CV Carburetor or the Mikuni HSR for Your Harley-Davidson
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- Is the CV carburetor better than the Mikuni HSR? It depends who you ask, some say you're throwing your money away on the Mikuni and you should just modify the stock CV carburetor. If your bike is stock (rare for a Harley) or lightly modified the CV carburetor may be just fine. However if you've got a big bore kit, cams, high compression and head work you'll want the HSR. Swapping an HSR out on a mildly modified bike will net you some gains but the gains increase with a more heavily modified engine. The CV carburetor will work with a high horsepower engine build if you modify it with a thunderslide and large jets, but at that point you will still gain more with the Mikuni carburetor. The Mikuni is a much simpler mechanically operated carb and tuning is a breeze with the best feature on this carb.
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What's you're carburetor preference and why? Maybe you just hate carbs and prefer fuel injection...
No one “hates” carbs. You just can’t deny the benefits of efi. It’s just sooo superior in every way.
I like a old school Harley but I also love my dyna that passes everything but a gas station.
@@Bluis5445 why? If you get a check engine light and need a technician to clear and fix it? Screw that nonsense... I wouldn't own a motorcycle if it didn't have throttle cables and a carburetor
@@Bluis5445 I have a 2005 with EFI. Awsome performance with a trouble free EFI.But my 1998 Fat Boy CVO. I did make some changes to the CV carb.But I also chance the stock ignition system to be able to adjust it with my carburetation changes I'd made.Changing one thing can affect something else.But in my case it was a must do kinda thing to get the performance I was asking for out of my 1998 Fatboy.Was well worth making those changes.
@@Bluis5445
Lol dyno shoot out & drag racers use S&S carbs. Want to see something good? Go to zippers website look at muscle kits for twin cam 124 EFI & then look at for carb models. On the dyno charts The 120 carb makes 10 more hp then the 124 EFI
I’m sorry I just can’t hear very well over my efi making 145hp and 155 tq. Well when ever y’all decide to join the rest of the world and ditch your carbs we can have civilized conversation.
Back in the day when cv carbs were stock on the motorsickle and you wanted the Screaming Eagle upgrade when you opened the box there was a 42HSR Mikuni carb in it. That tells you what the HD engineers thought about them
I have used both of these carburetors . I like them both. A lot of people change out the CV for the flat slide for a up grade. I have found that the CV is a little more forgiving with elevation changes. The flat slide does give a little more on performance end. I really can't say that there is anything bad with either one of them.
The CV is simple to tune.. it's actually a really good carb.
It really is, it's been around a long time and a lot of people have had a lot of success with power and tuning!
I use a YOST POWERTUBE instead of dyna-jet, I've had great results!! It's made for a C V ,,or an S&S CARB >95 Roadking here>> NW GA>
Back when I was tuning mine in, I found some shortcuts (I'd have to do again to remember) that got my jet changes down to 15 minutes. Just ignore the book and you'll probably find them instinctively. I added one of those cross-fin air directors in front of the carb (Boyesen X Fin or something) and you won't got the claimed 10hp gains, but I notice the throttle response is a bit quicker. Voila! A back door Mikuni!
Just switched to a 42mm Mikuni on my '94 Evo and love it. The instant throttle response is something you can feel for sure.
That's the biggest thing about the Mikuni is the throttle response.
Did you change jets? Or the stock jetting good?
@@dustyfelts1261 I changed the jet to a larger one, but when I took it to my mechanic for cam work, he put the original jet back in it. So to answer your question, leave the stock jets in and run it for a while and check your plugs.
@@stevenking9357 sweet thank for replying. I did change the main to 165 and the accelerater pump from a 70 to a 50.. but now not sure if the slow jet should stay a 25
Btw I have a stock 88 not an Evo tho
I agree with everything you said. CV carbs are fine with a stock or slightly modified engine but IMHO, if you've got a big cam, head work, etc, there's no point in modifying a CV. You'll be much happier with a Mikuni. I bought my 2000 soft tail used about 8 years ago. If it had to idle in traffic it would foul the plugs, didn't like to start when it was warm, etc. I took the carb apart and, low and behold! There was a Dyna jet kit. This is a stock 88 with air cleaner and exhaust. They had the biggest pilot jet available (I think an .048), but the wildest thing was they put 3 spacers under the needle! I figure there must have been 3 spacers in the kit so they just used them all. No wonder it ran like it did. What a bone head thing to do! So I rebuilt it with CV Performance parts and she's been wonderful ever since. Moral of the story - don't let a bone head work on your bike!
CV carbs work great when changing elevations from sea level to mountains.
Amen -
Not any different than the mikuni Hsr as far as altitude changes. Throttle response, no comparison the Hsr is unbeatable.
@@davidleonard8369 well I believe that ; but longtime had mechanic loves mikuni for performance but cv for altitude changes -
@@crspcritter hammer performance has ridden sportsters and Buels up to 10500 feet in Colorado. They state on their website that neither the mikuni or the cv had any real problems. They all just lost some power due to the thin air. They sell both carburetors but claim that the long stand tradition of cv carburetors working better in different altitudes is just a myth that won't die. I have ridden my sportster with both carbs from below sea level at the salton sea to over 9000 feet up in the mountains of big bear and I completely agree with them.
@@davidleonard8369 amen and many thanks fer that ; I ride to big bear many times also . Right in my backyard.
My buddy the ret hd mechanic puts mikuni on many . A bit of a dial in .
Well unless it makes a great difference in power and performance. You know it’s pretty fair share of bucks out the window-
👍👌
The CV carb was the first carburetor I’d ever worked on as a younger guy (27), and I have to say I took for granted how good a carb it is. I took it off my bike once to rebuild it when I bought the bike, and the way that the engine vacuum operates the slide basically means you just set your pilot jet right, get a decent sized main jet in there and check your throttle cables and you’re rocking and rolling.
They are pretty easy to work on, you keep the diaphrams in good shape and you're all set.
Hi 👋, I am sort of new to your work shop, I had a 1999 ST DEUCE, 1450’ in 2001/2 I fitted a Mikuni Carb HSR45 as I was going for a 1550 ,
D D 2-1 Boom Can exhaust system, cams , pump, ignition module, throttle response, was brilliant, even though I’ve gone to 1550. The fuel Combi was a lot better as well. I had to sell my bike in 2019 due to my ex female partner, scamming me for thousands of thousands of pounds., this was my pride and joy, and even people I commented on it how well I looked after it considering it was a 1999 model,
It was serviced regular and it never let me down. Unlike my ex female partner.
I’m now retired 71 years young living in France, however, I wish I had still got it as it won’t take me long to get to the Alps and into Spain and Portugal and beyond, great territorial, I would recommend MIKUNI over a CV any day, very easy to set up.
PHIL FROM THE DARK SIDE OF THE MOULIN FRANCE.
I run a S&S carb. Just used them for over 40 years.
old time rider. back in the Stone Age i ran a su because i would ride from sea level to the mountains in New York every other weekend. my bike wouldn’t be leaning out upstate. i could just ride without hurting my motor. the cv carb works the same way But, with a acc pump jet it with a cv proformance kit and it’s sweet
This is the main reason I want the CV carb. Riding in the mountains in Oregon with CV carb on the Honda 350SL we would pass the Harleys going up the steep grade that had to stop and readjust mixture for high altitude.
@@AlexCausey if you were too cool, or on aware, you would hurt your motor
Long live the SU. I bought a shovelhead with a mikuni once. Removed and installed an SU. Ran beautifully. If a manifold was available I wouldn't hesitate to put one on a twin cam.
That's one you don't hear about often these days!
SU carb where great carb also ,if I could find SU carb + manifold , I'd run one on my S&S 107 ci Evo motor they were a great carb for proformance and simple also I keeping my eyes open at bike swap meets maybe get lucky
My brother in law has had an old S U carb on his 58 pan for what seems like forever he sez there's. no need for anything else My experience in the past was all good with the bendix and the oh so simple mikuni
Not a screamer but so reliable and easy to work on.nowadays it's a super e . on my shovel
I've ran both carb designs on the Harleys I've owned and I wouldn't lose any sleep worrying about which one to run. I've ran both designs on one of my current rides (a 95" FLSTF with a very mild street cam) and there is very little difference between the two carbs. I would give a very slight edge to the Mikuni for a slightly better throttle response which makes sense given the butterfly of the Mikuni is mechanically operated vs the CV's vacuum operated slide so the fuel/air input is immediate vs, as a result of vacuum change. The difference is very, very, slight especially if the CV is properly tuned. In retrospect and based on experience, purchasing the Mikuni to replace the CV for that bike was not cost effective but if you're needing a larger carburetor to feed a larger engine with a more aggressive cam, better heads, exhaust, etc., then yes, I'd favor the Mikuni.
For one thing, the CV 51mm is the largest available but good luck finding tuning kits and or replacement parts for it such as the vacuum diaphragm. The equivalent Mikuni is the HSR48 which flow testing demonstrates is very similar to actually outflowing the CV51 so don't fixate solely on manufacturers size as a measurement of flow, let alone what is most desirable for your build. I had a 120" Electra Glide, which I just sold, equipped with the CV51 and it had great throttle response but not instantaneous. The difference is so slight between the two carb designs that I consider the point moot and from experience, I knew that changing that bike to a Mikuni wasn't going to materially change the performance so I never messed with it and wound up putting about 60,000 miles on that engine/carb setup and never had any issues or complaints with fuel delivery including throttle response ! BTW, both carbs are easy to tune and are what I would describe as trouble free.
Lectron
I went with a Mikuni when I had my TC88B slightly modified back in the day. Per Harley-Davidson’s part manual I went with a Mikuni carb, hi flow air intake, Vance & Hines pipes, Screaming Eagle ignition, platinum plugs and a torque cam. I noticed a rather significant improvement in acceleration initially but have grown use to it over the years so it seems normal to me. 19 years later, knock on wood, and she still runs pretty good.
That's awesome you did all that work years ago and still got the bike and running great today!
That's virtually my engine right there! 2-1 pipes and Andrew's 21 cams. I added one of those cross-fin air directors in front of the carb (Boyesen X Fin or something) and you won't got the claimed 10hp gains, but I notice the throttle response is a bit quicker.
Your channel is one stop shopping for basic Harley info. Good source. One of the few channels I subscribe to.
I am prepping to do a top end job and other work myself, on my 80k+ miles 93' Evo Heritage, bike show winner (2010 OKC Fair Grounds Bike Show). It sat for years while I was ill. Now I got to get it running right as cheap as I can. I come here to help me figure that out.
This episode confirms that I am going to rebuild my CV carb. again or have a service mega clean it, since it sat so long. For my autos, fuel injection is fine, but for my Harley, I like being able to tweek it myself with a screwdriver.
To your question, I prefer the CV over others because I already have it and it works well.
Looks like your an OSU Cowboy/fan? Dont hold it against me, but Im an O.U. Sooner grad. LOL!
Hey I was at that show in 2010, I likely saw your bike! I appreciate the subscription!
It won Best in Evo Class. I customized it myself for my biz. I removed all sheet metal and replaced with chromed stretched gas tanks, chromed full fenders, chromed fatboy wheels and chromed brake rotor covers, chrome brake calipers, etc, all against the lowered shocks black frame and black and chrome engine. I designed some mega fat Z bars and had them custom made. Added a Rick Doss headlight cover and rear V shaped tail light bar. I put black screen door screen on all the front lights for dark effect. LOL! ....and I drove it like that all over the country (with full windshield).
I originally, just drove it to see the show. A show official saw it as I pulled up and parked and asked me to enter it. Mega shocked to have won!
Back when Harley was using the CV carb if you wanted the Screaming Eagle upgrade when you opened the box it contained a HSR 42 Mikuni. That tells you what HD engineers think about Mikuni. Nuff said
I like that Mikuni carb, they those things are close to fuel injection level throttle response. Dialed in right they produce more and don't kill the fuel economy. If you fuel economy takes a dump with a Mikuni it's not setup right.
Which carburetor to choose is a decision that depends on a lot of different factors. I'd say that for a factory or mildly modified engine, you really can't beat the reliability of the CV, especially when it's properly tuned. And when it comes to repairs, or upgrades, I've found CV Performance to be the best company to deal with. Their products are much better quality, and their knowledge is spot on. The main thing to keep in mind is your application. Don't put a big high performance carburetor on a factory or mildly modified bike. Not only can it hinder performance in general, but it can also prove to be catastrophic. I learned that the hard way with my 1988 883 Sportster. Shortly into owning it, I was hit by a horse trailer that broke loose from the truck pulling it, and ended up totaling the bike. I settled for cash at the scene to avoid dealing with insurance, took the bike home, and began rebuilding a whole new bike with it. Other than the exhaust, the engine was unharmed, so I didn't need to change much. Due to my ignorance of what I was working with at the time, I let a salesman talk me into buying the S&S shorty with a thunder jet set up. I thought it would be needed for the new exhaust. The carburetor setup including the intake was over $600.00, plus the cost of smaller jets to put it on the 883. My best friend(who rebuilt this bike for me), tried to talk me out of it, but I wouldn't listen. Due to not understanding what I was doing, and not listening to advice from friends, I now had an 883, with a S&S shorty, and very short exotic choppers "fuelies" with 2 staggers leading to 2 1/4" pipes at the end. Even with the baffling, the pipes couldn't produce a good resistance, and the carburetor was so big for that little engine, that I could never get it tuned to run quite right. It blew 3 head gaskets, before predetinating on the front cylinder, and disintegrating the piston. The entire top end had to be replaced. After consulting with my best friend, and another professional mechanic, it was confirmed that the predetinating was caused by the carburetor and exhaust system I had chosen, as it was just way too much for an otherwise factory engine. I still have the exact same carburetor and exhaust system on the bike today, but now I have a 2004 Buell XB9 top end, Andrew's v6 grind cams and 4140 chromoly adjustable push rods, Jim's roller rockers, and Accell 35496 programmable ignition with stealth coils. This engine now can definitely handle the large carburetor and exhaust. But I wasted almost $2000.00 originally, and put even more into rebuilding the engine to where it is now, and all of it could have been avoided. The moral of the story is be careful when making decisions on which carburetor you choose, or any major modification for that matter. If I were building a hot rod engine like my Buell conversion, I'd probably go with the Mikuni HSR, but for anything basic, I believe the CV just makes the most sense. Bigger, higher performance carburetors can be cool, but they can also cause a lot of problems.
Stock cv carb . But I rejected it with the all balls carb rebuild and jet kit. I'm loving it. 2000 Sporty Custom 1200 runs great.
@@karlhockenberry9130 I never used the all balls jet kit. But my 03 Sportster had a terrible exhaust system, and the carburetor was just terrible. I put a Bassani pro street exhaust on it, and tore into the carburetor. Rejetting it didn't even seem to make a difference. It turned out to be the diaphragm on the slide was bad. I bought a new slide and jet kit from CV Performance after speaking with them. It runs much better now than it ever has. That's why I love CV Performance.
Very well said right there!
@@GixxerFoo thank you brother. I love the channel. Keep up the good work!
I have the HSR on my 02 TC and I love it. 3 years, zero issues.
1996 Heritage Special. 4500 original miles. Was pure stock. Bike hesitated and backfired in cool weather, OK in warm weather. Used Dyno Jet 8708.001 jet kit with 185 jet and followed all instructions to the letter. Idle mixture screw turned out 2 3/4 turns. Also added K & N air filter in stock air cleaner, drilled baffles out of stock mufflers, added single fire ignition set full advance at 2500 rpm and Screaming Eagle spark plugs and wires. Definite power increase and much smoother acceleration. idles smoothly. Starts right up hot or cold. Averages 40 MPG. Obviously I like my CV carburetor. An EV 27 cam is the next thing I'm doing. This bike is run at around sea level 90% of the time.
That's awesome, glad you got it running right! EV 27 is one of the absolute best Evo cams out there!
I agree!! Don't froget to CHANGE THE INNER CAM BEARING to a torrington !
I yanked my stock CV40 carburetor and replaced it with a Mikuni HSR-42 and jetted it via Minton recommendation. The best fuel economy i was able to achieve was 42-45 mpg. I went back to my CV40 and was happy to see 55 mpg again. In my area gas is $3.30/gallon. My bikes are Evo and all bone stock to include airbox, cam and mufflers.
Is the CV40 equal in performance as the HSR-42?
@@CarlosGarcia-ls4hn for the right amount of money after being modified yes and be more efficient. I used to toss CV's in the trash regularly but have since changed my tune. Pun intended
CV is a dam good carb.. People get this mental block because it's the "factory" carb.. but in this regard, HD nailed the shit out of it. It might be the most dependable part on the bike.
@@hawkdsl 🎯
Did your stock manifold accept the HSR-42?
Gixxer, once again, an excellent segment...I myself prefer the Mikuni over CV because of the overall performance gain that I got right outta the box! This is in no way to say that the CV is a bad carb, because it is not. Well jetted with the idle mix adjusted correctly, good free flowing exhaust and unrestricted air cleaner this carb works great, but once you get into using hotter cams, better flowing heads, etc, you are better off with the Mikuni.
CV carburetors are nothing new they go all the way back to the early 50s in the British and European sports cars they are much more efficient that's why they get much better mileage
@@donaldpeters8745 I had no idea that they (CVs) went that far back. I guess the technology, although somewhat antiquated by today's standards, is still tried and true.
Thank you, I really appreciate it! The Mikuni really shines when you start getting into the motor for sure!
That's when I made the switch to the Mikuni. Big lift cams and Baisley worked heads require alot. 👋
I have a Mikuni TM40 on a modified Suzuki DR650. There's no delay at all when you whack the throttle, that's for sure. Something to keep in mind about the HSR carbs, is that the slide can wear out, and when that happens, the stupid thing won't idle no matter what you do.
That's a great point! They will wear out too, I've had that happen on a dirt bike with a Mikuni before myself.
My 1988 FLHTC Electra Glide Classic was modified by a previous owner with a CV carb, but that owner was in Wisconsin. In Southwestern Texas at sea level I needed to change a jet. It wasn't that hard of a job. Did not need to remove the carb from the bike. Just drop the float bowl and screw it out, new one in. Now runs great. On a Shovel I threw away the stock carb and ran a Lectron. It ran strong. With no other modification I was out running Evos. I think I paid $25 for it at a swap meet. Now they cost more than an S&S. I am happy with my CV carb and will stay with it.
Nothing wrong with the CV really, they are great carbs!
Mikuni carb. Better throttle response also mid range adjustment. 02 Heritage high flow intake, Vance & Hines exhaust 550 cam
Mikuni is about the closest thing to fuel injection throttle response you can get but even easier to work on!
I bought my 1992 Fatboy and it came with a Mikuni Carb. While it ran OK in the bottom of the San Fernando Valley at about 800' above sea level, when we took it to the Sturgis Motorcycle Rally camping in Deadwood, SD at 7500' I was forced to change the jets in the Mikuni in order for the bike to run at all. When we returned home, I swapped that Mikuni for a new condition factory Harley CV carb and my problems were over, the bike runs perfect at any elevation, end of carb story. Of course I'm not trying to make a drag racer Harley, just a good reliable ride that won't leave my Wife and I on the side of the road and our Fatboy never has in near 20 years. My Brother Hotrod Riders that have EVOs seem to all like the S & S carb over the Mikuni carbs.
I swapped from a cv to a mikuni Went from 30 mpg to 50 mpg on 93 Fatboy Plus it woke my bike up
I pretty much agree if the motor is close to stock a mikuni will work good but most of the motors that come out of my shop are hotrods & the mikuni takes a shit load of time to tune . I prefer to run S & S carbs & even though mikuni carbs should flow more air than a butterfly carb it is not always the case ! I have also used CVs with great success .CVs work excellent on shovelheads & Ironhead sportsters ! So my carbs of choice are E & G S & S or a CV !
My old Harley has a Mikuni on it, and it runs pretty well for being 33 years old.
That's awesome! The older bikes are the best ones!
@@GixxerFoo YES 'SIR >DEFINATELY
Some years ago I swapped out my CV carb for the Mikuni 42 HSR on my 2000 Fatboy. I'm running Andrews 26 gear drive cams, 95ci, and have head work done. On trips, I usually get 48-50 mpg, so your analysis about not losing fuel economy is accurate in my case.
You have people that swear the Mikuni killed their mileage, I tend to feel the setup just isn't right if you're losing economy with the Mikuni.
Just purchased SS Super E kit for my 2002 FLSTC. I looked at Mikuni. SS has been very good for me with my build I am sticking with them. PS.S&S I think that company knows more about H.D. Big Twins than does Harley Davidson
Constant Velocity and a little tweaking of the jets is good with me
You can really make the CV perform when you get them setup right!
Love the Mikuni. Instant throttle response. It feels like the rear wheel is connected to your hand. Especially when you're in the power band. Easy to tune as well. There is a plethora of info on these carbs. Joe Minton even had some input on their tuning (romored,).
yep. up to 3rd gear power wheelies on my new 02 450r street legal supermoto
plethora? This is a family channel and no such language will be tolerated mister.
@@CarlosGarcia-ls4hn smatta witchu? Iz you ignant or sumting? ♥️
Check your spokes specially in twisting the throttle
I loved the CV carbs, with a dyna jet needle kit. I have since evolved to fuel injection (not my choice) but I Really miss that CV 800 rpm, potato potato potato idle ...
My 1998 CVO Fatboy.Id took it off and rebuilt it changing the needles and a couple other things.Then after making those changes I replaced the stock ignition system to one that I can adjust the timing to work well with the changes I made to my CVO carburetor.What a big improvement in the throttle response and just the overall performance compared to it being in stock form.Thank goodness for the aftermarket we have today.
We are very fortunate to have strong aftermarket, years ago it was a lot harder to chase parts.
@@GixxerFoo So very True
I went 42 mill mikuni on my 94 fx convert, and on my 01 dyna wide glide the best I found
Hi 👋, I forgot to mention this is the third MIKUNI carburettor I’ve used, as I have had a 1200s , FXR 1340 , I had changed the carburettor on these as well, Highly recommended! PHIL FROM THE DARK SIDE OF THE MOULIN FRANCE.
I have a 1987 FXR. It has SE Heads, SE 575 cam, Thunder header. It has wisco 10.5 to1 pistons. My friend I bought it from found HSR 42 Mikuni carb. Bought it used of eBay . The guy he got it from put it on 883 sportster. It was over carbed. Got it cheap. Love it.
Can't beat a deal like that! Those carbs are way too much for the 883.
The cv carb on my 100/100 softail works fine when tuned right. Parts are everywhere, couldn't ask for more for a street bike.
I've run both with no issue. I prefer the Mik. just because I have great control on a way long sweeper as I'm turning on the throttle.Usually run a 45mm jetted a titch so I don't lean out on extreme top end.Spark plug reading along the road is a forgotten art. 50mm CV stock is allmmooost as good,I just don't like daiphragms. I work with huge commercial actuators containing these things at work their, I guess big and crude,compared to a gear or electric replacement. Fuel economy is not my goal, personal reward is.🎉👍
I ran a CV rebuilt by Killer Motorcylce Products on my 91 Evo with pipes, AC and an EV-27 cam. Fantastic.
The EV27 is great in my '95Roadking!!!
I have 2 02 wide glides and both have the Mikuni HSR on them and I love them. One is a 95 with other mods and one is a 88 with cams and such. Both bikes run great and any changes to the settings is a breeze. Fuel economy is between 38 and 42 mpg which is perfect IMHO.
I have a CV on my FXR now. I bought a Mikuni 20 years ago to replace it. The CV works so well that I never did! I have a 42 and a 170 jet with a Dyno jet kit with the needle on the second slot. Runs great. Maybe someday I'll put the Mikuni on but the CV runs so good.
If it's working great I wouldn't change the formula!
You can buy a lotta lunches for that Mikuni! That's why I never upgraded, especially in light of the fact that if it's that debatable; it ain't worth it.
I happen to like my stock CV carb.
I find them easy to tune and my bike seems to run well with it. My air cleaner is a cone style that points to the front of the bike so I have full access to my float bowl and I can change my Jets without removing the air cleaner or having to disconnect the carburetor from the bike. I literally turn out four screws and nothing else and the bowl drops right off.
As more of lone Highway Rider than a group Rider I never feel that pressure to compete with other bikes.
The CV is a great carb, they work very well and are easy to tune. The Mikuni really comes in if you exceed the air flow capabilities on the CV which is pretty hard to do.
Just watched this video. I own a 1989 FXSTS set up with 3 5/8 bore cylinders with Screamin Eagle heads and a V-Thunder 5030 cam, HSR carb. This carb, on this set up is a monster. I also own a 1988 FLHS set with 4 5/8 stroke and 3 5/8 cylinders, V-thunder 5020 cam, S&S standard heads. I run the CV carb and I must say, that is also the right carb for this bike, given the weight. I enjoyed your take on both carbs. They are equally excellent carbs. You seem to have a lot of experience. I also love Evo engines. Never owned a Twin Cam, also own an M8 107 FLHX. Thank you for educating people. These are not F35 jets
I've been around cars, trucks and bikes all my life. It seems, at least in my experience, that the factory, pretty much knows what they're doing. Now I'm not saying there isn't room for improvement, but as far as reliability and all around dependability the factory knows best.
Have you even rode a Harley with a mikuni Hsr?
@@davidleonard8369 riding a Harley with a Mikuni, I'm pretty sure I have road one with just about every fuel delivery system you can think of. I'm not disputing that a Mikuni carb runs well, what I'm saying, is that for the most part the factory got it right. Most people don't have the skill, or the patients to diagnose and repair a factory carburetor.
@@thomaskirkpatrick4031 nonsense, the factory keihin cv is very simple and there is so much aftermarket support that a cave man can repair and tune one. But being a cv it can't match the instant throttle response of the Hsr. I have worked with both and even more than a few s&s carbs. All of them can and do work well but the response of a mikuni is like a light switch. My 1997 sportster has a 42mm mik and gets 47 mpg on 91 octane pump gas and runs mid elevens in the quarter and low sevens in the eighth. I was sad when Andrews discontinued the keihin flowmaster but the mikuni is even better.
Yep them stupid engineers know what they're doing......including putting gear oil in the trans and primary
@@thomaskirkpatrick4031
Except one thing , the factory also goes with the most economical solutions many times when they shouldn’t. You would think that since Harley HQ & S&S are in Wisconsin that Harley would use S&S carbs but it’s actually cheaper (or was at the time) to import the cv from Japan that’s a shame
I changed my 1999EVO to a flat slide and found the response more jerky which is the instant response I guess. I intended to sell the bike later and put the CV back on and could instantly feel the slower response, you don’t get more power as you still need x amount of fuel and air to do y miles an hour but for pottering around town the CV irons out the gentle throttle tweaks as you ride.
That CV really helps smooth out that instant response, much in the way new fuel injected throttle by wire vehicles have a little delay built into the throttle response.
I actually don’t have a negative opinion of the CV Carb however I did install a Makuni 42mm HSR on my TC and my EVO and I have never been unhappy with them. They always performed quite well.
I've never heard anything negative on Mikuni performance, always gas mileage suffers with them. I've had some do well on fuel with the right jetting but it takes some time to get it there.
@@GixxerFoo Gas mileage does take a hit. It’s noticeable but not drastic but I didn’t really keep track of it if that tells anyone anything. I don’t think you can wrong with either. Anyone riding an older bike is most likely also capable of working on them.
@@anchorsaweigh9893 Definately
I changed my carburetor from the cv to the mikuni hsr42 on my 80” evo. I had to change the jets a few times to get it running right. Now she fires right up.
Had plenty of bikes with a CV and never cared for the delay. When I went stage 1 on my Harley88 I went with a Mik 42 and loved it.
They say it's not altitude adjusting like a Cv but I couldn't tell in the Rocky's. I definitely liked the instant throttle response.
been running the original cv carb on my 1990 flhs 50,000 miles I put in a jet kit about 20 years ago. worked better after experimenting with it. the only thing that went wrong was the diaphram tore. I used a sealer on the hole and it worked. that was 10 years ago.
That's awesome, the diaphrams can be the culprit of a lot of issues with the CV carbs.
Just installed a mikuni copy on my 01 Road King vs my fully modded CV and I ain't going back even. Getting 44mpg with a cam, air, and fishtails.
That's awesome! Installing a Mikuni style carb doesn't have to cost your mileage!
@@GixxerFoo I was surprised as the cam and carb mods to the CV brought it down to mid 30s though it could have been a richer jetting. The accel pump and direct linkage to the slide if what makes the mikuni (you already know). For those who find it twitchy you can just adjust more delay in the accel pump.
What mikuni did you go with. The model numbers kinda confuse me. Some say I need 42-19 and some say 42-6. Some bolt right on and some you need a kit. Jp cycles recommends both..
@@joescott803 chinese knockoff from ebay...works good....42mm unless you have a huge motor
my old 2003 loves the stock cv thats on it,,,50 mpg,,it stays
CV is a really good carb for the street!
It also depends on the air filter too!! Just saying I can’t even tell you how much that makes a difference when you take the time to clean your air filter on a daily basis
Having the right air filter and the right size depending on how much power you're putting down for sure.
S&S Super E, easy to work on and tune and have instant response. I just rebuilt my CV on my Sportster and had a S&S Super E on my 93 Heritage and it had instant throttle response after I put a kit in it. I have never had a Mikuni but I might try one.
Drag specialties CV kit with bolt in hyd cam with a port & polish made my evo run so good.
Some of those CV kits out there really make a huge difference on those carbs!
I modded my original Keihin butterfly carb in the 80's. Centred the accelerator pump jet to hit both openings in the manifold, increased jet sizes, added an earlier higher volume accelerator pump and redrilled holes to older passages in the bowl and blocked newer one, removed choke plate and filled holes. Mods were outlined in an issue of Easyriders from the early 80's.
Less than $30 worth of parts and it was the best carb I ever used.
I considered switching to a mikuni or keihin but just stuck with my bendix/zenith. Discharge tube had a crack, just bought another with the adjustable main jet and I couldn't be more excited.
74 1200 big bore with the full work up
I went through the CV with all the tricks.
Then went to the Mikuni easy kit with some motor parts.
Then a Super E and the other two went on the shelf.
Super E is one hell of a carb!
Well I have kept my CV carburetor ..
back in the 70s and 80s I tried SU and the S&S ..
at that time didn’t have an Excelerator pump and I could not get used to the roll-on of the throttle .
I rode other peoples bikes with the newer ones but they do tend to gulp more gas .. I had it for quite some time..
but on my Evo I got my CV carburetor to run very well and get decent mileage in the winter I will put a 45 slow jet because really cold with the 42 it will cough once and a while ..but in the summertime it works perfect. I do run 170 maim jet And 1988 sportster Needle. I did take one round Of coil of the spring I clipped it off ,,in affect making the slide act quicker ..
I have followed Joe mentions,, advice on carburetor and exhaust and I found it to be spot on.
if someone gave me the flat side I’d give it a try but I’m not gonna go out. Buy one
One thing I always Wondered do you have to change the throttle cables
I have a 2000 fxdwg I put a mikuni 42 on it a year after I bought it new . I gained a lot more hp and mileage I have screaming eagle ignition ,Vance and Hines exhaust ,and screaming eagle air intake other than that the motor is stock . Hands down the mikuni is by far a way better carb I gained a 10 hp gain and get over 50mpg with a tune
I love my Mikuni 38VM on my Shovelhead. Went from S&S Super B to Delorto PHM. Then to Mikuni like I had on my 80 Sportster.
I don't object to a Mikuni carb except for the initial cost. I've had great luck with the cv with Joe Minton improvements. If you've got the money for big bore, cam, and other expensive upgrades then Mikuni is certainly the answer.
Mikuni is pretty expensive on the up front price, nothing wrong with the CV's for mild engine work. But like you said the Mikuni is the way to go when you really get into building a motor.
@@GixxerFoo there are many out there that can tune and trick out a CV to be as good as a Mikuni and have substantial fuel economy to boot which is the best of both worlds in my opinion. Bob Woods (of Woods cams) will be the the recipient of my CV once I finish up building my 89" stroker. It'll "appear" to be all stock on the outside but will be extremely nasty once its done AND will use stock pipes and airbox. Looking for 80hp with some mild headwork all done by myself on this entire long term build.
I have a CV carb with CV performance upgrade kit. It improved my performance but I dropped milage. I'm almost stock. For my 883 it made sense
Once you start putting the fuel to them they run a lot better but fuel mileage is always going to suffer a bit.
Got an hsr42 for free! Lol, here we go again with learning the jetting and messing with it. Also bought some wiseco 9:5:1 conversion pistons and found a local guy who will do the bore job for 175$. Can't wait to get her back together and rip this spring ☺️ all I need now is a gasket kit and let er' break in nice and slow. So ready for winter to be over here in Michigan, it's been a weird winter anyways.
Been running a Mikuni 42 on my 2000 Heritage the last 20 years, 95", SE203 for 10 years , Andrews 37 last 10, V&H 2-1 Pro pipe, Bike runs strong, i like the Mikuni, it is more thirsty than the CV40 Carb though, but its my bar hopper so its cool
Stop light to stop light is all you need on a bar hopper!
granted mechanical carbs are easy to mess with. But Ive always called them "bar hopper carbs" if you are traveling, the CV wins.
I had a 05 sportster with pipes and intake. Kept the CV carb, and never had any problems in 3 years. Later on I bought an 04 sporty with pipes, intake and they had switched out to the Mikuni HSR 42. The throttle response was very very good. However, I was always tinkering with the mixture screw. (Which wasn't too bad, just had to fine tune it constantly.) Now I've got a 1977 yamaha xs650 with 2 mikuni BS38 CV style carbs. Most of the performance guys switch to the Mikuni VM carbs.
It really depends on what your comfortable working with, also some engines just do better with one carb or the other. I've had bikes run like crap with a Mikuni and ended up going back to a CV.
Mine were 883s so it was probably a little too much carb on the 2004. The 2005 definitely had a bit more balls. I had planned on a 1250cc big bore kit on the 04 so it would have been just right then. But life got in the way and I sold it before any of those plans came to fruition.
FI is great, until you are stuck on the side of the road. CV40 for daily rider all day, get the right pilot jet in there and set the idle mix and all you need is enough main jet to maintain the mixture at sustained WOT. Stupid simple carb that can be dialed in for less than the cost of a tank of gas. For performance I would skip right over the HSR and go to Lectron. The HSR does well on a modded 1200, not a good match for an 883. The Lectron is also not a good match for an 883. Both will work fairly well on a modded 883 with open pipes, but the CV40 works fine in this instance as well.
I put a cv on my 1974 shovelhead 10 years ago and love it . I have had other carbs on the bike but , I like the cv best .
I bet the CV on the Shovel really woke it up!
Yep
The CV made a big difference.
Easier to setup . Better idle, milage . Good throttle response .
I put a 3" enrichener off a chinese bike . Just a plunger and pull knob .
No more cable .
I put Fullsac Performance headers on my '99 TC88, a couple used slip-ons from a CVO110 and re-jetted the CV carb. Put on an easy breathing air filter too. Got it dyno tuned. Very noticable improvement in performance and easy on the wallet. I spin the rear tire on that old Road King pretty easy now. so its all good...
Fullsac makes a dang good exhaust system, they really make some strong power! Getting a good dyno tune makes all the difference too!
I had 2 friends swap out their EFI with Mikuni carbs and they were spot on out of the box. I can’t say the same for my Super E swap I did.
The Mikuni is really well known for being super close out of the box, rarely do you have to mess with it much.
I have a Mikuni HSR on my 97 Softail big bore cam and head work. I like it except its really cold blooded.
Also did SE 95 big bore cams and some head wrk it's good but like you said doesn't seem like enough.
It's never enough, lol we eventually get used to everything. I like the 95's though, that short stroke makes them a lot of fun to ride.
I changed to the Mikuni 42. I get the same 30’ish MPG that I got with the CV. Of course my ride is far from stock. I do have better response and had a big change in power.
Mikuni is the way to go with some heavy engine mods.
CV is better, not only doesn’t preform as well, it saves the environment lol…. Mikuni all the way brother. CV’s can be a bitch to tune and, you can make many adjustments on a hsr a lot more easily and quickly, just my opinion. Lived and learned also, love the sound of a Mikuni…. Clack clack clack clack
Have had good luck with a CV on my 86 FLT. 86 Super Glide has S&S super E. Both run pretty good
Very nice!
I have had 10 Harleys with CV carbs (Sportsters and Big Twins). All of my CV carbs have worked great when I went from Sacramento the Lake Tahoe (about 6,000 elevation difference). Now that I live near Redding, CA, at the 4500 foot level, I have a Mikuni HSR on my 1997 Softail Heritage Springer. When I am in Redding, it works great, when I go to the 8,000 foot level in Mt Lassen National Park, the Mikuni is the pits. I look like an old diesel bus going up that high in altitude (black smoke). Also, when I go up in elevation, I get terrible mileage with that Mikuni... I have dropped from 45 mpg to 30 mpg and less with that Mikuni. I bought the bike with the Mikuni on it and will probably swap it out for a CV carb. I use to hate the "throttle blip" spit and die of the CV carbs when they are cold and the Mikuni does not do that, but my mileage is way down with the Mikuni. Now, try to get the Redding Harley Dealership to work on a Mikuni that is to be set up for 4,500 foot level when Redding HD is at 500 foot level.... Good luck with DAT. I might just jet down the Mikuni and see what happens. CV carbs are simple once you do 20 of them or so for all your friends who want "free" jet changing.
Redding must be hot as hell this summer. I us to live next to the river & cemetery. Beautiful town.
@@porkchopspapi5757 Yep, 112 degrees is not uncommon. The smoke from the fires is thick enough to cut... Pretty bad this year. The fire fighters are not directly fighting the Dixie Fire, they are letting it burn that is why it is over 700,000 acres.
@@ababbit7461 Damn. Ever spend any time on brandy creek near whisky town?
@@porkchopspapi5757 Yep, just a ride through on a motorcycle. I like that area on the western part of I-5. Great ride up into Trinity.
I installed the S&S Super E on my 1993 Softail Custom back in the mid 90’s runs great! Very easy to work on also and the main jet is very easy to remove just remove the plug in the bottom of the fuel bowl and remove the main jet.
Easy Peezy!
S&S makes a hell of a carb, they make power and they the serviceability is second to none.
On my 1200, the CV built with CV Performance's Velocity needle, diaphragm spring, 46 pilot and 185 main, I get plenty of power, great throttle response and 53 MPG at 70mph mileage on the highway. Stock cams, S&S Stealth AC and stock pipes with the baffles drilled out. Eats Twin Cams for breakfast
Ive had good luck with both.
I have too and it really depends on the motor and the application too.
I love my Mikuni on my TC95. You can buy a tuning kit with all the jets and needles already in it for performance tuning!
MY UNCLE HAS BEEN BUILDING AND CUSTOMISING HARLEYS IN MELBOURNE AUSTRALIA SINCE I WAS A KID IN THE 80’s HE STILL BUILDS BIKES AND SWEARS BY THE MIKUNI 42
In 2014 I switched my fuel injected magnetti morelli for an s&s super e I run 113 cubic inch 10 and 1/2 to 1 engine my carburetor is fantastic
I am surprised it was able to get the fuel it need with the MM system, I bet it really woke up with that carb swap.
@@GixxerFoo even with the fuel Commander it could barely idle so I ripped the whole thing out went with the thunderheart ignition system and an s&s carb works great
That's the way to go with the MM system. They work great till they don't and then it's a pain to find the problem and parts.
There’s always an upgraded version of something, especially carbs. But all in all, the cv carb is reliable and simple. Easy to rebuild on the side of the road if needed and the parts are cheap. I still run a cv on my evo, of course I’m running an s&s stealth air cleaner instead of the stock rig it comes with. But it does me well. Mikuni is nice as well but if I were to switch carbs… super e. Tune it and never look at it again.
Super E is a excellent carb over the Mikuni, the CV carb works for just about every situation with most riders. Some motors are really finicky about the carb and one does work better than the other for whatever reason on some engines.
I put a CV Performance brand drop in kit in my stage 2 Evo Dyna, mainly because I couldn't pony up the dough for the Mikuni lol. It's a fair bit quicker on the throttle response over stock and just generally smoother operationing through the powerband. It also has an external mix screw with a knurled end on it so you adjust it by hand 👌
CV carbs can make some power when you get them setup, the Mikuni is pretty pricey.
@@GixxerFoo Ya, I'll bet my little box of experimental jets cost under $20 or so - and once you set it, you forget it, she stays there.
I love my cv preformance kit
Ironically the arguably the best carburettor was the SU which used to be available for a Harley in kit form a flat slide was best used on the track for high RPM. CV
That's an excellent point!
Discussing which of the 3 (s&s, mik or cv) is really better , is hair spitting, imho. Properly tuned - they're all good enough.
However, they give diferent FEEL of the bike. And this is the matter of personal taste. Hence some ppl say they prefer one over the other.
Love the channel! I’m an S&S feller myself…I got nothin bad to say about the CV. I’m actually going to be running my 03’ FXSTB with both carbs back and forth to do my own comparisons on performance/efficiency differences, I’m still just learning how to tune the cv. The S&s is basically really stinkin easy but requires adjustment just about every ride. Which I love to do. Cause I love touchin my girl…GIXXERFOO YOU ARE THE SHIZ. I’ve learned a lot from your babbling ons. The channel is greatly appreciated!
I went with S&S super G. Mostly for service and parts availability. My 01 Sportster Custom has had major top end mods along with cams. It is stupid scary fast.
S&S Super G.....Float would stick....carried a Tool Bag everywhere.........or Smacked the Bowl to loosen . Pain in the ass...
You get the fuel to them and they will scream!
@@briangoldy8784 Wow. Never had the first problem with mine.
@@briangoldy8784 l 've had mine on for over ten years. Find it utterly reliable. S&S equipment is absolutely top drawer. It probably doesn't like getting smacked though.
@@farleyfox1840 LMAO. 1983 IronHead 1000 cc. XLS.. ..Never cared for this Carb.. Bike ran like crap......Actually, should have installed a Cam with Carb....but money was tight......I sold the Bike.
I’m an old guy that loves carburetors. Hands down the Mikuni is far better carburetor then the CV40. As you mentioned easier to work on and the throttle response. Not have to worry about the vacuum diagram is a big deal on a long trip as I had the top cap come lose. I get way better gas mileage with the Mikuni. Even if I get on it now and then. Also, not having a butterfly restricting air flow.
First off I do all my own work but am not a mechanic. I have a 74"shovel fx and a 92 flhtcu . I have done complete rebuilds on both engines flywheel up . Dana ignition in both . Shovel only extras was bore 10 over, headwork n pipes . 92- 10 over, headwork, ev27 cam . I run an SS E carb on both and once tuned they both work good for me . I tend to run my stuff on the hard side but not beating it. Just wanted to throw SS in there for thoughts.
S&S has one hell of a carb, they work very well and to me they are easy to work with. Some guys say they never can get them right, I dunno they have always worked for me. Btw that EV27 is one awesome Evo cam!
If I had somewhere to park more than one bike, I would absolutely love to have the Evolution powered Harley I loved in high school. I don’t have the space. Don’t have any expertise but can read, write, and understand English. Videos like this kill me. Now in my head I’m hearing that Wide Glide with the straight pipes I wanted to buy, the chromed out Softail Custom at the drive in, or the brand new silver Fat Boy with the yellow accents on the engine (ok, that Far Boy was in a Motorcyclist magazine). I will have to live with an M8 for the foreseeable future.
There's a lot of people out there that own a new M8 and still have a Evo, the Evo powered bikes are addicting.
Mikuni all the way. I went SE CV it was so so much better with Mikuni rt now response great idol can't say enough.
I really like the Mikuni carbs, they make a big difference when you have a high compression large bore motor. Some people hate the Mikuni and had terrible luck with them, makes me wonder what happened there.
I have a 88 on my 04EG. Cv carb is giving me fits since I changed the pipes. Has 509 cams and a big sucker air filter. Has 50/195 jets. Comp delete ( sprocket). What it does is super annoying. It tractors or two strokes so I’m constantly pulling the clutch so it doesn’t buck. Especially in town and around 2k. That dun dun dun dun. A shop listened to it saying idk sounds lean on the bottom and rich up top but I can’t really trust them if you know what I’m saying. It sneezes sometimes off idle so 🤷🏻♂️. Idk what the previous owner did other than “ carb work “. I’m starting to travel and it’s super annoying to feather the clutch much more than I should. I’m thinking it’s the cv is a basket case and heading to the mikuni route. 100-120 miles to a tank kinda sucks too. Tried adjusting the a/f all day. Any ideas?
It does sound like it's running lean on the bottom end if it's bucking around coughing through the carb. If it's got a CV I'd go through the carb and check the diaphrams just to be safe.
@@GixxerFoo it’s definitely not a smooth ride. Since it’s going into hibernation now I hope to figure it out in the spring. Thanks for the response!
1:37 CV is a fantastic carburetor up to 95-100 hp. If you modify the engine moore Mikuni is outstanding. I have a hsr 45 on my 1550 twincam. 209 psi compression, high lift cams and perfect ported heads (high cfm) with larger valves.
CV all the way. I put a mild hop up on a FLHT I bought brand new in 2000 with a CV. replaced the pilot jet and literally NEVER touched the carb EVER again. I sold it 9 years later with 110K miles on it. I'm currently on an '05 FLTRI. so far so good, but I wish it had a CV on it.....
There's a lot to be said about the CV carb, they work very very well. A lot of guys will opt for the Mikuni when you start getting into some real high performance builds though.
Mukuni carburetor on my 1989 Harley Davidson Softtail Custom has been great performance wise and I haven't noticed any fuel economy issues. In all actuality I have way better performance because I do have a little bit extra cam so the Mukuni is hands down easier to tune and runs much better for me. THANKS MUCH PAUL TAV 👍.
By the nature of the design the CV carb partially compensates for changes in altitude, while the flat(or Round) slides are very sensitive to altitude. This also includes changes in air density due to temperature and barometric pressure. Essentially CV carbs are better street riding especially if one rides in the mountains while the Mikuni's are for spot on jetting at the racetrack...
watched your buell video. was about to turn down a crf450R supermoto for one. so glad i didnt. my first bike can wait a few years {again} but for now. sweet christ. so much fun! and my entire friend group from highschool saw the posts about it and are now getting them. if i had known theyd get bikes if i had a dual sport id have gotten one 5 years ago when i sold my harley
has a mikuni from a local honda dealer. thing rips but if i stay at 2-3k for awhile i have to blip throttle every now and then
I've been wanting a enduro/super moto for years, lol just haven't gotten one yet. Buells are insanely fun not like a super moto or enduro can be.
@@GixxerFoo you have to get one and do some enduro motovlogs just finding cool stuff in the back country. im hoping to start doing that kind of stuff soon
On a v-twin, I don't mind using a mikuni carb. I actually appreciate the simplicity.
No need for carb balancing and access is straight forward.
On inline 4's, I want nothing to do with carbs ever again.
My take is the CV took me more time to understand especially after engine improvements. HSR 42 was so easy to tune but now with the internet and CZcams its now much easier to tune a CV.
There's a lot of excellent videos out there now on carb tuning, back in the day it was tough to get it sorted out.