THE MASON GREENWOOD DEBATE
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 6. 02. 2023
- After news of Mason Greenwood's charges being dropped, questions have now been raised as to whether Manchester United should allow him to play for the club again. Should Greenwood play for United again?
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the answer is no. he should not
Why not
@@BigSoulja69 just cause charges were dropped does not mean heâs innocent. Photographic and audio evidence prove heâs blatantly guilty. if he plays for united again itâs an example of the club condoning this behavior
@@danielsachs-amrami9919 the audio one is pointless,
@@ethanpownall7892 none of its pointless, heâs a wankstain of human being
@@danielsachs-amrami9919Whikst iâm of the opinion that the voice recording is pretty damning, we really donât know. Pictures can be easily faked, and the audio could be but I donât know. It probably did happen but we as observers canât be 100% sure. I also find it weird that her dad said heâs a nice bloke after that happening allegedly to his own daughter.
Rehabilitation doesn't just mean ignoring it happened and getting on with it. It means paying for what you've done, acknowleging it and learning from it via atonement.
Exactly. Some rapists in theory could be rehabilitated however that means they need to serve a lengthy amount of time in prison at the bare minimum and also coming with acknowledging that what they did was wrong and why it was wrong
Greenwood looks like he'll never spend a day in prison so the issue of rehabilitation isn't relevant here
@@fivestarman5130 not being a CZcams bellend and arguing for the sake of it, but having seen the prison system first hand please don't assume that going to prison equals genuine rehab. Time can be easily wasted in jails unless the person is driven to rehab. A forced course could be more beneficial than jail time
What if he releases footage of her assaulting him? What if the lady has forgiven him? Rehab? sick of they girly boys not accepting the law. Let everyone move on. Thank God these eeediots are not judges or in the police. True gerodie is known for making lewd moves over the internet and being a racist should no this best!!! The truth is not always that simple especially I'm cases that are with toxic relationships. Definitely Greenwood needs punishing and help. 2 year delay reputation damage etc is enough as it is. Who are we to judge. I think the two kids are actually back together.
He knows and should no even close to thinking of behaving in that way he will be buried in his career and in jail.
Or in this case nothing because as of now innocent .
what nonsense. the guy has literally been proven innocent based on the entire body of evidence available to Manchester Police and not just one rogue clip on CZcams. Social Media acts like its judge and jury.
Ronaldo payed the woman who accused him of rape 300k,case dismissed because of lawyer misconduct yet he continued playing like it was nothing
People forget with time
@@rashidazzan35 two week memory.
@@rashidazzan35 or women just lie
@@yousefehab4883 True women lie alot of times and it is pure hatred for United, anything that comes from United they will hate no to the bone
says more about the tart who's more concrned with money than justice
There are people who owns football clubs who have done worse but you don't have the same moral approach towards them.
The world ain't perfect... I struggle to understand why Manchester United is held to a different standard
the obvious answer is no, what happened to the no dickhead policy the club was trying to implement?
Why do I feel like this is a jab at Ronaldo ?
@@Pabloess07 wasnât even thinking about him but cheers
@Ardashir Shah đđđ
@@ardashirshah7786just stop with this absolute rubbish, deepfake technology is nowhere near that developed nowadays anyway, itâs easy to tell a deepfake
@@ardashirshah7786 nobody cares about the talent he has, everyone saying itâd be a disgrace to bring him back would still be saying it if it was Phil Jones who was in this trouble.
I really do believe that the majority of fans in the stadium would forget/accept Greenwood back after he'd played a good season or two. Football fans are very fickle.
Replace "football fans" with "people"
Some things are just unacceptable, this is one of them. I never want to see him in utd kit again
@@shapeshifter7676 Marcos Alonso literally killed someone and Chelsea fans got over it.
@@digitalguluv2678people care about their morals less when it comes to the team they support.
Didnt the girl her self forgive him? I mean she is the victim here guys not the fucking fans. Not only that but i hear rumours they are back together.Should Maso Greenwood be stained for life? Murderers get to complete their sentence and get on with life so why shouldnt Mason when he isnt even guilty in the court of law. If you have a problem with that he isnt convicted then maybe go make a petition for audiotapes to have more power in the court of law but you cant because they dont for a reason.
Geordie is right, this is probably the only place a young football fan will hear important conversations like this one
Short answer: NO
Long answer: No he shouldn't
@Ardashir Shah Key witness refused to give evidence, if they did he would be in the Dock. Hardly proof of innocence.
@Ardashir Shah If there was not enough evidence they would not have charged him, they only charge people if they think they have a good chance of conviction otherwise it's a waste of public money,but if people refuse to give that evidence in court there is nothing they can do.
The club I support from my country in South America recently went through a similar situation in which a player who is one of our own, ended up doing something unacceptable. The club immediately terminated his contract no matter if he meant to do it or not, even if he was one of our best players. Just having someone with those kind of allegations brings down the reputation of the club.
Greenwood wasnt found guilty he was
I agree. You can't have your business or football club associated with these types of things
@@franklingoodwinso you agree Arsenal should immediately terminate Thomas Parteyâs contract then?
@@200779pd why what happened
@@franklingoodwin you donât have any morality in football
I know what my eyes have seen and ears have heard.
No you donât.
You heard a small segment of a hacked audio file.
@@danielberry4765 You know it was hacked? I don't think you do
â@@danielberry4765 hacked đ
@@franklingoodwin
Yes.
It was hacked.
â@@danielberry4765 fcking grow up bro. He's clearly guilty as fck.
Point of fact: The charges being dropped (probably due to a behind the scenes deal) is NOT the same as being found not guilty.
Exactly, glad someone said it.
But I donât understand?
If they excepted money, what does that tell you about them ?
Also doesnât mean heâs guilty either
@@RDKID it means that they feel money is compensation enough for what they went through. You wouldnât say this about a stab victim, itâs crazy how victims of sexual Assualt are judged no matter what they do. A lot of victims arenât mentally strong enough to go through a trial, imagine millions of people criticising you & ripping apart your testimony online. You would take that money too
Wow, that was so stupid and dumb. You, who wrote this are innocent until PROVEN guilty. It's known as the fundamental tenet of western civilization. If you are game, I'll accuse you of a crime, and you will have to prove you are innocent. You don't have to be found not guilty, its for them to make a case, and if you didn'y hear what the CPS said when they dropped the case, "new evidence has emerged". Figure that out. I swear, the world is getting dumber and less critical by the day.
PS: (probably due to a behind the scenes deal), please prove.
We going to ignore thomas parteys case then yet he plays
Theyâre is no evidence Partey did anything , Weâve all seen what the scum Greenwood did
There is no proof whatsoever. Use your brain. Not every allegation should warrant immediate ramifications. The Greenwood case is entirely different
What did he do actually?
@@unluckygamer8821 we saw the texts, partey admitted it
@@damosapien but we donât even know itâs him .
This was a good discussion to have and I'm glad the panel had a lot of good perspectives on a very dark topic.
All these virtue signalling fools will want another chance if someone made allegations against them and the case was dropped. The same people spend 24 hours praising Partey all day long.
Gary Neville will sign him up asap for Salford! Or some team in Saudi Arabia would love to have him
Why would a team in sa love to have him?
@@darknessally this guy is clearly racist and thinks Saudis accept rape, which is not true
@@darknessally big name for cheap.
@@darknessally (theyâre rapists)
@@crunch1495 like they care about cheap lol sa team would never touch that man
Haven't watched the video yet, but respect to Geordie for treading this topic, given what has happened to him recently, not sure many would take that risk under the circumstances
whats the risk? he hardly said anything
I love how everyone knew to tell TG "No jokes" before he even started
KG*
@@arshanslm well, he is sure is cagey about it now
Thats Koulibaly's Grandad
ifykyk
@@hectorsalamanca2961 idk bro đ
@@lewisdewhurst1217 check out @KGthacomedian on youtube. The guy is funny. Also a cast member of Ted Lasso
Crazy how everyone forgets how David De Gea went through almost the exact same situation at Mason Greenwoods age yet not 1 person cares anymore now he's been successful.
Was he filmed in the same way?
@@collydub1987 So what they've done isn't relevant is what you're trying to say? It's whether it was filmed or not?
Man Utd male fan of over 50 years here. I completely agree. If he pulls on the sacred red shirt again, i will seriously consider if this is the club i want to continue supporting. I know what i saw and heard with my own eyes. We need to show support for this, and other girls. I have been villified by other United fans, who would sacrifice morality for club success. It's disgusting they feel this way. This is way more important than football. I have heard that the other current players don't want him back, and i believe ETH will make the right decision. He's made great ones so far!
Dear Bigfoot: *Would SM/BD "revenge" videos, be held, as evidence,* by the female knaves looking to rape the golden goose? ---------------------------------- If Manchester United doesn't play Greenwood, then they shouldn't sell the club to the Sharia law Sheiks, who represent the sentiments that will shake and *sully* the sanctimonious souls on Stretford End's sacred soil.
Kudos to you guys. Lovely to hear people stating what is morally right rather than trying to claim heâs now innocent and should be allowed to play football again. Her recording of him demonstrated how vile he really is.
Dear Tracy BB: Expression of anger caught on tape would have many who are only guilty of not controlling their emotions in hot water in a cold situation.
*Would SM/BD revenge videos be held, as evidence,* by the female knaves looking to rape the golden goose?
Only deluded people claim he's "innocent". The only thing that annoys me is hearing Assnal fans burying their heads about Partey, but wanting to jump on this. Or Chelsea fans ignoring the situation with Marcos Alonso and doing the same.
Wow, I listened to it and all it was was a spoilt desperate guy begging for sex. A bit like the cliche of women wanting some on a Saturday night whilst Match of the Day is on. He is pleading and eventually give up and says, "get off me". When people call others "vile", in psychology, it's called projection. Meaning that it is you that is vile, think about that.
@@edtcreative Only deluded people think they know more than the CPS who say "new evidence has emerged" and ignore it.
Crazy how everyone forgets how David De Gea went through almost the exact same situation at Mason Greenwoods age yet not 1 person cares anymore now he's been successful.
The tottenham guy is out of order and is also a big problem, you don't know why the charges were dropped and until then stop speculating.
real talk, his a bum of note, his one of those know it all clowns
I expected an ugly debate that doesn't take this case seriously from the kickoff and I'm surprised that the new guys actually took this seriously and said the truth and how our justice system continues to fail us.
My work colleague is a man utd fan and the day he heard not guilty he said yes we can finally get a our good player back playing đ€Šđ»
Dear Duggy: Dubious. Where did he hear "not guilty"?
We are hearing Greenwood's case dropped: Innocent.
issue with the kick off is total lack of discussion - its just everyone saying their own opinion one after another, not one person was asked to expand on something they said or was responded to directly.
Unpopular opinion: Thereâs not enough information to accurately judge this situation.
As for Man United, it would be a PR disaster if he shows up next season playing for the club.
I think the audio recording is enough information lad
@@mathewholman927 tell Johnny Depp that
@@_e5598 The audio recording worked in his (the victim) favour. Same with the Greenwood recording, it works in the victim's favour.
@@mathewholman927 not all of the recordings that were in the media before the trial. Short memories on you lot and I'm honestly shocked how much the mob is certain of his guilt.
I heard and saw all I needed grow a backbone you sop he's a rapist and should never play football again!
As a solicitor for 35 years the general public would be shocked to see how many claims of rape are basically malicious attempts to ruin someoneâs life. Proving rape and proving a false accusation are equally difficult. Every solicitor has dealt with both. The amount of relationships that involves consensual non consensual roleplay then a rape claim was made after a fallout is extremely high. This is why police take both phones. Weâll see a pattern of a woman asking to be tied up choked, âforcedâ dominated, videos exchanged on WhatsApp. Dirty talk about it. Then they break up and they will claim they were raped.
Greenwood was accused on social media, she refused to talk to the police, she got back with him and living with him two weeks later. This case is nowhere near clear and itâs genuinely freighting to hear people so uneducated on rape cases just assume guilt.
Remember to prove a false claim you need incontrovertible evidence of a premeditated lie. Thatâs harder to prove than rape because you have to basically have an admission of a false claim or catch them in a clear unambigous premeditated olie and that lie must impact the former claims. So its as hard to prove as rape (with added difficulty in the accuser having to incriminate themselves or be caught in a provable lie) which itself is incredibly hard to prove. So when people say false claims are rare what they are actually saying is provable false claims are rare.
By that logic grape is rare because only 1% of charges end in conviction.
Have you not heard the recording? No one could hear that and think it was consensual. Yeah she got back with him, but that is also very typical of a woman in an abusive relationship, so maybe educate yourself rather than tell other people to be educated.
Iâm not saying that you arenât correct about false claims, but this isnât a case where it is a false claim
@@ryanh2934 Ive heard far more graphic recordings, which also had video, that were later proven to be consensual non consensual roleplay. What do you think rape roleplay sounds like? Over 70% of women report rape fantasies, when you roleplay non consensual sex it sounds non consensual by definition. If he raped her why did she refuse to talk to police in any way and move right back in with him? At what point do you drop your apriori belief a rape claim must be genuine?
@@ryanh2934 So no evidence short of her admitting it wasn't true could possibly change your mind. Because if she gets back with him its proof she's a victim. If she says he did rape her thats evidence she is a victim. No matter what she does short of incriminating herself for a false claim, it shows he is guilty in your eyes. Honestly the jury system is in danger with cases with such an unthinking population.
@@ryanh2934 Yes the solicitor of more than three decades should educate themselves, not the man online who thinks there is evidence against the express view of the CPS. Fascinating. Please tell me all about your legal expertise.
@@YusufTalib interesting that I canât find you on the SRA - thought all solicitors had to be registered with them?
He wonât return for a couple of reasons;
1) the man United womenâs team have publically stated theyâd feel extremely gutted and disappointed if Greenwood were to play for United again. So the players have an issue with his return.
2) The United sponsors wonât want their image tarnished by the Greenwood case, which ultimately has a huge impact on the financial backing of the club. Considering United is run like a business itâs hard to believe that they would overlook their sponsorâs preference.
Iâm a United fan and I just think itâs a massive shame. A kid with so much talent has ruined his future. Yet, his talent doesnât outweigh his unforgivable actions.
He shouldn't. But will other teams share our morals? Whoever he signs for is gonna get a ridiculous talent. Having said that I don't think any prem teams would dare go for him and nor would any of the top teams in Europe
Just a reminder that Marcos Alonso literally killed a woman and he still played 212 games for Chelsea and he's probably going to be a La Liga winner now.
It was a car accident bruh
@@doddojr3556 "Accident". He was driving 113 km/h in a 50 km/h zone in rain. He was also drunk.
Youâre absolutely right on the burden of proof. CPS had a key witness back out, canât proceed, but United can and absolutely should play that clip and say to him âNope, off you goâ. Every sane person who has heard that clip should be saying the same
According to CPS there was new Materials coming to light.
Maybe it was new evidence?
Maybe she extorted Mason with fake Photos?
Maybe she liked the 50 shades of Grey way?
Maybe she said in that clip "stick it in" ?
Maybe she recorded him to extort him?
No you have only seen one story and thats it.
There is always two sides.
All we heard is a clip. It's a very damning clip but it's just a voice recording. It's no real proof of anything without context or further evidence.
The pictures of her bruises were even more damning and worrying, but somehow her dad was seen to be calming and restricting her at the time and speaking quite fondly of Mason and now she's back with him.
There must be more to this that we don't know, and therefore can't take into account. She clearly hasn't taken herself seriously as a victim and didn't take him seriously as a criminal. And stopped the courts being able to take him seriously as a potential criminal.
Anybody who is logical would be able to see that. I had the emotional reaction like everybody else but we've had months and months to think logically now.
@@DirtyJamesUK stop protecting a rapist. the clip is clear she says no and he says he doesnt care.
Well done the kick off for actually having the balls to speak about this. The fact itâs even a debate for people to say he should play football again is crazy
Yes agree 100% of course he has to play again - no conviction and a serious talent
He's not been convicted so of course he should be playing
Technically heâs never been charged of anything đ why shouldnât he be allowed to play football again? Thereâs been plenty of footballers who have been under investigation of rape and assault and still carried on playing. Allot are calling one of those footballers the goat!
@@daylebacchus5395 totally agree if he was a postman heâd be back delivering the post
@@Thailandfc24 Yh it should be down to clubs. Itâs whether they can morally choose whether to sign him. Itâs not for us or the leagues to say whether he can or cannot play
Please have the irish guy on again.
I'm not trying to defend him but what I will say is for as much information as we have compared to other similar cases, we have very little information of what happened. The truth is that we don't know why the case got dropped. And the only thing we do know about the case is the stuff that was posted in the beginning. This case has been ongoing for a full year and we don't know anything that's happened during that time.
Innocent until proven guilty. End of story
@@Samialexchak doesnât work in this case. Blatantly had the charges dropped because sheâs back with him or they settled out of court. Really not hard to get your head around
@@ljcm1750 they stated also new evidence came to the table.
Exactly. We're in dangerous times now that we have men advocating for other men to be punished even though they weren't proven guilty.
I agree consent must be given.
But if she's your girlfriend, you're committed to her, I believe it's her duty.
JUST LIKE it's a man's duty to physically protect her.
So men are expected to defend his women with his life, but his woman can hold him hostage of sex? How's that balanced or fair?
He should be punished if proven guilty. But I also think it's slimey af for her to feign not wanting sex on order to capture a recording of him appearance to r@pe her.
What man immediately says "ok that's fine" when his girl says she doesn't want sex? You're gonna push at least a little bit.
Thomas Partey should be mentioned in this discussion.
the arsenal fan on the table saying mason cant play...
he said the voctim doesnt get justice...
the victim is masons GF, they are back together, the victim says shes not a victim.
Partey admitted he raped a sleeping girl, the girl said she was raped, the only reason partey isnt in jail is because it happened abroad and it was a loophole that has now been closed but for some reason they say they cant look back at 'historic' crimes of a couple years ago.
Why?
100% Becuase if her account was hacked, photos can be altered, etcâŠthere could be a lot more to this story than meets the eye. Parterâs victim has been publicly vocal about it and that is swept under the rug. It might be the Greenwood did all this and more, and should be punished accordingly. But soooooo many people on the internet are speaking as though they know all the facts about the case and Greenwood is guilty.
@@mattsilliman1237 Thisâđœ..
@@mattsilliman1237 one of the facts Hariet was secretlym meeting Mason this entire time, including asking him to pay for her shopping.
Thanks for the discussion guys. Far too often the conversation shifts to the "how do we do right by the abuser?" It is a ludicrous way to frame the discussion, and as one of you guys said, his freedom alone is more than I am comfortable with. Unfortunately the way the laws are set up in the US and in the UK, it has to be a perfect storm in order for the victim to be fully vindicated and believed, particularly when dealing with someone of status/fame/and or money. Rather than ask what is right for Greenwood, we should be asking how do we do right by the victim. Allowing him to play football in any major league would be gross injustice.
Also, be careful how fast you judge people. People judged Depp right from the start and why not she had photos and audioâŠâŠ.oh but reality was so much more. Letâs wait till the other shoe drops. I think itâs not fair to either of them to be judged till we know ALL the facts
Exactly, everyone just condemning Him like we are all Judges... We really don't know anything... What if he's trying to save her imagine and not the other way around...
The bald guy with the shirt especially, what a fucking white Knight.
Let's all remember robinho is still playing football.....and he was charged with much worse things
Convicted and tried to be extradited.
Isn't he currently in prison
I donât understand how you can make an apology video for your last blunder begging for a second chance and donât even give the slightest bit of that same energy towards this guy
Funny how certain people on this panel forget they've had 2nd chances in life for nasty things they have done, but they won't entertain that Greenwood (who was thrusted into the limelight at a young age) can be re-educated and change his immature attitude.
As KG says his whole upbringing has to be brought in to question. No one is ignoring what happened, but there should be a chance to rehabilatate himself for wrongs he has done. Then possibly in time after attending therapy or counseling, either as a condition of probation he could become an advocate against domestic violence. Taking responsibility for his actions and making a sustained effort to change behavior.
Thanks for this conversation. As a Utd fan I've been pulling my hair out with my mates and other supporters feeling like I had a minority opinion on Greenwood. He should be gone. I think it's clear he can't play in England anymore. One thing is for sure though - He'll have a lot of suitors in Europe and beyond. Question for the England team if he continues to play at a high level - Questions will keep coming up - Is Greenwood coming back? One thing is for sure - The guy isn't going to go anywhere unless he starts to make right - He hasn't even apologised yet!!! I'm sure he's been advised to say nothing so as not to incriminate himself further, but will any team take him if he refuses to address the issue?
why would he apologies? his stance thus far has been not guilty? that'd be admitting something happened and then they'd probably re-arrest him and charge him.
@@Shard3432 Exactly. He's in the catch 22 of not being able to apologise/admit to anything, while also not being able to deny that was him on the recording. That's untenable for Utd. He's done.
@@damienhughes8823 he's done at united for sure, shame really as I'm a believer in innocent till proven guilty.
@@Shard3432 trouble is that he IS guilty! Not legally but there's not doubt that it's him on the recording (He would have denied it was him if so). He's let everyone know he's an abuser.
@@damienhughes8823 again, you can't state that with 100% certainty, have you analyzed the recording?
also his lawyers will have advised him to say nothing on the subject.
Should leave it to professional people as the investigation team, lawyers and wise counseling services have done there job. Let's move forward with forgiveness and hope
So we as a society just pick & choose if we accept the judge's decision?
its not gone court the charges have been dropped
@@pauljones8218 I know. The outcome of the investigation I'll say then
Very good video putting up genuine and right points. This stuff needs to be aired and listened to, so thank you for bringing this content!
Serious question for those who say no in absolute terms - so what happens to him? Because if you think him doing what he has been accused of doing makes him not good enough for Man Utd, then he shouldn't be good enough for any enterprise, right? Because why should any other business have different moral standards to Man Utd?
So does that mean, people in his position should all just be abandoned?
He's a multi-millionaire already, he quite clearly has no shame but if he did, it'd be smart for him to live his life in private with his millions and hear nothing from him again.
@@tomzknight7412 Fair, but he's also only 21. He was a teenager when he did what he did. That's not an excuse but my question wasn't limited to just him. I don't think he in particular should ever play professional football.
Buy my question wasn't limited to him. When kids make a mistake, and he for example was at the club since he was six. The coaches at the academy have had a major role in his upbringing and not just his football, not that they should take any responsibility for what he has allegedly done, but you can't be mad if they wanted to help him do better as a man and helped him through this period. If there is penance for what he did, there should also be a path for redemption is what I'm saying.
Now, this guy hasn't actually owned up to his mistake yet, and has had no penance for what he did. So you can't make that argument for him now, but people act like 1 bad episode in life should just end it.
@@amrithbharadwaj4945 I see your point. For me anyway Greenwood should've admitted to what he did and faced the necessary punishment. Then after he served his term I fully believe he deserves a second chance in life if he's willing to change, however he's not going to apologise as it would be an admission of guilt so until he apologises, he deserves nothing from anyone and it's his problem in my opinion.
@@tomzknight7412 why should he admit if he's innocent?
it's not even an accusation at this point. there's literal video evidence.
Should Partey play?
Unless you can show pictures or audios like we can with greenwood then yes, can you though? Didnât think so, shh đ€Ą
@@allip2modsaresimpingdiscor284 so he is safe because the lady didn't record?
@@justrandom2871Sadly yes. The reason why Greenwood shouldnât play is because we have enough evidence to say so. Most people arenât just going off of her accusations but the recordings are solid proof for most people.
In a better world, we would have a lie detector to be able to see whether someone is guilty or not. Sadly, we donât know if Partey is guilty or not.
@@justrandom2871 sadly yes. Itâs obvious he did do that but the lack of the same evidence that Greenwood had put in the public domain means heâll get away with it
Honestly - no. He got off one rape on a technicality (similar to greenwood. Only greenwood looks like he's paid his way out of it which Partey didn't need to do due to the law change). Still has 2 counts he's on bail for I think that the police are still investigating. Any other club they are suspending him. Arsenal... nah...
ETH benched rashford for being late, the guy's standards for ethical and upright conduct are high.
We need the same energy for Thomas partey whoâs got bail for the 3rd time
Ah, so he was the mystery footballer arrested. Just reading up on it now.
@@finfog4590 He hasn't been named by either the police or in the press. If you had read up you'd know that
@@franklingoodwin chill out
@@danielcalvin1497 Why? People are acting like they actually care and are point scoring. They'll defend Greenwood by saying what about Partey. Partey hasnt been named by the police
@@franklingoodwin neither has mason greenwood though. All police statements say â21 year old maleâ. It was only United suspending him and the evidence posted that told everyone. Iâm not defending him at all I think heâs a twat but mendy and greenwood have been publicised but partey and bissouma still play
Charges dropped doesnt mean innocence he shouldn't be allowed on a pitch ever again
charges dropped does not mean guilty either mate.
Doesn't mean guilty either so what are you punishing him for?
was she PAID OFF?
@MAG DEBATES who knows... it could be herself not wanting to press charges. It is not that strange for victims to have feelings or empathy towards abusers.
I could be completely wrong, we just dont have all the actual information to make statements
Charges dropped doesnât equal guilty does it tho
Bless up True Geordie. Keep coming with the quality content đȘ
They'll come out and say that they've mutually agreed to terminate his contract. Brings too much bad press to the club.
mutually agreed would require a ÂŁ25m exchange, he's legally innocent man united have no basis to fire him or push a termination. He'll just see the 2 yrs of his contract out.
@@olela6018 25m is a lot less than the money theyâll lose if they back him
@@olela6018 itâs gross misconduct they can easily fire him. Anyone who runs a business knows this.
@@XavierJAlexander lol what, prove it. he's not guilty of ANY charge, they have no basis of gross misconduct, anyone who has studied 1st semester of law would know that.
@@olela6018 hes brought the club into disrepute with his actions, now that the courts aren't involved they can review the vids, pics and audio themselves and render their own decision. He won't have a legal basis to challenge it.
'The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) said it had a "duty to stop the case" following the "withdrawal of key witnesses and new material that came to light".' More details of this need to be released before anyone makes their mind up.
The situation hinges on the context of the evidence released to the public. Itâs all well and good making judgements based on the pics and audio but we MUST know what other evidence came up in the investigation before coming to concrete conclusions. If it happens that there was hacking involved and there is context to provide (role playing etc) then itâs only fair this comes out for everyoneâs sake. If this evidence doesnât exist then you can only go by whatâs there and someone with that attached to their name should not be playing for the club but everyone deserves the right to defend themselves and we as fans deserve to know the truth.
Your comment is full of too much sense
Exactly. People are too quick to pick a side. An acceptable response to this stuff is âI want cast judgment yet Iâll wait to see the evidenceâ.
This new material that has come about could be a text from her, or a secret recording of her saying âIâm going to accuse him of rape and beating me so I get moneyâ.
Could literally be that, we donât know. So letâs not cast judgments before we know the evidence.
@@bradley4706 đŻ no one knows, as I seen in another comment everyone quick to forget the amber Heard case
another golddiging tart
@@karazor-el9596 maybe, but no evidence yet. Wait for the evidence.
There's more to it people turn to look oneside when dealing with these issues Ronaldo was eventually cleared Mandy has 8 charges dropped To accuse someone does not mean you are not guilty yourself
I was expecting the comments that KG raised to be raised by True Geordie(Not saying he didnt point out those, he did to be fair). Different cases which might not be same, but I remember when he was taking heat during his Andrew Tate battle, and it will be cruel for us to keep raising such things and label him all that. So big-up KG, the kid shouldnt play for United, but he should be able to play again. Lets not be judge Jury and Executioner.. We allowed CR7 to play, regardless of the dark cloud that was above him, We have Thomas Partey songs we dance to and rate the guy and all but he has a dark past. Lets keep the same energy, we have the legal system for a reason.
Nabi kieta was arrested for actual rape!! greenwood was arrested for ATTEMPTED big difference
The thing people are missing out on here is she said she didn't post or leak them and didn't want to. She also didn't want to press charges this was all done. Surely if the victim's wishes matter here not the public.
The fact that no one kicked up a storm when Marcos Alonso literally got a woman killed is mind boggling to me. Greenwood should be able to atone for whatever he has commited. It might not be what people want to see, but second chances seem to be a foreign concept nowadays. Imagine TG had to have all his social media accounts banned after his disgusting "jokes". In no way do i condone any violence against women, but as a society, we seemed to destroy people before they can even attempt to change.
Whataboutery at its finest. You're such a wallad. What does Alonso have to do with this?
Facts
You canât compare someone making offensive jokes to what greenwood did. Youâre an absolute scumbag.
We can't live in a world where we don't give people a second chance.
Imagine what would've happened to Chris Brown with the Rihanna issue if their situation happened recently. People would've fought to cancel him and make sure he never releases music again. These days people feel like you should cease to exist if you did something terrible.
@@TheDreamchaser2016: Rihanna recovered well. She'll be at the Superbowl.
He already does. Just not at a club like United
Most people asking for Greenwoods head are not United fans so there's a level of Rivalry...
The so-called evidence to a Trained eye is far from conclusive. And very convenient.
If a lady is Beaten to the point of massive injuries.... You walk straight to the police station... You don take pictures
In China.
The girl stayed with Greenwood and is even pregnant by him, the father spoke sympathetically about Greenwood, and the case got dropped. If the girl thought she was treated unjustly, she shouldn't stay with him.
Anything else related to Greenwood's personal life is irrelevant. I'm all for it if Man United decide that Greenwood should play again. đ
expected from united fans to defend a rapist
Money talks
I miss the old Kick Off cast ngl
What happened between TG and the rest of the old crew?
TG said something controversial and the rest of the guys separated themselves from TG. Theyâve since started their own show.
Full heart talk from KG. Well said much love bro.
I love KG bro
I am more for KG's opinion and the way he explaining it
I love the way the kick off has the people constantly interrupting each other thing down
He needs counseling neglecting him right now would make it worse
bro that's what it is...making it seem like his not a person is just demonizing him
@@gooseman1011 we always forget how it's like to be a teenager/young people can't put themselves in being a young person with that much fame
We've spent 200m on RWs and also about to spend 100m on a striker all to replace what this kid brought to the team.
Still don't think we have successfully replaced him
I don't know what to believe anymore. I'm not sure if he did it or did she frame him. But at the same time many lower level male athletes have been thrown into prison for the same allegations and haven't seen the light of day after. Until it comes to light the female was lying about it. But at the same time she couldn't handle it anymore and social media was the only option left.
Should have had this discussion when the match is not on. Serious topic, people trying to make serious points but then you get people screaming after a near goal
Heâs back with the bird. For all we know, it was a back and forth Barney and she released that to be vindictive. Knowing that heâs a dickhead when wound up, but would never act upon it. So, he may have anger issues but nothing else. Iâm not saying this is the case, but it might be.
Unfortunately thatâs just the case with many abusive relationships, the victim usually doesnât feel like they can/should get out. But the pics of bruises and audio of him forcing himself onto her clearly shows he will cross boundaries. The big problem is, is that itâs likely only a matter of time before someone else becomes a victim.
She also claims she wasn't the one who released the clips
@@KooKenjiClips If the victim forgives him then the public should especialy if he isnt found guilty like in this instance. if you have a problem with that then complain to the authoities why audio recordings dont have much power in the court of law but you cant because they dont for a reason so dont judge him for it.
There are players who have continued their careers who have been involved in similar situations to greenwoods .the public have been privy to the seemingly gory details which has magnified it .presuming the public are not enlightened on what this new material has come to light that has meant his charges have been dropped i think he deserves the opportunity to get on with his life and his career as a footballer although he will need a thick skin to do that with the abuse that he will be targeted with .
Look at ronaldo he got through it pretty quick
Even if I were to look at this purely from a hard-nosed commercial perspective, the damage to the club's reputation and dressing room morale by playing him is worth far, far more than the player's contribution.
How would you know how his return would affect team morale?
@@dimitar297 I don't - that's simply what is being suggested by the video.
Given that - and the reputational damage-, i don't think the value of MG's contribution would be comparable to the damage done - not even close.
Now, reading between the lines of your question, whether one agrees with the suggestion in the first place is a different debate - for instance if you don't think the clubs is harmed at all then you wouldn't have any trade-off to weigh-up to begin with.
You can disagree with the system, but it's the only one we currently have. The charges against him were dropped. He's a perverted man, but no one deserves to lose their livelihood like that. I don't think he should play for Man United, but he'll probably never play professional football again.
Mason Greenwood deserves a full apology
Here for the Irish guy, great addition to the team
In this country innocent until proven guilty is a thing. No dog in the fight. If the police can't prove an allegation then what crime has been committed
partey is playing (i wish he wasnt similar evidence shown maybe it was slighly less) arsenal fan too fyi
no bro, the evidence wasnt even remotely similar
How is this even a debate
does anyone think greenwood will seek rehabilitation if he does or doesnt get released by man utd? that to me would be tacit admission of guilt. therefore making holding onto him untenable
Amazing how every random person things they know best when it comes to legal matters, above the criminal justice system. If itâs as obvious a decision as everyone seems to think, then the charges wouldnât have been dropped. Innocent until proven guilty loses all meaning when people act like this, the reality is heâs been deemed innocent, and any other opinion on him being rich is all speculation.
As a human being, no. He shouldn't play for Manchester united ever again. His name and reputation are tarnished and if they decide to recall him and play him, then United's name and reputation will forever be tarnished. The evidence is there to prosecute him and I find it shocking that the case has been dismissed.
HOWEVER
As a football fan, his talent is too unreal to pass up. There will be clubs in Italy, Spain, even France who will take that gamble because of his age and a few years down the line, this whole issue will be swept under the rug or even completely forgotten. I don't see him ever playing for England again. I don't see him being that "prodigy" that United and England fans hyped him up to be, but if he can genuinely and sincerely apologize and get the help he needs, then by all means, let him play. If that's the only job he sacrificed his time, money and energy into, just for it to disintegrate over 1 stupid decision, he deserves a second chance.
This happens in sports. American athletes using racial slurs,domestic abuse cases, physical altercations, to name a few and they don't get the media coverage
Why?
Because athletes are human beings, just like you and I. They will have moments where they lash out and while I don't condone it, I do think he deserves a second chance. Not because of his name nor his money, but because he is a human being.
Morally, he shouldn't play, but as a football fan, he deserves a second chance
He won't ever apologise because that would be an admission of guilt. Until he admits what he did and faces the necessary punishment, he deserves no chances.
Great stuff lads đ„
Where's inocent until proven guilty
She didnât want justice. She dropped the charges. For whatever reason, she wants to be with him more than she wants to see him punished. Itâs sad, but itâs her call.
If he could do it to her he could do it to another, it's not just her call
Yeah itâs her call to forgive him but he shouldnât play football again
Yes, if you punish Greenwood, you'll punish her as well
@@QuickxScopexKing thatâs true. But without solid enough evidence for the cps to convict, then itâs in her hands.
You seriously don't understand how many works, do ya?
Thereâs more United fans who donât want to see him anywhere near the club again than who do. But of course you only mention the ones who would happily see him back
No not really mark goldbridge done a poll keep or sell and mason won by a landslide. Me I want him to play, heâs a black man whoâs alleged raped a white woman if he was guilty he be behind bars for less
This whole situation, and that's what you're offended by, have some shame.
Your delusional if you think this,majority of Manchester Fans want him back. Maybe you should be more specific to those in the UK
@@LoftusBlake any Manchester United fan who deserves to breath wouldn't want him near the club again
@@dansomething7742 just another emotional response
Great conversation
we still do know why the witnesses change their statements like its been 13 months since going to prison and yet someone changed their mind
On about her justice when sheâs now pregnant with Greenwoodâs kid đđ
The money men will decide. If we lose sponsors because our brand is tainted he has no chance of returning.
Football players like all people in sport are role models for children etc. Someone who has these questions asked of them and who has lost in the court of public opinion this badly should never be in the that position again.
As a United fan, cant wait for Greenwood to lead the line. Don't know wtf KG is on about, the case is dropped, the girl has forgiven him and is back living with him. IF SHE DOESN'T CARE, WHY SHOULD WE?
Actually so good to hear men talking like this. Thank you for putting this video out.
Edgar Alan poe said " believe nothing you hear and half of what you see".
Mistakes dnt mean life gotta end let the lad learn n use his influence to more awareness if he shows empathy give him a chance n all our opinions don't matter what does the victim feel if she feels he shld play let him play even if it's for man united
Irish Guy is a legend, delighted seeing him here
Him not knowing anything about football, he should fit in well đ He is a legend though, just not for his bad football takes
@@franklingoodwin the irish guy is not trying to claim to be some football genius, so he is not as unbearable as lot of football youtubers
@@shinebanana4084 I get it. I watch him for the vibes not expert analysis.
He's a funny guy. His bad takes and predictions are some of the funniest things he does, that and his hatred of Paul McShane đ
Simple uneducated guysâŠ.. Amber Herd had recordings !
You literally think the police and CPS are covering it up because heâs rich đ€ŠđŒââïž
If I was Mason Greenwood Iâd sue you âŠ.
I hope he does as youâll be paying out big bucks and apologising publicly!
If it can be proven that the Audio was not him, then I donât see why not, but if it canât, heâll probably play again just maybe not for man United
The audio is him. It's not in dispute. Not even his lawyers are arguing its not.
In response to the guy's comment about rehabilitation and what does he do now - go and do something, still using you skill set as a footballer but for WAAAY less money, where he doesn't get to be a public figure. Go and teach football to prisoners or something like that. Or like the other guy says, go to uni, get qualifications, get a trade - he's got the money to do anything he wants. And like the other guy says. he's 22.
Thereâs literally a video of Kareem Hunt (NFL Player) punching a girl and heâs still playing till this day. Greenwood should be allow to play again.
Do you think punching someone is as bad as sexually assaulting them?
Of course not
I'm going to wait till we get more about the case to make up my mind. There has gotta be stuff we don't know keeping him where he is. He is still dating her btw. Not an all clear by any means but there seems to be more layers involved than people wanna make it out to be.
Is there a full version of this video?
You had to be there
Even if he was allowed back at the team, I doubt he would be any good. The guy hasn't played football for 2 years