Adventure riding knee protection: pads, guards or braces?︱Cross Training Adventure
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- čas přidán 8. 07. 2024
- crosstrainingenduro.com Adventure riding knee protection: pads, guards or braces? How much knee protection do you need for adventure and dual sport riding? The answer will vary for everyone. The options? No knee protection at all. Knee pads. Keen on adventure riding in Australia? Check out our vids. These are usually sewn into riding pants. Knee guards. Then finally... knee braces. We will look at the pros and cons of each. But first? Ensure you have have some knee protection! If you like dual sport riding in Australia then you might like our adventure riding vids. Knee guards. These don't move around and provide much better protection, especially if they are long enough to provide shin protection as well. Welcome to Cross Training Adventure, we are into all things dual sport and adventure on the east coast of Australia. But don't be fooled by fancy looking knee guards. Check out our reviews of various adventure bikes and dual sport bikes. Viewers often ask me if they should use knee guards or pay much more for knee braces. Torn ligament. Personally, I think knee pads sewn into your riding pants are the minimum requirement. But these don't always protect you. They can move around. When your leg is flexed or straight they might not cover your knee. Next? The answer will be different for everyone. Are you a sedate rider who mainly stays on roads and the occasional dirt road? Knee guards will probably be fine. Our ligaments and muscles get weaker with age so the risk of knee injury increases. Comfort is a very important factor. Knee braces are much less effective with loose straps. But tight straps can be uncomfortable especially in the sitting position. Custom knee braces can reduce this. I use the CTi custom braces which are very expensive but you barely notice them. See our video comparing knee guards and knee braces. What are the most common knee injuries Generally they won't actually provide more protection. Also beware of knee guards that claim to be knee braces. EVS are the worst offenders with these glorified knee guards. Any proper knee brace has four heavy duty straps to prevent hperextension of the knee. If there is only one upper strap then it's not a knee brace. Next? Knee braces are the best protection. They are extremely good at preventing hyperextension of the knee. And they can significantly reduce the chances of injury with side impacts and twisting. ? This research for off-road riders found that ACL injuries are the most common. Knee braces can halve the rate of injury. Body positioning. Develop your balance skills so you are less likely to put a foot down in rough terrain. Practice figure eights with full lock turns. Motorbike setup. Ensure your footpegs have plenty of grip. For taller riders, stock footpegs can sometimes be too small. I use the Fastway adventure footpegs which provide a huge platform for my big feet. But if you are an aggressive rider or you enjoy riding rough terrain then you may prefer knee braces. Age is important. Next is damage to the meniscus. Again, knee braces roughly halve the rate of injury. Third? The MCL and braces are 80% effective here. Interested in buying some knee braces? See our video about how to choose the best braces. What else can we do to reduce knee injuries? Some riders will extend their inside leg for aggressive cornering. Don't slide your boot along the ground. Keep your boot in the air to help stabilise the motorbike. Tall or short riders? Get the ergonomics of your motorbike sorted. See our relevant videos. Last year I was on a one week off-road tour. On the first morning a rider fell off at walking speed when his front wheel hit a rock. No knee protection. Fractured tibial plateau and knee surgery the next day. $7000 down the drain. A set of $30 knee guards would have prevented this. Second case? A brand new dirt rider asked me to show him some local trails, but he shows up without knee guards. I suggest this is quite risky but he says lets go ahead. 100 metres in, he crashes on this easy track, he hurts his knee and has to limp back home. In rough terrain, you should have knees slightly bent, ready to absorb impacts. Don't ride with completely straightened legs. And finally... fitness. Regular exercise strengthens your muscles and ligaments which can make a huge difference with preventing smaller knee injuries. Obesity also places extra stress on the knees. Lose that weight! For more tips, see our video about reducing knee injuries. I'm really keen to hear about your experiences. Any knee injuries? What sort of knee protection did you have? What are you using now? Let us know in the comments. So the Cross Training Adventure focus is just get out there and have fun on two wheels.
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I bought a pair of POD K4 knee braces after watching one of Barry's vid. They've been a life saver, especially when the bike fell on top of me. I also use them for snowboarding, MTB and long hours of kneeling in front of my wife begging for forgiveness. Highly recommend!!!
been eyeing the POD K4 myself. Do you find the joint rubs your knee when gripping the bike with your legs? I've read it can cause bruising and abrasion.
After about 20 years of skateboarding and falling hard on concrete, I can tell you that kneepads with plastic caps are a must. The plastic disperses impact and odds are you are going to fall on an irregular shaped rock on a trail as opposed to flat concrete, which makes plastic caps even more important. Don't underestimate the damage possible from a low speed fall.
What we really need are pants with the pad on the inside and a plastic cap on the outside of the knee. The bottom of the pad should be level with the top of the boot.
Knee guards probably saved my knee last year. I could barely walk after coming off on a dirt road. Month later I was fine. Shudder to think what would have happened if I didn't have knee guards...
Great you had them on, Demus!
Like a lot of the other commenters, started dirt riding in later life, went straight to knee braces. We mid-life crisis riders who got the dirt bike can spend the money we saved by not getting the Ducati on preserving our creaking bodies.
Best side effect is stress-free exploring. I've spent years giving in to the urge to "just see what's up here", taking sketchy trails on ridiculously unsuitable bikes with only road-level protection, and spent the whole time petrified and counting kms to the exit. With a nice light dual sport and cocooned in bracing - let's goooo!!!
So true. The few rides I've done on bigger adv bikes have been disappointing when we see a rough track to explore then realise our bike and limited protective gear make it risky.
I started riding off road last year, being around my 50s and deeply unfit. I went straight to knee braces. I have crashed around a couple times (well, more a like a dozen), hurting myself in a few places (nothing too bad, but some required some resting time). I am still amazed waist down I have suffered nothing, not even a scratch, of course with the addition of proper boots and protective shorts (those are quite cheap and extremely effective, as my femur-head area had suffered a lot of punishment in road crashes).
The previous video here comparing them was one of the main reasons to do the significant investment the braces required. Couldn´t be happier.
Great to hear! I wish I'd started with knee braces instead of waiting till I'd already jiggered both knees lol.
Virtually the same for me. New to dirt a year ago after 10 years on road. I went straight for Pods. A bit uncomfortable on the long road stretches, but a very small price to pay for the confidence and protection.
You’re describing me right now. Looking forward to my first season. Going broke buying armor though. Basically only have a jacket and boots at this point. Which braces did you get?
I have bent my handlebar with my knee and a thin pair of Levi's. I always have at least pads, but it was a sunny day and I told myself "I'm just gonna mess around at slow speed, I'll be fine"
I can't believe I did not break any bone, but my ligament did not like that. It's been a year and a half and I still feel that sometimes.
And the annoying thing with 'minor' injuries like that is they might eventually go away but often they return when you hit your 50s, Cedric. I thought I'd recovered from both my knee injuries but from about 55 on I can really feel the weakness now...
I’ve been happy with the leatt dual axis knee guards. I find them to be very comfortable and they stay in place.
Just nice to see another of your videos Barry. It’s been a while!
Yeah, getting a bit of burn-out trying to keep two channels going so putting out less vids to take a bit of break.
Knee pads. I hit my knees many times crashing, no injury, lots of scratches on the pads. Once a torn knee when my leg got stuck between bike and hard rut crashing, healed by itself in a few weeks. Some say in such situations, the strain is transferred from knee to hip if wearing braces, and may cause worse injury by reducing overal flexibility. Some advise that knee brace is the solution for rider who have a fragile knee from earlier injuries.
Swapped bikes with a friend three weeks ago on a gnarly trail and he whiskey throttled my Beta 300 and cartwheeled into a boulder field. Fractured his kneecap and ruptured the tendon. No knee guards! Thankfully here in Canada the surgery was no cost. 6 week recovery. I couldn’t believe he was riding without knee guards! The Beta suffered cosmetic damage only. Luckily he has a desk job.
Ouch!
For those of you in the US who are discouraged by the price of proper knee braces, many qualify as a "certified medical device" and may be purchased with pre-tax HSA or Flex Spending accounts. I'm not sure why more safety gear doesn't have a similar designation, as it seems like a good "risk management" tool for health insurance providers...
The CTi braces are very useful in that respect as they are recognized medical aid.
Started back riding 3yrs ago at near 49, few crashes some at pace and thank goodness i had knee guards, but still ligaments get tweaked, went to pod k4 braces and they have saved me a few times from hyoer extensions. But they dont have as much padding on the petella, still they have been a good investment for me thus far. Lovin the adv and single track riding!
That's the story for most of us, Brad. A few knee tweaks THEN we buy the braces lol. I really thought both my knees had recovered from minor injuries in my early 40s but from 55 on I can increasingly feel the effects.
Purchased my first set of pods 16 years ago for $1000 when the bike I was riding cost me $1300... Now on my 3rd set of pods and have never had a bad knee injury. Worth every cent!
Great news, Trevor! Yeah that initial outlay of cash can be tough.
Knee guards do a good job for the price.
Particularly when someone (me!) gets whisky throttle on a single track, and goes into a tree at 40kmph.
My knee pretty much took the full force of it, but all I had was a slight bruise.
Great to hear!
Man, just getting started riding in dirt, I put my T7 over at a stop. Just gently. And i landed knee first on a (thankfully flat) rock. Didnt even break my kneecap, but horrifically bruised it. Lifting that 450lb top heavy bike while my knee was completely refusing to do its job amidst absolutely incredible pain was an experience i will not forget.
Bought some knee braces the next day.
Ouch. Glad the rock was flat, Derrick. As per the vid, our mate busted bones just dropping a dirt bike at walking speed.
@@crosstrainingadventure yep. Knee injuries are no joke, and they're really vulnerable. While I don't recommend people go super cheap, if money is tight even basic road sports(what you'd wear for stunt skateboarding etc) strap on knee pads are a worthwhile option and imho a better than relying on the armour in riding pants actually being in the right position.
My journey has been up and down with braces. Started with guards, took a couple hits to the knees on some single track offs - upgraded to braces. Found they were very supportive but just not comfortable enough (tried several off the shelf ones, never went custom CTI), ran a set for a year before it broke at the knee joint - not sure if this was from an incident where it actually saved my knee or not. Decided to go to a half way step between guards and braces and am overall very happy ( Running the Leatt Z frame). Yes slightly less protection, but way more comfort, and the best gear is the one that you will actually wear.
Great to hear you found a compromise, Mack. There's always that trade-off between comfort and protection. I vary my knee protection and type of boots depending on how risky I think the ride will be...
I have POD K8 knee braces (bought second hand, for the price of a pair of good knee pads). They fit quite comfortable, but the plastic end holders on the straps are a bit fiddly after many years of use. In the city I use motorcycle pants with upgrade big & thick SAS-TEC SC-1/EVO2 level 2 kneepads.
Other than that, EXCERCISE (physical fitness) would be the best, first line of defense protection, I'm sure !!
I’ve the same attitude. Two sets of gear, two different scenarios. Id wear the pods every day but for the longer time it takes to put them on.
Back in Argentina, I used to have multiple things... Acerbis Gorillas for enduro or serious off road adv. For street touring or light adv, pants with pads, mostly Rev'it. They are super comfy and served me well on a couple of crashes. For street bikes (sport or naked), no knee protection if I was riding on the city to go have a coffee or running an errand... If I was riding aggressive or going on a ride/trip, either pants with pads or Held CitiSafes knee pads... Now I am in the Netherlands, off road here is not really "a thing" ... So I keep only pants with pads (Rev´it and Alpinestars) both for my Adv bike and my naked one... I am considering getting the Held protectors again to use when I just want to ride in jeans in the city but have some kind of protections on. Cheers.
Definitely good to have options. I've got four options depending on my style of ride. Kevar jeans with no knee protection. Klim pants with built in pads. Knee guards. Then the full knee braces.
I bought Pod Active K8 knee braces after damaging my left mcl when my rear wheel slid out at walking speed and I put my foot down. My leg bent sideways. That hurt. But losing an entire season of riding really hurt. I was 64 at the time and I know the number of riding seasons I have left are limited.
Annoying how easily this stuff can happen! I've actually got video footage of me dabbing the ground riding through a slippery track. No crash, but a sudden pain, a swollen knee the next day, and about six months before it finally came good. And then in my mid 50s the weakness returned. A real shame I didn't get knee braces much earlier...
Have progressed from in-pocket knee armour, to knee guards, to now wearing Pod K8s. A lot more gear and faff to get on and off but no where near as much hassle as months of knee recovery should I have an injury. And you'll never know how close you get to a serious injury if wearing better armour saves you. Though I do reckon good fitness is the best. If you have the flexibility and strength to move about and stay on the bike, or have a higher threshold to take an impact if you do take a spill, thats the first step even before any body armour comes into play.
I'm with you, fitness helps a lot. And of riding with your 'comfort zone' of course. It's always fun to go hard and pick up the speed, but the chance of crashing goes up exponentially. I try to smell the roses most of the time nowadays and only crack the throttle occasionally. 😎
I get a Donjoy knee protection. Save my knee twice and my son once. Never will go out without them
I took the plunge and got some pod knee braces, expensive, but great,worth the peace of mind. I use em when I’m off road, I use leatt knee pads for commuting, everyday stuff. Basically one set of gear for road, one for adventure. Road gear = focus on comfort and road rash protection. Adventure gear = blunt trauma, body armoured less comfortable protection.
Same here, I'm just knee guards for easy adventure rides, braces for the gnarly ones.
@@crosstrainingadventure gotta say though those pods feel great, less bulky. Still can’t bring myself to wear enduro boots, Sidi adventures are is far as I can go.
Nice video. My wife is from SA, just had boerewors night before last. I used to ride with traditional north American beef jerky but now I always have droëwors or biltong in my pack. If you cook food in your adventure rides, try cooking pasta or rice with cut up droëwors in with it and the water. Awesome reconstituted meal. Your buddy Sutherland starts the Ironman on Saturday and has 12 days rally racing to co plate it and the Mex 1000. So awesome
Um wt heck, this was supposed to be on Joey's video damn phones and CZcams
I'd advise anyone who is touring to get a knee brace. Even if you're only 10% on gravel road it's worth it - ask me how I know. If, like me, you're only doing a little bit of dirt your skills won't be great as all of those dirt devils you see on CZcams. Your chance of doing something stupid (ask me) is way higher on that random bit of gravel. I've just got my MRI report back showing meniscus damage from a stupid drop and twist on a perfect bit of gravel road. I had all of the road rider gear with pads everywhere but that little twist to the knee could have avoided a trip down to the Base Hospital and the end of my week of touring.
I think about this every ride. Usually I only wear knee braces for dirt rides but as I get older I know I could twist the knee so easily on even our easy adventure rides. 😢
I've decided to get back into dirt riding at age sixty-four, for good or ill. I'm in above average shape for my age. Your points on exercise are well-taken. It works. I picked up a '22 RM-Z 250 and '19 DR-Z400. I also bought a full set of Leatt armor, including knee braces. Before I was able to use any of this, I was hit head-on by a drunk driver, while riding one of my street bikes. I suffered a shattered femur, broken wrist, and numerous other injuries. I was wearing full armor/padding in my Aerostich suit. The surgeon successfully rebuilt my femur. He also said it was broken before I hit the pavement from a torquing action; no pads or armor would have prevented it. This got me to thinking about braces. Had I been wearing them; the femur would have likely been spared. However, the energy has to go somewhere. One of my physical therapists said that would be the hip. Makes sense. I'm still going to ride off-road, once I'm fully recovered. But I may go with knee guards instead of the braces, based on my crash experience, even though I'll probably never replicate the conditions in the dirt.
Damn, glad you survived all that! Is the force transferred elsewhere? It's where we need more research. Some argue that braces transfer the force and fracture the femur instead... we did a video looking into the research about this.
Others suggest the neck of the femur might snap instead (personally I doubt this as braces typically only provide a limited degree of protection from twisting motions).
Re: femur breaks, some brands make braces designed to break before there's allegedly enough force to fracture the femur, but there's no really hard evidence suggesting this is a great idea.
@@crosstrainingadventurethanks, and more research is definitely needed. My femur broke at the bottom, the worst place, according to the surgeon. I have a 4mm thick, seven-inch long, T-shaped plate secured with eight screws holding everything in place, while the cadaver donor bone and natural healing knit it all together. The idea of the femur breaking higher up is intriguing, as I'm told repair work there is often less involved than mine was, relatively speaking. I'll check out you other brace video. I'm anxious to learn as much as i can.
See our vid about 'Can knee braces cause femur fractures?' We tried to find as much research or 'expert' opinions as possible.
@@crosstrainingadventure 'Can knee braces cause femur fractures? is another good video, and more food for thought. I can attest that a serious femur break takes a long time to heal. I was told to consider myself disabled for up to a year. And while I'm doing therapy diligently, four-months post-wreck I'm still using a cane to walk. You mention motocross riders that catch big air as a high-risk group, which makes sense. Since my main interest is trail riding, I'll likely never replicate the forces that broke my leg anyway, i.e., head-on collision with a car at a combined speed of over 100 MPH. Considering that, I'll give the braces I already bought a try.
My pods have saved me a recon.
I wear the pods as well. Very comfortable. Fortunately, I don't believe they have been fully tested on me.
None of us really want to fully test out our gear, Jim lol. If we are sane!
My Pods have saved me too. I'll put up with a slightly uncomfortable 60-90 minute road ride to the dirt for the protection. Once on dirt, barely notice them.
Baz I’ve been using skater pads for years they take big hits all day cheap comfy quick to put on works for me
Are they comfortable with bent legs in the sitting position on the bike?
@@crosstrainingadventure mate I forget I’m wearing them and I’ve had some massive stacks in them and they just work really well sit nice on top of the sidi crossfire boots fit under my wet weathers nice 60$ from the skate shop in town on about my 4th pair they work for me on the quad or transalp or the lil hundy so far they’ve kept me leg parts in good nick
I have two Knne Bikes. one for each leg. They act like outriggers. I never fall over
I high-sided once during a motocross race. Instead of tearing my ACL, my ACL pulled a chunk of tibia off. That was a nasty injury that required a screw in my knee. I was wearing CTI knee braces at the time. Not sure I am a fan of knee braces now. I would have rather just torn an ACL.
Ouch. Did the doctor say the knee brace contributed to the injury though? The usual debates centre around knee braces possibly increasing your chances of femure fractures (we have a vid about this) but no other injuries. And of course, they aren't that effective with certain impacts too.
@crosstrainingadventure He did not. However, I recently saw here on CZcams where another guy had the same type of injury from wearing knee braces as I had. He won't wear them anymore. I still do, but I have to admit I think it played a role in our unique injuries.
@crosstrainingadventure czcams.com/video/iDvH1h4Fka0/video.htmlsi=y020Q6Lcs1qJZeXo
This is the guy here on CZcams I was talking about. I had this same injury.
Let me know if you find a medical expalanation for it. I'm always keen to look at the pros and cons for all safety gear.
I just watched his vid. I think he may be overlooking an important point. On the good quality knee braces, you can adjust the stoppers to prevent your knee from hyperextending to the point where his type of injury could occur. E.g. I adjusted my CTi braces so that my legs are always slightly bent. A bit awkward for walking? Sure. But it's impossible for my legs to lock into position and not absorb an upward impact through the legs. I agree, though, that knee braces won't protect you that well from certain impacts. I did a pile of research and covered this in a video series. But after all that research I decided to always wear mine for dirt riding.
czcams.com/video/KvL-Qf4lng8/video.html&ab_channel=CrossTrainingEnduro
Another great one! And just as I'm twisting my head off trying to find out what to go for. Are really kneebraces only good for hardcore off-road or for people with injured knees?
Really hard to say, Thomas. So many factors involved. Can you go to work on crutches or does your work mean you simply can't afford to get injured? How aggressively do you ride? What sort of terrain? Etc etc.
@Cross Training Adventure Realistically, I mostly ride paved roads since offroad is illegal where I live. There is some gravel, and off course we do some offroad here and there, but nothing aggressive. The thing is, I've seen so many comments on forums about people getting serious knee injuries from slow and awkward mishaps, so I'm kind of wondering if braces might be worth it even if I'm not that much offroad
Yep, that's pretty common with the heavier bikes... and one reason I don't want to ride anything heavier than a DR650. That risk of getting off balance at low speed or even a standstill!
Great video thanks 👍 with knee braces on shoulder I take the knee pads out of my off-road pants ? Cheers Karl
It usually allows more room if you do...
@@crosstrainingadventure thanks that makes good sense 👍 cheers Karl 😊
I don't understand the mentality that "stays on roads" means that it is OK for your protective equipment to be of a lower grade. I hear this all the time about boots, armor, everything. Like, off road needs a higher level of protection, and on-road needs a lower level. The most dangerous place you could possibly ride is on a road. Cars don't hit motorcycle riders in the woods.
True... IF this wasn't an adventure riding channel. These videos assume you'll be out riding in the boondocks well away from any cars. If this was a road riding channel for commuters or sports bike fanatics then it would be completely different.
@@crosstrainingadventure I could see that. You probably have more roads going through boondocks there in Australia than we have in New York state.
I imagine you'd be hard pressed finding dirt roads at all? In Australia, the dirt roads usually start about 30 to 45 mins out from our capital cities and just go forever. Although it's at least an hour with Sydney.
@@crosstrainingadventure The northern 2/3 of the State can be quite rural. They have various maps of adventure loops that you can ride. "The Motorcycle Travel Channel" made a riding vid called "NEBDR - New York" which shows some of it, you might find this video entertaining to watch. NEBDR is for Northeast Backcountry Discover Route. But yeah, there's a traffic hazard pretty heavy on the roads in the lower 1/3 of the state, and it dissipates as you go north, but never entirely disappears LOL
When i was 16 i Went around a gravel corner on my 84 xr350 slid it out with the bike on top of my leg probably should have went to the hospital, think about that wreck everytime ive got to kneel down at work dont jack yourself up yall
Ouch. Yeah and as we get older it takes less and less to get permanent problems. I've got a few very mild tendon injuries now that I don't even remember getting... but years later the effects remain. I can't even swing a leg over my bike anymore, I usually have to lift my leg over. 😂
I'm 65 ride a 1200 tiger, and am recovering from a quadricep tear in my right knee. tore the other one, back in 2017. both events.. non bike related. Im just on six feet, and slightly overweight. What type of braces would you recommend?
There was a link at the end of this vid to our vid about how to choose the best knee braces, Kevin.
What is your definition of "rough terrain?"
I imagine sticking putting a foot down going ever rocks or trees would be more perilous for your knees than mud hole crossings or sand dunes. Most people would consider 2ft of mud to be rough terrain, yet I don't think that's what you mean.
Do you have any input on this? I am debating getting knee braces over guards in fear of injury, but where I live mud and clay are the biggest issues.
I guess everyone with have a different definition of rough terrain... for me it's anything in our vids which slows us down enough to shift down to first or second gear. I'd definitely include mud but we rarely ride that because it doesn't rain enough most of the time. Personally I'd definitely go knee braces if I was riding a lot of mud and clay!
And insurance don’t pay shit. My broken wrist cost $10k after insurance
Bummer. What was their excuse?
Just the general structure of a lot of high deductible plans (where you must meet like $5k to $7k of out of pocket medical expenses before insurance kicks in and also the high cost and low coverage amounts for post surgical rehab. Added up it was around $10k but that’s better than the $30k of total costs it would have been.
The only right answer is that only explosive reactive armor will save your knees
😂 True that, Theo! The reality is that all protective gear only offers a certain degree of protection. Some riders injure their knees despite wearing braces and say "They didn't work!" Incorrect usually. They probably reduced the degree of injury. Ditto with helmets. You can still get a brain injury in a crash. But your chances are reduced...
@@crosstrainingadventure So kneebraces with ERA will probably work best. But could ERA also protect my bike? It's a 1200 GS so not that far away from a tank
No ones stolen those gloves yet.. Shocking
😂
wrong, knee braces do not offer the best protections. As a matter of fact quite the opposite.
Are you referring to Ryan Hughes and his theory of 'What you brace makes you weaker?'
@@crosstrainingadventure No, I am referring to testimonies of many riders and surgeons stating knee brace do more harm then good. Same story with neck braces. Knee braces not only don't protect your knee against twisting but can be deadly when they penetrate your leg near main artery.
Interesting, I've never heard of that. And I did about a week of research before starting the knee brace series. Do you have any research references for those cases? Possibly they've only been published in the last two years so I missed them...
Guards that cover my shin too have worked for me so far
Been wearing Leatt 6.0 pads / guards on the big ADV bike comfortable enough to wear all day and are actually nice when you get to camp and are putting the tent together on the ground. I try to avoid putting my foot down / out on that bike. On real dirt bike or if doing extra gnarly stuff on the Adv bike I wear Pods K8 braces.
Same here. Any particularly gnarly adv ride I'll put the knee braces on. I tend to always wear motocross boots unless it's going to be a short very cruisy ride, then I'll use my flimsy adv boots.
@@crosstrainingadventure Yea I have the AStar Toucans I wear most of the time pretty happy with the protection, main feature being they are waterproof and more comfortable, got some older Tech 7's or my full moto SG 12's if i'm being silling and taking the Adv bike on single track