EVs, Synthetic Fuels & The Future For Petrolheads [S6, E6]
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- čas přidán 9. 09. 2024
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This week, Tony and I discuss:
00:26 So.. My GT3 isn’t ready.
04:47 The new 911 Carrera T!
11:41 My electric Mercedes EQS 53 AMG experience.
34:30 The cost of EV driving is a problem.
39:05 Will synthetic fuels save the petrolheads?
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Thank you for drawing attention to synthetic fuels, Sam. It's important work - we should all be focusing on synthetic fuels.
The cancellation of the Fiesta is a worrying thing to see when it comes to affordable cars becoming rarer with every launch
The price of entry for new cars is getting higher and higher unfortunatly , the Fiesta going is a sad day :(
There not cancelling it. From June 2023 they will only be making electric fiestas which will be based on the VW ID3 unfortunately
Agreed. Cars for entry level have been disappearing for years.
Plebs aren't supposed to own cars in the future - they are supposed to rent a service according to the WEF.
You’re 100% right. Soon there won’t be any Up’s, Aygo etc
The reason for the ev push instead of synthetics is due to efficiency, it requires a lot of energy to make the synthetics, during which more fossil fuels are used. If the grid does continues to rely more heavily on renewables it allows a direct input of clean energy into the car, rather than having to generate energy to make fuel to then put in the car. All that aside, for the smaller scale like with motorsport synthetics make sense, this is where companies like Porsche are investing in them. This is coming from a life long petrolhead and would love to see it become more feasible! Love the podcast sam!
They dropped your car off the forklift, mate. And they dont want to tell you that, so they say its a bit delayed. Makes perfect sense.
Porsche: "We had a slight problem with the GSF on your car."
(GSF stands for Gabelstaplerfahrer - German for forklift driver)
This is factual I work at Porsche Germany.
Very interesting, really hope synthetic fuels makes a big break through in the coming years.
as a petrolhead i love ev's if you are to use them only in the city or for very short distance commutes. i recently drove a Peugeot e-208 GT in the city and it was a blast and a hell of a lot of fun.
for everything else (long drives, track use) i would not even dream of going ev.
100% agree with this
went from my tuned MK7R with 410whp to my MYP and couldnt be more happy, been on plenty of 4k plus mile road trips, to the track, and enjoy it just as much as my Golf R if not more.
I have had one 18 months and it’s been great. I have had no issues at all . I repeat nothing. No servicing, no messy smelly fuel, no issues. Would never own a combustion car again. They’re messy, and unnecessarily complex,
@@tonipepperoni77 myp? What do you mean?
Love the podcast Sam! As a petrolhead engineer working in renewables, i have been conflicted by my passion for cars and the realities of our global situation for years now.
An aspect never seemingly mentioned on this topic is also the work going into making the manufacturing of EVs more sustainable and creating batteries that reduce reliance on rare earth minerals,
EVs will constantly get better and better, along with the infrastructure. Sustainable fuels strike me as excellent for enabling people who cant afford a brand new ev to keep existing cars on the road for longer , applications where electricity isn't viable (shipping, planes etc) and obviously the petrolhead inside me who likes v12s (though this is admittedly a luxury and sadly not a priority when the planet is burning) . They are
definitely part of the solution imo though still only a half solution as the tailpipe emissions are still present, I could see climate and land use issues if we leant too hard on them and carbon neutrality frankly wont be enough re climate change.
Cars will always be a thing, and i love them but the serious answer to sustainable transport solutions is improving public transport and city planning for more green spaces and cycling infrastructure. I acknowledge that many people have situations that mean they would struggle with aspects of this, but generally, freeing up the streets (one range rover for 1 person takes up the space for 10 people on bikes or 30 odd on a bus), improving air quality, improving public health, safer more pleasant streets for kids to play, nicer aesthetics would all be beneficial to everybody. How many beautiful old streets in the UK are spoiled by lines of crossovers on each side?? Cities should be designed around people, not cars, and now there are far too many of them contributing to the long charging ques and traffic. (shouldn't be a hot take but i fear that here it could be!)
Anyway, for me, achieving 100% renewable energy will enable everything that requires electricity to become more sustainable such as charging, green electric public transport, production of sustainable fuels, green hydrogen, heating, running factories. Long way to go with many challenges, none more so than big oil holding back progress. I urge everyone who reads this to watch Big Oil vs The World on IPlayer - eye opening stuff to know Exxon were developing EVs, battery tech and solar tech in the 80s, knowing fine well about what their carbon emissions were doing, just to throw it all away for profit and global warming cover ups. Think how much further on EV tech would be if they had continued in that direction, and how much better their position as a company would be now lol
Anyway, Tony, Shell and co. are not your friend, big oil will be looked back on like warcriminals in future years. Feel car guys too often forget this just because they sponsor their favourite racing drivers. Agree some of juststopoils methods are perhaps ill thought out and counter productive to say the least but hey, at least they are out there trying to raise awareness and get climate action!
Interested to hear what people think on these topics if anyone bothers to read, want people to see that car enthusiasts can also think rationally and understand the issues surrounding our passion!
Great discussion Sam & Tony , unfortunately people are blinded by the media and marketing but speaking as an engineer when you dig deep EV’s are not the answer !!!!
Well said Sir
the answer to climate chang e in the transport sector would be to ban cars altogether, as car fans that can't be the goal
@@betaich … which is absolutely idiotic and completely unrealistic. And this is exactly why they (government) will do it
All of the car companies who have spent billions and got it wrong should hire you because you're an engineer. EVs are here to stay.
@@pato10111 but it doesn’t make things better we end up using a ton of lithium for the batteries we don’t know what happens to the batteries when it’s finished we don’t know how many miles Ev can last over it’s lifetimes and also evs bring the price of cars so high
And we also don’t know how we’re going to generate enough electricity efficiency for the cars to run, diff geographical setting and diff conditions makes “green power” difficult and I can promise the price of Electricity will sky rocket soon
As I've said before here, someone needs to champion the £5K Zoe with a 70 mile range that you just charge from home and use as a run around. It would fit 90% of people in the UK.
70 mile range wouldn’t suit very many people🤣
@@-LK34- You'd be surprised. My mate had a Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV for 5 years that only did 20 miles on electric, and almost all their mileage was done in EV mode. Taking the kids to school, running errands etc. No good if you drive an hour to work every day, but plenty of people only ever do short journeys.
@@bigpops74 wouldn’t suit anyone in my family anyway
@@-LK34- unit it needs new batteries at at least 10k
The Zoe would suit most of my lifestyle. Work from home and cycle to office. Last week I did need to travel 400 miles in a day though so I took a train. Cost £200 all in
What a fantastic podcast!
I did a lot of testing and development work on lots of different electric cars so this is information based on my own experiences.
There were a few common problems I found with EV’s.
Batteries would diminish dramatically. One example is that the batteries on a Golf E we had went from doing on average around 102-103 miles of range to only around 80 miles of range within the space of a year. The vehicle covered approx a 3 year “everyday scenario” cycle in that year of testing. When the vehicle only had a 20 mile range left the performance was reduced and when it reached a 10 mile range, you had no heating and your performance is dramatically reduced.
There were other common trends of parts breaking due to the sheer weight of the vehicle. This was especially bad for vehicles where they may share the same components as their ICE equivalent.
I have seen a couple of instances in a crash test where the battery has failed. The entire fire brigade showed up in this one case including one of the really top guys in that county to help with one battery that had failed in a crash test. Everyone had to evacuate and no one could put it out.
The infrastructure is absolutely rubbish. I rarely ever found our charging stations to work (BP Pulse)
I notice at service stations now that people in EV’s are queuing up to charge up regularly. The costs are apparently more expensive than regular fuels yet you get less range, not to mention that this will get worse with batteries getting older and diminishing.
At the moment I feel EV’s don’t suit the majority of people. They’re expensive in general, the ranges wouldn’t be an issue if you could charge them easily in a couple of minutes. The impact on the planet is another topic and something I don’t know enough about.
EV’s are absolutely fantastic cars to drive I found but an EV definitely wouldn’t suit me.
We have worked on alternate fuels that work in ICE vehicles and I’m so happy you’re putting light on this. Hopefully more influential people will do the same as that’s the way not only myself see it going but every other person I’ve worked with.
Harry Metcalfe did a brilliant video comparing the impact on the environment an EV Volvo had against its ICE equivalent.
BP chargers not working is pretty inexcusable tbh when you look at their profits. With that dosh could put a charger on every street in the country. Shows where their true interests lie eh
@@dugmeat5881 it wasn’t even like it was an occasional occurrence. It was constant. I felt terrible for their service team because they’re fantastic but they’re completely overworked I’d say.
A mixture of the way these vehicles are produced, the longevity of these batteries, some consumable parts, how electricity is produced along with the infrastructure, these are some of the reasons as to what is failing these fantastic cars because the cars I’ve driven have been mighty impressive!
Nice new intro, but please edit in Tony’s laughter. That will always be the best part of any intro.
Agreed!!
Sam and Tony FTW at the BBC morning Show!
Great Episode as usual.
Given the now well known limitations and impracticalities of EV, not to mention lower disposable incomes and global energy crisis. I’m expecting a wholesale row back from manufacturers commitment to the tech. I’ll be amazed if it goes ahead the way it has been pitched. I just hope we don’t lose any manufacturers due to the financial impact of going down a blind alley with EVs
You should make Jeremy, James or Hammond speak about synthetic fuel!
Great Episode BTW!
I cashed in on my F Pace SVR earlier this year. Currently have a rental EV and I love the drive but hate the interface. Result? I’ve ordered an ipace from Jag for a familiar interface and an EV drive. I can charge at home and don’t do long trips very often - it’s big enough for my family and very comfortable. Currently paying 5p per mile versus 45p+ on the SVR. Agree that this doesn’t suit everyone so synthetic fuels MUST be part of the solution too for all the reasons you’ve discussed. Thanks for another great episode, roll on LA!
Hello one and all !!!
Started using this when I walk into the office in the morning 😂
Just to give you an example of a recent trip, in my eTron 55, Manchester to Edinburgh and back in the same day. 450 miles, 230 miles on home charge, cost £6.16 with Octopus Go. 220 miles at Ionity @ Gretna (one stop on the way up and one stop on the way back), that cost me £21.21. Total cost for 450 miles = £27.37. That averages 6.08 pence per mile so an ICE car would have to do 126.65 mpg to break even. Not just any ICE car but an equivalent mid size SUV with 300+ bhp (400+ on boost). This is based on UK high street fuel prices now, not motorway fuel prices which are higher and make the comparison even worse for the ICE car. You'd probably get mid 20's mpg from an equivalent ICE car if you are lucky. Also, total charging time (for both stops) was 45 minutes including a short wait one time. That is my personal experience and it is not a one off, I do similar trips weekly, North, South and East from MCR. These examples are for a relatively thirsty EV, 2.8 miles per kW on this trip, not one of the more efficient ones. Sometimes, I go to Norwich, 402 miles return, stay at a hotel with free overnight charging and I get 402 miles for around £6.16 - bargain!
Sounds like my experience too. Isn’t it funny how all the naysayers saying it’s crap have t actually lived with one? 🤔
@@vandit83 Spot on. I don't consider myself a "petrolhead" but I do like cars and there is a lot to like about EVs if you are doing 25000 to 30000 a year, as I do.
@@philhartley7551 definitely. Put 40,000 miles on an i3 which has toured the highlands and Ireland, 50,000 on an MGZS (which has been to France)and 60,000 on an 8 year old Zoe. But apparently they don’t do long distance and the batteries need replaced every 10,000 miles. 😆 all on original batteries!
It is interesting to hear about a positive experience of long distance trips. I still think electric is best as a 2nd car.
I do worry about charging costs moving forward, they could double it overnight at charging stations if they wanted to. Also there is increased demand and still not that many chargers up north.
@@faisalleeds Out of choice, I would use my EV over a
my 4.2l v8 for long trips. went to northhampton on friday, in the EV it would've cost me around £10, I went in the RS and it cost around £80
Here is something to consider for next time you talk about this "EVs convert over 77% of the electrical energy from the grid to power at the wheels. Conventional gasoline vehicles only convert about 12%-30% of the energy stored in gasoline to power at the wheels.". Personally I rather hear you speak about other things, but perhaps this subject is good for the youtube algo?
I’ve had an i3 for nearly 6 years and covered 50k miles in that time. It’s brilliant and I just don’t experience the public charger issues that you describe.
It’s rare I have to charge away from home or work but when I do i never have a problem.
It’s also worth noting that the 100k miles to balance out the environmental impact of construction vs ICE is absolutely not the same across the board. For example, with the i3 the production process is one of the most environmentally friendly of any car. There’s also a lot of renewable backed energy suppliers (in addition to home generation) so it’s actually very easy to run an EV with clean energy.
I really respect your views on a lot of things but when it comes to EVs I just feel like there is a bias. There’s no denying that EVs are a stop gap, not end solution, but they are a far better stop gap than you suggest.
I don't agree Tom re you saying Sam's bias. I think quite the contrary. Sam had been plugging EVs from a couple years ago, discussing Formula E, even had on guests to discuss the topic fairly. I think he has been very pro EVs and only lately began to realise the limitations and a lot of the lies promoting them. In my view they're a fad. Thankfully for most of the world they won't take off for decades if ever.
Synthetic fuels are still the way to go, though.
And you can even make them carbon-negative by just simply pulling more CO2 out of the atmosphere than you need and storing the excess carbon.
Basically we've had the means to make all cars carbon-neutral and even carbon-negative (plus ships and planes) for how long? More than ten years I think.
And EVs are - in a way - one of the reasons synthetic fuels have a hard time to get traction. That's the sad truth.
It’s inexperience though. He’s trying, but he isn’t used to it. My experience now gets round lots of problems. There is no way I’d go to a charge site and not know what speed is available for example
@@vandit83 that’s a fair comment about charging.
Great Podcast, very relevant. As a petrolhead with an EV as my main car now I didn't change because I want to save the world because my one car over the lifetime I use it won't do that and few will likely follow the example I set if I were doing that. There are a number of flawed arguments on both the side of EV and ICE and a lot of 'apples vs. oranges' comparisons, as Tony eluded to, I look at EV as this decades Diesel / Unleaded / LPG / alternative fuel source with in some situations significant personal savings to be had, but it's not the sole solution for our collective futures.
My situation isn't applicable to all but here goes; I had an Audi RS7, my 4th Audi RS car because I like performance (subjective I know!) cars, but it was 7 years old and about to clock 100k miles, 65k of those I added. To / repair certain elements of it in the future would be huge sums, in some instances more than the car is worth if I continued to do the miles I did. I looked at a replacement RS6/7 and similar cars from other marques, then I looked at RS eTron GT and Taycan. Fortunate that I have my own company, the cost of the RS eTron GT I chose in the end due to tax breaks, is in my pocket, half the cost of the equivalent RS6/7 to lease. And that doesn't take into account there being no VED, that there's now no cost of oil and parts for servicing etc on an ICE car. Up until October 1st my running costs in terms of charging were about 1/5 vs what it cost to fill the RS7 based on last years petrol prices (more if comparing with the last 8-10 months), post October 1st with the electricity price increase its probably about a 1/3 to 1/2.
The number of people who come up to me and say 'oh my car / my van gets better range and costs less', or 'you should have bought a tesla because it does over 4 miles per kW' I didn't buy it to be the most cost / environmentally efficient car, I bought it as a replacement for a 700bhp+ sub 3 second 0-60 car that wasn't really a necessity either!
I regularly do 600+ mile round trips in it for business, only once have I ran so close that I had the dash light up like a Christmas tree because of how little charge I had. It's a different style of driving ownership too. Better to think wherever you stop, leave it charging. Not like a petrol station that you go out of your way to fill up. So when I'm shopping at the supermarket, its charging; go to the cinema / out with family, it can be charging; I even go out for exercise and drop the car off at a charging point so it charges whilst I'm active. And believe it or not there are still some free to use chargers if you can find them!
There are of course negatives. The infrastructure has a long way to improve in availability and reliability and here's one for Tony to fuel his conspiracy theory; part of the reason the UK Government isn't imposing windfall taxes on Shell, BP etc is that the country is flat broke for a myriad of reasons. To deliver the charging infrastructure needed for EV's is a huge cost. Shell etc. are advertising how they're helping improve the infrastructure for an EV future, why would they do that for a Government who constantly rapes them of their profits through windfall taxes? They're not doing this EV infrastructure roll out primarily to save the planet but they do have the money to do it and the Government repays them in stepping in where they can't by allowing them to charge what the hell they like which is the biggest detraction of EV ownership, its the automotive equivalent of PFI hospitals, schools and roads! But the metering of these chargers does need regulation and sharpish, as an example presently if you are using a 50kW public charger the unit cost can be anywhere from 27p to £1 per kW! That's worse than the mark up motorway petrol stations make compared to local stations!
In terms of charging itself, the whole "EV's are only good for round town commuting" is just bollocks. If you're doing a long motorway journey, the recommendation is that you should stop and rest / get out of your car and refresh every 2-3 hours. Most of these cars now have a 180-220+ real world range which even if you managed an average of 70mph on our crap UK motorway / road infrastructure for all of those 2-3 hours, is still less than the range of most of the cars, in theory. Reality is the majority of people ignore that recommendation but if you did take it on board, when you stop, put your car on charge, go get a drink, go to the toilet, come back and depending on what charger you use it is part of fully recharged. Few people drive around with a full tank of fuel in their car ALL of the time so why have to have a fully charged battery?
For Sam, it's a pity Mercedes and all the other manufacturers of EV's don't give you and other journalists what most new EV owners get, which is a subscription service RFID card or App which allows you to charge at a significant number of the UK charge network but at discounted rates. In my case Audi have the eTron Charging Service, no subscription for the first year, £250 free credit (in the US Audi give new owners a year free charging but that's another topic of debate entirely!) and discounted rates at nearly all chargers except BP Pulse (robbing ********ds). I saw James Martin (JayEmm on Cars) had the same in his RS eTron GT review when he was talking about charging. That would have made your life so much easier.
I do have an issue with the UK Government forcing us down this route; if the UK does this by 2030 and is the shining beacon showing the rest of the world the way forward does anyone really think the rest of the world will say, 'ooh, look at the UK, we should do that because it's the right thing to do!' I can see Putin saying that for sure! That's why most are being sheepish about COP26 in Egypt, few if any have done anything in the last 1-2 years because world economics is down the toilet and until that is fixed which it never will be, unfortunately greed, despite Greta's best intentions, will always preside over saving the planet. Between the top 1% of the worlds richest they could solve most of the global economic issues and finance the environmental recovery of our planet yet they don't, one could argue why should they? Instead they want to go to the Moon and Mars and **** up another planet so that they will be remembered in history!
Well said!
Another actual EV user speaking the truth. Instead of ‘it needs its battery changed every 10k’ or other such made up bollocks by people who don’t own them…
The elephant in the room is that we they will still need fossil fuels in order to build EVs, all the plastics, wiring loom plastics, rubber for tires; alongside side all the mining for lithium and cobalt. So in many ways building EVs will always be more polluting than a fossil fuel vehicle. So for me synthetic fuels not only keeps millions of vehicles on the road including all the lorries, trains, planes and shipping infrastructure, which is even more of a difficult nut to crack, in regards to emissions. Its a more realistic approach rather than scrapping the current infrastructure. Plus many people currently run cars that would of outlived the EV equivalent. Once an EV exceeds its highly valuable battery warranty, they are a potential financial time bomb for owners due to the expensive battery replacement. And this used car market are part of that 83% that just needs a car in order to live and earn a living. Great podcast
This was great. Exactly like the people in 1991 who said PCs would never catch because they cost £4k and what's the point because I can just send a fax. You guys are the only people in the world who don't seem to understand that new technology gets cheaper and better as time goes on
Dear Sam & Tony
(and dear subscribers who might read this),
Given all that you’ve talked through, I believe you’d love to see this video about EVs or at least a bit of it.
Just turn the subtitles on
(link is in the end of message).
Very fascinating story about moving from horses to e-vehicles.
The guy talks about how the horses were removed by a lot of fuel alternatives (whales fat I believe) even before the oil and petrol was discovered.
And then crashes the “greenery” of electric cars, the electricity which is produced for them, the losses on transportation of the electricity and how soils suffer due to the power plants, crashes the dirty mining of battery components and how they are not recyclable AT ALL, how people in these mines are treated and how those batteries will poison our planet for thousands of years.
Then, e-vehicles still need to be produced which is not carbon neutral.
And then it’s just the cars, just imagine how much power banks, laptops, phones and etc are produced with the same dirty methods.
I mean nothing here is about carbon emissions at all, it’s a global game to secure car manufacturers to still produce and earn their share.
And the new global market split to flow all the cash from oil to electricity. I suppose, to secure oil and petrol stock is enough to still supply military and etc.
I’m gutted about all of this.
I hope you guys succeed and your agenda will be heard and well received, cause you’re doing the right thing.
Keep it up and believe in yourself more, Sam, you’re no longer a bad informed enthusiasts, but a voice to be heard in the nearest future.
czcams.com/video/_HbEl-2n5AQ/video.html
Please ask your fellow CZcamsrs with a platform to spread the word on synth fuel. We need to show the options to the public and get people talking. Plus with Audi and Porsche entering F1 they will need to use this technology.
Regarding more CO2 emissions in a Ferrari vs a Polo: the more fuel per km you burn, the more CO2 you emit. But that doesn't mean there was more CO2 emitted per liter of fuel. If you put 10L of synth fuel in them and drive them until they're both empty, they will have emitted the same amount of CO2. But the Polo will have driven further.
Just to push back a little bit, cars using synthetic fuels are still vastly less efficient than electric cars. Take for example that you create 100 kW from solar. Of that, electric car uses 85-90% of it to move. To create synthetic fuels, you lose some energy in fuel production and ICE uses only 25% of that energy to move (other goes to heat). That would mean that for 100 kW you can move 4 electric cars for the price of one ICE.
I know that I am generalizing and that there are a lot of other things to factor in (how much CO2 and water does battery production take, logistics of transporting energy, serviceability, infrastructure, longevity, ...). Governments should take more holistic approach to solve this problem. No one solution is going to fit everywhere. A great way of thinking would also be more public transport (trains) and cycling/e-bikes. When talking about mobility we are very car-centric, not taking into account that city planning can also reduce a lot of CO2 emissions with changes to zoning, building local corner stores etc. thus reducing the need to drive. The Smoking Tire had a fantastic podcast with Selika Talobtt about mobility and electrification for anyone interested.
When it comes to electric, people also need to take into account commercial uses, where vehicles and machines need to run for as long as possible, minimizing downtime. With batteries that is really hard. Harry Metcalfe visited JCB in one of his videos where they talked about why they are taking the hydrogen way.
As petrolhead I hate that Elon introduced Model S right when dieselgate happened so everyone jumped on EVs as being the only solution to pollution. Governments started pushing this agenda too hard because it was a trend at the time but they aren't actually fixing the problem. Norway (I think) had really big subsidies for EVs and was pushing for the electrification, but now they are actually rolling back their programs, because they have seen that it wasn't that effective after all.
I’m waiting on delivery of a bmw i4. The main reason I went Ev again is the deal was too good through my employer. I did look at golf r estates etc but the running costs were going to be too high for my circumstances. I charge at home on a cheap rate which most EV owners will surely do. Agree with sam and Tony. The government need to widen the discussion on this to not just have EVs as the solution as clearly they aren’t right for all people.
We will still need oil for the tyres on electric cars, oil based products that make electrical components. The idea of electrical cars as a zero carbon once being driven is also a stretch.
I bought an EV from a financial point of view. The fuel savings I have made v my previous diesel is £0000's (because I charge at home!). Not pumping out exhaust fumes outside local schools is an added benefit.
This podcast, combined with your video on the synthetic fuel being used in the 360, is an absolute triumph in the face of the ignorance we’ve continued to see surrounding electric vehicles for the masses. That may sound like a dramatic comment, but the fact that the movement to save the environment and the planet has not led us first to solutions like synthetic fuel is beyond me. We should be doing everything we can to “reduce, reuse, and recycle”, as has been taught to us for many decades now. Logically, this must include the idea of buying used, ICE powered vehicles instead of brand new vehicles (whether electric or ICE powered), and finding ways to keep those vehicles on the roads and relevant. The fact that synthetic fuels could make all combustion engines carbon neutral IMMEDIATELY, and yet the governments (including here in the States) and many of the activist groups of the world are not pushing this as a solution is deeply saddening to me. Please continue to spread the word and educate people on this topic, because with your influence, you may be able to make a true difference! Cheers to both of you guys for this candid chat.
Hey, you guys are classic. Tony's comment about only buying an EV when you need to, it's so correct! If I had access to Shell or BP to buy synthetic fuel, or any other gas station, I would do so. Without any doubt in my mind. If everybody had access to this fuel today, the world would stand still. Then we could concentrate all of our money and research on cleaning the air that we all breathe.... Let's enjoy the cars we love .... Regards from Spain, Reni 🍷🍷
I wonder how much synthetic fuel will be when it is in full production. Shell/BP etc will want a return on their investment whilst not impacting on the fortunes they are making in profit right now
@@philhartley7551 That is very true, I think when it is in full production, with the green power they will have to produce, I think they will still be in profit, but much lower than they have now. Did you see the profits today on the news??? Thanks for the comment... 🍷🍷
I think you’re absolutely bang on with what you are saying. We are of course all bias towards keeping the combustion engine going. The problem we face is that people who have control and push a narrative often times COULD benefit themselves financially by making deals such as for the push for electric vehicles. We as petrol heads are not against EVs, the majority of the population that drive cars would most likely not have an issue with just owning electric cars. The fact of the matter is, is that the infrastructure isn’t there, if there is a carbon neutral way (which you have proven) to use fossil fuels, then it’s clear that it’s not in place to “save the environment”, it’s so frustrating being in a system
With the build being delayed, you may as well explore the option whether it’s possible to change it to a Touring? 41:56 the CO2 emission is irrelevant between your 360 and a smaller car because it’s “CO2 produced in grams per km driven” so yours will use more fuel per km driven than a 1.0L anyway so the emissions is a constant stat
Good afternoon Sam. Congratulations to getting 52,000 Subscribers! Hope you are doing well. I watched your 360 with synthetic fuels. I found it very interesting and amazing. I agree about the electric vehicles and what you are saying. I also think hybrids are getting much better 60 miles an electric charge. Fantastic for just going round town in case of the Mercedes and the new range Rover plug-in hybrid. P510e absolutely brilliant. Keep up the great work. Love your podcast fantastic thank you very much
Tristan
Thank you guys! You have covered every EV point I have tried to educate people on over the years working at dealerships and now the general public when they talk to me (a car guy) I remember we replaced 3 batteries on brand new Volvo's inder warranty before being delivered new to the customer (scary thought!) And at $45,000 aud a pop I hear these are on the more affordable end of the scale from what other manufacturers charge
Doesn’t the production of the fuel rely on power from the grid, which as you have used in the argument against electric cars is mostly by gas at the moment?
Depends where you are. Scotland has a lot more renewables
Ev is not for everyone. For me it’s amazing.
I’ve got a Tesla model 3 and do 30k miles a year. I charge for free every day in the town where I stay. It saves me a fortune.
I bought an Ioniq 5 earlier in March this year. I was coming from a Golf GTI Clubsport which was costing me €85 a week to fill and that was before fuel prices went crazy.
It has the 58kW battery so on my night rate, it would cost me roughly €7.75 to fully charge it from empty (which it usually never is) which gets me realistically 300km or so. I was looking at Golf GTDs but currently that would cost me €100 to fill the tank for 700-750km realistically. So even fully charging the car three times for the same range, is a fifth of the price.
I'm under no illusion that EVs are any better for the environment or what have you. I bought it because it made sense at the time in terms of running costs, tax, insurance etc.
The big question is to assess the carbon consumption/reuse considering the full full full lifecycle of the car (car/battery production, minerals extraction, electricity production, car/battery dismantling, recycling, etc.).
So, THE SCIENCE!:
There was some confusion about whether synthetic fuel was "as carbon-neutral" in some cars as others. Any emissions coming from a combustion engine come from the fuel, emissions aren't magically generated out of thin air just because the engine is less efficient. So yes, a less efficient engine (Sam's 360) will produce more CO2 since it burns fuel at a faster rate, but if the carbon in the fuel is got from, for example, captured CO2, all this CO2 is is carbon-neutral.
Also, hybrid cars are basically the worst of both worlds not the best. They have lithium batteries which we know are bad for the environment due to the mining, and also have any carbon footprint associated with producing an ICE car. Furthermore, they have a small battery pack so can't go very far whilst emitting zero CO2, then when the ICE is needed, it wastes some of its power output on accelerating a heavy MGU and battery pack, meaning more fuel is burned.
Sam you need to look at the ability to produce synthetic fuels in the amounts that would be needed. Producing the fuel is the issue. I completely agree with you and your co-host about the EV etc but I believe the biggest issue with synthetic fuel is producing the volume of the fuel.
I would assume we can say the exactly same thing about the electricity made in volume! One more reason we need that discussion on all options possible needed to work in conjunction!
Also the efficiency of using the power system to distribute energy vs massive fuel trucks is way more efficient once set up (which is currently in progress). Combine that with charging at home with solar and a home battery, it's a no brainer for the EVs (except for special v12s, vintage cars, etc)
@@Habdabi Strong point, however, thats the point Sam and Tony talked about, only for those that can charge at home, can be worthwhile to have the EV, but that's it! only fo those that have a reliable and close access can think of having one, making it a niche!
Only people who don't have an EV have range anxiety. Some countries are better than others but I live in the Netherlands and long trips are no problem. I have charged from 10% to 50/60% in 10 to 13 min with range of 250km. I would also stop for 15/ 20 min with an ICE car and get a coffee or take a piss. I leave my home with 100% charged with solar panels. But for most people EV's only work if you can charge at home. Synthetic fuels are not the future IMO. ICE cars will be a hobby in 20 years I think like horses are today.
Or they just hate change.
Regarding the Carrera T, Tony can not fathom, that there are Porsche Fans who actually have an upper limit on spending - 'just get a gt3' - if it was only that easy 😄
There's a reason major manufactures are or have already left Formula E and migrating to F1. F1 are already using synthetic fuels. The rush to buy the first dedicated marketed synthetic fueled hybrid supercar will be the game changer.
Love the new intro!
Glad to see you've listened to the feedback and dropped the (spammy) shorts, even though you were adamant you wouldn't 👍🏻
If you ever do another Q&A or would like to talk about this here are some questions I have: Why are many car collections being sold?
Do the owners of these cars still own other, better cars that aren’t being sold? Will this trend of collections being sold continue?
Probably not a case of more collections being sold but more social media has meant mere mortals are more aware of it when it happens
What collections are you seeing being sold? (Genuinely curious)
@@Gotadime92 Pajamas is right, if you follow certain channels collections that have been twenty thirty years in the making are being sold off in one go. Not to take anything from this channel but just look at Kidd in a sweet shop last few clips on Sotheby’s behalf. It’s about a eighteen Car twenty plus million minimum private collection now for sale and I’ve noticed a good few.
@@SWR112 Cool, I'll check that out. I'd assume this is a sell-off before the recession really sets in for your average person. Smart money has been getting out for nearly a year now. The collector car market was (and still is) very overheated, and is correcting (if not crashing, TBD). Likely won't see growing values for a few years to come, aside from a few outliers. Just my opinion though.
I think a majority of EVs are to company employees wanting to reduce their BIK.
... I'm talking about, I'm talking about ... You don't know what you're talking about.
Tony. You're the man.
Just discovered I’ve got to to do a 220 mile journey in my EV tomorrow to get to Sheffield for 9am as my ICE car wont be fixed at the garage until Monday now ! Gonna be stressful !
I am moving back from EV to petrol - the gap between the 2 are now closer than ever with Elec prices going up and price of the elec car in the first place. As a business owner it still makes some sense with the BIK in the UK - but they are pretty emotionless.. 100% EV points are getting busier, I've had Tesla and Porsche for the last 3 years. Tesla have nailed it on infrastructure but not on car quality. Porsche are the other way round! Great chat lads..
It’s not that close. I pay 7.5p per kWh, to match petrol it needs to be 68p per kWh. Unless people just look for the most expensive way to charge…
Don't forget the emissions that are created making the existing fuel we use.
41000 miles in an eTron over 20 months, best car I have had, electricity costs me 7.5p per kW at home and 27p per kW at Ionity (public charging). Yes, I have had some charging issues on long trips but NEVER has this put me off driving this car. On long trips, I prefer it over my V8. Home charging is not BP pulse, home charging is something like Octopus Go. I have saved a fortune on fuel, over those 20 months, a lot in BIK, no congestion charge, no road tax and a significantly lower corporation tax bill for year one. Don't pretend you are not EV bashers, you are. Limited knowledge, limited experience and limited vision. A tank full of fuel (21.1 gallons) in an AMG 65 S class will probably cost you around £190 (assuming you don't use premium fuel, which you probably would if you have an AMG 65) and, according to MB, you get around 16mpg so that's 336 miles on a tank, at motorway pricing, You should get around 3 miles per kW in an EQS, so for 336 miles electricity prices would need to be £1.70 per kW to break even. if you paid that, you're more of a fool than i thought. Tonys' suggestion that you should only buy an electric car when you have to, means you will most likely lose out on the financial benefits that we get NOW, as they won't be here forever.
Sounds great.....until the BIK is no longer an incentive, congestion charge becomes a 'use of vehicle charge' and electric costs more than fuel
@@dommo9056 Fair enough but in the meantime, I'm saving a fortune!
@@dommo9056 whatever makes you feel better. I’ll keep saving thousands of pounds a year (and for the last 5!)
Also, green electricity is almost not existing, solar panels and windmills take soooo much emission to build, and solar panels being hard to recycle the electricity being put in the electric car is 50 shades of grey
Have an 8 year old Tesla model s, hasn’t lost any range after 60k miles. charge at my house, regularly get 200 miles on a charge . It’s perfect for me and the family day to day and mega cheap to run.
Guys, I love the podcast and I'm as big a car enthusiast as you can find (I drive a 997, an NSX and a BAC Mono) but I have to break it to you that I'm afraid you have jumped the shark with this episode promoting Synthetic fuels as the saviour of ICE cars.
Yes Synthetic fuels are carbon neutral in that they are created by sequestering carbon dioxide. It therefore does matter how efficient or not the petrol car is, it's carbon neutral.
Or is it?
Where does the electricity come from to produce the synthetic fuel? Currently the UK grid emits around 213g of CO2 for every kWh produced, and this is with around 1/2 coming from renewables and 20 % from Nuclear. Gas obviously emits CO@, but did you know that actually wind power and solar also release CO2? It's the CO2 released in making the equipment amortised over it's lifespan. Wind power is pretty good producing 4g CO2/kWh bu solar is not, and produces around 70g/kWh, mainly from the environmental cost of producing the panels which don't last forever. So you need to factor this in to the synthetic fuel mix. Producing fuels from UK electricity just doesn't make sense at the moment. We would need to produce them entirely from wind or nuclear (not solar - see above) to have any hope of efuels being environmentally sound.
There's also the fact that producing synthetic fuels is about 4 times less efficient than just using the electricity to power an EV, you consume vast amounts of electricity to produce the fuel which you then burn at 30% efficiency in an engine. It may be carbon neutral (actually it's not- see above how the electricity used to produce it always involves some CO2 release) but it is desperately inefficient and it is therefore very unlikely that we would be able to build enough renewable power generation to replace all of our fossil fuel use. If fusion ever became practical then it might be feasible but that is still on the distant horizon.
For the same reason hydrogen fuel cells don't really make sense, the losses in creating the hydrogen are too great, and even though the fuel cell is much more efficient than burning efuel in an ICE, it's still much better to just use the electricity to power en EV.
There may be a place for fuels in niche applications such as long haul aviation, shipping etc (possibly motorsport but surely motorsport would want to be mirroring what the general public can relate to and go electric?) but for general motoring, not a chance I'm afraid. I guess it's possible that fuels might be sold (presumably at a high cost) to allow classic cars to continue running but it's never gong to be mainstream I think.
Anyway love the show and enjoy your ICE cars while you can, I certainly intend to keep mine as long as possible.
I'm guessing you guys are unaware of the existence of the Dacia Spring. 10k electric city car with four doors. Neat.
Interesting maths by Tony. 83% of consumers don't know what car they want. 13% do know what car they want. What about the other 4%? 😂
He makes it up as he goes along.
One reason manufacturers don’t like EVs is that they don’t require as much maintenance- it’s the reason ICE was promoted over EVs from the beginning
£160,000 - 100% tax deductible, proper EV's like the taycan EQS etc wont make sense to non business owners / company car drivers until they hit the second hand market. Emission's I agree alot of electricity is made from gas and the raw materials are bad etc, but think about where those emissions are. They are in power stations in the middle of no where, or mines in the outback. Not coming out of the exhaust outside a school. Baby steps mate
So what about the areas of the world where lithium is mined? Those local communities and environments will be massively harmed, if not destroyed. Just because that is not by your local school, that’s ok? How is that helping the world as a whole?!
@@abagley2334 - You can’t help the world in one swoop, there aren’t schools next to lithium mines. Fix the tail pipe emissions, then onto power generation and transition into solar / wind / nuclear and then maybe mines but the reality is we are always going to mine, we are always going to need oil and always going to need gas. Pick the battles, take the wins
@@futurefuelsgroup8073 I understand the premise.
So ‘taking a win’. That’s prioritizing the local air quality, where the EV car is operated, over other peoples health you don’t have to see.
As long as people are aware of this.
Creating millions, billions of EV’s will have massive consequences to other fellow members of this planet. That’s not a win for them.
I agree with you mate, short term goals cleaner air in densely populated areas. Long term goal clean air everywhere. How we get there I don’t know. You are 100% right about the people who live near mines etc. how do we control that? Well it should be done by local government, let’s be honest in those countries they don’t really give a shot they just want money. It will come down to us the consumer to hold manufacturers to account and make them prove how they are controlling their supply chain and managing the impact
One of the main problems with e fuels is efficiency. It takes a lot of energy to extract carbon from the air and make hydrogen from the process of electrolysis. Only about 10% of the energy makes it to the wheels of the car.
Lots of Porsches being delayed by supply problems with the Bose sound option and it's been taken off many the configurators.
Agree 1000% on this narrative that’s forced on us to go out and buy an electric car. Almost shaming people for not having electric. It’s ridiculous. Fingers crossed that synthetic fuel becomes the norm.
Hey guys loved this episode especially since you were bashing EV's ❤️
Just wanted to let you know that the EV push is only in the EU and UK. Literally in almost every other country in the world there is no push towards EV's because every where else the countries generally make money from fossil fuels unlike the EU and UK.
They just want to control and get the money that the fuel companies are making by converting everyone to EV's which means the government makes the money not the fuels companies.
Unfortunately all the amazing cars are produced in the EU which is why everyone even cares about the EV mandates. In the US there absolutely 0% chance for them to go fully EV even though they talk about it sometimes
I owned a Taycan Turbo for 6 months and loved it! I didn’t buy it for being green, I bought it because it’s a 600hp 4 door car that can be written off on my business. Even took it on a track day and it was so much fun despite it being so heavy.
Electric is great if you don’t do more than 200 miles a day, can charge at home and even better if you have solar panels. But unfortunately that just doesn’t suit most people.
I only kept the car 6 months because it mainly sat on the drive and realised 130k to sit on my drive is abit excessive.
One thing to remember with high priced EVs is they are 100% tax deductible if purchased through a business which majority in Uk will be, makes the value proposition completely different vs an ICE equivalent
Yes , but the subject is about buying them as personal cars , not a bussiness ...
Heck, almost every big brand luxury/sports EV Car, is owned by a company or is a company car, exactly for those reasons you say...
But normal people can't deduct the taxes ...
As this segment proves, range is the wrong lever to pull, get a 100 miles charge down to 5 minutes and 99.9% of use cases are covered and youve achieved petrol parity.
I’ve got a Tesla Model Y. Because of the Tesla supercharging network (at least like 12 chargers at each) in a lot of areas down south, and at most service stations around the country, INCLUDING normal charge points. I never worry. If I was to rely on just the normal ones I’d worry because typically there’s at most 4 at each of them, and its 50/50 that you’d have to wait.
He’s right it’s about £50 full charge at the moment. But before energy increase around a month ago it was £30 full charge.
Totally agree missed this point altogether
Love the pod cast but Sam and tony are ev haters. They should do an ev special with ev owners.
@@benrobertson3624 That dont need to travel a 1000 miles a day to sell cars or record road trips
Its about individualisation, everyone will find a solution that suits them. Some people want to be deprived of all thrills others are junkies for it. unfortunately, the truth is we all love convenience and not everyone will take the time to figure out what's most efficient for them.
You only touched on it briefly, but the BIGGEST benefit to synthetic fuels by far is the ability to power planes and ships. A Boeing 747 creates as much C02 per mile as an electric car saves in its entire lifecycle. PER MILE? Why are we not doing this?!?
Combustion engine cars were not great in the beginning as well. EVs are still in the infancy stage, improving each year Eventually there will be battery technology breakthrough. However I am all for synthetic fuels. There is space for both.
Tony is spot on about the EVs. Thy work for some people but not everyone.
Living with a EV in Sweden(small market I know) is great. There are fast chargers along every road, almost every petrol station. The driving experience is fantastic(driveability, comfort, tech). And the grid electricity is almost all fossil free in Sweden so the carbon break even is much closer to 50 000 km than 100 000 km. But if we cant have fossil free electricity than we cant create fossil free synthetic fuels like you said. So then the efficiency of the EV(95%) compared to max 50% of the combustion becomes very important. Power/Electricity is expensive all around Europe at the moment which makes it a massive waste to burn fuel.
The cost to drive the same distance would be 100% larger for the synthetic fuel since it uses double electricity to produce the same energy content. One could argue that using a powerplant to directly charge an EV is better compared to making power thats get used in a synthetic fuel plant to make fuels. A fuel which is transported(hopefully fossil free) to a vehicle which then uses that fuel with 50% efficiency.
Dont get me wrong, I want both to succeed. That would be the only way. We need different systems at different places and in different situaitons.
Ive had a ford mache for 12 months and love it--have done 10000 this yr--although i rarely drive ore than 200 mikes a yr so have only had to charge it outside the house a few times--very pleased with the experience. Other reason for buying it is that I have my own business and virtually all of the £60k price was tax deductible in yr 1…….Although I love more my 488 Spider….
Thanks for pointing out what I've been trying to say for ages now about the use of synthetic fuels. its important to get it out there and the benefits of using it, we should be focusing on putting our efforts of producing the fuel more then anything else we already have everything here to use it like you've said. plus we have over 100 years of the combustion engine I don't see it getting beat anytime soon, it just works too good. thanks the great video
I think you and Tony are forgetting that most EV drivers (myself included) are doing so because of cost. I really don’t think about the environment when driving my ID4 around, but do think about the fact that it costs me less than a third of the amount compared to an ICE to run. And it’s incredibly quiet and refined to drive. Uber relaxing.
You also have to remember that most people don’t buy their EV’s they lease so who cares how much it costs to buy. Strong residuals (atm) mean cheap lease deals. And for me and I suspect thousands of others the almost zero benefit in kind taxation means as a company car (such as a staff lease car scheme) it’s a no brainier. No deposit, insurance/servicing/maintenance included for £320/month and only £5 to fully charge (on octopus go tarif or £15 normally) and a 300 mile range.
And yes you do really need a home charger to make it work so for people like me who have one (as most EV drivers do I reckon - if you can’t have one don’t get an EV atm) it’s a much cheaper driving proposition. And the instant torque off the line makes pulling out at roundabouts etc a pleasure.
Id4 owner here. Couldn't agree more. A few people in my circle are anti EV but I notice they are the people who change their minds very quickly about cars and what they say one month will be different the next. I think anyone who bought an EV in the last two years knows a lot more than a lot of these claimed petrol heads and has actually done their homework on ownership. A few family members slated my wife and I for buying an ID4. They spouted the usual nonsense but 6 months later they are moaning about fuel costs. They just don't like change but in a few years we all know they will be in an EV.
I 100% agree that if synthetic fuels can keep us carbon neutral then the entire shift should be to synthetic fuels using internal combustion engines. Electric is cool, but I believe in the long run we are going to look dumb thinking this was a good idea seeing how it's more environmentally disastrous than ICE. Keep up the good work man, but for God's sake can we please get the F1 podcast back? are you and Paul on the outs?!
1) UK Electricity generation is about 50% renewable. The point is the % renewables is increasing - your ICE car is not going to improve it's fuel efficiency.
2) break even point for additional CO2 used to generate battery varies depending on grid mix. Norway 8K miles, UK about 15K miles. This ignores the fact that ICE car produces emissions for the life of the car ie it burns stuff plus there is the cost of actually creating the fuel and getting it to you
3) EV prices are too high, but maintenance costs as lower (not many moving parts). Interestingly residuals of EVs seem to be holding up better than ICE (no doubt due to the transitions to EV's that's happening regardless).
4) If can't charge from home, UK charging infra is not upto scratch, unless of course you drive a Tesla then the issues you have had don't really exist.
Synthetic fuels are a stupid idea - OK no more CO2, what about all the other emissions NOx, particulates etc - CO2 kills the planet, the other emissions kill people.
Love your content but burning shit to move stuff around is not the answer. EV and it's infra agreed is not where it needs to be but it's only going to be better
1) On 25th October, it was 54% gas according to National Grid monitors: twitter.com/mygridgb/status/1584987372218974238?s=46&t=ZC9ngnOYDL8fxdZQnfUf1w
2) We speak to a global audience but I believe the Volvo study which we reference, used the EU-28 mix, as well as global electricity mix, and the break even points were 77k kms and 110k kms.
3) Most ICE cars are now offered with maintenance packs meaning little to no costs for first few years of ownership. Maintenance on an older cheap car can still be cheaper for 2-3 years, than the higher initial cost of buying an EV
Finally, P1 fuels are currently awaiting final stats on their product but it contains less sulphur, soot etc and is expected be cleaner than Euro6 norm. The benefit of synthetic is you can reduce/change other components, not just the fossil fuel. Many possibilities.
As we said, the best way forward is probably going to be a mix of various solutions but people need to also open their eyes to the potential negatives of a mass switch to EVs
@@BehindTheGlass Sigh. I was quoting the average EV mix over a year (it was 20% renewables in 2010). Additionally you might want to have another look at that Volvo report that at best was flawed at worst deliberately misleading and is often used in the 'EV's terrible' argument - personally think EV costs and infra failings are big enough sticks for you to bang your ICE drum without quoting flawed science.
While we are at it can we bring back gas lights, not too sure this electric light thing is going to catch on 😁
You need to own and run an electric car to fully understand, I’ve added one to my line up of cars purely as a commuter but intrigued to see if it ever gets used instead of the other vehicles when not commuting.
My main problem with synthetic fuels is when they use food to make fuel.. that’s not sustainable as well.. the main thing is, driving less, taking trains and boats etc. But yeah synthetic fuels are not working when they come from sources that are polluting as well or from food, and then we would have to go vegetarian all because there’s not enough food to feed the poultry and cows..
We don’t use food, we use biomass waist.. so second generation biomass. Exactly because we do not want the discussion food or fuel
I thought the UK government is talking about rolling power cuts because we don’t have enough electricity? So how we gonna charge all our electric cars
When are we getting the merch with Tony dressed up as a general with the words "in general" and a Porsche?
hybrid is still okay, as long as in the form engine iam on it, i think in future also maybe the ICE needed of MHEV due to start-stop; that would be good to fuel saving together fueled synthetic also with hydrogen (engine/hybrid and fuel cell) form as well.
An EV is only zero carbon if the electricity it uses is also zero carbon. The marginal electricity generation usually comes from burning gas.
I completely agree with you guys, but one devils advocate point you forgot is Company car tax. An EQS is 2%, whereas an S Class will be 38-odd %. MASSIVE difference.
I’ve just bought a CLA hybrid. 45k car costing me 114 a month.
Play the game and beat the government at it while we still can!
About the GT3 delay. Don’t forget it’s a GT product and a really costly one so you might as well get the level of client experience you deserve. It’s not only that you need it for the channel, you’re also a client that is about to spend a big amount of cash.
As the main argument against EV is how its made and 100k miles deficit. It would be interesting to know how big a dent could be made on the 100k miles deficit by using renewable fuels to make EV's?
From a current Diesel car owner, who has an EV on order’s perspective- for me the change was zero to do with the environment, an EV on lease through salary sacrifice is good value, as will be home changing.. please don’t assume EV drivers are all about the environment, not always so 👍
Mercedes have rightly screwed it with their EV naming scheme.
They have the EQE and EQS which are the electric versions of the E-Class and S-Class but then the SUV versions are called 'EQE SUV' and 'EQS SUV' instead of having 'GL' in the same which they always did for their SUVS.
Then they have the 'EQA' which is an EV version of the GLA, so what do they call the EV A-Class? Similarly, the EQB is based on the GLB and not the B-Class. It's just massively confusing for 99% of people.
I own a Mercedes EQA, I chose that after testing petrol equivalents. The reason for buying it was not to become greener but purely I prefer the way electric vehicles drive to combustion engines. I would never go back. I think a lot of the time you are missing the point of electric vehicles, sometimes people buy them simply because they like the way they drive compared with Combustion. So their higher pricing becomes irrelevant then.
So true. They are much nicer to drive. Tony and Sam are spoilt you see.
@@pato10111 Thanks for agreeing. At last someone on my wavelength.
That’s also the reason for me getting the E-tron, the next one is gonna be E-Tron GT, EV is a Perfect Daily if you don’t do more than 300km/day. This doesn’t need to be right for everybody, but it works well for me.
The problem with synthetic fuel is that the energy used to sequester the carbon for the fuel is often not green energy, so it still has a negative carbon footprint overall. However, that is changing. Personally I think we're jumping on the EV bandwagon too early.
Interesting chat and good to see Twiggy back on the channel!
Just to add my two pennies worth. I was looking to go full electric for my company car. I currently have a plug in hybrid (passat GTE), but now ive looked into it more and for reasons you have already said today, I'm sticking with the PIH option. Not sure what just yet, but i'm not going full electric. It just doesn't make sense too!! Great episode again fella's.
I’m guessing the reason for us not using synthetic fuel , it’s because the crops that are used to make it we need for food ( and the world is struggling for food )
is synthetic diesel a thing?
It seems to be being developed by at least Audi and and MAN mention it about powering Ships etc.
I never believed on EVs. Period. We’re under so much propaganda for electric cars that it is becoming border less sickening. Problem is so many big manufacturers have invested so much that they can hardly turn around now.
i still remember the big discussions when lead in fuel was being phased out and owners , myself included would carry an additive in the car to drop into the fuel when filling up. Eventually when engines were rebuilt and hardened valves added the additive became redundant. I have never owned a diesel car or a 100% electric car but i do use the wifes new yaris GR sport hybrid , which replaced her other yaris hybrid. A brilliant car with a great gearbox and no need to plug in, the wife gets better fuel consumption than me with my lead foot , but what a car. I did own last year for about 3 months a demo car range rover vogue p400 plug in hybrid, though i still love the shape the plug in part and the cars awful gearbox was too much for me and i sold it. Replaced it with a gorgeous 2002 L322 range rover overfinch . This year i travelled by car ( AMG GLB35) approximately 4000km from Portugal along the spanish coast to Monaco and up to Switzerland before driving to the uk and back to Portugal, an impossible trip with an electric car on a time schedule.Fingers crossed synthetic fuel catches on and the economies of scale and the government make it a viable option for all us petrolheads.. for now i will continue to enjoy my classic and supercars with 98 octane ...great discussions Sam & Tony
Could you try to get Bjørn Nyland on your channel?
He’s massively into EVs and does very systematic testing and real world use of just about every EV on the market.
They wouldn't dare!
@@philhartley7551 Adam right he would destroy them 😁
The problem of synthetic fuels is that they use field that would be used to feed people. Every solution has a drawback
This is more like it boys , BANG ON IT