since it feels like you've been working on it for at least a decade.
Great lesson about prototyping!
I never normally interact with youtubers outside of watching the videos or commenting, and very very rarely I'll join a channel briefly for a very specific reason (Like if they have an extended learning course or something I want). I never usually go to any meet ups, shows, buy merch or any of that stuff, but I actually think if this machine finally does get finished to martins standards, I'll go to see it live when he tours round my way!
One thing to keep in mind, if the outer material is in tension or compression, it'll move as it's machined. It's possible to machine around this if you go the long route of milling it like you're tightening lug nuts.
For the record, I would go to a world tour even without tight music.
Trying to stay with Martin is like a roller coaster ride. Computer technology achieves most all off the requirmenrs except on stage presence of an instrument.
The truly retro nature is "pain and pleasure. So is the design journey from performance artist to mechanical engineer.
I rate Ivan Miranda cause of his very strong mech engineer skills.
The suspense for next episode is insane!!
these videos always make me grin! martin! you will succeed!
I liked the loose music. It made it more human than industrial.
I want to point out that you don't really even need a circular shape to slot the metal bar into, and a v-shaped groove will work just as well with room for an adhesive based solution for mounting the bar, making the wheels even easier to machine and repair.
in addition, this would put less lateral stress on the machining bit.
Have you considered the tried and true method of programming mechanical instruments... the paper piano roll? I think you're underestimating how much having to manually reprogram in each song is going to affect things - not just for concerts, but while you're developing the machine and practicing, the ability to swap out songs quickly could be night and day.
Be careful when press fitting those long, thin metal bars into the new wheel.
Press fitting relies on constant friction holding a part in place...say the cumulative force exerted on those metal rods is 100% * X, and this 100% is enough to hold that rod in place
When assembling the wheel you might find that instead of 100%, you only need to put that rod 50% in for it to become stuck.
You'd have to hammer it in (risking bending it) or lubricate it (risking the rods undoing themselves because they're no longer held by friction)
That's why in machines, whenever we need something press fitted, it's either a short part, or it's being clamped.
I wonder if milling the lines from the programming wheel from the inside diameter would solve some challenges ahead of the construction.
1. It would provide bending points for the curve in conjunction with the channel for the metal rods.
2. It would be held in place by the structure of the wheel frame (force opposing insertion of programming pins)
3. The material of the wheel would hold the rods in (opposing the force of removing the programming pins.)
Maybe you need to consider the size of the final wheel. The one from the previous machines seem to be really big compared to your prototype. As the design relies on machining to work properly, If the wheel gets too large it may be really difficult to find a machine that can mount it properly (or too expensive). Also consider that milling the slots will introduce an axial force that will load the spokes in bending if the wheel is clamped at the hubs. This type of loading doesn't happen during normal operation, so it might be overlooked during the design phase (ask me how I know :D). Keep the machining setup in mind and include some features that make mounting and indicating on the mill easier.
The metal rods are a good idea, but I'm not sure if you could press fit a rod the entire width of the wheel. Maybe ask a machinist about this.
You are laterally building the tourbillon of marble machines! Kudos!
The World Tourbillon
Martin, I feel like you've entirely lost sight of the reason the world fell in love with the Marble Machine. It wasn't because it was perfect, played tight music, and used the best engineering to play a song. Those are problems that have been solved for decades.
We loved it because there was a crazy, steampunk-esque guy cranking a giant contraption made out of plywood that played one of the catchiest, most beautiful songs ever created. The entire project was an artistic masterpiece, and the world saw what you had created and held it in the highest regard.
While I understand your desire for what you see as perfection, please try to remember, at least sometimes, that what made the original so beloved was the fact that it was EXACTLY the opposite of what you're striving for now. I only hope that when this current journey comes to an end, however that may be, we are lucky enough that you'll consider giving the world more of the wonderous art you were capable of so long ago.
I don't think he has any intention of ever finishing another marble machine. I think he wants to pretend it's his goal, and make CZcams videos (ad revenue) from it.
You really havent been through much of the mmx mmy journey have you?
He is not building it because he wants perfection, he is building it like this because he wants a reliable instrument to use on a world tour. The og mm was a dumpsterfire and could barely play 2 musics without falling apart
While you do have a great point, I’m honestly loving the experimentation phase right now
@@billstrozberg3932 And MMX was also a complete failure, with the exact same approach and standards he's applying to this new one. You must be new here.
@@thomasbecker9676 wow you must really not understand how engineering works if you think the new approach has anything to to with the old one... maybe try to rewatch the entirety of the mmx build to understand what you missed, since you either didnt watch it at all, or you couldnt understand the first time you did
A lot of small wheels IS THE WAY. You could use gear reduction on , for example, the Bass wheel, and hot swap them while other instruments are playing