The Key Differences Between Autistic Burnout & Depression
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- čas přidán 17. 03. 2024
- Hi! I'm Orion Kelly and I'm Autistic. On this video I explore the topic of Autistic burnout and it's differences from clinical depression. Plus, I share my personal lived experiences as an #actuallyautistic person. #orionkelly #autism #asd #autismsigns #whatautismfeelslike
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I’m late diagnosed ADHD and I’ve come to realize that my reoccurring life long “depression” was most likely me going through cycles of burnout. I’m so glad I’m not alone. I felt so broken for so long.
Same here and still my therapists wanted to confince me that it's depression. But I felt that there is something different underlying. I had to beg for a screening for two years until finally someone truly listend to me. I "don't look" ADHD or autistic because i am high masking. So I guess I have to go through the same stuff with autistic screening.
Neuro Typicals don't (generally) understand, "I'm NOT depressed, I just don't want to BE around Anyone or to DO Anything". I've worked in RETAIL MANAGEMENT for too many years now (at 48, it's what I know and what I'm good at). I smile through the burnout, all shift long, 5 days a week... Trying to "adult" on my days/hours off is Too Much Effort!! When my two days off are split up, things get even worse. It's nearing the end of March, and I still have Christmas packages waiting to be mailed. No, I'm not depressed; I'm in a cycle of perpetual Autistic Burnout.
I to remember that with days off apart from each other. I miss the retail days but then again I don't.
Thank you for this. I get S.A.D. in winter. Medicine helped then.
The rest of the year, it doesn't. I have been dealing with burned out!
You explained this so well. It’s tricky because I do legitimately have depression, and the behaviors can look the same. But when my depression is managed, sometimes I still need to just bury myself under a blanket and avoid people and demands at all costs. It’s a coping skill rather than a symptom. The difference I think, is that in burnout, doing these things actually does make me feel better and recharge my mental battery. Also, I’m feeling very seen because I have a couple of friends who still haven’t received their Christmas gifts because I just have a lot of demands to manage right now and not a lot of energy. Oh well, they may get surprised with Christmas in July! 😂😂
@@myconfusedmerriment do you have any pain.symotoms
Well said. Congratulations for identifying, acknowledging, and communicating your limits🎉
In the build up to a burnout, I always get severely depressed and angry too... it's like the three need to reinforce each other to become strong... 😢
i feel the same way....
Same. I was diagnosed with clinical depression (and anxiety) verg young BUT I think it was brought on by Autistic Burnout and now they're so tied together it might as well be one Thing. Like, I wanna say this video was helpful but it really makes my brain feel more muddled. To be fair though, I haven't got a formal Autism diagnosis. Just ADHD. I, along with an insignificant number of people both trained and not, agree it's more than likely I have the AuDHD. Brains are weird.
Anger is both a protective emotion and an energizing emotion. It will get activated when you're running low on energy both to give you some fuel and to make you resistant to further demands.
I get less angry when depressed. But depression is dead inside. Therefore, when I get angry it's always burnout. Either way they are reasonable reactions to certain circumstances.
Thank you for the verbiage. That's exactly what I'm going through at the moment. It's a trifecta of....nm... I got to be nice. 🤣
I wish everyone in healthcare understood this. I wish I never again had to explain that I’m not depressed, that I don’t have anxiety, that I’m only burnt out, exhausted, and that giving me “pills and social training” only makes things worse.
I’m in and out of Autistic Burnout constantly. It’s so difficult to navigate when holding down a full time job and with all the responsibilities I have. Taking a step back ain’t an option for me so it’s never about beating it for me but surviving it. I thought I was being dramatic when I was feeling overwhelmed all the time but then I realised that there are millions of people worldwide in the same boat as me. Burnout seems to accelerate my anxiety too and my GP thinks that because I have anxiety and not depression on its own, antidepressants will not work for me. It’s so hard Orion mate. I just wished that health professionals were as passionate about helping us as you are. Burnout is an utter drain and we need videos like this highlighting the impact of it on our community.
I think everything people know about autism is still so basic right now... so I'm going to start off with saying that this is just a theory... But connecting an experience my mom had to your experience might be something to look into. My mom was diagnosed with depression many years ago. About 35 years ago.
*** Trigger warning - suicide ***
She was seriously suicidal. A doctor put her on an experimental medication that she figured wasn't working. She called the doctor and said she just wanted him to know it wasn't working and she was going to go kill herself. He said "NO!!! Come on, please! We gave you a placebo. YOU really need the actual medication!" So she went back and the actual drug DID help. But he told her that she'll need it continually for life. The drug never went to market, but he said he'd make sure she would continue to get it since it truly helped her. After a couple years she lost touch and never had that medication again. Now we know she's autistic and has had some burnouts since. But hardly anything compared to that incident. But if that was a result of clinical depression, she would always struggle with it and the lack of medication would have probably sent her over the edge years ago. I think it was just an extreme burnout she was going through. But the medication DID WORK. I wish I knew of other examples or a scientist who works in that field to give them something to start with. But I'm suspecting that depression medication likely could help some during burnout. Maybe share that with your doctor and just see what he says? Hope you find the support you need!!!
@@atlanticjem2012 Thank you for your comment. I’ve also gone through breakdowns a few times in my life. All before my confirmed diagnosis at 37 in August 2023. I’ve attempted taking my life on 3 occasions. First being when I was a child. The other twice as an adult. I have managed to gravitate away from the actually going through with anything side of things but I can still get intrusive thoughts. Especially when I have to face judgement, misunderstanding and lack of support for my Autism. I mask really highly to the point that many say that they wouldn’t have known I was Autistic. On the other side of that, people think I’m purposefully rubbish with my social skills. They think I’m this selfish individual who only cares about their special interests. I struggle to read people. I have serious anxiety out of fear of upsetting others. I barely have any proper close friends because I cannot maintain a friendship as people veer away from me when they realise we are completely different. I’m sorry to hear what your Mother went through. It must’ve also been very difficult for you aswell. I lost my Mother to secondary cancer back in 2022 and haven’t been able to grieve her loss as my brain just has no means of understanding how to process grief? My way to cope has been to keep busy in life and work through burnout. Being Autistic actually sucks. Not for the actual being Autistic part, but the lack of support post-diagnosis is heartbreaking. Especially for late diagnosed. It’s like they think because I’ve gone 37 years in life without being diagnosed, I’m somehow coping. My pursuit of a diagnosis was to obtain help for my problems. What I’ve got from it is an understanding of my problems but little solutions. Thank you for your advice.
Kind Regards
Derek - Scotsman on the Spectrum 😊
The thing about the anxiety is, if you're burnt out, but you need to carry on working, but you can see your work suffering because you're burnt out... and you're autistic so your spidey senses are tingling by default... that's going to make you anxious. I hope you get a break soon, good luck!
@@joeydendron Thank you so much. I just need to try to navigate it as best as I can. I have dug deep and since my diagnosis in August 2023, I have never lost a days work due to my Autism. Despite being flat out, I’ve never let it beat me. It’s really hard though. There’s days I feel like I’m so over it but I know that under that, there’s a strength to never give up.
Man, do i relate. I haven't even gotten round to getting formally diagnosed yet, too much to deal with, gotta keep going. I haven't missed work for burnout because that's not in the cards. Unfortunately, though, some things have caught up w me physically. I see your age and my heart catches in my throat, because 37 is when my body started just forcing shut down by way of illnesses. I've been lucky enough to have a union job I couldn't lose for being sick, but 6 years of watching days of pay drain away... And if you're like me, sounds like you are, there's nothing to fall back on. So even if I am home, writhing in pain and sweating through my sheets, it's up to me to take care of everything. I am so lucky my kid's grown and can make me a cuppa once in a while and takes care of himself... but I also think that's why my body stopped having the ability to keep being in survival mode daily. I'm having to reverse engineer and downsize and i just keep thinking, If I could talk to 37 year old me:
Make it your job, and I know it's too much but it can get worse, make it your job to create a more accomodating life for yourself before you hit the real breaking point. Pushing past burnout is one thing, you can't push past your body giving out. My mom died young of cancer, and i niw know it was the cumulative effects of her life of masked Autism that lost her that fight. We have a lower life expectancy, it's a fact of the stress - make it your job to think about tiny ways to slowly make life easier. unsolicited advice rant over 😅😅
Thank you for saying YEARS. I am newly diagnosed at 62 and at approximately 50 I hit a wall that I am just now able to understand. 100% burnout. I masked my entire life, made my way (however chaotic), and did my very best to raise my 4 children. I understood on a very intimate level that I was over sensitive and , seeing that trait in my children, I attempted to protect that in them. Now I’m exhausted; emotionally, physically, and it has felt endless. Realizing now that I am recovering from a life of masking, I have hope for a new beginning. Thank you!
I am 63 and I always new I was different all my life I am not diagnosed, it was only recently that someone asked me if I was autistic, that I actually thought maybe I am and looked on you tube to find out about autism and I recall do think I am, I did a test on line which said I was boarder line. I asked my doctor and he just said there is nothing you can do about it if you are and left me hanging so now I don’t know what to do. Xjx
I was also diagnosed at 62 with ASD and ADHD, trying to navigate this now. I’m looking back over my life and realise now why I was like I was.
Thinking of myself as that little girl in the playground, turning the skipping rope, but hardly ever skipping, always feeling on the outside of the group. Thank goodness I had a little group that accepted me for as I was. It felt like a lonely life. Even now I feel like I don’t really need any friends, although I make an efforts to find some. It’s exhausting, but I feel like I’m getting there. Thank you Orion for all that you do to help us.
I started to struggle more after 50 and was diagnosed AuDHD (plus GAD) just before I turned 62. I feel right at home on this thread.
PS to Roma: were you able to clear the rope the times you did skip? I don’t think I have/had dyspraxia, but Meg of I’m Autistic Now What? showed videos of her as a little girl, failing to ever time her jumps to clear the rope, and I remembered that was me too. (We were turning our own rope, I don’t know if that’s easier or harder.) I also could never ever keep a hula hoop up.
I was not a brilliant skipper, no!
I was also terrible at netball, anything to do with ball as I couldn’t catch them, and was always one of the last to be picked for the teams, which was really terrible !
Lor, You have just explained my life for the last 3 years. Im 58 and have been steadily loosing my ability to pretend (mask) or even be around others. Keeping a job is becoming harder and harder. I'm beyond exhausted. I have not been diagnosed but have taken quite a few online test and score quite high on the spectrum.
My experiences with depression and burnout - when depressed, nothing really gave me much pleasure but with burnout I still enjoyed things but didn't have enough energy to engage
Last week I received the double whammy diagnosis of autism & clinical depression.
Timely video, thank you.
Hang in there, and congratulations on your diagnosis. The only way is up and now you know you can be kinder to yourself and find sensory management protocols that work for you. Autism manifests differently in each of us but there are many commonalities to varying degrees. There's a good community building here with Orion's channel and other autistic creators. You're not alone - welcome.
Yes, me too. I was diagnosed with clinical depression before autism.
Same... about a month ago... I'm 45. ASD-1 & "Major Depressive Disorder" & (c)PTSD
Not only does that mean, "the struggle is REAL", but also... It's kind of nice to know that I was CORRECT about feeling like I was different. Sucks that NOBODY believed me...
When I think back to the time in my life that I am now sure was burnout, one thing sticks out to me as a key difference from depression: I WANTED to do almost all the things I normally enjoy, but I simply couldn't.
That's exactly how i feel now. There is SO much i could do if i wasn't chained down by my daily responsibilities that take forever to do, which leaves me no energy or time for my interests. Which makes me depressed because my interests are very important to me.
I just don't feel like doing the things that I used to enjoy. I have the time but don't want to.
Yes! For me I'll feel like I don't have the energy/will/focus to do things. It's especially frustrating because I know once I actually start it then I'll perk up and be able to keep going but dang if it doesn't seem to take ALOT to actually get started.
My autistic burnout feeds my depression. It usually starts when I overadapt/mask to fit in, at some point I start failing to get my energy back, so I cut on everything I can, more and more, until my life is reduced to my work, eating and sleeping (which is immensely depressing when you're forced to mask and deal with your shit manager's inability to deal with stress). At some point, it starts feeling like i'm getting derailed mentally. I lose my executive functions because i'm so desperately trying to match expectations not fitting me, in a world I fail to understand and get blamed for that.
My latest burnout stunt was pretty much me being the canary in the mine and taking the gas explosion for everybody else. Now, the team is still a mess, and the latest canary whistling has been shutdown just as harshly as the way I have been treated.
I'm quitting my company alltogether. They're clearly supporting this behaviour and not giving a shit. I have no reason to bother with them anymore.
Ive been through this. You deserve respect. I hope you find a good job in the meanwhile where dignity and respect are key values.
I'm going through this but I can't quit my job, I feel like I'm losing my mind. I feel like there is no way out, I'm a disabled adult and I'm fucked, forever stuck in a hellish loop.
@@AnaFernandez-bi2vq could you try to start looking for other jobs in your area? Or going online and checking other jobs too? I couldnt leave my current job yet but everytime i sent an application for others i felt some relief. Like i had some power back. Maybe youre feeling to stressed to do it...maybe not.
As someone diagnosed with both autism and depression, I think the key difference for me is my relationship to my interests and hobbies. When I'm in autistic burnout I'm still really drawn to my special interests and get a lot of joy from my hobbies. With a depressive episode there's this numbness (anhedonia) that affects everything and makes it hard to enjoy the things I usually like.
When i am in burnout, i have no physical or mental energy left to do any hobbies. That makes me depressed.
Maybe I am depressed then.
@@mette1245 I think for me, depression induces that “nothing feels good, nothing can help me” feeling that Orion was describing, whereas in pure burnout, I often want to do my hobbies but my brain/body is just not up to it and I need to rest more than I need to do something I enjoy. I do think the two can definitely overlap though, and it also really brings me down when I don’t have the energy for those activities.
On point here ❤
Amen we all have been through both and I agree with all of you and when I get to the point of depression or rage from frustration I call on God and remember that their is nothing He won't do to pull me through or to stop those around me who me be taking me there and then I rest up and grow from my experience.
You are so incredibly validating. Thank you for this. What I wouldn't give for you to be able to sit down with my therapist because you explain these feelings so much better than I can.
I feel the same. That’s why I often send his videos to close people. I want them to understand but my ability to explain is not that good.
My autistic burnout has been getting worse and worse. I work Monday to Friday as a teacher but I'm so exhausted by Friday evening, I pretty much spend the entire weekend in bed. But it's not depression. It's survival mode for me. Orion, I just want to thank you for all your videos because I never would have realised I was autistic if I hadn't of stumbled across your channel. You're amazing 🤩
The feeling of just surviving each day while dreading the next is so relatable! I hope you are able to get the support and rest you need. I wish you the best
@@ItsDrMcQuack Thank you so much. Yes, I experience dread nearly all of the time. It begins on a Saturday evening in anticipation of work on Monday morning. My nerves are shot.
That sounds so familiar - I'm an ex-teacher. I was bullied out of my last post & couldn't face another teaching job (I got a panic attack every time I opened an application form to fill in!!). I hope you're able to find some equilibrium for yourself.
I am a teacher too and allthough I like my job this school year is very hard for me. I am constantly sick and after the christmas holidays I had a total breakdown, cried for apparently no reason and had the feeling I just cant do this anymore. It is better now but the three - day - school trip with kids is coming up and allthough I did that before this one makes me feel anxious and fearfull ..
@@birgittnlilli9726 is there anyone you can talk to about how you're feeling? It's not healthy to keep pushing through anxiety & stress 💚
This is quite a revelation. For decades I thought I was finding ways to ward off depression, but looking back it was mostly finding ways to deal with burn out. I would describe it as a surfing a wave. At first the wave would crush me, then I could learn to ride it, then over time I could learn to see it coming and get mostly out of the way.
That's a cool analogy.
In my experience (as an adult who was never diagnosed and didnt come to the realization/recognition of my asd until age 47), that burnout would LEAD me to depression. If I would have know i was on the spectrum or understood myself better in general, maybe this would not have been the sequence... I would go through a burnout= not able to function around others, and with energy depleted and sometimes triggering a binge eating reaction too- which i see now as almost a type of stimming. These behaviors of mine would lead me to harsh self criticism and low self esteem= "why cant i function and be around others" " i am some sort of broken human being". These thoughts compounded month after month, year after year of having recurring meltdown, can certainly lead to depression and despair. NOW, for the past 3 years, that i am beginning to understand how being asd has shaped my life, I CAN ACCEPT myself and ALL that i do MUCH MORE and cognitively understand that i am NOT BROKEN, but have, instead, certain limitations.
depression and burnout and anger walk hand in hand i have found. Every other day i have a measure of disregulation ...healing...disregulation...healing..disregulation....so basically i never heal.
Orion, I'm pretty sure, you leveled up
during this last burnout.
Very well thought out video.
As hard as it is, to put yourself out here for us all,
you are a shining light in an otherwise foggy NT world.
hUgz from Ohio, Lee
My sentiments too, exactly. Well put.🎉
What a cool concept, leveling up during burnout! I'll keep that in my pocket for when I am feeling guilty for resting, thanks❤
Even knowing some of the differences, I can't tell how much intermingling there is between the two for me. Trying to parse it out just makes me even more exhausted.
Late-diagnosed autistic woman with bipolar disorder here. When I found out lots of late diagnosed autistic women get misdiagnosed with bipolar (or other disorders), I had to really consider the difference I felt when I was depressed vs. in burnout. The key difference for me is the thought patterns. When I’m depressed, even the way I think is depressed. I’m hopeless and numb. Colours are noticeably more dull (seriously, it affects my vision!) and my body feels not just tired, but physically heavier. In burnout, doing my special interests feels good, but when I’m depressed, nothing feels good.
Depression, for me, feels worse mentally and physically. However, I struggle with burnout in the sense that I feel like I should be able to function, but just can’t. The loss of skills is also frustrating, as well as the interoception and proprioception issues being more pronounced. I’m recovering from a 6 month period of burnout right now, which is longer than any depressive episode I’ve ever had. Both are a slow recovery process, and both affect my appetite and sleep. I wouldn’t wish either one anybody, and I’m sure different people have different experiences of both. That’s just mine.
Thank you so much for explaining this. I kept telling people I wasn't depressed (i knew what that was like from past experiences) but nobody believed me. I thought it was from finally being free from abuse in my life (getting divorced from the last abusive person in my life). After 50+ years of trauma my mind, body, and emotions were just shot. Now I realize it was probably a bit of that in addition to autistic burn out. It started ending when a safe person came into my life. I was physically, mentally, and emotionally exhausted but would still have great days of being able to get out of bed and do things along with days of only getting up to eat and use the bathroom. Then there were days in between where I felt half functional and needed large periods of rest between getting stuff done. I couldn't hold down a job during this time because daily energy was unpredictable. I did not feel hopeless, just helpless to do anything different.
This is such perfect timing.
I have a high level stressful job that has been taking so much from me for over a year. I officially burned out last week and currently on sick leave. It's the first time I experienced this and was worried about how I'll recover but your knowledge has really been helpful. Thank you
It will get better. Hope you manage to do relaxing activities that dont put a demand on you. Its been almost 9 months of sick leave for me but the drs are also trying to control an auto immune disease. I believe you will recover faster and be ok. I wish you the best
This last week was the first time I realized I was burnt out before laying low for a couple of days, and it made all the difference.
Before, I always thought I was just having a couple of moody days and constantly felt awful before starting to regain my energy. This time, the guilt of "being lazy" didn't magically disappear, but reframing those days as recovery helped me be a lot kinder to myself.
IME- When I am in burnout (after the initial x painful phase), I am able to plan and be hopeful about what I want to do after I recover from burnout. When I am depressed there is no motivation to plan. "Why bother" is the mantra of my depressed self.
The problem for me is that I have small burnouts inside of long burnouts, and when I feel a little better, I go out into the mosh pit of life and get burned out again, before really recovering from the initial burnout. I want to show up for friends and family, and my idea of life... I still fool myself into thinking that I can go back to life before being in my 50's, before burnouts, and knowing more about why. Also, I can't feel the burnout coming while in the mosh pit. It takes a day to really take hold. Which explains how I got into a grand mal burnout - going, going, and going without stopping to catch a breath...
I need to accept that I need to radically change my life, not just recover enough so I can go back out there for more of the same. Doesn't this sound like the recipe for insanity?
As someone who was is autistic (late-diagnosed) and also suffers from clinical depression. I would say that for me, i generally reject support from others when I'm deeply depressed for a combination of reasons. On the one hand, I know for a fact that no one can help. I am not depressed because something is wrong. I am depressed because that's what my brain does unless they have a brain replacement available, there's nothing they can do. Additionally, I know what a drain and a burden I am when I'm severely depressed. I want to minimize the effect of that. I would get away from myself if I could, but that's not possible. I can separate myself from others though.
Nobody told me about this and i asked myself why i am exhausted so fast, thank you!
Thank you, I'm always being asked by my mum "Do you think you are a bit depressed" or something along those lines....when I don't feel at all depressed I'm quite happy I just don't want to join in with certain family gatherings or get the garden sorted out yet or whatever it is that needs doing, it's interrupting the things I do want to get done
Yes, exactly. Some activities aggravate my burnout and others alleviate it…and it sounds really selfish to explain that the things I want to do literally make me feel physically better, but it’s true!
This topic is really interesting. Really good video!
In my first year in college I'm pretty sure that I experienced an autistic burnout. I expended at least 2 or 3 months just doing nothing. I went to the campus, and just wandering around, or laying down on the grass. Back then, I thought it was functional depression or whatever they call it. I dropped out of college for 1 year to be able to recover. In that year my special interest was music theory and piano, western classical music from the romantic period. I feel that I healed and recovered from burnout by focusing on that. After that, I started a degree in Mathematics which is and has been my main interest all my life.
Burnout feels like a full body and mental/ emotional hangover but without drinking for me. Ugh.
Do you have muscle pain
Yeah
@@tomsale5142 Yes
Do you have heds hypomobility with the autism as one diagnosed fybromyalgia CFS but to Me is it autism burnout do you have it every day to thanks for reply
@@kyubeyodaily anything what helps
I was diagnosed at 50 in January 2023. I believe I am still in burnout, as I have been masking all the time. Even at home for the past 50 years. I am struggling to find out who I am. All I know/ knew is masking. I am totally unsure if I'll ever know the real me. I have also been recently diagnosed with combined adhd. I don't have any specific interests for me. Even if I try and get out of burnout, I just don't seem to manage, too. I have had unregulated sleep. To the point I crashed and burned last night I managed to get 5-6 hours sleep in over a month.
I've got autism and depression and it does seem like the difference is what is necessary to improve burnout (lots of alone time, lessened pressure/responsibilities, minimised activities etc) is what can actually worsen depression (isolating, removing purpose, withdrawing etc). Things that can improve depression (social engagement, having a job, variety in life etc) can conversely trigger my burnout. t's a bummer and an ongoing art form trying to find the right balance.
Great point.
10000000% in burnout and don’t know how to get out. I want out but don’t know how. I lost my special interest and don’t know what to do. I am trying but doesn’t feel like I can do it in my own. I talk to friends but they don’t know how to help. :-/. Umph!
Hey, not sure what's causing it for you but if it's being high masking like it is for me, it's tough but figuring out how to unmask helps A LOT.
For years I would catch myself stimming when I was completely alone and stop myself from doing it. The trick for me is to confront my ableist biases and keep on stimming and I immediately feel a bit better. I'm just now, at nearly 30, learning to recognize and respond to my own signals in a way that allows me to self-regulate better. A pattern of doing that, over time, has made me so much less burned out that I'm seriously questioning my depression diagnosis.
If you're dealing with more sensory burnout stuff though, idk what to tell you because I haven't figured that one out yet 😅
Either way, I hope you figure it out. Burnout sucks so bad and I wish you well on finding your way out of it ❤
Exactly true to 100%. Also, neuro-typical people may think you're depressed when you're just extremely happy in that little isolated bubble of self.
This is the most annoying thing when it happens!!!! 🤦 And then they wonder where the rage comes from. 😂😂😂
Your videos are really good but I have a slight issue with the 'you won't allow yourself language'. I take every provision available to me to stay regulated and avoid meltdowns, but I currently am stuck in a living situation where Im I have neighbours who I can always hear, dogs outside constantly barking, on top of all the other noises that cause me distress. I wear earplugs, I am trying to get help to move so far to no avail, I regularly go to stay at relatives houses, I exercise and eat well and meditate and reflect. I am being bombarded with pressures having to go to work meetings and appointments and having to explain myself constantly. I am doing my best and allowing myself every bit of self help I can muster and it's not enough to cope with the overwhelming forces in every day life. Your message is right and it's true, many times if not most a large issue is not helping ourselves, but also many times we help ourselves in every way possible and still end up completely melting down 2-3 times a week.
And sorry if I seemed cold there actually, I do mean it, your videos are really brilliant and helpful and I wouldn't wish to police your language or anything, maybe my interpretation is wrong but I just felt I needed to express that :)
Also not to imply I think I've mastered self regulation either, but I know it all works when I'm only being bombarded by the regular levels of stimulus and demands beyond my control haha
Hey, no, that's a good thing to point out. A lot of us (myself included) are still deprogramming ourselves from the idea that our suffering is our fault and that idea can worm its way into
discussions where it is NOT needed.
Thank you for pointing that out! I definitely needed to hear it 😊
I was telling a friend that I wasn't depressed after telling her I've had no e ergy to do anything including bathing. She told me that sounds like depression. I told her it's definitely not depression. Depression for me is like "What's the point?" Burnout is "I want to do the thing, I just have no energy to do it"
Great video! For me, the key difference is the feeling of hopelessness. When I'm experiencing burnout, I generally have the clarity to understand it's temporary and within my control to correct. When I'm depressed, it's hard to find answers and to believe things will get better. Living with depression can be so difficult.
I think I'm coming out of a VERY long-term burnout that started in my teens (I turn 30 this year). I am extraordinarily lucky to have a place I can live with my wonderful partner whose job is able to support the both of us. I think I wouldn't be able to get better if I had to hold down a job as well.
I'm starting to see a future as an independent artisan and I truly wish that was an option for more people. As it is, the best I can do right now is try to support this community as best I can. So basically, thank you for giving voice to these issues, Orion. Truly appreciate you and this community you've built ❤
Do you have any chronic pain symptoms of your burnout pain etc
Last week a delivery person bounded up the wooden steps of my entry porch (BOOM BOOM BOOM), dropped down the heavy pkg of pet food (CRASH KABOOM) and then, as an added trauma, he rang the doorbell before he left😅
I was standing frozen in the kitchen enduring all of of this, knowing what would happen next. I then felt the cortisol (or whatever the triggering substance is) as it explodes painfully through me. Then the uncontrollable trembling begins and continues for several minutes. Loud and sudden noises are like a physical injury for me. Even in a place like the grocery store, I feel myself become like a bowl of jello.
I once felt that antidepressants made the feeling of water on my skin change to become more pleasant. That was about it tho. I didn't feel improvement so far as social anxiety or mood.
I know there is a measure of doubt out there about the subject of autism, but for me it is very real. Just imagine how burnt out you would be if this was happening to you!
Juleyray1975 I don't have to imagine - I live it!! And sadly it doesn't improve or alleviate with age. Mine has actually worsened, in that now an emotional or mental stress creates the very same reactions. The jello body AND mind, and I can hardly stay awake, until the heart palpitations begin anyway.
It sounds like an autistic burnout to me when I couldn't get up and make things this day about 3 years ago. I didn't have an idea about autism for me even if I felt different since my childhood. From that day I feel drained. I trail my body every day and I feel so tired in my body and my mind...I want to do things I'm interested in but I can't manage to begin it. I thought I was a lazy woman. Recently I had some appointments with a neuropsychologist who told me to "dig" into the autistic topic and maybe ADD as well 😅. I have new appointments with a psychiatric doctor to diagnose what's happening with me. You are a light in the darkness❤ it's exactly what I've been experiencing since 3 years and I thought I was crazy. But now I have to figure out what to do to get better🙄thank you for your excellent videos😊 take care.
Yesterday was my birthday and I told my husband and family that I did not want to entertain people for MY birthday. My Nana ask why I was depressed if you would listen I'm not depressed! I was trying to avoid being annoyed and anxious and having to take a few days to recover. I wanted alone time for my birthday or just my little family. My Nana showed up anyways and said if you loved your family you would have a party😮 I said if you loved whoevers birthday it was you wouldn't want to do that to them.
Thank you so much for taking about this topic! I have had so much trouble differentiating between the two throughout my life, and this discussion is so helpful for me. I think I've largely experienced burn outs and not bouts of depression.
This is why undiagnosed autistic adults fall through the system cracks. Because everything is depression for most clinicians...at least in my little european country. I hope in the future clinicians do specific specializations to better help us all.
Having burnout again! I used to think my burnout wasn’t real bc mine was super short (usually lasts a few days, sometimes even a few months) and I just thought it was seasonal depression or something. Boy was I wrong, this sht sucks and I’m so lucky to not get it for years bc I couldn’t imagine how bad that’d feel. I don’t know how you could go on with life with burnout that long, because how I experience it is BRUTAL. I usually have pretty bad suicidal thoughts during burnout, so I feel very bad for those who experience it for a long time. :(
I don't know what depression feels like. I know what autistic burn out feels like. It last for weeks to few months. The biggest thing is when I have it happen I have less spoons to spend. I like that analogy and people seem to understand that better than me just telling I have far less energy. I don't feel sad, I feel nothing at all for lengths of time then overwhelmed by all kind of emotions not just sadness. I find my special interests take too many spoons when before I'd actually gain spoons doing them. I'm still high interested just can't do that them anymore. As well circadian rhythm get out of wack not that it was good to begin with but it just worse.
Welcome back, Orion. I've experienced burnout for months at a time. Thanks for helping describe it so well! Hopefully the next time I'll be better prepared to put it into words and find better coping mechanisms.
I used to call certain things that happened to me “episodic depression,” knowing that they were technically way too short in clinical terms. The first time I thought I experienced this was shutting down the day after an event of my wife’s that I knew was going to be a challenge for me. The next day a post-event event suddenly presented itself, and I shut down. I thought it was depression but was confused because I was not that depressed. Later depressive episodes I recognize now as having been implosive meltdowns and shutdowns. It was not until I started a stressful job that finally made my inattentive brain fully aware of my social difficulties, and that boosted my anxiety, that I started having explosive meltdowns, and these I have learned are usually followed by adrenal fatigue/depression, not sure what to call that.
It all became a little clearer in 2020-21, when I did finally get MDD, although in retrospect this was heavily influenced by explosive meltdowns and dissociation. The meltdowns gave me energy that still didn’t really look like MDD, although the other factors were there. (I was still undiagnosed, though I started to suspect around then.)
What makes it hard to sort is that I think I have had at least hypothymia, if not low level depression, most of my life. The most marked thing about the MDD was the anhedonia, which has held on in a less depressed state. Also confusing matters: I was quite aware of psychomotor retardation, which is a MDD thing; but I have since realized that I spend a lot of time in Freeze, which is somewhat similar.
Sorry for all this, I tend to overshare when my life has gone to sh*t. I don’t have much by way of social support, so I appreciate this channel.
Very late diagnosed AuADHD at 57. I also suffer from depression. For me it's hard to tell where the burnout ends and the depression starts. It's hasn't been that long for me. I'm still trying to figure it all out, but I've been in a state of burnout/depression for 25 or more years. It all gets commingled when you have no idea what's going on.
Thank you! Definitely feel more validated. It's amazing how judgy people are. I absolutely hate my meltdowns and burnouts and try to avoid them. Having names for them and strategies definitely helps to minimize them. I do understand they are not good to be around and I avoid people but when people experience them I feel really bad. Also people try to shame me or villainize me for them. Even when I apologize and explain and try to show I'm trying to find ways to not do it again and ask them to help me prevent these, they will just say I'm childish/tantrums/bad or purposefully manipulative. The later one confused me. I actually questioned myself. I eventually realized that people have a lot bad/unscientific thoughts and beliefs about anxiety/fight response/anger.
Orion, you are on a roll with your videos! This honestly couldn't have come at a better time; well, perhaps maybe several months ago but I'd still argue I'm currently in the peak of my autistic burnout.
I share many of your videos (especially the ones you've made in the past year because that's when I first discovered you and started following you) with a very close friend who I live with and they are a very helpful tool that I use to communicate with her about how my mind works.
I was in burnout for years to the extent that I was diagnosed with dysthymia. I would have periods of major depression too. I would say to them that OK the meds work for the depression but there is this other thing happening that the meds don't work for and led to years in and out of a psych ward. Learned that I can step back from things (fortunate that I am on disability) when it is getting too much, later got my autism diagnosis which explains why I need to step back and it has now been 5 years since I have been inpatient. The things still happen, just have a better awareness now so that I can put things in place before it gets too bad.
Good morning from Fl. I woke at 4:15a. Sleep patterns are all jumbled up, I nap during day, go to bed early then wake at the wee hrs in the am. It's disgusting... Anyway, loved the info, it helped me with the difference in the 2, I feel as if I can distinguish the difference better. yet, they seem to melt into one as well. I shall watch the vid again when I'm more alert & awake. Thanks, As always Orion.
Have been feeling down since my failed diagnosis...due to high intelligence and superior cognitive skills. Was diagnosed with depression and social anxiety. Great, that answers 10-25% of my issues. Admittedly, it appears the place I went was geared toward children, and not so much adults, but it was a pretty devestating blow. Will be going for another assessment with a place that does specialize in adult diagnosis, but nonetheless, feeling pretty shit right now. My first thought was I need some Orion time to help me cope. Thank you so much for everything you do for the community. I truly appreciate you in ways I cannot begin to describe. I know I am, without a doubt, autistic, and I know this place only really being set up for kids shouldn't be the end of the road seeking a diagnosis, but damn if I'm not feeling like absolute shit right now. Thanks to you and a few other channels, I am trying to keep my head up and move forward, but wanted to let you know, the first thought I had was to come running to an Orion Kelly video for some comfort. You truly are a wonderful human being, and I appreciate you so very much. Wish me luck in trying to move forward, and congratulations on the birthday of this amazing channel
Definitively dont give up. I had decades of misdiagnosis concerning a physical condition so with a psychological thing it can be even harder. I know they study for years to do their job but im trying to offer support. Idk why but many things in life are unecessarily difficult. But i believe you will make it. Dont give up.
That sucks so bad, friend. My sympathies.
If it helps at all, the failure falls on the system for not being set up correctly, not on you for failing to be "diagnosable enough". You shouldn't have to deal with any of this and I'm proud of you for your determination to keep trying despite that.
Good luck, I hope you're able to find the diagnosis you need. Wishing you comfort, safety and ease on the way to find it ❤
I'm for sure not giving up. It was a mental defeat, but the more I look at it, the more obvious it becomes the center I went to may say adult assessment, but they are heavily set up for children. There was nointerview or discussions, and I know without a doubt, i will get a diagnosis. I'm going to make sure the place I go next does indeed specialize in adult evaluations. Thank you for the kind words.
Thank you so much for the encouragement and support. It helps immensely, and I will for sure not give up, discouraging as it was. I appreciate the support
@@LoneRider502Your have our support for as long as it takes. I suspected I was autistic for 11 years and had to save up to pay for a diagnosis (in the UK) last year at 56. Having it 'officially' confirmed changed everything for me, it was such a relief and devastation at the same time. Orion has created a such a supportive community and there are people here to prop you up as you go through the process. Good luck and keep us updated.
Thank you for saying "years" ! NT around me can't understand that, because they experienced typical burnout, which was absolutely a hard time, but their understanding is biased by their own and different experience. I just want to add that severe chronic pain is constantly triggering sensory overload and exhaustion, which can lead to years and years of autistic burnout. It's impossible to recover from something that never ends... But it's not depression, depression come and goes, sure, but it's very different. Thank you for this very important video !!!
Thank you, now I understand the difference! Recently I was diagnosed with depression and now I understand that that was caused by burnout. Burnout is gone now, but depression stays. But I will become better :)
Litsening to videos like this I'm beggining to realize that I was in sever autistic burnout for most if not all of my childhood
fell asleep, in burnout now, will try again when more energy to take it in. funnily enough i couldn't stand having a conversation outside my household rn, but listening to my buddies on YT monologue is soothing as can be. And validating as heck!
My goodness, I'm in a burnout right now from a specific person. This person is SO invalidating. He likes to play crutch violin with his own illness and I know he knows what he's doing. Then he also tells me how smart I am, and things will be okay...just like I have not made it to 47 years old. Dude,,,I sucked my ticks until I couldn't anymore. So I pull away. But THATS NOT GOOD ENOUGH!!!! Now it is some how "my fault" that there is this distance. OMG, yes Orion! I am being selectively mute at the moment...like don't bother me, i'm TRYING to refocus!!!! kinda like that...Thanks for your shows orion. I am still trying to do a good episode on here without deleting it LOL
I was diagnosed with depression as a child, and then later I was diagnosed with bipolar type 2.
Turns out I'm just autistic and my "episodes" were just burnout...
I feel like you're reading my brain with your videos. You're touching on all of the things I struggle with and it's kind of surreal.
Me to without bipolar diagnosis now diagnosed autism heds ADHD do you get fybromyalgia symptoms from.ling term burnout
Thank you so much Orion, God Bless us all. 😇
So like, how i just cant be alive sometimes, and shut down until im shamed and threatened into moving again
I do not remember not being exhausted.
Yet the video points me more in depression side than burnout. But you can get both :)
For me- depression I was still able to carry on with daily tasks and I’m not as easily triggered by sensory input. Autistic Burnout - I had difficulty getting out of bed. The exhaustion I felt caused me to cancel meet up with friends. I was so easily irritated by any form of sound and my brain was unable to process information and I was unable to do daily tasks.
I have never had the words taken from my mouth as powerfully and as frequently as I have while watching this video, and to be able to articulate them in such a way is poetry to me rn. I honestly haven't felt this validated, ever. I have recently given up my attempt to get a diagnosis as an adult, but I think this video has relit that fire. Thank you.
I am 58 and misdiagnosed since my 20’s as depressed. Every depressing medication was shoved down my throat (or else I would be labeled as non compliant and dropped as a patient/ refused care as punishment and it wasn’t until my son got diagnosed with autism that we realized I also am autistic. Knowing that makes my burnouts much much shorter because I understand what is happening and I don’t feel lazy or guilty about it anymore. The guilt and being told I was lazy kept me in a burnout cycle of self hatred for months at a time. Now my burnouts are a day or two and I am able to work and live my life much better. I am enraged that the medical industry did that to me.
I'm so sorry you went so long without proper help and thinking you weren't trying enough. Your situation sounds a lot like mine. Especially, with the forced antidepressants that did absolutely nothing. It is hard not to feel angry about it. I'm glad we both can now decrease the length of burn out and give ourselves more grace. I'm still struggling on not beating myself up. You will be a great support to your son.
@@Drstrange3000 when my son was born I felt such a connection to him. I knew what he was feeling and why and delt with him in a supportive way. I listened to him and what he needed. Having an autistic mom saved him. He didn’t have to hear all his life how wrong, stupid and bad he was. He is thriving. I have to mourn the loss of what I could have done or been but I did make amazing children somehow.
@@ScienceMom11 You are awesome! I think it helps that we know how it is to be misunderstood and different and some of us become more attuned to other's needs.
@@Drstrange3000 I feel like it also explains why as a nurse I always had amazing relationships with the patients that everyone else use to label as “difficult”. My brain knew somehow that they weren’t being difficult, they were in that trap of negativity we get caught in sometimes. It’s wild how eye opening this all has been.
Orion this is so accurate. I'm starting to understand my husband so much through you. He worked in tourism where the intelligence, permanently masked personality, enthusiasm made him successful but he'd practically be in an unconscious coma for the days between gigs. He left tourism and all he wanted to do was drive water trucks and dozers in the Pilbarra and never interact with a human again. Back and forth for a year... he got really bored, angry and depressed. Gave up work altogether and now flits from favourite obsession to obsession which is hard on me, but no more burn out!! Finding balance is impossible!
I swear I've been through both at the same time ending in me being strong enough to destroy everything that was making me depressed
Couple all this with high dose corticosteroids and a break up and i have no idea what im experiencing any more 😵
This gave me so many epiphanies as well! This is so me! Thank you so much 🙏🏻❤️
I’ve experienced both burnout, and depression. There is a slight difference. The burnout came after a period of extensive physical, and mental exertion(repairs after a catastrophic flood, and also after Delta Covid). Both burnouts lasted years. Walking to the mailbox was difficult . Depression is something I’ve had since age 12. It affects my mood, but doesn’t really affect me physically. I can still go through the motions of life. (Totally anecdotal though, and the only real difference is probably the presence of a trigger event. It’s probably far more complex, and things seem to get worse, the older I get)
I use the term turbodepression for burnout, it feels to me like a regular depressive episode turned up to 11, the regular timeline for a negative mood like that is different, passes much more slowly, and a kind of physical exhaustion I just hadn't dealt with before that.
I actually stopped drinking coffee entirely during that time because I was so crushed so relentlessly, that's crazy to think about for me.
I notice that during a burnout I stim way less and that jittery feeling I usually have inside me is just obsolete. As much as I ever want to stim, it feels awful, ESPECIALLY vocal stims. It feels like a shutdown, in a way. I feel hungover asf rn, esp due to the double danger of a migraine and burnout
Dr K @HealthyGamerGG has a great video about burnout where he explains the neurological differences between depression and burnout.
Wow. Thank you for pulling apart the common threads in my life so I can see them clearly. This video helps me. It makes me wonder if "manic depression" can really be closely occurring troughs of burnout in an autistic individual who is not depressed.
I love how authentic and real your videos are. You help me to forgive myself as i learn just how much is covered by the mask.
I went on vacation with a bunch of couples. Even though we were doing fun things, I couldn’t wait to go home. I felt like a loser for not enjoying my vacation.
i was recently diagnosed as autistic at 24, your channel was one of the few that led me to seeking a diagnosis, your channel is also one of my favorites on YT. thank you
Thank you Orion. ❤
This helped me so much to understand my experiences. I had, for a long time, just thought that "depression" manifests differently in different people, which I'm sure is true, but I kind of concluded that my "depression" just wasn't typical. When I'm going through "depression," I feel unable to complete regular, everyday obligations. I often feel completely exhausted for no apparent reason. I have difficulty maintaining a train of thought. At the same time, I'm still able to enjoy things I normally enjoy and can have fun and even feel happy. It has always confused me, but again, I just assumed my "depression" symptoms were not typical.
Now I see that it probably hasn't been depression at all. I think that the _consequences_ of burnout, like the guilt I feel over being unable to keep up with normal responsibilities, might sometimes lead to depression, but it never starts out feeling like I'm depressed.
I'm so glad I watched this. Thank you.
I have felt the burnout often, varying from days to weeks and sometimes months, the best thing I have found to help me out the quickest has been the ppl around me at the time
I’ve been diagnosed with clinical depression, generalized anxiety disorder and social anxiety. I don’t have an autism diagnosis but am considering pursuing one (it would explain so many things!). Anyway, for me, a common experience for someone with clinical depression is that they don’t feel like they matter enough to receive help. And even if they have people who are willing, they don’t want to be a burden to them. Which is why it can so quickly turn into suicidality as an effort to relieve their loved ones of the perceived burden they are placing on them. Great video, btw.
Thanks for covering this topic. Im pretty sure im Autistic, im waiting to be tested by a psychiatrist. Im trying to work out if im depressed or if im in autistic burnout. From what you described i believe i am depressed and probably some autistic meltdowns or burnout.
I think they can mix. When I got my MDD diagnosis I wish I had been more conscious of the major role meltdowns were playing in my condition. Quite likely burnout too; certainly shut downs.
Major depression, severe and reacurent w no phsychotic features. I was so happy when i heard the no phsychotic features part. Because that is what i have to be happy about.
I went through regular periods of intense misery and hopelesness for the last ten years or so. They occured usually twice a year and they got worse every time. I have always thought it was depression but now I'm sure that those were burnouts. I finally understand so many things thanks to this video, even though I found the blue lights in the backgound quite annoying. In the end I always got out of those phases quite easily, like you mentioned, with the right stimulation or just by turning to my special interests. I will always remember one evening back in 2020 when I got out of school feeling like rubbish and while I was waiting for the train at the station I could think of nothing but suicide. Then out of the blue I saw a guy I knew from when I was a teenager. He had been literally the closest thing to a real friend I had ever had at that point. I hadn't seen him for years but I immediately recognized him. When I saw him walking by just like that I had no doubt what to do. I pushed all those negative emotions on the traintracks where they belonged, jumped up, suddenly full of energy and ran after my old friend. We did the ride together and had a very good time talking about how our life had changed since we last met. Later that night I still felt tired but I was happy. I think that goes to show how burnouts are caused by prolonged emotional and sensory distress rather than by traumas. Now that I think about it I do feel kind of priviledged. I wish people with clinical depression could get back to normal just as easily.
Thanks Orion. Your support and validation mean a lot to me. ❤
I just had a burnout episode at my job (QC in a fast-paced Industrial environment) and decided to take a few days off.
Gonna share this with my team.
Subscribed!
I've been told for the last 7 years that 8 had depression. I knew I didn't because I've had depression and this didn't feel the same. I didn't know I was autistic until last year and now it all makes sense and I'm getting better. Now I know what to do to take care of myself. I need to unmask, I need to rest when I need to without feeling guilt about it, I need to acknowledge the things that I find difficult and either find other ways to do them or avoid them when I'm burnt out. As soon as I found out I was autistic (and have ADHD) and began to acknowledge it and work with it I felt better. I'm not OK now but I'm much better than I was. Misdiagnosis is as damaging as the 'illness' itself.
Currently going through this & I've been trying to piece together my problem & this video is explaining my current burnout. It's awful at work, somewhat bad in my personal life as an extension of work.
Doctors and health professionals aside.
Making a video like this sharing thoughts and experience can help others to find questions and thoughts that they might have missed and can take with them to a professional later. People sharing these things is important regardless of expertise and education. Lots of help and answers have started with videos like this one.
We are many that are grateful for what you and other youtubers do.
Thank you so much for this video, Orion. I feel like something just clicked and I understand myself and burnout so much better. I have definitely struggled with depression at different times in my life, and burnout sounded very familiar too, but I didn’t know where one ended and the other began. Now I know why antidepressants do seem to help me…sometimes. They get my baseline level of energy back and fight off that all-consuming state where nothing feels good and even things I enjoy don’t help. But there are also times where some things feel good and recharge me, but everything else is pushing me into meltdown/shutdown. I now know I have been struggling with episodes of burnout for at least a year now. And I think I’m basically like a battery that’s constantly at like, 10%. I can do things, but it takes very little for me to get completely drained. On the weekends or if I have more downtime, I might be able to get enough “recharging” to get back up to like, 50%, but I’m never anywhere near 100%. If we really want to lean into the metaphor, perhaps my battery can’t properly hold a charge anymore. But even though I’m frustrated and tired and discouraged with the state of things, this feels different than straight up depression. Thank you for sharing these insights, now I can at least name the problem accurately.
Thank you Orion so much 🙏 doing my autistic life with your support is helping me so much!!
Thank you for this amazing information, truly trying to navigate. Finding the keys to all my doors are important to me in order to thrive. 🐣
Thanks for sharing this as i watch this happen to my loved ones and then myself but i would think masking seems to be the cause for most so i think what helps me is to just be me always no matter whereor who im around and i have way less stress. You and your son were surrounded by family and should their for never feel uncomfortable and if you were maybe don't envite them its your sons day not theirs. Love what your doing keep up the amazing work 🙌🙏💯
Thank you for this video. I really didn't understand burnout very well, I definitely do now, and I realize that I have been dealing with burnout for a while now and didn't know.....
Once again, another informative video! Thanks, Orion!
I think it's important that I say this. I am a recovering alcoholic, late diagnosed ASD/ADHD, and Bipolar 2. Covid pushed me over the edge in two ways. One, I started drinking way too much, and two burnout. Now that I am sober and I have too be. My late diagnosed autism is like starting life over with no way to cope. Don't get me wrong, I am medicated. I just have to learn how to do things in a different way that now accommodate my new way of life. Depression is easy to happen for anyone, especially having autism. Now throw in Bipolar 2, and I don't know what is what. I really needed this video Thank you Orion ❤️
Thanks Orion.
💙🏴
Thank you. That was extremely interesting.
L-Dopa(dopamine precursor) was a game changer.
Has it helped did it help physical pain
@@tomsale5142 achey and general weakness
Positive 🎂B-Day wishes for your soon. It’s Good To See You & Thank you for ur content 🩵
Great video Orion. I'm just coming out of a burn out, so it was perfect timing. Very validating and supportive indeed😊👍.
This was super helpful!
Wow Orion, this is one of your GEMS of videos!
Useful insights that make perfect sense, and I agree with the conclusions you've made.
Thank you so much!