3 Body Problem Explained - Nanofibers Staircase Sophons and Wallfacers
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- čas přidán 28. 03. 2024
- Explanation of some of the least understood events in the latest TV show series. Why did they use Nanofiber to destroy the ship? Why send a brain into space? How come Sophons can't destroy everything on their own and why would UN introduce the wallfacers to fight the San-Ti aka Trisolarans?
I am a big fan of the Dark Forest hypothesis solution to the Fermi Paradox and I'm quite defensive of these series, not because it's a good TV show, but because the ideas in the book are amazing and very complex.
The three body problem tv series are made of 8 episodes. I'd recommend reading the books before watching it. - Krátké a kreslené filmy
New video on San Ti Kardashev scale: czcams.com/video/fMhLexfMLEE/video.html
WTF?! You couldn't put a Spoilers warning at the beginning of the video?
@@stevechance150 Well it's not really a spoiler since by the time you see it you'll already know well ahead it's inevitable.
The biggest plothole was the United Nations agreeing on anything, let alone coming up with a plan.
good point :)
The Netflix series was a good adaptation. They can’t get everything right.
They have likely deleted many scenes to make the show watch worthy.
It’s difficult to predict how they would re-enact the rest of the books.
Such as the micro-universes. The Singer. The 2D solar system. Black Lines. No time. The spell etc.
Agreed, I liked this adaptation and I’m glad this isn’t another dogshit netflix adaptation but I still dislike the changes, I’m worried about how they’ll adapt the fairy tale and 4d scenes, those parts from the book were some of the most text-heavy sections and I can’t imagine the scenes being as impactful when adapted into live action
lol thanks for many fucking spoilers I guess.
The shows kind of dumb honestly. Its giving Raised by Wolf vibes. Great concept but the story got out there and lost the audience.
The biggest problem of the books and the show, is the trope of the "magical bullshit device" ie, Sophons, that can do seemingly anything, but not conveniently what the plot needs to not happen.
I've addressed this very issue in my last video. In a nutshell, Trisolarans don't want to appear like existential threat to entire population for multiple reasons. They could cause cancer in every human body by knocking out DNA molecules if they wanted to, but that would likely have negative consequences to their ultimate goal.
the sopphon cant do everything. the hack was done by eto
@@BlizzPorthonestly, i think the trisolarans have a very “economical” mentality of bringing down earth. By the time of the great ravine and later the droplet, seemingly all the sabotage they did, as minimal as it looks, was enough since they kept humanity from advancing in the field the trisolarans considered most important. Space manipulation and material science. ETO and messing with colliders was really, just what was needed, humanity was set back enough and all they did was a little push
@@calencori think the hack on the automated car that tried to kill saul was also eto, right? But what about the time sophon appears in front of wade at the season finale. He doesn’t have a vr device on. Did sophon imprint all that was happening on his retina like the universe blinking?
@@BlizzPort When I read the book, I just took the idea that Sophons are not all powerful and could not harm humans in anyway except giving retinal illusions, they are just protons which have negligible mass, even when accelerated to the speed of light, they just pass right through, a DNA strand is like the size of a moon compared to a proton. Its the ETO that was carrying out orders from them since they have no other means to harm any person. "You're bugs" now thats like an attempt of mimicking Evans, to ahow dominance and disdain about their technological gap, since the concept of looking down is also very numb, all they can rely on is other humans because no foreign object can scare us more than what we are used to scared from.
This guy who comments in this video is a special case lol
Thank you very much for this video! The show really added a lot of confusion regarding the concepts and substracted a lot of reasons for them.
Your explanations very compactly add all the necessary context.
I would also point out the needed 1000 nuclear devices to accelerate staircase, Ideally, they only managed to use 300 as the world didn’t fully trust the program. And even then, there are over 10s of thousands nuclear weapons of all kinds, their production not even being a rare or time consuming endeavor. 300 nuclear devices for the staircase is not the massive commitment he paints it on the video, if anything it’s little
The San-Ti have supposedly been observing Earth in miniscule detail for several years when the show starts, and still they are surprised to learn that humans lie and make up stories very, VERY late in the game. I didn't really buy this. It's also a bit hard to buy that they have to get an invitation to Earth before they decide to migrate to their neighbor star system. If they are that malcontent with their home world, they could have left eons ago, and at their current level of technology they should be past the point where living on an unstable planet is much of a problem for them.
That's where the Dark Forest Fermi Paradox solution comes in.
Yea that was the biggest plot hole for me. Theres no way that they couldve been observing humans for more than 5 mins without realizing this about us. And its crazy that in all of their time, they never realized that a star system 4 light years away was capable of sustaining life for them in a stable way.
Like were they even trying lol😂🤷🏽♂
@@ICU1337 If you've never told a lie. And no one you know has ever told a lie. It would take more then general observation to realize that someone new you are talking to can tell lies. They'd have to tell you first.
@@spamfilter32 if I tell you I'm going to do something and then I intentionally dont do the thing, is that not a cause for questioning? Its an interesting concept and I fully understand and get you said, as I had a similar line of thought as well but...
The San-Ti have been watching us, without any human knowing for months. You telling me in all that time, ever single faithful has done as ordered without a single bit of deceit or laziness or lie? Let me tell ya, those faithfuls are something else to be that devoted to the path😂
Actually... When Ms Ye gave the lady that solved the 3BP the headset, that whole interaction was prefaced on a lie. Those werent her daughters headset, she never even played the game. She purposefully lied to her to recruit her. For a species that cant lie, wouldnt that be a huge red flag🤔
@ICU1337 yes and no. If you haven't ever experienced something. And don't have language to describe it. It may take a long time to understand what you are observing for the first time. And while they sophons may be able to listen to every conversation, doesn't mean they actively do since some conversations are trivial while others are very important Iineed.
I think in the books the ship isn't even completely destroyed because as the fibers cut the steel it would heat up and weld back.
Good bookreader
Well that doesn't really make sense, since the fibers have virtually no resistance, they would never make enough heat to weld anything. If the fibers did, the supports holding the fibers would bend. But that is a problem for the books. In the TV-series the ship crashed and ignites, which is very likely, considering all the burning diesel from the engines and the tanks, flowing all over the ship burning everything to a crisp. Totally and utterly insanely stupid idea. But very cool. Hard sci-fi this scene is not though, but I'm fine with that
They don't need to heat anything. Any sufficiently fine cut will invariably heal due to Van der Waals forces
@@N.i.c.k.H agreed, but the "heal" would not be perfect
@@fakeaintreal Apparently the average distance between human skin cells is 25,000-40,000nm and the cells themselves are about 30,000nm in diameter. I'm no expert but it seems likely that a nanowire at slow speed might just push the cells apart. At very small scales things just behave differntly to the macroscopic scale.
I think entire show needs an in depth explanation cause if feels like writers themselves didn't understand the book either. Like the entire thing with sophons and wallfacers seems messy and inconsistent. If sophons can work only on subatomic level, then how come they took control over a car?
As far as I know, the car was hacked by their Human followers. Sophons can't take control of cars, ships, planes etc...
At what point it was mentioned that the cars were controlled by Sophons? Can't a human control and drive an automated car from a distance?
The Netflix show is what happens when deep expansive content is crunched and dumbed down for the sake of a shiny money grab.
@@greggsmith4570 Yeah, the show is bad and badly executed. I'm not defending the show itself, rather the ideas from the books.
The show is great u can't try to do everything in a show and make it boring that hold point of these youtube videos to explain tings u missed
you just saved a couple of hours of mine monthly explaining these to others. Thanks!
Haha, awesome :))
Just made another video, this one on dark forest theory explaining why most aliens are likely hostile.
if a Sophon can hack a car, 3 cars they surely can hack an airplane
sophons cant hack. they can only influence in the subatomic scale
@@calencor what's the difference from influencing 3 cars and a plane?
@@calencor what's the difference from influencing 3 cars and a plane?
@@FPL_Habesha eto hacked the cars not sophons the show doesn't explain things that are important like the nano thread needs to be in an exact space since someone might lay in the ground also the dumbest one is the sophon hacking digital bill boards and phones and displaying the message 'you are bugs' sophons cant do that they can only display it like when augie saw the timer in her eye but instead of the timer it says 'you are bugs' I recommend the tencent version of 3 body but be warned its super slow and you will need to read the subtitle but its free to watch
Thank you I will give it a try@@rnielvhinsieans.elpidama6935
If they can project things on your retina, they can project just white screen and make you essentially blind.
I think that would make the whole science thing pretty hard.
Yeah, the whole being able to project illusions into retinas is a little too glossed over for how incredibly powerful that ability is!🙄
There are only two sophons.
If the nukes in space had a secondary objective to somehow alert potentially “other” aliens then why did they stop detonating after 3x explosions when they lost the sail on the pod?
The MAD communication is not supposed to be used until as a last resort. In the end of Death’s End, the San-Ti realize the danger of inviting the entire Dark Forrest to Sol System and leave Earth, only to have their own world destroyed by more advanced species due to all the commotion they made.
There's no such thing as "only function on a subatomic level" except in regard to distance at which some forces operate. The energy required to accelerate and decelerate protons to near light speed and then perform sharp turns at those speeds (as seen in the particle physics interference experiments) is equivalent, by E=mc^2, to a particle of much, much larger mass. I'm not even going to quibble about where the energy comes from, but, unless you're going to deny E=mc^2, the idea that they can only have affects at the subatomic level just does not work.
To me the entire premise of the story seems flawed from the beginning. With so many exoplanets discovered in the "habitable zone" it defies logic that the Trisolarans would choose to invade another advanced civilization. One would think that the smart option would be to avoid planets that are capable of communicating and instead move to one with more primitive lifeforms.
Habitable zone doesn't mean the planet is habitable. It only means the orbit is at a distance where the star is not too destructive or too far away. Only small percentage of planets in habitable zones can actually be habitable due to sheer amount of conditions that are required.
There are few things problematic with searching another planet. First, Trisolarians are desperate, it's a miracle that their planet is still in the Tri-solar system and wasn't swallowed by one of the suns or shoot out into deep space. Second, they were invited to Earth, so there is a high chance that they were already on their way when they realized that they will have to fight humans and it might be too expensive to now switch the target of the fleet. And the third thing that comes to my mind is the fact that their technological advances were focused on survival, they are more advanced than we are but that doesn't mean that they can do anything. For example their terraforming technology might be non existent so it's a better idea to focus on the planet that doesn't require terraforming and already has some allies who will help you with conquering the planet.
They are going with the "dark forest" mentality of getting rid of future competitors for galactic dominance while expanding outward.
@@BlizzPort Nah, doesn't make sense still. Earth is a specific type of planet, our atmosphere, mass, chemical makeup, magnetosphere, etc. The chance there are exoplanets more similar to the Tri-solaran's current planet than Earth is extremely high if we are talking about a 400 year radius at 1% lightspeed. Not even addressing the energy expenditure hassle of a war of extermination against an entire entrenched species, which have a long time to prepare.
If they can shoot super computers around the galaxy at the speed of light and communicate with them due to quantum entanglement, they can find planets BETTER than Earth for their biology, so the reasoning for them coming to Earth is still kind of hard to explain, excepting just "aliens are dicks and want alien slaves". They can create their own slave labor (advanced AI), can find and colonize other exoplanets far quicker and easier than they can Earth, a planet that they are already concerned about winning a future war.
@@pinky8167honestly it's really hard to no spoil the rest of the series trying to explain the plot holes, but traveling to unknown star systems, even with using sophons is incredibly dangerous
Thanks, that answered a lot of my questions about why certain things were done.
If you can manipulate digital screens, you can manipulate electronics as a category.
The 1s and 0s for the making the screen display "bugs" and for shutting down a device, like a nuclear failsafe, aren't fundamentally different.
I can't wait to see the "critiques" version soon.
I think that, secretly, Wade opts to slice apart the boat in order to exterminate the ETO. In one move, he can recover the hard drive and eliminate an organization that could blossom into a massive pro-alien movement if given time.
Good point
This is probably dumb but why did the san ti even need to do that whole vr headset thing in the first place? Couldn’t they just keep using the sophons without saying anything and then show up 400 years later if their whole plan is to exterminate everyone anyways?
They already explained why.
Their ships will reach us in 400 years within which period we would be either on par or have surpassed them greatly if left uninterrupted.
It took us 100 years from steam power to come up with nuclear bombs. In a few decades we had hydrogen and neutron bombs and went to the moon.
Now we're perched to terraform Mars and settle the moon in this century which will give us access to Jovian resources around Jupiter in the asteroid belt.
So the sophons mainly are here to stop us from advancing also to recruit willing people to silence and sabotage our science while they worship the Santi.
they need to assure understanding humanity, no place for mistake in their plan- they realize how dangerous of potenial humanity by realizing deceive ability of human
What kind of alien announces that they are going to turn up at Earth and crush humans like bugs in four hundred years? Imagine how successful SEAL Team 6 missions would be if the US adopted that policy 😂🤣😂🤣
Spite. Anger. Arrogance.
This all happened right after they learned about human deception. It also happened right after they find out that meaningless bugs were going to dare to try to resist them.
The message was to show us fear. And according to what I've read about the books, it worked quite well.
It is actually genius. It destroyed society and law and order.
If storytelling were logical and reasonable, it would be boring and you can't prove me wrong
@@Dave_of_Mordorthere is so much good fiction without people carrying the idiot ball in order to make the plot work, i wouldn't know where to begin
@@j8000 you wouldn't know because it doesn't exist
I love your voice please make more videos like this I can listen to before bed
Little correction on the book the fleet can travel at 1/10 lightspeed which is 10% lightspeed, they need a little more than 500 years to reach earth and they are not moving at 1/10 lightspeed at all times, the fleet had to accelerated for a small period of time and then coast with it's sails open to capture antimatter from the space around it (for a very long time) before it had enough antimatter to accelerated a little more and then do all of that again and again.
Thank you so much for these explanations. Clearly, there was so much more depth to these events than the TV show succeeded in conveying. I was wondering why Will was the right candidate for the NPP mission -- especially given the emotional effect it would have on Jin, a key team member.
Also, thanks to your explanation, I assume Wade might have been hinting at the main purpose of the NPP to Jin when he whispered inaudibly to her in mission control after the "failure". Though, it's an interesting approach to intentionally scream into the dark forest as a means of defense.
I really like the idea that there are many unseen layers to human deception here, which makes sense given the realization that the San-Ti are relatively incapable of it.
One thing that bugs me still: How did it take so long for the Trisolarans/San-Ti to understand human deception? How does their struggle to understand the wolf in grandma's clothing square with the Sophon's use of human-like avatars?
I also now wish to have seen more about what Wade was doing in the background. As much as I enjoyed following along the point of view of the "Oxford 5," I would have loved more depth to Wade's character -- especially given he was clearly up to a lot more than was portrayed.
You're welcome.
1. This is my take. The idea why they can't lie is because their thoughts are visible to every other Trisolaran, so the concept of lying to them is like 4th dimension is to us. It's like someone blind since birth tries to visualize color. Such person can tell you that blue is more cold than red because that's what they learned from people who have sight, but they have no way of actually visualizing neither blue nor red, because they never experienced it.
Trisolarans never experienced lying because of the nature of their communication so their leadership overlooked this important detail. And most of their communication was conducted with ETO who likely never lied to them because they worship them.
2. Sophon avatar is human-like only in appearance I'd say. Psychologically and mentally they're pretty much Trisolaran.
Bouncing a radio beam off of the Sun would not increase its strength as the TV show suggests. Also, if Alpha Centauri had been behind the Sun when the original message was beamed at it, then the aliens would never have received it.
Also another idea directly from the books, it's not the fault of the TV show.
@@Ali-bu6lo
Either way, it's a bit of a flaw in the story.
@@davidbrisbane7206 Yes, it's a flaw, but as mentioned it's unfair to blame it on the show.
@@Ali-bu6lo
I haven't read the book.
Science. Fiction.
😑...
Just say you dont like science fiction and move on at this point.
What kind of alien doesn't lie and then tells the enemy it can't lie? This mistake alone will doom their efforts to take control of Earth!
Yeah that looked quite naive in the show. In the books its more subtle. The idea why they can't lie is that their thoughts are visible to every other Trisolaran, so the concept of lying to them is like 4th dimension is to us. It's like someone blind since birth tries to visualize color. Such person can tell you that blue is more cold than red because that's what they learned from people who have sight, but they have no way of actually visualizing neither blue nor red, because they never experienced it.
iirc it was because they're basically telepathic, also children inherit their parents memories so having private knowledge just isnt a thing
@@jamrollz
Fine. But why tell your enemy this?
@@davidbrisbane7206that hold point it does matter to them it only Mather to humans that can hide what them thinking
@@davidbrisbane7206unintended arrogance is a safe bet, considering how wildly beyond the current earth technology they are. They also like to “send messages”. “If they can crush us, what business is it of ours”
Can someone explain to me like im 5 whats going on in this show? Ive watched a ton of recaps and still dont underneath whats going on.
Well in a nutshell it's a deep dive into dark forest hypothesis according to which all cosmic civilizations have to be hostile towards each other due to cosmic sociology, which explains exactly why that's the case. Now the plot is about humans making contact with Trisolaran civilization and naively expecting help. Turns out they want to take our planet, but their entire fleet can arrive in 400 years due to its size, by which time we'll develop technologies that can destroy them on arrival (due to exponential growth of technology). For this reason they send two multidimensional probes the size of a proton to interfere with particle collision experiments in order to slow down our fundamental physics research. Because these probes are small, they can travel at the speed of light and get to our system in few years time, long before their fleet arrives.
First season is mostly about how humanity reacts to it, like building a particle accelerator on the Moon so that these probes can't interfere with all particle collisions. They restructure the command structure to make it unpredictable since those two probes can record pretty much anything we say and write. That's like a very, very simplified synopsis.
@@BlizzPort thank u so much for helping me understand and taking the time to explain it to me, I appreciate you doing that, thank u.
The aliens are only four light years away from Earth, so they must have been listening to radio for a century and have seen TV pictures from eighty years.
Yeah lol, that's true :)
Those signals are too weak in the vast space and can't be heard by any aliens. Ye Wenjie's message was heard only after the Sun's amplification of 100 millions times
@@kevinsophiavideochannel5996
I think you'll find your statement is incorrect, and bouncing them off the Sun is likely to make them weaker and not stronger.
@@davidbrisbane7206 What I said is what is in the book. It likely is not true scientifically but this is science fiction. The books don't have many plot holes if you read them carefully. The Netflix show fails to clarify some of the interesting details.
1:11 The width was also chosen such that people who were lying asleep would be cut, the fear being that people would slip through, like kids through monkey bars or vertical bar fences.
If sophon can manipulate the computers of a particle accelerator, it surely can manipulate an airplane's piloting computer
Yeah, but sophons didn't manipulate the computers, but the particles inside the particle accelerators. Computers just display the results from the detectors placed inside the accelerator.
@@BlizzPort actually sophon is inside the VR game, in the tv serie.
@@garethjax a sophon is a proton turned into a computer. "Sophon" is an avatar, a visual representation of the AI in one of these computers.
Just discovered your channel! You’re doing an excellent work ! I subscribed !
The sohpons couldn't have an effect on large systems like planes because planes dont function on a subatomic level? But screens do?
This is one of the problems with super powerful tech in sci-fi. They'd often have an impact or use case that isnt really accounted for.
Im quite confident that the transistors in the chips used to fly our aircraft and spacecraft would be vulnerable to sophons. Altering the appropriate binary 0s and 1s through transistors could bring anything in the air swiftly back down. We'd never even get off the ground. But then we wouldn't have the rest of the story, so....
Every action sohpons needs to absorb energy, so sohpons can only focus on the most important things. Do you know how much energy it takes to change the screen?
Can't wait for Pitch Meeting to do this series!🤣
People need to read the books before asking so many questions
They shouldn't need to. The show should be judged on its own, otherwise, its a horrible adaptation.
Santi is probably a type 1.5 civilization comparing to earth's 0.75. If they are type 2, they could have built dyson spheres around their suns to mitigate the chaotic era.
To build a Dyson sphere in a 3 body system, not sure. Every time two stars pass each other, the sphere would fall apart due to gravitational forces, though maybe some advanced tech could mitigate this...
But you're right, they're somewhere between 1 and 2.
A Dyson sphere would be obvious to the galaxy, and they already knew that's dangerous. You're right though, they could have used their tech to protect their planet from too much heat and cold. They did build underground structures so at least some of their population could survive chaotic periods. But, their calculations told them eventually their planet was going to plunge into one of the suns so they knew they had to move. Still, they could have built large orbiting space colonies they could move around as needed but once they discovered humanity and how quickly we were developing technologically, they knew we were an imminent threat.
@@BlizzPort Supposedly their tech used on 'Dropelet' should hold the structure integrity in extreme gravitational pulls. But I guess even with a type 2 civilization, it's probably not very feasible to produce enough droplet like objects to cover not one, but three suns.
@@jwzjwz2003cn Yeah that's true. They had the tech for it, so I guess we could assume it boils down to feasibility.
A Dyson sphere is capable of harnessing energy from a star but it will not mitigate or even completely block the gravitational forces that a star would exert.
Their top speed is actually 10% SOL, but it takes 400 years because it takes time to accelerate to 10% and time to decelerate when they get here.
How does the VR helmet works if they can't read minds?
I took that thing to be built by humans with the aid of alien tech... but then the question would be, why give that tech to humans in the first place? Even if they say they will help you conquer earth and use it to recruit more bright people, it seems like a risk not worth taking.
You have to put it on. Those who never put them on are not scanned. ALso, every thought AFTER you take it off should be considered (as far as we know) as private
@@Obsidian-Nebula and how were they made on earth?
Especially since the wearer was not moving or talking outside the "game"?
It only intercepts sensory input and output. It can't read the mind. The former is very advanced neuroscience, the latter is Legilimency.
I am fine with what you mentioned. What I can't swallow is who on earth built those advance gaming headsets. Even if you say the aliens taught the cult the technology on how to build one, I can't imagine people on earth has the skill nor machinery to build them.
Yeah I agree with that. The entire gaming thing is dumb... Plot would be far better without it.
The sophons alone are enough to interface with the human retina. It’s mentioned in the show that the headsets feature retina scanners as well as a few other sensors.
I believe the implication is that combined with the sophone software which the betrayers have (the file that’s larger than any other piece of data on earth) it becomes possible for the humans to visualize and experience what the players are doing in the virtual spaces.
The reasons the sophon AI wouldn’t take extreme measures is obvious. If humanity understood a truely existential risk was eminent, then they would immediately realize a deterrence solution: destroy earth.
The purpose of the sophon was to confuse humanity, maintain the possibility for their counter action, and thus the illusion of a possible victory, and to limit scientific development. There are major unknowns still, such as the nature of humanity, and the ecology of humanity. Recall that the Trisolarians consider the success of the Sophon to be pretty much a moonshot since it’s far more likely Humanity will exponentially develop superior technology in the centuries it takes the Trisolarians to arrive
@@EccleezyAvicii Good take. That's a good rationale for why Trisolarans didn't go too hard on the population. If humanity felt all hope is lost they'd definitely make Earth uninhabitable as last resort, much like they did in Matrix against the machines.
@@EccleezyAvicii I have no trouble with the game (software) itself, it is the headset that troubles me. Remember it is not only just any VR headset (that I am also OK), but the player can also sense, taste and smell, that is saying the headset is capable to interact (not just scans the player's brain activities, but also to influence it), these are what I can't swallow.
@@user-ud9hf8sh6o The Sophons, not the headset, are key to the VR experience, manipulating vision directly as seen when humanity witnessed the sky's anomaly unrecorded by devices, indicating an entoptic event. The headset serves as a sensor, capturing data (retina, brainwave, etc.), but the Sophons' technology surpasses this, allowing them to hijack human vision without directly accessing brainwaves or thoughts. They rely on neurological data from headsets to synchronize player perceptions, demonstrating their baseline limitation to interfacing only with visual and possibly aural precepts. Recall we also hear the pulsing/throbbing sounds from the first person perspective of the scientist as their countdowns approaches 00:00:00. This limitation is apparently transcended with more info-such as brainwave/retina combined data from the headsets.
The sensory data the headsets capture are also streamed/VOD into modern computers for the betrayers to observe so that the trisolarians can more easily leverage humans against each other.
I dont watch this show, this just showed up on my feed, but that first counter is pretty weak?
It looks like whatever it cutting that ship is going kinda slow? How is that not enough time for people to send any kind of alert of a disturbance (kinda assuming people are screaming at some point) and then the drive gets wiped.
Also what does it matter how far apart those fibres are if the ship collapses into a pile of steel and fires break out...? That would raise chance of damaging any electronics far above 4%...
Yeah I thought the idea was kinda exaggerated? lol they could've cut what they were looking for; it could've been stomped by the pieces of the ship; it could've exploded as far as I'm concerned lol
I’m still wondering how they got all those nuclear bombs out there in a line like that. The perception I took is that space travel was pretty much still like it is today only maybe a little farther ahead. I didn’t read the book so there’s that but was kind of surprised they were able to do that all the way out there.
Less than 8 light-minutes away for helio-synchronous orbit is not impossible. Piloting them remotely is something NASA and Space-X are already capable of, So the issue becomes getting them to line up. If they have proper instrumentation, it shouldn't be too difficult. Though them not explaining cosmic grease, or the Spell, does seem to be getting ahead of the story.
You state "The Sophons can only affect things on a subatomic level so they can't destroy large things like airplanes"? Hate to tell you, but airplanes are made of subatomic particles just like everything else in the universe.
:)))) Ofc, but they don't operate on subatomic level haha. Messing up few molecules in aircraft hull won't really do anything.
@@BlizzPort messing up molecules is what bombs do very effectively, but I guess these aliens don't know this(?)
@@mclark42 They do, but they're light years away...
You know what's the most questionable?
Alien sending their Super computer in earth in quantum state. If it is in reality, It's density would distort Space and fabric of time and it will be detectable.
Plus, quantum entanglement doesn't allow useful faster than light communication.
@@davidbrisbane7206 Yeah that's true.
@@davidbrisbane7206 Not in 3 dimensions. The higher dimensions may allow for transfer of much more data.
@@davidbrisbane7206 The entanglement effect is known to be much faster than light speed.
It is known to be at least 10,000x light speed
@@aeixo2533
There is no evidence of higher dimensions. Only String Theory seems to need them and it's practically dead as a theory and has no experimental evidence in its favour. Are higher dimensions possible? Yes, but very unlikely no matter how beautiful String Theory is.
The ship scene was still idiotic. They dismissed a special forces raid because it might allow time for the drive to be wiped, only to carry out a far more complex plan that ALSO left plenty of time for the drive to be wiped. The crew just happened not to do it, Evans tried to escape with the drive instead, and might have succeeded if he hadn't broken his ankle.
Another small point that I thought was dumb: The brain probe failing because one of the mountings came away. It looks like it was just bolted down. This part would obviously be subjected to immense stresses, wouldn't they have made better allowances for that? I'm no engineer, but my immediate thought would be to mount the probe in a sort of cradle made from the same immensely strong nanofibres as the sail and connecting wires, rather than just attach it to them with metal bolts. If a layman like me can think of that, why couldn't they? Not to mention, the actual reason for sending this probe in the first place is still incredibly nebulous and vague. What even was the intended outcome? All they were really doing was gifting the trisolarans a human subject to experiment on, basically doing them a massive favour and giving them a tactical advantage. There's even a very good chance that giving them a human brain to study would allow them to develop the ability to read human thoughts.
How did the headsets get to Earth?
I had a lot of these thoughts watching this guy’s review of the show, i thought to myself “should i tell him” because a lot of what’s set up won’t be paid off until the Deterrence era. So the show suffers from a combination of not communicating things as well as the book, and kind of putting characterization over explanations. However i very much still liked the show
where is the link so I can downvote
@@mac_attack_zach I wouldn't recommend doing that, the best way to deal with videos like this is to ignore them. CZcams rewards engagement, it doesn't matter if it is negative.
Unless you think their video will actually make interesting points, then you should just watch it.
@@waspoppin4784 you just commented an entire paragraph instead of the actual video. I don't want the link so I can watch his bullshit, I want it so I can downvote without watching. I've heard enough here, this guy is obviously hating on it for views and I'm not gonna give him one. But what I don't appreciate is people like you gatekeeping.
The biggest plot hole is that It seems that sophons can literally do anything EXCEPT kill humans(the important ones at least) old school style.
they mostly can get every information on earth but cant harm Human directly cuz sophon is a size of photon with zero Mass which mean zero energy to cause destruction. its main purose is to cripple science and spying info
The Santi literally gave you the answer on how to deal with them. They fear that in 400 years it takes for them to reach Earth, earth’s science would have exceeded their own. Even if they know about our new science, the things they can do with it are limited since they are on a moving fleet and resources are limited. So… just do what they feared we would do… try to advance our science even with the sabotage of Sophons.
The idea of using the concept of the black forrest concept to deter the impending fleet is a logical one, however, any type two civilization would have the ability for Ftl capability in the form of an Alcubierre modification using an understanding of quantum gravity . Also sophons cannot convey information via entanglement.. not quantum mechanically feasible . Also sophons should be able to hack navigational arrays . Another thing that is annoying is that even in a non chaotic era any evolution on a planet like Proxima b could not produce a civilization like the San Ti.. is it possible .. remotely:) but not likely
Oh well at least it’s interesting and its solution to the Fermi paradox is plausible that is if the instinct for self preservation of a species is universal which should be :-)
Do you think Will's brain will encounter the enemy of our enemy?
subscribed just on the basis of this video..
Good thoughts on the world-building of Remembrance of Earth.
Of course, there is no faster than light communication possible using quantum entangled particles.
... according to our current level of science / knowledge.
@@Peregrino69
Sure. Been like this for the last 70 years at least. Particles that we have entangled in experiments can't be used for useful communication.
good job explaining 👍
I do think they should have been more obvious about how sophons can know anything/affect particles but the ETO and their vast oil family wealth allowed them to operate at a super high level spy like organization, multinational, highly connected, advanced tech etc
when I saw Jack get killed, or Tatiana in general, I was like, sophons can't touch people! (thought it was some bs tv alteration)
now that it's finished I still think it's been pretty faithful and was a good adaptation, but I highly agree that they didn't flesh out the ETOs power and reach, nor that Sophons allow for trisolarin monitoring which can be transmitted directly to ETO members - that the ETO represent a sort of global pre millennial religiously devout all powerful corporate espionage cabal, that they were doing the physical/dirty work 'the whole time'
it makes sense that the layperson would assume sophons act as some sort of hack of electronic systems, like the more popular ai sci fi they've been fed en masse, on top of the assumption that they would Even know the difference between electronic, mechanical, atomic, or subatomic processes
Nice try but us the syphones can only affect things like screens, there can still do a lot of harm such as giving airplane pilots wrong info etc.
What's funny is that most of the stuff people have problem with are directly from the books, so they should blame the books not the show that has done a faithful job at adapting those points.
Did you read the books?
@@greggsmith4570 Yes, I have read both Three Body Problem and The Dark Forest, I haven't read Death's End yet since the translation isn't yet available here, but I've read a summery of it and watched CZcams videos about it.
1) The ship incident
Using such a convoluted way to get the hard drive was mental. When I saw the wreckage bursting into flames - I was facepalming - there goes the hard-drive.
The 4% risk assessment was bullshit:
They had no idea about the cultist's IT infrastructure - since they had no intel. This means no idea about the server placement, arrangements.... etc.
We also saw the wreck bursting into flames. They must have known that there will be fire - since they had the helicopters ready.
The hard drive could have been burned, crushed beneath rubble, drenched into water or if the cultists were serious they could have been rigged a bomb to the server room / or to the whole ship.
I think in reality special forces would have used combined assets of special forces units, gas, drones... etc.
Also the objective made little sense. A better objective would have been to - capture cultists for interrogation (you need to know what other cells exists), secure assets and secure the ship (you don't know what else is valuable).
Interrogation of Dr. Ye Wenjie was also strange. There are drugs that break your resistance and after they murdered everyone on the ship, they didn't use any real interrogation methods? Why?
Finally the story could only progress forward because of shitty writing - what if the Sophons decided not to decode the hard drive? In that case a captured cultist technician would have been very useful.
2) The guy with the brain
Why should the invaders care about this? Also why would anyone waste resources on this?
3) traveling at 1% c
I agree with you on this. Not only does it cost a lot to accelerate - you also need to decelerate and traveling faster would make the journey more dangerous - you need more shielding to protect the ships from dust and stray particles. So this makes perfect sense to me.
4) Sophons
The whole Sophon stuff sounds bullshit to me.
Considering that a Sophon is supposed to be an "unwrapped" proton - whatever that means (considering the proton is built from quarks and if you try to blast it with energy like they showed us it would just fall apart into quark soup). Also:
How does it "hear" and "see" stuff?
How does it control where it is going? It shouldn't have a propulsion system, or if it has one - where does it get the fuel / energy?
How is it no affected by other subatomic particles? For example in the particle accelerator it would have been shattered into quark soup if it tried to do what they showed in the show.
Where does it get the energy to operate the planet-size mega-computer etched into it's extradimensional surface? Or how does it get rid of the heat this mega-computer creates?
Quantum entanglement does not grant instantaneous communication. Information can only travel at the speed of light - this was tested and no FTL communication could be demonstrated.
Also how would the Sophon send the massive amount of information it is apparently sending to its entangled pair? Does it rapidly alter its state, which is interpreted as a binary code? If so, how can it change it state itself, or what happens when it collides with another subatomic particle that changes its state?
I will not question the part about the car control - since we know there are still cultists out there - who could have executed the attacks.
It would have been nice to see some confirmation - like:
evil mastermind: "Did you succeed killing the guy?"
evil henchman: "The car hijacking was a success, but some rando interfered and it failed."
evil mastermind: "No matter, we will move to plan B."
But it's not a big deal, and this way we got the surprise mf sniper - which was cool.
5) Back to the brain stuff
First - nobody would waste resources on this kind of crap. Not to mention it would take years to prepare the infrastructure getting the bombs into position.
Second - why would the aliens even consider picking up the brain? Not only would they need to decelerate they would need to accelerate to the opposite direction to match speed -- adding years to the travel time. This is such a waste of delta V, for no benefit - it makes zero sense.
You said it introduced uncertainty - I am sorry, what? How? Why?
Why would they need to do anything about this brain? If I am an invader, that decided to wipe out humanity - since apparently we lie and because of that there is no chance for coexistence, then why would I be bothered by some random brain? Not to mention - radiation would have rendered the brain useless anyway. We do not possess the technology to protect organic stuff from radiation for that long - especially if it goes through the heliosphere and entering interstellar space.
6) Wallfacers
Don't tell me that a planet sized general AI - which is supposed to be much smarter than humans - couldn't easily figure out what these three humans plan from their commands and actions.
If I was leading the Tri-Solarans - I wouldn't have bothered with this invasion. If I have the technology to build a fleet of 1000 interstellar starships that can travel to nearby stars. This means, I also have the tech to build a Dyson Swarm around that star (using space mining and repurposing the original starships). Once the Dyson Swarm is generating enough power to have "infinite" resources - I start building O'Neil cylinders and move the population over to them. There - problem resolved, without having to fuck around with aliens or humans.
You can't build a Dyson Swarm in 3 body system. There's no stable orbit.
The probe with the brain could be intercepted by a much smaller ship long before it reached the fleet. Fleet can't move faster than 1%, but they can send forth smaller vessels.
Why Trisolarans were interested in this brain will be explained in season 2 or 3. Don't wanna spoil it, but it has to do with the undermining of Jin, who's the lead scientist in PIA.
4% risk is actually derived from the fact that nanofibers are 50cm apart, and the drive is roughly 1-3cm thick. So the chance of it being cut is thus roughly 4% with a small margin of error. Ship didn't burn in the books, nor was it severealy damaged.
That reply must have taken you long time to write :) so I'd recommend reading the book. It will answer most of it.
@@BlizzPort Please re-read what I wrote:
"If I have the technology to build a fleet of 1000 interstellar starships that can travel to nearby stars." - remember the "nearby stars" part
"This means, I also have the tech to build a Dyson Swarm around that star" - meaning: around the star you have traveled to, which hopefully is in a stable system.
About intercepting the probe:
Where do you get the fuel?
You are traveling at 1% c on a vector towards Sol.
From Sol towards you comes the probe traveling at minus v (v
@@kenawyn Oh I see. There is a video I made why they have to come for us. Sure they could just go to another system like Barnard's star system and build a Dyson sphere there, however that would always lead to their demise because if they don't limit our technological advancement and conquer us, by the time they get to Barnard's star system, we would be technologically far ahead of them, and then they would be at the mercy of a far stronger nearby alien civilization (us). The only equation in which they can survive long term is the invasion of our planet, and even here it's not 100% guaranteed. This fact is clearly demonstrated in game theory.
As for interception. Remember, this is incredibly large fleet. They're moving billions of tones of mass at 1% the speed of light and plan to decelerate all that mass to 0% as they approach Earth, so the amount of fuel and energy they hold is gargantuan. Intercepting a mini probe weighing few kgs is a laughing matter for such civilization.
@@BlizzPort Thanks for the recommendation. I will check out the video.
Well, if every civilization thinks like that, then sure - wiping out humanity is the safe option.
My issue with the invasion scenario is that by doing that they risk what they want to avoid.
Sending ships across space is super visible. Firing a single RCS thruster from earth orbit is visible from Pluto. And firing the big interstellar drives should be detectable from lightyears, and this will broadcast the fleets location the whole time while they accelerate and decelerate.
The war with humans in 400 years could also be messy - nearby civilizations might detect the battle (when its light reaches them) - depending on what type of weaponry is used.
Also the humans could be a**holes when they are cornered and see no chance of winning - they could fire up a huge antenna and broadcast earth location - which would make the system worthless.
If they really wanted to do this stealthily they would use an ultra-relativistic electron beam - See "How to Win an Interstellar War" Kurzgesagt episode.
Yeah I get that it is a large fleet. That is why I said that they would have to send one ship to pick up the probe.
The issue with intercepting the probe is that while they are traveling at 1%c towards earth, the probe is traveling at let's say 0.5%c towards them. Which is a 1.5%c difference in speed. If they want to pick up the probe either the probe needs to decelerate, reverse and accelerate to match the incoming fleets velocity and vector, or one ship from the fleet must decelerate early, turn around and match the probes speed, so they can pick it up.
They could also use some trickery, like shining laser light at the probe's sail - if it is reflective enough - to slow it down, but it is unlikely that they could equalize speeds this way.
If they only plot an intercept course, that is not enough, because of the 1.5%c speed difference. Even if they have some tractor beam or similar tech, the brain wouldn't survive the high-G forces of rapid deceleration if something like this would be attempted.
@@kenawyn I imagine a small craft that's sent at 3% the speed of light to intercept the probe and correct its trajectory over the course of 50 years.
With a trust of just 1000km/h you can slow 1% down to 0 in about a year. Their voyage is 400 years long so they have all the time in the world.
As for electron beam, yeah that may seem like a plothole at first, but Trisolarans are not a hive mind. Their government would never get the approval from most of their factions to flat out exterminate another civilization. This is why their plan from the start is to conquer us, not to exterminate. The same way U.S. govs couldn't just nuke Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, even though mathematically it would've been the simplest and most cost-effective approach.
So why didn't the San-Ti, an advanced civilization, send a probe or sophon to explore a solar system only 4 light years away eons ago?
They are not that advanced. 4 light years take 400 year to arrive.
@@bryanliang3507 Send a sophon.
Because of the fear of revealing themselves to a more advanced race and leading it to them
“Only 4 light years away” isn’t as close as you think it is. Lol
@@aaronknautz7364 So far away that they sent two Sophons at near the speed of light, in a bit over 4 years. Could have done this ages ago, since they are more advanced.
I'm gonna have to agree with the guy right 2:00
Alpha Centauri is indeed a tristar system, but it's mostly a binary star system, as Alpha Centauri C, orbits the other two stars at quite a distance, so really, the tristar system is much more syable than depicted in the TV series.
*Depicted in the books.
Most of the things in this show that people are taking issue with are from the books, whether they are fair criticism or not, people must blame it on the books. The show did an acceptable job at adapting.
@@Ali-bu6lo
I thought the TV series did a good job with a flawed idea. Some things in the story are quite feasible, like the nano fibres and the solar sails. I normally wouldn't bother as God knows how the Enterprise moves through space and I don't mind that 😂🤣.
Science Fiction. By its very definition, its going to take a few liberties here and there to drive the plot forward. And are there or are there not, 3 suns in that solar system.
@@ICU1337 "Science-Fiction" has different types. On one hand you have Hard Sci-Fi while on the other hand you have Soft Sci-Fi and Science-Fantasy. Hard Sci-Fi have to adhere to known science much more strictly.
And then there's the necessity of a story being consistent with the logic and laws of its own universe, even fantasy worlds need to do this. I love this trilogy but it has some potholes.
@@Ali-bu6lo theres not a single "hard sci-fi" story that I can think of that still has to use *fiction* to drive the plot forward. Theres always going to be a plot hole if you look closely, no matter how hard you try to cover it up.
I think what you nitpickers are looking for is a science documentary😴 😂
I presume the aliens can travel much faster than 1% the speed of light, but this is possibly the maxium speed they can travel at and hope to slowdown and enter orbit around Earth. Since the aliens are at least 150 years ahead of Earth in technology, then surely the aliens could send a bioweapon at something like 20% the speed of light to wipe out resistance on Earth in 20 years. Surely this would be their best and cheapest option? We'd be able to do this in about 50 years using solar sales powered by lasers in Earth's orbit.
They are 4 light years away
So 20% speed would take 20 years to reach
Today also we humans are capable of detecting objects and predict its path and can destroy the bomb in space.
I think we are enough capable that if we found some objects like this approaching us in less a month time we can get rid of it.
The “it can only effect sub atomic particles, not larger things” excuse makes no sense when you acknowledge the sophons effect electronics. Planes and missiles have similar electronic components as say video billboards and cell phone displays. The haphazard limits on sophon technology makes no sense.
In the book Sophon doesn't have the power to change displays of billboards or cell phones. The Netflix show tried a bit too hard to impress audience and introduced a bug.
I disagree with the ship one. It collapsed, as it definitely would, and it'd probably burn as well. The chance of destroying the hard drive is orders of magnitude more than the 4% of cutting it.
Also the "uncertainty" statement doesn't make sense. There isn't much uncertainty about picking up a brain that from their perspective, even if pledged its allegiance to them, couldn't give them much. Or at least giving anything that could be used against them.
Cutting the drive wouldn't actually destroy it. 2 things. 1. We already have the technology to repair drives that have been smashed (at least the NSA and CIA do. And almost certainly the Chinese equivalent do to). You would also have to burn it after smashing it. So cutting alone would leave most of the data recoverable. and 2. the cuts made by nanowire would be so small that it could be certain that virtually no bits of data would actually be damaged by the cuts. any loss would be the equivalent of removing 3 or 4 letters from all of War and Peace, and then asking if it is still readable.
@@spamfilter32 as I said, the probability of the drive being destroyed in collapse of the ship is orders of magnitude more than it being cut, so the chances of cutting the hard drive scenario is negligible therefor irrelevant.
Also I don't believe they have the technology to recover a smashed hard drive when it's encrypted, since even small losses of data can make the decryption nearly impossible as far as I know. Do you have a reference that discusses this about encrypted hard drives?
And that's ignoring the encryption can of worms on its own, assuming they were hoping on getting the decryption keys/passwords to keys with some other method such as social engineering or something. Which would make killing everyone you could attempt social engineering on to get those very stupid.
Also as I said, I think it'd be very likely to burn as well.
@@mohamaddelkhah there are many private companies that specialize in data recovery from damaged hard drives. You can be certain that the intelegence services have recovery technology that is leagues better than what is available to the public.
Decrypting the hard drive would be the real problem. But the book solves this by having the aliens do it for them.
You should link the video you are responding to
Your reasoning for why they can't kill Saul is just flat out incorrect. When the plot demands it, the Sophons and their allies on earth have no problems killing individuals. The only reason Saul is alive is because the script says so.
That's fine by the way, but there's no reason to tie yourself in knots trying to justify it.
Why are (some of) my answers to comments here getting deleted? It's pretty hard to have a discussion if you have to find a way around the algorithm first. I have already wasted an hour for this now. Can you fix this? (If the filter took them out, then feel free to delete them all except that about "Hundred Authors Against Einstein", which somebody already responded to.)
Yeah that's annoying. CZcams has filters in place by default and I hate those, but if you turn them off, the views drop significantly. However, I've looked into "Held for review" where filtered comments go, but there's nothing in there.
Plot holes are contradictory logic loops in stories. They are NOT connections which the story leaves open to explanation. Just because the story fails to explain an occurrence does not make that event a plot hole. People need to stop misusing this term.
But sophons in the show can hack screens and cars which are not subatomic
I dont think your last point was mentioned yet in the TV show. The only nukes were used to propel the brain. Not Morse code.
And it seems a lot of people miss the fact that almost everything happening on earth is not the aliens, its the humans acting for the aliens.
The aliens are telling them how and what to do.
The show could be better at explaining what they actually do though.
I know theyvhave the entangled particles, to communicate in real time.. but i got lost with the eye in the sky thing.
Its hard to tell the explanation inside the game from what is real. Did the particle really grow over the earth? Can it become transparent over the earth? Are they seeing everything because they are looking INSIDE the particle from outside by looking inside the particle on their side?
I just dont get how they are doing everything they can do just bu using those particles.
And im assuming they are actual bugs. Tiny. Thats how they can reach the speed and how they survive their suns. The dehydrating part made me think that. I know you can drown bugs then they fone back to life when they dry out. And i think they survive cold and heat by become dormant, hybernating or whatever.
The last bit was spoilery and wasn't in the first season. All else was fair game, and I agree with the points you made.
That last one is not quite accurate, the deterrence is set up by Liu Xi 200 years into the story.
I need to read the books
They're worth a read. In a nutshell it's a deep dive into dark forest hypothesis and why all civilizations have to be hostile.
@@BlizzPort Thanks. I think caution is warranted. I'll enjoy spending more time thinking about active hostility. Have you read "The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet"? I very much like that. In practice I don't believe we'll ever make radio contact with an alien civilisation, and actual physical contact is even less likely. Sigh.
@@BlizzPort which is actually pretty depressing. Can you do a spoiler video on Will's character for those of us that might not make it to 2035 when the series concludes?
How do place humans 1000 nuclear weapons is space? How does the detention of each nuclear weapon not affect the capsule holding brain?. If humans are capable of accurately placing 1000 bombs why can't they take place the capsule instead of 1000 bombs? Each bomb detonates after the parachute crosses the bomb which means the capsule will cross the detonation every time, doesn't make sense
I still don’t understand the reason for sending the brain to the San-Ti. Whatever reason given in this video doesn’t make sense.
Trisolarans have access to everything we say, plan and do. This means the only way to counter them is with measures that are uncertain to both sides.
Wade knows Trisolarans won't miss a chance of capturing this brain if it's not loyal to mankind. Nothing else would work (nuclear warhead, virus, emp, spy camera etc...) anything else we send their way Trisolarans would either ignore or destroy. But a brain of the enemy species, one that's not even loyal to mankind, one they can study and use against us, well, they'd be foolish not to capture it. And they did.
Whether that ends up helping them or us is a coin flip. But a coin flip is still better than a zero chance.
@@BlizzPort Thanks for the reply. However, if what you say is actually the book/TV series reason it makes no sense at all.
@@bashbrannigan It makes perfect sense once you think about it. What would you send instead of the brain?
@@BlizzPort What an ignorant person you are. I just asked a question and no reason to insult. Unless you’re 12 years old, then you can be excused.
Since I thought we could destroy the Sofon with a single antihydrogen, the story lost its meaning for me
You could if you could locate them. But we have no way of locating any particular particle. What we do is shoot billions of them and then measure those few that happen to collide inside the detector :)
How exactly would you intercept a subatomic particle traveling at light speed, changing direction billion times every second?
@@BlizzPort inside a particle accelerator
They said it goes inside to mess with the collisions
And can regenerate after being broken
@@BlizzPort or when it’s unfolded and big
There is a lot of science in the book that is thrown to you. The Netflix show does explain most of it, but it’s so fast you may miss it. Or it assumes you know some of the science already as a Sci-fi nerd. The very little they do leave out between those two, is do to crunch of time limits of film (8 episodes so only 8 hours to tell the tale of a 400+ page book basically.)
But it is an engaging series but… I like shows in which the science is at least plausible to a degree . Another ridiculous concept. It is the concept of the spore drive, which is ridiculous, but the warp drive is not.
Airplane ELECTRONIC controls and computer systems certainly operate on sub atomic levels. Also, the Sophon’s can clearly mess with human perceptions, brain function, and develop detailed psychology profiles that allow them to drive healthy individuals to suicide.. The implications there are pretty far reaching.
Well airplane electronics operate on subatomic level just like a tree does. But that's not what I've meant. Sure electrons are subatomic, but the airplane won't malfunction if you knock billion electrons. It may cause a delay or lag at most, but it won't bring it down.
You're right about their interference with brain function, that part is completely inconsistent with their limitations. It's a plothole, unless there's something I've missed.
@@BlizzPort well, honestly I have no dog in this fight. I get why people love the books and the ideas it dives into. And anything that gets people debating cool futures of humanity I am down for. But the whole “dark forest” idea turns me off. One, fermi’s equation is based on just an insane number of assumptions and is a,most assuredly wrong. Two, recent … “study” … about why we haven’t found other life yet suggests that humans might be one of the first intelligent species. Suggesting that even if the dark forest is real, we are more likely to be hunters than hunted. But also, what would we be hunting? What resource (other than habitable worlds) would we compete for when we have access to a galaxy or multiple galaxies? And even competing for habitable worlds seems a bit unlikely, because who knows what human biology would even be that far in the future. Sorry for the rant … enjoy the books, not tying to turn you off. Just the dark forest and Fermi paradox kind of annoy me.
@@johndeere3486 No I enjoy debating this stuff. Sure it's possible that we're the first, but then it means intelligent civilizations are extremely rare occurrence. More like an anomaly. Which is likely. There were billions of species on Earth in the last 600 million years, and only one evolved into a civilization. Dark forest is more like a warning rather than solution to Fermi problem. It explains why hostility may be unavoidable. It's avoidable only if the hunter is so powerful that nothing short of type 3 can be a risk to it. In a way, Type 3 shouldn't fear Type 1, because they already control entire galaxy. However Type 1 will definitely view another type 1 in a nearby system as a potential threat. It's not about resources as much as it is about future power dynamics. For example, USA is not strangling Iran because of their resources, else they'd invade and take them. USA sees them as a potential future threat if given the room to freely develop. And they're the same species, living on the same planet, with instant communication available and completely under their radar.
Now imagine if Iran couldn't be observed, spied upon, communicated with and sanctioned in any way for some reason. I have no doubt USA would invade. Like there's no scenario in which USA would wait to see what Iran does if left unchecked. That's at the core of the dark forest theory.
There you are, simple really, or you could just read the books 👍😎
Why in hell would this f** video spoiler the next season?
Why give the impression it's all about the show and explaining plotholes of this first season and then tell whats going to happen with the bombs in a major spoiler? This channel can go extinct if it can even hold up simple spoiler warnings.
PS: the sophons really are a giant plothole.
Just alter some DNA on the atomic level by crashing into other particals, same as in the colliders. That by itself was a plothole, as pointet out by nuclearphysicists, since they were never to stop research as depicted but instead just statistically differentiate the expected from the bogus data.
Spoiler warnings make no sense. Knowledge is always positive in my book, and people should never resist it. Like why keep yourself ignorant? So that you can enjoy it in a garbage adaptation? I bet learning about it in my video is better than whatever D&D can come up with lol
DNA argument is true, I agree. Sophons could cause cancer in every human in less than a day.
@@BlizzPort
1. you obviously don't differentiate between information and entertainment.
Watching the series or reading that book is for entertainment purposes, it is not a scientific source of knowledge.
2. your video makeup deceives watchers in that you argue about the show and not the book, which is an important aspect because they differ from each other.
3. To spoil some other persons fun has no argumentative basis in "informarion or ignorance" , it's simply a moralistic matter
@@levnzt6949 Hardly any sci-fi is just for entertainment, apart from maybe StarWars :)
You think C Clarke wrote Space Odyssey to entertain you? Then you've missed the whole point...
@@BlizzPort star-wars is science-fantasy not science-fiction.
And yes, sci-fi is for entertainment, even if it is thought provoking on deeper levels it mainly creates an escape into another, sometimes better reality. It can create joy and awe is interesting because it's creative with a fixed set of rules given. Those rules are based on or extend on the laws of nature we already know of.
But it still is entertainment. Same as role-playing games in fantasy worlds.
If it wasn't entertainment then it must be wisdom. But this it can't be because it's speculative by nature. Else it stopped being "fiction" and started being "science".
You can't have both.
Good sci-fi is high quality entertainment.
Or do you believe the book was actually written to give us an real manual to defend against San-Ti?
@@levnzt6949 Science is not entertaining to you? You talk like the world is divided between entertainment and science :)))
World is not black and white. The 3 body problem book is much more than entertainment. It's a philosophical examination of several ideas like dark forest hypothesis, great filter theory, game theory and so on. The plot is there to guide the reader towards better understanding of these concepts. That's why I laughed at your spoiler alert. There's nothing to spoil here. The plot is not the topic of a 3 body problem. The dark forest hypothesis is.
The deeper problem with the story overall is that it tries to be "hard sci-fi", but at it's core it breaks down to odfucating magic with tech-speak because plot. It's established that Sophons can only;y effect sub-atomic particles, take travel time between points in space, and are capable of spying on every conversation, but not thoughts. Conveniently they can effect the retinas to see elaborate visual representations of whatever they choose by bumping around potentially trillions of sub-atomic particles into describable images. Lets keep in mind that they are working on a scale below atoms, and thus can't effect even an entire atom at one time but only bits of it. then they also have audio signals to impart to the human auditory nerves at the same-ish time. then you have the duration of the of the conversation the Sophons is engaged in which locks them into a location for the duration of the communication. Because they are bound by time, in however minuscule increments, they certainly can't be capable of monitoring all human communication. The larger problem is that on their scale they would be incapable of receiving audible communication. Sound waves are complex wave patterns of molecules in atmosphere. A sub-atomic computer can't interact with and entire atom, let alone even a single molecule of the hundreds of millions you need to process in order to decipher any meaning in an analog communication. Also, it's pretty "hand-wavy" to have the Sophons be able to effect human retinas, but somehow not be able to effect nerve impulses that do things like tell your heart to beat or your lungs to breath. And then there's the whole thing where they cant read thoughts, when interpreting neurons firing off signals is a whole lot more in their wheelhouse than listening to a conversation.
And yes, the boat thing looks cool, but it's super dumb. A wave of special forces storming the boat would present some risk, yes. But with something so vital as the drive there would be a measure of control. The spacing of the filaments my reduce the chances of damaging the drive, but it's still a big chance with something so important. That's not taking into consideration that they have no way to know the size or number of drives the data is physically store on. there's also a great chance the drive (or drives) could end up at the bottom of the canal buried in mud under thousands of tons of shredded steel, or damaged by the fires that would likely start. It's a neat science fiction story, but it'd be better served if it was willing to own that rather than trying to take 3Am college stoner chat like The Dark Forest idea and try to elevate it to the status of an hypothesis.
Oh yeah, the Morse code atomic bomb thing may be the dumbest bit of the story. It wouldn't be noticeable to anyone not looking directly at the solar system with VERY sensitive equipment during the short span of time that the bombs detonate. Building arrays of overpowered transmitters all over the planet blasting a signal out in all directions would be more feasible, and the signal could be broadcast indefinitely. Eggh, I gotta stop. This story just annoys me too much.
The whole ship slicing thing was almost enough for me to stop watching the show. The first logical step would be to try to get a person on the inside - a bit like "James Bond" (it seems that would not be too hard as they seem to accept all kinds of people who are "believers") - posing as a cult follower and build relationships within the organization - then steal the data when the opportunity rises. Not the ham-fisted "lets slice the thing to pieces and hope the data survives".
Also - for being of such importance to mankind - the entire operation seems very small. A mansion in the English countryside. One would think the entire world would come together for this effort - calling for a very large campus of buildings and facilities. The way it is depicted in the show is more akin to a hobby project .
Also why are there THREE wall facers? Could they not be in conflict with each other? Technically one wall facer could order to whole world to try to understand the "unwrapping from 10 dimensions to 3 dimension" in order to attach the sophons - which could directly contradict an order from another wall facer? And if 3 wall facers are OK - why not 1000?
Speaking of which - why is not the #1 priority to figure out how to eliminate the sophons. That way you would not need wall facers - which seems like a terrible compromise (best would be if ALL the best minds in the world could work on the problem freely).
1. Yeah I agree the mansion thing is quite ridiculous. It should've been a military base at the very least, but you know, D&D are woke and I assume they don't like military.
2. Eliminating a subatomic particle that moves at the speed of light is kinda impossible with current technology. Like how would you that?
3. Sure, they could chose one or thousand wallfacers, though I think they chose few because there are not enough resources for hundreds of them because whatever a wallfacer requests must be provided by the UN.
@@BlizzPort 1. Yea. But I think it would be something similar to NATO in structure - where the head is a civilian (currently Jens Stoltenberg) who is mostly a political leader to get all the parts working together. And how many bases and facilities does NATO have? Thousands. For this *monumental*, global, 400 year effort - it should be 10 times that.
Putting the world under effectively marshal law for 400 years may no be a good idea (i.e. having the whole thing being lead by military). You may end up destroying what you try to save in the first place.
Anyho - the point is - the stuff we see in the show is not believable.
2. Actually we do this all the time. A proton (the sophon is described as a modified proton) can be converted to a neutron by pushing an electron into it (essentially a form of fusion). Or trapping it in a larger element (if it is a single proton - it is essentially, atomic hydrogen). Problem is of course to trap 2 specific protons...
Point is - THIS would logically be the first point of order and massive R&D funneled towards it.
3. But why is this not explained? (I have not read the books). And what if two wall facers request the same resources? Then their wishes can not be fulfilled. The logical approach would be to have different wall facers assigned to different problems - with different resources. E.g. Wall facer #1; Particle physics research (sophons, unwrapping dimensions), WF #2; Outer space defenses, WF #3; Surface defenses, WF #4 Alien research, etc.
Also one thing never mentioned; the aliens actually provided some important clues that should immediately trigger R&D; That there are 10 dimensions, and that they can be unwrapped/manipulated, that FTL coms is possible (and there are probably more that i cannot remember).
@@jarls5890
1. Agreed. In the books they tried to focus on defense predominantly, which as you've guessed did fall apart fast because populations started rioting and the environment got screwed.
2. Well yeah, that's the point. We can interact with particles only in carefully set up experiments. To trap a specific proton that's zipping around at light speed, you'd need a strong magnetic field, however this is sci-fi so these protons are intelligent and can spot and avoid any magnetic field. So you'd need some tech that can track sophons and instantly create magnetic field anywhere on Earth, which is very much impossible today or in near future.
3. Agreed. The TV show generally dumbed everything down, so there should be category for each Wallfacer, but TV show simply doesn't go much into details because they wasted 90% of the time developing characters that are actually irrelevant to the core plot.
brilliant commentary and response. please keep it up.
I like how shows expose how fragile book plots are. The entire premise is good fiction but doesnt make a lick of sense. You're explaining based on the premise of the book, not a realistic approach.
I'd say the biggest problem of the book series is not the plot but the original premise: based on what we know life cannot even develop on planets in unstable star systems let alone sentient life. Even though the three-body problem makes for a very interesting and fresh narrative, it is not hard science fiction despite all other concepts are relatively sensible.
Nice… use clips of the SHOW and then give SPOILERS from the book without any warning ⚠️
Well you'll know it before it happens anyway, so it's not really a spoiler.
3bp is not game of thrones, it doesn't revolve around shock and surprise. You're supposed to know the dark forest theory before watching this show.
I think the book has many flaws. try to read it as someone with low iq that is curious with science, so you wont keep finding holes in tthe logic. after season 1, i feel its stupid since a few episodes in. i wished they defend it in a psychological context at least for the reasoning, since we know not much of the alien priorities.
Imagine if the guy talking here was a main character? It would have been the most annoying series
The very fact that facts not presented in the tv show have to be relied upon to make sense of the show proves how poorly written it is. The books may be great but the tv show sucks. The tv show doesn't explain the nano wire spacing, the attempt on the scientist life not being the sophon, the reason for the wallfacers etc, etc, leaving the audience thinking none of it makes sense.
PROBLEMS WITH THE SOPHONS: why can the sophons manipulate every computer and video device on earth to read "you are bugs" but it can't manipulate an airplane's on board computer to read the wrong altitude? How can the sophons accelerate to the speed of light, change direction and come to a complete stop instantaneously? The power necessary would be enormous and detectable. If the sophons are the size of a proton why can't equipment be shielded from them they way they are shielded from protons?
NANOFIBERS: Just how did they determine a 4% probability when they didn't know what kind of storage device they used, what size it was, how the device was orientated, whether the boat would breakup in the water or on land or what sort of fire or explosive damage would happen?
WALLFACERS: How can one person possibly keep all the detailed information necessary for a major battle plan against an unknown enemy in his/her head without notes or something? How can they do it for 400 year!? In 400 years the chance of something catastrophic happening to one or more of them is almost certain. How would anyone, even the Wallfacers, know if their plan is feasible without discussing it with various experts? Once they start to put their genius plan in play any half intelligent enemy is going to have a good idea what it is.
Thanks for your video. The video you referenced had such shitty criticism. The guy just tried to criticize the Netflix show while not understanding the source material.
You said you’re gonna talk about plot holes of season 1 yet instead end up adding in spoilers for book 3. Downvoted.
Oh I'm sorry, though it's a minor spoiler in the grand scheme of things.
233rd to comment.
please find a better voice
why? oO I think she is quite pleasant
you don't like women or something?
@@maverick4607 trash ai voice. nice job instantly jumping to misogyny though. So brave! 👏
@@cataraxis-jn9fu what are you mumbling about?
@@maverick4607 are you thick or something?
For 90% of these comments, the show isnt dumb or nonsensical, you just didnt pay attention and likely just went in with a hate bon*r because almost everything i see being whined about is explained simply in the show, sometimes in depth and sometimes multiple times.
Why are all these explanations just a summary of what just happened not an actual explanation
I haven’t seen 3 Body Problem, and tho I was curious about it for a minute, all these vids that explain it make me realize that it’s just confusing and nonsensical. I’m not going to watch this vid or the show.
The brain plan is ridiculous.
Dude can’t even speak English properly 😂😂