6 Volt Positive Ground and 12 Volt Conversion Explained
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- čas přidán 23. 07. 2024
- I go over the basic understanding of 6 Volt Positive Ground and what is actually changing when converting to 12 Volt Negative Ground.
Check out VintageAutoGarage.com for complete conversion Kits!
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I realize this is a 2 year old video, but I have to say, well done, very well done!
Thank you Steve I appreciate it
Ford used positive ground from 1928 through 1954. 6V switches and wiring (+ or- ground) were designed to work at twice the Amperage of 12v systems making headlight relay switches redundant.. Especially with LED bulbs that draw almost nothing.
I used this video and others to build my 12v conversation kit and it went swimmingly thank you so much for your knowledge
This is great! I'm restoring a '52 Ford F1 with my Dad and we're probably going to use that conversion kit. Thanks for the video!
No problem! Thanks for watching
Great refresher. Been a long time since I dealt with 6v reversed
Keep up the great work Zac! We just bought a 1951 Saratoga, and now I have a better understanding of a POSITIVE GROUND system, appreciate that!
no problem! I am glad I could help!
I work as a volunteer at a car museum. In addition for Ford, a number of other companies used a positive ground system including International, Studebaker, Graham, Kaiser/Fraser, and Packard. Positive ground was also common in British cars.
Thanks for sharing, Zac! Electrical stuff is a mystery to a lot of people, for sure! Enjoy your weekend! Be safe!
I appreciate it Harry! You too have a good weekend
Thanks for a simple explanation, great video!
No problem thank you for watching!
Thank you
A clear and well organized presentation!
Kind regards Kim
Thank you!
Thank you for making this video!
Thank you for watching!
thanks, great info. note that amps should be the same before and after lights though.
My old Triumph 650 motorcycle is 12 volt positive ground, from the factory you indicate this is bad/unsafe situation...no worries great video
So 55 was the last year FMC used 6v batteries. I have a 55 Lincoln Capri coupe with a 6v Positive ground. In 56 that's when they switched to 12v batteries. Thanks for the video!
Outstanding! I have added this to the site.
Great! Thank you
I have a few questions. I’m wiring a 51 Ford to 12 volt using the 22 circuit kit from Speed Way and a single wire alternator from Vintage auto . Your video instructed that a relay should be installed for the switches. Is a really needed for every switch such as the lights and overdrive solinoid? if so, in wiring the switch, will I run a hot wire to the switch, then a wire to the relay, also adding a hot wire to the relay, then to the load? In the video I was not understanding how the relay was activated when the light switch was pulled. Currently my car has no overdrive. I have access to two transmissions with over drive. One is from a 50 Ford and the other is a 50 Merc. Can either transmission be installed without any modifications. I appreciate your tube presentations. Very informative. Al Rice Kerrville, Tx
Nice, thanks. If i were to switch everything over from the kit but keep the 6v generator till it dies, would i then have to run a 12v negitive ground voltage regulator. I assume so. I will have nothing on my truck except external lights and turn signals.
Zac explains things so a guy like me can understand.
Thanks Fred!
Great video, thanks. I just obtained my dad's 1942 Ford Military Jeep. It is 6 volts. Do you think it is positive ground also?
Ford, British, and Japanese companies ran positive ground not due to current issues or relay costs, but due to corrosion science. That is negative charged metals become a sacrificial anode and iron is cheaper than copper. Relays will work pos or neg ground also. Your “load” explanation is for AC not DC. All vehicles are DC and the load is the same no matter how you ground it.
I have an old John Deere tractor on a 6 volt system, I was wondering, can you use a step-up/ boost converter to boost it to 12 volt just to run 4 LED lights? Like to keep it as original as possible but I don't want to convert the whole tractor to 6 volt. I would just like brighter then candle lights if I have to work at night. Like original but need to battle functionality. Thanks
не знал что раньше на фордах было 6в)) прикольно объяснил! молодец!
Nice job 👍
Thank you!
I'm in the process of acquiring a '35 3 Window Coupe Ford. It's a nice solid running car which I plan to recondition to be an occasional driver (not a trailer queen). It is a 21 bolt Flathead that runs great but, it's 4:11 gears, mechanical brakes, original '35 21 bolt flathead with 6V electrics. My quandary is this; what do I do first - the differential so I can achieve 60mph without killing the engine or, upgrade to a negative ground 12V system so I don't burn the car to the ground?
The very first thing that I would do is a wiring harness, if the car is original style wires there is a bunch of circuits that are re unprotected and don’t have fuses, even if you wanted to keep it 6 volt I would still recommend modern style fuse box and relays
Thank you sir!
My 53 ford is already changed over to 12 but a guy told me make sure you don't burn up your heater or radio? So how can I know if the radio and heater is properly changed over? Thanks
I would check their power supply with a volt meter, they should be 6V negative ground, you can use any voltage reducer for the radio but for the heater it has to be a high amp reducer, Vintage Auto Garage sells specific reducers for a heater
Just had my 1942 Ford Super Deluxe Business Coupe converted to 12 volt negative and electronic ignition. Sure makes life so much easier and I can actually see at night now with the new lights! Love it! One question about something that I think I have the answer to, but want to hear your expert opinion. Someone added a couple of lights (which we later determined were old VW signal lights) to the back as signal lights. The lenses were clear and they had put some type of red cellophane paper in them to make them legal (although they looked pink). So we put red LED bulbs in which I really like. We didn't add resistors because they seemed okay at the time. The front signal lights are regular bulbs in the running lights. Now, I noticed that the signals blink fast and sometimes have a twinkle to them like fast flashing Christmas tree lights! Will adding resistors to the LED bulbs take care of this problem? I figure that the turn signal relay/flasher is reading these bulbs as burned out perhaps? Thanks for any information. Appreciate you!
You need to switch out the flasher to a LED flasher, that should fix the problem 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop We replaced the old flasher with a new three prong flasher, same as the one that was in it, and added resistors to the LED's and presto...working great! We believe that the LED's with no resistors helped to kill the original flasher unit. Whatever happened, the signals and emergency flashers are working properly now. Thanks!
How is it that my 29 model a is negative ground 6v? It was that way when I purchased it. What has been changed to allow for that? I've been driving it that way for almost 10 years with no issues. It charges as it should and everything works. However the amp meter does go to the negative when the motor is running. I'm assuming those wires are backwards and should be switched. What's your thoughts on that?
In the video you said 1930 to 1953 so is it that all 1929's are negative ground ? Because I also have a 1930 model a and it is positive ground.
@@oldschool621 1929 Model A would’ve came stock 6 volt positive ground, in order to change it you have to re-polarize the generator and change a couple wires around, it’s pretty simple to change to negative ground
What should be the voltage going to distributor on a 6 volt positive ground system? Tia
Points distributor? Somewhere in the neighborhood of 12,000 to 15,000 volts. To the coil, 7.4v if you can keep the generator or alt spinning fast enough.
Great video Zac! Thanks for the info. I’ve always been curious why it is common to switch to negative ground when converting from 6v to 12v - especially if there is no intention of adding or upgrading electronics? I have a 53 Mercury M100 and converted it to 12v positive ground and I am wondering if it is worth the hassle to switch?
Yeah no problem at all, and these cars drove all the time back in the day just fine with 6 volt positive ground. The biggest difference that makes it worth it to me, is worst case scenario, you could get a just start from anyone, and you could pick up basic electronic parts like the alternator if you were to have issues when out cruising, also it makes the car a little safer with relays and more fuses than original. Technically 6 volt is fine, I just like that peace of mind and the little extra reliably
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop Great points! I was thinking about the advantages of having a negative vs positive ground? Any reason beyond adding in newer electronics that are factory made to work with negative ground?
@@Gypsie33 the downside to just going to negative ground and keeping it 6 volt is now you are putting the loads all on the switches and you would still have to add modern relays to everything, for me if I was going to do all that work anyways, might as go 12v. Back then relays were expensive and big, there is only two relays on the entire car, the starter and the horn, making everything else dangerous when switching to negative ground
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop yes I was going to keep it as a 12v but was debating if I should switch it over to a negative ground or keep it positive. Thanks a bunch for the info!
@@Gypsie33 no problem, let me know if you have any more questions.
So how does this work with the starter? If it's built for a positive ground and you reverse the polarity, wouldn't it spin backwards?
The starter rotation isn’t determined by polarity it’s determined by how the wires are spun inside, starter will spin the same direction either polarity
Would the change of positive ground to negative ground make the starter motor spin backwards?
It does not, it’s not about polarity of the wires that decides the directional spin of the starter, it’s about how the starter is internally wound
so if you have a wet hand on a negative ground car and a wet hand on a positive ground chassis you get "ZAPPED" ?
Is this same for a 54 f100?
As I am scratching my head, I sorta kind of understand. But, on my 1947 John Deere B tractor I don't understand how the 12 volt power is running to the starter. It is a positive ground system. There is a ground line running from the battery to the starter, and another wire to the same terminal on the starter, I am guessing to the ignition switch? I don't quite understand how the starter is getting power?
I am confused. I have been told repeatedly that the current from a battery flows from neg. and returns to the positive terminal. So a switch on the neg. side of the circuit would be handling all the current
In the circuit all of the load goes through the switch no matter where the switch is installed.
Inside the switch contacts may last longer with current flow direction.
How much does it cost to switch to 12v's?
I have some specific questions about gauges..51 f1, painless wiring. 6v to 12v. Can we speak directly?
Of course, send me a message on either Instagram as Wired Customs, or Facebook as Wired Customs
Why would my test light light up when on the negative terminal and the points?
Sounds like your motor is positive ground
What kind of relay for the headlight circuit?
Honestly any 12 volt relay would work, it doesn’t have to be anything special
Appreciate your videos how do you charge a 6-volt positive ground battery do you put the charger on backwards or the standard way
First you need a charger that can charge a 6 volt battery, when it comes to the leads you hook ground to ground and positive to positive
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop okay thanks a lot that's what I was thinking I just picked up a Ford flathead and I've been watching your videos trying to get educated
I got a 49 Mercury with a 255 Flathead somebody put a 12-volt battery in it and started it and ran it I bought the car it won't start wondering if the 12-volt battery may have fried something in the system
In order to make OEM 6V gages work, a power reducer is required. How should their polarity be wired to the voltage reducer?
To the reducer it is wired up how you would normally expect, key switched, fused and + to + and - to - when you make the conversion the gauges will be wired up 6 volt negative ground, the gauges will operate normally because they work off of the resistance the sensor puts out. My previous couple videos goes over the reducer is much more detail
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop thanks for the reply. I knew I couldn't connect the reduced 6V positive to ground like the gauges want for obvious reasons. The 12 to 6v reducer must have its own ground on the low side in order to work...
@@johnbeyl3892 no problem, and it sure does, it has its own ground wire
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop so one more question. How do I deal with the ignition since it has a resistor in it that likes 6v. Is it better to wire that all to 12v or should I run it through the voltage reducer and keep the same coil and resistor...same question for the starter solenoid...?
@@johnbeyl3892 you need to watch my video “6 to 12 Volt Conversion, Everything you need” but yes you need to replace the coil and starter solenoid
I need a 12vilt conversion kit for a 1933 pierce arrow . Who makes one that can be used on my car
Vintage Auto Garage is going to have everything you need
What about just adding an 8 volt battery?
now why wouldnt you put 12v to the chassis? if you could fuse the circuits?
Are you saying a 12 volt positive ground?
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop yes for a 12v pos. ground
FYI, I have a 1955 Ford CustomLiner, a two-door sedan with 6-volt positive ground.
Many old tractors as well.
IINM a generator can be used with either positive or negative ground, but an alternator needs to have negative ground. Otherwise the diodes can get fried.
1930 to 1955 actually my friend
Hey Rembrandt why do 6 volt batteries last so much longer than 12 volt batteries? I think your artwork is better than hunters.
Yet I’m still making money off of this video, thank you for contributing
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop serious question I have 54 international but the battery is at least 6 years old maybe more like 9 or 10 6V still going and I have a 50s Ferguson tractor 6V that's battery is at least 8 or 9 years old, both positive grounds and they've outlasted 12 volts that are in daily drivers
I'm guessing that 6 volt start up was a warm engine. I've NEVER heard a 6 volt start up that quick lol.
Haha they both where cold, before I did this conversion I got it running really well so in some sense I cheated
6v s witch is on the neg sidenot the ground not pos side.
Im pretty sure electricity moves from negative to positive.
You lost me at Hello! 😊
th switch explanation is wrong. the same voltage and amperage we found on the lamp is on the switch! amps doesn´t evaporate! sure you need an relay, like we use today, to not burn the switch. 6V has even the double of amps if you compare with 12V (same watt at the lamp).
Ahhhh
Should I tell everybody that current flows from negative to positive? DC generators produce AC current? Only thing that produces DC current is a battery. Lots of utube videos done by folks that may not have as much knowledge as they think.
6V positive ground explained. "Its wrong. Any questions?"
Also the greatest danger with positive earth is jump starting . People do not expect positive earth so they may Conect the jump leads back to front …. Zzzzzzzaaaaappppp
Use the colors. Red +, black- duh
You're a fantastic automotive electrician, but a terrible art historian Zac. LOL
What would you suggest for me to change
doesn't anybody notice all the mistakes in this video ??
List them out, I’ll take the video down and re record it
Should have got your facts straight before doing the video. . Very confusing
Total B.S. This guy knows nothing about what he is explaining!
Explain to me what’s wrong then
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop -- The first half of your video, almost everything you said was wrong! You constantly referred to the negative side of the battery as Ground. Ground is the frame of the vehicle and whatever side of the battery is connected to it. Relays are great to have to switch high current loads but are not related in any way to what side of the battery is connected to the frame. Weather you're switching the battery side of a load or the ground side of a load, the switch is still switching the exact same current. "After the load the amps are a lot lower" No, the current is the same on both sides of the load. You may be good at converting a 6 volt + ground cars to a 12 volt - ground system but you need a better understanding of basic electrical terms and concepts before trying to explain this process to others.
@@rpsmith I hear what you're saying, but you could have been just a little nicer bringing it to his attention, or you could have just explained it in a nice comment, or even better, take the time to make a video, and explain it. I would definitely look forward to that, and once you do, reply to my comment and let us know.
@@OnlineAutoRepairVideos -- You are 100% correct. My bad and my apologies to Zac.
I agree with rpsmith. Misinformation is worse than no information.
I have an old John Deere tractor on a 6 volt system, I was wondering, can you use a step-up/ boost converter to boost it to 12 volt just to run 4 LED lights? Like to keep it as original as possible but I don't want to convert the whole tractor to 6 volt. I would just like brighter then candle lights if I have to work at night. Like original but need to battle functionality. Thanks
They make 6 volt LEDs, that sounds like the easiest solution
@@WiredCustomsSpeedShop 6 volt LEDs aren't very common and hard to find in the correct sizes needed for a lot of applications.