Here's Why Russia Invaded Ukraine | w/Bill Maher
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- čas přidán 13. 03. 2022
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@RealTime host Bill Maher and Ben Shapiro sat down to discuss the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
Watch the full episode here: • Bill Maher | The Ben S...
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Seeing Bill and Ben having a civilized discussion on current events without the audience cheering or booing is so refreshing
Thats what I said. It was actually nice to see Mahar as respectable.
@@kuraikenshi2349 yeah when bill doesn't have the trained clapping seals to play to makes a difference
I can only wish Maher had such civilised discussion with Trump. One can only dream.
To someone without a brain.
Yea like when so-called "tolerant" far left groups shout down republican speakers while refusing to engage in any debates.
You two debate way better than our current politicians.
I agree with you in that statement. 👍🏼
So true !
That's what happens when two respective people talk. They understand they gave have different views but still come together on an agreement. Wonderful country we live in to be able to express our own views with out being put down
It’s not a debate, it’s an interview
This is how things should be done. Two people who obviously disagree and are very different can have a respectful conversation. In most cases you will find that you agree on far more than you disagree, and at least you can listen with intellectual honesty to the reasons behind someone else's position.
I left the left because the left lost the ability to have a conversation without calling you every terrible name they can think of. Slander, threats, etc. I'm not conservative, but I have found that I can at least have reasonable conversations without being called names and without being threatened. So for the foreseeable future, I will be voting exclusively for republicans. Until such time as the left learns to have civil conversations again and to be intellectually honest, and to return to being science centric rather than their new ideological religion, I will not be voting for them
Nor should you.
I'm from Poland. Ben Shapiro is completely in the right here. Japan and Germany turning to good is completely different. Japan and Germany were on their knees and defeated. Russia was NEVER defeated. Until the '89 and the fall of communism. They were constantly bullying their neighboring nations since their earliest days and never faced consequence!
I heard that Himler turned to the Allied nations in the final months of the war to somehow form an alliance with them and crush Russia. And I just wonder if it wouldn't be beneficial to the world if that was done. Germany was already defeated and you could still judge them properly for their crimes, but AFTER crushing the Russian communism... But no, instead your leaders in the West, Churchill and that guy that replaced Roosevelt... I keep forgetting his name, got played by Stalin at Yalta... or was it Potsdam? Well, he played the West at both. And we ended up with what we ended up with.
Lmao polski give me a break. Russia bad? How about ukrainians slaughtering in most gruesome way polish in volhyn?...Bullying. lol Never mind they fought and died for all of us before becoming nazi soaps lmao. Bullying. Fuckin pro russian regions in georgia and ukraine so be it. West and germany destroyed russia sent bolsheviks. Communism germans invented to split and defeat slavic people. All the collaborators like poles and ukries are sooo blind..puppets. slava rossyii and fuck off with traitors of our slavic civilization long live russia. It was russia who was bullied for centuries...poles, swedes, turks, mongols, napoleon, hitler, nato. Russia was suppose to watch how kiev bomb russian donetsk for another 8 years? Give me a break. Russian nation has right to feel secure..they are a nuclear superpower they dont let russophobic ukraine regime install US army just few hundred miles from moscow.
Pffff... Sure, it was better for Soviet people left you all suck Germans... Oh, wait a minute, you are doing this now😅
I am Polish and I can not believe that I am so impressed with Ben Shapiro’s understanding of history and politics post WWII.
I don't always agree with him, but he definitely develops an extremely intricate understanding of foreign conflicts and diplomacy.
Healthy, civil arguments. Miss these.
No one yelling the other down, no one throwing insults, no one making incredibly stupid arguments.
Thank you, Gentlemen.
And no loud obnoxious audience hooting applauding at any point they may agree with.
Have you seen how hard left circles are covering this? They have completely thrown Bill Maher out. They insist he is snuggling up to the right. It’s hilarious. At the end of the day they ultimately believe that conservatives are irredeemable and Bill is now a bad guy because he had civil discussion with Benny Shapp.
Yes because they created Nato to fight Russia
@@brasshouse9822 which is funny because I feel he’s gotten to ra-ra Democrats because of Trump.
Really, it’s because bill has been hard on the younger generation as of late during his new rules segments. But, they tend to completely miss his points
Except the guy making just that. ”Incredibly stupid argument ” about the fact that finland and other countries would be part of russia if not member of NATO. Do you really beleive this in the US? His entire argument is based on missinformation. Finland is not part of NATO. His entire argument just falls flat. Its really scary how this guy can just pull up dated to back up his missinformation. It is straight up lies just to prove his point. Scary. Please guys do your own research.
The way these two guys from very differing political views engaged in conversation without resorting to profanity, hyperbole, or personal attacks is an example everyone should emulate.
But both are Zionists
No talking over each other, no bs wokeness, no performative statements and exaggerated gestures. Just two guys who actually believe what they are saying, rather than saying what they believe "their side" wants them to say.
And what's really sad is just 10 or 15 years ago this was normal and not shocking to people, that opposing sides could debate each other with respect and courtesy.
And no audience members clapping every time Maher speaks like in his show.
@@saqeralthawara2342
Are you sure Bill Maher is a Zionist?
Is that why they don’t mention the hypocrisy of condemning Russia for what they’re doing to Ukraine yet turning a blind eye to what Israel is doing to Palestine or Saudi Arabia to Yemen?
We need so much more of this. These guys need to do a regular show; people from the left and right having civilized discussions in good faith.
I have not heard such an abundance of verbiage even from grandmothers on a bench near the entrance.
Great idea! We have a similar one in the UK between Alistair Campbell on the left, and Rory Stewart on the right. But Maher / Shapiro would be far better.
Bill is not from the left dude is a centrist
This is the way it was done in the old days as I was growing up. People with different opinions used to be able to conversate without all the anger, insults and threats. I salute these men for being able to talk at each other instead of going off on each other
They both have a mutual respect for each other. We need more of this instead of buying into the cultural cancellation
Yes. However, it is two respectable, intelligent people. There are very few of those left.
@@wesleyhobbs2332 Actually, it is one respectable, sensible person and another who is silly but realises that those around him have gone completely gaga
both of them think trump lost the election
@@JoefromNJ1 He kinda did and kinda didn’t. It's very gray matter but both of them seem to be seeing only black and white in it.
@@Juide80 what?
It shows how weird politics has become that it is refreshing to see a conversation between two people on opposite sides the aisle that are respectful to each other and both reject the crackhead woke stuff.
Agree.
Like the good Ole days.
Still, both are completely wrong on this topic.
@@denroy3 Don't be shy, do elaborate.
Maher has really, *really* mellowed out this last year. He was as contentious as literally anyone you could mention until he started realizing (last year) that his own side was gleefully destroying western Civ.
I have to correct Shapiro at 5:32 - Finland was never a member of NATO - both Finland and Sweden applied for full membership in 2022.
he is lying about everything he says in this interview.
Enlighten us @@foresthunter1894
So painful agreeing with Bill Maher over my hero "Ben Shapiro" but I couldn't agree more, nato is and has been outdated and should never have been encroaching on Russia, why does nobody remember the security conference in Munich in 2007, when Russia specifically said they could not accept this
ukraine broke an agreement between Rusia and ukraine, it was serious agreement, that a is a cause for war, unfortunately
@@scarletj.salazar6706 Name the agreement!
@@mdjey2 Minsk agreements
@@skanderbeg1751 Ukraine didn't broke it. Check the facts. Russia started fire seconds after agreement.
What I love about this is that Bill is arguing a view that more closely aligns with Trump’s expressed view that we should have made Russia an ally, whereas Ben is arguing the foreign policy of Hillary Clinton, to prolong opposition to Russia. In other words, there’s nuance in their ideology that defy the standard left/right paradigm.
Who would’ve thought!
Why I won't ever vote for Ben to be president. He'd get us into a pointless war in the blink of an eye.
There is no room for nuanced thinking & debate in today's culture...I demand that CZcams ban this video!
Amazing if we can get that in the white house and in congress.... 😞😓 hopefully one day when the Bidens and Pelosis of the political spectrum are gone.
Ben's a neo-con; Hillary's a neo-lib. They both love war
Just a small notice as Ben has gotten some things wrong:
1. Finland isn't part of NATO
2. Russia actually applied to NATO but was denied.
Ben don’t care about your facts.
@@daron9229--You still think that Socialism is a good system, and Communism is worth another try, because this time, it'll be better.
Russia applied to NATO during the cold war.....also known as trolling. Just saying.
@@ronmcmartin4513 ?
@@ronmcmartin4513 The old adage about assuming comes into play here--and this time the ass isn't a donkey
I like how they disagree on practically everything, but yet they still can have a civil discussion on the subject matter while both coming to an understanding between the twoof them. If only our elected officials could understand this style of cooperation. Maybe we wouldn't be so politically divided between the left and right.
Zionists
They both are lying
I love these civil discussions. Both sides can learn from this but I can understand being tired of the same old b.s. It takes someone special to remain civil. Much respect to both of y'all.
These two have great chemistry. They may disagree on many things, but that’s what makes these conversations so important. We need more of this!
They have a lot in common.
They're both zyonst israhell first America second.
This is because two adults are having legitimate conversation... WE HAVE FORGOTTEN HOW TO ADULT
We can learn a lot, listening to these two.
Agree. Love to listen to these guys.
More of this and less of Trumps sour stupidity.
Bill should do this more often. This was a real debate. Get more opposition people on your program.
conversation
Agreed!
Lol debate? Your sweetheart kept trying to avoid simple questions and Bill had to hold him accountable like he's a babysitter 😂
@@mmaxine1331 Yes, a calm rational one. Can't we just sometimes, agree to disagree. We (our nation, generals speaking) can learn a lot from a demonstration of rational discord, especially nowadays..
Ours Shapiros show not Mahers.
Bill missed totally, that Russians don't want amerikan Rokets on their Border. There's no difference to US interests. Amercans don't want Russian Rokets on their Border to Mexico for example. Or is it like if the US does it then its ok?
I am very conservative, I agree with Bill here... NATO should've been disbanded after the cold war
I respect Bill alot because he is willing to talk about sensitive topics without screaming or calling you a racist when he doesn't agree. He's exactly what a true old fashioned liberal is without the modern leftists unhinged mentality
@Arsenio People don't know where the middle is anymore. It's just sad now. But on your point I agree.
@Arsenio Sadly the middle seems to be where the bulk of our population is, the hate and fear baited emotional nuts played by the lying news and power players that control them. Control them to the point where they can't even think for themselves and they just parrot whatever they think their side would want them to parrot. These guys are classic in their platforms, we call them moderates only because we see they can behave moderately, not because of their views, their views do differ greatly. They are the extremes, just not the extremists, the crazy extremists are our neighbors and friends, the ones who don't really even care what's going on, or what's truly best, they care about having a "side."
YES! he is a true classic liberal, and now a days classic liberal is considered almost republican compared to the woke left
"The middle" is not necessarily rational and moral, it's just a compromise between two ideologies.
So everyone forgot how he acted the last 4 yrs? Yeah, I say this is an act. He is an actor.
Wow. This is the very definition of old fashioned, polite and respectful discussion, irrespective of what political leanings you might have. Well done and respect to both of these men.
Yeah , i don't agree with Maher on his politics , but he's been way to reasonable lately. That's probably why the left is turning on him!
Nothing but disappointment for Ben not calling out the ridiculousness of Maher’s suggestions if Russia being too ‘woke’ to go to war thanks to TikTok. It shows how clearly oblivious the two are of what this war is actually about, nothing but bureaucratic bullshit talked during this piece. There are major reasons for this war and almost none were discussed. As long as we ignore them people will stay sheep. Look up the war the Ukraine has been fighting for the last 6 years in Luhansk and Donetsk. Look at what the Ukraine did to Crimea after Russia annexed it. Look at the geographical significance of the Ukraine for Russia and ask yourself why they might want to take it versus having the US control it.
@@jiggymario8161 That's never gonna happen , Putin will never agree to that . Plus the last thing you want to do is provoke an unstable maniac with nukes!
@@jiggymario8161 Spot on observations , couldn't have stated it better. Also Ukraine isn't exactly a democracy , they've been corrupt for a long time and ran the country like a dictatorship. There president has shut down dissenting views and silenced his critic's! They should never be allowed to become part of NATO! I wouldn't be surprised if this whole thing was staged and he's really a puppet of Putin , this whole thing could be a ruse!
These kind of civilized debates were common. Remember William F. Buckley and Gore Vidal?
Its so refreshing to see a civil discussion
Putin asked to be a member of NATO
and was told no deal.
Look it up.
Ikr
Proof that a television audience does absolutely nothing to raise the intellectual or civil level of discourse in this country. More of this, please.
Nothing wrong with having an audience as long as they just shut up and listen instead of clapping and making noise
2:31 "take Kosovo back"??
Kosovo was within Serbian sovereignty since the founding of modern Serbian Republic whose territorial integrity was violated in 2008 by unilaterally declaring independence and stationing 3rd largest NATO base.
Absolutely. It's okay to disagree RESPECTFUL. Open minded debate to see the other point of view and get a different perspective not this my way or no way. As we see in DC. How are we as a species going to advance if we can't do this? Think of all the money and resources including life's.that could have advanced mankind. If you were a extraterrestrial life form that could travel the vast galaxies would you want to get involved with us?? I think not. Just food for thought don't know if it even exist as such. Like John Lennon imagine.
This puts shame to every Sunday Morning show on the MSM. Whoever thought of this, thank you and great job Messers Maher and Shapiro; a thoughtful, respectful debate, kudos.
This is the beauty of podcasts too. Long form conversations without interruptions , TV breaks, and sycophantic audiences.
More please!
When did Putin say invading Ukraine would be a cake walk? He didn’t.
This is what we call constructive political discourse. Listening to them chat makes me "think". That is the most important thing, to make people think and considering different perspectives to gain a broader understanding.
Two smart people with different points of view having a civilized discussion. We used to see this all the time. We need to see it again.
Make democracy great again
Ben is a not very smart person
They don’t interrupt one another.
Ben should stick to what he knows, he comes off as a hell of a dumbass here, saying Finland is part of NATO, lol no it isnt its neutral, Bill is better except calling anyone cynical
Yes. He always tries to make things black and white/ binary, and angling toward the right wing. He's either intellectually dishonest or not very bright at all.
I like this format better than with a studio audience. I think having an audience detracts. Good job gents.
I've been saying for a few years now that Bill should nix the studio audience format. They're semi trained seals who have no idea how to react when challenged with counterpoints that don't reflect their own agenda then obnoxiously cheer to make up for being silenced with pure logic the minute before that. Bill's body language even suggests that it's getting old.
USA: 😉Its ok when we do it, ignore it its all in the past . 😠🤬But when u do it is evil.
Calling people "gents" is SOOOOO Patriarchal......🙄🙄🙄......like, get OVERRR your OLD social constructs, pfff! Like, TOTALLY!🙄🙄🙄🙄
When he's with audience the show's staff are controlling them, they tell the audience when to applaud and when to stay in silence so that wouldn't make any difference.
@@samuelluria4744 “gents” ~ “gentlemen” = men who have their strength under control.
IF that’s patriarchal I’ll take it.
But don’t despair. There is also a matriarchy.
I like it that Ben actually comes across as more culturally aware than Bill (and I like Bill more in general) in this one. Yes, the problem is that Americans lack the capacity to comprehend that older nations and cultures have different hard-wired desires and priorities.
Боюсь, что Бен осведомлен недостаточно хорошо)
These two don't really understand what they're talking about. I find the facts these two have ridiculous. The Russian princes captured Kiev in 882. This is the 9th century, not the 11th. Finland is not a member of NATO and has never been one. Many other things also cause laughter. The most striking thing is that they accuse us of cynicism, of being bad, while they are absolutely cynical and calm about the invasion of Iraq, the bombing of Japan with nuclear bombs and Vietnam. You have killed 30,000,000 people in just a few decades. Remember, enemies, you will break your teeth about the Russians, as Napoleon and Hitler broke their teeth. You will wash yourself with your own blood. Russia is not Japan, Vietnam or Iraq.
Yes it's a bullshit war egged on by NATO. This could be stopped now. The US president is committed to finish it, to the end. Not leaving in backdoor for negotiations. No talks. The USA always had talks with who they warred with since Vietnam, for sure, but not now. WE have embiciles in our white house.
It’s amazing how smart Bill Maher sounds when he doesn’t have a drooling studio audience hooting at his every word.
...and dogging Trump every few seconds.
That's when he had just his staff there. It's getting back to normalcy.
Because he's right on this. The rest of the interview he said plenty of real stupid stuff.
Never seen both these guys so serious..
@@2367J Both sides say a lot of stupid stuff. The democrats are not always right, just like the republicans. Out of curiosity, what stupid stuff did he said?
It is so refreshing to hear polite discourse between two intelligent people.
Well done, gentlemen!
Ben is so right..We, in the West, think EVERYBODY wants what we want....They don't....That's our biggest problem...
@@davidwright873 We keep failing that lesson over and over again. Iraq and Afghanistan are good examples. Not everyone wants democracy and freedom. Some just want security.
Benny boy is a neo con. He openly supports war in Syria and middle East. Don't be fooled.
@@davidwright873 WE don't even know what we want in this country. The rich want half a dozen homes, the middle class wants 1.5 and the poor want to be able to muster up rent.
@@davidwright873 Same thought was applied to Afghanistan, the "story line - we are chasing terrorist's", and now we are in country, lets "turn it into another Western Nation". Bring in all the NGO's and let them loose. Did it work.? If you look at Afghanistan, they tried to develop a Western style Nation (there are vlogs on YT on this) - did it work - NO, they returned to the Nation "they wanted to be" - just as they are now doing again.
When talking about Kosovo and Metohija, Bill Maher should really get more informed. There is a reason why Ukraine hasn't recognised that part of Serbia as independent - territorial integrity and UN charter. If he argues that national minorities have a right for external self determination, then he should be talking about Ukraine aggression on DNR and LNR and not Russian invasion.
The Russophobia evident in Shapiro is overwhelming.
Yea, what's with that?
More of this, please. Mutual respect even through disagreement. No harsh words. No name calling. Just civilized discussion from smart men from opposite sides of the aisle.
Amen..we are starving for healthy debate.
Platform= The most damaging word/concept this century for free speech and healthy discourse.
The View, are you watching? I can just see Joy's "duhh" face and Whoopi "suck it up" man!
Not civilized when he keeps interrupting and cutting off Maher when he's stating facts. Again trying to censor facts he wants to conceal
@@jsavak99 Perhaps but it's already light years ahead of what we usually get, in terms of quality.
Yes, I get tired of the gotcha clips you see on youtube of 1 debater getting over on the other .
Shapiro at 5:35: ‘Finland has been bordering Russia since 1949 as a member of NATO.’
Incorrect. Finland is only _now_ considering to become a member of NATO, following Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.
Fuck the facts
The real issue is the middle defense systems. Russian ICBM’s can carry prototype warheads that carry roughly a dozen smaller war heads. This technology negates all current known western defense systems. It assures the MAD principal. By nato placing middle defense systems closer and closer to Russia’s border, there is a possibility to shoot those mussels down, before they finish ascending, before the main warhead releases the smaller ones. This would allow the west to negate a nuclear strike. Which would allow us to launch our nukes without retaliation. Effectively ending the MAD principal.
Furthermore, the idea that this is “blitzkreig is silly”. These people think Putin is trying to annex the entirety of Ukraine. The same people also act like the CIA and SOF haven’t been in Ukraine training soldiers since 2014. The Ukrainians are getting western intelligence and military aid. A “quick war” would result in massive casualties on both sides. For the length of the war, the current casualty numbers aren’t necessarily staggering. Russia clearly has strategic goals in this war:
-1. backing the ruble with gold and being embargoed has allowed them to build strength world wide in the energy sector. This is crippling the west (countries like Germany laughed at Trump during his UN speech, now they are seizing Gasprom assets to keep their country running) and will only make Russia stronger as every day passes. US media can print lies all day, but the reality is bearing itself out.
-2. New photographs show Ukrainian troops burning boxes of documents. A month ago the pentagon had to admit the dozen or so biolabs that existed in Ukraine which were American funded/run. Though they did all they could to deny involvement and brand it as a conspiracy theory. It is likely that Putin is working on obtaining as much compromising material as possible. The west might pretend otherwise, but the world knows zelenksy is no golden boy. And that Ukraine is a pit of corruption.
-3. Global alliances are cropping up for Russia and China as the west and more namely the US continue to stop trade or Alienate themselves from dealings with nations they disagree with. By doing this, they allow Russia and China a legitimate excuse to grow closer, with other countries like Pakistan, India and Turkey playing along.
-4. It is well known that fighting hasn’t stopped in Ukraine since 2014, in some areas like the Donbas, between pro Russian Ukrainians and the Ukrainian military/militias. I am sure that if any part of Ukraine is annexed, it will be areas such as these. So a thorough sweeping of the territory is expected.
-5. The west has not stopped escalating since this began. Again, if Russia is patient, and doesn’t overstep it’s boundaries, it will gain a legitimate excuse world wide to take more and more action in regards to foreign military aid sent to Ukraine. They can win this war and come out looking nothing like an aggressor.
Just my two cents. Russia is misunderstood by the west, much like eastern cultures were not so long ago. I feel that we paint them with a broad brush, with stereotypes like communism, strong men and cynicism. The truth is that Russian history is much older than 1917. No doubt that plays a big part, but since we never seek a cooperative stance with them, we never learn anything about them besides what we hear from ourselves. Seems kind of backward for a “democracy”
@@pokerone6489 > A month ago the pentagon had to admit the dozen or so biolabs that existed in Ukraine which were American funded/run. Though they did all they could to deny involvement and brand it as a conspiracy theory.
There are no biolabs developing bioWMDs. Ukraine is far too corrupt to do it efficiently - 99% of all money sent to do such things would be stolen. US failed to make Ukraine to do much, much, MUCH more trivial thing - some very basic steps to reduce corruption, and you think they can safely, efficiently, and *totally secretly* run a WMD program. LOL...
"Russia is misunderstood by the west". Exactly this is true about you and Ukraine.
He must be referring to Norway
@@pokerone6489 I agree with almost everything you said and I am no expert but I am familiar with a small bit about the smart missiles being installed near the border of Russia. I also heard that Putin retracted a little bit from that saying that he guesses the missiles are not as dangerous as he thought after all.
I would also like to bring up that Russia has tons of propaganda against it's people as well. In Russia you are forced to take the vaccine from what I have been hearing from Americans in Russia. I am not trying to say Putin is especially bad compared to the west not at all. I think there is more to this story. The main thing I am concerned of is the globalist's and if they are backing Russia and China because it seems like the US is being slowly dismantled.
I am not sure if you have read Anthony Sutton's book or heard any of his talks about National Suicide. It's about how the west gave China and Russia nuclear weapons and high end technology. I think til this day it is being denied. It was definitely denied back then but it is true that the west gave their secret technology away which would seem counter productive.
What a fantastic adult conversation between two points of view. More please on any subject between the two of you 👏👏👏
It is sad to see the US citizens struggle with reality.
Finland is not and has never been part of NATO, only cooperates in military exercises with them abroad.
Sincerely,
a Finn
@Fernando Cunha This was more of a reply toward Ben's claim which was false.
Welcome to nato
and it's a big part of his argument, saying NATO is a deterrent from Russia, while we literally see a war to prevent joining NATO. I just don't get how everyone says "naah, they just want to conquer the world, someone's next"
@Fernando Cunha Brazil and Argentina are not part of NATO either and they are doing very well BUT they have no border with Russia. Ask Japan, Poland, Romania, the Baltic States, Georgia, Slovakia, and Ukraine about how good Russia is. Putin wants to annex Ukraine and wipe it from the map like Hitler and Stalin did with Poland.
@Fernando Cunha you said about Sweden, Switzerland and Austria not Finland. Don't change the subject!
Don't care for Bill Maher generally but I give him props for coming on Bens show and keeping it civil.
His arguments were quite sensible tho
@@kunjupulla True.
@@KG-th3cr It almost feels weird, cuz we all are used to people screaming at each other when discussing such sensitive topics, my respect for both of are like 5 times more now 😇
The last year Bill has really come around imo
Haha, I approached it from the other side, usually agreeing with Bill Maher’s views. Yet…I found myself decidedly agreeing more with Ben on this one.
I think this is a very healthy productive way both sides of the isle can come together. Nothing unites people more than a common adversary.
The west said it was suppose to be a cake walk. Never heard the ruasians saying it. Urban warfare is the most difficult. It's not Afghanistan or Iraq where there's just desert.
When both these guys agree you know someone's making a lot of money on war
AMEN!
Finally, two well spoken respectful people coming together and expressing their views without resorting to bickering. Imagine if our government or even citizens could do such a thing and where we might be as a people or even country. It’s hard to sift through all the emotion based arguing and get to what really matters in this world.
I'm like this my whole life.
And people like me are rare...
It's not hard to sift through emotion based arguments, actually you're right, it's pushed out through every media.
Imagine if all people decided war is not an option and only the hire ups got into the ring… lol… never
This is the world I grew up in ……. would love to see it come back
Yes. However, it is two respectable, intelligent people. There are very few of those left.
The entire interview was so worth it just to hear Bill Maher say, "Communism was so evil."
What he said about NATO was 100 percent correct and Ben dodged debating it
@@Itsamansworld1 can we borrow your alternate reality time machine so we can test that theory?
Shapiro didn't debate it because you're talking about historical events and there is no point in debating it. You can't know what would have happened. So what is a childish tactic at best.
Grow up.
@@Itsamansworld1 nope try again commie
"A person's only worth is their ability to pick rice." Pol Pot. The ultimate in equality, which is why Bill hates it. He's very smart. In pure communism you are human - nothing more nothing less. Perfect and pure equality. For those who behave it could be good. For those who want to fly their own flag-not so much.
I agree. Now someone needs to tell the Democrats.
Putin DID look at joining NATO. He decided against, we didn't stop him. And Ukraine had no plans to join NATO - part of their agreement with Russia was not join, and in return give up their nuclear weapons. What they DID want to join was the EU - not a military alliance.
I am a person anybody in the west would consider leftist. Or communist. My worldview about governments is that they are ideally democratic and socialist.
This is the first video I have ever watched featuring Ben Shapiro that wasn’t featured as a punchline in a US late night show.
It is an absolute gem, in my opinion.
This is a proper argument. A reasoned discussion between two people who know their history and aren’t fully eye to eye on their takes on the facts.
I would like to say, instead of Maher saying communism, a better term is “enforced communism.” Enforced communism doesn’t work because it is evil. And people who aren’t living in fear of punishment naturally just help each other, looking for equity.
I am, at the time of this post, living in far eastern Ukraine, teaching English and doing other things as a humanitarian aid worker. I am feeling grateful that tonight I have electricity and internet connection to post this comment.
I wholeheartedly agree with Mr, Shapiro’s take. Not because I know the historical facts, but because of my experiences in Ukraine since late March of last year.
I hope to find this sort of reasoned exchanges of perspectives and ask that anyone who has read my comment up to this point will point me in directions of more content like this video.
Thanks for this post and Слава Україні ✊🏼🇺🇦‼️
What Bill said about communism changing the psyche of a people is very true. I was born in communist Cuba and my parents came to the US when I was only 6yrs old. Most of our relatives that stayed behind have a very different mentally than my family. And the Cubans that migrate to US now are not the same kind of people that migrated early on.
It's good for you to share that with people.
How
How specifically are they different?
@@kennystreamsthings Thinking as a collective vs like an individual. Any kind of individual success, freedom, personal responsibilty or ownership being punished under communism.
its crazy how u can manipulate the mind of millions.
My first thought was: "These TWO guys? In ONE room?"
Happy that they have to organise these meeting. They are reasonable Americans.
Unlike Democrat politicians, Ben and Bill are adults and act like it.
Remember when Ben met up with Ana Kasparian? Priceless
If Jewish people can claim Israel, why not Russian people claim Kiev?
Both know they r talking bullshit but they r still fulling the public...
Impressed with the two arguing civilly. Was glad to see Maher come out against communism and agreed with a lot what he.said. We pushed Russia into the villain role.
Any mainstream liberal such as himself would do the same. You've spent too much time watching right-wing propaganda which paints everyone to the left of Trump with a broad brush....
@@aliAli-ty4rf I have been through the public school system, the news networks are 95 percent left wing and I don’t watch network news of any sort but I am brainwashed? You should look in the mirror. You aren’t the one who is a victim of propaganda and brainwashed? What is your news source?
Right wing and left wing are arbitrary and undefined terms. My beliefs are based on principal. I have to live with and compromise on candidates because none of them are perfect. Trump is far better than the woke mob and sleepy Joe. I can admit fault and defects with him. I am not under any illusions and can admit those faults. He isn’t a god figure. I don’t quote him. I don’t idolize him..
Because I, not you, can see nuance and the fact that Trump, though he has zero filter on his mouth and is a ruthless business man who uses the law and his billions to his advantage, did a shit ton more to help the country than the geriatric puppet who currently holds office.
Yes. However, it is two respectable, intelligent people. There are very few of those left.
THANK GOD FINALLY. A respectful debate on current politics between 2 famous figures from the left and right? Please let’s keep doing this and we might actually have a democracy.
Edit: We might actually have a constitutional republic*
Edit 2: for the nerds.
While often categorized as a democracy, the United States is more accurately defined as a constitutional federal republic. What does this mean? “Constitutional” refers to the fact that government in the United States is based on a Constitution which is the supreme law of the United States.
we don't want a democracy, nor have we ever been one. Mob rule is bad. We are a republic.
Weve never been a democracy.
This isn't a Democracy, it's a Constitutional Republic. True democracy is idealistic and completely unworkable.
Maher is left? Doesn't seem like it.
@@myfriendscallme7866 Its more like the left has shifted more to the left and left Bill behind alone in the center.
It’s nice to hear interesting, intelligent people talk to each other.
1:41 “Kiev is the ancestral home of Russia, from around the year 1000. I’m not saying that gives them a right to take it. It’s a completely different nation now. It changed, it’s not even part of Russia right now”
Cool.. now do Jerusalem
THIS is the kind of discussion we DESPERATELY need in our country NOW!!! These two are PHENOMENAL!!!
Yes. However, it is two respectable, intelligent people. There are very few of those left.
I heard nothing constructive about how to end the war and save a few remaining lives so in that regard it was a waste of time.
@@justhikeit If you recall the beginning of the video, Ben started out by saying, basically, that all western attempts at ''ending'' or ''preventing'' such wars from taking place were rendered moot by a myriad complex factors. I think that actually having the gall to own up to this fact and publicly acknowledge it, is, in and of itself, at least worth its weight in gold.
First? This is hilarious 🤣🤣🤣🤣 the fact that these two are talking in this format is just weird world 2022
Okay
So I'm not tripping?
czcams.com/video/LJnJqWIjI60/video.html white house Just Responded..Breaking news 😱
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@@kevintewey1157 well I mean I'm not going to comment on your personal situation, however sure this is not part of that trip that you probably are on? 🤣😂
Civil discourse. It’s a good thing
Shapiro completely lost me when it turned into Germany and Japan.
Is Shapiro really saying in 5.37 that Finland has been a member of NATO since 1949? Well Ben...you are so wrong.
Thank you Ben and Bill for a phenomenal show of civil debate. This debate was absolutely refreshing and intelligent. Needed and necessary and our country and in our politics today.
Except Ben said Finland was a NATO member - it's NOT
05:32 Ben is wrong - Finland was never a member of NATO, though there's some talk about joining now in fear of Russian invasion.
Finland like Sweden were never NATO on paper, but always involved.
Finland, Sweden and Denmark
Finland, which shares a 1,340km (830-mile) border with Russia and, like Sweden, is a Nato partner after abandoning its position of strict neutrality at the end of the cold war, is expected to outline its decision regarding the alliance before midsummer
Thank you for catching that.... Mistake(?) On Ben's part. I had to replay it a few times to be sure I hadn't misheard him.
It kinda defeats the argument he was making there too, so not a trivial mistake.
America needs a Ben & Bill Podcast
I don't know the year, but it was on Clinton's watch. Putin had a sidebar with Clinton, and he asked Clinton why don't you invite Russia into NATO? Clinton punted after saying he would discuss the idea.
BRAVO to both Shapiro & Mahr.
It’s refreshing to see 2 people with opposing political views sit down and exchange thoughts without all the “theater” that usually accompanies this type of exchange.
My faith in human-kind has slightly been restored. 🤘🤘
I’m a total conservative but I always loved Bill. He speaks his mind but is also self aware and sees value in hearing everyone’s opinions right or left.
The fact u sound intelligent tells me, u r conservative, but def not a republican
Then you shouldn't be watching Shapiro the Jewish Neo-Liberal
@@hdfreepicss3xy617 huh??
@@whitesandandreef4919 no clue either lmao
5:33 Here Shapiro errs. Finland is not yet a member of Nato, but has applied for membership in wake of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
"30 years ago, 1991".
Yeah, that hurt.
This is great. I know Bill studied history, so its great to hear his views in detail in a longer format. And Ben of course is a smart guy. Makes for a good convo. Great to see this interview 👍
Maher is correct in this respect; the way we dealt with Russia post 1991 is the proximate cause of this whole mess. NATO is certainly part of that.
We have no idea how NATO and the west dealt with Russia after the USSR fell … maybe overtures were made maybe not. Ben nails it, Russia and its leaders possibly had no interest in western democracy. Hence, the Russian people allow a Putin to gain and remain in powers. Assuming certain beliefs about what the west may or may not have done at to reaching out to Russia is irresponsible.
How so?
@@arcguardian In 1990 HWBush and secretary of state James Kaker promissed Gorbachov that they would not expand NATO influence "one inch eastward" from Germany. There have been 5 Nato expansions eastward (almost 14 countries) since and some of them share borders with Russia.
The missile issue in Ukraine borders is also not a good look to NATO.
I think it's dangerous to ignore 30 years of NATO expansion and just assume Putin woke up two weeks ago wanting to make Russia great again.
But that's just me reading into history..
Putin said the work to drive democracy forward in russia was one of his goals in 2005, when he also said that the fall of the USSR was the " biggest geopolitical disaster of our times". Well, he certainly didn't invoke democracy, and now he has invaded a country that he wants to bring back into russias fold. Its pretty clear that he is ideologically driven.
@@marcofurtado5459 well ever since yeltsins shelling of the parliment building - ending all hopes of russian democracy (which it did) , probably convinced Nato to not trust what they had first seen after the fall of the ussr.
On the other hand Nato has tried to get closer to russia many times despite this and forming council like deals with russia but they have all been rejected.
Finland isnt part of Nato
Ben Shiron you are lying
Been a looooong time since I last agreed with Bill, guess he's still sane at some level...
Maher is getting older and he sees his team has gone coo coo for coco puffs and he is scrambling to find some semblance of sanity. Finally! Sensible conversation among two people that don’t have to agree on everything… loved it.
At the same time, he knows the the totality of the opposing side is even more koo koo--and that's why he caucuses with the Dems(metaphorically.)
Seeing these two talk like civilized adults gives me hope in humanity.
The nerve of bringing up Yugoslavia into this 🤣🤣🤣
Putin is not Milosheviki of Russia, Zelenski is! Russia is safeguarding separatists right to self determine just like America did in Yugoslavia!
по видео я понял, что русские плохие, что мол Запад сам хотел видеть Россию в НАТО, а Россия злая, потому что не хочет видеть американские базы в своей стране и каждый день говорить: Да богославит бог Америку! И им посрать что при Горбачеве и при Путине Россия спрашивала у США насчет присоединения в НАТО. На что нас нахуй послали, попутно присоединяя в НАТО все пост-советские страны кроме России. Такая странная политика не должна ли была насторожить Россию? Которая стремиться иметь полный суверенитет от США и не быть под их влиянием, а просто стать партнером. Эти люди так разглагольствуют будто их страна является королем мира и всегда им будет, а остальные - подданные.
Bill is one of the few people who really makes sense. Ben is clueless when saying finland is a nato member, they are not!
Plus avoided answering Bill about nato's reason to exist ..I 'm huge fan of Ben but He really went around the bush on this one and did not answered.
It's called being "exposed "
Check your facts. Finland is one of NATO's most active partners and has been a valued contributor to NATO-led operations and missions in the Balkans, Afghanistan and Iraq.
Finland is one of six countries (known as 'Enhanced Opportunity Partners'1 under the Partnership Interoperability Initiative) that make particularly significant contributions to NATO operations and other Alliance objectives. As such, the country has enhanced opportunities for dialogue and cooperation with the Allies.
@@leocalderon8604 wrong....they absolutely are not members of nato...after russia's invasion both nordic countrys Sweden and Finland consider joining'.....
Bill has a valid question, and I would wager the answer was "keep a boogie man so the weapons industry has a reason to keep pumping out weapons and technology to sell" .
The comments here are not at all about the substance of what they're discussing and all about the form. Yeah, it's nice that they're civil to each other, but if that's all you got out of this then it's setting the bar low.
I don’t usually agree with Shapiro, but I 100% agree with him in this. I’m a liberal, but dismantling NATO would probably be the worse option possible.
A proper conversational debate. Should be used as a template for discussion in all schools today. Mutual respect for each other’s views.
No, it’s not the respecting of the others view but the respect of the person.
Yes. However, it is two respectable, intelligent people. There are very few of those left.
@@wesleyhobbs2332 unfortunately mate, I think you’re right on that.
It's amazing when two people of intelligence have a discussion, it's exactly that; a discussion. Thank you both!
You are hawkish Ben…
I totally disagree with you on these interventionist (globalist) view
This was a beautiful pairing! I like seeing discussions like this. No need to be insulting or threatening. No need to disrespect the other person. It was wonderful to watch all round
I don't know what happened to Bill Mahr, but he's making more sense by the day. GREAT conversation. We need much more of this!
Just cuz u agree w him, doesn't mean he's making more sense. Everyone thinks their way is the making sense way!
@@whitesandandreef4919 But you can disagree with someone while still thinking that they're making sense, I mean if you're an honest person (By the way, this isn't me saying anything about Bill Maher, just generalizing).
@@Juide80 but ofcourse
Same observation here
Bill has been pretty much the same for years. It's the discourse around him that has completely warped. Including your view of what "makes sense"
It's always fun to hear how the words "Good People" are monopolized by one group of people as they think.
BILL MAHER RUSSIA WANTS TO JOIN NATO OR EUROPE UNION BUT THE US POLITICAL PARTY SAID NO THANKS
I always love hearing them talk to each other. It’s one of the best examples of people with different perspectives having a very functional, fruitful conversation and exchange of ideas. They argue points but they also just accept each other’s perspectives and opinions as well. Please continue doing stuff with Bill in the future 🥰
Shapiro is wrong about Finland being a member of NATO. It's concerning that he can insist it so strongly with a back story of when they joined and everything, yet be flat out wrong about it.
I've seen Ben Shapiro and Steven Crowder both say that Finalnd is a member of NATO confidently... It's concerning when you see them so wrong because it really makes you question what else they get wrong.
I have a lot of respect for Ben, but he does get A LOT wrong specifically on this issue. Domestically i think he is generally on the money - but geopolitics? Nup.
Shapiro speaks fast, thus gets some things wrong. It was a cringe worthy moment. Finland is part of the EU, which does have defensive policies similar to NATO's, albeit not identical. Trouble is, Fimland has not been invaded by Russia after WW2 not because of the EU, but because of a treaty USSR had with Finland and Shapiro completely missed that. Not to mention no one seems to talk about the strategic reasons Putin had to invade Ukraine, which have nothing to do with the Kievan Rus. Namely that Ukraine is a stopper for the Northern European Plain that funnels towards Russia, thus making control of it paramount from a Russian perspective (Maher may have been on to something there, albeit naively, obliquely and possibly unintentionally as well). The second reason for Russia to invade Ukraine, from a Russian perspective, is the fact Ukraine has the 2nd largest deposits of natural gas in Europe, right behind Russia. They are not exploited atm, but should they be - sonething Ukraine was trying to do and being blocked as much as possible by the Russians, Russia would lose both billions as well as influence over the EU, with Germany being head of that list. Those natural gas deposits are in territorial waters belonging to Ukraine, in the Black Sea. Crimea controls half of it, the southern coast controls a lot and Snakes' Island covers much as well - it's why the Russian Navy occupied an otherwise forgotten and empty speck of dirt in the Black Sea. To note how the Russian military is staying close to those areas, along Southern Ukraine, from Transnistria all the way to Donbas.
Anyway, both Shapiro and Maher missed points and made mistakes, from Finland being in NATO to ignoring much about the weight of the EU in Europe of all places.
The point of their segment was to suggest dark times ahead and the need for unity in facing them, in a rather clumsy, yet touching and cute manner.
Everyone thinks they're an expert on European politics now, that's my issue with all this.
And there's also another reason why Russia is not invading Finland for decades as well, and it has nothing to do with NATO.
@5:00 Maher says "it caused them" not to do it, Shapiro politely shuts it down with "I wonder if that's the case" and Maher realizes immediately he said it like it was a fact, it clearly wasn't as Shapiro highlighted and he steps back to "well, we'll never know". What a wonderful conversation, no insults, no trying to trap one another for mistaken hyperbole, no oneupmanship. Thank you both.
I love this discussion- it’s calm and rational. Something we are sorely lacking in the media and politics today.
This brings me back to a Reagan and O'Neil debate
Bill Mahr is quite right in his analysis, Good job Bill.
You mean right wing.
@@1pt21jigawatt I don't know what would be considered right wing here. Ben's opinion seems to match the neocon perspective.
Seeing Bill and Ben have a civilized discussion and they are both on opposite sides of the spectrum shows that the 2 are more civil than most think
Hello from Russia.
I've seen some of your videos. and had a lot of respect for you. I was sure you were an expert in what you were saying.
but after watching this video, I realized that you can be absolutely incompetent with a smart face.
Finland has not been a member of NATO since the 40s.
Finland, Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia have been part of Russia for longer than the United States has existed. Finland gained independence in 1917 and became an independent country for the first time in its history. (Estonia and Latvia have also never been independent in their history). In 1947, Russia and Finland have a peace treaty. all this time Finland was oriented to the west, but had good relations with Russia. this was not a problem. until your country put pressure on them in 2022 and forced them to become part of NATO.
you mentioned Georgia. The Georgian president hoped that NATO would support him. he struck a blow from the MLRS at the Russian peacekeepers. killed peacekeepers. killed a lot of civilians. for which he received a blow from Russia and it took 5 days to calm the NATO puppet. Russia is not the USA. Russia does not invade neighboring countries as long as these countries do not attack it or kill Russian citizens. you have so many misconceptions in this video that it would take a weeks to explain everything to you. it's a pity that you turned out to be so shallow...
It's wonderful to see two people having a discussion even disagreeing at times yet having a reasonable basis for the disagreement. Each of which seeing the others point of view agreeing to disagree and moving forward with the conversation. Absolutely fantastic
Summed that up very well !
Shapiro although well spoken, is not an expert on everything. Finland is not a member of NATO. They are now considering it but not a member yet.
Bill and Ben, I applaud you for a good honest intellectual conversation, and not be a jab fest.
This makes sense and we need more of this. Thank you.
That's actually how two typical Americans who have opposing views actually talk to each other. The Political divide in America is highly exaggerated by the Political establishment and the media.
Most Americans are either moderates or libertarians. Only about 30% are actually liberals or conservatives. America is too big of nation to only have 2 ways of thinking.
@UAE Emirates
I'm sure he misspoke. You've obviously never done any public speaking or spoke on camera in a conversation with someone. You only have so long to get a point across and you're trying to get as much information into a sentence as possible. It's far easier to debate someone in written words when there's generally no time limit.
I actually watched an old interview with President Kennedy where he kept referring to South Vietnam as South Korea and kept referring to Cambodia as Burma and he's considered one of the most intelligent Presidents in US history.
@UAE Emirates
But would you be so quick to point that out if he shared your Political logic?
That's the problem I see with our whole Political thinking in America it's all a brain dead wasteland of hypocrisy and it's spun to fit our world view. If it doesn't match up to our preconceived notions, we disregard it as propaganda or irrelevant. I like being challenged to think outside my comfort zone.
I just enjoyed seeing people of 2 opposing ideologies have a polite discussion on this topic. The media wants people like me to hate liberals and for them to hate people like me and I think that's plain ignorant. I don't agree with Bill Marher on most of what he talks about but I respect the fact he tries to base his opinions on logic and his understanding of things and not talking points from the DNC or Woke Cancel Culture crowd like most liberal commentators do.
@@shanejones7906 boom. Perfectly explained sir 🙏
Bill and Ben, the Flower Pot Men? (British kids' show back in the day)
It is great to see Ben still advocating for western strength, instead of pandering to alt right Russian sympathizers
Ben I live in the UK I think you would be very happy living over here,I also believe you would be accepted with open arms.We have a tendency to embrace strong intellectual individuals here in the UK and you would fit in with our society so well in fact Hatton garden was practically made for you.
What a calming discussion that was and that’s how it should be.
I think we can all agree we need more of this and less craziness on both sides.
"Finland has been bordering Russia since 1949 as a member of NATO" uhh Finland isn't, nor has it ever been, a part of NATO.
Have a feeling they will be after all is said and done.
I was looking for this comment 😬
Finland and Sweden get the same protection for free. No way would NATO stay silent.
Norway and Denmark were founding members tho.