Joe Simpson, master climber explains how with a broken leg, no water or food and stuck in a crevasse with little hope, his atheistic values gave him purpose and drive to save his own life.
I can't imagine making the decision to go deeper down the crevasse. It could have became narrower pinning him there in the dark, unable to move and just waiting to die. Thinking on it puts my stomach in knots.
Just hear me out imagine if death didn’t exist and you just sit there for time to come. There are a colossal amount of reasons for death so don’t forget about it.
@@DrewJPS I think you make it sound too simple and easy of a choice to make. People have burned inside houses because they were too scared to jump onto the blow up thingy. To stay put on the ledge is a non instant death, so staying there +1 +2 +3 hours is not even necessary a consious choice one makes, since there is no urgency and no point of no return. Besides, we dislike the unknown, and for a reason. I honestly believe there are many people who would've waited until they're too weak or not gone down that crevice at all. Also because seeing the sunlight from that ledge might give some a feeling of false hope.
Richard Adams in "Plague Dogs" relates a cruel experiment done on dogs in a drowning tank. The tank was deep enough that the dog couldn't touch bottom and the sides were sheer and unclimbable. The dog would swim and swim until it couldn't any longer. At the point of drowning the dog was recovered and resuscitated. They found that domestic dogs would keep on going much longer than feral dogs. The inference drawn was that domestic dogs expected external intervention. The ferals didn't.
So you think, what like the fact that he had hope of the possibility of rescue if he could only get located by Simon/get close enough to camp etc led him to "keep fighting" longer than he would have had be believed himself like totally alone on the mountain with no way of rescue ? Or is what you think relates ?
Seems many think that being religious makes you stronger. What if it is the other way around? Knowing the only person that can save you is you. Instead of asking for help, realizing you are your own help and it's your choice about life or death.
Dude, I’m all for your atheist values but you really are trolling without actually reading people’s comments. This person is saying that he found strength within himself and didn’t need a god. Exactly what you’re trying to argue - he’s making the same point you are, but you’ve just been rude. Not a good case for atheism, we get enough rubbish from religious people about being bad, we should be promoting love and peace as atheists to prove them wrong!
Joanna Wolf GOOD GOD. Can't one even make a friendly rebuttal to an old religious myth without being criticized?? WTF! It's wimps like you are the problem, stand up for what you believe or let others do so on your behalf.
how did this guy crawl 4 days like really in that weather broken leg, i believe the human will is strong but god can only help you in this case and this guy doesn't seem to believe so, u do the math.
The few times my life has been in mortal jeopardy, the last thing on my mind was any kind of religious response. I can personally attest to the fact that an atheist doesn't cease to be an atheist because of mortal peril.
I think that this movie exemplifies an atheistic response to crisis. As for myself, my rational view of the world and humanity's place in it was born during a difficult time in my life; it really kicks the theory in the pants that atheism is for people without problems. This is truly an exellent video!
I see a lot of religious people asking what purpose would a guy have without god? What they don't understand is that if there is no heaven and there is no afterlife then you better be damn sure you wanna live and enjoy life right now and do the best you can with the time you have, fight for survival. He cant stop and give up to the idea that its ok to die and just wake up on the other side. I kinda wish i could believe in the supernatural, but yeh.. no evidence around..
While that was mostly incoherent gibberish, the one lucid connection of words in that was "What is on an atheist's mind during mortal peril?" From personal experience, I can tell you panic, first, then practically considering your options in order to get out of the situation. Prayer doesn't do a damned thing, except waste time.
I am a Christian and I wouldn't sit there and pray for God to have an ... idk eagle pick me up. I'd pray for God to give me strength to climb out. I'd pray for him to keep me motivated. Hell I still want to live!
I think "you atheists" have a misconception of what "God" really means.
The climber gives a good example at 3:35 "...I always wondered if things really hit the fan whether under pressure if i would say a few hail mary's to get me out of here..." Apparently your conception of an "almighty being" is something that bails you out whenever you get into trouble, if that is the case, i can plainly see why your philosophy leads you to atheism. Dont stop questionin things, pursue the truth.
loved the movie. disturbed me a bit back then this part since i was an agnostic with a strong believe in a personal god. things have changed in the meantime.
There is beauty in science. People that don't see that usually do not have an understanding of science. I also feel that it is a lot more easier (and convenient) to believe in what your parents told you to believe than questioning things. That doesn't mean that you do not believe in anything. You are just using your own head instead of following a doctrine.
His spirit was guiding him through the ordeal. I remember from another part of the documentary, there was an inner voice telling him which way to go, where to put his feet. Atheists have that connection too, fortunately. 🙂
"I was brought up as a devout Catholic. I'd long since stopped believing in God. I always wondered if things really hit the fan, whether I would under pressure turn round and say a few 'Hail Marys' and 'get me out of here'......It never once occurred to me. It meant that I really don't believe, and I really do think that when you die you die, that's it. There's no afterlife. There's nothing" -- Joe Simpson.
The belief of god should not deter somebody from the preservation of their lives. God gave us life to be meaningful. We should treat it as sacred and also we should respect that gift and seek to defend it.
god or no god i love my life...nice story by the end of the day...know im gonna be climbin peaks soon..helps to know tht some one survived this...peace out..
Thanks so much for clipping this. I saw this film probably not long after it came out and continue to think of it years later. The sheer belief of Joe believing in himself and his own survival is quite clearly just as powerful as that in an external omnipotent being. It's possibly one of the most powerful examples of a "miracle" happening WITHOUT any belief in God.
Huh? I've literally never heard even a single survival story of similarly powerful nature where their survival is in any way attributed to a miracle of God, none, though I don't doubt such does probably exist, but any actual "survival " stories (i.e where THEY survived, not where survival "happened TO" them) tend to attribute survival to nothing other than strength of will& resilience &determination to live often &remotivated by thoughts of loved ones/family etc...paired with an occasional stroke or two of random luck, & obviously whatever actions& assistance from others that will necessarily exist for any survival story of this nature... so I'm not sure what you mean exactly? Unless you're trying to say that basically "this was essentially a miracle that he survived this" but you think a miracle is something that only happens in a context of God/religion, so it basically "might as well" be a miracle, it's "the closest thing" to an actual miracle outside if God, or something? Honestly I keep reading &can't figure of what you mean by the miracle thing. But if it's the latter, you may want to consider that the definition of a miracle doesn't by default necessarily involve God, it's simply a "welcomed but improbable or extraordinary event" , it could be "a welcomed event not explicable by natural or scientific laws & therefore is regarded the work of a divine agency" but it doesn't need to,, in otherwords a miracle is just an event that's extremely unlikely/improbable /seemingly impossible that may or may not invoke God If the former, you should search for "I shouldn't be alive" on CZcams for some ssar survival
It was a stunning documentary. I was glued to the screen the entire time. What I struggled with was his (Joe's) lack of faith after seeing the wonder of God's creation and the urging he had to keep pushing forwstd, even to the extent of lowering himself into what could have been a bottomless depth! How could anyone not believe on a Higher Power by the time his struggle had ended? What a miracle to be reunited with his friends! And, to survive! I pray someday he realizes that God has such great love for him that each of the hairs on his head are numbered! Anyway, I loved it!
Carol Worth maybe he just believed in himself... And wanted to continue living his life. He doesn't rely on falsehoods and myths and weakness, he done everything by himself, nobody helped him which is obvious.
in fact a belief in a "god" might have preventing him from going on. Instead of believing in a fery land after life and thinking everything would be ok, he faced facts and persevered.
It wasn't religion or god that got him out of there. But sheer determination AND skill. . He took a real risk going further down the crevasse, but in the end it paid off.
I love this movie, but I don't think Joe Simpson's drive had anything at all to do with atheism. And if it did, that's fine, but I don't think that it's what we should focus on. The fact that he had the drive is what is impressive. I don't care if he got it from buddhism or christianity or aetheism. What's important important is that he found purpose and meaning from somewhere
I haven't preached to anyone. I have stated the logical facts, and you're right, people ARE responsible for their own actions, and you will learn this first hand, that I'm willing to place money down on in Vegas.
Whole lot of tipping going on in *this* comments section I see. You're all enlightened by your own intelligence are you? Does it make you feel euphoric?
I was going to reply that "Allabouthejourney" is anecdote, not evidence. But I'd forgotten that for the religious, anecdotes are evidence. smh...smh...
Hmm, if he was religious, obviously other religious people would say this 'miraculous' escape is proof of God's love or mercy, or something. How then do they account for this escape if Joe's an atheist? Of course, we atheists know how to account for it all: Shit happens, but sometimes we get lucky.
This movie is highly recomended. But I disagree with the theory that was his atheism that makes him keep moving. I'm pretty sure that no matter if he was atheist or if was the Pope of Rome, when you are in the mountain you only depend of yourself to put your ass safe. Its a brillant exemple of the spirit of superation that push men to climb a mountain.
if people are going to impose laws regarding such beliefs, or try to have them taught to others in public forums such as schools, then they've crossed a line from being non-harmful individuals belief to being a threat. When those comforting beliefs are used to change public opinion of issues such as homosexuality, international religions, or even scientific understanding it is a threat to rational people. Belief is fine, so long as it's understood we live in the real world.
One thing I've always wondered is, if there's an eternal afterlife of endless bliss, as long as you are a decent person while on planet earth, why does this tiny amount of years really matter at all?
Its not as long as you are a decent person. Our works dont save us, it is the belief that Jesus Christ died for our sins is what saves us and anybody who accepts it.
@@aboutface102 yes but it needs to be a real confession. A belief not only by mouth but also in the heart. So yes as long as you do that then God will save you
@@boostiana4813 Lol, this is why all religions suck. I hate them all and they won’t die out soon enough. And they are dying, I hope you are aware of that.
I've often thought the reason people lived so long in the old testement is because the earth was sparsly populated. If they were in trouble with a disease or survivig a medical problem they had to rely on what the body was telling them to do. Not waiting for help that wasn't coming. They probably prayed to god too as an insurence policy. But knew it was up to themselves.
Well some religious people pray for supernatural intervention such as a god getting them out of dire circumstances, but what Atheism means that you don't think help is coming from gods. What Joe is saying is that he wasn't going to wait for the christian god to save him but that he was going to save himself.
This is a 13 year old comment so I’m not sure why i am responding, but do you really think that a Christian in this situation would think that God is going to send an eagle to come and swoop down and save them? Of course not. A Cristian would pray for the will and strength to keep moving forward. You can read about people in the exact same situation with the survivors of the Uruguayan flight 571 where they did rely on God’s strength..
havnt any of you thought that perhaps joe's ability to escape death was maybe an act of god in itself. joe rejecting to turn to religion is perhaps what triggered god to intervene by giving him the determination and commitment to get back to the campsite.
DEAR SIMON: I speak for myself when I say that my own life experience proves otherwise. In 1990 I was to come across a rare mss. which describes MY past life in the 16th century as a Polynesian warrior living on the west coast of Mexico in what is now known as Puerto Vallarta. Past-life regression therapy later confirmed this for me. We are flesh in the moment, yes! BUT we are spirit eternally. What's in your wallet?
"Mss."? What is an mss. ?? I'm pretty certain this is exactly the kind of the thing that is the reason why regular therapists have to be extremely careful or not even at all try to recover repressed memories of some potential or suspected trauma because end up creating false memories, so many people were in jail for these "memories" that were entirely induced, the suggestigibilty of the mind is alot
@bodrie4 yes 100% they know how long it takes a carbon atom to breakdown so by looking at the amount the atom has broken down gives a nearly exact date........but moreso soil layer samples can be dated very accurately.when the layer is dense they know it is forest period and when there is sand they know it was flooded under water,so yes its based on FACT,i dont know who or what created the world but i know that man never walked with dinosaurs.
ID (intelligent design)is clearly present. Just because you don't see the beauty of the design, doesn't negate that beauty. Who or what "God" is, is the open question. That's it. Nothing is happenstance in its existence. The belief that what you see came without direction from anything goes against Occam's razor. Black is Black. You can call it whatever, it is still black. The only thing that changes is your perception of that said reality. It is easier to believe in nothing, then something.
He didn't mention anything like this in the book. I wonder if he was encouraged to add this in the movie. Because he didn't believe in God, he didn't pray when facing a dangerous unknown. He says that meant he really doesn't believe in God or an afterlife. Maybe it simply means he didn't expect praying would help. It's a gripping story, but I think he's very foolish, both of them, for trying to climb that mountain. 1000% for tenacity and endurance, 0% for wisdom.
Atheists dont 'always' equate the rejection of established religion with that of the rejection of any possibility of god. I suppose it helps to strawman your opponents position to make a point.
That was incredible. This shpws you that humans don't need a god to do amazing things. I might be tempted to say, that a theist in that situation would have started praying, waiting for paradise. Just bloody incredible this story.
@bodrie4 carbon dating! also the soil that dinosaurs are buried in can be dated certain layers are known to be formed pre/post ice age........so yeah humans DEFINATELY havent EVER lived side by side with dinosaurs/dragons.
Because if you believe in supernatural things like god or gods it might mean that you think these supernatural beings will intervene, suspend the laws of nature, and save you. Atheism means you are alone and you have to rely on yourself, that there's no reason to believe there is an afterlife, so it can motivate you.
@snowyywwinters let me get my point across as effectively as my uneducated self can. In the bible, in the old testament there are multiple instances of dragons being used & you hear dragons in cultures through time so whos to say they havent lived w/ humans? Dinosaurs were discovered in the 1800sNow scientists say they date all these dinosaurs Millions of years ago. Oh yeah? by using what How can you date these bones out of the ground that far back What do you use that you know is that old?
What exactly about atheism, though. No belief in god, but that is about it. I'm sure there is a lot in common between us humans. I think a healthy respect for nature was why he was so happy at the bright sunny day, regardless of who or what created it. Religion or atheism was irrelevant. It was all about taking the opportunity out that happened to have created and having the courage to do so.
No where in the video does Joe Simpson say his atheism got him out of the situation. In fact @ 7:42 he says "Jesus this is big"... LOL Quite ironic in my book Joe!
His survival values rather than 'atheistic' ones. Knowing he had only himself to rely on and no imaginary sky god dealt him the courage to keep going knowing that he might not make it. But that didn't stop him and he didn't call on some superstition to help him. He did it all himself - of course. Good man and well done. :)
I think people are giving this part of the film too much credit to atheism. All he said in the film was that he wasn't going to pray to God in the moment of facing death because he didn't believe in Him...either way, whether he believed or not, he was going to try and get out. No one said that if you believe in a God you'll wait down there and do nothing like a dumbass for God to literally reach his "hand" out to save you...you try and get out! His will to live saved him, not his atheism.
He's talking about something very personal most people get fidgety or move around when talking about things like that. Remembering past events that almost killed you tend to make you unsettled whatever country you are from.
Can you believe Joe? It never occurred once? You would think he would say to himself constantly that "Those stupid simpleminded God fearing people would be praying and saying Hail Mary's, to make himself feel superior while singing the Boney M tune
We're not "caught up" for nothing - I saw the whole movie too, and this was THE climactic struggle. This is the part everyone remembers. He deals with the idea of choosing whether to wait and pray, or to rely on his own human strength to make progress. A metaphor for the history of human advancement. If this movie should have any meaning deeper than a mere mountain climb, it's the secular humanist message that is central to the whole movie.
wait and pray? people who pray need to do things on their own as well. keep advancing bud, even though you have an unreadable youtube name with no picture, what progress.
@robswift008 But do they know 100 percent garantee no buts ands or doubts about it that carbon dating is accurate? Based of of what? You see what I BELIEVE is on a Faith..and it fits logically...but everyone seems to be trying to find out exactly what happened and there are literally thousands of explanations scientists have came up with..so how can you say that scientific reasoning/testing etc is is definite? Anyways thats what I believe and I cant really impress my belief on you.
The movie was interesting, good makeup and graphics, I enjoyed it. When Joe was hopelessly dangling in the crevasse with a broken leg, instead of praying he went into a cussing rant. He did mention he was raised a Catholic but knew he didn't believe in God, so he didn't pray, and relied on himself. At the end of his painful decent, he was lucky to find himself within shouting distance of his two friends who rescued him. I must admit it did bother me- that Joe survived such a seemingly hopeless ordeal without even a prayer in desperation, aren't all atheists theists when facing imminent death? How could this atheist get a reprieve? Could it be that Joe, an admittedly selfish bastard, with a self professed distaste for children was given another chance at life to make amends with the Almighty before eternity actually sets in?,
dont get me wrong.. i like relegious people ..almost all my friends are relegious....infact im an indian so almost every one here is freakin relegious...BUT PLEASE DONT FORCE UR BELEIFS ON TO OTHERS...if someones an atheist let him be...
Don't be ridiculous. I am an atheist, but it is impossible to be motivated by atheism to do anything (even to campaign against religion, which is motivated by an hatred of religion, rather than by atheism). Given that so many religious people claim as credit to their religion what is in fact credit to the individuals concerned (Martin Luther King, Michelangelo, Bach etc.), I feel obliged to apply the same response to those who hold my views.
So if I KNOW or BELIEVE that God exists, that makes me a coward? I found myself in a somewhat similar position (probably a hundred times easier than his) and the thing that bothered me most was that I felt I was so endlessly stupid for getting myself in that situation so I just plain and simple excluded any call for help (I had my cell phone). I smoked a cigarette, pondered on the chances getting lower the more I waited, so I got going and finally could save myself. I believed in God back then and I do now, actually with the certainty that Jesus is no legend but the real thing. I gave myself however a very low chance of success so perhaps God did help me out. But right then I didn't even think of asking Him for help, I was so ashamed of putting myself in such a bad place that I was ready to get the outcome I had certainly deserved.
I really don't anderstand how Simon left his fellow down and moved forward to save his own ass and he doesn't even checked if Joe was been died or not ? what a kind of friendship was that ? I supose that Joe should think 1000 times before he calling Simon as a friend ......
I'm not sure you fully understand the severity of the situation. In an extreme situation most people just simply go to survival mode. Or actually the brain does. You can forget about beliefs at that point.
Snow Rik When I try to save my friend ,I'm in survival mode also .Its a matter of principles . I will try my best to do something in that situation not only for Simon , but for myself . I can't even believe that I will live with that if I was Simon , I will loss my selv respect in every time I see or remember Joe . Joe said in one of his interviews that what Simon did actually saved his life.It was adiplomatic explanation of the situation. I think Joe survived not because Simon cuts the rope , but Joe have no any other options . He found himself facing the death ALONE and he must fight to survive ً
simon saw that his friend (who had already severely broken his leg mind you) had fallen over 100 ft into what appeared to be a bottomless crevasse... i don't blame him for assuming he was dead. joe himself said he was surprised he survived the fall, and that he was only a few feet away from continuing to fall even further
We can't even begin to know what it's like in that situation. I wouldn't be so quick to judge. Since this happened Joe has defended Simon from criticism constantly. :)
I understand your point, and your logic is sold. But from my perspective it's still absurd. Example: think of the first time you kissed a girl (or guy). Now what if I said that your experience was nothing but a ridiculous idea and didn't happen. You'd just laugh. The thing is that most ppl's relationship with God is based on belief and ideas, which isn't too far off from fantasy. There are many tho for whom things are different. And yes, I cannot know God as I know math or as I know my wife.
No, I think God doesn't exist. Saying that I think He 'bails you out' is not only a lie but also sily: how can something that doesn't exist bail you out of anything? I'm saying that the religious often use 'miraculous' escapes like this as proof of God and his mercy. And should some kind of God-like supreme being actually exist, then I think it's most likely that he wouldn't bother to rescue anyone, religious or not.
I'm not atheist, but I also don't buy into religious qualificactions of God; as a "somoeone" or "something" that saves or condemns, punishes or rewards, who has mercy and who judges. I think that conception of God is rotten. It's a gross misconception. It's not about faith or belief. It's about gnosis.
I'm not even going to try to understand why you believe in anything that you haven't seen proof of, but this I do want to know: Why do you look hold such disdain for people who want to see some proof before they devote their lives to something?
That is perhaps the most illogical thing I've EVER heard. If you see something in front of your eyes, empirically, you must conclude it exists. A star is no different. I can tell you know nothing about science.
This still brings a tear to my eye. It's amazing what stubborn determination can do.
I can't imagine making the decision to go deeper down the crevasse. It could have became narrower pinning him there in the dark, unable to move and just waiting to die. Thinking on it puts my stomach in knots.
You'd have no choice. You'd do it. You just don't know that you're capable of it.
Just hear me out imagine if death didn’t exist and you just sit there for time to come. There are a colossal amount of reasons for death so don’t forget about it.
@@DrewJPS I think you make it sound too simple and easy of a choice to make. People have burned inside houses because they were too scared to jump onto the blow up thingy. To stay put on the ledge is a non instant death, so staying there +1 +2 +3 hours is not even necessary a consious choice one makes, since there is no urgency and no point of no return. Besides, we dislike the unknown, and for a reason. I honestly believe there are many people who would've waited until they're too weak or not gone down that crevice at all. Also because seeing the sunlight from that ledge might give some a feeling of false hope.
Richard Adams in "Plague Dogs" relates a cruel experiment done on dogs in a drowning tank. The tank was deep enough that the dog couldn't touch bottom and the sides were sheer and unclimbable. The dog would swim and swim until it couldn't any longer. At the point of drowning the dog was recovered and resuscitated. They found that domestic dogs would keep on going much longer than feral dogs. The inference drawn was that domestic dogs expected external intervention. The ferals didn't.
So you think, what like the fact that he had hope of the possibility of rescue if he could only get located by Simon/get close enough to camp etc led him to "keep fighting" longer than he would have had be believed himself like totally alone on the mountain with no way of rescue ? Or is what you think relates ?
This taps into some serious primal instincts
Seems many think that being religious makes you stronger. What if it is the other way around? Knowing the only person that can save you is you. Instead of asking for help, realizing you are your own help and it's your choice about life or death.
Dude, I’m all for your atheist values but you really are trolling without actually reading people’s comments. This person is saying that he found strength within himself and didn’t need a god. Exactly what you’re trying to argue - he’s making the same point you are, but you’ve just been rude. Not a good case for atheism, we get enough rubbish from religious people about being bad, we should be promoting love and peace as atheists to prove them wrong!
Joanna Wolf
GOOD GOD. Can't one even make a friendly rebuttal to an old religious myth without being criticized?? WTF! It's wimps like you are the problem, stand up for what you believe or let others do so on your behalf.
how did this guy crawl 4 days like really in that weather broken leg, i believe the human will is strong but god can only help you in this case and this guy doesn't seem to believe so, u do the math.
The few times my life has been in mortal jeopardy, the last thing on my mind was any kind of religious response. I can personally attest to the fact that an atheist doesn't cease to be an atheist because of mortal peril.
Your speaking for yourself… after all these years
And if you're wrong, I'm sure you'll be the first to admit that you don't deserve Heaven or peace.
I think that this movie exemplifies an atheistic response to crisis.
As for myself, my rational view of the world and humanity's place in it was born during a difficult time in my life; it really kicks the theory in the pants that atheism is for people without problems.
This is truly an exellent video!
I see a lot of religious people asking what purpose would a guy have without god? What they don't understand is that if there is no heaven and there is no afterlife then you better be damn sure you wanna live and enjoy life right now and do the best you can with the time you have, fight for survival. He cant stop and give up to the idea that its ok to die and just wake up on the other side. I kinda wish i could believe in the supernatural, but yeh.. no evidence around..
Xirus5 Read about Quantum Mechanics, the universe is full of evidence.
If you research it there actually is a lot of evidence
Does anyone know the instrumental song which occurs when he start talking about his religious beliefs
While that was mostly incoherent gibberish, the one lucid connection of words in that was "What is on an atheist's mind during mortal peril?" From personal experience, I can tell you panic, first, then practically considering your options in order to get out of the situation. Prayer doesn't do a damned thing, except waste time.
Such valiance!
Powerful movie
I am a Christian and I wouldn't sit there and pray for God to have an ... idk eagle pick me up. I'd pray for God to give me strength to climb out. I'd pray for him to keep me motivated. Hell I still want to live!
I think "you atheists" have a misconception of what "God" really means.
The climber gives a good example at 3:35 "...I always wondered if things really hit the fan whether under pressure if i would say a few hail mary's to get me out of here..."
Apparently your conception of an "almighty being" is something that bails you out whenever you get into trouble, if that is the case, i can plainly see why your philosophy leads you to atheism.
Dont stop questionin things, pursue the truth.
Pathetic
very great movie. i wanna see this again
Awesome and powerful story. Although i hope i dont have to go through that myself.
Does anyone know the name of the track that starts at 0:50?
loved the movie. disturbed me a bit back then this part since i was an agnostic with a strong believe in a personal god. things have changed in the meantime.
There is beauty in science. People that don't see that usually do not have an understanding of science. I also feel that it is a lot more easier (and convenient) to believe in what your parents told you to believe than questioning things. That doesn't mean that you do not believe in anything. You are just using your own head instead of following a doctrine.
Philos2006, I couldn't have stated it any better, lol. You're right, this is an excellent example of what is behind the myth of "miracles".
His spirit was guiding him through the ordeal. I remember from another part of the documentary, there was an inner voice telling him which way to go, where to put his feet. Atheists have that connection too, fortunately. 🙂
"I was brought up as a devout Catholic. I'd long since stopped believing in God. I always wondered if things really hit the fan, whether I would under pressure turn round and say a few 'Hail Marys' and 'get me out of here'......It never once occurred to me. It meant that I really don't believe, and I really do think that when you die you die, that's it. There's no afterlife. There's nothing" -- Joe Simpson.
anyone who has any sense of purpose in life should see this movie. It's truely amazing!!! Joe should be
a cult figure.
incredible story
Oh speaking of which,
If anyone is looking for good reading on Catholicism and Atheism I highly suggest
"No One Sees God" by Michael Novak
superb!
This is true. He could have fallen into a crevasse with no escape route.
The belief of god should not deter somebody from the preservation of their lives. God gave us life to be meaningful. We should treat it as sacred and also we should respect that gift and seek to defend it.
If he had prayed then either.
A he would have waited and died
B he would have got out and it would be a claimed that there is a god.
god or no god i love my life...nice story by the end of the day...know im gonna be climbin peaks soon..helps to know tht some one survived this...peace out..
u will the shut up tonight bastard
@@arjanpatel4895 😹😹😹😹
i'll keep that in mind when i go to the arctic :)
And they say there are no atheists in foxholes.
Thanks so much for clipping this. I saw this film probably not long after it came out and continue to think of it years later. The sheer belief of Joe believing in himself and his own survival is quite clearly just as powerful as that in an external omnipotent being. It's possibly one of the most powerful examples of a "miracle" happening WITHOUT any belief in God.
Huh? I've literally never heard even a single survival story of similarly powerful nature where their survival is in any way attributed to a miracle of God, none, though I don't doubt such does probably exist, but any actual "survival " stories (i.e where THEY survived, not where survival "happened TO" them) tend to attribute survival to nothing other than strength of will& resilience &determination to live often &remotivated by thoughts of loved ones/family etc...paired with an occasional stroke or two of random luck, & obviously whatever actions& assistance from others that will necessarily exist for any survival story of this nature...
so I'm not sure what you mean exactly?
Unless you're trying to say that basically "this was essentially a miracle that he survived this" but you think a miracle is something that only happens in a context of God/religion, so it basically "might as well" be a miracle, it's "the closest thing" to an actual miracle outside if God, or something?
Honestly I keep reading &can't figure of what you mean by the miracle thing. But if it's the latter, you may want to consider that the definition of a miracle doesn't by default necessarily involve God, it's simply a "welcomed but improbable or extraordinary event" , it could be "a welcomed event not explicable by natural or scientific laws & therefore is regarded the work of a divine agency" but it doesn't need to,, in otherwords a miracle is just an event that's extremely unlikely/improbable /seemingly impossible that may or may not invoke God
If the former, you should search for "I shouldn't be alive" on CZcams for some ssar survival
Maybe the miracle was given by God. I guess we'll all find out when we die (after it's too late).
Why would that have stopped Joe going over the edge? (serious question)
PS: Forgive the typos. 😕
It was a stunning documentary. I was glued to the screen the entire time. What I struggled with was his (Joe's) lack of faith after seeing the wonder of God's creation and the urging he had to keep pushing forwstd, even to the extent of lowering himself into what could have been a bottomless depth! How could anyone not believe on a Higher Power by the time his struggle had ended? What a miracle to be reunited with his friends! And, to survive! I pray someday he realizes that God has such great love for him that each of the hairs on his head are numbered! Anyway, I loved it!
Carol Worth maybe he just believed in himself... And wanted to continue living his life. He doesn't rely on falsehoods and myths and weakness, he done everything by himself, nobody helped him which is obvious.
Pathetic religious nonsense there is no god you old fool
in fact a belief in a "god" might have preventing him from going on. Instead of believing in a fery land after life and thinking everything would be ok, he faced facts and persevered.
Faith in God has lead an impossible amount of people out of hellish situations such as this
@@blacknclvr7019 irrelevant
It wasn't religion or god that got him out of there. But sheer determination AND skill. . He took a real risk going further down the crevasse, but in the end it paid off.
I love this movie, but I don't think Joe Simpson's drive had anything at all to do with atheism. And if it did, that's fine, but I don't think that it's what we should focus on. The fact that he had the drive is what is impressive. I don't care if he got it from buddhism or christianity or aetheism. What's important important is that he found purpose and meaning from somewhere
Fear of death is a strong motivator!
Can you watch This film online for free????
you skipped the climb to the light. bummer.
I haven't preached to anyone. I have stated the logical facts, and you're right, people ARE responsible for their own actions, and you will learn this first hand, that I'm willing to place money down on in Vegas.
Whole lot of tipping going on in *this* comments section I see.
You're all enlightened by your own intelligence are you?
Does it make you feel euphoric?
i seen this on TV, it's a great movie. this clip is a slap to the face of anyone who believes god helps believers in near-death experiences.
I was going to reply that "Allabouthejourney" is anecdote, not evidence. But I'd forgotten that for the religious, anecdotes are evidence.
smh...smh...
Hmm, if he was religious, obviously other religious people would say this 'miraculous' escape is proof of God's love or mercy, or something. How then do they account for this escape if Joe's an atheist?
Of course, we atheists know how to account for it all:
Shit happens, but sometimes we get lucky.
This movie is highly recomended.
But I disagree with the theory that was his atheism that makes him keep moving. I'm pretty sure that no matter if he was atheist or if was the Pope of Rome, when you are in the mountain you only depend of yourself to put your ass safe.
Its a brillant exemple of the spirit of superation that push men to climb a mountain.
It's so sad this guy has 55 subscribers in 2007 and the time I'm posting this start of Feb 2021 LOL
just buy it at amazon. Its only 10 bucks. :)
This is kind of like Bush praying for the victims of Katrina. He felt no sense of urgency because he thought Jesus was going to take care of it.
i completely agree with you, and i am an atheist.
I still hate trusting ice screws. Doesn't seem right. It's just ice.
if people are going to impose laws regarding such beliefs, or try to have them taught to others in public forums such as schools, then they've crossed a line from being non-harmful individuals belief to being a threat. When those comforting beliefs are used to change public opinion of issues such as homosexuality, international religions, or even scientific understanding it is a threat to rational people.
Belief is fine, so long as it's understood we live in the real world.
If the devil exists, does the fact that one doesn't believe he exists have any bearing on his existance?
One thing I've always wondered is, if there's an eternal afterlife of endless bliss, as long as you are a decent person while on planet earth, why does this tiny amount of years really matter at all?
Someone’s actions have a way deeper impact on the world than you think.
Its not as long as you are a decent person. Our works dont save us, it is the belief that Jesus Christ died for our sins is what saves us and anybody who accepts it.
@@boostiana4813 So I could spend my entire life murdering people. But as long as I accept Jesus died for my sins I am saved. Fantastic
@@aboutface102 yes but it needs to be a real confession. A belief not only by mouth but also in the heart. So yes as long as you do that then God will save you
@@boostiana4813 Lol, this is why all religions suck. I hate them all and they won’t die out soon enough. And they are dying, I hope you are aware of that.
I've often thought the reason people lived so long in the old testement is because the earth was sparsly populated. If they were in trouble with a disease or survivig a medical problem they had to rely on what the body was telling them to do. Not waiting for help that wasn't coming. They probably prayed to god too as an insurence policy. But knew it was up to themselves.
What have i found
Well some religious people pray for supernatural intervention such as a god getting them out of dire circumstances, but what Atheism means that you don't think help is coming from gods. What Joe is saying is that he wasn't going to wait for the christian god to save him but that he was going to save himself.
This is a 13 year old comment so I’m not sure why i am responding, but do you really think that a Christian in this situation would think that God is going to send an eagle to come and swoop down and save them? Of course not. A Cristian would pray for the will and strength to keep moving forward. You can read about people in the exact same situation with the survivors of the Uruguayan flight 571 where they did rely on God’s strength..
havnt any of you thought that perhaps joe's ability to escape death was maybe an act of god in itself. joe rejecting to turn to religion is perhaps what triggered god to intervene by giving him the determination and commitment to get back to the campsite.
DEAR SIMON: I speak for myself when I say that my own life experience proves otherwise. In 1990 I was to come across a rare mss. which describes MY past life in the 16th century as a Polynesian warrior living on the west coast of Mexico in what is now known as Puerto Vallarta. Past-life regression therapy later confirmed this for me. We are flesh in the moment, yes! BUT we are spirit eternally. What's in your wallet?
"Mss."? What is an mss. ??
I'm pretty certain this is exactly the kind of the thing that is the reason why regular therapists have to be extremely careful or not even at all try to recover repressed memories of some potential or suspected trauma because end up creating false memories, so many people were in jail for these "memories" that were entirely induced, the suggestigibilty of the mind is alot
@bodrie4 yes 100% they know how long it takes a carbon atom to breakdown so by looking at the amount the atom has broken down gives a nearly exact date........but moreso soil layer samples can be dated very accurately.when the layer is dense they know it is forest period and when there is sand they know it was flooded under water,so yes its based on FACT,i dont know who or what created the world but i know that man never walked with dinosaurs.
ID (intelligent design)is clearly present. Just because you don't see the beauty of the design, doesn't negate that beauty. Who or what "God" is, is the open question. That's it. Nothing is happenstance in its existence. The belief that what you see came without direction from anything goes against Occam's razor. Black is Black. You can call it whatever, it is still black. The only thing that changes is your perception of that said reality. It is easier to believe in nothing, then something.
He didn't mention anything like this in the book. I wonder if he was encouraged to add this in the movie. Because he didn't believe in God, he didn't pray when facing a dangerous unknown. He says that meant he really doesn't believe in God or an afterlife. Maybe it simply means he didn't expect praying would help. It's a gripping story, but I think he's very foolish, both of them, for trying to climb that mountain. 1000% for tenacity and endurance, 0% for wisdom.
You're too far gone, my friend.
An atheist is less likely to accept death than someone who thinks they're going to 'heaven'.
My dad met joe Simpson
hi can u send me a pictures of ur dad i wanna see what he looks like 😋
Totally not a biased story at all
Who’s here from swavesey village college
Simon is that you?
I just dont get how christians can devote their whole life to "God" when in the end when you do die it could all be for nothing
Atheists dont 'always' equate the rejection of established religion with that of the rejection of any possibility of god. I suppose it helps to strawman your opponents position to make a point.
That was incredible. This shpws you that humans don't need a god to do amazing things. I might be tempted to say, that a theist in that situation would have started praying, waiting for paradise.
Just bloody incredible this story.
@bodrie4 carbon dating! also the soil that dinosaurs are buried in can be dated certain layers are known to be formed pre/post ice age........so yeah humans DEFINATELY havent EVER lived side by side with dinosaurs/dragons.
Because if you believe in supernatural things like god or gods it might mean that you think these supernatural beings will intervene, suspend the laws of nature, and save you.
Atheism means you are alone and you have to rely on yourself, that there's no reason to believe there is an afterlife, so it can motivate you.
M’Climber *tips helmet*
I hope you're not referring to the ID that was dealt with in Dover. If you are, then you've got a hard case to prove.
@snowyywwinters let me get my point across as effectively as my uneducated self can. In the bible, in the old testament there are multiple instances of dragons being used & you hear dragons in cultures through time so whos to say they havent lived w/ humans? Dinosaurs were discovered in the 1800sNow scientists say they date all these dinosaurs Millions of years ago. Oh yeah? by using what How can you date these bones out of the ground that far back What do you use that you know is that old?
What exactly about atheism, though. No belief in god, but that is about it. I'm sure there is a lot in common between us humans.
I think a healthy respect for nature was why he was so happy at the bright sunny day, regardless of who or what created it. Religion or atheism was irrelevant. It was all about taking the opportunity out that happened to have created and having the courage to do so.
atheism simply means lack of belief in god(s), not nihilism. your conclusion is a non-sequitur.
No where in the video does Joe Simpson say his atheism got him out of the situation. In fact @ 7:42 he says "Jesus this is big"... LOL Quite ironic in my book Joe!
His survival values rather than 'atheistic' ones. Knowing he had only himself to rely on and no imaginary sky god dealt him the courage to keep going knowing that he might not make it.
But that didn't stop him and he didn't call on some superstition to help him. He did it all himself - of course. Good man and well done. :)
Veronica Denyer that’s what god wants it’s called free will
Wowww what true survival n wow
I think people are giving this part of the film too much credit to atheism. All he said in the film was that he wasn't going to pray to God in the moment of facing death because he didn't believe in Him...either way, whether he believed or not, he was going to try and get out. No one said that if you believe in a God you'll wait down there and do nothing like a dumbass for God to literally reach his "hand" out to save you...you try and get out! His will to live saved him, not his atheism.
How much do British people more when they speak, do they not understand staying still?
He's talking about something very personal most people get fidgety or move around when talking about things like that. Remembering past events that almost killed you tend to make you unsettled whatever country you are from.
Wow. Nice generalisation of an entire people based on one guy remembering a hugely traumatic experience. Twat.
You dont need god when you have true human spirit.
Can you believe Joe? It never occurred once?
You would think he would say to himself constantly that "Those stupid simpleminded God fearing people would be praying and saying Hail Mary's, to make himself feel superior while singing the Boney M tune
We're not "caught up" for nothing - I saw the whole movie too, and this was THE climactic struggle. This is the part everyone remembers. He deals with the idea of choosing whether to wait and pray, or to rely on his own human strength to make progress. A metaphor for the history of human advancement. If this movie should have any meaning deeper than a mere mountain climb, it's the secular humanist message that is central to the whole movie.
wait and pray? people who pray need to do things on their own as well. keep advancing bud, even though you have an unreadable youtube name with no picture, what progress.
@robswift008 But do they know 100 percent garantee no buts ands or doubts about it that carbon dating is accurate? Based of of what? You see what I BELIEVE is on a Faith..and it fits logically...but everyone seems to be trying to find out exactly what happened and there are literally thousands of explanations scientists have came up with..so how can you say that scientific reasoning/testing etc is is definite? Anyways thats what I believe and I cant really impress my belief on you.
when they say no water, what about all the snow around him...?
The movie was interesting, good makeup and graphics, I enjoyed it. When Joe was hopelessly dangling in the crevasse with a broken leg, instead of praying he went into a cussing rant. He did mention he was raised a Catholic but knew he didn't believe in God, so he didn't pray, and relied on himself. At the end of his painful decent, he was lucky to find himself within shouting distance of his two friends who rescued him.
I must admit it did bother me- that Joe survived such a seemingly hopeless ordeal without even a prayer in desperation, aren't all atheists theists when facing imminent death? How could this atheist get a reprieve?
Could it be that Joe, an admittedly selfish bastard, with a self professed distaste for children was given another chance at life to make amends with the Almighty before eternity actually sets in?,
Gem Guy I believe that's why I survived cancer--so I didn't die believing in a meaningless universe of chance.
dont get me wrong.. i like relegious people ..almost all my friends are relegious....infact im an indian so almost every one here is freakin relegious...BUT PLEASE DONT FORCE UR BELEIFS ON TO OTHERS...if someones an atheist let him be...
Don't be ridiculous. I am an atheist, but it is impossible to be motivated by atheism to do anything (even to campaign against religion, which is motivated by an hatred of religion, rather than by atheism). Given that so many religious people claim as credit to their religion what is in fact credit to the individuals concerned (Martin Luther King, Michelangelo, Bach etc.), I feel obliged to apply the same response to those who hold my views.
So if I KNOW or BELIEVE that God exists, that makes me a coward? I found myself in a somewhat similar position (probably a hundred times easier than his) and the thing that bothered me most was that I felt I was so endlessly stupid for getting myself in that situation so I just plain and simple excluded any call for help (I had my cell phone). I smoked a cigarette, pondered on the chances getting lower the more I waited, so I got going and finally could save myself. I believed in God back then and I do now, actually with the certainty that Jesus is no legend but the real thing. I gave myself however a very low chance of success so perhaps God did help me out. But right then I didn't even think of asking Him for help, I was so ashamed of putting myself in such a bad place that I was ready to get the outcome I had certainly deserved.
" when you die you will see!!!" - You crazy theists - still hiding behind Pascals wager I see.
I really don't anderstand how Simon left his fellow down and moved forward to save his own ass and he doesn't even checked if Joe was been died or not ? what a kind of friendship was that ? I supose that Joe should think 1000 times before he calling Simon as a friend ......
I'm not sure you fully understand the severity of the situation. In an extreme situation most people just simply go to survival mode. Or actually the brain does. You can forget about beliefs at that point.
Snow Rik When I try to save my friend ,I'm in survival mode also .Its a matter of principles . I will try my best to do something in that situation not only for Simon , but for myself . I can't even believe that I will live with that if I was Simon , I will loss my selv respect in every time I see or remember Joe . Joe said in one of his interviews that what Simon did actually saved his life.It was adiplomatic explanation of the situation. I think Joe survived not because Simon cuts the rope , but Joe have no any other options . He found himself facing the death ALONE and he must fight to survive
ً
simon saw that his friend (who had already severely broken his leg mind you) had fallen over 100 ft into what appeared to be a bottomless crevasse... i don't blame him for assuming he was dead. joe himself said he was surprised he survived the fall, and that he was only a few feet away from continuing to fall even further
Very very true.
We can't even begin to know what it's like in that situation. I wouldn't be so quick to judge. Since this happened Joe has defended Simon from criticism constantly. :)
@compsciguy And that makes them pathetic, poor human beings. And they should be ashamed, and seek to improve themselves.
Your first statement is actually proven wrong.
I have no idea why this movie has anything to do with being atheist...
I understand your point, and your logic is sold. But from my perspective it's still absurd. Example: think of the first time you kissed a girl (or guy). Now what if I said that your experience was nothing but a ridiculous idea and didn't happen. You'd just laugh. The thing is that most ppl's relationship with God is based on belief and ideas, which isn't too far off from fantasy. There are many tho for whom things are different. And yes, I cannot know God as I know math or as I know my wife.
No, I think God doesn't exist. Saying that I think He 'bails you out' is not only a lie but also sily: how can something that doesn't exist bail you out of anything? I'm saying that the religious often use 'miraculous' escapes like this as proof of God and his mercy. And should some kind of God-like supreme being actually exist, then I think it's most likely that he wouldn't bother to rescue anyone, religious or not.
I'm not atheist, but I also don't buy into religious qualificactions of God; as a "somoeone" or "something" that saves or condemns, punishes or rewards, who has mercy and who judges. I think that conception of God is rotten. It's a gross misconception. It's not about faith or belief. It's about gnosis.
I'm not even going to try to understand why you believe in anything that you haven't seen proof of, but this I do want to know: Why do you look hold such disdain for people who want to see some proof before they devote their lives to something?
That is perhaps the most illogical thing I've EVER heard. If you see something in front of your eyes, empirically, you must conclude it exists. A star is no different. I can tell you know nothing about science.