Thirty Years War - Famine - European History - Extra History - Part 3
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Many things added up to create the famine that swept through the Holy Roman Empire. The 1600s were naturally lean years, as the environment dropped 2 degrees. But things got much, much worse. Let's unpack the economics of the 1600s, how debasement worked, and how while people were eating their neighbors, noble families just got richer.
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Part 1 - Conquest - • Thirty Years' War - Co...
Part 2 - The 2nd Horsemen - • Thirty Years War - Th...
Part 3 - Famine - • Thirty Years War - Fam...
Part 4 - Death - • Thirty Years War - Dea...
Part 5 - Chaining the Dragon - • Thirty Years War - Cha...
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#ExtraHistory #ThirtyYearsWar #History
"Let's eat grandma."
"You forgot the comma."
"I wish I did."
Hi
Oh no
Sahrland™ extreme +
@@HogBurger
Oh yeah 🍷
UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Addendum: In 1696, Sir Isaac Newton was employed by the Royal Mint in England to develop ways of stopping people shaving and clipping coins. His solutions included adding small ridges to the rims of coin so users could tell if any metal was missing. You can see these on coins such as the US quarter, Euro 10c and British 5p.
Because of this, for centuries the rims of British coins were inscribed "DECUS ET TUTAMEN" meaning 'a decoration and a safeguard'
Clever.
@@pendragonxt3674 Another history video I watched (one of Lindybeige's iircs) explained that this took a while to come along because it's not difficult to do without the machinery needed to mill the coin, and hence not much way until then to prevent coin clipping.
Same with Roman Coins, which suffer debasement to the point that taxes have to be paid in metals and food, and even paid in land up front, after 3rd Century Crisis.
Hmmm I wonder if this has something to do with why almost all the types of coins in my country has a ridge
@@deanmilos4909 probably, although at this point I wonder whether that’s still a necessity or just decorative
“First came the Greycoats to eat all my swine,
Next came the Bluecoats to make my sons fight,
Next came the Greencoats to make my wife whore,
Next came the Browncoats to burn down my home.
I have naught but my life, now come the Blackcoats to rob me of that."
- Anonymous Poem from the 30 years war.
@@DieNibelungenliad sus
@@DieNibelungenliad big HMMMM
@@DieNibelungenliad you are aware it's a reference to "grape without the G"
Look up Japanese "comfort women" in ww2
@@michaelvnuk nice! I'd love to comfort some Japanese women if you know what I mean
@@DieNibelungenliad REALLY
think though that thought (not a good look)
It's amazing to think that such a devestating war is relatively unknown outside of the circles of History lovers.
Its very well known in Europe. Well central europe atleast.
@@kinetic2245 I was going to comment the same. Although I think that a lot of people aren't aware of the full scale of it. I for sure am learning quite a few new things
Yeah we covered it in 3rd year (at age 13) and in 5th year (at age 15)
US-centric history is the cause. For example, while everywhere else people call it the 7-yrs war, it is only in the US that people call it the French and Indian War. Or how the volatility of Balkan is often unrecognized in the US when it plays such a massive role in the course of European history.
It's not, in a survey in germany in the 60's a majority answered the 30 years war as the worst thing to have ever befallen the german people.
All I have to say is: The past was the worst, anyone who says they “miss the good old days” needs to learn about this period (or any other time in the past 400 years).
I live in a world of three layer toilet paper and broadband connections, hopefully my kids get to grow up in a world of four layer toilet paper, fiberoptic connections, and i can complain about how they got to grow up like even more sensitive little assholes than i was. Now that is progress.
@@erikrungemadsen2081
Ha!
@@erikrungemadsen2081 Get off your virtual reality brain implant, back in my day we just had smartphones.
@@erikrungemadsen2081 They probably won't use toilet paper anymore.
@@user-sf2if2df4n Maybe we will find out what the three seashells are for.
_Packs filled with steel and war, but nary a thought to the plow._
To fall for such a little thing... a bite of bread...
In Germany there is also the expression for cats:
"Dachhasen", which means something like: Roof rabbits.
Now you can guess where that comes from and why there is a law that slaughtered rabbits (as a whole) can only be sold with their heads on. ^^
In France, slaughtered rabbits could only be sold with their paws still attached.
Cats
Housing armies on civilians houses was one of the issues that led to the Catalonian revolution of the reapers.
Also included as the 3rd amendment in the US Constitution.
@@adampay8906 was going to comment something like this, there was a large number of german settlers in the US I wonder to what extent this conflict influenced the third amendment of the bill of rights.
and the american revolution aswell. it's generally a shitty thing to do to people.
@@cageybee7221 Yeah, this made me remember when the British housed soldiers into civilian homes in Boston.
Everybody was expecting Sabaton's "Lion from the North" to be the theme song for this series, but it seems that d'Artgnan's "Wallenstein", which mourns the famines and economic devastation of Wallenstein, fits more.
i just love how they are doing this by the four horsemen great way to talk about the thirty years war
+
I like to think the last year or so has given us all at least a slight appreciation for important things running out and leaving people in bad places 😟
The vaccination rate in my area is around 30% (with 0% of children vaccinated) and most people are running around without masks soooooo . . . nope!
Nope, I thrived in 2020 compared to years prior.
In Japanese history earthquakes were associated with wealth and opportunities for the poor and could reset the balance in a society. This is cause a rich person could lose a lot in a disaster cause they had a lot to lose. A man that had nothing had nothing to lose. When that rich person lost their home, the poor could find themselves employed in building a new home for that rich person. This not only was income but this allowed them so develop skills that they could get another opportunity with and so on. A master of their craft could have a disaster to thank their success for.
Things like pandemics show who the haves and have nots are, I was a have not until everyone decided to take a long vacation.
@@zenogias01 oh good for you
I only know two films that tackle this historical period: the last valley with michael caine and alatriste with vigo mortensen.
There’s film called the Germans but it’s in German
The Three Musketeers' many film adaptions are in that same period, just next country over.
Alatriste is more so the 80 Years War, so part of the same general European religious conflict, but very different in terms of warfare, politics, and impact
@@eliezertzaruri4389 true
@@eliezertzaruri4389 yes, though the ending battle is Rocroi, very distinctively part of the last phase of the 30 years war and not a Dutch conflict.
Geeze, is German bread being incredibly expensive, like, an omen of a huge war?
Food being expensive is generally an omen of a war.
Other way around. Great wars is an omen for hiked up prices on necessities, since long and hard wars mean that a large number of men will be unable to produce food and goods, while still requiring to be fed, equipped and paid, and while laying waste to production zones (farmlands and cities). Best case scenario that last one can be avoided, but that requires the commanders to be polite and honourable about their warfare.
In 1923, when a German bread costed quadrillions of Marks, we just had a huge war behind us.
But yes they basically did the same with paper money what they did with silver coins 300 years earlier.
@@helenanilsson5666 its dialectical, one reinforce the other - but increasing food prices can be caused by external factors… while war will cause the food prices to surge, rising food prices no matter the reason will allways spawn some form of conflict.
Stopped WW3 by feeding the Germans.
"The poor eating each other and the rich making more money." Some things never change, do they?
Your comparing people eating each other due to starvation and a lack of food to modern day wealth inequality
@@am-bushgaming4811 Because there still are people starving while the rich get richer.
Solution: eat the rich
@@am-bushgaming4811 It's still just a good metaphor for the poor fighting each other.
@@am-bushgaming4811 yes he is, so what? its still true as ever, as cannibalism as extreme measure of hunger still exists
"You have 8000 coins, then you have 10000 coins, an increase of 20%!"
Who did your math there...?
8000*1.2 = 9600
Presumably the math is off because they rounded up to keep the numbers nice and neat, but it could be a math error.
It's actually 25% of 8000...so...
maybe just gotten the numbers mixed up. 8000 is after all 80% of 10000 so from 10000 to 8000 you would get a decrease of 20%.
Math is sexy! Too bad I don't calculate well in my head. Still, point taken (swoons)
Familiar profile picture you had there.
I look around and see my home fade away
My time at home now feels far too short.
Just a youth, barely a man when duty called on me
If I ever see my home again
That I do not know
With kinsmen from my village
I went to war
And the world burned...
I prefer listening to the Swedish lyrics.
They should absolutely do an episode on Tamerlane
I would love to learn more about that part of the world. The middle east just disappears from the dutch curriculum after the crusades. And before that just the levant
AKA, Timur the lame
AKA, Timur the jerk
AKA, BAD NEWS
@@AegixDrakan no
@@mustafaardateker6004 Well, he is up there in terms of amount of people killed. I think fifth? After Stalin, Mao, Genghis Khan, and Hitler? So... I'd say he was bad news to his enemies.
@@syro33 Most of the killings from Genghis Khan came after his death so I feel that Tamerlane ranks higher on the genocidal maniac list
People: Literally eating each other
Extra Credits: How’s your phone bill doing?
Wipper refers to the movement a scale makes when weighing coins. Like a seesaw.
Kipper comes from the regional word of "kippen", which can be translated to sorting something. (we now use this word for piling some stuff up, like emptying a wheelbarrow for example)
Source: Wikipedia (and some common knowledge I guess)
whilst the explanation is decent you have to remember that the meaning of those words could have changed over time somewhat.
According to Wikipedia, Kipper is food -- specifically, a herring of some sort that's been cut in half, gutted, salted, and cold-smoked. And apparently, that's a breakfast food? That doesn't sound like something I'd wanna eat in the morning, myself.
So, now, I've learned something else today that was totally unrelated to the subject.
Interestingly this gives us two interpretations of "Kipper und Wipper"
1. "Clippers and scale" could refer to cutting metal off a coin and then weighing to see if the coins still weigh enough to pass the muster against non-debased coins.
2. "Sorting and weighing" could refer to the overall cycle that happened: debasers would make fake coins to be as close to the size and weight of real coins as possible without using much silver or gold, then exchange them for real coins that they'd melt down to debase. Both the debasers and anyone trying to determine if coins were debased or not would then have to weigh a set of suspect coins against a non-debased set of coins, sort them into groups to narrow it down, and then continue until they'd found every debased coin.
Kippen means tilt
was just wondering when the next ep would drop
Weekly series so next Saturday.
Ever Saturday
Normally Extra History episodes drop on Saturday's around 12:30 PM Central (UTC - 05:00 Summer / -06:00 Winter)
8,000 coins becoming 10,000 gives you a 25% increase, not 20%. Common mistake, but you gotta check that before recording.
Hilariously obvious bad math lmao.
historians, may or may not have picked an humanties major to stay away from all maths entirely.
"Looks like someone's on track to get a Playstation..."
Scalper: "Imma stop you right there"
wrong video?
I think the story of pied piper comes from these times. Cats and dogs disappear, rats get into food stores, that sort of thing. Then all the kids disappear...
Hey, they're just going to candy land!
No it’s from the 1300s
Reminds me of the Ankh-Morpork gold dollar...with the approximate gold content of seawater :P.
homeopathy but in coinage
"In Alsace the bodies of criminals were torn from the gallows and devoured; in the whole Rhineland they watched the graveyards against marauders who sold the flesh of the newly buried for food; at Zweibrucken a woman confessed to having eaten her child. In Fulda and Coburg and near Frankfurt and the great refugee camp, men went in terror of being killed and eaten by those maddened by hunger."
-C. V. Wedgwood's _The Thirty Years' War_
Greetings, Fellow youtuber stragglers surviving everything around us
Quite a stretch to believe we're surviving my cloud dude. But hey, nice seeing you.
@@OKingSizeTv Indeed, quite a stretch indeed, and nice seeing you too.
Hello Cloud friend! Thank you for the warm greetings. God bless you buddy.
@@Numba003 And may god bless you too!
Do a series about the Mexican war agnsit France
Username checks out!
@@giacomofasulo3861 thanks
Yes i wanna see this, a,ong with more stuff about mexico in general
Yes
@@neumo5005 thanks
Medieval Soldier: "Nice place you got hey I'm going to stay for as long as I feel like so."
“Nice food, would be a shame if someone was to eat it...”
And eat your food - and take any food and valuables you have left for the road. And that's a nice looking daughter you have ...
@@jonnunn4196 Exactly
The middle ages were long gone by that point. This was the early modern period
@@jonnunn4196 suddenly, being a medieval soldier doesn't sound so bad after all! Food, drink, lodging, a cozy bed, a fireplace, women of any age or size; and all I have to use is force!
"The biggest economic crisis in europe..."
* stares in Weimarer Republic *
that's a single country?
there's always bigger fish, and there was always a worse time.
“The rich getting richer” WOWW, whata surprise... not. Nothing’s changed to this day.
Just have to look at Biden and the Democrat party printing heaps of money.... they are debasing the currency right now in front of everyones eyes.... its why inflation has shot up in the last 2-3 months. Timber, meat, fuel, etc have all gone up heaps in price.
and then they lose thier heads
@@cubiusblockus3973 fact
@@cubiusblockus3973 Isn't the money printing part a method of the FED? The politicians have a rather small amount of influence.
BTW timber is not expensive because of devalued currency but because of high demand. Here in Germany, the construction companies complain that lumber mills export wood into the US to make more money.
@@derorje2035 lumber has been at 50 year high for value for almost a full year now in the US
Hey, I wrote my bachelor's thesis about this stuff (the debasing of Roman coin in the third century AD to be precise). Love to see it getting some love here in a slightly different context
Few things sound so desperate as quite literally having all of your food taken. I can’t imagine being the man attempting to convince my family to try eating grass to supplement our lack of food.
Stay well out there everybody, and God bless you friends. :)
Absolutely wild that it took until Frederick the Great in the mid 1700s to go "Huh. Maybe we should store food reserves in case something bad happens? Let's do that."
It's wild and sad, but not necessarily surprising. The level of state power needed to both compel the extra production of grain and then acquire the extra grain for the state only was starting to coalesce in the Early Modern Period (very roughly end of the Hundred Years War to the fall of the Bourbons). You can see it in Rome, with expansive trade networks funneling grain from Egypt, Spain, and North Africa into Italy, then collapsing with the Crisis of the Third Century, then re-emerging to feed Constantinople by Justinian's time, then failing again with the Plague of Justinian. You have a similar issue in China with the "ever-normal granaries" reliant on moving agricultural excesses around using the Grand Canal, when Imperial power waned, the Canal waned with it, only to be restored with a new Dynasty.
Food was always stored in granaries and cottages though for thousands of years.
The problem is that it does no good if a bunch of mercenaries come over and take it or if it runs out before the coming harvest because the last harvest was poor.
I Have a good Idea, Extra Credits and Oversimplified do a history compilation video.
Hell no that's an awful idea!
Sir...you are a genius.
Anyone else catch the venture bros reference? Eat the pennies billy.
I was just thinking that too. Billy Quiz Boy should be very afraid.
St. Cloud!!!!!!!
Billy, eat the damn pennies!
8:42 We keep saying "eat the rich" and we all just end up eating each other.
I hope this series isn’t just going to be 4 parts for the horsemen since the war has planets of material and usual series are 5 episodes and sometimes 6.
5th one will be "and hell followed after"
@Sara but the war episode already happened...
Germany and hyperinflation, name a more iconic duo
Ireland hearing about famine: "First time?"
Wasn't the Irish genocide two centuries later?
@@Punaparta 1845-1860 (stretching the end a bit).
Awh man, I hope you will one day go further into the details of the war -Such as the Bohemian Phase, Danish Phase, Swedish and lastly the French phase of the Thirty Year War. There are so many details and stories you can talk about.
Still, I think you do well right to talk about the idea of the Horseman of the Apocalypse theme of the Thirty Year as a humanitarian disaster, which it truly was and would have severe consequences for centuries to come.
I love your channel!
Please make a series on the Dacians=))
Who are the Dacians?
@@pendragonxt3674 The Dacians were the ancestors of the present day Romania before they were defeated by the Romans in 2 very interesting wars.
Great video!
I really love getting into the nitty-gritty political and economic details like this.
Math lies: "You have 8000 coins then you debase them and now you have 10000 coins. You just upped your assets 20%"
This is obviously not true as its actually a 25% increase. A 20% increase from 8000 coins would be 9600 coins.
I thought this was important as many views might not be well versed in math and get confused.
Great videos though, I love you guys for that!
This episode somehow got the message of money's inherently insane nature across just as well as the south sea bubble series.
Can we do an episode on Mao's revolution after this one?
Mmm this episode made me hungry. Should go have a snack.
Medieval peasants: *anger*
God, this series is depressing.
@Leonardo Gurney like the rest of the channel
This is a war that killed at least a third, maybe a majority, of the people of the Holy Roman empire, devastation on the scale of The Black Death. Why would it ever fail to be depressing?
The first part definitely reminds me of Spice and Wolf.
As an Irish man I’m quite familiar with this horseman...
Can you please do a series on the French Fronde?
"Hey, what about if everything that could possibly go wrong in a certain place went wrong at the same time ? Wouldn't it be funny ?"
The gods, probably.
Probably while reminiscing about the Bronze Age Collapse… “Hey, we should try that again sometime”
Coin debasement sounds like inflation / money printing when the gold standard was still popular
It really is amazing to think that Europeans actually survived so many huge wars
Well, many didn't
4:25 It's a good thing this is a channel about history, not math.
2,000 added to 8,000 is a gain of 25 percent...
never thought coin counterfeit or devalued currency would be part of famine, but it fit in so well with 4 horseman.
It's a wonder how humanity hasn't fallen yet considering how bad things got back then
No it really isn't. Things never get so bad for everyone at once that it'd collapse the whole humanity
Hank Green: DON'T EAT GRASS!
The "best" outcome one can take from the 30 year's war is that it was so horrible for everyone involved it largely ended religious wars in Europe. There was still plenty of religious strife and conflict, but nothing on this scale ever again. Tolerance through atrocity is kind of a horrifying concept.
There is a great book about the climate at this time called the third horsemen
What's the name of that book
Wallenstein wasn´t one of the most influential Generals in the conflict, he was THE General of the Conflict. He not only played a major part in the failure of the Bohemian Revolt, by seizing it´s warchest and turning it over to the imperial Court. He was also given supreme command of the imperial Army. Next to that, he heavily industrialized the War in itself by producing equipment, clothing and weapons for his troops in manufactures owned by himself. Still making a vast profit and in many cases he was given the principalities he conquered in the Name of the Habsburgs. He is also the one that more then anyone else at the time coined the phrase "der Krieg ernährt den Krieg." Which translates into "the War feeds itself".
It is suprising to me that Wallenstein has not been mentioned earlier, or more frequently, considering that he had such a major impact on the conflict.
Sad that the first Generalissimo doesn't get a mention beforehand. He was able to work with Tille to humiliate the Danes, and rebuilt the army to match the Swedes in combat.
Mints: Look at me clipping and recasting coins to make more of them, I'm so devious!
Early central banks: Noobs. Look at my money printer go brrrrrrr!
Modern central banks: You're adorable. I can expand the money supply by the press of a button.
Luckily Modern central banks know how much money they can add to prevent runaway inflation, and when to decrease the money supply
gotta love that St. Cloud eat the pennies reference at 2:41 xD
That St. Cloud reference when mentioning pennies did not go unnoticed. Good job.
Thank you for the video.
Im just happy they didnt get hello fresh as the sponsor 😄
One particular quirk of precious metal currency are other forms of currency debasement that can only exist due to the softness of these metals. One was sweating; putting gold or silver coins in a bag and shaking them heavily, causing them to chip and scrape. At the end the coins are removed and the bag carefully cleaned for metal to be melted down, and the sweated coins swapped for new coins. This was the least-profitable form of debasement, but since it was just accelerating the natural damage of coin use, it was nearly unproveable in law. Another was plugging, punching holes in large coins to extract the metal, then hammering the coin flat again or filling in the hole with a similar-coloured metal. Plugging was generally very obvious and easier to enforce, so it was less popular.
can you pls do the roman empire
or the roman republic( Julius ceaser)
The cycle of using worthless money in the neighboring areas to get better money so it too could be made worthless is fascinating.
7:38 Mmm, the Third Amendment is looking real smart now...
Didn't help anyone during the civil war though
Healthy dose of history
It has to mentioned maybe, that some kind of clipping coins was very common for centuries at that point. Namely if you wanted to by something for less than a penny, the smallest coin (like a point of ale maybe) you would simply break a penny in half or quarters if need be. Different from how they did it in that period, but an interesting look at how money was used.
Fantastic video once again. 👌
Extra History reminding us ONCE AGAIN, *ALWAYS PAY YOUR MERCENARIES.*
4:20 your math is wrong. If you've 8000 coins and you increase it's value to 10000 that's 25 % increase. 8000 x 1.25 = 10000
I feel like a lot of the themes that we are covering in this series are repeating themselves now. Rising tensions and conflicts, sickness, wealth disparity between rich and poor. Also the people in charge trying to make money over the the lives of their own people
That has always been the case, it isn’t repeating itself as it’s always been this way
It truly is a good day whenever extra credits uploads
Btw wheres the polish swedish union?
History teaches us this lesson time and time again:
ALWAYS! PAY! YOUR! MERCENARIES!
Acording to the german Wikipedia-Page Kipper(-Zeit) does not refer to the clipping of coins but rather to sorting out certain coins. The german word "kippen" means tilting or dumping.
Small addendum. Wallenstein turned the forraging and looting into an art form. Famously he raised an army of 50.000 men. When shocked nobles asked him, how he could possibly pay and feed and army of that size he replied: You have to pay and feed an army of 20.000. And army of 50.000 can feed and finance itself. He even demanded "contributions" from Catholic cities for not plundering them, even though he was supposed to protect them. And one town in the Palatinate was supposedly sacked 23 times within a few years, several times it wasn't even clear which side did the looting and to the remaining townspeople, it made no difference
8:24 Who else cried after seeing the horse 😭
no i can not not
And now the last horse is coming
One note to add that I think plays well into this series is that one of the significant hypotheses for the causes of the Little Ice Age was the decrease populations of first Eurasia (from the Black Death primarilu but also the Mongol conquests during the 14th/15th centuries) and then the Americas (due to European conquests and disease being spread). This occurred by reforesting significant agricultural lands as people died off, sequestering more carbon and reducing greenhouse effects. What makes this so appropriate is how it humanitarian disasters elsewhere, caused in part by some of the very powers involved in the war, may have worsened the humanitarian disaster here. It's a fascinating example of the interconnectedness of the globe and a point that the system of governance in Early Modern Europe was basically a disaster creating machine.
2:43 "Eat the pennies, Quizboy". Thanks for including this!
History repeats itself. It is why we should be knowledgeable of the past so we can be wary of the future.
I can't wait for episode 4 cause that's my favorite sermon
“And I looked, and behold, a pale horse, & his name that sate on him was Death, and hell followed with him: and power was given unto them, ouer the fourth part of the earth to kill with sword, & with hunger, and with death, and with the beastes of the earth.” Revolations 6:8 king James Bible version
I like the horseman comparisons
And so we continue ‘German Hardliner Starts Intercontinental War That Kills Millions - Part 1’
Eat the pennies quizboy.
Never thought I'd see a venture brothers reference here
And when extra history continues a nice series, there is nothing for many to stop the want to see it
The two best things about Extra Credits are the adorable pigs and ponies.
2:41 "Eat the pennies Quiz Boy".
Native German speaker here.
While I am no etymologist, the word "kippen" refers to something being toppled, flipped over or emptied out while "wippen" refers to something ging up and down repeatedly (a seesaw is called a "Wippe" in German).
In reference to money, I assume thise words describe huge market crashes and wild fluctuations for prices of goods, from near worthless to unobtainable.
Heeeeeellllllllllooooooo fellow history nerds, how are you?
good thx
Im a history buff
This is why EVERYONE hated the Hapsburgs.
I can't really recommend enough watching "the last valley" it's about the war period in Germany, and you can watch it free in CZcams, it's fictional but really involved all the th30 year war issues the famine, endemic, religious bigotry and civilian war suffering. And it's centered on civilian and regular troops not the generals, or Kings or war heroes,
Since this is about Famine, let us not forget Churchill causing the Bengal Famine.
There is an old song called “Flanders icht not”
Or “Flanders despair” and they show the grimness of the time
This is a great way to teach about wars. You should do one the Congo wars and their effects viewed as a humanitarian crisis.