Why are my tig welds GRAY? (It's not what you think...)
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- čas přidán 17. 02. 2022
- One of the most ANNOYING problems I help people with, is working out why their tig welds are turning out GRAY! This is something I dealt with, and had to figure out the hard way, so my goal is to help you work this out FASTER, and show you that the problem may not actually be what you think it might...
Grab a coffee, come hang, and let's get welding.
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Time Stamps
1:18 Excessive Heat Input
3:00 How to identify the problem
3:45 What to focus on
4:01 A technique to help control heat input
4:47 Let's add some challenge to this now....
6:30 Double tapping
💎💎💎Take a FREE online Tig class on my website HERE👉 www.pacificarctigwelding.com/
Hey I’m new to tig welding and have only been learning through CZcams, I’ve been practicing on regular steel plates and I’ve gotten better at keeping the tungsten at a good height and not touching the filler rod with the tungsten but the tungsten is still getting dull really fast and not staying sharp at all, what would cause that?
When you weld do you control your heat or do you lift arc it?
Thank you.
I am interested in online class
When it gets really bad, I've heard it called "sugaring". Another name the lab coats use is "carbide precipitation". It is basically removing all the good compounds that make stainless stainless. You will eventually get rust in the effected areas. The man is right --too much heat.
You're correct, the proper name is carbide precipitation. It's when the heat causes too much chromium to evaporate from the heat effected zone. It destroys the anti-corrosion characteristics. Chromium makes steel anti-corrosion because the box centered crystal structure is filled with Chromium atoms, which severs the shared electron field of the centered atom, making oxidization less likely to propagate.
Dang. Been tig welding for 40 years and uh… well… I learned something. Thanks man. You just got a new subscription.
I have been tig welding over 30 years and glad to see you explaining and showing the techniques. I just wanted to add that the angle of the touch cup also has an effect to color. I consistently correct new welder who angle the torch to get better view will draw in air as a scavenging effect.
Watch my channel and I'll show you stuff you haven't seen in 30 years
You mean the torch is better to be vertical to the workpiece for better gas coverage?
Just got my welder a week ago, thanks for the tip and the simple explanation why.
. Yes
that's exactly how it is. correct
Dusty, no lie I've become a better and more aware tig welder since I've started watching you channel. Good stuff my brother, always pumped when I see your channel notification pop up!!
Same here dude! Fill and chill ✌️
Same here man! This is precious information. Thank you dusty!
My biggest issue is heat input for sure. Thanks for the tip
Hey man, this is awesome. I'm an orbital weld operator for ss sc-10/sc-11 tube, and I haven't had the chance to have a hand in mig/tig or stick welding. This was an awesome breakdown, and I've learnt abit more about welding 👌
I just recently had this problem and first thing I did was like you said to crank up the gas-flow only to continue to be disappointed and stop working :) It feels like such a no-brainer, but is so easy to forget.
You do a great job man! Your videos have helped me out so much, thanks!
So toked you are this close to 100k subs, I have been watching since you had less than 10k. Keep it up, love the tips and techniques!
Thank you Dusty, have a great weekend.
Thx for the tips Dusty! Very good info priceless in fact!
Some really good information and easily understood in the way you explain it. Thanks! 😁
I’m 67 years old and learned gas welding when I was 14 years old, but your videos help me to do better tig welding… thanks.
I was on my bed watching your video at 1am and after watching your video , I immediately go to my shop practicing my tig welding , I can't sleep until I get it , thanks
You must be young with no kids. 😂 I can barely remember what it's like to do something like that anymore.
I'm pushing 40 with kids and no way I'd lose sleep for anything. Enjoy it while you can.
AMAZING VIDEO, what you show made me realize so clearly what was happening to me
The most common issue I see in facebookposts, are people using too thick of a fillerrod paired with a way too "blunt" tungstengrind, causing them to overheat the piece because of the width of the arc, and the ammount of amperage they need to properly melt the fillerrod
Well I've seen enough. Had to subscribe. It's the no nonsense, here's what I do style of videos that I like the most. No hype, no "I'm a better welder than you so you should do what I tell you" attitude. The double tap method seems foreign to me, but I can see it being really handy. Next time I have an aluminum job with outside welds I'm definitely trying it.
Spot on. A skilled welder is few and far between. To bad most jobs don't care about the weld that much. A good welding company is few and far between as well.
A large nozzle also means a lot of spent argon, which is not cheap. Companies don't like that.
I just started high school welding this year and still can barely do 6011 stick welding💀. Hopefully I’ll get this good one day
Amazing videos Dusty! Very insightful information, Ive just started out tig welding and Ive always been getting these grey welds even with gas lense cups. Keep it up fam, all the way from South Africa
Time= heat.
New welders will have less skill and probably slower.
If I could just keep from dipping the tungsten. My hand eye coordination is long gone, I learned to oxy/acet weld back in the 1970's then because of my trade taught myself to mig, now retired and trying to tig.Keep going back to spool gun . Great channel.
Are you indexing your torch hand, resting it on something as you move it along? Or trying to hold it up in the air? Think of a dentist grinding on your teeth. He's going to rest his hand on your chin... if he doesn't he's going to grind your teeth down to little nubs, because he won't have a steady enough hand to avoid it. Nobody does. You must index the hand that is holding the torch or the tool. Then, put in some practice time, and study time. Study. Practice. Study. Practice. Study. Practice. Little changes over time lead to perfection.
Thank you, Dusty excellent video I am learning so much that I didn't know . 👊
When welding chrome moly, excess heat input and gray welds is beneficial. Welds which cool quickly can be brittle even when ER70-S2 filler is used.
Your surly not welding Chrome Moly with a 70s series wire…… 🤦♂️ and excess heat and gray welds are Not beneficial when welding chrome moly……. Welds that cool to quick, crack…… plane simple
@@thomasmcnicholas8656
4130 chrome moly tube is welded all the time with GTAW and ER70S2 for aerospace and motorsports. Used to be welded with oxy-acetylene too, no need for matching filler.
After proper technique, a true color lens is what has made the most difference in my welds. The ability to see air penitrating the shield gas before it reaches the puddle, gives me the chance to adjust the torch to compensate or stop before the coverage is lost.
Best money I ever spent for welding wasn't a machine, it was going for a Lincoln 4C lens equipped hood. I can see everything so clearly now, and it's made a massive difference on my welds, and even arc starts. It's definite bang for the buck, with a decent enough hood and a top of the line lens. These newer lenses are miles ahead of the stuff from 10 years ago, and light years ahead of what we had in the 1990s. I liked it so much I bought 2 more- one for me, one for my assistants. The newer headgear is much better than the original, so I upgraded my older 3350 with it too. If anyone is on the fence- just do it.
Whoa I needed this, thanks for putting stuff like this out there. You're so fkn cool Dusty, keep up the great work
Hey Dusty thanks for the info! Can't wait for Monday to try this stuff out!
By the way: do you have any videos on other techniques like "walking the cup", swaying, and keeping the filler rod into the joints instead of tapping? Greetings and thanks!
Thanks for all the tips!
one thing to remember for someone just learning and welding on a coupon thats say 6 inches long x 2 or 3 inches wide .. stainless has low thermal conductivity meaning it will dissipate heat much slower than aluminum.....so that small practice coupon will will get hot very quick
I really enjoy these videos and I don't even have a welder!
There are two guys on CZcams who explain basic to intermediate welding better than anyone else. That’s both you and Tim from TimWelds. Other excellent channels are much more aimed to the experience welder, where they assume you already know the basics. Some are in between, like Jody from Welding Tips and Tricks.
Unfortunately once you get away from the pro channels, it’s difficult to find a good channel. Most are guys whose welding isn’t, well, the best. They need to learn rather than teach.
Excellent thx...
Lake Havasu 🌞 Az
With out this channel and your advice I would have thrown my $3500 welder in the trash... thank you for all of your advice and most of all,for staying humble and kind,we need more of that in this f'd up world we all live in.
Watch my channel to see aerospace welding and space x weld tests. after you learn from this amateur
The world is better when Trump is president. Somebody had to say it.
@@hxhdfjifzirstc894 that one is more than obvious at this point... ty for sharing though
It takes years, remember 👍
Nice to share information, thank you 🙏
A lot of good tips,thanks for your awesome vids🤗😎🤗😎
I'm in school right now. I'm running too hot. This will help significantly.
Thanks man. Really helps.
Amazing information! I do have a question I am terrible with using the peddle I am guessing you can get the same affect with lift arc or scratch arc
Thank you very much!
Awesome video mate! Really helpful! Do you have any tips to make welding Stainless with scratch start easier?? Thanks!!
Just watched a 7 minute commercial.. and no answer to the question posed.. one of those endless promise and wait for the answer, and... no answer. I was somewhat excited earlier today when found this channel, thought it would be another gem like the weldmonger, but naah..
Huh? The question is "What causes it" and the answer was very obviously TOO MUCH HEAT INPUT. It causes carbide precipitation, or a leaching of chromium. It's actually a pretty basic part of stainless welding- you have to move fast and use correct settings and can't dwell too long, or it'll put too much heat into your weld. Using low amps actually is just as bad if not worse than too high amperage, due to the dwell time.
Thank you sir
Great info
I have not seen this in your videos, but would love to see one on thin sheet metal. Like 18 gauge. I have been tig welding for a year and still struggling thin sheet metal. I find it reacts totally different to the thicker stuff. Most of the time I do very short passes to not put too much heat into the panel. But I find it either is not penetrating so weld is sitting on top, or penetration with an inch wide heat effected zone, or worst cases blow through. Thank you for your videos!
Back gassing really thin sheet is super helpful. It's not just for stainless and exotics but sometimes necessary for steel to avoid pulling oxygen from behind the weld and bubbling up.
1/16" tungsten and pulse should help
I think I need you to look at my welds. I weld very thin tubes and either I struggle with too little heat (not getting a propper puddle) or the heat affected zone is huge.
At last I know! Thank you!
Great video! And great explanation! Thanks from Kazakhstan) Best wishes for you From Borat directly)
Good stuff brother.
Dusty, I have also the gray problem, it to mutch heat input you say. So I get turn down the amps or go faster. Even how low I turn the amps down they stay gray. My tungston als turns purple. My postflow is 5sec. 1,6mm tungston color purple. And 7 liter a minuut of 100% Argon flow
Great video Dusty. 🪙🪙
Thank you what size diffuser was that ceramic? and how much post Flow do you think
Thanks mate 👍
the content of your videos are packed with important info that my instructor didn't teach me. I just started Tig welding, I have a natural talent for It so I can't wait to learn more from your channel!!
Thanks Dusty LARRYMOORE
Thanks as always my friend! I appreciate you watching!
Great video dude.
Question? Are you double tapping to mimic a larger diameter filler rod?
Hey could you please make a video of how to setup your machine and what amperage you recommend for stainless and aluminum please it would help me a lot
Just as well you're already north of the border.
The merest suggestion that a problem will not be solved by ordering fancier stuff is downright UN-American,
and if you were south of the line, they'd hogtie you and send you north! ;-)
Nice presentation, as always. Clear, informative, and thought provoking.
This is awesome.
When i see you setting your machine to 40 amps that would be your max but you can make it lower with your pedal? Im just using a very basic lift tig welder atm and i havent done much practice yet but this video helps alot i thought i needed more gas but i now know my welds are wayyy to hot
Also, double check your filler rods grade numbers and SIZE !! Make sure use the right filler rod size to the working piece
GREAT INFORMATION DUSTY, I AM OFF TO DO A RANDOM ACT OF KINDNESS,,,,CHEERS, PAUL
Thanks, I like this, and I know too much heat is my problem. But I am confused too. I'm welding stainless about the same size as you in this video, and my amps are low, but my travel is faster than you show, and if I travel any slower I'm worsening the excess heat input. So, do I need more amps and faster travel? IF so, how do you travel so slowly and not overheat? In this video specifically, I think it would help a lot to talk about the material thickness and machine settings.
Well said.
Excellent!
Tight arc gets you a long way….
Hasn’t mentioned that directly
When I have that problem it's almost always a arc length problem
Thanks
Heat control is so important but I'm finding it difficult to master. I'll try the double tap!
Same here hoss, my weld looks great but turns to charcoal before im done. I think its my speed, tungsten size or mostly im an idiot and need to stick with mig and stick welding lol
@young11984 At least you're humble! Good luck with the learning curve!
i am just making long tube headers, all my welds are grey, i tried everything, tube is AISI316 , diametre 42.6mm, 1.6 mm tick, and used current from 40-60A and welding wire from 1, 1.6, 2mm and best is 1mm wire, and 45A to prevent melted metal to pass through tube and hang inside of tube, so, my travel is very fast almost too fast so it can not be to much heat input, argon is 4.8, 13 liters per minute, cup is 10
Hey bro do you have a video on your welding table set up?
I switched from ceramic to Pyrex and man, rainbows 🌈…… also go through alittle more gas now since using Pyrex furick lenses…. My welds never looked as bad as the example you showed, it was uniform in color, just not colorful
I see kids in my welding class have their machines set to low thinking it's going to help the oxide problem when in reality their having to sit and heat longer making their welds gray so I recommend weld as hot and fast as possible
hows it going, im an apprentice and i was wondering your thoughts of pulse welding on ss as it was a game changer for me and lets me lay out consistent dimes
I just started trying tig welding, actual weld looks good but looks like charcoal lol. I have the basic set up also, does tungsten diameter matter? Im using the one that came in the tig torch which is the larges of the 3 that came with it
the start of a weld is very important, the width of the weld, then follow the width of the weld, drop in filler wire at a steady pace, using pulse welding is good if welding in stainless steel.
Hey brother, do you wish you just got the 255ext first rather then the 210ext? I’m stuck on what to get. I’m using it for automotive/ motorcycle fab. Turbo systems etc. does the 255 do that much more? Obviously amps is more but features? Thank you
Edge cups vs Furick cups, which are better?
Your beast bro❤
Canaweld machine VS your Everlast
what do you like better and why?
how are the different and why?
Looks like 3/32 tungsten and 1/16 filler rod on 3mm(1/8) material? I think where I go wrong is the filler wire. I’m using 3/32 filler rod. It’s too big for what I’m trying to do. Find myself melting the rod with the torch instead of the puddle. No bueno.
hardest thing for me with tig and the reason i get this is i just get sick of waiting for metal to cool i just want to run joints lol i get this alot with mild steel.
Dusty,
I'm having issues now and again when welding SS and steel with a super bright arc forming in the middle of my pass. I usually need to back off on the pedal to get it to go away. I am positive my work piece, filler, and tungsten are clean. At first, I assumed it was because I dipped or somehow contaminated my tungsten, but it has happened when I know for sure that's not the case. My set is .093 blue tipped tungsten with 2% lanthanated. I'm using a stubby gas lens kit with about 20-25 cfm of argon. My welder is a Lincoln 200 amp inverter type. Any help would be appreciated.
how far from the basemetal do you have your tungsten
I’ve always used a size 12 cup sometimes used a 9 in tight spaces just technique tbh if not just get a wire brush out haha
I weld a lot 1/16"th thick 304 stainless tubing (car headers), I cap the ends a purge it (with a vent hole) it typically takes 30-35 amps (sometimes I will have my wife watch the amp gauge while I weld) to end up with a pretty, shiny looking weld but I do not get a decent weld on the inside unless I use more amps, to the point it starts turning grey on the outside. What am I doing wrong or is that just the way it is??
Does that oxide affect the strength of the material? Does the metal getting too hot cause it to be brittle?
Is this specific to stainless?
I feed the rod with every dab. It's easy for me as I've been doing it for years. It came from tig welding super thick aluminum, Preheat thick, multiple pass aluminum even. You have to feed the rod every dab.
awesomeness Dusty.....
Nice one 👌🏻👌🏻
any tips for welding thin stuff like 20ga without it going grey? especially when welding a shape where you cant get a copper backing plate on it?
Uses pulse modes.
That does not avoid the issue but if it happens phosphoric acid can be used to eliminate oxide on the solder join (grey/black as well as any coloured chrome oxide). Then the piece look shiny without even the thermal area being visible.
Can you do a video of 4g stainless plate? Having trouble with it right now
Limping in too cold is a big problem self-taught welders struggle to overcome. They limp in with nowhere near enough heat and by the time the piece is hot enough to fuse together, the entire area is glowing red hot and as soon as the shield gas disappears the heat comes rushing back to the weld area and discolors EVERYTHING. The key is to go in hot and get out of there as quickly as you can so you don't overheat the entire piece. That way, the surrounding area around the weld is still relatively cold and able to suck away the heat from the welding. It's all rainbows 🌈 and butterflies 🦋 from then on!
I am a pipe welder and I see this when you weld the following passes too close together. A temp stick is a good idea to prevent this. You can see that it is cooler but not so cold as to cause brittle welds. Usually the employer wants you working quickly to knock out the welds but taking a little time between passes makes for better welding
Sometimes it seems like I need so much amperage to get a puddle established that I make a huge heat affected zone , what am I doing wrong ?
Yeet! Love this channel
make a little sheet metal thingy. a trough to fill with gas. tape it to the back side of thin sheet and tee off a gas line to it. use the pedal like you are driving on ice.
literally 3 days ago i received my welding machine and 2 days ago this video appeared... you had the same video already but i didnt really get a lot of info from it xd
Goes to show it's not the equipment but the worker. I rock a fixed Jackson hood and have no problems. Imo I prefer how much definition they have compared to some autoshades.
One other thing what are your thoughts on slapping aluminum plate on the backside of what you're welding? It draws the heat out but at what cost?
I see you mention controlling the heat effected zone but i dont see you mentioning how to control it.
Reduce amps, move faster, etc or did i miss it.
@6:30 for one