Lotus Elise Cup 250 vs Exige 350 - On Track at Goodwood
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- čas přidán 2. 08. 2019
- Bell & Colvill invited me to join them on one of their exclusive track days. Open to anyone, their days are low numbers, high quality events with great crowds and a good atmosphere. I'd never been to Goodwood before and so I was delighted that on my first ever visit I could go out on track in not just one, but two amazing Lotus cars.
With the Elise Cup 250 costing the same as a very lightly used Exige 350, is there a reason to go for the smaller car - or is bigger really better even in Lotus land? Join me and find out.
Skip to 8 minutes in for driving impressions.
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Thanks for continuing to be the best unpaid lotus ambassador - I have an Elise because of your videos
Thanks for your kind words!
Me too
Imagine paying that much money for a car that won't even include a ratio
@@craigstevenson7708 imagine to spend that much money on a infotainment system that does include the radio, but does not include the car: a Playstation steering wheel, and the computer having fun instead of you. Imagine!
I have an Lotus Exige 430 Cup, so much fun on the Nürburg Ring Racetrack.
3 years on...and getting better and better, thanks
Thanks for the Lotus content!
I love your videos and we've talked on thelotusforums before but don't completely agree on the Cup 250. I honestly think the cup 250 is quite different compared to the Exige (sport). The amount of grip the Cup 250 has compared to the 350 is very different. The liftoff oversteer is something you really use on the cup 250 to get the nose planted if you've missed the apex just a bit. The Exige is faster in straight line speed obv and it is actually easier to get better laptimes on faster tracks due to the extra top-end. I honestly think the Cup 250 is a better choice if you're driving it on track and for several reasons. The running cost is day and night compared to the Exige. The V6 burns through fuel, tires don't last long compared to an Elise Cup, the brake discs crack after 3 trackdays due to the heat generated and you need to upgrade those for sure when driving on track. If we're talking Exige cup, that's a different story. I agree with your opinion that you feel you would reach the limit of the Elise cup faster, however in my opinion it's due to the amount of trust the car gives you due to it's excessive grip. I might be exaggerating here but in the Cup 250 I sometimes feel it has moments where it has some open-wheel characteristics. You need to get on the throttle earlier then your gut tells you, brake later then your gut tells you is possible... It is an absolute blast on track. Powerwise you do lack on faster circuits but you can fairly easily get it to 300hp. There even is a turbo conversion available nowadays but that is very $$$ because you need to upgrade gearbox to handle the power (460hp to be exact). As a track car I just use a cup 250 at the moment. I was very hecitant to buying a Cup 430 but decided not to due to exponential running cost increase at the moment for a car that spends a lot of time sitting in a garage. For a car that isn't being used much, in a country like Belgium it would be silly as we have ridiculous taxes on high hp cars and don't feel like wasting money. At some point I will probably uptrade towards a cup 430 but still feel the Elise cup 250 is a very challenging car. If you can't squeeze every tenth of a second out of an elise cup, you probably shouldn't be driving a higher hp car on track. It's a great stepup with tons of headroom for learning. Last trackday I was the 3th fastest car on track, just one second behind a 650hp ZL1 and an Arial Atom. I think that says a lot about how fast on track the Cup 250 really is if you already know somewhat what you're doing.
thanks for the advise! i am loooking for a new lotus and it really made me rethink my position. i love the 430 cup, its probably my favorite car ever ... but it isnt cheap (so that i was looking for an exige 350) and the running cost argument, as well as the handling and pushing it to its limit does make lots of sense. i have been driving an elise cup 220 for a long time. it is great fun pushing it to its limit, that is just so rewarding. i do however sometimes feel like it could be faster. i still have to testdrive the sport 350 tho, maybe even the sport 410. seems like an intermediate. the value however you get out of an elise cup is not to be underetimated. whilst not being the fastetst in a straight line, curvy mountain roads are insane to drive!
@@thapleyer8387 What did you end up doing? komotec is releasing their 285 kit and a 300 kit soon for the Elise. Put 300hp in an Elise and it's a balistic missile :-) I still have zero regrets of buying it and still glad I bought one over an Exige. Just the new open gated shifter alone is reason enough to buy a newer MY17.5 Cup 250. It's amazing.
@matt Harvey if done right, yes. But I do feel that you might have more 'hard to solve' issues with an engine conversion. I would get an Exige in the S2 if I'm honest. If not, get a 111R and have it tuned a bit and it's a brilliant car. Very playful. The S3 Cup is more on rails.
Well done James. This Lotus content was a perfect b’day present for you and your channel. Keep up the good work.
Cracker of a video with 2 wild cars, awesome to see them both side by side 👍
thanks James for the continued great content, congrats at getting to three years and 39k + subscribers
I bought a 2006 Lotus Elise (US version) thanks to your channel.
These trackday vids are so good 😊. I need to book one up. Glad the channel doing so well.
Thank you for reviewing these great vehicles.
I test drove that exact exige 350 sport, same number plate and everything. Most fun I've had in a car, bell and colvill are fantastic. Will be buying a lotus soon
Great video. I’m about 2 months into Cup250 ownership (from Jamie at B&C) and enjoying every minute of it. I did test drive a few different Elise / Exige but went for the 250cup since it felt like the best compromise between track (which I’m fairly new to) and road (which obviously is the main amount of driving time). On the road the 250cup just felt more agile than the Exige. I’m also lucky enough to have a 911 (991.2) if I want quick!
Great video James, a fair comparison and outcome I think.
Great to see you back in a Lotus, if only for a day!
I have to say that I enjoy this channel so much, I subscribed a while back, the content has grown since then, well done!
I drove a V6 sport then bought a Elise 225 cup and I found it more useable and enjoyable on the road. Amazingly rapid and sharp. Both beautiful cars though!
You deserve way more subscribers.
Thank you for your great reviews sir.
Continue to love you content - thanks Jay
I like a bit of pewter! Especially with some yellow piping. 😊
Great video - very enjoyable to watch 👍
Excellent return to Lotus content. I desperately want an Exige 410 Sport.
Beautiful track and amazing cars. You drive pretty well and were much more relaxed and smoother in the Exige. My choice too. Thanks for your insights.
The more i learn about the Lotus range the more I re-watch all your videos and a little bit more info seeps in.
Soon...Soon... I'll know which one i want... its only been 7months of research so far :)
The longer I look into them, the larger my deposit gets and the more I look up the range. I started with humble Series2 desires... and now here I am.
Logo has been improved; looks good 👍
Also cool new graphics!
Oh, and 10 bonus points for Bell & Colvill. Can be used at any affiliated store
"One of them is called 'No Name'...because it has no name" 😁😂
Great Lotus content and history too! 🏆
New music, still sounds like it could be the intro for Time Team 😝 Good to see more Lotus back
I'd love to see more videos like this
Really like the car stats graphic something sadly many motoring journalist outlets have moved away from and really don't know why! It's good to get technical and a bit geeky about these things. This should be your new thing to set you out from the rest of the CZcams car bloggers, please do it for as much as your other content as you can. Great video, keep them coming, regards Ben.
Thanks Ben. This is the prototype video for them, they will be appearing more often from now on
I miss my V6 exige s, I miss my Exige S sport and touring roof scoop 1.8. I miss having a lotus around.
I have the answer to your problems: BUY A LOTUS AGAIN :D
Good video James, considering the limits of filming.
Jamie at B&C gave me the keys to an Exige 350 last year - it's a fabulous car, and as you say, now a fundamentally different car in both power and character to the Elise. If I was going to buy one for the track I would have an Exige, but for the road (and considering my limited driving skills, I still fancy an Elise (if I ever part with the Evora).
Glad the channel is going onwards and upwards.
the wheels on the elise look really great
Enjoyed the cars and love the Goodwood circuit. You must do the revival it's just top drawer. My lad and I will be at our seventh this year, and now to be joined by the wife and daughter.
Exige👍 sounds wicked. Doppler effect effect 😎
Welcome back
Great vid thanks man
I can only thank you. When i saw your videos especially the JPS Cup 250, i was like i'd one. We want all them : Exige S1, 1.11S, Sport 190, 340R, Exige V6, Cup 250, Cup 260, Exige Cup 260... So now i bought my Toxic Green Cup 250 & 1.11S.
I have literally been waiting for this.....
Absolutely amazing 😉
Best video in a while
Me too
Congrats
Elise is my dream car, hoping Geely makes it available in Cape Town, if not, i will get one for sure!
Finally some Lotus content again.
Like the new end screen looks professional AF.
Lovely video. I'd go for the Exige with the 3.5 Toyota 2GR-FE supercharged V6 all day.
Good stuff 👍
Great to see you back on the track in a couple of terrific cars! Congrats on an outstanding video, your channel growth over the past three years - and too, a couple of terrific sponsors! I'm guessing B&C wouldn't consider opening a USA franchise somewhere near me in the USA????!!! ;) This is a great watch, James - please keep them coming!
Thanks John. I hope to see you again soon, either here or in the US
Keep it up ❤
Great video. Thanks James. It might be a bit tricky to organise but it would be great to see a comparison between the S3 250 Cup and the S2 Exige 260 Cup.
Fantastic video! One of the best yet. Can you please do a comparison between a S2 Exige v S3 Exige ?!?
Keep it up! 😊
Deeez Nuuutz
Totally agree
Great, love to see track days. How about a comparison between a Noble M12 GTO, a Porsche GT3 and an Ultima 720 GTR???
AmaIng video again! It’s exactly what I’m looking at the money (apart from the coronavirus situation lol) thinking of a exige V6 2,000 for £44k looks amazing and great price for the newer gearbox option car for 3 years old
Great video JayEmm. Please don't make Bell & Colvill's fabulous track so popular they lose their very special appeal! And big thanks for featuring my Exige Sport 410 on a couple of drive-by shots!!
That should have read 'fabulous track days'!
Which Exige was yours?
@@JayEmmOnCars the Metallic Black Sport 410 Reg 'Exige Al' filmed exiting the chicane and heading off down the start/finish straight.
This intro is WAY better than your new into.
Hard to see how, given the choice of one of those cars, anyone could choose the 4-pot. Just on sound alone, never mind power.
Thanks again for quality, free videos.
Julian Evans that’s a question I asked myself earlier this year. I had the 350 Exige a couple of years ago - loved it. Very very quick. However when looking for a new Lotus I chose the Elise 220 Cup. Better match for the country roads and general speed limits in my local area. It came with a Tubular exhaust and makes quite some sound as well. To my mind it’s just whatever you prefer at that point in time...
@@mikehedges5954 - Interesting reply, thanks. I'd love to be in the situation of being able to make that choice.
I drove a Sport 220 and Sport 350 back to back and ordered a Sport 240 Final Edition. The 350 did sound better, and the straight line performance was tempting. But I’ve had cars that are faster in a straight line, and I was focusing on the overall handling qualities and fun factor. I thought the Elise was more nimble and better balanced, as if the chassis was designed for it, rather than being adapted for the bigger, heavier engine. I preferred the more compliant suspension for road use and will definitely appreciate the lower running costs too.
Had a 350...but no longer due to a fault from new. Should have bought the cup originally but at the last minute someone put me in a 350 and the sound won me over.
This video is perfect timing, as I am just about to take a leap of faith with lotus again, and buy the cup 250 now. I think the choice between the two is what you plan to do with it. Just a track car....350 wins.... but a tad more expensive to run. If however, most of your time is on the road, I think the 250 wins as an all rounder.
The ‘serious’ comment was spot on. The 350 is serious and grown up. The 250 is more fun ?. British B roads......250 weight and size better ?
You might nip to the shops (the long way) in a 250....but not a 350. 350 sound though......
If 90% of your time is spent on the roads for ‘fun’ days out at the weekend etc, which would you buy then ?
I don’t know what to do again .......you just confused the hell out of me.
Fu*k it. I’m getting a Caterham 420 ! 😂
Stephen I loved my 350, but when I was getting back into a Lotus this year I went for the Elise 220 Cup. I went through a very similar thought process as yourself.
Caterham involves a few too many compromises for me. Good luck with choosing!
Mike Hedges what are you thinking now Mike ? Wished you still had a 350 or happy with the change ?
I love the Caterham, and if it was just me to think about, I would probably buy a Caterham, but I don’t think it’s a car I could live with for a few years. I am hoping the Elise is the sort of car I can live with for many years to come.
Stephen 5 months, a couple of track days and 3,000 miles in, I’m very happy with it. Very well balanced car. It’s great for country road driving as well. It’s more economical, so you’re not filling up as frequently as in the 350 (it’s a small difference but noticeable). It’s a very marginal decision and one, I think, that is very personal to your needs at the time. I went up the power / performance and exotica range over the past 16 years and have come down the other side. I do have another car that gives me the power hit and a bit lairy if I want it (M4 CP).
Mike Hedges Good to hear. Incidentally, I had an M3 CP for a few days until 4 guys tried to nick it in the middle of the night whilst we were in bed. Great car, but after that experience, had to get rid. 😔. The lotus will be a fun car, weekend and holiday thing. Hopefully a few track days also. I think it will get more use than a 350 would (in my personal circumstance) and the 250 is more than enough for road use, with cheaper running cost and insurance.
The most difficult choice is which colour ?
Stephen I’ve heard a lot of M cars get nicked...so far so good for me. Touch wood. Good luck with your purchase! Colours...a lot to choose from. I ‘needed’ a yellow Lotus :)
Nice comparison. Can anyone testify how either of these more more modern Lotus stand up to regular track use in terms of reliability?
I feel the MK2 Elise looks much better than the new ones
Jay is one of the reasons my wife and I each drive a Lotus. I have a Turbo Elise, she has an Evora. Would love to meet him in person one day, but Ohio is a long way from Hethel and Manchester.
Never say never
@@JayEmmOnCars Well when your near Cincinnati Ohio, let me know!
Just saying, there is a 2zr PnP option for the cup 250 as well as a smaller supercharger pulley and exhaust and intake options. Plenty of options for the Elise cup 250 just to name a few.
What are your thoughts on value now we're on final versions? I was thinking Elise 240 final but I notice about a dozen sitting at dealers but not a single Cup 250. But I recall after the Elise S1 came out nobody wanted a S/H Elan - will they hold value in the upcoming hybrid era? Understand you don't have a crystal ball but subject for a thoughts-monologue maybe?
Loved the video and the REG numbers! By the way, are the 2 REG numbers street legal? The spacing is not in accordance to the DVLA rules, is it? I am curious to know!
Elise all day any day 🤟
When side by side they look pretty much the same!
NIce. :)
Thanks James for a top class review. One question is the Exige larger than the Elise inside, and how comfortable are the seats coming from a larger person?
No different in interior sizes, and I find the seats comfortable but others may not
Two nice little cars... what is the goodwood noise limit, does an Evora 4xx need a special exhaust to be allowed there?
The louder Evoras need to be careful on track
Great video James! I really want to get a second hand 350 sport but just all the problems I've read on forums and the apparent lack of customer service from lotus. Would you honestly recommend one even after your own issues and your friends issues with lotus? Has anything changed with their customer service since Geely took over?
If you want one I'd get it from a good dealer, happy to recommend some
Thank for making these videos, very informative. On a side note, you really should do some cardio, it seems you were having a hard time catching your breath
James - what about Exige 350/380 Vs Evora 400 ? Thats closer to my own dilemma
Does it weigh too much to put in a dead pedal.
Jay have you got full footage of a few laps ? be worth uploading them for anyone interested in viewing a full lap if they were interested!
It may be added to Patreon when it relaunches
Cool stuff! More subscribers for Jayemm please. 🤗
Can you still get an Exige with a 1.8 lump or is it exclusively V6?
Just V6 now
Lotus elise with best driver is better 👌👌👌🥰
Could explain the variance between the engines of each car a bit more in detail.
I want to get an elise 220... Is it acceptable as a daily or it's just a pain?
I couldn't do it daily, and I tried.
The grey one looks like it's just been done in primer :D
JayEmm, have you driven the new Mazda Miata? They upped the HP for this year. Just wanted to hear your take on it since it's a superlight, rear wheel drive and 6-speed manual car like the Lotus cars.
I haven't yet but I really want to
The Mazda is nothing like a Lotus.You can't compare them
Jay, have you watched Mighty Car Mods Lotus videos?
still think the elise is a far better looking car than the exige, small changes and small angles make a big difference, but the noise from an exige is great.
What difference in weight does the AC option have for the Elise?
About 15kg
JayEmm on Cars wow, that‘s a lot if you consider it costs about 4K$ to take down 10kg by having some carbon fiber components... do you know what the radio option adds in weight?
@@VanjaMario around 3-5kg I believe
Exige 430 next?🙂
Dos cochazos👏
But can the Exige still be a good b-road car? The Henesy venom is a dreamcar i must say.
Are these available in North America?
no
@@000GunterGabriel000 that's not fair...
I love Lotus. You sold your Evora. Ugh
JayEmm please go back basics own another lotus. You and the Channel need it. What about a basketcase for pennies and do a sort it series of videos
There arent really any good cheap Lotus out there. One day I will have another but not yet
Electrical?
You've got one like and one dislike - I think there are people subbed to your content that just click on your newest release to dislike it anyway. Did you piss someone off at Goodwood ? lol
The phantom disliker has been around for ages
@@JayEmmOnCars Whats to dislike you are either interested in this kind of content or you are not and its hard to fault most of your stuff to be honest.
@@voivod6871 Huzzah Huzzah!!🇬🇧🇬🇧🇨🇦
It could be an Australian thumbsup! 😁👍
I'd go Exige purely on the sound it makes, it sounds far more raw and throaty than the Elise.
The Camry's engine is underrated
@@greathey1234 Having just read up on the specs of that engine, its definitely underrated, not being up on toyota other than the vvti 1.8's, I wasn't even aware that the v6 3.5 existed.
Looks like he’s engine breaking at the same time as using his brakes. Clutch killer? I want to try that, but it looks like something you do in someone else’s car.
Blipping the throttle on downshift is standard practice on track in manual
In conclusion, if you want to go fast on track buy a Suzuki Swift?
Good car
😂
A great little car, but has the Nana vibe to it😅
I hate that exotic cars often have seats like this. Foam cushioning weighs almost nothing. Adding more cushion couldn't possibly make the car slower
What are the better cars for the money? Porsche?
I too would like to know. For Exige money i suppose you can take your pick from Porsche, BMW, etc etc
"You can't really get that much more power out of the little 1,8L of the Elise" or something like that.
Let me stop you right there kind sir.
a supercharger, a much bigger turbo, methanol and an onboard race gas mixer (refuel with pump gas and alcohol separatly, the "mixer" will do the ratio) and a new 5-speed toyota transmission, nets you are ruthly 850hp to the wheels. You can get much more horses out of old toyota engines. And if you had fun with those, I bet you gonna like hondas enignes even more.
Anyways, cool video!
The old 2zz was good for decent power, not the 2zr as used here
I Thought Both Cars Have The Same Size But It Turn Out They Dont
AHR Red interior wise i think they are both the same it’s just the exterior dimensions are much larger on the exige
I know this is an unpopular opinion but I really wish they will add DCT versions (not a torque converter). I've kind of moved on to non-clutch driving already.
I think it will happen in the next generation of cars
I know this is an unpopular opinion but I really wish they will add self-driving versions. Driving is so boring, i've kind of moved on to playing on my phone rather than driving. :) Seriously you have many choices since all auto makers are moving to stupid auto gearboxes (Alpine, 4C, Porsche, blablabla), but as if it wasn't enough you want Lotus, which is based on pure involvement, to go auto', yeah right
I had an evora 400 auto and the box was as good if not better than the ubiquitous zf 8 speed. Which i thought was as good as a dct. The downshifts on the evora auto were fantastic!
Exiges wing looks like its from another car dosent match at all
Appropriate seeing as the car looks like a Porsche.
I am surprised Lotus are still making cars. Well, until 29 October at least.
What on earth are you talking about?
@@funkyhouseman Brexit
@@greathey1234 a uk car company owned by the Chinese and currently using Japanese engines with chassis made of english aluminium. 👍. Think you need to educate yourself young Greathey.
@@funkyhouseman Owned by the Malaysian Proton
@@greathey1234 no it isn't, it hasn't been owned by proton for over a year 🙄. Google is your friend.
Not gonna lie, I've never been able to tell these two models apart. When you said 'it's difficult to believe they share a lot of components' I was thinking.. apart from the colour, is there ANY difference? I say this not to be facetious, but because I think the woeful lack of any new design architecture has held Lotus back.
lefroy1 Hi Mum. 😜
The Elise and exige are vastly different, the exige is much bigger, drives differently and justifies the price difference.
man, u should go see a doc to check ur heart and lungs functions. heavy breathing from doing nothing more than walking around a car.
Stood is the past tense of stand. "I am standing", is what you should have said. Same with sat. Any wonder Meghan wants to get the hell out of your country.