The zariman has become my favorite area of the game before that it was deimos and the void towers but omg the zariman is a literal dream come true for me. It is a place that any of the factions if they knew would never come within a thousand miles of the place. It is our home.
@@TheDsIEGE easily the best updaye they ever did in every area, whether its lore, esthetic or gameplay. Hopefully they return to form now that duviri is done
@@TheDsIEGEHow I pray that our Dormizone will become an Orbiter Zone, maybe build an orbiter garage beneath it? Seeing a bunch of unused space outside that front door.
Finally, I like how void angels are servants of this void god just like regular angels are portrayed, but we're essentially known as devils by everyone else, which is interesting because you'd think devils are fallen angels, but not all are. I wonder what type of "devil" we are and our relationship with the man in the wall.
@@honestkyn718 Yup, the only difference between the servants without will (angels and {depending on the mythology} demons) is the voice that commands them and the hand that aims them.
I believe you're forgetting one more possibility that arises from eternalism. The possibility that there's a 3rd tenno. A third ship. The Zariman that made it to its destination. Now they would obviously have no real impact o the story (possibly/yet), but it gives us the 3 paths of possibility, the tenno that made it, the tenno that got stuck in the void jump, and the tenno that failed the jump entirely.
Did the Orokin send the sentients to Tau before or after the Zariman incident? I thought it was before, so they could terraform it for the colony ship. If so, since the sentients eventually turn on the Orokin anyway and set their goal on preventing the Orokin from ruining another system, they probably would have killed everyone on the Zariman anyways. And then the sentients would back to Sol and destroy the Orokin, since there would be no operators for the warframes.
@@kevinpaap2890 I think the Sentients were sent after the Zariman. The Orokin have to build a junction/solar rail to the Tau system. The rail will make the journey safer than a void jump with a reliquary drive, but there needs to be a gate on both sides. Which means someone needs to travel to Tau and build the other side of the gate. The Zariman crew would have built it but their void jump failed, and humans probably won't survive long enough to make the journey without void travel. So the Sentients were created and traveled to Tau the slow way.
@@JCLegendary I am fairly sure the sentients were sent in to terraform Tau, and then the Zariman would be sent to colonize it. It made it back just as the war had started.
I wonder if the raptwing ephemera (released with the angels of the zariman) is in some way a reference to the man in the wall, since when you equip it on your frame, or more importantly on your drifter/operator, you get 4 arms just like tmitw
On nidus I have 6 arms with it and the honor skin and interstingly the lotus chest seal sits over the hands on his chest like shackles, which I thought was a pretty cool little feature also.
Tbh I think she’s grandmother after talking to her a few times over again n her dialogue is vaguely familiar and grandmother says she don’t need a name she knows who she is I wonder if there’s a link. Just a thought I had tho 🤔🤔🤔
I think it's important to note that certain advertisements are canon as well. The tennocon 2022 duviri paradox 20 minute gameplay video is in fact CANON and happened before we broke free of the loop properly. The difference in audio and actions aren't coincidence, Teshin is likely the only one that remembers us from our miriad of cycles and attempts to escape. Even the new war trailers: Ever thought it was wierd that in game it just happened? we didn't see the invasion or anything? Turns out we did. In the 2019 New war official cinematic trailer.
This. It’s also further “confirmed” by the fact that the Tenno do send us archguns through the paradox, however that works. Plus I do believe in New War the Drifter does say that the operator was in Duviri for a bit, so I think we just haven’t seen it yet
Us being Void Demons that look like children has always been my thoughts, though I've always leaned more towards Daemonprinces where Wally essential scooped out out soul (our light as it were) and replaced it with bunch of void stuff/shoved out light into a body made of void stuff. Being out and out dopplegangers would be an interesting twist, though I'm not fully convinced.
I find it pretty odd how the front half of the zariman is sticking out in to the origin system AND duviri. Like the drifter's version was sent to their construct reality, duviri. And when they reconnect with us, maybe our version was sent to our reality.
Little thing on the drawings in the Zariman (in the new war quest): when I got the light back (starting the "Meet your parent" quest part) and shone it on one of the pictures depicting the man in the wall (was on a sideways table) the picture CHANGED into the creepiest sideview I've ever seen. haven't played the quest again after that.
OMG I thought it was just a visual bug, I noticed this too!! Absolutely creeped me the hell out. I want to say there are lights you can pick up around the Zariman missions that you can use that may let you be able to see them again!
As for who benifits there is actually a lot of lost lore in "ask a cephalon" where you ask the lotus' personal cephalon why we barely see npc's in warframe and stuff: Because we're deployed far, FAR away from them due to how destructive warframes are. colonies of people are benefiting from our actions, even the railjack cephalon cy leaves the empty ships we clear out "for the locals" which is pretty messed up if you think about all the bodies inside of them.
As for who is "the" tenno and who is "The" drifter. It's quite simple: We are all the drifter, we are all the tenno. None of us are the drifter, None of us are the tenno. We all are the main character in all of the quests and none of us are. It just depends on how you frame the timeline. I think the only constant is that we all took the deal.
My take on the Zariman we do missions on is it is a separate Zariman, but also real. Two versions of us, two separate pasts, perhaps two separate Zarimans. Perhaps it’s the drifter’s Zariman, which hadn’t been rescued from the void, finally reappeared because now we’re in the origin system. The operator’s Zariman reappeared in this system, and now that the drifter is here, their Zariman is too. This also carries an explanation as to exactly how the drifter got their powers. The drifter was in the origin system when the operator re-shook Wally’s hand, and because they’re the same person, drifter got those same powers. Because the drifter was in this system when the Tenno got their powers (in a way), the drifter also got those powers. Kind of like the void trying to correct the timelines now that they’ve mixed and muddled.
I'm of the opinion that the zariman that we currently explore is the version from the drifter's reality. In the version where we take the deal, the kids kill all the adults and things don't get a chance to get as bad as it has gotten. In the drifter's version, either noone took the deal or someone else did and as a result the zariman falls further into the void chaos.
Minor point - for the Drifter, it turns out they DID take the deal, but the Man In The Wall saved everyone EXCEPT the Drifter - one of the tablets in Duvuri, one of the creepy ones, reveals this.
An interesting angle for why Tuvul may have been eager to launch even with the risks (the damaged biomes), might just be down to textbook narcissism. It could simply be that he had no greater design for the crew and he was just a dick.
There is always a third option, DE wasn't as ambitious with the lore back then, so later events essentially removes them as cannon. It's entirely possible this is just rectonning some older lore.
exactly right, anything before the new war id reckon COULD possibly be retconned here and there purely out of scope since before that point it seemed the story direction was very simple@@TheDsIEGE
Thank you! Really well put together, the plot we have all wanted is becoming clearer. I think in Drifter's reality the sentients wiped out the origin system so there was no rescue, adopting the operators timeline for a planetary system ripe for invasion. We the player are here considered another incarnation of the drift/operator - making choices along the eternal weave - glimpsing the horror future through our screens. The deal stretching all the way back to us never having stepped foot on the Zariman in our future.
The story of the 10-0 was one of the most unsettling bits of lore that seemed to have been glossed over it would make for a great stand-alone survival horror game
I want to point something out I realized when watching this that I never noticed before. Look closely at the scene where Wally extends his hand for the handshake. His hand looks very similar to the way the Drifter's did after gaining the Lotus' severed hand in the Duviri Paradox. This made an entirely new thought enter my head, and it's a wild one. What if we........have all this time.........been the man in the wall ourselves? Sounds nuts I know but as wild as this ride has been I would not rule it out.
@@TheDsIEGE Another thing I have considered is the possibility that this whole time we are just a schizophrenic and all this has been different personalities warring inside one head. Duviri really made me think about that with the different personalities driving the environment depending on moods.
I have a gut feeling that the man in the wall is us, the operator, after merging the void. He is what we eventually become. I have a feeling the ending of the story will either be us becoming the man in the wall or us breaking the cycle that creates the man in the wall ending in his defeat. It really makes just because how the tenno are linked to the void. The void doesn’t exist to harm the tenno but maybe use them as some sort of vessel or physical embodiment. Maybe we make the void strong just as it makes us strong. The man in the wall is that peak point in power in which we are one with the void. Maybe the man in the wall let the operator and the drifter survive because they are two halves that make him whole. The drifter able to create his own world inside the void and the operator able to harness the power of the void and control those around them. The man in the wall is an all powerful figure we fear because we don’t any thing about him, but he is just us when we stare into the abyss it stares right back. From the moment we shook his hand on the zariman we were instantly intertwined by fate. I believe that we are playing through the creation of the man in the wall, “our other self” and the ending of warframe might be us resetting the timeline to avoid him from being created or us turning into him creating a timeloop we trapped in. Could also explain why he takes our form and why he calls us kiddos. Because we are the child version of him. I think it would be a perfect ending until warframe 2 of course 😂
One thing i noticed from this video. I remember that Pallidino called the man in the wall the great indifference however there seems to be a lot of indifference among the orokin, the holdfasts and even the tenno (be it through the near constant warfare numbing the tenno to empathy for the starchart version or the drifter being a nexus point of duveri but manifesting his unstable emotions as characters of the tales of duveri as a way to deal with it all.) What that means and what if any effect the two coming into contact will have i cant say. It may be all 'part of the plan' or a point of eternalism that we currently inhabit if what i understand of it is right.
@25:20 the picture of the "Beast". Its upside down (strangers things upside down?) and when flipped you can see eye's and nostrils. , and what I see (the black smug) looks like the Lotus head. Remember in the New war, the "I need more...MORE!!!" scene?
Pretty sure we have always been a void copy, since Wallie took our "light" or made a deal to be connected to our "light". The real Zariman came back with only the Tenno Demons aboard, everything else was likely swallowed up by the Void. Was stated that none of the adults were aboard if I remember correctly. The us that wasn't saved was likely still a real person dying in Duviri over and over until our Void self-made the deal and infused the real Tenno with the void during New War/Duviri handshake. This likely was due to Duviri being a void created barrier to save our real self but was slowly eaten by the Albrecht clone, the first Wallie. Also, to clarify, I don't believe Wallie is the Albrecht void clone, just the feeling I get from all of our interactions with him so far, pretty sure there are multiple Wallies just as there were for multiple Us. Pretty sure Albrecht Wallie will be a big villain in a future story arc soon though. Also think that Executor Tuval will be another one at some point as well. I just believe Wallie wanted our "light" to hold himself together so to speak as the void and its song seems to tear things down and change them. I believe the Zariman we visited is a void created one made from the memories of the Real Us once his memories were combined with ours through the lotus hand, allowing travel between the real and Duviri. Reason one of us has to always stay in Duviri is that the Duviri and our deal will fall apart if we aren't in both places at one time. I believe the Albrecht Wallie needed the real Albrecht to stay in order for him to be free. Basically it's a deal with the Devil. Also our Wallie never states that we cannot save ourselves either. I personally don't believe Eternalism is completely real in Warframe, just the void allows for all possibilities to happen and so Eternalism can exist inside its space. But the light from Real Space allows Void stuff to solidify whatever it is. Reason we can help the Zariman crew that was recreated from the Void. Pretty sure the kids were not affected by the Void Chaos because their emotions and thoughts were less solidified as kids who haven't experienced enough of life or it's trials to be true believers of anything, leaving them less susceptible to the Void stuff. I also believe the real villain of Warframe will be Wallie's enemy and whatever is bringing back the Eidolons and made the entropic energy that makes up Archons with a high likelihood of it being whatever Hunhow is holding back, which is likely hunting the Lotus as she got her powers from a deal made with that being or God when she was formed. This will likely become a further Narmer faction in the future. Just my thoughts. Also, we have the mother Unum still yet to be fully explained in game, she stops time in New War, which makes her insanely powerful. Maybe even more so than the Wallies. But we will see if what I think is right in next few days at Tennocon. Think us seeing Stalker will give us more on Hunhow when we see him at Tennocon, maybe his death or him no longer able to hold stuff back. I have a few other theories, but I've landed on this one as the most likely (or most interesting) currently until it's stated otherwise as it's less generic, all the other theories I have feel too cliche which likely makes them more plausible at times though. Appreciate your thought provoking videos as always! Thanks, TheDsIEGE! Also apologies for the long response. P.S. The dark and light choices we are making have been stated by DE to be dark (Calm and Pragmatic) and light (Fiery and Passionate), can't remember which livestream they stated this but they did clarify this already. Would be interesting if it also affects our Wallie Void Daddy.
@LilFeralGangrel While I see your reasoning I have one word that tears down that logic. Eternalism. We were originally told all the adults went crazy and tore eachother apart, they all died on the Ten0. Now we have void creations of them living on a second Ten0 ingame, only thing stopping them from deteriorating is our "light". It's completely possible we get a void Tuval boss fight later or heck with the 1999 expansion we could even get a time travel to his massacre. Just how I see it, you believe what you want to though.
My own personal take as to hy the ship appeared and then disappeared is that after the deal, wally took the ship to the origin system, basically dumped out all the radded up kids, took back the ship, and brought it back to the origin system when he was done messing with it
Yeah, you're right. The one the Orokin claimed the children from was built by them. But... if they reclaimed the ship and the tenno years back... how did it get back into the void?
So Drifter was left behind to the mad/ravenous adults and potentialy having all his other timelines and posibilities destroyed/killed off, while everyone else was saved... Damn Son
I was uninterested in the zariman after the quest but watching this gave it a new light for me to appreciate, helps that im getting back into warframe cause of whispers in the wall
You know... a bunch of people brought forth a theory to me years ago that I didn't want to admit but... If you've ever seen Fight club, or the willem dafoe version of the green goblin, they are talking to their conscience, but it's in their head. It makes me wonder if we aren't doing the same thing. Can't say for certain, mind you, he does seem to be the master of copying people but... i'd say either are possible if my theory is accurate.
@@TheDsIEGE I think you're right about being our projection, our body got the blacked eyes/changed voices several times already: with Lotus killing Erra in The Old War, rejecting continuity (The War Within'), TWW mountain ending scene and maybe more.
Great video as usual, D-man! I love your channel's logo but I have a suggestion: it would be hella cool if you changed the D to look like the Zariman itself which is also shaped like a D. Or something like that, you get the point. Just a... funny little idea I just thought of.
completely unrelated to the video, but i wanna say just how much i appreciate your content and the amount of thought & effort you put into your theories. other channels make the most surface-level bare-bone low-effort recital of stuff that is already clearly laid out ,and i just die a lil on the inside. yours are actually Inciteful, thought-provoking, and never fail to make my day better. Thank you, truly.
Thank you!!! That really is the goal here, to peel back a few layers and look into the deeper story. It's the reason I started the channel in the first place, so I really appreciate you saying this. Many in the community don't like my content because they feel it makes too many grand assumptions off little things, but... I believe that's where the people who make the game get their ideas moving forward too! Looking at things already established in world and build off little breadcrumbs. Personally I love this type of content and given that people like yourself still enjoy it, I see no reason to stop!!!
There's something I don't think you've noticed (and afaik no one else has either) I mentioned this on the (Un)official Warframe Discord, I can give you the message date and everything, but Ballas, he "dissapears", right after TMITW appears at the end of the New War, and this is DURING a cutscene, we never get any confirmation of him actually dying, or better yet, where did he go? I'd love to hear your thoughts on that, or if it helps you on the foundation of your theories, love ya Siege, keep up with the videos.
Thank you for the video! What a coincidence the main Warframe channel released a teaser about the same topic on the same day. A have a theory reaching back to one of your videos where you mention a possible mother-father fight between the Lotus and the Wall. In the Apostasy prologue, a single purple light leads us to Lua and show us how the Lotus leaves us. Possibly for our own good to know it happens. But in the Chimera prologue, the Man in the wall himself shows us the way to Ballas giving us a sword to KILL the Lotus while making fun of her and projecting Lotus shaped black figures to attack us. He wants her dead or he wanted to release the Drifter the way like this.
@22:30 The "Singing, laughter and play" didn't come from TENNO(S) it came from "younger version" of adults (like you can see younger version of Yonta during void flood mission). "Younger version" could also mean kids that were "Yuvan". Who's bodies were taken over by adults so adults can live longer. Although Albrecht encountered Man in the Wall, he didn't take "the deal". The kid whos body Albrecht took over, his last Yuvan, did take "the deal". Man in the Wall only makes deals with children.
I really like this video😊. My favorite part is when the man in the wall double ganger asked deisege is that all you remember kiddo? And Deisege answered how he would but not his in game character. I like that. It makes it more personal. I was not so crazy about the intro with the voice over that took a full minute before deisege came in. I think if you wanted to do something like that in the future, you should voice it yourself. You have a nice voice Deisige.
Thank you for that feedback and I think you're right, the intro was too long. That being said, I wnted to include it because I'm not sure many people have seen that given that it never appears in game, only online. But thank you for the compliment on my voice!
I want to be able to explore the Zariman, without having the pressure of a mission time or objective thrown upon us. Explore it, and feel the pure disturbing horror of it, but same time, the weird beauty of the Zariman. How twisted the void made it, and the people, twisted in horror, but same time, a strange beauty to them. Has such a potential to it, for eploration. Have said this on previous video, but I keep wanting this, and who knows, maybe the Devs will see the comments, mine or someone elses, and get inspiration to make such a option in the game
I would like DE to make the Zariman an entire open landscape after completing the nodes, like a reflection of Duviri itself, but with a key difference, that it is clear of enemies except void angels. Since the bounties seem to take place on the nodes anyway.
I this is actually how i assumed it was. It would explain why the operator is in a child form and how they can't die. It also makes more sense the drifter them being the actual tenno, or maybe they're the tennos light? To me that would also explain the events that transpired before we start the duviri quest. Like the void is eroding the defense of the tennos light (duviri) to get to the light (the drifter).
Something I only noticed recently is that on the Zariman all the what i can only describe as patches of solid void all over the place is also in the design of The Man In The Walls crown around where the ears would be.
Yesterday I came across a log of that one asshole degrading everyone on the ship, then cutting food rations to one meal a day as a punishment. Didn't even know there were logs on the ship. Interesting stuff, great video.
Question: ❓ When doing the Archon hunt missions, the "RAM" Erra talking/telling about a backstory in the past of a Sentient who saw "Demon of the Void" and he feared it not? You mind give me a hand with that.
"And I beheld a great Ram, and the horns of him were crowned with Sol, and with Tau. And upon his tongue, the Zariman flame. And the mighty daemon of the Void, cowered before him. And he feared it not." Many of Pazuul's quotes are iterations of bible versus, and this appears to be some kind of scripture like reading. It could just be metaphor but... it could end up leading to the final confrontation with the man in the wall as prophecy. We might get a little more lore at tennocon but it's tough to say.
I noticed that Cavalerro makes a Junji Ito reference when doing the Argozene missions where he says, “Find the socket that calls to you, your socket, the socket that was meant for you…” Between that, the tragedy of the Zariman, the spiral designs of the Void Angels and the Zariman, and the fact that the Void “calls” to the ghosts of the Zariman until they theoretically reach the point of no return gave me a lot more Junji Ito inspiration than I realized at first. Also if the Tenno is a “void doppelgänger” as per your theory, I wonder if the empathy the Tenno show has anything to do with the Drifter trying to help and empathize with the other children and Wally mirroring that empathy to a degree. If Albrechts void mirror spawned “The indifference”, could the Drifter spawn “The Empath” or can the void ONLY be indifferent. Tagfer does describe the void as clumsily doing things but also lonely.
a new solar rail is being build towards tau after ingame hints found on the zariman, duviri and deimos also zariman, duviri and deimos is linked interconnected by the void. where the void also leads to duviri thats why the zariman blends into duviri. duviri has an inverted zariman accessable.
"Zariman Actual" - Doesn't feel like a slip. Did I miss something or does this not feed directly into the idea of the "copies" - Maybe Void travel IS making copies. One here, one there.
In fact, pulling on that strand a little more, maybe the film "Primer" has some interesting ideas that would be helpful here? I cannot help thinking that WE don't travel, but we create a copy of our consciousness in another place (transference?), but we have to use The Void to do this. They call it a "long jump", but maybe transference across a long distance requires more of The Void's energy to try and keep that consciousness intact, increasing the level of risk if something goes wrong? Cephalons are simply consciousness digitized, right, so why is this not the same principle? Are we ALL cephalons at the end of the day?
My take on the whole deal being represented with a handshake between ourselves (operator to wally operator and the operator drifter) is that wally clones are the real us or albert that got corrupted into helping the void and are time traveling, making different timelines go thei way or the voids way. The copy operator we first shake hands could be either an alternate self travelling to other timeline (just like how the drifter is able to influence the operator timeline) or could perfectly be the same “us” operator that in traveled back to save it self giving us void powers, how did we get powers first get void powers if we gave it to ourselves? Simple we just were always meant to get them, travel back and re ignite them in the past. Also this means the void depending on how it sees you it can corrupt u in two ways, if it has no (big) use of you it turns you into an angel, the other being into just make you work for it keeping ur body, making you work for it by trying to corrupt ur own or other timelines and lead it to the void cascading into the real world. Another less thought interpretation of the deal is that at that moment all of our timelines converged into the two that we have, making all possibilities being the operator and the drifter, eliminating possibilities of more “us” being summoned to save the day like the drifter, but working like a soft reset that allowed the drifter to gain powers, meaning that both that the two timelines were made one, and that this time that matter, wally has a failsave on us, so if he corrupts our timelines its ALL timelines (taking this in how possibly baro made deal to converge all his alternates (pc/console) into one)
Steve said in a dev stream or something that the "morality" choices are just thematic or aesthetic and will have no surprise plot twist attached to them.
if progress far enough in duviri, zariman and deimos and met the right condition you are hen even able to break in duviri the undercroft. and weaken what the undercroft is to hold back. and also those holes then work as a enemy gathering device, but at the cost of breaking what ever the undercorft binds.
As for the ships considering they are mirrored with it going towards whatever land you are in it's likely they're just sitting on top of each other as the ships themselves serve no other purpose unless in relation to the Tenno. at the start when the ship gets catapulted past Saturn towards tau and if we consider his perspective there are all these foreign little lights. some take the deal some don't. some are more interesting than others some fight others decide to turn inwards and considering how curious and playfully malicious he is as to our reactions, curiosity may be tempted him investigate and to follow the ship back home to see more reactions and see more stories and to do that he found one light just in the right spot with the right shine to take the deal but it is that want that he describes. he wants a willing person or vessel in this case to help him in exchange for a bit of help on some vague " I'll scratch your metal back and you scratch mine" deal that is important. in all other documentations of voids or abyss the person is always resisting his pull afraid of his shenanigans except the tenno to an extent. if we go with the whole drifter is the original child here then it makes the shenanigans a bit more believable since "great I have one really bright ass light in the bottom corner of room next to the room I want to go to" and since the timeline is parallel to the drifter then it paints the Tenno we play Ie. the operator being not a doppelganger but more a failed copied facade more than anything which makes a bit more sense since they seem to only be able to react to things although whether that is by design or not is questionable. the drifter is the only one who seems to suffers from the common human condition of looking to the bleak future and giving up in apathy at his powerlessness meanwhile our operator seems to spout nothing but cookie cutter "we fought with honor" rhetoric that seems really hollow and silence in most other cases they only change being important decisions like killing the queens or remembering umbra's memory which seems to satisfy the want for more and whether it's just time constraints or not is up to you either way whether because of times changing and the game sort of rotating in the oven not getting the full treatment on all sides is debatable but what is clear is he wants us to want. he wants us to feel, and our operator seems to serve their purpose just fine, but they lack humanity it may be a light but not the right one like the other. " It just doesn't have that shine kiddo". consider also how the material used in question here for this window shopping doesn't seem to really matter as he will pick the highest high lights like Albrecht or lower ones like us, people who would even consider making the deal or getting close enough to at least see him. what happens in-between seem to be possible rewrites to push that shine in just the right spot and lead him right back to where he wants to be. maybe we already did with the whole sentient ship in the sun and us being his eyes and ears in a sense and now he's just happy to jump through the gaps to see more little lights. as for whether this wall of text is helpful or not the answer is no because you can't react to him in any way. you did in apathy at the end as the drifter and it created a crumbling kingdom of fever dreams, so to do or not do. there are other things like when the operator just blindly does dumb sht with lotus like the whole Natah quest which considering how loyally our character follows her and how she may or may not have made a deal with the man in the wall is food for thought. or consider how he doesn't really infect or corrupt anything merely transform as we can see with the hold fast where at the start their dialogue is just like rambling pure thought but as we bring them back to reality it seems to quiet a bit preventing them from turning into a smear of void bodies on the ship's halls. other small details also add up such as with music or cues like the deal with the very human chorus in the background or how Duviri's music is just more alive in all case apart from the undercroft slightly leading to that whole human feeling thing mentions before although that can be attributed to more live actual instruments. idk, it means nothing mostly. just pure thought.
I find it hard to make sense of lot of story concepts, based on trailers, lore expositions or whatever. As it feels like lot of stuff, especially the trailers get retconned a lot, my most clear examples being the conversation Nathah has with her "mother" in one of New War trailers, only for Erra to reveal their "mother" to be dead all along, also in Duviri trailer, Dominus Trax talks about "what's so interesting out there", and says he wants to follow Drifter out of his realm, only for that topic to never be touched upon. Honestly, i want to follow and keep up with Warframe lore, but i feel like lot of things get rewritten on the fly and don't add up with previous info, and i can't really make sense of lot of topic anymore. At least that's how i feel..
One thing is that it's entirely possible to have a military ship that has no weapons. For example- USNS Comfort is a military vessel, but has no weapons and its role is primarily for civilian benefit.
First... @TheDsIEGE ... Awesome video, as always... one that needs to be watched more then once. Great job. Second... Even the logs at the beginning, tell us about childrens who laugh and roam the ship. A Girlfriend or wife of the narator of the logs, even tried to kill one. MAYBE... Adults never really got mad... Maybe kids did. I mean... every parent would notice that "that thing" is not their child, so they would become agressive... right? And "kids" killed them in "selfdefence". I mean... Who said that adults got mad? The survivors - kids. Also... what Holdfast are saying that adults got mad... the crew is made of the void. They will say what we wish to hear... right? And in the War within... at the end, depending on what we do with the Kuva, Wally possess us and say something... relevant? Maybe a first clue to what you are saying now? And about the Zariman... ship itself. It kept bugging me for a long time... Ember codex tells us it was military ship. Queen tells us there are fires in the lower decks (same decks where kids were hiding?), and we see the ship as colonist ship, without any evidence of fires.... - So I tried to explain it with the Eternalizm... There were all posibilities... And Zariman, colony ship went to void... and Zariman miletery ship... and Zariman explorer ship... There were kids... and there weren't kids... The Man in the wall, chose the reality of the ship he found it was most useful, and made it real. Does that mean... that actually, eternalizm is dictated by Man in the wall? All choices come in one spot in void and only one comes out in the reality, while other choices remain in void to be swallowed/eaten/or what ever by the man in the wall... maybe? Sorry for the long post... its just... after every video you make... I start having endless ideas, some stupid some not so much... but it always makes me think. Thank you :)
Hmmmm.... that's an interesting take and one to consider... Makes a lot of sense too, like this whole thing was staged for a specific purpose, if you will.
A thought occurs about the drifter and the Tenno. There’s a theory about how Wally creates a copy of albreckt entrati and how he questions if he’s himself or a copy. And the same could be true for the Tenno, now Wally likes the Tenno but hates the drifter this we know. What if the Tenno is a copy made by Wally and the drifter is the original us before the deal was made. This would explain why the drifter is the one switched out when the Tenno is trapped in the void by ballas. Their not from parallel timelines but the same one.
They did say one of the next warframes would be a Halloween one so maybe they will release a creepy quest like chains of harrow but on the zariman around Halloween
Maybe it’s just because it’s my favorite example of a big crew on a ship going nuts and everything going crazy, but I always felt the events on the Zariman kind of played out similar to dead space. If the crew of the ship turned into the angels? Definitely similar. However, the way it was presented on game felt more centered around how the ship exists now in the origin system rather than how it was when we, or the drifter, were still lost. The holdfasts touched on their experiences, but the rank ups were more about them coming to terms with what happened and moving forward, so we don’t dwell on much. Would love to see a true retelling of the events on the Zariman in game, and maybe through both perspectives? See how the ship became empty like it’s seems to have done In drifter’s universe, and what it was like when we were rescued in ours. Whether each result was because of the deal, and what that deal pertains to I’ll worry about later. Now, I just want some real spooks, some real messed up shit, rather than just…hearing about it? Thinking about it? Imagination only gets me so far if none of it ever becomes a reality.
The Zariman reminds me of that ship called "Aniara" in the novel titled with the same name authored by Harry Martinson, I feel a sense of dread, realizing that the ship is a giant grave...
I haven't finished the video yet so i don't know if it will come up later or not, but one of the things i never hear anyone talk about is how in the circuit there are quotes about not letting the angels break through or else their "master" would be free. Part of me wonders if the man in the wall is that "master" the angels have and would have so many different weird implications to it. I hope they expand more on who their master is eventually.
I'm not sure... but given what we see in the newest trailer, it looks like the man in the wall is free, so was all our work for nothing, or is there a second entity?
So I have an interesting idea that kinda a bit more out of the box but as the saying goes "To see the future we must look at our past" what if DE has given us hints or at least ideas they wanted to use but couldn't from their previous games? While there probably a few ideas and connecting dots that seem a bit pointless sometimes it's those small things that really tell the bigger picture. Though I'm taking this idea from Bungie sometimes storytelling does connect to other things in strange ways.
What happened to the original Zariman ten zero, well it reappeared and the children were taken off and then it was quietly decommissioned and then just as quietly slipped back into the void. Or there is a second Zariman from a different continuum that appeared in our time line that we are playing around on now while the original is who knows where or a possibility of all three.
Damn... it wasn't just "the Void drove the parents mad" because they lacked a child's imagination or neuroplasticity - 'twas all the fear and anger and desperation of all those thousands of would-be colonists, manifesting pseudophysically through the Void and reflecting back into everyone's psyches a thousandfold. I'm frankly surprised that the ship merely got stuck astride the Veil and didn't claw its way back into realspace as some sort of world-destroying monster seeking revenge against the Orokin that sent it.
@TheDsIEGE did you notice the frame of the transmission? 2 Yellow dots on the Left side, 1 Yellow dot on the Right side and a Blue and White dot on the bottom., thats because The Centauri System IRL is a Binary Star System.
it is a different ship the ship that has reappeared is the zariman that the drifter comes from it's from a time line where we tenno weren't found or rescued something sent it back here or perhaps it never left myself i believe that time doesn't exsist in the void it has no meaning there a place where past present and future is one
I think the Zariman we explore is a different 1 there's the 1 from our timeline that made it back to the system the Drifters ended up in Duvri and this other 1 that has a slightly different events then the other 2 where possibly the kids either died or got out of the Zarinan leaving the adults to kill each other and probably end up as Void angels them instead of getting out of the void at roughly same time is as in our timeline something got on the ship reaking havoc on it making the adults left to basically hide wherever they could stalling and getting rid of the opportunity to get out of void until the new war happens and we're stabbed getting yeeted into the void but it wasn't enough to leave the void until the end of the new war after the man in the wall appeared leaving a big enough opportunity to escape from the void to where we got the quest just a thought even though I'm probably wrong so worth a try to guess.
There are some useful assumptions (which have been directly provided for us, by DE) which can always be taken into any account (or attempt at an accounting of anything in WF): We as Players & Devs are The Tenno A Player: Is a Tenno Is the Operator Commands the Warframes The WF Universe is "The Dream" The In-Dream (In-Game) Operator is a "Projection" into "The Dream" (via The Second Dream) "The Void" is a Technological analogue of Chaos & Khora (in Cosmogony) Real-World History & Historiography (as we know them) are substituted with Mythology (in the Origin System) Science is substituted with Pop Science, Pseudo Science & Myths of Science abstracted from Fantasy Fiction & Popular Culture The Void enables a constant breaking, shifting, and splitting of "Continuity" The Void is also an analogue of "The Collective Unconscious" (in the Jungian conception, where The Ego is mischevious & the source of enmity, the seat of creativity, constitutes the whole of the Freudian unconscious, and presents as a doppelganger & individualized representative personification of The Collective Unconscious) The Void is the source and Environment of The Origin System All "Reality" of The Origin System is drawn from (and returns to) The Void The inhabitants of The Origin System are natively adapted to the mythic nature of its reality and history The discontinuity that is apparent to us (and pervasive throughout) is not perceptible to natives of The Origin System, (any more than the discontinuity of a dream is apparent while we are sleeping). Our presence (as The Tenno) in The Origin System is largely unknown, and is always "masked" where it is known. The Zariman is the Cover Story for the Tenno Presence in The Origin System It is not a Fiction within that context It is a reality which "we" developed as and from a fiction about what The Tenno are (The Dilemma of Reality as a Dream was pretty solidly hammered out by Descartes, while Nick Bostrom dumped a virtual bucket of cold water on the heads of Simulation Hypotheses with the Simulation Argument & Trilemma and the Five-Statement Expanded Argument. So WF took the route that threads between them, by rooting The Simulation Hypothesis not in our history, but in a permeable Dream Mythology. What Metal Gear and The Dark Crystal would be, if you put them together. Or what The Tempest and World On A Wire [Simulacron 3] would be. czcams.com/video/MvBEOnc_U50/video.htmlsi=hUI3sLpA-vw0ppMu czcams.com/video/YvlQ8TQsmQA/video.htmlsi=sI0kdVNv-pUMpVgj czcams.com/video/lxKC9TPnwTM/video.htmlsi=PYC6f3_KH7RnINUs czcams.com/video/sbUjHSrwjTM/video.htmlsi=S4eAIvZa2kpBSxsd czcams.com/video/5Wpr7a6IANo/video.htmlsi=u1BLxIbUeh1nGLDE ) It doesn't have to be the gospel for anyone who plays. Most everyone who does play makes an enormous effort to ignore that stuff. It is necessary to ignore it, in order to imagine a narrative continuity at work (or in play) in WF. There's no assurance that anything I wrote is absolutely true, or exactly right. It's just like the stuff that accompanies any deal; we're always free to take it or leave it. czcams.com/video/hoW_ZLYNb2M/video.htmlsi=2q2ZFDUoc7ATCjLY
Something that is always bugging me like a little voice in the back of my head. Is the phrase “ WE END AS WE BEGIN” it’s said by so many important characters. By Wally, in the requiem oull, Wally keeps repeating this phrase whether it’s in voidtongue or by own of the void mirror characters. The question is why is that phase so important to keep getting repeated? My theory is that the end of warframe is at where it began. Whether that’s the deal we make aboard the Zeiremman or all the way back to the door entreti made.
I think during the deal with man in the wall. He saved children by making copies of them and sending them back to origin system. While drifter waa sent back to drifter. i believe tenno has void power because they are made of void power and that's why drifter dont have void power initially
The people of the Zariman revolted against the Orokin rulers. Tuvul requested those people to be punished. So the Hold fast were the ones who responded with violence and cutting them off from their food. Tuvul didn't care for his people starving to death. My beliefs are that the reliquary drive didn't fail, but was sabotaged too as a punishment. The Hold Fast saw their mistakes, but it was too late. They died trying to right their wrongs. Only for them to be mysteriously resurrected and be stuck with their guilt seeing what their obedience to the Orokin did. They are stuck forever, having no choice but to face what the consequences of their behaviour was day by day while they simply cannot die.
@@TheDsIEGE I don't remember who but there was a lore CZcamsr who pieced all the Zariman lore together that came with the Angels Of The Zariman update and he said that Yonta had to install a switch that would cause the ship to fail if the people would revolt. Because the Orokin knew they would. Similarly to how the Orokin built the Sentients to lose their fertility once they traveled back through the void to prevent them from rising up against their makers. The Orokin were responsible for these horrors. They deserved everything we did to them and more. The only mildly good Orokin are the Entrati family and they are really only good because their infestation and responsibilities leaves them no other choice. But even they stole bodies from the children if their own citizens.
@@thimovijfschaft3271 It really is criminal just how easily the deeds of the Orokin can be glossed over by how fascinating and impressive their empire was. When you first play the game you're awestruck by what they've built and how advanced their society was. It's only later do you realize just how *e v i l* they truly were. From body snatching to sadistically finding the worst ways to let the people under their rule suffer for breathing in their direction the wrong way. Life for the Orokin was great, life under the Orokin... was thinly veiled HELL. The fact the Entrati family are halfway decent is honestly more of a miracle than anything else. But perhaps that's balanced out by the fact that dear ol granddad is 90% of the reason we're all in this mess in the first place.
@@nirablackfire2792 the Entrati are probably only halfway decent because they have been stuck with eachother for a thousand years. So they don't really have much of a choice. But yeah they likely committed body snatching as well since... Well they are Orokin...
This puts Warframe in a beautiful unique place for story, insinuating that we are possibly the villain. This possibility intrigues me... finding out after years that I might be the problem and not the solution would shatter my perceptive. I wonder if the tenno could ever change this about himself? Great video as always. You keep me thinking.
The tenno have always been the villain of the story; we are gaslit to believe from the very start that we are to be neutral and are presented to different versions of the same story; the only real life in the whole solar system are the people of Cetus, Fortuna, Deimos to an extent, and Phobos, beyond that its just colonies of the main three factions. We are always shown that the main three factions have their own reason to "conquer" the rest of the system and kill the Tenno, but it always has boiled down to a basic of constant war due to lack of communication. Should the Grineer and Corpus agree to forge an alliance, they'd raze with the Infested, take down all of the Orokin territory and their technology, and make a somewhat decent front against the Sentient. We are but mere mercenaries in an ongoing war, we fight for "freedom", but it does not matter, because it isn't OUR war that we participate in.
The fingers on the floor of Albrecht's lab are his own, from all the shattered realities now condensed in to just one (quantum mechanical super-position collapse* when Albrecht observed all possible realities taking place in the void). The void shadows the real world. Albrecht fell into the void. Albrecht is the void entity now, and he has one missing finger symbolizing his lost finger from his sole, collapsed reality from many*. The "man in the wall in humanoid form" that we see on our ship is the real "man in the wall". He is Albrecht's doppleganger, escaped from the void. Albrecht is trying to get out of the void to switch with the man in the wall.
The zariman has become my favorite area of the game before that it was deimos and the void towers but omg the zariman is a literal dream come true for me. It is a place that any of the factions if they knew would never come within a thousand miles of the place. It is our home.
Same here. I could spend hours there. It's literally the best area DE has ever made if you ask me.
@@TheDsIEGE easily the best updaye they ever did in every area, whether its lore, esthetic or gameplay. Hopefully they return to form now that duviri is done
@@TheDsIEGEHow I pray that our Dormizone will become an Orbiter Zone, maybe build an orbiter garage beneath it? Seeing a bunch of unused space outside that front door.
Imagine an alien isolation type game set aboad the zariman
The acting in those terrifying voice logs in the beginning is still so good.
Seriously... I mentioned during the premier of the video that the actor just absolutely killed it. Made me feel the emotions!
It gave me Halo 2 ARG vibes "I love bees" logs, they are beautiful teleplays @@TheDsIEGE
Finally, I like how void angels are servants of this void god just like regular angels are portrayed, but we're essentially known as devils by everyone else, which is interesting because you'd think devils are fallen angels, but not all are. I wonder what type of "devil" we are and our relationship with the man in the wall.
It is an really cool dynamic they are using! I hope it leads somewhere, that's all!
Kinda like the ghost rider deal, we access the power, and It accesses us and our abilities by getting us accomplish it's goals along with our own.
The difference between angels and demons depends on whose signing the checks
@@honestkyn718 Yup, the only difference between the servants without will (angels and {depending on the mythology} demons) is the voice that commands them and the hand that aims them.
I believe you're forgetting one more possibility that arises from eternalism. The possibility that there's a 3rd tenno. A third ship. The Zariman that made it to its destination. Now they would obviously have no real impact o the story (possibly/yet), but it gives us the 3 paths of possibility, the tenno that made it, the tenno that got stuck in the void jump, and the tenno that failed the jump entirely.
I wonder how the sentients would act in that third reality.
Did the Orokin send the sentients to Tau before or after the Zariman incident? I thought it was before, so they could terraform it for the colony ship.
If so, since the sentients eventually turn on the Orokin anyway and set their goal on preventing the Orokin from ruining another system, they probably would have killed everyone on the Zariman anyways.
And then the sentients would back to Sol and destroy the Orokin, since there would be no operators for the warframes.
@@kevinpaap2890 I think the Sentients were sent after the Zariman. The Orokin have to build a junction/solar rail to the Tau system. The rail will make the journey safer than a void jump with a reliquary drive, but there needs to be a gate on both sides. Which means someone needs to travel to Tau and build the other side of the gate. The Zariman crew would have built it but their void jump failed, and humans probably won't survive long enough to make the journey without void travel. So the Sentients were created and traveled to Tau the slow way.
@@JCLegendary I am fairly sure the sentients were sent in to terraform Tau, and then the Zariman would be sent to colonize it. It made it back just as the war had started.
@@JCLegendaryno before the mission the tenno was supposed to part of the very first people to colonize that new system
I wonder if the raptwing ephemera (released with the angels of the zariman) is in some way a reference to the man in the wall, since when you equip it on your frame, or more importantly on your drifter/operator, you get 4 arms just like tmitw
Hmmm... Never thought about that... INTERESTING!
On nidus I have 6 arms with it and the honor skin and interstingly the lotus chest seal sits over the hands on his chest like shackles, which I thought was a pretty cool little feature also.
I'd love to tell Acritis about the Zariman
Tbh I think she’s grandmother after talking to her a few times over again n her dialogue is vaguely familiar and grandmother says she don’t need a name she knows who she is I wonder if there’s a link. Just a thought I had tho 🤔🤔🤔
@@skinnydelegateofrhyme8637Or maybe Acritis was based on Grandma when Eluria wrote tales of duviri.
You find out Grandmother's name if you listen to her Dagath story.
I think it's important to note that certain advertisements are canon as well. The tennocon 2022 duviri paradox 20 minute gameplay video is in fact CANON and happened before we broke free of the loop properly. The difference in audio and actions aren't coincidence, Teshin is likely the only one that remembers us from our miriad of cycles and attempts to escape.
Even the new war trailers: Ever thought it was wierd that in game it just happened? we didn't see the invasion or anything? Turns out we did. In the 2019 New war official cinematic trailer.
This. It’s also further “confirmed” by the fact that the Tenno do send us archguns through the paradox, however that works. Plus I do believe in New War the Drifter does say that the operator was in Duviri for a bit, so I think we just haven’t seen it yet
Us being Void Demons that look like children has always been my thoughts, though I've always leaned more towards Daemonprinces where Wally essential scooped out out soul (our light as it were) and replaced it with bunch of void stuff/shoved out light into a body made of void stuff. Being out and out dopplegangers would be an interesting twist, though I'm not fully convinced.
It's tough to say... the way you describe it could just as easily be the way too, Maybe we'll find out soon!
@@TheDsIEGE "Soon" in relative, DE terms of course lol.
@@notsae66 don’t forget to prime and umbra-fy it. Lol
The Orokin always considered us demons, but they were not very reliable narrators.
@@YumLemmingKebabs And dont forget, the Orokin are *incredibly* stupid too (and Assholes), this does not help their case :V
seeing how far the story has come is just.. so nice tbh :')
Yeah, and this year might really put a nice capstone on all of this... fingers crossed!
that would mean the story would be done...i wouldnt like that@@TheDsIEGE
@@wtfman2049maybe it would just be the end of the man in the wall story... And we'd have a new threat emerge 🤷♂️
I find it pretty odd how the front half of the zariman is sticking out in to the origin system AND duviri. Like the drifter's version was sent to their construct reality, duviri. And when they reconnect with us, maybe our version was sent to our reality.
It always bugged me how it seems to face the front in both worlds.
Little thing on the drawings in the Zariman (in the new war quest): when I got the light back (starting the "Meet your parent" quest part) and shone it on one of the pictures depicting the man in the wall (was on a sideways table) the picture CHANGED into the creepiest sideview I've ever seen. haven't played the quest again after that.
I'll check that out, thank you!
OMG I thought it was just a visual bug, I noticed this too!! Absolutely creeped me the hell out. I want to say there are lights you can pick up around the Zariman missions that you can use that may let you be able to see them again!
As for who benifits there is actually a lot of lost lore in "ask a cephalon" where you ask the lotus' personal cephalon why we barely see npc's in warframe and stuff: Because we're deployed far, FAR away from them due to how destructive warframes are. colonies of people are benefiting from our actions, even the railjack cephalon cy leaves the empty ships we clear out "for the locals" which is pretty messed up if you think about all the bodies inside of them.
As for who is "the" tenno and who is "The" drifter. It's quite simple: We are all the drifter, we are all the tenno. None of us are the drifter, None of us are the tenno. We all are the main character in all of the quests and none of us are. It just depends on how you frame the timeline.
I think the only constant is that we all took the deal.
My take on the Zariman we do missions on is it is a separate Zariman, but also real. Two versions of us, two separate pasts, perhaps two separate Zarimans. Perhaps it’s the drifter’s Zariman, which hadn’t been rescued from the void, finally reappeared because now we’re in the origin system. The operator’s Zariman reappeared in this system, and now that the drifter is here, their Zariman is too.
This also carries an explanation as to exactly how the drifter got their powers. The drifter was in the origin system when the operator re-shook Wally’s hand, and because they’re the same person, drifter got those same powers. Because the drifter was in this system when the Tenno got their powers (in a way), the drifter also got those powers.
Kind of like the void trying to correct the timelines now that they’ve mixed and muddled.
1:46 props to the voice actor, you can really tell how close to tears he was and just how traumatic the accident must’ve been.
I'm of the opinion that the zariman that we currently explore is the version from the drifter's reality. In the version where we take the deal, the kids kill all the adults and things don't get a chance to get as bad as it has gotten. In the drifter's version, either noone took the deal or someone else did and as a result the zariman falls further into the void chaos.
I like this... Maybe we took the deal and it effected everyone else on the ship, or didn't dependent on what we chose...
Minor point - for the Drifter, it turns out they DID take the deal, but the Man In The Wall saved everyone EXCEPT the Drifter - one of the tablets in Duvuri, one of the creepy ones, reveals this.
@@JoshabitheTogekiss But as the nature of the void and eternalism, he did as well. The operator being the result.
@@TheDsIEGE I also did have a thought that maybe it's just how the drifter remembers it not how it actually was
An interesting angle for why Tuvul may have been eager to launch even with the risks (the damaged biomes), might just be down to textbook narcissism.
It could simply be that he had no greater design for the crew and he was just a dick.
Very true... and he is just that, lol
There is always a third option, DE wasn't as ambitious with the lore back then, so later events essentially removes them as cannon. It's entirely possible this is just rectonning some older lore.
That's true too and one of the issues with theory crafting. Tough to get something right when retcons can change everything we know in an instant
exactly right, anything before the new war id reckon COULD possibly be retconned here and there purely out of scope since before that point it seemed the story direction was very simple@@TheDsIEGE
Thank you! Really well put together, the plot we have all wanted is becoming clearer. I think in Drifter's reality the sentients wiped out the origin system so there was no rescue, adopting the operators timeline for a planetary system ripe for invasion. We the player are here considered another incarnation of the drift/operator - making choices along the eternal weave - glimpsing the horror future through our screens. The deal stretching all the way back to us never having stepped foot on the Zariman in our future.
Posting for posterity following the demo today. We are blessed.
The story of the 10-0 was one of the most unsettling bits of lore that seemed to have been glossed over it would make for a great stand-alone survival horror game
and visiting it is no better. That place is creepy as hell
The beast in the end...it has 6 arms. The Man has 4.
four that we know of.
I want to point something out I realized when watching this that I never noticed before. Look closely at the scene where Wally extends his hand for the handshake. His hand looks very similar to the way the Drifter's did after gaining the Lotus' severed hand in the Duviri Paradox. This made an entirely new thought enter my head, and it's a wild one. What if we........have all this time.........been the man in the wall ourselves? Sounds nuts I know but as wild as this ride has been I would not rule it out.
I think that's actually a pretty good possibility. Not probabilty, but possible without question.
@@TheDsIEGE Another thing I have considered is the possibility that this whole time we are just a schizophrenic and all this has been different personalities warring inside one head. Duviri really made me think about that with the different personalities driving the environment depending on moods.
I have a gut feeling that the man in the wall is us, the operator, after merging the void. He is what we eventually become. I have a feeling the ending of the story will either be us becoming the man in the wall or us breaking the cycle that creates the man in the wall ending in his defeat. It really makes just because how the tenno are linked to the void. The void doesn’t exist to harm the tenno but maybe use them as some sort of vessel or physical embodiment. Maybe we make the void strong just as it makes us strong. The man in the wall is that peak point in power in which we are one with the void. Maybe the man in the wall let the operator and the drifter survive because they are two halves that make him whole. The drifter able to create his own world inside the void and the operator able to harness the power of the void and control those around them. The man in the wall is an all powerful figure we fear because we don’t any thing about him, but he is just us when we stare into the abyss it stares right back. From the moment we shook his hand on the zariman we were instantly intertwined by fate. I believe that we are playing through the creation of the man in the wall, “our other self” and the ending of warframe might be us resetting the timeline to avoid him from being created or us turning into him creating a timeloop we trapped in. Could also explain why he takes our form and why he calls us kiddos. Because we are the child version of him. I think it would be a perfect ending until warframe 2 of course 😂
One thing i noticed from this video. I remember that Pallidino called the man in the wall the great indifference however there seems to be a lot of indifference among the orokin, the holdfasts and even the tenno (be it through the near constant warfare numbing the tenno to empathy for the starchart version or the drifter being a nexus point of duveri but manifesting his unstable emotions as characters of the tales of duveri as a way to deal with it all.)
What that means and what if any effect the two coming into contact will have i cant say. It may be all 'part of the plan' or a point of eternalism that we currently inhabit if what i understand of it is right.
@25:20 the picture of the "Beast". Its upside down (strangers things upside down?) and when flipped you can see eye's and nostrils. , and what I see (the black smug) looks like the Lotus head. Remember in the New war, the "I need more...MORE!!!" scene?
It's definitely one of the creepiest images to come across, especially when you're not ready for it. like I was, lol... Still gives me the shivers.
Pretty sure we have always been a void copy, since Wallie took our "light" or made a deal to be connected to our "light". The real Zariman came back with only the Tenno Demons aboard, everything else was likely swallowed up by the Void. Was stated that none of the adults were aboard if I remember correctly. The us that wasn't saved was likely still a real person dying in Duviri over and over until our Void self-made the deal and infused the real Tenno with the void during New War/Duviri handshake. This likely was due to Duviri being a void created barrier to save our real self but was slowly eaten by the Albrecht clone, the first Wallie. Also, to clarify, I don't believe Wallie is the Albrecht void clone, just the feeling I get from all of our interactions with him so far, pretty sure there are multiple Wallies just as there were for multiple Us. Pretty sure Albrecht Wallie will be a big villain in a future story arc soon though. Also think that Executor Tuval will be another one at some point as well. I just believe Wallie wanted our "light" to hold himself together so to speak as the void and its song seems to tear things down and change them. I believe the Zariman we visited is a void created one made from the memories of the Real Us once his memories were combined with ours through the lotus hand, allowing travel between the real and Duviri. Reason one of us has to always stay in Duviri is that the Duviri and our deal will fall apart if we aren't in both places at one time. I believe the Albrecht Wallie needed the real Albrecht to stay in order for him to be free. Basically it's a deal with the Devil. Also our Wallie never states that we cannot save ourselves either.
I personally don't believe Eternalism is completely real in Warframe, just the void allows for all possibilities to happen and so Eternalism can exist inside its space. But the light from Real Space allows Void stuff to solidify whatever it is. Reason we can help the Zariman crew that was recreated from the Void. Pretty sure the kids were not affected by the Void Chaos because their emotions and thoughts were less solidified as kids who haven't experienced enough of life or it's trials to be true believers of anything, leaving them less susceptible to the Void stuff. I also believe the real villain of Warframe will be Wallie's enemy and whatever is bringing back the Eidolons and made the entropic energy that makes up Archons with a high likelihood of it being whatever Hunhow is holding back, which is likely hunting the Lotus as she got her powers from a deal made with that being or God when she was formed. This will likely become a further Narmer faction in the future. Just my thoughts. Also, we have the mother Unum still yet to be fully explained in game, she stops time in New War, which makes her insanely powerful. Maybe even more so than the Wallies.
But we will see if what I think is right in next few days at Tennocon. Think us seeing Stalker will give us more on Hunhow when we see him at Tennocon, maybe his death or him no longer able to hold stuff back. I have a few other theories, but I've landed on this one as the most likely (or most interesting) currently until it's stated otherwise as it's less generic, all the other theories I have feel too cliche which likely makes them more plausible at times though. Appreciate your thought provoking videos as always! Thanks, TheDsIEGE! Also apologies for the long response.
P.S. The dark and light choices we are making have been stated by DE to be dark (Calm and Pragmatic) and light (Fiery and Passionate), can't remember which livestream they stated this but they did clarify this already. Would be interesting if it also affects our Wallie Void Daddy.
Yeah no it's unlikely that Tuvul will ever show up, he was stomped on by Voruna when he tried to do continuity on a child. (maybe a tenno?)
@LilFeralGangrel While I see your reasoning I have one word that tears down that logic. Eternalism. We were originally told all the adults went crazy and tore eachother apart, they all died on the Ten0. Now we have void creations of them living on a second Ten0 ingame, only thing stopping them from deteriorating is our "light". It's completely possible we get a void Tuval boss fight later or heck with the 1999 expansion we could even get a time travel to his massacre. Just how I see it, you believe what you want to though.
these lore videos are amazing. Thank you so much for putting these out.
Part of me wonders if there are any other drifters out there, we know there were hundreds of tenno. But what about their counterparts?
I always wonder what the significance of "the Hollow children" will be... who's to say it's not that, passengers aboard the ship...
The answer is yes because you can still form a group for Duviri
Man, I love your videos. Always worth the wait!
I LOVE the concept of the Man in the Wall, it´s so cool. I´m glad we´re finally focusing on him in the new expansion.
My own personal take as to hy the ship appeared and then disappeared is that after the deal, wally took the ship to the origin system, basically dumped out all the radded up kids, took back the ship, and brought it back to the origin system when he was done messing with it
The zariman is literally a ship built by the orokin
Yeah, you're right. The one the Orokin claimed the children from was built by them. But... if they reclaimed the ship and the tenno years back... how did it get back into the void?
@@TheDsIEGEbecause they tossed the ship back into the void to cover up the discovery of the tenno
@@TheDsIEGEalso Archimedean yonta tells us we arnt void manifestation but something much more interesting
I quit playing Warframe a few years back but have recently stumbled across your channel again. Making me consider jumping back in.
Completely off topic but I didn't realise how much Citrine looks like the void angels, probably doesn't mean anything tho.
As always great video! And as always you blew my mind with it!
Thank you, I'm glad you enjoyed it! And enjoy your next mission on the zariman!!!
After seeing the recent trailer for tennocon, i think you hit the nail on the head with this one.
You got all my attention after this video and therefore new sub
So Drifter was left behind to the mad/ravenous adults and potentialy having all his other timelines and posibilities destroyed/killed off, while everyone else was saved... Damn Son
Love your videos
I was uninterested in the zariman after the quest but watching this gave it a new light for me to appreciate, helps that im getting back into warframe cause of whispers in the wall
gave me bit of chils thinking about it but great video and great deep dive into the lure
So if we're the doppelganger, and we see our own doppelganger on our ship, does that mean Wally can make a copy of a copy?
You know... a bunch of people brought forth a theory to me years ago that I didn't want to admit but... If you've ever seen Fight club, or the willem dafoe version of the green goblin, they are talking to their conscience, but it's in their head. It makes me wonder if we aren't doing the same thing. Can't say for certain, mind you, he does seem to be the master of copying people but... i'd say either are possible if my theory is accurate.
@@TheDsIEGE I think you're right about being our projection, our body got the blacked eyes/changed voices several times already: with Lotus killing Erra in The Old War, rejecting continuity (The War Within'), TWW mountain ending scene and maybe more.
Great video as usual, D-man!
I love your channel's logo but I have a suggestion: it would be hella cool if you changed the D to look like the Zariman itself which is also shaped like a D. Or something like that, you get the point.
Just a... funny little idea I just thought of.
completely unrelated to the video, but i wanna say just how much i appreciate your content and the amount of thought & effort you put into your theories. other channels make the most surface-level bare-bone low-effort recital of stuff that is already clearly laid out ,and i just die a lil on the inside. yours are actually Inciteful, thought-provoking, and never fail to make my day better. Thank you, truly.
Thank you!!! That really is the goal here, to peel back a few layers and look into the deeper story. It's the reason I started the channel in the first place, so I really appreciate you saying this. Many in the community don't like my content because they feel it makes too many grand assumptions off little things, but... I believe that's where the people who make the game get their ideas moving forward too! Looking at things already established in world and build off little breadcrumbs. Personally I love this type of content and given that people like yourself still enjoy it, I see no reason to stop!!!
There's something I don't think you've noticed (and afaik no one else has either) I mentioned this on the (Un)official Warframe Discord, I can give you the message date and everything, but Ballas, he "dissapears", right after TMITW appears at the end of the New War, and this is DURING a cutscene, we never get any confirmation of him actually dying, or better yet, where did he go?
I'd love to hear your thoughts on that, or if it helps you on the foundation of your theories, love ya Siege, keep up with the videos.
That's a really good catch... Hmmm... Let me think on that a bit.
00:00 HOLY SHIT KYLE CRANE!?
Thank you for the video! What a coincidence the main Warframe channel
released a teaser about the same topic on the same day.
A have a theory reaching back to one of your videos where you mention a possible mother-father fight between the Lotus and the Wall. In the Apostasy prologue, a single purple light leads us to Lua and show us how the Lotus leaves us. Possibly for our own good to know it happens. But in the Chimera prologue, the Man in the wall himself shows us the way to Ballas giving us a sword to KILL the Lotus while making fun of her and projecting Lotus shaped black figures to attack us. He wants her dead or he wanted to release the Drifter the way like this.
@22:30 The "Singing, laughter and play" didn't come from TENNO(S) it came from "younger version" of adults (like you can see younger version of Yonta during void flood mission). "Younger version" could also mean kids that were "Yuvan". Who's bodies were taken over by adults so adults can live longer.
Although Albrecht encountered Man in the Wall, he didn't take "the deal". The kid whos body Albrecht took over, his last Yuvan, did take "the deal". Man in the Wall only makes deals with children.
I really like this video😊. My favorite part is when the man in the wall double ganger asked deisege is that all you remember kiddo? And Deisege answered how he would but not his in game character. I like that. It makes it more personal. I was not so crazy about the intro with the voice over that took a full minute before deisege came in. I think if you wanted to do something like that in the future, you should voice it yourself. You have a nice voice Deisige.
Thank you for that feedback and I think you're right, the intro was too long. That being said, I wnted to include it because I'm not sure many people have seen that given that it never appears in game, only online. But thank you for the compliment on my voice!
some interesting theories, nice
I want to be able to explore the Zariman, without having the pressure of a mission time or objective thrown upon us.
Explore it, and feel the pure disturbing horror of it, but same time, the weird beauty of the Zariman. How twisted the void made it, and the people, twisted in horror, but same time, a strange beauty to them. Has such a potential to it, for eploration.
Have said this on previous video, but I keep wanting this, and who knows, maybe the Devs will see the comments, mine or someone elses, and get inspiration to make such a option in the game
I would like DE to make the Zariman an entire open landscape after completing the nodes, like a reflection of Duviri itself, but with a key difference, that it is clear of enemies except void angels.
Since the bounties seem to take place on the nodes anyway.
I this is actually how i assumed it was. It would explain why the operator is in a child form and how they can't die.
It also makes more sense the drifter them being the actual tenno, or maybe they're the tennos light? To me that would also explain the events that transpired before we start the duviri quest. Like the void is eroding the defense of the tennos light (duviri) to get to the light (the drifter).
😂😂😂 i'm sorry but you using those lines out of Rell was hilarious!!
Watching this after seeing the Warframe teaser really has me thinking we're finally gonna confront Wally.
The zariman was by far my favorite update, i liked just exploring the classrooms
Something I only noticed recently is that on the Zariman all the what i can only describe as patches of solid void all over the place is also in the design of The Man In The Walls crown around where the ears would be.
a day wait... damn
no it's today... that's my fault.
@TheDsIEGE oh okay I'll be there
Yesterday I came across a log of that one asshole degrading everyone on the ship, then cutting food rations to one meal a day as a punishment. Didn't even know there were logs on the ship. Interesting stuff, great video.
Question: ❓
When doing the Archon hunt missions, the "RAM" Erra talking/telling about a backstory in the past of a Sentient who saw "Demon of the Void" and he feared it not? You mind give me a hand with that.
"And I beheld a great Ram, and the horns of him were crowned with Sol, and with Tau. And upon his tongue, the Zariman flame. And the mighty daemon of the Void, cowered before him. And he feared it not." Many of Pazuul's quotes are iterations of bible versus, and this appears to be some kind of scripture like reading. It could just be metaphor but... it could end up leading to the final confrontation with the man in the wall as prophecy. We might get a little more lore at tennocon but it's tough to say.
I noticed that Cavalerro makes a Junji Ito reference when doing the Argozene missions where he says,
“Find the socket that calls to you, your socket, the socket that was meant for you…”
Between that, the tragedy of the Zariman, the spiral designs of the Void Angels and the Zariman, and the fact that the Void “calls” to the ghosts of the Zariman until they theoretically reach the point of no return gave me a lot more Junji Ito inspiration than I realized at first.
Also if the Tenno is a “void doppelgänger” as per your theory, I wonder if the empathy the Tenno show has anything to do with the Drifter trying to help and empathize with the other children and Wally mirroring that empathy to a degree.
If Albrechts void mirror spawned “The indifference”, could the Drifter spawn “The Empath” or can the void ONLY be indifferent. Tagfer does describe the void as clumsily doing things but also lonely.
a new solar rail is being build towards tau after ingame hints found on the zariman, duviri and deimos also zariman, duviri and deimos is linked interconnected by the void. where the void also leads to duviri thats why the zariman blends into duviri. duviri has an inverted zariman accessable.
"Zariman Actual" - Doesn't feel like a slip. Did I miss something or does this not feed directly into the idea of the "copies" - Maybe Void travel IS making copies. One here, one there.
Good catch, never really thought about that!
In fact, pulling on that strand a little more, maybe the film "Primer" has some interesting ideas that would be helpful here? I cannot help thinking that WE don't travel, but we create a copy of our consciousness in another place (transference?), but we have to use The Void to do this.
They call it a "long jump", but maybe transference across a long distance requires more of The Void's energy to try and keep that consciousness intact, increasing the level of risk if something goes wrong? Cephalons are simply consciousness digitized, right, so why is this not the same principle? Are we ALL cephalons at the end of the day?
@@TheDsIEGE How did the trailer hit you? Seems like we may well be going down your path sir!
My take on the whole deal being represented with a handshake between ourselves (operator to wally operator and the operator drifter) is that wally clones are the real us or albert that got corrupted into helping the void and are time traveling, making different timelines go thei way or the voids way.
The copy operator we first shake hands could be either an alternate self travelling to other timeline (just like how the drifter is able to influence the operator timeline) or could perfectly be the same “us” operator that in traveled back to save it self giving us void powers, how did we get powers first get void powers if we gave it to ourselves? Simple we just were always meant to get them, travel back and re ignite them in the past.
Also this means the void depending on how it sees you it can corrupt u in two ways, if it has no (big) use of you it turns you into an angel, the other being into just make you work for it keeping ur body, making you work for it by trying to corrupt ur own or other timelines and lead it to the void cascading into the real world.
Another less thought interpretation of the deal is that at that moment all of our timelines converged into the two that we have, making all possibilities being the operator and the drifter, eliminating possibilities of more “us” being summoned to save the day like the drifter, but working like a soft reset that allowed the drifter to gain powers, meaning that both that the two timelines were made one, and that this time that matter, wally has a failsave on us, so if he corrupts our timelines its ALL timelines (taking this in how possibly baro made deal to converge all his alternates (pc/console) into one)
6:11 well this is new to me....and now I cant unsee it -_-
Steve said in a dev stream or something that the "morality" choices are just thematic or aesthetic and will have no surprise plot twist attached to them.
Yeah, but... we'll see if it always stays that way...
if progress far enough in duviri, zariman and deimos and met the right condition you are hen even able to break in duviri the undercroft. and weaken what the undercroft is to hold back. and also those holes then work as a enemy gathering device, but at the cost of breaking what ever the undercorft binds.
Dam dude 😎 I can't wait to be there at tenno con
As for the ships considering they are mirrored with it going towards whatever land you are in it's likely they're just sitting on top of each other as the ships themselves serve no other purpose unless in relation to the Tenno. at the start when the ship gets catapulted past Saturn towards tau and if we consider his perspective there are all these foreign little lights. some take the deal some don't. some are more interesting than others some fight others decide to turn inwards and considering how curious and playfully malicious he is as to our reactions, curiosity may be tempted him investigate and to follow the ship back home to see more reactions and see more stories and to do that he found one light just in the right spot with the right shine to take the deal but it is that want that he describes. he wants a willing person or vessel in this case to help him in exchange for a bit of help on some vague " I'll scratch your metal back and you scratch mine" deal that is important. in all other documentations of voids or abyss the person is always resisting his pull afraid of his shenanigans except the tenno to an extent. if we go with the whole drifter is the original child here then it makes the shenanigans a bit more believable since "great I have one really bright ass light in the bottom corner of room next to the room I want to go to" and since the timeline is parallel to the drifter then it paints the Tenno we play Ie. the operator being not a doppelganger but more a failed copied facade more than anything which makes a bit more sense since they seem to only be able to react to things although whether that is by design or not is questionable. the drifter is the only one who seems to suffers from the common human condition of looking to the bleak future and giving up in apathy at his powerlessness meanwhile our operator seems to spout nothing but cookie cutter "we fought with honor" rhetoric that seems really hollow and silence in most other cases they only change being important decisions like killing the queens or remembering umbra's memory which seems to satisfy the want for more and whether it's just time constraints or not is up to you either way whether because of times changing and the game sort of rotating in the oven not getting the full treatment on all sides is debatable but what is clear is he wants us to want. he wants us to feel, and our operator seems to serve their purpose just fine, but they lack humanity it may be a light but not the right one like the other. " It just doesn't have that shine kiddo". consider also how the material used in question here for this window shopping doesn't seem to really matter as he will pick the highest high lights like Albrecht or lower ones like us, people who would even consider making the deal or getting close enough to at least see him. what happens in-between seem to be possible rewrites to push that shine in just the right spot and lead him right back to where he wants to be. maybe we already did with the whole sentient ship in the sun and us being his eyes and ears in a sense and now he's just happy to jump through the gaps to see more little lights. as for whether this wall of text is helpful or not the answer is no because you can't react to him in any way. you did in apathy at the end as the drifter and it created a crumbling kingdom of fever dreams, so to do or not do.
there are other things like when the operator just blindly does dumb sht with lotus like the whole Natah quest which considering how loyally our character follows her and how she may or may not have made a deal with the man in the wall is food for thought.
or consider how he doesn't really infect or corrupt anything merely transform as we can see with the hold fast where at the start their dialogue is just like rambling pure thought but as we bring them back to reality it seems to quiet a bit preventing them from turning into a smear of void bodies on the ship's halls.
other small details also add up such as with music or cues like the deal with the very human chorus in the background or how Duviri's music is just more alive in all case apart from the undercroft slightly leading to that whole human feeling thing mentions before although that can be attributed to more live actual instruments.
idk, it means nothing mostly. just pure thought.
my scales show more dark then my light my evil choices out weighed my good ones i have a little light but more shadows
I find it hard to make sense of lot of story concepts, based on trailers, lore expositions or whatever. As it feels like lot of stuff, especially the trailers get retconned a lot, my most clear examples being the conversation Nathah has with her "mother" in one of New War trailers, only for Erra to reveal their "mother" to be dead all along, also in Duviri trailer, Dominus Trax talks about "what's so interesting out there", and says he wants to follow Drifter out of his realm, only for that topic to never be touched upon.
Honestly, i want to follow and keep up with Warframe lore, but i feel like lot of things get rewritten on the fly and don't add up with previous info, and i can't really make sense of lot of topic anymore. At least that's how i feel..
One thing is that it's entirely possible to have a military ship that has no weapons. For example- USNS Comfort is a military vessel, but has no weapons and its role is primarily for civilian benefit.
First... @TheDsIEGE ... Awesome video, as always... one that needs to be watched more then once. Great job. Second... Even the logs at the beginning, tell us about childrens who laugh and roam the ship. A Girlfriend or wife of the narator of the logs, even tried to kill one. MAYBE... Adults never really got mad... Maybe kids did. I mean... every parent would notice that "that thing" is not their child, so they would become agressive... right? And "kids" killed them in "selfdefence". I mean... Who said that adults got mad? The survivors - kids. Also... what Holdfast are saying that adults got mad... the crew is made of the void. They will say what we wish to hear... right? And in the War within... at the end, depending on what we do with the Kuva, Wally possess us and say something... relevant? Maybe a first clue to what you are saying now?
And about the Zariman... ship itself. It kept bugging me for a long time... Ember codex tells us it was military ship. Queen tells us there are fires in the lower decks (same decks where kids were hiding?), and we see the ship as colonist ship, without any evidence of fires.... - So I tried to explain it with the Eternalizm... There were all posibilities... And Zariman, colony ship went to void... and Zariman miletery ship... and Zariman explorer ship... There were kids... and there weren't kids... The Man in the wall, chose the reality of the ship he found it was most useful, and made it real. Does that mean... that actually, eternalizm is dictated by Man in the wall? All choices come in one spot in void and only one comes out in the reality, while other choices remain in void to be swallowed/eaten/or what ever by the man in the wall... maybe?
Sorry for the long post... its just... after every video you make... I start having endless ideas, some stupid some not so much... but it always makes me think. Thank you :)
Hmmmm.... that's an interesting take and one to consider... Makes a lot of sense too, like this whole thing was staged for a specific purpose, if you will.
A thought occurs about the drifter and the Tenno. There’s a theory about how Wally creates a copy of albreckt entrati and how he questions if he’s himself or a copy. And the same could be true for the Tenno, now Wally likes the Tenno but hates the drifter this we know. What if the Tenno is a copy made by Wally and the drifter is the original us before the deal was made. This would explain why the drifter is the one switched out when the Tenno is trapped in the void by ballas. Their not from parallel timelines but the same one.
They did say one of the next warframes would be a Halloween one so maybe they will release a creepy quest like chains of harrow but on the zariman around Halloween
Maybe it’s just because it’s my favorite example of a big crew on a ship going nuts and everything going crazy, but I always felt the events on the Zariman kind of played out similar to dead space. If the crew of the ship turned into the angels? Definitely similar. However, the way it was presented on game felt more centered around how the ship exists now in the origin system rather than how it was when we, or the drifter, were still lost. The holdfasts touched on their experiences, but the rank ups were more about them coming to terms with what happened and moving forward, so we don’t dwell on much. Would love to see a true retelling of the events on the Zariman in game, and maybe through both perspectives? See how the ship became empty like it’s seems to have done In drifter’s universe, and what it was like when we were rescued in ours. Whether each result was because of the deal, and what that deal pertains to I’ll worry about later. Now, I just want some real spooks, some real messed up shit, rather than just…hearing about it? Thinking about it? Imagination only gets me so far if none of it ever becomes a reality.
I many questions
Me too. Making this video cracked my lore brain.
The Zariman reminds me of that ship called "Aniara" in the novel titled with the same name authored by Harry Martinson, I feel a sense of dread, realizing that the ship is a giant grave...
Tasty snacks man in wall drifter and operator I wonder now what happens in 1999 Warframe where he use console and colapses
I haven't finished the video yet so i don't know if it will come up later or not, but one of the things i never hear anyone talk about is how in the circuit there are quotes about not letting the angels break through or else their "master" would be free.
Part of me wonders if the man in the wall is that "master" the angels have and would have so many different weird implications to it. I hope they expand more on who their master is eventually.
I'm not sure... but given what we see in the newest trailer, it looks like the man in the wall is free, so was all our work for nothing, or is there a second entity?
So I have an interesting idea that kinda a bit more out of the box but as the saying goes "To see the future we must look at our past" what if DE has given us hints or at least ideas they wanted to use but couldn't from their previous games? While there probably a few ideas and connecting dots that seem a bit pointless sometimes it's those small things that really tell the bigger picture.
Though I'm taking this idea from Bungie sometimes storytelling does connect to other things in strange ways.
What happened to the original Zariman ten zero, well it reappeared and the children were taken off and then it was quietly decommissioned and then just as quietly slipped back into the void. Or there is a second Zariman from a different continuum that appeared in our time line that we are playing around on now while the original is who knows where or a possibility of all three.
you can go to that underside??? i always figured it was out of bounds....well played DE you hid a helluva thing there
Oh yeah you can... and it's pretty crazy down there.
I swear acrithis is grandmother from subtle things they both say in there dialogues
Working on a theory paralleling characters within duviri with ones from the origin system. We'll see if it goes anywhere.
Here after Tennocon:
Warframe is now Rick and Morty.
Albrecht Walltrati.
I hope Loid isn’t weird
Damn... it wasn't just "the Void drove the parents mad" because they lacked a child's imagination or neuroplasticity - 'twas all the fear and anger and desperation of all those thousands of would-be colonists, manifesting pseudophysically through the Void and reflecting back into everyone's psyches a thousandfold. I'm frankly surprised that the ship merely got stuck astride the Veil and didn't claw its way back into realspace as some sort of world-destroying monster seeking revenge against the Orokin that sent it.
Shotout to the guy who did the voice for those audio logs
@TheDsIEGE did you notice the frame of the transmission?
2 Yellow dots on the Left side, 1 Yellow dot on the Right side
and a Blue and White dot on the bottom., thats because
The Centauri System IRL is a Binary Star System.
I very rarely spend any time in the Zariman, so after this video, i did!
It's a really creepy place...
I love the Rapture Bioshock vibes.
I think most thought it would be a series of short hops to Tau, Rather than one single leap.
I know siege is gonna be eating good on lore after that tennocon teaser that just dropped
it is a different ship the ship that has reappeared is the zariman that the drifter comes from it's from a time line where we tenno weren't found or rescued something sent it back here
or perhaps it never left myself i believe that time doesn't exsist in the void it has no meaning there a place where past present and future is one
I think the Zariman we explore is a different 1 there's the 1 from our timeline that made it back to the system the Drifters ended up in Duvri and this other 1 that has a slightly different events then the other 2 where possibly the kids either died or got out of the Zarinan leaving the adults to kill each other and probably end up as Void angels them instead of getting out of the void at roughly same time is as in our timeline something got on the ship reaking havoc on it making the adults left to basically hide wherever they could stalling and getting rid of the opportunity to get out of void until the new war happens and we're stabbed getting yeeted into the void but it wasn't enough to leave the void until the end of the new war after the man in the wall appeared leaving a big enough opportunity to escape from the void to where we got the quest just a thought even though I'm probably wrong so worth a try to guess.
There are some useful assumptions (which have been directly provided for us, by DE) which can always be taken into any account (or attempt at an accounting of anything in WF):
We as Players & Devs are The Tenno
A Player:
Is a Tenno
Is the Operator
Commands the Warframes
The WF Universe is "The Dream"
The In-Dream (In-Game) Operator is a "Projection" into "The Dream" (via The Second Dream)
"The Void" is a Technological analogue of Chaos & Khora (in Cosmogony)
Real-World History & Historiography (as we know them) are substituted with Mythology (in the Origin System)
Science is substituted with Pop Science, Pseudo Science & Myths of Science abstracted from Fantasy Fiction & Popular Culture
The Void enables a constant breaking, shifting, and splitting of "Continuity"
The Void is also an analogue of "The Collective Unconscious" (in the Jungian conception, where The Ego is mischevious & the source of enmity, the seat of creativity, constitutes the whole of the Freudian unconscious, and presents as a doppelganger & individualized representative personification of The Collective Unconscious)
The Void is the source and Environment of The Origin System
All "Reality" of The Origin System is drawn from (and returns to) The Void
The inhabitants of The Origin System are natively adapted to the mythic nature of its reality and history
The discontinuity that is apparent to us (and pervasive throughout) is not perceptible to natives of The Origin System, (any more than the discontinuity of a dream is apparent while we are sleeping).
Our presence (as The Tenno) in The Origin System is largely unknown, and is always "masked" where it is known.
The Zariman is the Cover Story for the Tenno Presence in The Origin System
It is not a Fiction within that context
It is a reality which "we" developed as and from a fiction about what The Tenno are
(The Dilemma of Reality as a Dream was pretty solidly hammered out by Descartes, while Nick Bostrom dumped a virtual bucket of cold water on the heads of Simulation Hypotheses with the Simulation Argument & Trilemma and the Five-Statement Expanded Argument. So WF took the route that threads between them, by rooting The Simulation Hypothesis not in our history, but in a permeable Dream Mythology. What Metal Gear and The Dark Crystal would be, if you put them together. Or what The Tempest and World On A Wire [Simulacron 3] would be.
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It doesn't have to be the gospel for anyone who plays.
Most everyone who does play makes an enormous effort to ignore that stuff.
It is necessary to ignore it, in order to imagine a narrative continuity at work (or in play) in WF.
There's no assurance that anything I wrote is absolutely true, or exactly right.
It's just like the stuff that accompanies any deal; we're always free to take it or leave it.
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Something that is always bugging me like a little voice in the back of my head. Is the phrase “ WE END AS WE BEGIN” it’s said by so many important characters. By Wally, in the requiem oull, Wally keeps repeating this phrase whether it’s in voidtongue or by own of the void mirror characters. The question is why is that phase so important to keep getting repeated? My theory is that the end of warframe is at where it began. Whether that’s the deal we make aboard the Zeiremman or all the way back to the door entreti made.
The Zariman situation really reminds me of Dead Space.
I think during the deal with man in the wall. He saved children by making copies of them and sending them back to origin system. While drifter waa sent back to drifter. i believe tenno has void power because they are made of void power and that's why drifter dont have void power initially
The people of the Zariman revolted against the Orokin rulers. Tuvul requested those people to be punished. So the Hold fast were the ones who responded with violence and cutting them off from their food. Tuvul didn't care for his people starving to death. My beliefs are that the reliquary drive didn't fail, but was sabotaged too as a punishment. The Hold Fast saw their mistakes, but it was too late. They died trying to right their wrongs. Only for them to be mysteriously resurrected and be stuck with their guilt seeing what their obedience to the Orokin did. They are stuck forever, having no choice but to face what the consequences of their behaviour was day by day while they simply cannot die.
It's a bad situation no doubt... it also makes me wonder if the sabotage you speak of was always going to happen.
@@TheDsIEGE I don't remember who but there was a lore CZcamsr who pieced all the Zariman lore together that came with the Angels Of The Zariman update and he said that Yonta had to install a switch that would cause the ship to fail if the people would revolt. Because the Orokin knew they would. Similarly to how the Orokin built the Sentients to lose their fertility once they traveled back through the void to prevent them from rising up against their makers. The Orokin were responsible for these horrors. They deserved everything we did to them and more.
The only mildly good Orokin are the Entrati family and they are really only good because their infestation and responsibilities leaves them no other choice. But even they stole bodies from the children if their own citizens.
@@thimovijfschaft3271 It really is criminal just how easily the deeds of the Orokin can be glossed over by how fascinating and impressive their empire was. When you first play the game you're awestruck by what they've built and how advanced their society was.
It's only later do you realize just how *e v i l* they truly were. From body snatching to sadistically finding the worst ways to let the people under their rule suffer for breathing in their direction the wrong way. Life for the Orokin was great, life under the Orokin... was thinly veiled HELL.
The fact the Entrati family are halfway decent is honestly more of a miracle than anything else.
But perhaps that's balanced out by the fact that dear ol granddad is 90% of the reason we're all in this mess in the first place.
@@nirablackfire2792 the Entrati are probably only halfway decent because they have been stuck with eachother for a thousand years. So they don't really have much of a choice. But yeah they likely committed body snatching as well since... Well they are Orokin...
This puts Warframe in a beautiful unique place for story, insinuating that we are possibly the villain. This possibility intrigues me... finding out after years that I might be the problem and not the solution would shatter my perceptive. I wonder if the tenno could ever change this about himself?
Great video as always. You keep me thinking.
The tenno have always been the villain of the story; we are gaslit to believe from the very start that we are to be neutral and are presented to different versions of the same story; the only real life in the whole solar system are the people of Cetus, Fortuna, Deimos to an extent, and Phobos, beyond that its just colonies of the main three factions. We are always shown that the main three factions have their own reason to "conquer" the rest of the system and kill the Tenno, but it always has boiled down to a basic of constant war due to lack of communication. Should the Grineer and Corpus agree to forge an alliance, they'd raze with the Infested, take down all of the Orokin territory and their technology, and make a somewhat decent front against the Sentient. We are but mere mercenaries in an ongoing war, we fight for "freedom", but it does not matter, because it isn't OUR war that we participate in.
The fingers on the floor of Albrecht's lab are his own, from all the shattered realities now condensed in to just one (quantum mechanical super-position collapse* when Albrecht observed all possible realities taking place in the void). The void shadows the real world. Albrecht fell into the void. Albrecht is the void entity now, and he has one missing finger symbolizing his lost finger from his sole, collapsed reality from many*. The "man in the wall in humanoid form" that we see on our ship is the real "man in the wall". He is Albrecht's doppleganger, escaped from the void. Albrecht is trying to get out of the void to switch with the man in the wall.