Why Socrates Hated Democracy
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- čas přidán 27. 04. 2024
- We’re used to thinking hugely well of democracy. But interestingly, one of the wisest people who ever lived, Socrates, had deep suspicions of it.
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“We are used to thinking very highly of democracy - and by extension, of Ancient Athens, the civilisation that gave rise to it. The Parthenon has become almost a byword for democratic values, which is why so many leaders of democracies like to be photographed among its ruins…”
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Pro of democracy: everyone gets a vote
Con of democracy: everyone gets a vote
Yes comrade :)
@@nguyenhoanglong420 communism is cancer, you're a clown
@Timothy McCaskey Indeed, the best government for me would be the sofocracy, despite being simple if the science politics were based on that, we could have a MUCH better government
the pro of democracy is there is a vote. And the con is everyone votes. The difference is big my friend mankind are social being the minority thing and decide the rest follows
@@ADUAquascaping Indeed socialism is better
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that."
-George Carlin
A funny quote, but technically then, that would be the MEDIAN person, not the average. It also assumes that there is an equal number of people above and below that line. Sadly, more than half the population is likely stupider than that, as those above the line include many higher (but not outlying) numbers that offset the average further per capita. Just sayin.
Carlin was an atheist , they don't come dumber than that
@@ethanwilliams1880TECHNICALLY, median is a form of average, and since the original commenter did not explicitly say mean (which is what I believe you are referring to), then you could interpret this as the median
@@ethanwilliams1880If the difference above and below average are equal, median and average are also equal. Pretty sure median IQ is equal to average IQ.
@@Rsconquestmedian IQ is not always equal to average IQ.(for a group, on world scale your statement is indeed correct.
However in this context we are talking about a country, which is just a group and not the world total)
For example, if five people have IQs-
80, 69, 100, 150 ,175
Then the median is 100
But the average is 114.8
"Democracy basically means of the people, for the people, by the people. But the people are Retarded" -Rajneesh Osho.
Yeah, but it is said by criminal, who abused weak people.
Stupidity in mass... Is indeed not gonna be helpfull
who?@@JakubSvoboda23
@@JakubSvoboda23 well criminals are unavoidable in society, we cant simply blame their existence. The system we euphemize and deem perfect posseses many oversights. Political systems are made to accomodate the society it is found in, if a "evil" dictator comes into charge without rebellion, we should blame the system.
@@tayar3797 i blame morals of individuals
"Democracy is a system were people are counted, not weighed"
- Allamah Iqbal
If intellectualism is the argument against widespread democracy, then the answer is clear. Make sure every citizen is well-educated in the ways of democracy, & not ignorant of it...!!! Start with proper funding of a quality public education system. Otherwise, we'll end up with a deplorable, wannabe dictator, with 91 criminal indictments, who says he "loves the poorly educated" because they're easy to manipulate.
"Democracy is the worst form of government apart from all of those that have tried before it" - WC
@@Hjh826"it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time." This one is correct and has different meaning.
@@GiorgiTch937 meaning is the same and I couldn't remember the exact quote so I paraphrased. At the end of the day the quote still means "democracy has many flaws but it is the best option we have at the minute"
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."- Winston Churchill
It's a nice quote, but Churchill never actually said it.
Churchill, one of the greatest genocides of the last 200 years
Churchill, one of the greatest genocides of the last 200 years
I saw very uneducated people having more wisdom and consciousness than they so called “upper class” of society. Democracy is a state of well being of all humans, independent of their education. It’s arrogance that block’s our evolution!
Do you know where it came from?
Sounds to me like Socrates wasn‘t against democracy - he was against stupidity given power and influence.
aka low information voters
Well, I suppose he was against the way democracy has been implemented, that is the ability for all to vote with not enough safeguards to minimize uninformed voting. But yeah, pretty much what you said lol.
democracy always favors concentrated interest groups. they have the power and incentive to mobilize while a dispersed public is Ill informed and lack incentives or even successfully get bamboozled by the special interest groups and their sophistry
OK but is it worse than the corrupt high information voters? I agree with rhe ship analogy but what is the solution? Should political science be mabadory in public schools? How do we property educate the masses and who is in charge of carriculum.
Given the scope of power it's impossible to have a truly informed voter base.
My grandfather told me how people can become so stupid.
There was a very good doctor in my grandfather's village. He was also very kind, and he always treated the poor without have to pay and have done lots of social work for that village. So, people started asking him to run for Election, and after some time he finally did.
Seeing his popularity, his opponents made a plan.They started gossiping: "Hey, if the doctor is elected, he will not have time for your treatment, then what will you do?
So the foolish, greedy villagers voted against the doctor.
He's right tho. The doctor best role is being a doctor, not a talker.
The problem is when society appreciate the talker more, aka pay them more.
It's not the political ideal that decide how good that country is for me. It's how much they pay their teacher. Corrupt people can corrupt every single form of government out there.
@@ancy1205 as if there can be no more good doctor.
@@whitecrow20XX the doctor was not only good in skill, but also in conduct. that's why he was loved in the first place. he was literally giving free healthcare.
@@user-yv1ty1ek1l If loving-human like that doctor was that rare, humanity is surely f'd in the first place. It can be reproduced, and what use of education if it can not multiply the skilled and loving people? Your short-termism way of thinking is why the government is f'd up.
They were not being greedy, though. They were simply being logical. The other candidates were right, if he won the election, there probably wouldn't have been another doctor that could live up to him.
It needs to be mentioned that the “Socrates” described in this video isn’t referring the man Socrates, but rather Plato’s character named Socrates.
I was not aware of that. Could you give an explanation?
In every single one of Plato's dialogues where "Socrates" appears, Socrates is Plato's character. We have no idea how many ideas attributed to this "Socrates" are actually just Plato's ideas. All of his dialogues were written after the real Socrates death, so it simply isn't possible for Plato to remember hundreds of pages worth of dialogues that Socrates had.
In Phaedo, there's a line in the beginning that says "Plato was not there [by Socrate's bed] but he was ill", almost explicity stating that Phaedo isn't an accurate depiction of what Socrates really did. We have an image of what Socrates was like based off of Plato and Xenophon, and later Diogenes of Laetrius but because none of the sources are completeley reliable we don't know much about what the guy really believed in.
Also, Xenophon partially is unreliable because oftentimes he did the same thing as Plato and attributed his own ideas to have come from Socrates.
Most of the ideas you hear coming from "Socrates", are actually just from Plato.
@@gipsybauski8971
I think everyone knows that but you can keep bragging I guess
i genuinely disagree. the way things are often attributed to socrates is proof that most people don't know. simply look in the comments and you'll see countless people talking about how Socrates was right about democracy, he was a wise man, etc. when it's really plato's ideas for sure.@@jorgitoislamico4224
0:37 the video mentions that... pay attention.
Killing him for speaking his mind. What a democracy.
Well i think that's called freedom of speech not democracy....sure it is a part of democracy nowadays....but it isn't the same thing
Have we changed much since then?
No more killings sure, but constantly bullying people will inevitably deteriorate their mental health, slowly causing them to suicide . In some ways, its worse today. I remember watching a video about two 5 year-olds fighting, and the comments were absolutely ripping into these kids and their parents.
An absolute constitutional monarchy is without a doubt, the best form of governance. At least it will instill basic human decency in us.
Really? Why? Wouldn't an absolute monarchy just lead to one person having too much power? Or maybe a person who isn't fit to lead receiving it via inheritance?
@@darksecret6050 fun fact, freedom of speech is not democracy
@Imperialismo Pagano Look at all the oligarchs that govern the world.. They are well trained indeed, to serve their own interests
"Stop stealing my quotes" - Socrates
This deserves more likes
“History tells us whenever the first few replies of a comment say “underrated underrated” , then comment is never underrated”
"write that down"
-pluto
Fr people
"I'm dead, so is democracy, wait .WHY ARE YOU HERE? "- socrates
This is why public education and democracy cannot exist without each other
Lol what???? That's like saying without cable news "democracy" can't survive
@@nathanyoung7587 democracy cannot survive without access to information. Dunno why you’d single out cable news, but you were sort of on the right track there.
@@thiccum2668 why do you assume I'm against "news?" And please explain to me how you comprehend that. I'm saying a democracy can survive without" news"?
@@thiccum2668and if you think cable news is"news" and not propaganda please explain
@@nathanyoung7587 oh no, mass media is propaganda. But not all news stations are the propaganda behemoths like fox or cnn.
My teacher says that the ruler in a democracy is a reflection of the citizens of the country. Now I get it.
Rip Hungary
So he didn't "hate democracy" he just pointed out that you need to be capable of logical thinking before you get to vote...
Jason Strom obviously uneducated people that vote is not a good thing but what’s your plan?
@Jason Strom A portion of the people can be whatever they want it's the majority that interests you... Because it's democracy...
Thanks for that. Hate is a really strong word and often used incorrectly. Pointing out the flaws in a system hardly connotes hate
And who decides who is educated or not? There is much to be learned outside of schools as well. In many cases it avoids indoctrination.
Just because the masses are stupid doesn't mean anyone has the right to silence them.
@@daanvanrijn4117 Stupid is one thing uneducated is another. There are numerous ways to measure the quality of the educational system.
The people vote for who they like. Not for who they need
Moreover, they vote those who they *think* they like.
That's a good distinction. A disillusionment between self-interest and apparent self-interest.
I think that's what Socrates meant by the thought experiment of either voting for a doctor, or a candy shop owner.
Absolutely right! Trump and Bush are proof of this.☹️
i just cannot express how right your statement is
Great post. I haven't heard these theories since college. A great refresher.
Democracy depends how you apply... you may not let ignorant to Vote... but offer them to get educated minimally to earn the right to Vote! Be advise that the Democracy is not what the Sociopathic Elite tell you about it. They are selling you an Oligarchic System as if it is "democratic" System. Din anybody (any professors of social "science") tell you about Pseudo-democracy?!
Your Content Stands Out In A Refreshing Way! I Truly Appreciate The Absence Of Background Music In Your Videos, As It Allows Your Message And Personality To Shine Through Without Distractions. Keep Up The Great Work!
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what's for dinner" - Ben Franklin
'The lamb' being the propertied elites whom Franklin and his fellow 'founding fathers' wanted to protect from the unwashed masses!
@@davidparry5310 I see you are unread. For without Such as these 'elites', there would only have been 'unwashed masses' as you put them. These men were made 'great' by the thankful masses who recognized that without their rising to the occasion, there would have been no Great new nation. Nothing near the level of freedom by which to exploit this country to the point of allowing communistic venues such as this one; upon which many an indoctrinated fool perches to crow against those who were willing to give all so that we might know peace for a meaningful measure.
Asinine and uninformed slander against the founding brothers of this nation is why, in part, those like yourself will never be remembered and they will always be.
The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, and ours has been subcontracted to oblivion...
But alas, such has been the way of all great nations.
The last one of us be sure and blowout the candle on the Mantle...
@@techstuf4637 CZcams, owned by a transnational corporation, is communist?
Yeah, I think we're done here. You're obviously too much of a fruitloop to be taken seriously.
Debating
@@davidparry5310 You wouldn't know a transnational if it bit you on the arse. Although, now that I think about it, I wouldn't take that bet.
Ok, NOW we're done here...
🧐
the lesson here is that just because you can use twitter doesn’t mean you understand politics
Anyone who attached themselves to some political party Or extreme ideology will never understand politics, except the politicians who do it of course
@@alice_in_wonderland42
Like the video said, people who are allowed to vote but uneducated will only be tricked and fooled choosing the corrupted before the one that can change and save the country
people on Twitter make me lose braincells
@@alice_in_wonderland42 absolutely agreed, 100%
it really sucks because no one actually thinks this is valid, when in reality it is
I totally agree with Socrates after seeing what democracy has done to my country!
It wasn’t democracy that did anything to your country it was your progressive leftists that is destroying it.
and socrates was living 3000 years before us💀imagine that
What country, and what has democracy done to it?
And that’s not a democracy but an oligarchy with democratic elements
What country?
This was respectfully profound; thank you. 🎉
“The problem with democracy is that people who need leaders aren’t qualified to pick them”
-Michael Malice
👏👏👏
💯💯💯
Who actually "picks" them? It ain't the average voter! They're given two choices by the systems of bureaucracy within the two major parties, of which are funded and controlled by oligarchs who work to protect the status quo and give the false impression of choice.
Or, the options for leader are always very bad...
@@andrebona and somehow people still vote for them. That’s kinda the point, don’t vote for someone just cause they’re running
As George Carlin put it: “Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups”
Spoil Something large group of stupid people can destroy everything around them but can’t solve a problem. Majority of the people must be controlled by minor intellectual group.
Huseyn Hasanov majority of people controlled by small group of intellectuals was called soviet union, turns out 10000 of the smartest (maybe) people in that country could not manage what hundreds of millions did naturally in their daily lives before, eonomic productivity, and because of that failure they collapsed. If you can design a system that has such little power that a group of autocrats can run it, and not overtake freedoms of the governed, well wed be in 1808 or something such.
Goth Floss Josh Soviet Union collapsed because of the wrong economical ideology. The economy of the world depends on the Capitalism and only better ideology can replace it. The Soviet Union was controlled by dictators, not a small group of smartest people. Also majority of the people just eat, drink, work and sleep. They live like an ant. All of them must work on their own department because they are mastered on their own speciality not on politics and management of country.
Huseyn Hasanov My point was you cant sum down all of life to a few intelligent people at the top, and about your point about dictators, there were countless bureaucracies with heads of those but all worked towards the same vision of killing or imprisoning opposition and maintaining power through fear. Ministry of entertainment, Ministry of organization, countless ministries, with their
own heads. The head of state was simply the most powerful among them, it isn't like his power wasn't divided amongst his own government. Majority of people being economically productive leads to shit like us arguing with iPhones over CZcams. Imagine saying that sentence 20 years ago. No one would have a fucking clue. A small group of intellectuals might have quite literally made both CZcams and the iPhone, but the entire market and it's incentives were where it took place, and the market contains every human who participates in it.
@@immaculatesquid If leaders are using the fear, they are bad leaders that who uses religion, political ideology and etc. The intellectuals who controls the country must choose the best decisions for the future of everyone but you can't make everybody happy and give them comfortable life. As I understand you also say that some intellectuals should work on the development of technology and etc. I totally agree with this argument. Intellectual should work on different departments.
wow, thats what I worked out myself couple thousand years later, and when presented it to some public was called a lunatic. Thanks.
IT IS IRONIC THAT I DISCOVERD YOUR AND THIS PARTICULAR VIDEO BECAUSE MY BROTHER HAD THIS DISCUSSION LAST NIGHT ABOUT SOCRATES' VIEWS ON DEMOCRACY; IN PARTICULAR, THE IDEA THAT THE MASSES ARE EASILY LED OR MISLED BECAUSE OF LACK OF COMPREENSION OF ISSUES. THANKS FOR THIS VIDEO
"There are too many incorrect quotes in this comment section."
---Sun Tzu, The Art of War
"Plagarism is the sincerest form of flattery," so it is said. It follows that the converse would be "Incorrect plagarism is the most insincere form of flattery."
Lol
😂 I love it!
"I wonder what this Bitcoin thing does"
-Adolf Hitler, 1931 CE
Ha ha
__ayatollah khomeini 1974
"Democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov
Yes and in this way it motivates the system and the knowledgable people to spread the knowledge so that ignorance is reduced. Because this is the solution if the ignorance gets same weight. The other solution would be to give greater weight to the knowledgable but you increase their power and reduce even more the power deficit of the ignorant ( who already have some lack due to ignorance) and also you motivate increase of the gap by increasing the power of knowdgeable and lessen the power of the ignorant.
@@innosanto
That used to work, but today spreading ignorance has never been easier. The knowledgeable are far outnumbered and easily drowned out. We live in a time where a single well-funded hit piece is enough to refute hundreds of independently researched, peer-reviewed articles.
It also doesn't help when your elected Sweet Shop Owner (and his political party) constantly denigrates intellectual institutions for the sole purpose of keeping the poorly educated easily manipulated.
innosanto you present it like if it’s a bad thing to further reduce the power of ignorant people that way. Why? You know, the way democracy functions now is the way to keep everyone quiet and a little bit satisfied. I don’t think that leads to an optimal result for humanity.
I hate democracy because it has created leaders whom follow the tide. One minute they're going one way, the next they're headed in the opposite direction. FOH
@@innosanto well yes the goal should be to destroy your so called *_gap_* and encourage all to become knowledgeable.
As an Indian looking at how democracy has ruined this country, Socrates was right on every word.
Bhai, 2 mahine baad GATE hai, padhle nhi to AIR 1 nhi aani teri!
@@nirbhaykumarchaubey8777😂😂
Oh yeah? Then what political model do you think would work?
india is quite amazing concerning Democracy. 1.5 billion people are concentrated in that small amount of land with numerous cultures and opinions but it still functions. I acknowledge problems it has but system is still better than other countries.
Alternative system will divide who india. Imperialism, Monarchy, Diccatorship, Communism, one party leadership, will bring chaos here. Diversity can only be managed with representatives. and to have representative means to have Democracy or republic.
@@donotdoit8428so you saying you didn't watch the video.....education....is key....without there are many candy-maker who can exploit democracy and no one would listen to doctors....and thats exactly what is happening in India.....
LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE OF THE PHILIPPINES
Did my thesis on this at uni: when socrates was sentenced to death, it was done so under the expectation that he would flee the city. this was common practice, and after some time, his allies in the city would have been able to quash the judgement and secure his safe return to the city. but by accepting his death sentence he chose to give the middle finger to democracy, choosing death simply to prove the validity of his argument.
Ah, so that's why it is always said that he "chose" death. ^^'
That's badass
He sure showed them
Can you send me your thesis? It sounds really interesting. Thanks
@@fourfundamentals210 I did it ten years ago so i dont have it saved anywhere! General gist was talking about the susceptability and toxicity of moral panics within democratic systems. I compared it to the Mccarthy Trials in the US as a 20th century example of how history repeats itself in this regard. Plato, who was a student of Socrates and has written most of what we know about him, would go on to write one of the most influential books in human history: The Republic, and he did it using a fictional Socrates talking to random Athenians to articulate his arguments. Its not only a nice homage to his teacher but also shows how Athens went on to regret its action over Socrates, since Plato went on to be so revered in the city he would found an academy in the city that would survive hundreds of years
This is so so good! Everyone in this world should see and hear this video!
Great video!
"If voting worked, they wouldn't let us do it" -- Mark Twain
this quote made my day
That is true...it does not work because idiots vote. If voting is done by intelligent minority it would came to our understanding that voting foes not work. All politicians are just corporate and interest groups pawns.
@@kvarnerinfoTV The thing about modern democracy that there are many problems when it's comes to elections. Sometimes people just choose the minority group that chooses for us.
Oh Jesus. Twain didn't say or write this either. Here's a clue for the future. If you EVER see a quote attributed to someone, AND it doesn't cite where, when, etc that the quote was made, it is most likely incorrect and/or misattributed.
@@g1a1r1y3 This one I did research myself but thanks for your contribution :)
"This comment section is full of quotes"
- Probably Socrates
😂
Mizo?
@@biebersucks27 yes
Ok
"I never said that"
-Probably Socrates
thanks. very precise
Socrates was the greatest philosopher, his thought of philosophy are learning many students of the Universities, and make to philosopher, lecturer and others.
"What men learned from History, is that men never learned from Histroy."
Underrated comment AF
Got this quote from my Pastor named Geneha Kim, I think I got this when he teached history.
@@11stemgen1dinoeldinjr.d.de8 That pastor "teached" you "histroy"?
@@olchat2012 yes, I think the title was history of Real Bible Believers, when Satan covered up all faces of possibilities (Conscience, Science, School, Government etc.) for us not to be saved.
@@11stemgen1dinoeldinjr.d.de8 what’s a pastor?
"There's no point for democracy when ignorance is celebrated." -NoFX
@Smoke’Em If ya Gott’em If you’re referring to Democrats and Republicans that’s just not true.
@@-hydro ignorance, case and point.
objectively, it is true.
This is basically America
This is Democrats Liberal , always talking about democracy, and fighting for Democracy.
@Smoke’Em If ya Gott’em you're confusing the party with the people. People always align themselves in groupings whether it's political, religious, whatever. We gravitate to like minded people. The difference is in America, there is a shared national identity that helps the great melting pot be the best system ever created. Until corruption from people holding DIRECTLY OPPOSING ideology's of any kind, like (* and communism subvert the system from the inside. America isn't broken. The system is the best that's ever existed. The problem is and always will be people in general. NO MATTER TERM LIMITS, HOW MANY PARTY'S OR ANYTHING ELSE. CORRUPTIOIN AND SUBVERSION.
Inspiring
Excellent, thanks a lot !
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." Winston Churchill
The masses ONLY know of bread and circuses. Nothing more.
Dakoder II so true lol but sad and pathetic
But who gives right to anyone to define a 'average voter'?
We WaNt To LeAvE tHe Eu
Oh help my country
Trinayana Kaushik 1/2 the people you meet are below average. George Carlin
Socrates: democracy won't work if you don't educate voters first
Comments in this video: so democracy bad
Socrates: no, educate people into having common sense before letting them vote
Comments: so democracy... bad
Democracy is cancer. Republics are better
Oh thank god!! You’ve somewhat restored my faith! Educate the electorate? Nah, let’s go for tyranny instead. Oops, I’m meant benevolent tyranny.
@@mymathmind democracy always leads to authoritarianism. Our Education was made solely for the purpose of indoctrination
Black Knight 😂
@@mymathmind look up the origins of education in the west
This is exactly how i am thinking, but he said it better
very interesting, thanks !
“Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.” - George Carlin
hahhahha , now i want to watch that whole George Carlin bit
We should lead the WORLD by scientists, or better, an omniscient AI. Everything should be decidet to the best of everyone and the rise of humanity itself, regardeless of the opinion of the people, which think, that many good things or ideas are bad. The humanity is now like a toddler, we need radical changes to grow to a wise adult. To the public, many of those changes are apparently nonesense, horrific, dumb or just bad. That leads us to the current situation. Politics is an ongoing fight for staying on the top, therefore politicains DON'T ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT ANYTHING, which is not directly affecting thmselfes, the ONLY REASON politicians seem to care is because they don't want to lose public sopport or even cause a scandal led by the peak of mount stupid (Dunning Kruger effect). Of course this system gives us basic rights, we should be glad of having, because nearly everyone agrees in having freedom of speech, freedom of movement , human rights, press freedom and so on. But the biggest flaw of this whole system is the reliance of nearly any big, important decission on the collective approval of a majority of the public, which usually has no idea of nearly anything, especially something that complicated to make REAL changes. Therefore the public gets it wrong very often, which leads to the fear of losing the next election, because of a public outcry, even though of making a good decission. And therefore they make bad decissions, which the gerneral public thinks are good, just to stay on the top. Really bad problems can't be solved like that. The reason why we have different jobs is, that everybody makes that, what he can do best. Sadly politics dosn't work like that. Everyone can make decissions, wheather they should or shouldn't.
@@arctrix765 You want a 'Benevolent Dictatorship' - I'm all for it too.. sick of self-serving narcs in grubberment
@@adammacer Yeah, but despite this, there should never be a dictatorship, brcause the danger of someone ruining it for all is too high
"Everyone could become a leader and i want it"
-some clowns-
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect", Mark Twain
Why ? And if in democracy majority will not decide than who will ? This will make mockery of the democracy
@@sanketkumar8040 majority of people in olden days said earth is flat, only Galileo says it ia round. So by your implication, earth must be flat Because majority said so... If 99 % people say 1+1= 3 and only 1% says 1+1=2. Which one would be correct according to your logic?
@@badapjiedkylla1899 i agree with you i hate democracy. But the other ways of running the country can create chaos mass killing like in China . Even a revolt today in such countries can lead to very high destruction of that nation . I don't see any other way.
@@sanketkumar8040 yes very true. Democracy may not be the perfect system of government but it is the best available out there till date..
亗ApØLoGïSt FøR GØD亗 not for india though... There are just too many ignorant people... Democracy leads to big problems when it comes to a diverse country like india... The guys pitch in religion and the game of politics reaches another level
"Crowds are influenced mainly by images produced by the judicious employment of words and formulas" Gustave Le Bon
In matters of conscience, the law of majority has no place.
- Mahatma Gandhi
There's another problem.
Before we can vote, for better or worse, the candidates we can vote are limited. In most cases the doctor can't even participate in the election.
That definitely is the case in the US (and the UK and also countries like Russia) but in countries where democracy isn't structurally flawed (I'd argue in the Netherlands where I'm from), the candysellerproblem definitely exists too.
The DNC made sure there Sweet Shop Owner was going to kick out Docter Sanders, that's for sure
philiponify everyone is a candy seller the only question who is the worst
Ricther Belmont Rand Paul is the doctor Sanders is the delusional old man pretending to be Santa Clause
agree. Sometimes we have to choose between a turd sandwich or a giant douche.
Government: "We should let everyone vote."
Socrates: "But why?"
Government: "KILL HIM!!"
smart guy: talks about something people disagree
free speech: adios
Makes you think
Athens did not offer universal suffrage tho...
However, something doesn't add up in this video. In Ancient Greece only a very small portion of the population got to vote. For starters, slaves could not vote, and they were above 50% of all people in Greece. Women also couldn't vote, and check this out, uneducated people also could not vote, only male adults who had gone through citzenship education could vote.
@@nerdienew911 The sad story of Jordan Peterson
imagine how messed up it would be if the sweetshop owner and the doctor teamed up to make everyone take a medicine that didn't work
🤣
It is the king who forces them to do it (the king runs the show. not the sweetshop owner or the doctor) and people who find themselves in the position of the sweetshop owner or doctor are often times Forced to play ball. Others do so willingly.
@@bestieswithtesties does the king cast a magic spell or what
Brilliant ❤
‘’I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only make them think’’
- Socrates.
And that's still a stretch in Murica.
I don't think he can make them think. But, it was a good trick to say that though😉
@@lgv3051 he can make 1 out of a 1000 think ..that is a seed 😉... seed of hope
Ok
In Plato's The Republic he says that the Academy should not teach people what to think, but rather how to think. Schools today teach rote learning, not critical thinking skills.
“Democracy is only ever as effective as the education system that surrounds it.”
Ayyy, you got any of that education? *scratches neck*
@François Miville
Feeling entitled whilst being uneducated is worse.
@François Miville so, people should be dumb-asses?
@François Miville Because there is a difference between being truly educated and just learning facts through school without any idea about where these facts come from, but also because they don't teach us about the importance of tolerance, moral, and that feeling superior to others actually is more a weakness than a strength. It is important to focus in math and science, yes it is, but also is important to focus in healing one of the biggest cancers about western culture: "Pedantry and complex of superiority,", otherwise we are not truly educated.
François Miville no. Educated people are not worse. Uneducated people are FARRRRR more entitled. No question.
Education machine broke
Very good point!
A democracy needs many strong institutions as it's pillar and a good self updating education system is one most important one of them, which is lacking in India atleast.
Mark Twain once said "If voting made a difference, they wouldn't let us do it.
"
The chances are basically the same to win the lottery as to have your vote actually matter (winning by a single vote margin).
When in doubt, always go back to Twain 😂👍
@@mikitz That's a pretty simplistic way to think about vote mattering.
@@TeamPill The best jokes are based on reality (I'm not saying that one was really that great, though).
@@mikitz
No votes matter.
"Democracy is a kind of government in which, people are counted but not weighed"
-Iqbal
What does that mean ?
@@hamzah1694 Search for weighted averages
It is basically an average where each element's contribution is weighted. Your normal average is in fact a weighted average where all weights are equal. So it is a generalization of normal averages. The weights can also be called factors, coefficients, parameters or simply "multiplicity", as is, a vote of weight 2 counts as 2 votes.
I get it. Thats how them “dumb-minion” machines works.
It is not weighted but weighed
Useful
I would love to read more on This topic.. Could you send me some recommendations?
I think that this only tells us that we should keep improving our education systems.
Alexander Petrohv yepp
Yep education is all about competition and not collaboration. Like Finland
Alexander Petrohv How exactly?
Hear, hear!
That can only happen if uneducated people think it's important. I.e. never.
"A democracy is only as good as the educational system, that surround it" on point
Right.. I was so glad someone finally pointed it out.
don't blame if education system is bad, people have to educate themselfs as well education system is just part of it and not all.
We should lead the WORLD by scientists, or better, an omniscient AI. Everything should be decidet to the best of everyone and the rise of humanity itself, regardeless of the opinion of the people, which think, that many good things or ideas are bad. The humanity is now like a toddler, we need radical changes to grow to a wise adult. To the public, many of those changes are apparently nonesense, horrific, dumb or just bad. That leads us to the current situation. Politics is an ongoing fight for staying on the top, therefore politicains DON'T ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT ANYTHING, which is not directly affecting thmselfes, the ONLY REASON politicians seem to care is because they don't want to lose public sopport or even cause a scandal led by the peak of mount stupid (Dunning Kruger effect). Of course this system gives us basic rights, we should be glad of having, because nearly everyone agrees in having freedom of speech, freedom of movement , human rights, press freedom and so on. But the biggest flaw of this whole system is the reliance of nearly any big, important decission on the collective approval of a majority of the public, which usually has no idea of nearly anything, especially something that complicated to make REAL changes. Therefore the public gets it wrong very often, which leads to the fear of losing the next election, because of a public outcry, even though of making a good decission. And therefore they make bad decissions, which the gerneral public thinks are good, just to stay on the top. Really bad problems can't be solved like that. The reason why we have different jobs is, that everybody makes that, what he can do best. Sadly politics dosn't work like that. Everyone can make decissions, wheather they should or shouldn't.
@@arctrix765 Didn't read because your first sentence is cringe
@@TwizzElishus And you are exactly the reason why democracy is flawed
brilliant!
Truth is most people are stupid, but we all like to think we are not part of that group. In most cases its idiots fighting other idiots, and both think they are right.
The best thing to do is recognize that we are and improve whatever state we are in.
@@howtorooms3621 Kingdoms lead by priest kings are better. Let the wise Druids lead not the crying feminist and spineless politicians
@@ADUAquascaping XD
It's like a loop really
I AM SMART because I DO NOT VOTE! I have no idea what they stand for because I have yet to educate myself about politics. So, I have all the right to claim I do not belong to the sheep.
If Twitter tried to cancel Socrates, it would be a hilarious week
Twittards are authoritarians disguised as democrats and liberals.
Democratic*
@@nandhakishor2659 Very aptly put 👏
@@nandhakishor2659 Authoritarianism can be very useful sometimes.
@@talisdorman.9796 You mean twittards are useful?
platon too, read the book: Die offene Gesellschaft und ihre Feinde - Platons Zauber. In a specific way, platon changed the words from his teacher in his favor afterwards
This aligns with my thoughts, but he articulates the philosophy in a more sophisticated and intelligent way.
"The foolish man believes himself to be wise, while the wise man knows that all men, himself included, are all fools."
Who said this? A fool?
To a degree.
Gumla Socrates said this
explains a lot
Are just men ,not perfect like all humans you might have problems with omnipotence and perfectionism.let god be perfect we re not we just need to improve for better
When I brought up this point in front of one of my 8th grade teachers, in a group discussion, he shamed me in front of the class. Wish I had known Sokrates brought up the same point.
I wasn't allowed to think this.
Trust in Dog assuming you live in the United States, I’m just assuming based off your experience with your teacher, it’s not even a democracy it’s a republic. That’s why the pledge of allegiance says “and to the republic for which it stands”
@@mariedemers9839 However, Socrates' argument still holds true because American representatives' decisions and policies are crafted to align with the opinions of their constituents.
Its ridiculous the reaction people have if you speak against democracy. Its become completely sacred, almost a religion, whilst its clearly failing in some areas due to the problems Socrates predicted.
Democray has only ever lasted a relatively short time when its been used before and its arrogant for people to think it will automatially survive eternally now, or that the system could not be improved by introducing more meritocacy.
And what did he say to shame you?
And criminality was nothing to do with Socrates' ideas around who should be able to vote.
I don't think he hated democracy. He hated tyranny
Good video
This explains why politics is about how well you present yourself to the public (even by lying) rather than how good your project actually is. It also explains why celebrities are more appreciated than scientists and philosophers.
Excellent point.
exactly why Caitlyn Jenner is a great possibility for being elected in California. because of her unprecedented qualifications of:
1 being a celebrity
2 being a woman with a dong....
@@triplem5770AND MONEEEY
Is celebrity a measure of character? All I know the former and the latter are people and people are flawed. Don't worry, no one cares! Take the shot, left or right arm, it's for your safety. We are the scientists and philosophers, we know what is best!
@@mattja52 Are you redirecting or something? We are talking about someone who studied and research vs someone who is famous. Not human flaws.
“The biggest flaw in democracy is that stupid people can vote” -my dad
Your dad's right
Your dad is right
Your dad's from the right
@@elkevinski ?
The definition of stupid can change based on the whims of each individual; then if a law were to be made saying a set group of people were unqualified based on factors they may not be able to change ever, then those people get orchestrated and slowly dehumanised.
Better idea: just give the best education possible to all and hope for the best; or invent mind control and give the reins over to the most morally stable people.
I agree to a certain level with you
"I've said it before and I'll say it again, democracy simply doesn't work."
- Kenny Brocklestein
Government: "We should let everyone have a say in elections."
Socrates: "I have something to say to that"
Government: "CATCH HIM!!"
Wow thats pretty mind opening
Nicely framed dialogue.
@@roshnikarai2555 Well the question is what is the alternative... Who will these so called "specialists" be when it comes politics? Most politicians are rotten anyway. You think having politicians voted by politicians instead of the people will make things better? Politics are corruptible in it's nature no matter what system you use.
@@Yourebeautyfull i liked your comment but still I do have an opinion of the fact that there might be some option of corrections. Tried and experiences of practicing democracy have given us some flaws among many goods. Despite of having pro Democratic ideology i should be optimistic as there are lots of democratically elected leaders who are optioned just for their name and not for the ideas they hold. They turns to autocratic way of functioning.
@@Yourebeautyfull that's one intriguing point, because how do you choose who has a say in the governance then as you mentioned Men are corruptable. The senate system didn't work for Roman Republic and Monarchy/ Dictatorship is just not an option, everything comes down to French Revolution how every for of governance failed there and as the time goes on we see cracks in Democracy. The question is really complex and there isn't an answer
“You can’t have a functioning democracy without a well informed electorate” - Thomas Jefferson
For a functioning Democracy, Education of Electorate (Vote casting people, 18 yrs n old. College students are most ideal candidates) is must. - Thomas Jefferson
yet even all people are well informed，there is no assurance they make right desicions
johan qian ah I believe your opinion might be rooted in the old capitalist/fascist “human nature” fallacy. Humans are a product of their environment, we are not born “good” or “evil”, we are blank slates.
Shit Storm yes I do. “Fascism” is defined as “the merging of state and private power” (to consolidate power and gain control over a given society). In other words the inevitable conclusion of capitalism, as evidenced by casually observing any capitalist economic system since 2500BC (when capitalism/private ownership was invented).
P.S Wikipedia is not a reliable source of information when it comes to sensitive subjects like this (I’m assuming you read a false pseudo-definition on there)
Copied from Platon.
"Geniuses are not discovered by general elections."
-Some guy
"Democracy is a device that insures we shall be governed no better than we deserve." - George Bernard Shaw
" _Deep quote_ "
-Big brain
No, Big PP
well said
certainly, big PP
You just made me rethink my whole purpose in life.
Ah, Big Brain. My favourite of the Ancient Greek Philosophers
"why are there so many quotes in this comment section?" Jackie Chan
"stfu, bitch" - aubert eistein
“Because quoting other ones wisdom”
- Obama
"Because fuck you thats why" George Washington
@@papaindica3185 "You win" - Vladamir Putin.
So .. why are u gaeh
We the People is just a reality of life. Getting We the People on the same page, doing good, that's a very difficult matter.
Brilliant.
When I took Latin, in high school, I was told that Socrates hated lawyers, because he said, it had nothing to do, with the truth, but who told the best LIE!
Doesn't make sense
Example: IF you went to court for a crime, and you were GUILTY, but YOUR Attorney told the best LIE; THEN, you would be found NOT guilty! So, the truth does NOT matter; ONLY who tells the best LIE!
These lawyers were also known as sophists.
Socrates was right. Lawyers are little more than paid charlatans
That's interesting, because Socrates was Greek.
“Absolute democracy is like 2 wolfs and a sheep discussing what to have for dinner” -Ben Franklin
Love this one
dizzyguy 101 Except the sheep can walk away without being killed.
Let's turn that around on the constitutional republic. Then the electoral college is one wolf with 3 votes and 2 sheep with 1 vote discussing what to have for dinner right? Either way loser claims tyranny of majority or tyranny of minority.
@@simplefolk8991 well no because in order to win the election you need some big states votes and as well as small states, nice try tho
@@chrisc5560 Yeah, but a single Wisconsin voter is more than ten times as worth as a Texan, New Yorker or Californian's vote and this isn't an anecdotal exception, it's the rule with many small states holding, proportionally, more significance with the arbitrary number of electoral college votes the states have. And the big states currently are as good as secure. Thus resulting in occasions where the populous vote does not have a majority but the state votes do. And it is what it is, populous democracy republic is feared to become a "chaotic tyrannic mobocracy" but on this scale of 327 million people a republic with an electoral college(mind you next to 0 other actual republics use the electoral college to elect a president/prime minister, most use populous vote) can be complained to have "tyranny of the large minority" too.
I completely agree
Education is key to democracy
" I love democracy"
- Palpatine
Ability to quote prequels does make you intelligent
This is golden
*I AM THE SENATE!*
That quote makes sense in a very sad manner
Tensor TF no one asked
What I've learned from this is that we need a better education system.
Sooo many walking about wit heads full ov useless rubbish ..! J.D Rockefella said 'He does'nt want a country (planet) full of thinkers... He wants them to become half conscious slave workers'.
ppl didn't like it
If people were exposed to Socrates early on I think the world would be a very very different place. Who could be a better teacher than the inventor of logic, philosophy, morality and ethics? There is a lot of absurdity in the world right now
@@nixtoshi There are Morbid Heretics that have been about for awhile now.. that have power, and deem that men like him.. Plato and others.. are dreaming clowns and there word holds no power. Because it is always easier to take the easy path and wait for a Wise Prophet to come along, and discredit them... than what it is to go and path your own road, and hang off the Coat Tales of them. The schooling system does'nt want wise people... it wants lost sheep. So yes you are completely right !
Your wish will be fulfilled soon. 😉😉
Soon means 2035
Democracy, the form of government that hurts the people who don’t understand it.
As a sweet shop owner, I totally agree with this.
Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve.
-George Bernard Shaw
- ❗️PLEASE READ ALL❗️👍✌️You may be surprised to hear that the word “Democracy” does not appear in the Declaration Of Independence or the US Constitution, or in any of the Constitutions of the 50 states. The founding fathers did everything that they could to keep us from having a democracy. James Madison in the federalist papers said, “ democracy’s have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security, or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in there lives, as they have been violent in there deaths.” Alexander Hamilton said...” real liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of democracy.” The founders had good reason to look upon democracy with contempt. Because, they Knew of the democracy’s produced in the early Greek city states where in every case they ended up with mob rule then anarchy and then tyranny under an oligarchy. During that period in Greece there was a man who urged creation of a fixed body of law not subject to the majority whims. The Romans adopted that man ideas, in which they created the 12 tables of the Roman law and in affect built a Republic that limited government power and left the people alone. Rome became wealthy and the envy of the word. However, it’s people forgot that “the essence of freedom is the proper limitations of government”. Once the Romans dropped there guard, power seeking politicians began to exceed the powers granted them in the Roman constitution. Some learned that they could elect politicians who would use government power to take property from some and give it to others. Benjamin Franklin said, “ When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of our republic.” Agriculture subsidies were introduced, followed by housing and welfare programs. Inevitably taxes rose and Controls over the private sector were imposed. Soon a number of Rome’s producers could no longer make ends meet. Productivity declined, shortages developed and mobs began roaming the streets demand bread and other things from the government. However, there was no food to give since producers stoped producing .Many were induced to trade freedom for security. Eventually the whole system came crashing down.They went from a republic to a democracy and ended up with an oligarchy under the progression of the Caesars. There are really only two true forms of government, Oligarchy, and a Republic. Monarchy doesn’t exist in the practical sense in which it’s always a group that puts one of its members up front.(oligarchy is the most popular form of government in history!). Anarchy doesn’t exist because it’s just a transition, like like a vacuum, in which it brings in an oligarchy. Democray come from (demos Kratein) which means people rule; which mean MAJORITY RULE. As I already stated Democracy doesn’t really exist because it always goes from mob rule to anarchy and finally tyranny under an oligarchy. The word Republic however, comes from the Latin words , (res) meaning THING and (Publica) meaning PUBLIC. It means the public thing, THE LAW!. The key is in preventing a republic from getting to a mob ruled democracy, like what happens in the Roman Republic. The United States Republic is following the same fate as the Roman Republic. The only two true forms of government are , an Oligarchy and a Republic. When Benjamin Franklin exited the Constitutional Convention he was asked by a woman, “ sire, have you given us a monarchy(oligarchy) or a Republic.?” Benjamin Franklin answered, “A Republic ma’am, if you can keep it.”
i wonder if republicans think thats what they represent still (a republic). as far as i remember from what i learned, republicans and democrats used to be vice versa to what they are now. thus the trouble with words.
Where else have I heard that name? Oh yeah Muslims fabricated a Quote (Reference) and a Book (which doesn't exist) claiming he spoke good of Muhammad and Islam: Many of them still believe it is true.
@@theislamophobicprophet5718 what are you talking about !
@@Ryma907 George Bernard Shaw
“A good dictatorship is better than a bad democracy.”
- Stalin, probably
Add my boi Putin to it.
A good x is better than a bad y
I disagree!
i.e. china
I agree, if democracy not managed carefully, foreign powers have a chance of controlling yhe government.
Great!
Exactly what happened with the political system in my country :(
"I love democracy"
- The Senate
"I love the poorly educated."
"I am the senate" - Palpatine
Best comment
Space Marine: We can go home later boys.
FOR THE EMPEROR!!!
*Hunts down heresy in Star Wars*
@@Clos_Goldstienburg-III speaking of star wars. best line ever. - This is how liberty dies... to thunderous applause. They voted themselves into tyranny
Democracy is 51 people telling 49 people what to do.
Better than an oligarchy where its 5 people telling 95 what to do
@@gninja92 5 experienced people in economy or politology againts 95 unexperienced ? Just wanted to put slightly different angle, I don’t support oligarchy.
Good thing we live in a republic.
@@DeVanHelmoski A Republic is not far from democracy's problem either. Yes Dumb people will elect more skilled and educated people. But they elect to represent what they want. Dumb Greedy people will elect smarter people that promises to serve their greed. Let's look at the US for example, we know we need to get spending under control but that means we need to give up our greed. Smart people who know what's right such as cutting social security and Medicare to reduce spending will usually never get elected to make that change in Congress. Thats because Americans dont want to give it up because we are greedy and want "free" shit. Because of the way Americans think our Republican system will doom us once our debt gets high enough we go bankrupt, the dollar will crash and anarchy will engulf the US. Because America seems to get dumber and dumber our Democratic System will lead us to our eventual demise. The end of the American Republic is near.
@William Henderson *leech
One of the biggest problems with democracy is that almost 50% of elected officials are actively trying to make the government fail at all times.
Actually makes sense
“I tried democracy once. But then my wife and her mother voted me out of my own house.” -Rodney Dangerfield
No respect
Maybe he was the impostor
This.....this is the problem with Democracy
This is exactly my problem with democracy. I live in Australia and our politicians are like children plus majority of the population doesn’t know what they want for themselves let alone who to vote for the countries leader and why. Basically everybody hates talking about politics.
Kingdoms lead by priest kings are better. Let the wise Druids lead not the crying feminist and spineless politicians
Well, that doesn't seem to have done a whole lot to worsen conditions in Australia, considering it's still one of the wealthiest and most advanced nations in the world.
@@HeortirtheWoodwarden purely because we sell huge quantities of raw earth materials to China. Give us 100 years and we will be a third world country alongside America.
@@LeviKerrison Wealth is not about resources. If it was the DRC wouldn't be one of the most miserable places to live in the world. It's about culture, about institutions, about free markets, stability, wise policy, investment, education, among other things.
@@HeortirtheWoodwarden dude you are off your head to think it’s not about resources. 2. We charge huge fees for immigration and 3. We charge huge sums of money for international students to attend you Universities. Yea we have it good now, but everyone is lazy and complacent, this only goes in one direction. We are wealthy because of raw earth exports and international investment in natural resources. That’s it.