C-172 Crash Auburn CA, Cirrus Crash Knoxville, Gulfstream DR
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- čas přidán 23. 12. 2021
- Cirrus Crash Knoxville
C-172 Crash Auburn
Gulfstream Crash Dominican Republic
LINKS:
Kathryn's Report 172 www.kathrynsreport.com/2021/12...
C-172 ADSB flightaware.com/live/flight/N...
Kathryn's Report Cirrus www.kathrynsreport.com/2021/12...
Cirrus ADSB Data globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=...
FAA Wake Turbulence: www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publi...
ASN GIV: aviation-safety.net/database/... - Věda a technologie
I'm amazed on how easily a Cirrus pilot was seemingly fooled behind even a moderate sized jet...the effects of vortices even after 30 seconds didn't disturb the air...but after 40 seconds it was like a tornado...a recipe for disaster! Wow! Thanks Juan...That smoke video was an excellent teaching lesson.
There is so much more involved with being an experienced pilot than the average individual understands. Juan, thank you for keeping aviators educated and on their toes. Merry Christmas everyone.
A good pilot is always learning. It's not just a saying.
As a low hour pilot, I try to learn something new on every flight. Every mistake is a chance to improve and prevent it for next time. It mental challenge for sure.
@@mwp1088
Every day in the front office is different! When I flew, I used to read accident reports. NASA has monthly accident reports to which u can subscribe too!
drivers should do this too
As a non pilot, it is simply amazing how much knowledge that is required to fly an airplane properly and safely. Thanks for your insight. Merry Christmas
As another non pilot, this is so true. Those "little things" can kill you.
@@sdgardner1954 the devil's in details. 😔
As a pilot it’s not so much the amount of knowledge but paying attention to those items that are critical to safe flight.
As a non pilot, I say no thank you, I'll stay feet on the ground. Too scary for me. I learned through the grapevine that an ex boss of mine retired from business a couple of years ago and just got his pilot's license. I wonder if he knows what he possibly got himself into.
I assumed it was all pilots (or aspiring pilots) watching. Apparently you guys are just as big of nerds as we are!
In the late 1990s, I was on a US Sailing Coastal Passage Making class. One of the other students was at the helm and steered through the wake of an Arleigh Burke class destroyer. The nose of the boat submerged and a sheet of water made its way over the foredeck and dodger, depositing a torrent into the cockpit. 'best to steer clear of larger objects when in a Fluid Dynamics affected medium (e.g. air or water).
The wake turbulence is amazing to witness. At Oshkosh one year there was a Sea Fury and Mustang making laps with the former using tip smoke. When he pulled up at the end of the runway after the low passes the smoke was swirling around then like magic made a perfect doughnut circle that just hung in the air...until the trailing Mustang then punched right through it. Very cool display indeed!
I've seen that sea fury with the sanders smoke pods here in chino! It's beautiful to watch the vortices. My favorite formation from it was an exclamation point! A large oval ring with a circle just underneath!
Mu thoughts for those who have lost loved ones this week, and great thanks to Juan as always. I have heard about wake turbulence, and the effects before, but never with a visual demonstration which shows as clear as day, how incredibly dangerous it can be. I've learned something today
Really appreciate the effort put in to find and include demonstrations that show the situations you are explaining.
As someone who grew up in a sail boating family, it’s like this plane, in the wake of the Airbus, is like a 30 ft sailboat following closely behind a giant tanker…obviously, small boats stay out of those lanes, but even large motorized yachts can create a wave wake that bounce you all over the place, it can be really scary. I’ve heard airplanes being compared to sailboats, in that ‘they want to stay level’ and it is really hard to flip a large (ours was 30 ft) sailboat, but, you will feel like you’re all going to die in that kind of bouncing around. So many tragedies recently, probably due to the holidays…so sad. Thanks, Juan, love the information that you provide.
That L-1011 video was a real eye-opener. I didn't realize how long the vortices remain.
Juan: I learned to fly in 1972-73 at Harlingen (TX) Int’l and was always concerned about wingtip vortices. I was in a C-150 and we had airliners landing…. Your video footage of those tornadoes coming off the wingtips is the first time that I have seen them so dramatically. All student pilots should see your clip. These things are real, and can happen to anyone following a heavy.
Wake turbulence: Years ago I was at Boeing field they used to let us takeoff at midfield I was number two behind a citabria waiting at the hold short line when a Boeing 747 was taking off it rotated just before it got to us, right after the 747 went past us I saw the citabria that was still holding get picked up in the air about 15 to 20 feet and then was slammed back down onto the taxiway it bent the left landing gear. I heard the tower call the citabria and asked them if they were you OK. the citabria replied we would like the taxi back to the ramp, it was amazing to see what a wing tip vortice could do to a small aircraft
I got rolled 90 degrees to the runway 200ft agl as a student pilot in a Citabria by an R44's wake. Light wing loading and wake turbulence make for a bad combo. Fortunately big control surfaces saved me.
EXCELLENT info. I'm a pilot and don't think I've seen the smoke wake turbulence test. Thanks for all you do.
Merry Christmas.
That L-1011 footage is educational. I don't pilot, but I have been in a older 737 on approach to the old Denver International flying parallel to the Front Range. Clear weather, no wind, all of a sudden the aircraft starts dancing around. Aircraft settles down, as do my hands on the armrests, Captain comes on and says we passed through the wake of another aircraft. Because there was no wind, the vorticies hung in the air for a long time. Don't remember separation distance. Definitely got my attention!
As a retired airline pilot AND a current private & ultralight pilot, I have imagined the following situation: You are on approach to a mixed-traffic airport, and suddenly your light aircraft begins an uncommanded roll. No time to think. Opposite ailerons are an instinctive reaction, but if that is insufficient I have drummed it into my head to apply max power and UP-elevator to the extent my current airspeed allows.
The reasoning: An uncommanded roll that exceeds your aileron authority means you are in a vortex beyond your aircraft's roll capabilities. The quickest way out of the situation is to PULL OUT of the vortex instead of fighting it. Pulling 100-300 feet OUT of the vortex just might save your day.
116,113 views • Dec 24, 2021 •
Wouldn't attempting elevator up (pitch up) simply tighten and/or potentially pull the nose toward the ground if inverted? I have always wondered if going with the roll would be advisable in any way. I realize as private/commercial pilots we're not supposed to be doing aerobatics but perhaps going with the flow (aileron in the direction of the rotation) thus rotating with the vortex would help. Probably a dumb idea due to my lack of experience but just a curious thought. My flight instructor (+10k hours of experience and holder of wright brother master pilot award) sadly was killed by wake turbulence and I think about wake turbulence often and its effects on aircraft. He was unable to visually see a large airliner landing previously as it had already touched down and ATC didn't make him aware nor warn him.
If you're inverted, up elevator might not be a good idea. Or at least that pulling on the yoke when you're upside down isn't a good idea is it? When you're inverted, what exactly is UP elevator? (I'm admittedly not a pilot, although I did learn some stuff flying simulators and RC aircraft.)
@@dansw0rkshop by elevator up I mean pulling back on the yoke which is considered to pitch the nose up. When inverted though pulling the yoke back would pitch the nose toward the ground which I think would still be considered pitching nose down.
Many Years ago, back when we were really just learning about wake turbulence and there were no warnings, left out of Montgomery and got caught by some. Rolled the Piper PA-28 into a left bank 75/80 degrees, Pucker Factor pegged out but did have enough altitude to recover. In a light aircraft it can be unannounced and very violent.
The demo showing the vortexes was really helpful as you can see it.
Wake Turbulence- When in the pattern, and the controller asks if the pilot sees traffic on final, then instructs the pilot to 'maintain visual separation, caution wake turbulence, cleared to land/option' , it is good to remember the controller is placing the spacing requirement for wake turulence on the pilot. I don't know if that is what happened here, but when Juan is describing the miles or time required behind a heavier A/C, this may be the context where a Cirrus could end up one minute or so behind an Airbus. The pilot can always extend, and letting the controller know they are extending is reasonable. Once again, I don't know if that all happened, just one possible scenario. My background is as a retired controller. This channel is always informative, thanks for the work put in.
Thank you Juan. The C-172 event really was a Christmas miracle. All things considered, home safe. Blessings abound!
Imagine concluding the flight by exiting the airplane in someone's upstairs hallway, right next to the kids bathroom.
Christmas miracle indeed 🎅
More valuable information, Juan!
Wingtip vortices are no joke. Many moons ago before wake turbulence was "a thing", I was a solo student pilot flying a Cessna 150, and was cleared for takeoff shortly after a C-124 Globemaster executed a low approach from a GCA approach (how's THAT for old school? :) ). At about 200 feet AGL I encountered its left wingtip vortex and the airplane started rolling right. Despite applying full left aileron the airplane flew out of the vortex above and to its right. If the airplane had two occupants, I am unsure if the outcome would have been a good one.
Once under control, I responded to the ATC request along the lines of "are you OK?" with the firmest voice I could muster, then checked my underwear and continued to my destination, mentally taking a chip from the LUCK pile and placing it on the KNOWLEDGE stack.
Learning more from an og than any corporate or institution made content, keep it up Juan
"Am I late for dinner?" The 172 pilot probably didn't say, but should have, to at least maintain his "Pilot Cool".
I can't imagine going down, then finding myself in someone's hallway... it would be a total disconnect from reality for a few, I would think.
Anyway, just wanted to try a little humor, having 4 sad incidents just before Christmas- which, once again, you did a wonderful job on Juan.
May everyone have a Merry Christmas, and a Happy.. and SANE, New Year.
Am I late for dinner?" "The name is Bond. James Bond"
@@osakarose5612 Merry Christmas, Rose
The best aviation safety channel out there, I much appreciate your work Juan. Merry Christmas from the uk 🇬🇧🎄🎅
That one in Auburn I thought for sure was going to be a fatality! Definitely a miracle there! Imagine flying one minute and being in someone's hallway the next! Crazy!
R.I.P. to those in the separate incidents in which folks didn't make it.
Merry Christmas to you and the family, Juan! Thanks as always for the triple-A+ content!
Thanks for all the detailed analysis Juan! Years ago as a fresh pilot I was flying a C172 VFR cross country and going under the Detroit Metro airport TCA overhang. Unbeknownst to me, I was crossing perpendicular to the departure runway extended centerline and was hit by wake turbulence. The shock was straight down and very strong. The clipboard and pen hit the ceiling and all the dirt came up off the floor partially blinding me(vacuum your floors!). I was lucky and now give big airports a wider berth.
Thank you, Juan. Absolutely stellar as always…THANK YOU for your dedication and service to pilots everywhere! ✈️
And Merry Christmas to you and the little Lirios-and the Mrs, too!!
🎄☃️-May you continue to enjoy life voraciously, setting an example for us all 💘
Without a doubt this is your best video. I was never comfortable with effect of wake turbulence.
Great video, as always.
The "heavy" designation is so important.
Merry Christmas, Captain.
Thanks for the well done multible reports.
Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, Juan and family.
My Brother was in UPT at Williams AFB in the early 70's flying a T-37 on final and a C5 had landed 5 minutes earlier and he was flipped inverted from wake turbulence with gear and flaps down. He was able to right it and did a tower flyby for visual damage (none) and went around and came back to make a safe landing.
I used to sit at the approach to an international airport.
My favorite was the 737-200
Primarily due to the vortex it generated 1000 meters out from touchdown.
Now, I'm about 1Km out from where the 737 would touch down, by the time it finished with the reverse thrusters and pull off to the taxi way the vortexes above me would dissipate with a whishwhishwish sound that would approach me and follow where the 737 was to the runway. It was cool when humidity was high and the temp was low you can see the vortex unfold. Other wise you don't see it, just hear it. Some times there is no sound other wise you can here a quiet whish sound for a while till the vortex unravels then it's quite remarkable.
Follow that in a light aircraft....
Among the many things taught in flight school, this should be up there.
Thank you Jaun. Jut wanted to add about landing behind a heavy stay above their approach path and land beyond the their touchdown point.
Thanks Juan...Although I am not a pilot, I enjoy your videos....Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to your family.
My son flew on AA B777-200 last night 23/12/21 from MIA to LAX. He was fortunate and was upgraded to First Class. Said it was fantastic and he flies often. It was IFR landing to the East from out over the Pacific. I followed it on Flight-Aware... Look liked they did a little vectored "oval" loop in southern AZ, maybe buying time?
Merry Christmas Capt Browne and family! Keep up the great work.
Thank you for all the great work your doing to keep us safe and informed. Chris in Ireland
Wow! I've seen wake turbulence through cloud formation movement before, but that L-1011 does an incredible job of showing the sheer scale of the wake.
Juan, the best video that I ever seen was with a B727 flying in the wake of a B747 with wing tip smoke generators and I think it took place at Edwards AFB many years ago. Love your videos.
Merry Christmas Juan, thank you very much for your great videos! cheers
Thanks for reporting on these events Juan, Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Bless your kind heart, Brownie! Thanks for all you do! PS -- anyone who thinks wake turbulence is no big deal for a heavy jet can look up Qantas Flight 29 in April 2017, even 74's aren't immune.
Another great video ! Thank you & Merry Christmas !
Absolutely formation flying in weather can be very disorienting. I recall air refueling over the Pacific in a monsoon rainstorm. At times I swore I was going straight down. There was nothing I wanted to do more than disconnect from the tanker and get away from it. And in a B-52, it can take up to 45 minutes to fully refuel.
..Book of intensity, 'Perfect Storm' describes the several attempts at refueling the rescue Helo .... in the soup.. Failed and lost crewmen, incl the 'swimmer... if recollect.. ;/
Thanks Juan. Merry Christmas to you and the Family!!
Another very informative and educational video Juan - thank you for all the fantastic content this past 12 months. Happy New Year.
This channel has achieved critical mass. Among the 285K subscribers, and 92K viewers of this video, there are comments on each crash from viewers with local knowledge and WX observations, who witnessed the crash, know the pilot, or know something about the history of the aircraft. An important feature is that Juan presented possible scenarios, but did not jump to conclusions. The exception is the Cirrus, which has an obvious *probable* cause, but still subject to investigation.
Wow that was an incredible visual about wake turbulence Juan. Merry Christmas to you and your family and stay safe. See ya here. 👍
Thank you for your time on all of these plane crashes and enjoy your holidays.
Great video Juan. Merry Christmas to you and your family. Looking forward to seeing you in July 2022.
A paraglider pilot once told me over a beer, that if normal folks could see what the air was doing and moving around all the time.... not many people would dare try to fly in it. Its a wild place up there. 🍻
Thanks Juan for another informing video! Prayers for the families of all lost. Ref the Cirrus crash; having been an ATC for 31 years, I just wanted to clarify the 4 miles for a small behind a large, the small Cirrus pilot is allowed while in the pattern to maintain his own separation if the controller makes sure he sees the Airbus, therefore the 4 miles would not apply to ATC.
Thanks Mark.
Love that real time wake turbulence video! Powerful!
thanks, Juan, for the updates. always amazing how succinct your coverage of these accidents is. always grateful for your expertise in these matters. take good care. happy new year and fly safely!
Thanks for the G IV update. One of the passengers was a decently popular music producer with his wife and 4 year old child on board. Hopefully more info comes out. RIP to all, especially my fellow airmen.
Merry Christmas, Captain. Or happy holidays. Appreciate your content and wisdom. Cheers
Great content, Juan. Merry Christmas.
Outstanding report on wake turbulence.
As a young man I worked in the food service industry @ Dulles airport outside Washington DC. Had ready access to runways and wandered around out there at night. Certain areas adjacent to runways would "echo" wake turbulences in a very audible cosmic swirl. Kinda trippy. Quite remarkable soundzzz; your video of tip vortices was demonstrating how those sounds came about.
Learning to fly, gotta love it.
Thanks Juan. I'm a landlubber but learn something new every time you post. All the best for Christmas and the new year. Mart in England.
Regarding the 172 crash at Auburn: This was a flight school plane (that I've flown a few times as a renter) and looks like it was the 2nd flight from Placerville that afternoon. The other 172 that landed safely at 14:50 local was N7954G. It was pretty ugly that afternoon with brief, but heavy showers in the vicinity. It appears that the accident aircraft went to KPVF to pick up the other 172, which had landed at KPVF the day before. So no surprise if there was an instructor on board and that it could have been a "company" flight. Will be interesting to hear what the pilots involved have to say about the conditions then.
Which flt school? Flew a couple planes out of sunrise
@@jeffdo9195 Mach 5
Jaun, excellent video report great 👍 visuals and data
You are a
“ National treasure”
I mean that 100%
Best wishes from
Las Vegas Craig
Happy New year
Once again a clear concise report; not extra words! thanks for including the background data. I'm not against CAPS. It can be a great thing. But with any tool, it needs to be used properly. I can remember learning to fly in a 150. My instructor and the controllers were always on top of wake turbulence alerts. Of course just about everything could cause issues with a 150, but I loved it.
Thank you Juan for the instruction. My condolences to the families. RIP.
Thanks Juan, Merry Christmas to you and yours
In 70s I flew regularly with an instructor on freight runs to Greenville TN in a B18 out of BNA. Returning to BNA we followed commercial aircraft and real felt the walk turbulence. Jim stayed back but advised me of this. Most multi engine time was in this aircraft. Juan wishing you and your family Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
Thanks as always and Marry Christmas to you and your family
I learn so much from these; great reportage, analysis, and opinion.
Thanks!
MERRY CHRISTMAS to all. Great work Juan.
I was flying a Cessna Cardinal 177RG under the hood working on my IFR eating. My instructor was handling the communications with Cleveland Center. Suddenly, the Cardinal began shaking badly. The panel was a blur, couldn't make out anything. I recognized wake turbulence, reduced power to idle, brought the prop back as an air brake, and called the Center for a deviation away from whatever was above and ahead of us. My instructor thanked me for reacting quickly. The Cardinal suffered no damage. I was glad I'd donned my shoulder straps.
I flew into EWR’s perpendicular runway once on the old Continental express turboprop probably a dash-8 and we must’ve encountered severe wake turbulence. Like we hit a brick wall, followed by a loud bang, and immediately tipped up to the right. It’s the real deal wake turbulence.
Well done again Juan, and Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Outstanding presentation as always. Thanks Juan
Auburn airport, I remember it well, when I was flight instructing for this fly by night outfit out of Lincoln. What I remember about Auburn this time of year when those storms come in off the Pacific is that they get some IMC and a lot of marginal VMC. Also that airport is on a bluff, there’s a lot of hilly rugged terrain and housing around the airport. Thus if you have an engine failure in a single engine airplane it’s going to be a challenge finding somewhere flat to put it down off airport should that be necessary. Keep it high and fly it tight and you may be alright.
In the 80’s I flew on a formation instrument flight. I was flying a Seneca information with a Navajo in and out of IMC. Also, a friend was flying a SAAB 340 on the visual approach to runway 13L. He encountered wake turbulence causing a bank angle of 120 degrees. He was able to regain control and land safely
Excellent information. Thank you. MERRY CHRISTMAS to all.
It's as though we were back in aeronautical college again on this one!!!
Thanks Juan
There was an incident at Oshkosh when smaller plane on a tight left final was dumped on the runway from the wake turbulence of the the Ford Tri Plane ahead of him.
Many years ago, my 182 following another 182 on final was rolled, less than 90 degrees, by wake turbulence. My takeaway was that the aircraft in front of me does not have to be larger to create problems.
Thanks Juan and Merry Christmas
Thanks for the informative and instructive content -- the wake turbulence video was particularly sobering!
As always very good explanation and demonstration of 3 different accidents thank you
Thank you and Merry Christmas from RB, Nova Scotia
Merry Christmas from San Diego!
Thanks, especially for the Cirrus analysis.
I watched a 172 get tangled up in wake turbulence of a 767 on final. That 172 was flipped onto his wingtips in a flash. Pilot did a good job in recovering but I bet had to change his shorts.
So verry sorry to hear of these sad avents,our thoughts go out to the loved ones especially this time of year,,thank you Juan,from Devon England.
Thank you for sharing.. I learn and learn from you 💯
Merry Christmas Juan, to you and your family, from Grande-Digue New Brunswick Canada. Thank for you’re dedicated work on flight accidents,which I am very interested, living close to flying college.
Wake turbulence is a rarely experienced phenomena that few pilots truly experience. The only time I definitely felt is when I was landing a beaver behind a turbo otter both on floats on a calm day. I was quite close behind him and underneath him, offset to the left as not to chance running up on the back of him. Well at a few hundred feet there was an uncommanded roll can’t remember which direction. It was quite startling but luckily with full inputs I was able to right the ship and land. The boss watching from the dock said I looked like I was having a fun time!
116,113 views • Dec 24, 2021 •
It seems like the Gulfstream might have been able to make Los Americas Airport if they hadn't initially tried to turn back to the departure field. It is so important to brief takeoff emergencies before the take off. If they had identified Los Americas as the best option for a departure emergency before they took off, they might not have wasted time with the 360.
I was thinking the same thing.
Good job Juan. On the wake turbulence separation, if the controller for example told him to turn base or some direction like that, it would be ATC error. They must ensure he gets the 4 miles separation at touchdown. If however the controller issues the traffic and gave a caution wake turbulence and then some landing clearance, it would be on the pilot to ensure adequate separation by either flying above the wake or giving himself enough space.
Excellent vortice demonstration. Thank you!
MERRYY CHRISTMAS TO YOU AND YOUR FAMILY Thank yiu for ALL of your insights!
Thank you for your time on this Christmas eve Juan
Thanks for sharing. Condolences to all who have lost a loved one. That first mishap where the pilot wound up in the people's hallway must have been a doozy! Glad all were ok or survived in that one. Wishing all of you a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.
Thank you for the insight.
I watched the plane crash in Alcoa at Amazons new constructed building , still under construction . I was walking my dog seen this plane above circling twice then heard a crash then smoke few seconds later . Thank God he missed little river mobile home park . Prayers to the familys ! Be safe .
Thank you. Merry Christmas
thanks much for another great aviation video with great commentary and useful information ......
Merry Christmas to you Juan and to your family.
Absolutely fascinating. Thank you.
Thanks for your hard work. It's been a tough month for aviation. Keep them safe out there big guy.
Awesome video on the wake turbulence issue. Scary.