'Tango and Juliet' Cessna 140 Crash
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- čas přidán 20. 04. 2021
- Time for a Blancolirio GA Safety Stand Down.
UPDATE: More Details from the family 4/23
They passed away at 7:19 pm 19 minutes after take off from Sedona.
Their tanks were 3/4 full.
Their cargo was 40 lbs luggage and 160 + 125 body weight.
He did not sell the Piet.
He has flown Cessna 140s for the last several years. This is his second of about the same age.
Joylani was 40 not 38 years old.
He has been privately licensed since 2016.
Has full instrument rating
And is a couple months away from his CFI with Sunrise Aviation in Orange County where they lived.
He was meticulous and calculated. Well trained in stall spin. Never flew in bad weather or compromised.
I know he taught us about things to consider when flying high elevations and variable temps.
LINKS:
Tango and Juliet:
/ @tangoandjuliet
Sheriffs Report:
www.coconino.az.gov/CivicAler...
Plane and Pilot:
www.planeandpilotmag.com/news...
Theme:
"Weightless" Aram Bedrosian
www.arambedrosian.com
/ gyllstroem
Patreon:
www.patreon.com/user?u=529500... - Věda a technologie
UPDATE: Additional Details provided by the Gill Family 4/23
"They passed away at 7:19 pm 19 minutes after take off from Sedona.
Their tanks were 3/4 full.
Their cargo was 40 lbs luggage and 160 + 125 body weight.
He did not sell the Piet.
He has flown Cessna 140s for the last several years. This is his second of about the same age.
Joylani was 40 not 38 years old.
He has been privately licensed since 2016.
Has full instrument rating
And is a couple months away from his CFI with Sunrise Aviation in Orange County where they lived.
He was meticulous and calculated. Well trained in stall spin. Never flew in bad weather or compromised.
I know he taught us about things to consider when flying high elevations and variable temps."
Any info. on whether they were in the pattern/approach at Clark?
7 and 19. Wow.
With that info, I am scratching my head.....
All I can think of is that they sold the 120 and bought the 140 because it had a larger engine, probably a Continental 100HP rather than the original 85 HP. The might have thought the extra power would get them out of situations more easily. But more likely, the aircraft's climb rate at that density altitude just didn't out climb the downdraft of some high winds ... If I had to pull a number out of my butt, I'd guess that the climb rate of that aircraft in those conditions was maybe 300 fpm. I've been in many aircraft with a lot more power where full power wouldn't keep me at cruise speed at my altitude. I remember many years ago being on the south side of the San Gabriel Mountains in California in a Turbocharged C-210 and only being able to maintain 90 knots. A C-140 wouldn't be able to fly in that downdraft.
What was the METAR at the time of the crash?
The false start, where Juan starts to report the accident and then has to stop and compose himself before he can find words to speak -- a very powerful moment. Thanks for not editing it out. Condolences to the friends and families of those who were lost in this accident.
I hope Captain Pete sees this one day when he is old enough to appreciate what strength and "manliness' it took to not edit out that spontaneous and raw display of emotion.
@@paulloveless9180 Few things require more strength than allowing others to see our pain at close range. Juan teaches two lessons here, only one of which is about Density Altitude. Blessings.
agreed... yeah... I think we all feel it
Absolutely.❤
Genuine man.
Not a pilot but I've learned more about flying on this channel. Juan does an amazing job explaining everything about flying for a common person to understand. I really appreciate that. Thank you Juan!
Agreed. I love his channel for this. I hope one day I bump into him at an air show. Seems like a great guy to chat with.
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Retired ARFF Crash Rescue Firefighter @ KSAF. Most if not all of the GA crashes I responded to were the exact phenomenon Juan describes here. At 7,000ft ASL the air density is really low and throw in a gust of wind (very common in springtime in Desert SW) and stall ensues.
Condolences to the family and thank you Juan for your experience and sobering overview.
yeah I bet at 70000 ft asl there's like no air at all
Great refresher on density altitude. Thank you for your respectful handling of this tragedy.
Density altitude. B17 pilot told me their runway was 2 miles long in England. "On a warm day we used every inch of it" when fully loaded.
@@LuvBorderCollies and those planes had FOUR turbo-supercharged engines making LOTS of horsepower EACH!
Whenever I hear the words 'maiden voyage' whether it be boat, plane, RV, etc. my 1st thoughts are wait a little while longer, get some more local time under your belt, and expect problems (whether the transport is brand new or new to you). Your 'new to you' dream car breaking down miles from your home is a totally different challenge than during the cross country trip you always dreamed of.
I salute the dreamers who are passionate in what they do but it makes their loss no easier to handle. Thanks for sharing Juan.
Juan turned the ads off in a sort of moment of silence for this tragedy. Who does that, but a man of integrity and character? He would think it’s not worth mentioning in these comments, but I disagree. There is not a person here, whether associated with Aviation or not, who doesn’t admire both Juan’s professionalism and knowledge and his compassion for flying families everywhere.
Thanks, Juan.
Are all the other tragedies less deserving of demonetization though?
I learned to fly at Santa Fe, NM (SAF, field elevation 6,300) in a ‘67 C150. For one of my cross country training flights, I chose a springtime flight to Grants, NM (GNT) that took me past the leeward side of Mt. Taylor on a windy day. The rotors coming off the mountain had my VSI alternately pegged at plus, then minus 3,000 ft/min. In a violent down draft, I barely cleared the last ridge before you drop into the valley where the airport is located. If I’d had the extra weight of a passenger that day… I learned a huge lesson about flying small, underpowered aircraft in an area of high terrain. Your margin for error can quickly become non-existent. That was my “never again” moment.
We're huge fans of Tango and Juliet because of their love for adventure and for each other. We are shocked and grieved for this beautiful couple and their family and friends in the aviation world. Thank you for gently breaking the news to us.
They looked so totally happy.What a tragedy. Condolences to family and friends.
Accident analysis is what drew me to this channel, wow what a tough one Juan. Your professionalism and passion is outstanding, thank you for what you do.
Hi, I am a PA28 pilot here in the UK. Have about 340 hours in my book and I learnt so much from this blog. Please keep up this great work to try to educate and bring accident rates down.
Great job Cap'n, you and your fellow dedicated youtube GA experts are doing a lot to help stop so many of these AC from falling out of the sky.
Your Dads engineering skills and your Moms reporting skills have produced someone who has a very unique talent in describing and explaining complicated situtations in a concise, understandable and compassionate manner.
I always look forward to your informative and entertaining videos
BZ
Juan Brown is without a doubt the best source for those of us who want to know what happened in a specific crash. The loss of Tango and Juliet is especially heart breaking. They truly broke the mold for CZcams aviation videos with their unique style.
Juan, I just want to emphasize how much you as an individual are doing to help prevent tragedies like these. Your clear concise explanations of important topics are the best eulogy you could provide.
Thank you Juan. Your respect, conduct and reverence are over the top. I doff my cap sir.
Thanks Juan, great recap. RIP to these fine folks. Their Turbine Bonanza video ride is one of my favorite CZcams videos.
Thank you, Juan, for this video. Both Tango and Juliet were very much loved in the Pietenpol and Jazz communities. Their loss will be a gut-wrench for many hundreds of folks whose lives they touched and made richer for having the privilege of knowing them either in person, online or through private messages back and forth. It made me happy to know that Tim watched my youtube channel and would very often ask me questions on various topics.
GOD Speed Tango and Juliet
I'm sorry Captain Browne.
Thank you for helping us learn from this tragedy.
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@@coldchickenwings9437 its a fake account, report the comments please
Thank you Juan, I greatly appreciate your channel and the focus you bring to GA and safety. You did a great job of breaking down the issues of density altitude and low power GA aircraft, something I was aware of when I actively flew but never gave it great consideration. Great job on this channel!
I flew from SoCal out to Williams about ten years ago in a 172 with one passenger. Just past Kingman, I found myself barely holding altitude about 1000 agl. Density altitude and terrain were trying hard to get me.
I flew to Williams and peach springs many times 172 2 people summer never had a problem 2 people 4 I would run less fuel never a problem 160 hp 172 R
@@cooperparts Id have to check my logbook for time of year but I recall being slightly nose high and barely stopping a slow descent. This went on for maybe 20 mins.
I flew the 180 hp Skyhawks up there. Like stepping in mashed potatoes.
Big Bear Lake on a hot summer day...
Pilot report mashed potatoes
Back in 1964, there was no "tailwheel rating" and I put in some time in a Cessna 140 as a student pilot. In fact, two of my required x-countries were in the C140. The C140 had a bit of a learning curve, especially for a student pilot, but was manageable with proper and intense instruction. Never got to fly it with my Private SEL because the company sold it before my check ride. Really enjoyed the airplane, partly because I felt a sense of pride in flying a taildragger. Never had density altitude problems because I was flying out of New Orleans Lakefront. Haven't flown in over 40 years now but I follow all the aviation CZcams channels.
Anytime there is an aviation incident, I go to your channel because you always have the best information and your credentials give you the highest credibility.
You're a wonderful man, Juan. Knowledge is possibly the most valuable thing that one can share, it truly is power. I'm not a pilot, but my appreciation for the Knowledge that you and other pilots possess increases every time you pass on this sort of information.
I wish the families and friends of this lovely couple who have passed, to find peace in what must be such a difficult time for them. Forever more, their souls will be soaring above the clouds in eternal blue skies.
Thanks for your report Juan, I’ve been a subscriber for some time now and appreciate your work. RIP to the young couple 💐
Thank you for having the knowledge and grace to so quickly put out something that turns a tragedy into a chance to learn. As always, no sensationalism, just profound respect and useful, factual information. My condolences for your loss.
As an A&P that was very well explained. My condolences to the friends and family. Cabin air was a class I seriously struggled with in school. Thank you for the refresher.
“Use your superior knowledge, not your superior skills”. How very true in motorcycling, in climbing, in my own sport of sailing. A sad but excellent presentation. And a good lesson in density altitude.
Thank you Juan for keeping the human elements of flying, even when tragic results are part of it, front and center and the excellent explanation of density altitude and it's effects. We all know that was a hard one for your to record. RIP in cloudless skies and calm winds for Tango & Juliet.
I am sorry for your personal loss... Thank you for still giving us the report on the crash despite your obvious pain of their loss. Your efforts are highly appreciated and your emotion reminds us all how fragile life truly is...
A sad story and an important accompanying lesson on density altitude, delivered with your usual outstanding care and compassion regarding aviation incidents. Thank you Juan.
Well done Juan, sorry you had to deliver the bad news but glad we have you on the job. Thanks again.
That was a good learning experience for me here on YT. I’m sad these two young people lost their lives, but I will not let this go to waste. Thank you Juan and my condolences.
You are of amazing character and we are all fortunate to have your experience based commentary. Thank you.
Such sad news. Thank you Juan for taking the time to share with us, when you must be so saddened yourself.
Thank you Juan. God bless the couple in this GAA. I will never ever forget the takeoff and long low altitude flight across Lake Tahoe back in the 1960's...DA. Even though I was a young girl I knew something wasn't right about this flight and I thank God we made it back home safe.
Putting aside the obvious, which is your tremendous knowledge and ability to explain all things aviation, Juan, you are an absolute class act all around and I am thrilled to support your channel..Thank you so vey much for your time spent making great content as well, please continue as you are very appreciated.
Thank you for doing this. You have turned this sad moment into a lesson that will hopefully prevent other tragedies.
Thank you Juan. This was a class act video: sadness in their passing and appreciate the knowledge sharing for safety.
I flew a Cessna 150 for many years as my first airplane. I had a cruise prop on it and because of that my climb performance was negatively impacted. Density altitude was always a “nasty passenger” in my plane and so it was always a number right in my face. Whenever it hit around 3000’ (I flew out of a mountain airport in WV, Mallory Airport) I was ok by myself but could not take a passenger or other load without having to fly through a valley for a slow climb. After doing this a couple of times I quit even trying it altogether.
Even years later flying piston twins I had a good habit from this experience to analyze performance in a density altitude situation. My last commercial hours were in a Golden Eagle with turbochargers. What a difference eh?
Thanks again! Love the old birds. We just have to accept their performance limitations.
I love their channel. Their filmography, sound tracks, and joy of flight was inspiring. Oh good grief...
Good info, and sad news Juan. As a flat-lander from Mn, flying a straight tail 172 home from Phoenix last week was eye-opening. We flew out Monday, and taking off out of St Johns Arizona the density alt was over 8000'. The Stinson crash video from a few years ago is a good example of mis-calculating Load, DA, and subsequent performance (or lack of). Thank you for another great video.
Very educational and emotional video Juan, you simplify the possible causes of the accident by reminding airmen of the elements of performance, and special attention to high elevations, high temperatures and wind as factors that require respecting margins of safety.
So sorry to hear this. I learned to fly at Ryan Airfield, AZ elevation 2417'. Checkride in a C152 with trasition to C172. We took many trips around the area after licensing. There was one to Globe at about 3261'. I remember having a really tough time at Globe due to density altitude. I got away with it and one could say I learned the easy way but one wonders how many untold storiess there are like mine. I am sure we all wish we could somehow transmit that experience to others so that they would be aware of how this situation can spring upon you when you think you have it figured. Many years ago, we used to read a periodical called Aviation Safety to learn about all kinds of accidents and think them through. I am sure that videos like this one are very helpful for those who seek them out. Thank you for your post.
Juan, thank you for your report. It is sad to hear this news. I hope, someone after watching this video, will be extremely careful in flying in this type of conditions. My condolences to the friends and family.
Juan, this kind of information and emphasis may save lives. Thanks for all you do!
Under unfortunate circumstances, you brought education. Sorry for your loss and condolences to the families. Like you said, let us learn. Keep it up brother.
I’m heartbroken. I’ve watched their videos for awhile now. I’m a pilot, and am so jealous of the obvious love they had for each other. What an extraordinarily cool couple. From what I saw he had good pilot skills so this is an unexpected tragedy. A good pilot and a beautiful funny sidekick flew west way too early. Damn
Juan, I am very sorry for your loss and the loss of all loved ones of these two. I am a student pilot (going for PPL) who lives in Sedona, so I intend one day to fly in this exact area. Your lessons are being soaked up by many of us viewers like myself. I will be studying everything you have to say about this particular incident so that this terrible loss does not go in vain. Living in Arizona I am also doing my best to properly understand density altitude and your summary of it here is excellent.
Say no early and often ...
@Molly Rae Do you know a CFI in Sedona? I’ve searched but don’t know a lot of folks in aviation so haven’t had much luck.
@Molly Rae Thanks. I did actually find an instructor in Cottonwood, so was just wondering. KSEZ probably not ideal for a beginner like me anyway.
Thanks for sharing, Juan! Sorry for the loss of your friends. As you often point out, best thing to do is to learn from the situation.
Juan, I am a LSA license Weight Shift pilot. My wife and I fly together regularly and I have been following your channel for a while. Thank you for doing one of the toughest jobs in aviation. It is never easy covering the tragic events, and when it's personal, there is no way to hide how we feel. Your channel gives many of us information that keeps us safer doing what we love, keep up the great work my man. We are very sorry for the loss of Tango and Juliet.
This definitely looks emotionally hard for you. You are a fantastic human being and sorry for the loss. Thanks for making a safety teaching out if this. You took the tragedy and made the best possible out of this. They would have been proud, and surely are. ❤️
That was obviously a tough one for you Juan but there also was a very important lesson to glean from it. Good job as always.
So glad you did this density altitude subject. There is a gut turning video on here where a pilot tried for a mile or so to take off and went into trees. Stinson 108-3. Thanks for explaining that so well. I appreciate you. Sorry for your loss.
Always learn something from your channel, Mr. Brown.
Back in the 70s my boyfriend and I enjoyed many flights in his Champ.
He was a very conservative, careful pilot...like you mentioned he reviewed those charts to understand limits and compensate for decreased air density.
I'm not a pilot but have better appreciation today for our daybreak takeoffs and avoidance of flying at high altitudes in hot weather.
RIP to a lovely couple, and condolences to their families.
Excellent eulogy and cautionary instruction. Hoping the best for their families.
Roughest turbulence I’ve experienced was between Flagstaff and Kingman, the winds in North Az can be deceivingly brutal. Flown from So Cal to KFLG 4 times in the last few months. Found their channel from this report, what a wonderful couple and a huge tragedy. Thank you Juan
Just so sad. Thanks for getting through this and bringing it to us. You are a good man.
Thank you so much for your work, humanity and also my condolences for the loss of your friends.
Thank you Juan. Your review made me thankful to still be alive. In my youth I had a "friend" that would ask me to go with him flying. He always seemed to want to push the boundaries. We ended up in the inverse position in the middle of snow covered lake.(wheels instead of skis) I was very naive and trusting. I flew with him once more after that. I called it quits after that. Young and dumb. I will celebrate 65 yrs this year. I shake my head at the things I survived. My dad was a US Army aviator, fixed wing and rotary. I am surprized he didnt get more vocal with me about choosing my friends more carefully. Maybe I wouldnt have listened. God bless Tango and Juliet. RIP.
In my early years I also got into a density altitude in a Cessna 150 . This was in Kentucky on a hot day with high humidity . I was flying with a passenger , only, in a area that turns out to have been a valley and I got below the tops of the tree. Then on the attempt to get out the performance was ZERO I was just sitting at altitude . I made a decision to put carb heat on to prevent possible carb icing , and of course I knew that also reduced power by 5% but that was better choice than going to 0% power at the wrong time and the recovery of a frozen carb . Yep got out of it ok , but your so darn right in what your saying ,, I didn't take any chances like that ever again ..
One of the problems with "hard-knocks" training, learning how serious those chances are from actually taking them, is that some won't get out of it okay even the first time. It is their first serious experience, but also their last. It is so tragic that it makes the urgency that we hear and feel from Juan in this aftermath very important for young students and pilots, especially, to grasp. For them, I especially think that it is worth every last penny to go take a course with a highly experienced mountain-flying instructor in the summer, and in a normally aspirated airplane. Few things can scare someone to respect the limitations of their machine and themselves more than those types of practical experiences while still remaining in safe hands. A fundamental pilot safety skill is always imagining that _something_ is making the margins of safety less than what we perceive them to be, and feeling determined to find it before it finds us.
@@ReflectedMiles Totally agree . We had a wife and husband in NZ that did specialty training , flying in mountains. Unfortunately they went flying with their 2 kids in the back of the 172 and were slammed into the mountain , loss all 4 . And we can never forget what happen to Steve Fossett in a high performance aircraft in when we now know was a down draft . Interesting that I also was caught in a down draft on the last leg of my pilots test . That was after I checked the weather which had incoming clouds but no notam's . This was over western Kentucky and as it turned out was a frontal passage that had a bad down draft , in my case 1200 ft per min . I was below the clouds and 1500 AGL . I got on the horn to the ATC and had the wits to do a 180 and fly to my pre-planned alternate airport where I waited it out and called in to the FBO to advise all was well. That was in 1976 ! As a 5 time National Rifle Champion I've studied winds on low levels, and have a good understanding of micro changes in terrain that have big impacts on issues including flight ,, now I see more of that in the NZ landscape than the US , this is a hazardous area and is well known for wind dangers .
I did this also in North Caralina on a very hot summer day out of 3000 ft of grass in a C152 with me and friend in plane. I was positive we were going into the trees but just barely made it over..............NEVER AGAIN.
Juan, You do a great job of keeping everyone safe. I love your videos!
Juan, you gave an excellent presentation on density altitude. I'm very sorry it was precipitated by this unfortunate accident. You don't have to look very far to find how many of us have had close calls due to density altitude. Your presentation bears repeating as the weather warms up every year. How easily we forget valuable lessons learned. Thank you for the reminder.
The unfortunate thing about tragedies like this is someone (in this case 2 people) lost their life. But if this video saves just one person’s life then it’s not in vain.
This is so sad, so tragic. I’m sorry to their families for their loss. As a long time aviator I know it happens, rarely, but it does. It still surprises me and saddens me every time I hear of a crash. Time to dig in to what happened and learn from it. Thanks Juan
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Thank you Juan, such a great mind and heart to have. Save lives, learn, create value out of a hard hard thing. 2 such people who were so young. I just turned 57 yesterday. Lets learn, my goodness I'd never want this for anybody.
Thanks Juan. I learn (or relearn) every visit to your channel. I used to regularly fly in that general area of the accident almost every other weekend. Typical intro to general aviation for non-flying friends and family. Mainly launching out of DVT (north of PHX) with Sedona (SEZ) or Payson(PAN) as the destination for breakfast. Even flying a 180hp AA5B (Grumman Tiger) with 1/2 gas and 3 souls onboard, the post breakfast climb out of SEZ was eye opening with higher terrain all around. I became notorious for having my passengers meet me at the airport at 5:30AM for the cooler air and made sure we were back to DVT before 11AM to take full advantage of the lower density altitude. Bonus was not having your passengers lose their breakfast once the thermals got boiling. Calculating Density Altitude and adding lots of margin became a religious part of my preflight planning.
Such sad news. Thank you for the refresher on DA, Juan. May they rest in peace!
You’re a class act, as always. Despite your sorrow, you used this tragedy as an opportunity for education, to possibly save lives.
This channel is amazing! thanks Juan
Thank you Juan for the report. You are a standup guy (don’t to tell you that), I’m sorry for the loss you are feeling. Stay strong. Your videos are priceless. You’re contribution to helping everyone fly safe is appreciated by all.
Doing good training to save people's lives, well done Juan.
RIP.
From a CFI, thanks for an excellent reminder about Density Altitude.
Here in Florida with a C172, actually anywhere, after 6,000 feet or so, climb rate really drops.
Especially in the 152 we use for spin training.
After 4,000 feet or so, got to get out and push to maintain a climb...getting under 200 FPM.
Juan great video it made me cry from the beginning I watched a friend crash in a military aircraft in Alaska when I was camping it was on a saturday Sunday evening I get a call to have my aircraft ready for a recovery, anyway story not important but I know what the friends and family are going through I will be praying for all involved and please do people not try to push aircraft beyond limits aircraft can be replaced friends and family can not, again God bless everyone involved and all out there who read this.
Our highest thoughts to friends lost! Thanks Juan! Always nice to see you!
My mom and dad crashed a Cessna 140 back in 1948 in Maine. Just got lost getting dark and landed in a field. Nosed all the way over. They were ok. I was born in 1957.
Wow that Instagram post, only 7 days prior... So much hope and optimism for this couple embarking on their new Cessna 140 journey. Absolutely awful tragedy.
My condolences to you, Juan, and their friends & family. Thank you for this informative video.
Hi Juan. Another great instructive video. Sadly though cause the lost of these 2 community friends obviously touched u and us aviation fans also. My condolences to everybody in the community and specially to their family and relatives.
So sad! I follow several YT pilots (not this couple) and it is amazing how much I get caught up in their lives as if I know them personally. It would be very difficult to lose my YT “friends”. Stay safe everyone.
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Thx for covering this Juan. I never met them but I enjoyed their easy-going approach in the videos that I watched. I've flown in the Flagstaff area multiple times in my 180-horse Tiger and felt underpowered then. I can't imagine what 100 horses feels like. RIP.
Thank you Juan Brown for the very kind way you have of sharing the bad news. The Sheriff's report raises a lot of questions, and doesn't have a coherent timeline of the events. I know you will stay on top of this and give everyone a better understanding of the accident causes when that info is available. My heartfelt condolences to T&J's immediate family and to their extended CZcams family, of which I am a member.
Thanks Juan. Felt your heart in this one. Keep it up!
Thank you for an aviation eulogy. Condolences and compassion for the families, friends, and people they touched.
They were a dear couple. We enjoyed meeting them twice at a couple of Amboy fly-ins.
How lovely for you to have met them. May I ask you (understandably Juan will be unable to answer this question as he has so many comments) I'm listening to all he is saying, but I'm not a pilot) and I'm wondering, would Tim have initially encountered turbulence unexpectedly which threw him off? And if this was the case - is there anything a pilot can do to get out of this first sign of a problem? I think what I'm asking also is, let's say he knew not to grip hard and pull back, even though it's human nature and obviously an adrenaline based reaction? If he didn't pull back and cause a stall, why is it so hard to recover control?
@@Brooke52528 The NTSB have more facts than anyone, I think it's all speculation from everyone else. Best to wait for the full report from the NTSB. Tim was pretty experienced, as far as I know, so I would imagine he did the right things. Sometimes, there's no way out.
@@JamesGood Thanks James, for your reply. Appreciated. Yes, the NTSB findings will give the facts and not the speculation. Juan has speculated, based on his knowledge and the small bits of information obtainable thus far. We have to wait, and see.
Wise words from a true expert, always good to watch this guy.
Not being a pilot I've learner more about aviation from Juan than all the rest put together.
Great content, many thanks.
Thanks Juan for sharing not only this tragic event that took two lives but your emotions that shares the pain and makes it real.
While no value can be placed on a person's life, the value of learning from the loss is equally priceless.
Thanks for getting our the message to make the next flight safer ! Rest in peace Tango & Juliet
I had a first hand experience with density altitude in a 85hp Cessna 140. A friend and I flew one into Big Bear California in the morning and departed that afternoon on a spring day. Let's just say the old girl had a less than enthusiastic climb out on departure. That was definitely a gut check moment.
glad u made it
Learing to fly in So. Cal , my instructor required a landing and takeoff at Big Bear as one of his real deal lessons. For some reason we ended up substituting 29 palms on a warm day.
@@charlesoneil8559 He understood about Big Bear on a warm day.
Juan, I met the parents as they arrived in Williams to meet the investigators.Tragic and heart wrenching. As a private pilot who learned to fly out of the mentioned airports and currently flying a J-3 Cub and Bonanza out of the same I will say you hit the nail on the head. I dont think density altitude was a factor as it would have showed up quickly as they climbed from Sedona. As this crash was effectively on the left base for Runway 18 at KCMR within sight off the airfield fence a stall spin in the pattern from getting to slow in gusty conditions is my guess.
Saddens me as I often stop at the airport on my way home from work to see who is stopping in. I would have loved talking to these two.
Jim, Good meeting you there that day too.
Totally agree....The accident report stated that after turning left to base, their groundspeed had slowed to 42 knots. It also stated that the twilight conditions made it hard to recognize the horizon. I think Tim, while keeping an eye on the runway, just got nose high, too slow, and stalled. Obviously, the altitude and possibility of wind gusts didn't help. The only good thing was, it was all over in a matter of seconds.
@@nealbraatz3911 You don't know that. Could have suffered in paralyzed agony for hours. Shut up.
@@User0000000000000004 I'm sure any family or friends of this couple, who read your comment, will be comforted by your scenario of their loved one's final moments as opposed to mine. Good job Marty!
@@nealbraatz3911 If they just delayed the flight till the morning likely be still making great aviation videos.
Thank you, thank you, thank you. Your videos reminds me every time the responsibility and the importance of getting ready for a flight
Eye opening,
Thanks Juan for refreshing our awareness of density altitude and safe maneuvering speeds at higher altitudes.
It is heartbreaking to hear of this young couples passing.
Many years ago I took off from Mammoth airport in a Cessna 140 with the stock c-85. I had full fuel just myself and maybe 20 lbs of baggage and it was an eye opener. I leaned for peak rpm and when I got a little airspeed I raised the tail and accelerated to the normal rotation speed and when I eased the wheel back it lost speed without coming off the ground so I pushed the nose back down and got another 5 mph before I tried to rotate again and then it came of the ground. I had a pretty good crab to keep me tracking the runway and was only a foot in the air while trying to accelerate hoping I wouldn’t sink back down onto the runway. The good thing was that the terrain taking off to the east was lower and wasn’t a problem. I learned a few good lessons that day.
So sad to hear of this. Condolences to the families involved. Thanks, Juan, for going over the DA scenarios. I have over 200 hours in a Cessna 140 out of KBFF back in the late 60's and early 70's. The field is at 3945' in western Nebraska where the wind always seems to be blowing from one direction or another and summer temps can hit 105-110F. There were days when we could barely achieve 7500' MSL with 2 , 140# teenagers in the craft. Fortunately, my friend, who I always flew with in this aircraft, was and still is an excellent pilot(recently retired from a major carrier with over 17,000 hours military, private and commercial flight time) was able to make excellent decisions and keep us both safe from all the flying enjoyment young pilots often do. There were many days we either waited out the conditions, or found a more capable aircraft. , but we flew this plane all over eastern Wyoming, Colorado , Kansas and Nebraska year round. Always better to do your homework before flying and be safe, not sorry.
I had the opportunity to meet with them several times at L18 while they were working on their Peitenpol. I could feel their excitement and love of flying every time we spoke. Something all of us flyers feel. Thanks for sharing their story and refreshing our understanding of density altitude.
Watching these videos helps keeps these important factors fresh in my mind as just a weekend VFR pilot. Keep'em coming !
Also very sad to see this story. When you said Maiden journey....I was thinking, did they just attempt a Cross Country on a maiden voyage?
Very well done Juan, much respect. I completely agree with you about that area/corridor of hostile winds and terrain, not a friendly environment for the average performing aircraft. There are three places where I've experienced terrifying winds/turbulence: Palm Springs, Flagstaff/Sedona, and SE AZ thru Carlsbad, NM. Fair skies and Tailwinds forever.
My condolences and deepest sympathies to all those affected by this tragic accident, a sad reminder of how fragile our lives are. Thank you to Juan Browne and the Blancolirio channel for this respectful update on the incident and what might have transpired. Except for what I have already stated, I am at a loss for words to describe how sad this feels, especially when looking at the photos of the vibrant pair in the midst of what their lives could have been. My thoughts are with you and the departed.
Juan
I thank you again for the early report of this accident and your continued great work to help educate pilots and passengers to the safety awareness required when flying really anything especially
The lower powered vintage aircraft
Best wishes to you and your family
Happy New Year 🎊🎈🎆
Las Vegas Craig
Thank you for your experienced insights. Your videos are of great benefit to the general aviation community.
I was flying at Clark Airport this past Sunday, around when the crash occurred. I was in a 100HP Foxbat and it was very gusty and high DA conditions. I landed at Clark with my friend and when we took off, we did struggle to climb, but made it safely. Such a tragedy for these 2 aviators.
Although we who follow your channel don’t know you personally or the ones involved in this tragedy it still doesn’t stop us feeling for their friends and family, take care Juan
Thank you Juan for informing us of this tragic loss. We know it wasn't easy!
Thank you for sharing your wisdom and enlightening us with invaluable 'lessons-learned'! May peace be with their families in this time of mourning!