A New Vision for Consumer Hardware | Framework
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- čas přidán 14. 06. 2024
- There's a different way to build consumer hardware: creating an ecosystem for modularity & upgradability. Framework is reinventing laptops, and soon much more, in Episode 39 of S³.
Startup: frame.work/
0:00 What's Framework?
1:33 Audience & Model
4:50 The Laptops
8:04 Employee #0001 at Oculus
10:57 New Audiences
12:26 My thoughts
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"that's not our product, that's YOUR product" that's what every other corporation is trying to erase from our heads. We don't own anything anymore. Thank you, framework, my next laptop is going to be a framework laptop.
Yeah, glad I saw this, its an idea that everyone wants!
@@ThunderStruck94660 And I'm willing to pay extra for it
This product is not the solution as the price is absurd. I change my laptops every 7 years. I can buy 3 laptops with similar spec for the price they currently charge. This means I would have to change nothing on the laptop for 21 years for it to be somewhat worth it money wise.
Now if you look at the products from 20 years ago, they look nothing like today, this laptop would not be able to follow the technilogies.
Finally, if that is the start price there is no way replacement part would come cheap and now that you are force to use their product it might even be worse.
@@TheRealLeccho Yeah, I just checked the price.....yawsa!
@@TheRealLecchoapples and oranges.
You are talking about replacing a whole laptop every 7 years, whereas the point of framework is that you don’t need to.
If in 7 years you find you need a performance boost you swap out the main board, if your port requirements have changed you can just replace them, etc.
As he said, it’s about longevity of the product not frequently milking consumers for the cost of a whole new device.
Bro the video start with the founder breaking into the building thats crazy!
Edit:
One thouasd that was unexpected. Thank you!
We forgot the keys!
true problem solver
LocksmithLawyer is a saint for helping people not buy junk locks 😅
How's that crazy? he just forgot the keys. I have the same problem all the time. Sometimes I also fail to remember if I own the place but that's Ok people usually help you with that
@user-em1nn4nv7j LMAO
If framework ever starts to make modular phones I will be buying one IMMEDIATELY. They're one of the few companies these days that I really have a lot of respect for. Cheers
Agreed
Yes!!
Fairphone already does that
I think a Framework and Google collaboration would go great together for developing a modular phone. They've got all the stuff in place for it to work out great if Framework acted as an active design consultant for a joint modular Pixel design. Google already started and they need a large manufacturer to get chips from.
@@EconaelGamingthey're repairable, but sadly not upgradable. Still cool, though.
I really hope they don't ever IPO. Because then we'll be back to square one pretty quickly.
You’re so right. Corporate greed kills off all good intentions. Google is a great example
well they have Linus of LTT as investor... pretty sure they are in good hands
(Linus did say he will divest if he thinks they are shitting things up, during one of the pre-investment WAN show episode)
@@PrograErrorSo he will just divest when the time comes then and tell everyone about it. If they're really that big it won't matter much
@@tvm73836To be more specific, I would say the boards of highly successful companies tend to be controlled by large financial institutions, which exist to extract as much value as possible and return it to their investors. At Google, Larry and Sergei became embroiled in scandal and stopped fighting off the parasites. Tech companies create long-term value that's bard to measure. This is not necessarily the fate of all public companies but requires a strong executive team to avoid.
@@rothn2 it could be a goo or a bad situation. He'll divest if they go a course he doesn't like
I feel guilty for not yet buying a framework laptop, they're doing great work.
Most of us that are very interested in this company, just have desktops. We love that we can get a good repairable laptop to possibly even game on but yah, I’m just glad the next gamer generation can start their journey with a very good laptop.
Don't feel too guilty, Framework themselves have said that they would rather you keep your current device as long as possible before buying one of theirs, since their whole thing is keeping e-waste down.
You should not have to feel guilty for not buying Framework hardware.
You should feel guilty for buying Apple hardware, or HP hardware, or Microsoft hardware, or Samsung hardware, or any of the known closed-source hardware producers. They are the cause of soo many, soo many problems. Just for their profits.
@@yniwazai9877I don't have £1699 to blow on a laptop that is slower than one for £800. Also, I can repair a Lenovo pretty easily lol.
would've bought it but it's not even available in my country
Nirav and Framework are a case study in creating a great business that puts the customers, the environment and the engineers that make it face-first and honestly it's a very refreshing break from the almost "single-use" nature of consumer hardware. This is the first time in a while I've been excited for consumer hardware and they couldn't start shipping to my country soon enough.
Jason couldn’t have wished for a better opening! Breaking into your own office! Loving S3!
Another thing i realized is that framework main business may become the selling of mainboards.
The Laptops being the main atractive product, but the mainboards being so small and versatile. Just makes them incredibly valuable for thinkerers. Licensing the use of the Mainboards for independent hardware will be cool.
I've got my eye on some many cyber deck and diy steam deck builds!
License? Just make it open.
@@whatilearnttoday5295 Well, yes, my brain is still wired in the old way when talking about business.
What we also need is for framework products to ramp up and get cheaper!
@@Splarkszter None of these types of businesses are truly open. You always need to join their "Association" or "Federation" or whatever they call it. You always need to agree to their terms and even pay them money.
If they play their cards right, it would not be surprising to see a Snapdragon Framework laptop in the near future with solid state cooling.
Now they're gonna make cars that you can't replace the tires on
who
@@__systemctl__ they
@@__systemctl__apple was gonna do it
Fortunately they failed.
@@__systemctl__ You know Tesla's gonna try, if they haven't already.
@@scheimong Tesla's basically become the Apple of cars... (I don't mean that as a compliment.)
Please make it available worldwide. I’m in Kazakhstan, and I just ordered a prev-gen ThinkPad T14 from a local reseller because at least it has a RAM slot and upgradable SSD. I’d give the Framework Laptop a shot if it were available here.
The way he talks, you can tell that he’s smart. He doesn’t use words willy nilly. Doesn’t try to intimidate you with jargon. But you can just tell.
more like he's just technical...
I always have the feeling that people who use too much jargon or try too hard to appear smart usually aren't that bright. He's an engineer with an eye for business
@@oblivion_2852it's the Feynman technique. It's like you explain it to someone and then ask them back what you explained and don't blame the other person for not understanding if they can't explain it back.
He's extremely articulate, obv v smart. Typical C-suite personality.
This guy has rolled really well, and not only has gotten high stats in intelligence, but wisdom and charisma as well. I hope his luck doesn't run out, that he is able to power through, and is agile enough to dodge any traps or pitfalls this industry holds. It's an absolutely magical product and I believe it would very positively contribute to the health of our ecosystems and the value of our technology space. May the experience of his previous successful endeavours forward into the future.
Repair- and upgradeability is the best thing ever, they are the complete opposite of planned obsolescence!
Fantastic episode!
This has sooo much potential. I really hope Framework can scale-up and totally disrupt the industry. The 16 will probably be my next laptop. Seems like a legit righteous company, one that I'd like to see succeed. I hate how wasteful and anti-consumer the electronics industry has become. It needs to be brought-down and made to heel.
8:30 BASED CEO
What good timing, my framework 16 finally just arrived... and today the algorithm pushed me this video! Great editing man, I've done several framework vids and I truly think they are the most exciting company of this decade. The vision and the products are unlike anything out there rn. 👏
These guys need to make flagship degoogled phones
Check out Fairphone series
YES PLEASE!
And printers, even though I know they don’t want to have to do that one 😜.
1. Buy a pixel or some chinese flagship.
2. Flash a custom rom.
3. Enjoy your 60% functional phone.
@@jaydeep-p 80% usable
@@jaydeep-p but those likely have hardware backdoors, it just feels too weird trusting a Google phone to put a privacy OS on it.
Just got to say I love my Framework 13 so far. I have had it going on a year now and its held up amazing and even runs Linux like a dream. Can't say thank you enough to the team at framework for giving me my right to ownership back. I hope one day they make a smart phone to got with it.
Which Linux distro are you running?
Are you using the Intel or AMD version?
S tier content and editing as ever.
Can't wait for the algorithm to bring more people to your channel. Loving every episode I see!
Love the framework laptop as a concept, I'd definitely be interested in a more modular personal laptop.
He is definitely in the algo, for a few weeks now. The 'if you like x you may like y" algo, for i assume UndecidedWithMatt and TwoBitDaVinci since i only save search on my tv cookies, logged out...
Please Patel. We need trackpoints of Lenovo equivalent quality. Do that, and hundreds of thousands of Thinkpad addicts will consider you.
Lenovo equivalent quality circa 2010, the trackpoints suck ass on the newer models.
@@mos6581com Sure, but any trackpoint is better than no trackpoint.
you could always just create your own framework compatible keyboard with track points/nub thing if you want. it's open source :p
@@mos6581com Any trackpoint is fine with me, and it works fine on my current, more recent, machine.
@@chimpo131 Well, no. Not gonna do that :)
I don’t know how to describe this style of explainer product introduction but it’s honest and engaging and not patronizing. Good stuff!
Well done, one of the first channels, subbed without needing to watch others in the channel, enjoyed the format, let the subject do the talking and opinion piece at the end. Perfect.
I’ve been saying for a decade that there will be a new line of successful products based on the idea of “right to repair”. Now someone needs to build a car that doesn’t require you to take it to the dealership to change a damn headlight, brake light, spark plugs, starter, heater core or any of a number of things that used to be easy to replace on any car fifty years ago. Some cars even bury their battery so you can’t get to it. Ridiculous. Consumers need to punish manufacturers by refusing to buy vehicles purposely engineered to be taken to the shop for everything.
We gotta get your channel to blowup, been loving your work! It's refreshing to have the subjects/founders walkthrough and breakdown the processes from their point of view. Having them tell the story without interruptions is pretty engaging. Especially when the CEO has to break into his own office. 😂 I hope that makes sense, your production of telling the stories is brilliant 🍻
I really hope they succeed and continue to stay in business. From my research, battery life is a little sub par as with performance vs price. But everything else considered, i absolutely love the direction this company is going and would gladly consider their 16" if/when I ever need to buy a new laptop. QMK RGB is awesome, alternate screen options would be cool and open source options to build your own keyboards (maybe hotswappable switches) and mousepads (using Cirque or similar touchpads) Good stuff Framework. A possible metal framed version could be nice as well. Look forward to what you all do.
If priced competitively and not overpriced, i would definitely buy this as a tinkerer.
spoiler alert
it is not.
You're definitely paying for the ability to replace any part you want. Every customer will have to decide for themselves if Framework is charging more than they should, and should take into account that this is a small company, making a more complex product. It won't be cheap for a while.
@@benjaminoechsli1941Yeah, it's definitely going to take quite a while before economies of scale kick in. That's the paradox that they need a large install base to justify a lower price, but also people don't want to pay the early adoption tax.
It's way cheaper than buying a new laptop every few years so you could say it's a great investment.
I love the idea of customisable hardware, but for me personally I want the best components that market has to offer. If I can build a laptop that looks a sexy as a MacBook (nice chassis, great display, amazing speakers) and has a smooth OS, then I'm in. I imagine many people feel this way.
I think the OS part might be a problem... MS literally has monopoly unless you can go Linux distros...
Great idea and philosophy, Framework is one of the kind, getting recognized and respected.
I love all of your videos. But I especially love covering framework. They do such great work
Framework laptops are the BEST for you and the planet - outstanding devices !!
Bought my Framework 13 a little over a month ago. I absolutely love it and hope to keep it forever!
I love it! Great idea! Wishing you success.
Yes! Glad to see more places covering them
Amazing story and interview!! Cheers and thanks
Nice interview Nirav. Big supporters over here!
Ketzal Sterling started something like this in NZ (Called The Module Project) a few years back. Not just laptops, but his idea was for many more products.
TBH there's many people who started something like this, but Framework is the first to be this successful. tho let's see if the gaming laptop will have a second gen, since according to Linus of LTT it's always the OCM/ OEM that's screwing this kind of projects since they really like to be control... (one of the OEM for motherboards/ laptops had a similar concept of modularity but them screwed the pooch and the project got canned...)
Great initiative Nirav Patel. One of these days, Ill get a Framework laptops.
Framework should partner with companies like Fairphone. You guys all have the same (great) ideals.
for me at least it seems like framework are a lot more passionate and genuine than fairphone are. biggest issue is fairphone doing away with the headphone jack to then try and sell you their fairbuds, which are not repairable like any and all bluetooth earbuds. its a baffling decision
@@oggilein1 well it took courage. /s
This needs more attention! Great concept but this is just the beginning.
I'm not in the audience for this product, but I know people that are. This should work.
Absolutely loooooove this idea! I'm in!
What I really want to see is different chassis. Like an otter box one or one that has drive bays so you could install a CD player
Coolermaster made a tiny case to put it in so you can vesa mount it to a monitor and make an AiO-kinda machine. A youtube channel called Elevated Systems put one inside of a mechanical keyboard. The framework is designed to be made and hacked by anyone. And if someone doesn't make exactly what you need, you can do it yourself. This is why this is a game changer.
@@devnol I like DIYing but I also want to see this company continue to make great products and I think the configuration market is something that they could easily tap into without hurting the DIY market.
I'm worried that they may go the way of pebble and otherwise reach too high of a saturation with the consumer with out releasing a substantially new product.
@@kirmie44 Different enclosures and cases isn't really part of their product design lineup, that's where partners like coolermaster and users on 3d printing repositories come into play. As for the pebble analogy, those guys died because they failed to innovate when competition like fitbit and apple leapfrogged them in 2014. Framework is way ahead of the curve here and their business model is fairly well laid-out. Also, if competition appeared for framework that would actually mean they've achieved their goal which is to encourage and motivate sustainable products. I can't imagine someone like hp would want to follow that model but if they did that would actually be pretty good to see.
@@devnol there are a lot of people who would switch to a Pebble today if they could. They weren't leapfrogged. Their product line up just wasn't that diverse, causing them to run into the oversaturation problem (similar prob TV manufactures ran into in the 2010s). No one wants to buy a new watch every year. Framework is going to have a similar issue. Having partners create components is a neat business model but not many are picking up the torch. A 3D printed main board case is a drop in the bucket for the configuration diversity this Framework can support. I also don't think they are mutually exclusive. If framework creates some 1st party configuration options, it could show the potential. I think a chunkier 13 with a drive bay for a DVD player and a touch screen are 2 easy first party options. I think an Otter Box Style Chassis (military grade durability or something) is a great 3rd Party option. What I think would be a bad decision is to leave all configuration options as Bespoke DIY components. Those are great and should be an option but they are very limiting in market appeal and with hamper Frameworks ability to reach a broader audience.
@@devnol also, your last point there. I think this could be trickier than you think. Other manufacturers are very much able to play the oligopoly and phane repairability in the mean time til framework goes under, then reverse. I want frameworks mission to survive along with the company. I don't think you can keep one without the other.
With my pebble analogy, they were tge reason smart watches gained popularity. You could argue that their mission was complete with the diversity of smart watch products available. However, there isn't anything quite like pebble on left on the market. If framework disappears, other companies might become more repairable, but the upgradeability framework offers would never be matched
I LOVE FRAMEWORK!!! 🚀 💕
Saw one video and I am a subscriber. Into the rabbit hole now.
soceted CPU's would be nice and/or a framework version of the old thinkpad 410 or 440 or whatever that last good one was... like one not so focused on being so slim i guess, but mainly the socketed cpu would be awesome
Yeah, a larger framework laptop with a real sturdy frame and more cooling space would be bonkers. I'm passively eyeing the 16 for now, but if there'd be a framework thick boy on the market in a year or two, I'll definitely be buying
I am so glad that framework exists.
Hope this takes off. Hope all manufacturers do this
This will live or die by the community. The marketing has to be on point and the community nurtured every step of the way
I'm going to buy my next laptop from these guys
This guy knows his stuff
So sick and mad respect for breaking into your own building haha
love the choice to go into the inside of the device from the "top". way more approachable
Really good video and interview!
Wow, this guy is awesome! Cant wait for my framework 16, it will actually be 346% faster then my current laptop! Going with AMD for the first time in my life
Love my framework! Running great with nixos.
We loved the idea. Put about 75 out in our fleet. A year later....NOT happy. Drivers issues, screen issues, etc etc. Want 16 inch cause everyone wants a 10-key. 6-9 months out. Gonna go back to LG grams
0:30 picked their own lock!
1:20 trying instead of replacing a car because you have a flat tire.
2:25 knowing your audience, adventurous but aiming for build out value.
3:54 if Apple was mature, maximizing longevity and repairability.
Good job guys! I work in IT and device repair in SF and would love to promote your product. We've been advocating right to repair for a while and the state of soldered parts is really lame lately and I'm glad someone is oushing back with a better more repairable design.
I avoided laptops for years because of the disposable nature. I would love for this to become the industry standard like we have with desktop form-factors. When I have someone ask me if I can fix their laptop I would always have to say maybe depending on what's wrong with it. I love what you guys are doing! Great Work!
i own a Frame.work 13
batch 4
use it daily for work.
How is it? Share your experience.
@@aniksamiurrahman6365 12th gen intel here, the laptop has had a few issues like the charger cable stripping and my HDMI expansion card not working, framework support worked great and shipped me replacement parts free of cost since I'm still in that 2 years warranty. The laptop itself is great, i love the keyboard. Works amazing on linux, every hardware it uses is supported. For gaming it's bad, the CPU overheats, thermal throttles easily and the integrated graphics are just not good for any 3d game. so i used the fact that all 4 ports are thunderbolt to buy a fairly old 1080 eGPU, now the only thing holding it back is the screen refresh rate which is 60hz but honestly there are very few games where i think it would help to have faster refresh rate. Battery: yeah i get like 6h on Linux, windows I don't know maybe i'd get 5, 7 or the same. The charger is small enough so that you can carry it in the laptop pouch which i highly recommend getting. Overall it's a dream machine, being able to open it up and see it is crazy satisfying and the screen is beautiful and bright enough. expanding its capabilities as i can afford or need is an amazing feature.
@@user-us2qt5hx6o Thanks!
I love the philosophy of this company.
This is a killer product. So cool
I love this. It's about time, really. It's an ecological imperative.
The founder is absolutely awesome. He is just "a it's locked, lets lockpick it". Wat a hands on person.
Love this idea. Please bring out a consumer cel phone with easily replaceable battery, touchscreen and display at a minimum!!!
the battery thing is going to happen due to EU regulations in the coming years 🎉
Fairphone largely fulfills this need, yes? But limited by its price (the cost of ethics) and processor performance (the cost of longevity)
there is a samsung phone with replacable battery
@@yarkee8128fairphone might as well not exist considering it's only available to a small portion of Europe (less then 8% of the world)
The Surface Book was my worst computer purchase ever! I have advocated for these kind of products for years, and I'm glad this company is making it a reality.
I'm definitely buying one!
The fact that they launched the 13 after 18 months is one thing. When the pandemic hit less than 3 months in the US into those 18 months is that much more insane and impressive
very nice concept! ❤❤❤❤
awesome. gonna take a look.
Love this! Hope it will be available overseas (South Africa) soon.
I want one of these so very badly. I don't have a ton of need for a laptop but dang it I want one because I love their vision so much
Damn. This will be my next laptop for sure!.
I eagerly await the sale of this new innovative device!
Breaking into the building due to forgetting the keys at the beginning is the best opening!
I seriously wish Framework came to Singapore. If this were here, the amount of laptop sellers here would probably see a huge loss once word of mouth happens and how good it is. Imagine, if something goes wrong in the laptop, you just buy the part and fix it yourself.
That is really a good ad... I think I will buy one 😱
I kinda want one i wish you could make a lower end version since that would really bring a new audience imagine being able to get something very cheap and then say replace the battery a bit later and maybe upgrade the cpu later since especially with linux u can run smth light
I fucking love this.
Thank you !
I'm shocked at how high this video quality is for a channel of this size. You're killing it.
great interview
Not the founder breaking into his own office💀
Last time I checked the price was through the roof.
grate vid, get well soon mate.
I have had one for the last year as my personal laptop (I guess I was one of those 'early adopters'). The speakers suck, but when they make better ones, I can swap them in myself. I'd get the larger screen option, but having the smaller version is a bit more portable.
I own a Framework laptop and a Fairphone. Love it 👌
So they are launching framework watch. 😍😍😍
Value
Framework: expensive upfront no matter you computer gonna break or not
Evil counterpart: pay when it break
Environment
Retired Framework parts: only tiny group of Framework community may need or buy
Evil companies computer retired: any one in the world who need a functioning computer may buy
Future proofing
Framework: platfrom with large overheads that the whole industry is moving away
Evil counterpart: tightly integrated componts with higher performance and efficiency
Greatest business idea in the world!
Value and Environment get solved as economies of scale kick in, future-proofing has already been proven since you can upgrade your existing laptop with a new mobo and on top of that folks have been able to use the older mobo to create embedded systems as a recycling option.
@@SomeNerd361 No, it doesnt. One of the motivations that the evil companies make laptop less/not repairable is the ecnomies of scale. They are cheaper to make than the modular one. He reinvents the wheel doesnt mean he can do better...it is not like he do anything innovative, he just use the old way to make laptops. In other video, they mentioned that, for the DIY kit, they need to assemble then dissemble the kit to ensure the kit can boost during QA. Do you think such labor intensed process can beat the fully autonomic process that evil companies are using?
For the future proof of the devices itself, I am not sure if you understand the "future" he talking about is not such a far future. When a new product first come up, it usually has a couple of facelifts/versions before they make the next generation and reset the cycle. As he said in the video, the goal is to bridge the people who buy the earlier version to the last version (WITHIN A CYCLE). You should notice that this is not such a large window. Each version would only have incremental performance improvement and rarely any feature upgrade. So the upgrade is only sensible even from the performance standpoint when you have a very early of the computer and upgrade to the last version. And after this upgrade, there are is no "future" for the device. It is not like you put a 40series nvidia on a PCIe 3 slot can have much performance benefit due to the bandwith limitation. It is even less sensible in terms of economics as you have already paid overprice for the spec at the time and you need to buy an expensive part on top of that. And let me review how people who buy early version of evil laptop would do in this situation: wait and buy the next generation that offer real performance leap and new features.
And I have no idea why would you call on you mobo station example "recyceling". You use TWO computer worth of materials to build TWO computer, and at the end of their lifes, you dispose TWO computers and create TWO computer worth of e-waste. You recycled nothing.
Pretty sure the older retired MB can still be used for other stuff much like a Raspberry Pi, which many other people are doing.
i have a framework 16 and I'm happy i bought it! :D
One of the things that draws me to Framework is the concept of actually OWNING my own device. All to often other companies want our money and then want to dictate how we do things afterwards and I'm completely against that.
Don't tell me, planned obsolescence and yearly subscriptions?
Sits down to watch.
Yess love this, will be a customer.
Fair initial assumption tbh !
Id rather spend more for something like this. Cant wait.
This man "Narvan" will do great things in life. i can tell
this kind of modularity is just fascinating. This is definitely going to be my next purchase.
Would love to support the company and buy one of their laptops, just too expensive
Still love my model 13 ❤ build it from parts with my 7j kid. It really is that easy 😊😊😊
I have had my AMD 13 for a bit now. It's amazing enough that my wife nearly got one but she went with a MacBook M3 15" due to workflow. (Plus a chunky discount through work) Framework gets the bits of the 16 right, through that regular iteration, they're cementing their place here.
Beautiful
I saw a smart looking guy at the airport with a computer with a gear on the front. This answers everything. Awesome
What a genuine CEO.