How THE MARVELS Makes SECRET INVASION Even WORSE
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- čas přidán 18. 11. 2023
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The Marvels underperformed at the box office, but it is leagues better than the low-water mark of the MCU: Secret Invasion. But somehow, the events of the Marvels made Secret Invasion even worse. We explain how.
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Written and Hosted by Ryan Arey ( / ryanarey )
Edited by Lee Mazzio and Ethan Lavinsky
#Marvels #SecretInvasion #MCU - Krátké a kreslené filmy
Agents of Shield writers would have done an awesome job with Secret Invasion
Didn't they do something similar with the Life model decoys that somewhat more in line with the premise of secret invasion in the comic based on what I heard?
@@mittens123ize yeah they did. That along with the Shield is Hydra arc were way more suspenseful than the Disney+ Secret Invasion
Yeah, they would have definitely done an awesome job :).
But that's just the thing... 9/10 it isn't the writers fault. Its studio interference. Writers come up with great stories but if it doesn't contain a character or storyline that The Suits want to push, it won't be accepted. Which forces a great written story to be forced into being rewritten over and over and over and over until it doesn't even resemble what it was and only has what the studio wants. Forced studio rewrites create a bad story, which makes for awkward direction, which makes a bad finished product.
@@bball90 good point. Saying writers was just a easy convenient target. Whoever it ultimately is that's responsible should've taken notes from AoS
I still can't, for the life of me, understand why they made Secret Invasion in such a small scale. It was to me the defining Marvel Comics arc that showed just how amazing such large scale conflicts could be, especially with it building up for quite a while in the comics. They could've done a Skrull invasion story, sure, but kept it at Fury having to weed out a few Skrulls, then have them come back with a vengeance and upgraded abilities to not be discovered.
You CAN make a good Secret Invasion on a small scale. Heck, Doctor Who did it WAY better than this show with The Zygon Invasion / The Zygon Inversion two parter in Series 9.
@@Thunder025 I don't disagree, I just think the grand scale of the comic event would've been amazing to see on the big screen, and should've been saved for it's own phase or something, so the series could've been used to instill some early paranoia into the MCU, sort of like Elektra dying in the comics, making us doubt who everyone is during almost the entire multivers- ooooh, imagine if they would've used some multiversal stronger Skrulls come to this universe and invade it, like Secret Invasion but not just the Earth being infiltrated, but the entire fucking universe, so we'd be paranoid in even the cosmic side of the MCU for years.
*drooling*
I think the main problem with the MCU is lack of direction. Marvel films and shows in phase 4 & 5 have been building up: The Societal Aftermath of the Blip; The Young Avengers; The X-Men; The Fantastic 4 and the Multiversal War, ALL AT THE SAME TIME!
The MCU has been biting off way, way more than it can chew. What made the Infinity Saga flow and connect so well was because it had a single looming threat to build up: Thanos. And having a clear goal in mind allowed Infinity War and Endgame to surpass expectations.
"You can't have your cake and eat it too."
Exactly, too much things happening at the same time. All for money, disney+ content, more diversity inside and out, all for money. In the end, it destroy the whole saga, the faith of the actors in it, the people who actually are competent, the billions box offices, all gone because they wated to do so much so fast at them same time.
On top of that, every phase ended with something to tie everything together. Phase Four came and went and nothing tied anything together. We do not have anything tying Moon Knight to Shang Chi (which it seems like they completely forgot about those two promising characters).
On that I agree. Phases 1 - 3 were an interconnect saga, where each film could be seen as a chapter in the Infinity Saga. Phase 4 was films and shows that just happen to exist in the same universe(s).
The biggest difference is having Disney+ and attempting to convince shareholders that it was a good idea.
HOPEFULLY they have more organization in future tv shows and movies. Shouldn’t see any more strikes any time soon and hopefully this slowdown has caused them to be more focused on what majority of us are more than willing to pay for.
The previous movies had subplots too.
I LOVE your idea to depower Carol in this movie by making her realize that using her enormous power against one side or another only makes things worse, even when she means well. Her choice to destroy the Supreme Intelligence (and that decision’s fallout on the Kree and subsequently Carol) was the most underexplored thread in The Marvels. It was also the most interesting.
I woulda watched a whole movie just about her character realizing that dealing in absolutes (first the skrulls are evil, then the kree are evil) is a path that leads only to suffering. With great power comes great responsibility - including a responsibility to refrain from wielding that power unwisely.
Ive thought a good way to move her story forward was to temporarily remove her powers.
Brie Larson is a decent actress, most of Mcu problems is writers.
If they’re smart then they’ll play the long game IMO and explore some grey areas in Carol’s ideas and actions, especially with the X-Men coming and with them the likes of Rogue, that’s a writer’s dream to have that clash in the MCU, there’s a lot of possibilities. I think Carol might get the villain arc instead of Anna, or at least she’ll get somewhat ostracized.
@@thestarseeker8196 rogue absorbing her powers would be a great call back
Depowering Carol is the worst idea. Shes the only real hero on the team, the rest are unestablished n00bs. This rightfully should have been Capt Marvel 2, fully exploring the depths of her powers in space, what she did after endgame, etc but instead the Mouse had to get in and fuck it all up with a weak ass "tie" to the X-Men in a sad and transparent attempt to boost box office.
@@keni95851 To be fair I’m certain they incorporated the others as a trio because of how poorly received the first one was. They probably thought they couldn’t sell the sequel on just CM’s name alone. Which is the studio’s fault of course for making a mid quality film. I still think there’s no question this one was better and I feel like they wouldn’t lean into some of the story beats if they weren’t planning on continuing to expand more on those in the future. Agreed that the Beast thing was weak.
Frankly at this point it would just benefit the mcu to consider Secret Invasion non canon. Just revive Hill and Talos, Keep Fury's wife a thing, but just like forget the rest of it happend
I would love that.
It would explain how out of nowhere it was that Rodey was a skrull... since when??! Not since before Infinity war?!!
@@mretieIt's not out of knowhere. Like how else could Rhodey be normally walking after getting paralyzed? Like he was getting therapy but then 2 years later he's up and walking fine as is he didn't get his back destroyed.
So yeah the Skrull reveal was the most logical way to explain this. And it makes it moe tragic when the real Rhodey learns how best friend Tony Stark is dead.
Secret Invasion needed to come out AFTER The Marvels. If they were going to have to reshoot the whole thing anyway, they should’ve delayed it and done it right.
Also, one small change to drastically improve The Marvels, replace Dar Benn with Jude Law’s Yon Rogg. Barely any changes to the script would be necessary and it would be drastically better.
It was supposed to. The marvels was pushed 3 separate times.
@@Nanobot1989unfortunately most ppl don't remember this or don't acknowledge it, so they can continue to push their narrative
Sadly, Jude Law forgot to marry Loki
they cannot push their women supremacy agenda if they use Yon Rogg again. At least to a lesser extent. Now they have al story of all female heroes vs female villain.
@@ShinkiroZero dawg what are you talking about
Just watch and Marvel Studios will say that Secret Invasion is a “What If” or a non canon story, this honestly doesn’t make it any better, it just makes it even worse.
Don’t worry in Deadpool three they’ve just poked fun at this secret invasion she hulk attorney at law toxic fandom superheroes movies others in general.
I really hope they make it non canon at this point, the skrull plot had SO MUCH potential and the truly wasted it, and now not even mentioning or showimg any kind of consequence? It's just so damn much and they just erase and plan the plot properly
I agree! Say non cannon, storyline nonsensical!!!
More like a multiverse each was 9n it's own verse
At this point, I wish they would pull something like that to just erase and forget about that nonsense once and for all
Honestly I’ve decided that secret invasion had to be in a branched timeline
For Maria Hill's sake, I goddam hope so lol.
Maybe if they had combined The Marvels and Secret Invasion, they could have made one coherent story that matched the current MCU. 🤷♂
I think that all projects feel pointless because we don’t know what all this is leading up to. During the infinity saga we got teased Thanos which didn’t give much but it showed that something was coming. With Kang right now there’s pretty much no link between Kang and our hero’s like not even a single hero in our timeline knows who Kang is and there’s no interaction between the two, our upcoming villain and our hero’s are completely discredited from one another.
1.) Ant-man, Wasp, Stature/Stinger, Hank, and Janet are all alive and no about Kang.
2.) that's about as much as knew about Thanos at around the same time in phase 2 (The Guardians of the Galaxy)
The key difference between the Infinity Saga and the Multiverse Saga is that the IS mostly stuck to the heroes' stories being separate or turning out to involve an infinity stone at the end where were knew what it was building to
Meanwhile the MS has built up Incursion, the Thunderbolts and Young Avengers (which have an easy way of tying into Secret Wars), weird shit with the Ten Rings (which apparently relates to Kamala's bangle but doesn't matter for SW since the sequel isn't until after that), the X-Men/mutants (Which means an incursion bringing they into the MCU is unnecessary but we've only gotten Kamala in the main 199999 so where are the rest), whatever the fuck is up with the Eternals (no sequel confirmed), Dane Whitman's three man quest to steal Blade's movie from him (Hopefully dashed into the rocks by Mahershala Ali threatening to quite), geopolitical turmoil that will hopefully end with CA4 so it can't fuck up anything else, and finally THREE different movies that ended with implications that the characters would return while not actually having their actors on board (SM:NWH, T:LaT, and GotG:V3)
I think the key thing that's holding Marvel back right now is all of the blatant "sequel" baiting without sequels being confirmed. With the Infinity Saga it felt like all of the pieces were already announced well before hand which allowed us to accept the disparate threads of some parts of the MCU. Meanwhile, the Multiverse Saga has most of it's threads hanging loose and the ones that do have a next pin in sight lead to the Thunderbolts of all things. It feels like they're setting up 20 things but only actually filming a quarter of it
@@jtf5223 Ik wasp, ant man and his daughter know about kang but the problem is. All hero’s are so split up right now that Hank, Janet, hope Scott and his daughter all feel like there in their own little bubble and have no relevance to the greater mcu right now so it just feels pointless that they know about kang. Maybe down the line things will change but right now every character is there but non of them interact much at all and every movie and hero just feels so disconnected from one another. At least in the infinity saga the infinity stones are what connected Thanos to our hero’s.
Maybe because marvel doesn’t let different production teams talk to each other about separate productions. This isn’t a theory it was literally said about wandavision and dr strange… bet if any upcoming movie has anything to do with time they won’t have anything in line with what happened in Loki. Even the fact that the writers for dr strange didn’t know what to call these different universes because they didn’t have any communication with the Loki team who set the foundation of different timelines and universes.
I completely agree, how can you develop a character in a cinematic universe if neither director using the same characters knows what each other are doing with the characters. I think this lack of communication between projects is really killing the mcu especially as there so many characters now.
dead wrong
the movie has literal continuity from Ms Marvel with sets, actors, costumes
@@dimitreze if you thought for like 2 minutes before commenting this you’d understand that those two productions were shot at completely different times, ms marvel started filming in 2020 and the marvels started in 2021 so they weren’t happening at a similar time, the people working on the marvels had a chance to watch the show. This wasn’t the case with secret invasion.
Stop defending this movie and marvel as a wholes flaws and terrible production
@@dr.stephenstrange8471 I really think it is hurting them the most. Especially when you remember early marvel movies being connected in subtle ways. Now it’s like they forget it’s the same universe and only do things like mention another heroes name. Like even Loki a pretty good show did it pretty badly like when Loki mentioned tony stark something about it just felt very forced, why was Loki talking like they were old pals hahaha. I’m not really there for marvel or comic movies anymore, watching occasionally to see what’s happening but they’re just not v good anymore which is a shame, comic movies could be great, I just like seeing when they do comicy stuff, like I think captain marvels suit in this actually looked pretty cool, Monica’s was pretty bland and then ms marvels made no sense since her show ended with her mother making her a lovely looking homemade suit with love but it’s thrown out the window and will never be seen again because she needed a new costume to sell new toys.
Been loving the coverage on all the Marvel content, despite the rough patch we're experiencing with the company rn. Love your insight, theories and ideas on where the MCU could be going! And Doug really is putting in so much work on the show recently, make sure the boy is getting extra treats and is having his heavy work load delegated amongst the rest of you 😂
Just end the M-She-U and audiences will turn out. Watch how Deadpool 3 succeeds
@@Knightfall182damn people really don't like women lol
@@ericblakemore3381 When feminism is involved, definitely. WW 2017 was a success because it avoided all that
it’s kinda his job
@@ericblakemore3381
That's all they care about. Not the REAL issues plaguing the MCU just subjective bs that's a none issue.
BTW, weren't the first 20 MCU movies not released in chronological order? I had trouble following the overall storyline arch. Then I went to a four-day MCU marathon and saw all 20 movies in IMAX and in chronological order. That's when I realized that those weren't just good movies. They were brilliant movies.
So, now I'll keep watching and wait for it all to tie together. And I love the Easter eggs. It's fun knowing what I missed and how they connect stories. Time will tell.
I said this as well but this time it’s bcoming more difficult bc they doing time travel a going back an forth to different universe. So when it’s not chronological it definitely seem crazy. But hopefully by the time they reach the End Goal it will be clearer
Don't know if you heard but Kevin Smith is a big fan. Spends the 1st 10 minutes of the latest Fatman Beyond talking about your Beast Xmen theory. Super cool.
They need to completely forget Secret Invasion ever happened. Just ignore EVERYTHING about it. And The Marvels is just fine. I enjoyed it.
I am convinced that Secret Invasion happened AFTER The Marvels. Fury's time on Earth in The Marvels was only for a hot minute, so that doesn't mess up that he had not returned prior to Secret Invasion. The Marvels happens right where Ms. Marvel ended, and there was no mention of the President's war on Aliens in that series, either.
Exactly!! That’s what I was thinking.
Still trash
Losing Monica would also explain his depression.
This. Because it’s absurd that the show directors didn’t know what was in other productions so as to make all things connect seamlessly.
I was thinking the same thing. This takes place right after Ms. Marvel considering the end of that show and the beginning of The Marvels, so it would put Secret Invasion after The Marvels, assuming Secret Invasion takes place after Ms. Marvel's show.
EDIT: Also, the line about the Skrulls in the emperor's colony makes even more sense with Secret Invasion being after The Marvels, because those are the known Skrulls on Earth to people like Fury. That whole scene is about telling (not showing) Fury there are way more Skrulls on Earth than even he was aware of.
Instead of Valkerie showing up and taking the skrulls to earth, it should have been Nebula taking them to Nowhere. That would have made more sense.
Actually watching this, there could be a dope Annihilator Era (and post Marvels) Captain Marvel movie that uses these misfires to answer:
- why NF never found them a home and Varra's BTS involvement with the peace council
- why 1mil Skrulls defected to Gravik post the SI destruction
- how Asgard gets involved from an earth perspective post Marvels
It could be an interstellar Winter Soldier for Carol with Dar Benn as one of the "good guys" in the past and Carol's guilt
The issue between Secret Invasion/Marvels is the same as Wandavision/Multiverse of Madness, Marvel Cinema isn’t coordinating with Marvel Television. The MCU is supposed to be a series of chapters that make up a whole, but ever since the MCU came to Disney+ there’s an obvious disconnect in storytelling between interconnected projects.
worst thing to happen to the MCU was disney plus
all of these Marvel/Disney/Star Wars speculator/review videos need to include these very honest rants about how they are letting us down. We all see it but sometimes these videos seem disconnected because they are ALWAYS speculating about how things will work and I'm exhausted by how frequently they are wrong and it makes me depressed hearing about how cool something might be or can be then to just be let down IRL. Thanks for making this video it is very important.
A lot of your points came up at New Rockstars too and the thing I need help with is how I do recall Secret Invasion was indeed supposed to come out after the Marvels, which was slated for July 2023 originally.
they did put her in a situation where using her powers only made things worse, with dhar bens bangle absorbing her power and redirecting it at them, but she just ended up continuing to use her power until they got the switching down
Doesn’t the Marvels take place before secret invasion since it starts where Ms. Marvel left off?
its still a plot hole cause new asgard and valkyrie were never mentioned in secret invasion
The only reason I can think Fury took the Khan's to space is because their home was no longer safe as the Kree now knew exactly where they lived, and had fought all 3 of the Marvel's inside.
Should have been Mrs Khan threatening to make a PR nightmare if not put into touch with her daughter. Could have also given us the Khan's bliped or unbliped status. Maybe Kamala was bliped but the rest of her family wasn't and that is why they are so protective.
He took them for the same reasons we would e took them if they learned all of this top secret info in one day…if it wasn’t Kamala family they would’ve been in a black site somewhere getting they mind wiped 😂😂
He took them cuz he didn’t have anything else he could do with them…they n on is about saber now and they know capt marvel real name they know rambeau has powers
They know too much and he doesn’t yet know how loyal Kamala is….by the end she’s his new pet project son I need to wack the fam u know 😂❤️
At this point, why can't secret invasion be post- the marvels, like play with the chronology, they've done that so many times
Or put the movie before the show on the timeline. That makes it at least a little better when I think of it that way. It really clears up alot of the plot point complaints to just do that. Easy fix to make it a little better. The empty planet may not have had species to hunt. Only plants. It's just sad most mcu coverage is negative right now. It's feeling awful like the Star Wars fandom over here rn.
1.) It almost has to be since Ms. Marvel happens late 2025 (even though one even in the show is a holiday that happens in early June but whatever) and Secret Invasion happens at some point in 2026. The last scene of MM would've had to jump months ahead to happen right before The Marvels
2.) The idea that the Skrulls on earth were aggressively carnivorous and couldn't bare the thought of being on a planet without animals is fucking hilarious.
@@jtf5223 Not aggressively carnivorous, just not strictly vegetarian for whatever that was that Thanos was growing. I imagine MCU Skrulls are at least omnivorous. I'm trying to think of a reason why Thanos's garden was not the answer. Had to be something. No food, or they couldn't live and breathe in their atmosphere...something. If The Garden was a viable option at all, I can see a Skrull in the know, like Talos being like, "Yo Fury, there's a perfectly good planet that Carol completely scouted. It's empty and perfectly habitable for our people." Talos knows as much as Fury does and I'm sure Fury knows about round one on the Garden. Danvers probably told him when she started telling her friend Fury about when he missed from the Snap to the Blip. For some reason, The Garden wasn't the answer.
Maybe the Garden was to close to Kree space. Only excuse I can think of.
@@pikeman777 actually that's pretty good. Noone can argue with it, unless some internet sleuth has figured out exactly where in space the coordinates to all the different planets really are
I just watched The Marvels and the entire time I was thinking it was originally supposed to happen BEFORE Secret Invasion.
this channel is the best for marvel fans in my opinion, the other channels seem to be making alot of "Breaking News" videos and all its about is a 2 month old tweet from a "very reliable source". this channel is informing and positive.
I honestly can’t understand how marvel can make something as good as Loki and then fumble on so many other things.
OMG i love your analisys and you need be chief of writing. The delays of next projects can be a breath of hope of new movies and series connected better
Do we know for sure that Valkyrie took the Skrulls to Earth? I don't remember that being mentioned in the scene, she could have taken them everywhere else in the 9 realms.
I think the Marvels happened BEFORE Secret Invasion. The last scene of Ms. Marvel is the first scene in the film. That could be months before Secret Invasion. Also, Fury might have been in a bad mood because he thought he lost Monica.
It's always funny how everyone is ok with comics that are convoluted and illogical, but then has problems with things in the MCU that can be easily explained by human nature. 1) Nick Fury: In Secret Invasion, he was depressive in the Marvels he had recovered from that. Nick's wife: She has her own life and isn't permanently hovering around her husband at a huge station. 3) The Khans: Their house was wrecked by the Marvels and the Cree during that fight at the beginning - they had nowhere to go, so Nick took them to the space station, until he found something for them. 5) The earth is larger then the US and what the US president says has no value under a different jurisdiction. 6) Nick Fury didn't find the Skrulls a home because he needed them. This all seems a lot more logical (and so self-explanatory that I would feel like they treated me like a little child if they explained it) to me than people who are created from the shards of somebodies soul.
I like these types of criticisms bc you give other ideas and other options instead of just complaining about stuff. Thanks.
Imagine marvel telling the secret invasion is In the other universe and that’s why they never bothered to show us any avengers in the show and they killed one of the main character Maria hill.
The Marvel's was shot after Secret Invasion and was scheduled before. I think it took place before Secret Invasion which is why his wife was missing. The Marvel's is a good movie. Sites like screen rant and cbr are starting to suck the fun out of everything.
Im 100% sure this is supposed to be before SI and I cant believe nobody has picked up on this
I loved the Marvels, but even I could tell something was cut. The rescue sequence with the cats happened too fast and me it little sense. I always think they should have put it secret invasion after this movie to make it work.
I think you're right, Ryan. The Marvels should've been released before Secret Invasion. Nick Fury feels like a completely different character in The Marvels than in Secret Invasion, and the fact that Percilla isn't in The Marvels at all when we saw her get abord the ship to SWORD at the end of Secret Invasion just tells me that you're probably right about Nia DaCosta probably not watching Secret Invasion at all. Something tells me that The Marvels was greenlit when Bob Chapek was in charge, and we know that he didn't care about fine tuning when it came to Marvel Studios and Disney+; all he cared about was getting content out. This lack of interconnectivity has his handprints all over it. Hopefully Bob Iger can make a difference again.
I think it works better to say that Secret Invasion is in a totally different universe. And it will be pruned quickly because of their willingness NOT to do TEAMWORK!
Case closed and we move on to ideas that make sense!!!
I disagree, marvel right its like actually shit, rhe more you mess with it, the worse it just gets.
It's the lack of continuity of characters that ruins this movie for me! Fury should have just been a whole new character. The Marvels was awful for his character.
I would have assumed maybe Secret Invasion happened after The Marvels. Fury was cheerful in the film. Maybe with the things that happened to the Skrulls in the film affected him and you see his mood in the TV show.
Wasn't The Marvels supposed to come out before Secret Invasion? Things would make more sense if they came out the other order. COVID and strikes have really screwed up a lot of their plans.
Man, fuck Secret Invasion. The Marvels doesn't owe it anything. It should be de-canonized from the MCU. I'm much happier with the explanation from The Marvels - after she destroyed the Supreme Intelligence, the Kree were weakened and Carol relocated the Skrulls to a new planet, and both groups were working out a peace treaty.
Same with the different characterization of Scarlet Witch in Wandavision and Doctor Strange 2, the problem wasn't the movie, it was the show, it should have made Wanda a proper villain instead of a victim.
I find it alarming that CZcamsrs can come up with greater plots storylines and scripts than studio heads!!!
Thank you for all the coverage on the Marvels. It really helps to stay updated with the MCU when you have no intention of watchin that movie
Secret Invasion please be retconned, at this point it would be a blessing
Lets just sweep secret invasion under the rug and say it was a different universe. Job done! The marvels was a good movie IMO, I know it could of been better but whatever was happening behind the scenes causing so much editing and cutting they put together something that worked none the less and the acting was spot on, I loved Fury returning to his Fun side. I do love the pointers you gave that would of connected the show and movie better and It does make sense that the secrecy between the projects makes no sense when your trying to make an interconnected universe...
Secret invasion happens at the same time as marvels in parallel universe
Mobius: That's the proper flow of time, and it happens again and again and again because it's supposed to, because it has to. 🤣❤️
Secret Invasion happened in the Fox X-Men Universe - There, problem solved
It takes place in the Morbius universe just in case just don’t mention.
What's really odd is that even though the directors of Dr. Strange 2 and The Marvels didn't know what was up with the Disney plus shows, certainly Sam Jackson and Elizabeth Olsen did. Seems like you really have little power as an actor, even if your performance has really shaped the character.
Carol showing that superheros can over reach and topple societies when not careful is kinda a great argument for why Tony was right in civil war
Maybe one issue as well is there’s no clear communication between writers. Because they were only given a few plot points. For example, Wandavision and Dr Strange MoM.
If The Marvels had shown it took place before Secret Invasion, Secret Invasion would make more sense. Fury would be hobbled by the escape from and restoration of the SABER station and Droge would be in a weakened state and willing to talk to the new Kree government that sprung up after Carol restarted their sun.
I heard that they’re making a 3rd season for What If…?. So I’ve been thinking, if they include Gravik and his Skrull forces at the end of the season, the episode will be titled “What If… The Skrulls Win?”. And the episode will be 1 hour long and will include the Avengers in it, so they could stop Gravik and his forces. That will be Secret Invasion.
They should use The Watcher to "explain" that the events of Secret Invasion happened in a different universe (hence, no mention of those events in the main universe). In fact, do this for all major continuity issues (i.e. the giant rock mass sticking out of the ocean from The Eternals - that stuff happened on 838 or wherever).
Tbh its ridiculous that the conflict around that show was about Fury and the Ppl of Earth. Not being able to find a home/planet for an alien species that is obviously wayyy more advanced.
I took my friend to the Marvels and she asked if she needed to see Secret Invasion. I just went naah.
I am here for the real high five from Doug at the end. Well done buddy
I choose to ignore the existence of Secret Invasion, so I may continue to enjoy the MCU.
It’s my understathat this movie was originally supposed to release before secret invasion. Which would explain why the movie’s Fury is a little more light hearted than the one we got in the show. And also why there’s no mention of his wife in the movie.
I thought The Marvels began immediately after Ms. Marvel. So would that mean secret invasion is canonically after?
These inconsistencies are so obvious with the viewers and the youtubers. The people at the MCU have been pretty smart so it makes you wonder, why they didn't anticipate this fix accordingly. Did they not care? Maybe Secret Invasion did occur after the Marvels in their mind.
Honestly I thought Secret Invasion was FINE until the finale. But that's true of a lot of MCU shows.
I also liked The Marvels for what it was. Not everything is gonna be Endgame. Hell, nothing SHOULD be Endgame until Secret Wars. Expecting every project to be game changing ever since Infinity War and Endgame changed the game AFTER A DECADE is wild. Yeah, fatigue is real and some of the shows aren't great (Hawkeye is the only one I plan on ever rewatching) but like, The Marvels was better that Iron Man 3 or T4or.
With fury we missed a great opportunity with him with his wife saying honey where is my super suit or something close to it to his wife 6:07
I agree, Secret Invasion should have been an Avengers level threat of a movie
It’s pretty obvious the two projects were made without much input from the other. Then someone realized the Skrull colony in The Marvels completely undermines the premise of Secret Invasion so they added that line about it.
Ultimately, though, the writers still chose dumb plotlines like super-dooper-Skrulls with all the powers, and ripping off Spaceballs. So it’s not as if they’re demonstrating a skill set where knowing the other projects would matter.
Many weeks late on this comment, but have only just watched "The Marvels" and I have not watched "Secret Invasion" yet, and really after hearing so much negativity about it don't really have any desire to do so. The MCU hasn't lost me entirely, but just about every movie the past couple of years has been sub par. Additionally did I miss some movie or show that showed the Earth becoming a major galactic player with orbital stations, space elevators, and what looked to be a fixed jump point getting regular use for interstellar travel?
I’d be okay with them retconning secret invasion as being an alternate universe that gets pruned at the start of Deadpool 3.
Great points! 💯 They need to take a break and develop some stories that will get people excited.
"aggressively fine" ha. I've never heard that, but I love it
I had such a cool idea for a rewrite... marvel should have just swapped the releases.. you could have Valkarie rescue the group of Skrulls seen in he Marvels and take them to Earth.. Gravik.. who's been serving Fury on Earth for years to try earn a place among us humans.. but after he sees his people being welcomed he goes against Fury and joined his group in New Asgard.. The US president becomes paranoid after he finds out that the new species has just welcomed to our planet.. have been here for years and there's over a million of them
So they literally destroyed nick fury character in her first solo movie. After they made him name the avengers after her and the cat and his eye. That was when I told myself that I couldn't ever be a fan of the character ever again.
Ahhh indeed. Imani saved this film tbh. How ever. Instead of Darr Ben. They could have at least made the villain Chiar from X-men. And focus more on Imani and Captain Marvel with Monica being recruited along the way. Fury wasn’t necessary. Monica should’ve been in charge of Saber while Fury was on earth dealing with secret invasion. This movie should have indicated that secret invasion occurred concurrently with this move hence why the aliens returned to earth.
because originally the marvels used to be before secret invasion. marvel change the release schedule. if i'm not mistaken the marvels and guardians of galaxy 3 exchange release dates schedule
that planet was destroyed, as long as there is Kree hunting Skrull down
I’m just tired of everyone complaining about Emilia Clarke’s character getting Captain Marvel’s powers and not being in the Marvels.
Her powers are only active if she’s activated them. Plus, Captain Marvel and Monica are entangled because they touch the jump point at the same time. Ms. Marvel was entangled because she was wearing the bangle when they touched it. Emilia Clarke was likely not using Carol’s powers at that moment and not touching a jump point. So, no Emilia Clarke.
The plot point that the Skrulls never found a home is the dumbest choice in the MCU.
I also live by the rule of "judge by what is there and not what isn't or what you want."
Ryan and the ScreenCrush team do a fantastic job of adhering to that rule. You guys made good points in that Carol should have been in SI and The Marvels should have released first.
I thought The Marvels was a fantastic fun film, but I too bumped into the Valkyrie part in a bad way. Like in the theater I was thinking "So we're going to take the refugees to Earth where the world has declared open season on them? Wow..."
I loved when the marvels went “ it’s gonna be a MARVELLOUS day “ and just marvelled all over them
The only thing i would change for the Marvels is the plot where theybwere entangled. I mean, you could clearly see that all of them are already connected to the main villian even without the entanglement issue. Carol is already fighting Dar Benn's kree soldiers, Monica is investigating the breaches and Kamala is in possession of the other Bangle aka the Nega Band. Dar Benn is also targetting every world that Carol calls home which means she would still eventually come to earth. So insted of tje three of them finding out about the bands during the entanglement, why not let them know smfrom the begining ?
Captain Marvel would be trying to stop the Kree from finding the Nega Bands and would fail to do so, But Dar Benn would also fail as she only found one of the pair. Which would lead to them going to earth to find the other pair. Monica and Fury would have contact with Carol and the three of them would find Kamala fighting off kree soldiers who are trying to get the other Bangle for Dar Benn in her house. And then the story could play out the same from there on. Only without the entanglement.
I would also add on to the drama with Monica and Carol because i feel like there was not enough drama between them for the audience to get emotionaly connected. And Kamala's deed to comfort them would have been more impactful to the audience.
Secret Invasion should have been a proper Avengers movie
I only just realized it while watching this (unrelated to Secret Invasion) but the Marvels renders Agents of Shield S5 and on for sure non-canon thanks to Hala being a dying planet in the MCU, but alive and well in Agents of Shield. Might even make Agents of Shield as a whole non-canon if it can be proven that Hala was alive and well pre-world crack, since there isn't anything that should have changed what Captain Marvel did to the supreme intelligence. (though it's possible I'm mixing up WHEN that happened)
Maybe 'Secret Invasion' was not in the 616?
Very well said. After watching the marvels I had a massive question mark - is secret invasion before or after the event of the marvels ?
Cux the two fury doesn’t really joint together! Feels very disconnected !
Easy fix, SI happens after Marvels.
Now Fury knows about emporers colony because its in Asgard.
It now all works.
He took the family to space because their house was destroyed and they had nowhere else to go. At least that's what I took from it.
Marvel Studios are probably trying to sweep Secret Invasion under the carpet, I doubt there's going to be much if anything about it ever mentioned again, in the same way no one seems to have noticed a giant figure sticking out of the ocean after the events of The Eternals.
I think one additional factor is not only the dependence on other movies anniversaries shows but also the release date of those properties. For example switching the release dates of spider-man: no way home and doctor strange and the multiverse of madness led to a significant change of storylines as America Chavez was rumored to premier in No way home first and then switch to Multiverse of Madness. Or the switch in release dates of Morbius where the trailers showed heavy influences of multiversal versions of spider-man while the final end product had nothing in it, except what‘s happening in the worst post-credit scene ever…
I think it would be interesting to see the alternate versions of The Marvels and Secret Invasion if they had switched release dates as initially intended. You wouldn‘t get the question of what‘s happening with Fury‘s wife, because you don‘t know that she even exists… and it would end up in a double-whammy once you‘d learn that those displaced Skrulls that Carol just rescued and brought to Earth have now to hide because of new politics based upon what‘s happening in Secret Invasion.
With Fury being different in Secret Invasion compared to this and the stuff about the President wanting all aliens gone, apparently Secret Invasion was meant to come out after The Marvels. As with the other plot holes... I got nothing.
The only way out or explanation could be that the events of Secret invasion are set after the events of the Marvels.
Moving forward. I'm hoping (although it's a long shot) that the MCU completely ignore Secret Invasion like the way WWE ignore Chris Benoit. It doesn't exist.
Let's be honest man they didn't watch secret invasion. In the Marvels was put through the wringer so many times and was rushed to get to the finish line that they didn't even have time to implement changes if they did watch secret invasion. We saw this with Multiverse of Madness
Do we know if The Marvels didn't happen before Secret Invasion? Maybe I missed that.
It's truly amazing that what killed star wars was Disney giving too much creative control to the wrong people but what is killing the mcu is disney taking away control from the people who should have it. The problem with writing a series is that a mistake tends to cascade into bigger problems and the mcu has made a lot recently.
It been demonstrated several times that you can fix the inconsistencies between projects fairly easily. The problem is they don't care. The producers writers and directors should watch any relevant shows or movies together at the start of a new project. Captain Marvel made a billion dollars because people thought they had to see it.Why would you want to get rid of that.
Whereas in Phase 1, there was a clear vision, something to work up to, but in whatever phase this is, it just feel like no one knows what the overall connective story us supposed to be.
Their release order don't have to match with their timeline order.
The Marvels may still take place before Secret Invasion.
Because we don't know the exact date when they happened in MCU timeline.
Fury taking the khans makes sense for 4 reasons, 1) their home is unliveable at the time because of the fight. 2 with aliens outlawed he doesn’t need people knowing aliens are still operating on earth and 3 he needed to debrief them properly and was on a time limit. 4 he basically sanctioned a child solider and this was his way of keeping the khans in the loop about their daughter. If not, they could blab and risk ruining everything he is trying to build.
The more mellow Fury is explained that after secret invasion, he gained new perspectives on life and the Khan’s with their positive attitudes and caring nature are rubbing off on him.