Dealer Had it for 6 MONTHS! Crazy Wrangler - Part 2
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- čas přidán 18. 03. 2022
- The "BroDozer" Jeep Saga continues...
After messing with the bulk connector above the right front wheel, we lost two more ABS sensor signals, and also the TPMS module dropped offline. Is this a CLUE??
Let's pinpoint exactly why the ABS sensors are dropping out, and determine if this issue is in ANY WAY related to the global CAN drop out, which seems to be very intermittent.
THINK TOOL PROS:
www.amazon.com/dp/B08XXWHQVJ?...
Enjoy!
Ivan - Auta a dopravní prostředky
Ivan, you continually impress me. Your curiosity and logical thinking used to fix really crazy problems are amazing. I have seen you fix all things not just automotive and you never step back. Your patience is remarkable. Working outside in the cold does not stop you. Cudos to you sir!
Ivan this makes for a good video title - but then the general public is not typically aware that this is EXACTLY NOT the type of repair that most dealerships really want to get involved with. The dealership should have told the customer to come get the car rather than to let it linger for 6 months. Cars like these make for PERFECT content for a guy making videos fixing cars who can benefit from CZcams views and AD revenue. So it great that you are doing this and its great for educational content for the rest of us.
Probably lingered at the dealer for 6 months because the customer was insisting it was warranty, and refused to pay. I see this almost everyday working in a dealer.
One of these first days, I'm gonna put up a short video of my DIY Power Probe build. But, until then, here's the recipe in text format:
Automotive Repair DIY'ers, Here's A Few Easily Built Inexpensive Diagnostic Helper Tools
----
The Poor Man's Power Probe Substitute:
A Power Probe is a tool which one hooks up to the battery terminals of a car to test power and ground wires at various places on the vehicle. It has sounds, flashing lights, and a display for voltage and such. The tool starts at around a C note and goes up fast depending on accessories.
Now, if you're using it every day and fixing cars is your career, such an expense and time-saving tool makes sense. But, to the occasional shadetree mechanic, those resources can be better utilized elsewhere.
I came up with a homemade version which would fill the bill rather nicely.
Start with a quality 14 gauge, ten foot extension cord. Cut the female plug off keeping 4' or so of the cord attached. Strip back the external cord sheath 2' or so exposing the individual wires of power (black), ground (green), and common (white). Attach 30 amp alligator clip/clamps to the individual wires -- a red clamp for the black wire, the black clamp for the white wire, and a naked clamp for the green example. Use green heat shrink tubing to mark the ground clamp as, well, ground.
What we now have is a female power cord end with alligator clip/clamps on the other end.
Do the same thing to the male extension cord end but rather than use alligator clip/clamps, go with some kind of female banana socket. Keep the red, black, and green color scheme consistent and with continuity.
So, how to use? The red and black conductors are rather obvious. The green conductor can be used for supplying a valid 5 volt reference if necessary.
Here's the nice thing about this setup.. If one needs a longer reach, just patch in *any* regular extension cord for battery-to-back-of-trailer diagnosing.
Be sure to leave each individual conductor with enough room to get an amp clamp around it.
The Poor Man's Load Pro Tool Substitute:
For DIY tool load testing, just raid a couple of incandescent dual-filament tail light bulbs, sockets, and a few inches of wire lead the next time you're at the junkyard. I have a collection of marker lights (0.2 amps), tail lights (0.5 and 2.0 amp), and headlights (55 and 65 watts). Plastic wide-mouthed athletic sports drink bottles can be cut like a funnel to provide a hood to protect flesh and bulb from meeting while hot. Hot glue will anchor the bulb socket to the mouth of the funnel hood
The Poor Man's Amp Clamp Signal Booster:
Most multimeters are fused to 500 mA for low-current in-line amp measurements. The fuses tend to be expensive and time-consuming to replace. As such, it’s best to use a DC amp clamp for most of the detective work until the very last handful of milliamps are accounted for. The problem is that most inexpensive DC amp clamps do not possess the necessary granularity when down in the tens of milliamp measurements.
How to boost the signal?
Build a coil of ten loops of insulated wire using zip ties. It would be a good idea to fuse it appropriately. Then, with the amp clamp on the coil, all the meter’s readings will be 10x. Using varnish-coated magnet wire, one can make a 100x (a 100 loop coil) booster.
Finally, I got off my lazy backside. Here's the video of the DIY electrical diagnostic tools:
czcams.com/video/wkUGeFYLgoo/video.html
From all the damaged connectors you know the dealer tech has worked on it while frustrated. An 8" section of fat tire bicycle tube slid over the connectors in the wheelwell and taped to the wires would protect them better than the nothing they have now.
Better to use 2" electrical heat shrink tubing and tape the ends with good quality electrical tape.
At this point I would have packed that connector full of DIELECTRIC GREASE. And then ziptied it together. 👀
Stabilant 22 is better. It's a compound you mix with alcohol to make an EXTREMELY thin liquid contact enhancer. I've saved some extremely corroded PCM connectors with that.
This is what separates you from the rest Ivan, you can take the whole car and look at it by observation and pretty much figure it all out! Cant wait for part 3!
Most mechanics do not see much benefits in "diagnosing" due to less pay in doing it. They are thinking, "I could be doing a couple of brake jobs" vs. this and take home more pay. Not a lot of incentive.
@@Garth2011 You just have to charge appropriately...can make plenty of money doing diags, if you are efficient :)
It's foolish to remove the wheel liner and expose all that delicate stuff but it's totally stupid of the FCA engineers, who KNOW people will possibly do things like that for tire clearance, to put those items there. After all, Jeeps are known to be the most modified vehicles ever sold.
Waking up with Ivan - My day HAS to be GREAT!!!!
I really enjoy watching your videos. I was in the automotive repair field my entire career and have seen the evolution from a pure mechanical business to a mostly electronic/electrical diagnosis business. Keep up the good work.
We had so many control problems on the locomotives with these style plugs. We went to a straight splice modification.. most of our plugs were in compartments, but they would still get damp and cause problems.
Even if the dealer was able to determine that the connector was bad, they wouldn't have fixed it without installing a brand new harness. Can't say I blame them but it does mean that repairs like this are either really expensive or impossible to be done by a dealer. Nice job, as always, Ivan.
I had a bad connector like that on the variable valve timing solenoid on my Volvo S80 and that's exactly what the dealer said. It already had almost 200K miles on it so I just crazy glued the two halves together.
@@godblesshamas I've done that or just cut the connector out and solder and heat shrink it all together. You do what you gotta do.
Well, a pin that's bent is a ticking time bomb. It will go bad again. The only "proper" repair is to replace the entire harness. Bending the pins back might restore functionality, but it is impossible to say for how long.
@@kastooMcFry Funny you mention that as I kept getting the wrong connector for one of my front O2 on that same Volvo. Apparently that one year only they made the connectors different for left and right. So I just snipped the connector off and problem solved.
@@godblesshamas There are companies out there that will sell you the right connectors. I've done a fair bit of Subarus ("the car of New-England", as they say) and there's a company that sells almost any connector. I'm with you, tho. On my personal cars, I may try to find a connector online or at the junk yard but life is too sort if that takes too long. I've done exactly what you do.
I am an old master mechanic and own three modern vehicles. I get the longest warranties I can get for them and limit my shop work to classic cars. Give me points plugs and condensers and I can fix it. When I had my shop I hired mechanics to do what you do and I gave them (and you) full credit in troubleshooting these monsters. I love to watch your videos to remind myself why I stay with the old vehicles. I am going out to my shop to work on my 1954 Dodge Red Ram Hemi drag car.
Makes me very happy I got rid of my 2018 Wrangler Rubicon when it started acting weird at 14K miles.... No more FCA products for me ever!
I wish my niece had listened to me, but she went and purchased her jeep anyway. Fingers crossed she has good luck
Ive wrapped a zip tie around connectors before to hold them together if tabs are broken.
We held our locomotive fleet together that way. It absolutely works. Locos hit all types of switches and bumps.. proven method.
Enjoyable as usual. You have this strung together like a who-done-it! Keeps us coming back for more. Great job!
i love watching your videos. I do not even work in a field related to automotive repair, but its just fun to watch your troubleshooting process. I might be a sicko too because i think i would enjoy doing this if i was a technician.
I grew up in State College and my back yard was Green Hollow Park where I played pee wee baseball. Sometimes I get nostalgic, then I watch one of your vids and remember just how harsh the winters were... I guess I'll keep my old bones in Texas where it's nice and warm.
Winters are actually pretty mild... It's not Siberia 😅
Nicely done
Good morning Ivan, thanks for the video.
Diagnosis: Aftermarket modifications and inexperienced/frustrated/incompetent dealer tech created electrical issue.
Superb tenacity in diagnosing the problem Ivan! Looking forward to the 3rd and hopefully final video for this repair and diagnosis. Cheers!
Awesome work Ivan 👏
Can't wait for pt 3 😁
You're knowledge and diligence are impressive. Keep up the great work!!!
🏁
I would have got a great big pair of grips on that connector, great job Ivan
You are a man with patience. Just dealing with all those wires water and other mechanics have fooled with has me crazy just watching!
You're so good at this because you can't settle for not finding the problem. There's only so many things it could be. In my experience, it's always something simple and it's made even simpler by using the diagnostic approach, not firing the parts cannon. I love these case studies. Knowing that the diagnostic troubleshooting method _will_ find the problem gives me so much ambition and motivates me to find it no matter how deep I have to dig. As far as jeeps go, those fender liners aren't missing. It's a *jeep* thing
5:04 “…unless my backprobe isn’t long enough…” 😄
Wooh part 2! Thanks for the series Ivan! I found one jeep wrangler with the active swaybar in the front had a connector there that wasnt on my schematic and bypassing it brought all the modules back online. We ended up installing a bypass kit for that electronic swaybar at the customers request because it is a known problem. Weird that jeep would even put these major connectors where they do knowing people will take them off road.
So true, for a vehicle that is promoted as "offroad" to have such electrical fitments so exposed is just idiocy in design.
Ivan, that's a tough job taking someone else's Jeep off-roading to see if you can break it! Don't forget the Vodka! Actually, incredible job and incredible patience. Continually impressed by your work! Hoping things work out in Part III. Looking forward to that episode. Thanks for Sharing!
IVAN, great logic/approach thinking to fix this truck ur AWESOME in my book hope will see the truck in part 3 running the way should without any U codes and tell the customer to get a finder liner in there to protect the body and wiring from salt and dirt as always great video brother.
Stabilant 22…worked for me on several vehicles when I was in business!
Great work as usual.
Perfect 👌🏻
When jou take a close look at the scope in part one, you can see the signal GLITCH ( the white bars between the signal), when you move this same plug.😉
After using Deoxit D5 Spray to clean the pins, then use Deoxit D100L on each pin and cycle the connector a couple of times. For this particular job I would use Deoxit D100L in the little brush bottle. But, if the connector wire exits are not sealed and wrapped the problem will eventually return. You could use Grote Ultra-Seal to seal the wire exits and then wrap with abrasion tape. I would also tie-wrap the connector mated, and then tie wrap the wrapped connector to the frame so it cannot move. Orient the connector to shed water. Weather Pack pins are round. Metri Pack Pins are flat and have different sizes (150, 280, 630) for the required current and can be mixed on a in-line harness connector.
Love the videos keep up the diagnostic mayhem.
Just tell the customer everything will continue to work great as long as he doesn’t use it for what it was meant for.
Really cool. My Spidey sense was tingling on that connector when you mentioned the lock and the tabs were broken... Sure sign someone has been in there a LOT, or someone inexperienced was in there mashing pins with fat multimeter probes or t pins.
Way back in my Jeep CJ5 four wheeler mudding days, we would completely wad up connectors, distributor cap wires etc. with spray can undercoating!!! It was effective but a mess later when working on them!!
It seems bewildering why Jeep chose to put this connector in a place where it would be open to the elements . I have to agree with the others on your skill Ivan. I have never seen such diligence and thoroughness ,I just wish you were in the UK.
It's normally protected by a wheel well liner.
There is supposed to be a wheel well liner in there, which the owner probably removed when they lifted the truck and put bigger tires on, likely due to interference (i.e. rubbing).
@@kain0m Oh I see. Well I would suggest the first port of call would be a new wheel liner to prevent this from happening again.
Great find Ivan, poor pin fit is a beeotch. Looks like the last tech was in there and probably got it to work temporarily, thinking it was fixed permanently. Time for a bypass.
Greetings from Costa Rica Ivan... I had problems in the past with that weather rubber protection, preventing good contact on several connectors on a Jeep and on a Chevy, also on a Suzuki GSXR... I would check all of them
I good tool for taking connectors apart and checking drag on pins. Use a pin vise for cleaning a torch with dollar store sewing needles
When I saw all those modules with codes in Pt 1, my first thought was "set it on fire, adios.." You have much more patience than me...
Gm abs module plugs can get pretty dirty too. Almost gotta take a torch to it to get it to come off.
Got to love modern vehicles. One connector and the whole works goes down! 😂
I wanted to see mudding that thing for bonus footage!!
I would jank some zip ties around these connectors. Also contact spray helps. Well done sir !!!
So, no green crusties but maybe pin fitment and not fully seated. Test light showed the connector was finicky. Good progress Ivan!
Not uncommon for us at the dealership with problems like that to ask the customer what they want in that situation. Many times an option is to delete the connector and connect the wires and solder them together if they have a vehicle in those conditions. We caution that it will make future diag or repair more difficult if the connector is then deleted. One example is the rear connectors by the spare tire on the newer f150s rotting out. They’re in a location they can be deleted no problem and alleviate the problem in the future of water intrusion with minimal future diag process interruptions. In cases like that it makes it easier because if done correctly that area is no longer In question for potential problems.
Awesome find. Now bring on the slush.
I wish I had the $ to have you come to MI and figure out my truck lol. Learned a lot watching you though so once I get the money for some diag stuff I can track down the issues
I always use silicone spray or grease on those weather packs that are right to try and keep them happy and dry
I love this. It's like a murder mystery movie.So many twists and turns.
It’s the pressure washing that’s killing it.
i would be putting a few cable ties just to make sure that connector dont open or get another connector new used to make good but nice going there ivan
Got the first like, finally! Your first instinct on the wheel well connectors was right!
Good stuff.
Had something similar a month ago on a 15 Compass. By the time I got to my buddy's shop it was a no crank, it was losing com with PCM, ABS and 4WD intermittently before. Backprobed PCM can wires, had good signals just not getting back to gateway, ran the backprobed com wires back to the breakout box and could talk to PCM that way with scanner. Figured messages just weren't getting there. It was a similar connector in the left front wheel well, no gremlins, looked good. Sprayed some stabilant 22 on the pins and plugged it back in and car fired up and hasn't been back in a month.
YES on the Stabilant 22!
I was looking at that connector, and two things came to mind: 1 - why the hell is this thing swinging loose at all? This should be something that is strapped down / bolted and not hanging in any manner, and 2 - the truck has Fox Shox, which suggests suspension mods. I am wondering if when that mod was done that the connector was opened and closed a bunch of time, and perhaps even damaged at that point. After that, it would have always been a little looser, and may have finally wallered out the pins to the point where it fails the drag test.
I've put a Ziplock bag or 2 around a connector and used zip ties to hold the 2 parts of the connector tight together when nibs of plastic are broken.
Ziploc bag would just hold in the moisture lol
You really should invest in a lift or at least some Quick Jacks. Your back will thank you. :)
Outstanding diag as usual! Good job.
Tomorrow is Monday and no day for mudding!
Today’s Sunday which is good for mudding!
👍"Connector body shows signs of frustration..." (Nice way of saying "Somebody jerked this thing all up.."
That big connector underside (@19:55) I would have put two big tie wraps around it to keep it tight in!
You need a pin pusher tool to make sure pins on each connector are seated and "clicked" in connector housing. This can cause intermitent connections. You can also use needle nose pliars on male pins to check seat.Can use paperclip on female side if nothing else from the wire side
Your videos should be mandatory viewing by all auto mfgr engineers. The ability of various systems and connectors to completely disable a vehicle is really disturbing. The availability of competent diagnosis and cost of repairs for these issues is disturbing. I truly don't know what I will do when I need another vehicle.
Crazy but true, that's why some manufacturers have a combination of can lines for redundancy.
@@scientist100 No, no manufacturer has redundant CAN lines. CAN bus does not support redundancy. The only thing many manufacturers do is to seperate CAN networks for critical and non-critical components, to reduce the number of nodes on each network.
You could buy an electric car or truck.
That’s a whole new version of automotive fubar
I would put a few big zip ties around those connectors and make sure that they hold together tightly; that's what the hinged lock is supposed to do, but the tabs are broken-- so you have to make up for it somehow-- large zip ties would do the trick.
You call it a weather pack right we all do but is it weather proof all the way around that connector I thank all them connecters need to be put in weather proof bags just to keep them out of the weather by the way love your videos keep them going
You are a good man Ivan. Most shops would send that thing packing. It’s a highly modified off road truck that has had the wheel liners removed among other things, no thank you! The same guy that removed all those parts can fix it… those trucks are a nightmare because you don’t know what they already touched or messed with. Best thing the owner can do is dump that thing trade it in once it’s fixed between being a fiat Chrysler prod,having a 3.6 pennastar v6 and being so negatively modded, that thing is going to be a regular sight in the shop in its future …
Lot of work to revive a misbehaving connector - that missing mud / splash protection really took its toll on it (probably because someone didn't seat it properly some time before).
Still very curious to know whats going on with CAN C bus.
Sometimes the Oring/Seal fail and you have to remove it permanently. My solution is pin tighten as you did, Deoxit and pack the connector in Dielectric Grease to make it weather resistant.
Ivan where did you get the Battery Cable extension leads you show in this video? The ones you used for extending the positive and ground to the rear of the jeap for testing? Great videos you put out by the way keep them coming! -Brian-
Good work Ivan. You really do like a challange don't you. I'm no Jeep fan but it seems to me that most if not all these problems are self inflicted. If it had been left alone it would probably be working fine. Whoever did all the modifications didn't do it any favors. Sure does look cool though and makes for good content.
With those flat male pins I give them a very slight twist and they make good contact. Clearly that connector had suffered several attemps on its life.
I would assume that when you were talking about silicone grease you were talking about Dielectric grease that you were coating in that connector? All the best from Canada
I worked as a service representative for the Xerox corporation. Was never satisfied with a repair unless I was 100% sure I had found the problem.
will you be suggesting to the customer to reinstall the inner fender wells ?
I would zip tie the connector as well and maybe add some DC5 to the exterior of the connector
You could use a large oring to, replacing that green one, or rap that connector in gorilla black tape.
Ivan have you ever thought to use, "Chemtronics CW7100 CircuitWorks Silver Conductive Grease", to increase condutivity and keep moisture out of connectors? By the way you are amazing!!!
I wondered if there's new plug that you can get from dealer and replace it? Then repin it all. So the new plug will have a tab on it??
Great video overall getting there!!! Nice find on that pesky connection!!
I'm sure they'd be happy to sell him a $7000 harness. 😛
Issue is not just the connector housing, all the pins are bent as well.
Maybe that’s why the inner fender well was removed. Someone had been in there before, didn’t repair the problem or fender well upon exit.
The only thing I can think of is that the modules got shorted to ground and that's what took the network down.
I would be tempted to do away with that connector all together, redo all the connections with high quality waterproof heat shrink then a high quality overall heat shrink 100% waterproof and leave enough for it to flex without straining the soldered connections. That connector has had excessive interference to be 100% reliable in the future. As usual your skills amaze me and give me a better mindset when striking difficult diagnosis issues in my field of work.
Thanks Noel!
Ivan could have put Humpty Dumpty back together again, no parts required..😉
I find it amazing (not in a good way) that the manufacturer chose male connector for the power side. Every time I build custom connectors I make sure the power is supplied from the female side of the connector for obvious reasons.
Wonder if they were front probing stuff.. causing even more damage.
Very interested in what you find causing the CAN problems. Working on a 2017 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Sport 3.6L RHD rural mail delivery vehicle (all dirt roads) that after driving on the route for about two and a half hours vehicle will just die. Pull over it restarts no problem. Have not been able to catch problem with a scan tool on it. It has set aU0401 implausible data from ecm/pcm and a C121 torque request signal denied.
Stabilant 22…works great.
Ivan in your opinion are Stellantis connectors and wiring as good as competitors? Considering that JEEP can be used for serious offroading, does the brand make components robust enough to handle a higher duty cycle. I would say if you are in the back 40 and your off roader conks out, then you have to call MORR or equivalent.
Tell the Nut Behind the Wheel to put the side shields back on and to stay out of deep water.
The connector might be ok for now, but the inner linings are still missing so just wait till the electronics come to fail again soon.
Ivan, it does not made any sense to place this kind of electrical connector in those locations, eventually it’s going to get corroded and faulty, mainly when the vehicle is advertised as an off-road one. These engineers are just designing either in a hurry or knowingly to make customer spend more money at dealers . Curiously, the technician at dealers they are not savvy enough or they are influenced by management to not do the right thing.
You should do a shop tour new sub here
Grasias
Ivan is GOAT 🐐
Maybe 2 zip ties around that connector to keep the pressure on especially through rough terrain.
That Jeep should really have its fender liners all that exposed wiring going to cause issues
Once the bulk connector is clean and tight,....... Zip ties will hold it , without fail.
Zip ties and piece bicycle innertube should work.
If trail reliability was of concern... Maybe it was time to replace the connector(s)?