The shocking result of Epic Games vs Google
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- čas přidán 14. 05. 2024
- Full explanation of the Epic Games vs Google antitrust lawsuit. Find out what the future will look like for mobile and game developers after this shocking new precedent was set.
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🔖 Topics Covered
- Changes in the Android Ecosystem
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- Why did google lose against Epic Games?
- Why did Epic Games lose against Apple?
- Is epic games creator of Unreal Engine?
- Trends in mobile game development - Věda a technologie
You're telling me Apple avoided anti-trust laws by being MORE monopolistic?
magnificient innit
quite literally
Yes
Apple's backroom dealings protecting them, Google was alittle too boastful with their approach.
Yeah apple has less idiotic lawyers, nailing basics from my undergrad business law class…
It is just astonishing how apple avoided this lawsuit by being a complete monopoly.
Again, it’s not illegal to be a monopoly. But if you do shady under the table deals, amazingly, that is illegal
Judge😂
@@trentbosnic There's no way to create a monopoly without doing shady deals.
I think the key here is like, you can be your only competition as long as you aren't abusing that position. The app store being an extension of the apple products does make sense if you consider the fact that one has to opt into buying apple products to be exposed to it. They aren't trying to snuff out other app stores on all devices to assert their dominance as the one and only app store you can go to. That's what I took away from this at least
@@airixxxx you imply then that apple did shady deals. Tell us
"I think it's wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly."
-- Steven Wright
That _is_ kind of funny, now that I think about it.
A monopoly on Monopoly.
Well, he's not wrong
Underrated comment and comedian! 😎✌️
He's Wright, you know!
Being labeled as a monopoly has a lot more legal implications than just "you can become one without breaking the rules." Once you are legally assigned the status of a monopoly, you automatically become a highly regulated entity by the government. The problem has been that the government has not stepped in and labeled these very obviously oligopoly corporations as such, so they are not being regulated to the standards that a legal monopoly would. It's a bit of nuance that isn't covered very well, in general, but I think people need to have a clear understanding of it. We CAN control monopolies through regulation (like limiting the amount they can tax people that use their digital stores), but we need to assign them as a monopoly under the letter of the law.
Do support but law is afforded and they can afford it.
As a big4 employee I can recommend the government to force the monopolist to hire us for yet another audit
"being labeled as a monopoly" is arbitrary and counterproductive. The only thing regulations cause on a so called "monopoly" is an even bigger yet monopoly, as now you'll have the starting monopoly intertwined with the state, the biggest monopoly of any kind ever.
doesn't matter anyways, lobbying/bribing is legal for these companies. if they have a monopoly, they have more than enough capital to purchase favor
@@peteMickeal33 Norway called and they have been Stockholm syndromed into believing their alcohol monopoly is not just being babies by their government, who thinks they aren’t adults and this have their own government monopoly on alcohol. Nobody is going to complain if the population thinks it’s normal.
I’m in that photo at 1:38. It was taken over 10 years ago at the University of Missouri School of Business… but was a journalism class. Apple showed the same photo in a WWDC keynote. Wasn’t staged, you got a credit with tuition towards an Apple or Dell laptop… Apple was way more generous.
Quality backstory
What did we do to deserve daily FireShip reports?
Shhhhh, you don't want him to notice
Guess we've been nice this year. Don't be naughty in 2024!
But in all seriousness, he was taken aback by personal issues you can check on the community tab and is now back on full throttle.
AI
its autogenerated
He finally got the gpt-4 and fakeyou api keys set up
Not to mention it's pretty much impossible to use degoogled Android in India, all the major banking platforms have made play test attestation necessary.
Google have been trying for far too long to force their apps on android users, and they don't understand why people don't want to use them... it's tragic.
Same applies to most places. Most users don't care about privacy enough to degoogle their phones, and so most companies don't see profit in supporting anything else. It _is_ possible to fake the play store attestation, but it's like 2-3h of work trying to find what works and how all 3/4 steps come together to make it happen. I managed to do so with my previous rooted phone and only the google pay activity of the app was crashing at that point because it assumed google pay was installed, but the app was mostly usable.
Also, most developers simply don't care enough to push back against the defaults and put in 5 more minutes of work to add an if statement to prevent crashes in edge cases. I keep having to listen to my colleagues make fun of me for that kind of stuff because "I'm going though [extra 5 minutes of] trouble to support something unlikely", so you literally have to push back against everyone when you're trying to do the right thing and it's exhausting to deal with so many conformist dimwits, inform people who don't care, and waste time to achieve a 0.0001% change in the world.
google (ironic I know) play integrity fix, it works wonders for me. requires root (magisk or kernelsu)
You don't want to do banking on an Unlocked Android device (unless you don't care about your money i guess).
All banks do that, it's not only in India. There are ways to bypass that though
What people often miss about monopolies, as you stated is monopolies are not illegal. What is illegal is you can't use your monopolistic status as leverage against other companies squashing potential competition.
sounds like apple squashing alternate store and side loading to be. hope the EU regulations knocks them down a peg
Like what Epic wants to do with Epic Games Store.
Thats what Google/CZcams did with an alternative CZcams platform (Grayjay)
You can't create a monopoly without doing using ilegal means to destroy the competition.
@@airixxxxthat is not true, Google Search is a perfect example of a monopoly that was created without any illegal means.
So wait, how is Google paying devs to get them to publish on the Google Play Store for not even exclusivity but to launch at the same time as others is a no, no, but Epic paying devs to publish games exclusively on their store and hold it behind bars for x amount of time is fine?
Exclusivity contracts aren't inherently monopolistic as long as there is competition in the market. Look at streaming services for instance.
Not disagreeing with you but it might come down to the fact that I think a lot of people are just using Epic Games for the free games (like myself) and mainly using Steam or other platforms for gaming outside of these free games, while Google Play doesn't really have a competitor on it's scale.
Fair point! But I don't get the the whole thing anyway. Samsung has it's app store and it is sort of large.
@@dadlord689lets be real. no one actually samsung store other than downloading good lock extensions and stuff. google play has complete control over the "normie" part of the apps.
you can very well download an apk from various spaces. but the vast majority only use play store. i for one hate google stuff and only download open source stuff whenever possible. but not everyone is willing to put that effort
@@beastlymc9562 so you support companies aiming to become monopolies...until they become monopolies?
Apple really pulled out a Savitar lol, "the more you do it, the less the rules apply to you"
Apple just didn’t do shady under the table deals. Simple as that.
@@trentbosnic...that we know of.
They don't have to do the shady deals to enforce their monopoly. Because it's a fundamentally monopolistic system. Apple needs to get kicked to the curb@@trentbosnic
@@trentbosnic The whole existence of Apple as a company is shady.
@@trentbosnic yeah and Santa Claus is real also
Imagine being an open source project is an disadvantage
apple must also have a monopoly on good lawyers. Them winning is outrageous
you don't become a trillion dollar corporation with spending millions on good lawyers google is just d::b they think everything is software
Apple is a government agency basically.
Its all because they had a judge instead of a jury
nah, imagine you create a nice garden and let people in to build and play. On 1 side, no one can make anything without your permission. On the other side, everyone can make anything, but then you, the owner have to compete fairly with the builders, otherwise, you're not a fair player in your own rule.
@@116pantonIt's good that the European Union is forcing Apple to allow sideloading, and Apple is running out of excuses because the sky didn't fall as they cried.
Stop distracting me at work Fireship, I have Splunk dashboards to pretend I'm updating
😂
Stop distracting me at work Fireship, I'm the only dev left at Spotify scrambling to fix the play button.
I also have to manually send out each Spotify unwrapped email, and I can only type so fast.
This seems a bit rich considering this is also the same company that pays devs for exclusive video game deals regarding epic vs steam ... and then even complains that most people like steam more ..
Yeah but epic is so shit compared to steam that they aren't actually ruining things for users.
That's not just a joke. That's literally why epic is in the clear. They are unethical, but too shit for it to be illegal
if they ever got to the point where they overtook Steam to become the defacto game storefront then these tactics would be seen as monopolist. Until then it's seen as 'fair' competition, even though it's highly hypocritical.
Perhaps this is superficial but I like Steam more simply because the user experience on Epic's client is abysmal. It isn't like Steam is perfect or anything but at least it works.
Google is a monopoly on android apps, but Epic isn't one for PC Gaming. This is not a 1:1 comparison.
@@dayansiddiqui4426Also the steam store decentivizes people making games because of their extremely high portion of funds they take from game developers. 30% is extremely high price to ask when a developer studio has to pay taxes, and usually pay engine fees. Honestly us as gamers are making it worse for our selves by supporting steam with our wallets. Why even make a game if youre just gonna lose a 30% of every sale at least to the store
I’m almost certain that the recent Spotify news where they barely get charged by google was the nail in the coffin on this for google
Laughing writing this comments from an ubuntu with Android Studio installed making apps for a living. WTF. Apple is so closed and so rigid that it's legally unattackable. It's quite magic.
Legal lesson:
Anti-competitive practices with self: Not-monopoly
Anti-competitive practices with others: Monopoly
This is America.
Epic is doing the same with developers on the Epic Games Store. They're thinking this will be a "rules for thee, not for me".
this is capitalism*
@@ludicrousreality0 More like statist socialism.
@@cherubin7thwhy yes I'm a citizen of the Kingdom of Apple
@@TheRibbonRedbut epic's cut is 12% though. Thats 2/5 of all other stores except windows and humble bundle
I still don't understand why this doesn't apply to App Store though?
Yes Android is open source but the Google Play Store is a private product so how can they be held accountable for creating a monopoly but App Store can't?
he explained it in the video. it's not illegal to create a monopoly.
did you watch the video? it's because google made shady deals and paid developers money to use their billing service
The point is that Apple did not financially incentivise anyone to support their monopoly - because they created one so strong, no one can bypass it anyway. I know this is absurd
The app store is the only option while android has multiple options and tries to "bribe" people into choosing theirs
The problem was Google paying developers to not use/make other app stores thus killing the competition
Apple just allows no app stores so there's just no competition and no unfair adventage for them
"Everybody has to think different in the exact same way."
- Jeff @ Fireship
Thanks, it's an epic quote 😅!
Was looking for this comment 😂 genius
They made us think different into their way 😂
Tea came out of my nostrils!
Super tragic. Heartbreaking for the techies... A blatant motivation for companies to be less transparent and more closed off 😢
the main difference was really that apple case was settled by a judge and the google one by a jury
Absolutely amazing summary, as always. Thank you!
Amazing info. I would like to listen more of these.
"Everyone has to think different in the exact same way" 👏👏👏 *He comments on his Macbook*
Yeah was about to comment the same😂😂
LOL, the headline here is that Apple has better lawyers than Google.
So in other words, Epic is pressuring Google to change Android into a full Walled Garden, whether they realize it or not.
Pretty much. Their lawsuit against Apple was horse shit too, they are angry they had to pay a fee for getting access to the largest distribution network in the world. They profited around 2-3 billion dollars via Apples store and they were pissed off it wasn’t 2.6 billion.
But without the App Store they wouldn’t have made a fraction of the sales to begin with. Epic are pathetic.
@@trentbosnic "without the App Store they wouldn’t have made a fraction of the sales"
You say that as if people use the app stores because they want to and not because it's extremely annoying to do anything else by design. They are basically just monopolizing the distribution of apps with anti-competitive practices. Also your math is wrong.
Also it's the consumer that is forced to pay that big fat cut to google and apple at the end of the day, not epic. Bye corpo shill.
Nah, Google could turn it into a totally closed system like Apple and the courts would still rule against Google and favour Apple.
@@HELLO7657this comment is stupid. Apple is a whole package. Why should they allow other apps to their software in the first place. It is like saying the theme park is a monopoly. You can build your own theme park though.
The same way you can build your own operating system, store and phone too.
@@HELLO7657Regardless of anti-competitive practices. I think the bigger issue is their shitty right-to-repair practices. If you want to keep me in your walled garden, at least let me fix the damn thing.
@Fireship I love your videos!! Could you make a video on how to do fullstack? As in how to properly split the frontend & backend and how to connect them? Thanks!!!
So, Google lose because they did Android as the Open Source. And Apple win because they make iOS as the Close Source. Looks like Open Source is not the good options for business and everyone want to take the commercial advantage of it.
No google lost because they were bribing and coercing devs to not use third party stores.
You can have open source if you aren't an anti-competitive peice of garbage about it
Apple said "It is my products, my customers and my terms. Who tf are you, Epic?".
Every one knows Apple is more restrictive and has no alternate store for iOS unlike Android. Heck, even developers can't run their own app on their own iPhone without paying developer fee to Apple 😂 so this ruling simply means Google lawyers are bad, Apple's were great.
developers can actually run apps on iPhones or iPads without developer account :) i have done this myself, it's official
Google's defense was Killed by Google.
not necessarily because it also depends on the jury. But it is funny how apple gets away by being more monopolistic they have to give the same ruiling to both
@@Monawwarthere is a limit of only 3 apps you can install at the same device. Plus you need to have apple hardware, which is not able to run games🎉
The Apple app store installs apps for Apple's own iphones. Meanwhile, google play store is just one of the many methods for downloading apps for android. Apple and Google are very differnet in this case
Always great content
So glad that you finally back
Hey ... you know ... I get really excited when I see one of your videos. I already know it's gonna be faya
My question would be what will they do after they allow side loading and stores are created to complete Will they reopen another lawsuit?
I'd never though I'd hear a positive characterization of Tim Sweeney.
I'm not sure about the Google case being valid, but it's crystal clear that Apple is much more of a monopoly, why didn't they lose their case?
Because the iPhone is like buying a PS5. If you buy a PS5 then you can ONLY buy PS5 games. The iPhone is the same way. They built the iPhone to only be used with the apple App Store. Google is trying to kill off competitors on an open platform. Apple would be a monopoly if it tried to kill off android to force everyone in to buying an iPhone.
Money
Paid the right people for the ruling lol
Because Apple is private moron how hard is it for people to understand this. Apple built their own os and app store so they can do whatever they want with it. Android is built on an open source google doesn’t own it.
I have watched most of your videos and sometimes i wonder how you get all these knowledge from 😮😮😮😮😮
I will be so happy if you can do a short video on explaining frontend , backend and app development with js and python
the code report is so helpfull thx
It’s so much better to create your own exclusive platform than to join an open platform and monopolize it
I sure wish we would have gotten the same result with Apple. Aren't they the biggest player in terms of phone adoption rate anyway? Seems like every app prefers to be on Apple before they hop to Android (if they even make the hop)
Was not expecting the project hug clip. That one got me xD
1:02
Remind me of a certain company that thinks that their platform is competitive to steam but it's actually not.
What would be interresting, if the EU now forces Apple to open up.... :D
Apple will say "Don't use it if you don't like it. It is my product."
@@TheOne11111and the EU will say don't sell it if you can't follow the regulations, its our market.
They already are doing this with the sideloading legislation
@@dayansiddiqui4426bruh a civil war will start if europe ban apple product…and I am half joking saying that
Would be nice, but just like American courts, European courts won't touch Apple. The EU once fined Microsoft 500 million for including their own Browser in their own operating system, because people were too dumb to download another browser. But they had no problem with Apple doing the same
I feel like Google's just doing intentionally bad decisions at this point, or now that i look back at it thats always been the case 😅
I think it's the fact that for a long while we let companies that big do whatever they wanted without consequence, now we're sloooooooooowly starting to hold them accountable for things .-.
Not you. Giga chad Tim Sweeney is holding them accountable.@@FAB1150
Maybe they're actuality hoping this result will reverberate to apple in some way down the line, maybe in some years or months.
Your use of memes for perspective is unparalleled. i.e.: 1:49 had me rolling.
another smoking gun is that some chat logs literally went "hey remember to turn on disappearing messages." and it's the last message in the log. I believe the judge called it an open attack against anti-trust laws.
why this video became private for an hour*
If the google play store rules change, do you think developers will start releasing Andoid-exclusive apps?
Possibly... But it depends a lot on market share too. Lots of app developers make quite a large amount of money via in-app advertising.
So it's in their best interest to distribute to the largest number of users possible. In the case of the USA (which is a high value ad market), iOS holds a significant market share.
doubt. Depends on how much the app actually interacts with the system and stuff like that, but in the past few years most frameworks were going in direction to allow you to deploy the app to multiple different systems - without any technological gains, I doubt that any company will want to cut their consumer base
That won't be the case, for a small developer it is way easier to build an android app than an ios one, but for big companies and startups this means losing either most of the US or missing on the rest of the world.
No, more like they will make them 20% cheaper for Android users, and ilOSers will keep paying the old prices
this seems like the type of thing that will ahve huge ramifications 10-15 yrs from now in a way we couldn't understand now. and probably will end up being negative
Like every time, UE only can make changes in Apple rules pushing them. How they did to lighting port switch to type C.
We need a real open source phone OS, running compiled native applications, urgently.
But ... That exists already. Lol
@@deaddevil7 Great! Which OS, that can run all 'Modern' C++ 20+ compiled binaries, compiled against a widely used fully featured native and open sourced 'modern C++' mobile GUI library (not talking about Qt mess) out of the box on the 'latest' mobile phones, 'without' crashing every second time, and has native apps to check my bank account do you mean 'exactly'?
There are some Linux phones back in the day running Ubuntu Touch, but it seems to be lost in time as it was discontinued before mass production (dead on arrival)
Even Ubuntu Touch OS itself is abandoned and already obsolete
@@sihamhamda47Yeah, my point is, attempts like Ubuntu Touch (to be fair, still gets updated by UBports, even like a month ago) have pretty much zero market share today, let alone an active following of modern C++ app developers (mainly because these people aren't even allowed to exist today). On top of that it runs only on a select amount of (old) devices, hence no real incentive for any company to build an alternative app besides their Apple Store and Google Play Store spyware.
@@sihamhamda47 there are other OSes, some even compatible with Android apks.
Would this not threaten Epics own store which also uses exclusivity dealings to hijack the market?
They operate in a "rules for thee, not for me" kinda deal.
i never really understand this argument because until the EGS was released we basically had a monopoly with steam.
Epic is not a monopoly on the PC market (and their exclusivity deals usually don't last longer than 6 months, maybe a year in extreme cases). Devs can decide where to publish their games on PC, they realistically don't have that choice on android or iOS (if they want more than 20 downloads.) PC is much more complicated because there are so many different stores now and you're not as limited in the apps you're allowed to install, or where you get them.
The epic exclusivity deals are much more similar to how TV shows only run on one network. You still have plenty of choice as in the creators / publishing company can choose which service to use, just as the users can decide which services they want to pay for.
Fighting monopolies doesn't mean we'll get full communism where everybody can have everything. It just means that one large corporation does not hold the power to put consumers and industries in a stranglehold.
@@maxmustsleep until EGS? So GOG, Uplay, Origin/EA didn't exist then? Don't forget the bountiful amounts of MMOs with their own sites.
Androids can sideload too. Every brand phone (Samsung, LG, Asus, and the countless Chinese manufacturers) each have their own App Stores aside from Google Play Store. Epic themselves have been using the Samsung Play Store to host Fortnite mobile for years now.
It really feels like you don't understand what monopoly is & just repeating what Epic says.
@@maxmustsleepSteam is a monopoly for how good their service is, unlike EGS who try to compete with Valve through exclusivity deals
@@TheRibbonRedwhat was market share of GOG back then? Have you forgotten EA games were all on steam before they pulled them away. You mentioning some niche launchers that don't make up fraction of the market or didn't even exist back then is not helping your case.
Plus even now how many people use GOG without steam vs Steam without GOG. Show me the numbers.
"everyone has to think different in the exact same way" shots fired
I just kept getting more respect for Tim Sweeney as you rattled off some of his accomplishments and goals. Hearing that he buys land just to preserve it for nature was beautiful. What a gentlemen!
don't let him get too big, he wants to have a monopoly so he can have control.
cant wait to support the more free and open software environment by playing my favorite game fortnite on the one truly open operating system, its not like some greedy corporation would ever want to get in the way of that
nicely done report, good job sir
Another thing with Play Store is, most people blindly believe every app on Play Store is safe, not to say that shady games that target kids
uninformed people maybe
Apple brides the judge for sure
Man 30% is ridiculous number its just too much man this is absolutely insane
That's steam's cut as well. Which is similar to that (a distributions model)
it's what everyone does; content hosting services get quite a bit expensive as they expand, and back then this was basically set as a standard. whether it's still needed now I don't know.
30% is industry standard. You have to realize that a platform like google play, steam, playstation etc handles a lot of stuff for the developer. They manage a storefront, payment processing, user review system, cloud saves etc.
Its 15% if you earn under $1M each year
most countries tax 33-35% of the entire population weath production
Its crazy that in america they think about monopolies as somthing good
Now that the EU is forcing Apple to open up “shops”, will this restart the process for them?
We’re living in a world where less monopoly means more monopoly, and more monopoly means less monopoly.
This is all because we treated Harambe wrong.
Nothing new here. The EU once fined Microsoft 500 million for including their own browser in their own OS, but didn't care that Apple did the same.
@@maythesciencebewithyou bruh
Epic needs to do this with Roblox, taking 75% of developers earnings for a game they created has gotta be stealing
Great video crazy ❤
this is the news i need with the voice i need with the info i need with the edit i need, please, don't stop. also in need: a mod for operagx where every time there is a need of a sound you hear "this is the code report", and now I have a new task in hands
"Everyone has to think different in the same way" dro ain't wrong 😂
Epic did win against Apple.
Why else would Google and Apple change their terms to only take 30% after the first million and not before it.
We all owe Tim Sweeny a debt.
Jeff, i don't know about your skills as a developer, but you are super entertaining and your references and quotes are always top notch and witty. Don't ever change!
I'll share a couple of points that should help clear confusion as to why Epic won against Google & not Apple, despite the latter being arguably "more monopolistic" on account of their walled garden.
1. Epic managed to show that the existence of alternate app stores on Android was a sham - they're all controlled by Google. For eg., they showed emails b/w Samsung & Google execs negotiate a deal where Samsung's app store would only have the front-end developed by Samsung's engineers. Essentially the entire back-end infrastructure including payments, would continue to be handled by Google's App store. Of course Samsung would be compensated for giving up control.
2. Google arguably miscalculated by agreeing to a jury trial, as opposed to having the matter decided by a single judge, as it is common in these types of cases. Companies don't like unpredictability in these matters & having a judge bring the parties together to hash out a settlement is the usual way to go in these cases. Post jury selection, Google did try to remedy this by walking back, but then it was too late. This is a significant reason for this verdict which caught legal analysts by surprise, as normally Big Tech usually wins.
seems strange. the public is mostly against bigger big tech. a judge would probably have been more favourable for google.
This at the same time helps adblockers and trackign blockers in their fight against Google.
Interesting video! 💙🌼
I hate Apple so much for their monopolistic behaviour
I was looking for comments like this 😊
Why?
Once you can side load on iOS I'm getting an iPhone, until then, I'm stuck on the shitshow that Android is.
Hi @Fireship, I hope and pray, you are happy, healthy. I have a question => I have been using Jetbrains IDEs for sometime now but now I feel like I can get stuff done on vscode and it feels like getting expensive for me. What should I do cant makeup my mind. I have a macbook and mostly .net dev at work and js or go personally there is no such requirement of ides work wise.
Why did you stopped using Jetbrains products and what should I do?
Stop using Jetbrains products? you answered it yourself " but now I feel like I can get stuff done on vscode". You don't need any advice on this do what is best for you in your situation. I occasionally use Jetbrains products for some languages like C++ I find it very useful for that language, but I don't and probably wouldn't want to for GO and JS. Those languages are generally easier to set up a development workflow in VScode that is as good or close to as good as any Jetbrains IDE is. But that's me, you do you man.
What about third party apps on app store ? Is it due to EU or Epic Games ?
How in the world did Apples walled garden live this but Android with its ability to allow sideloading and installing other matketplaces didnt??
Epic Games speaks of monopoly when they are actually making exclusivity deals.
Imagine praising Epic and Sweeney when they are as anticompetitive as they get. Look no further than how they run the Epic Games Store, and how they bribe developers to launch exclusively on it; as opposed to how Valve runs their store with no exclusivity deals. Epic tries to force consumers to use their platform by buying up games and IPs and forcing them to only be sold on EGS, whereas Valve entices consumers to use their platform with an amazing feature set and user experience.
You have to be kidding right? No shit the monopoly that is Valve doesnt need to sweeten deals when it started out as the defacto XD
Exactly. They are the worst in tech world and they dare to sue others after all...
@TurtleKwitty
GOG exists.
Blame the developers/publishers for taking the exclusivity deals in the first place instead of Epic offering them lol
@@dilbertron2 Can make the same defense for Google here then.
Keep posting daily, I love this coding report. ❤
Stevies' quote should be sub-tended 'with how the current conditions & procedures in the world are laid out'.
Steam is next. Steam charges 30% apparently too. But if Apple, Google and Steam are all doing this, is it really even a monopoly? Or just the current industries pricing standard?
Newsflash, it's the standard. Epic is just throwing a fit about not being able to get a bigger cut. The billion dollar corporation is only looking out for themselves
@@KibaWolfbane Thats what I figured. Epic is stirring things up for themselves. Also people hate on blockchain, but blockchain was legally declared as workaround for the Apple app store.
Epic games could have just use the technology’s security functions payment processing, to skirt around Apple’s 30% price tag as the legal systems in the US has deemed it legal and not a violation.
This doesn't apply to steam because valve doesn't try to coernce or bribe game devs to exclusively release on their platform.
Ironically enough, the epic game store would be closer than steam of being guilty of this, but epic isn't even the largest player in the PC game distribution field, let alone have a monopoly, so they can't be shown to be exploiting the market in an impactful enough way. Essentially epic is unethical, but they are too shit at it to be harmful to consumers
Google Play takes 15% if you earn less than $1M each year, the same conditions are with Apple, 15% if you earn less than $1M each year. So the 30% mainly affects larger apps. With Steam though, they do take 30% from the start until you earn $10M which then it drops to 25%. The thing with Epic though is that they have a 12% cut from their launcher, so make what you will of that
@@beastlymc9562 doesn't matter when Epic doesn't give you free communities to promote your games, free workshop integration for communities to mod your games, free Akamai CDN that's far more reliable than bloated Amazon AWS that Epic uses, etc.
But you probably don't understand how all of that comes from the 30% cut.
The long-term impact of the Epic Games vs. Google lawsuit remains uncertain. However, it has undoubtedly created a significant shift in the mobile and game development landscape, with the potential for increased competition, innovation, and fairer terms for developers. As the industry evolves in response to this landmark case, developers will need to be adaptable and strategic to succeed in the new app ecosystem.
ah chatgpt
"Think different in the exact same way" - apple
0:46 afaik one needs to sign up to something with Google in order to even see the source code
Well, thanks to EU sideloading is coming to IOS
Yay, the feature that nobody asked for
@@trentbosnic yes but it could change the view on apple in the case mentioned in the video
One of rare cases that I respect EU. Some entities (like apple) only understand POWER!
Classic google
Meanwhile Tim Sweeney:
Pays developers/publishers for exclusivity on the Epic games store, and also charges a percentage fee for games developed on the Epic engine... Pot meet kettle.
Bro, do u have an ai to find or generate short videos and photos to ur exact needs?
Playstore allows side loading for payment methods while Apple store does not . Epic is crying so much for no reason. 😅
That's not how law works. Winning against Google allows them to fight Apple again using this win as advantage.
It's funny how Epic and Tim Sweeney blasted Linux as a trash OS, and wanted nothing to do with it. Believes that Windows is superior.
Is suing Google and won to have more control to run their software, on a Linux based OS.
Can someone please tell me the logic here?
The serious answer would be that, generally people think of desktop Linux distros and Android as separate OSs. And I agree with that even though that's not entirely true.
Though I don't agree with "Linux is trash" thing.
@@YuriMomoirothat's fair point that Linux itself is fragmented into different mini OS. And I'll admit, the "Linux is trash" was facetious on my part, for his outspoken attitude towards the OS over the years.
The iPhone 111 pro max and boba tea image cracked me up
🎯 Key Takeaways for quick navigation:
00:00 Google *vs. Epic Games Legal Battle Overview*
- Epic Games wins a legal victory against Google, challenging the 30% cut for in-app purchases on the Play Store.
- The case highlights the debate over the fairness of app store fees and the potential impact on the mobile app development landscape.
01:11 Apple *vs. Google Legal Contrasts*
- Epic Games won against Google, citing anti-competitive behavior, while a similar battle with Apple resulted in a loss.
- The closed nature of Apple's ecosystem compared to Google's open-source platform plays a significant role in legal outcomes.
02:06 App *Store Strategies and Developer Treatment*
- Google's Project Hug and financial incentives for developers to launch on the Play Store are discussed.
- Internal documents reveal strategies to maintain dominance, treating top developers differently, and preventing competition from alternative app stores.
03:04 Epic *Games' Objectives and Tim Sweeney's Role*
- Epic Games seeks fundamental changes in app store operations rather than monetary compensation.
- Tim Sweeney's bold approach against big tech, despite being an outlier, results in a legal victory and echoes Steve Jobs' quote on changing the world.
Made with HARPA AI
appreciated bro
These platforms shouldn’t take more than credit card companies. We need to nail them to only getting 0.9 percent of sales rather than 30%. These buttholes have gotten away with this for too long.
Based on your uneducated opinion?
No storefront can operate at those margins, even Sweeny's own Epic Games Store, which takes a 12% cut, consistently loses money by operating its store front. His revenue cut is only propped up by fortnite money, and isnt a feasible business model, as they admitted during the Apple suit.
I don't know shit about enterprises or making money, but I am mad and I'm going to compare two things that have nothing to do and feel self fulfilled making my dumb comment that didn't do anything
bandwidth costs money, and building the store costs money, 0.9 percent will not cut it considering majority of your app downloads is probably free.
alternative is user directly pays the stores to use them, for example I can imagine paying F-Droid $5 to use it. Servers costs money.
@@binaryp69 I don't have the latest data but in the apple law suit they showed that the store itself is profitable and it's down to their weekly free game giveaways and their exclusivity deals that they are losing money. Developing a competitive platform in this market is a costly endeavour and most services of that scale lose a ton of money in their first decade or so until they either start to become profitable somehow or the owner cuts its losses and shuts the platform down.
Google and Apple should just remove Epic from there platforms..
That would create another lawsuit since they'd use their monopoly to influence the market
they have, years ago too
Ok cooperate fanboy
@@gondorianslayer4250 they both run a business…EPIC doesn’t wanna pay them for what EPIC agreed too…so remove them
@@gondorianslayer4250 I couldn’t care less what happens to EPIC
It doesn't matter for OPPO users anyway cuz Epic Games and OPPO had a collaboration that OPPO themselves decided that they make the Fortnite available on The OPPO App Market for users to install and play.
On that note, why xbox and playstation doesn't allow other stores? What is their cut?
Again, having a monopoly is not actually illegal, no one can make Xbox and PlayStation open up to third party stores. So they fall under the apple category. But if Xbox or PS ever did open up to third party stores, and then they bribed devs to not use those stores, then they would fall under the google category
Its not the monopoly that's illegal here, is the bribing and exploitation
So you saying Epic games are Giga chads ?
always has been
So the fact that google gives people a chance to compete with them is what makes them a monopoly, whereas apple does not allow any competition whatsoever on their software making them a literally monopoly but since there isnt any competition apple isnt a monopoly
some economics education would help videos like this a lot. for instance, there's no such thing as monopoly unless government is involved.
Also, the Google case was decided by a jury. Not so with the Apple case.
Calling Epic Games David is a bit missleading. They have Tencent and Sony behind them.
Tencent is controlled by China too. I don't 100% trust Epic Games, even though I have to use them for making games with Unreal. Better than Unity at least.