Brushy Bill Roberts
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Updated video on Brushy Bill - • Was Brushy Bill Robert...
On the night of July 14th, 1881, the infamous outlaw Billy The Kid was killed in Ft. Sumner New Mexico.
Sheriff Pat Garret was questioning Pete Maxwell as to Billy’s whereabouts when the kid walked into the darkened room. Realizing he wasn’t alone, Billy spoke his final words “Quien es, who is it?". Garrett - recognizing the Kid’s voice - drew his revolver and shot twice; the first bullet struck Billy in the chest just above the heart. Thus ending the short, yet bloody, career of Billy the Kid.
But did things really go down like that? Did Pat Garrett really kill Billy The Kid? In 1950, 69 years after Billy was allegedly killed, a man known as Brushy Bill Roberts met with the governor of New Mexico, claiming to be Billy The Kid and requesting the pardon he was promised decades before. The 90-year-old Roberts spoke fluent Spanish and, like the kid, was ambidextrous; able to shoot a gun with both hands. He had five signed affidavits from people who actually knew the Kid back in the day swearing that he was, indeed, Billy.
And he had every bullet wound Billy was said to have plus many more. #wildwest #oldwest #western
Was Brushy Bill really Billy The Kid? And if not, who the hell was he?
josh@wildwestexta.com - Zábava
The shooting of Billy wouldn't be the first time Pat Garrett had blatantly lied as a lawman.
Agreed
I think Pat Garret wanted to be a pulp fiction novel hero.
Or the first person pat shot thinking it was the kid
He was shot and killed because he tried to screw someone over. Lol alot to lose of his name sake if the stories he told came out as BS
Pat was so badass that with his back turned dick in hand pissing he was a threat…. 🤣 😂😂
“You’re Billy the Kid, too, ya know. You all are. Dirty, Little, Billy Bastards…”
You took my farm Mr Chisholm!
@TommyBoy-719- you took a lot of farms, Mr. Chisum. And as long as Billy the Kid is taking some back, I'm with him
@@williamavitt8264 😅
Holy shit, this is the best historical opinion vs. historical evidence video of all time! Thank you, sir
21 year olds today can't reasonably be compared with 14 year olds let alone 21 year olds back in the 1800s. Those kids back then were piled with responsibilities at a very early age.
One of my ancestors fought in the Confederate Army at 14. A lot of young MEN did.
Us poor people still live like that.
Billy or not they should of givin the old man the pardon....what could it hurt.
I was an adult when Young Guns II came out and was equally obsessed. 😂
I was not and the other day I went to the cinema and apologized and revealed where the hidden entry we kids used, and that was used by kids since the 50s. Was I wrong?
In that picture of Billy the Kid, he looked like he had a deformed lip to me. I am a fan of Billy and think he was a hero and deserves to be given a pardon for fighting corrupt local government back before the federal government would do anything against it. Billy needs to be a hero of New Mexico - I say that as New Mexico is one of my adopted states.
Do you mean a cleft?
He had 2 protruding front teeth that made his upper lip look weird.
Are you talking about Brushy Bill ? He was a Con man.
Slight movement could mess up photos abit maybe that's what happened.
@@sidneydaugherty4895 ....is all.
BB I have several old family bibles from my ancestors, passed to me by my dad's mother. She was the family historian and I found recorded dates and names with a link to each one to explain the connection. Found out that this recorded her family tree back to the 1550 decade. She was Luilla V. Parker born 1896 and passed in 1984. Family Bibles are important to family history. Thank you.
My great uncle was a very old man in the 60s he claimed that Billy was never killed by garett and was tought how to shoot by an older guy he new as Mr. Robert's. I kinda want to believe my uncle.
well Robert's is one of the most common names in the country so...
@@ispartacus1337 true that
Scenerio 2 for sure. Great episode, absolutely loved it. You are also hilarious. Keep up the great work, will be looking for more to watch. Thank you!!!
I am so glad to have uncovered this Podcast. I was blessed to have been chosen to have worked on the set of Young Guns II. I researched 18th Century Buildings used as hotsets that got shot up, the newspaper sketch of William Peterson that Emilio reads and shoots up as well as sketched the horse for a taxidermist to make when Emilio’s horse gets shot in the beginning. I spent a glorious four months on the set. Thank you for this podcast. How can I attach a picture from the set to you?
I LOVED the podcast‼️It is obvious to the vast amount of effort and work that was dedicated to developing an impressive knowledge base for Billy the Kid. The well organized and engaging delivery style captivates listener attention to allow one to easily follow the podcast's content despite initial forenamed possible confusion with the podcast's use of multiple aliases for Billy the Kd. A highlight and genuine point of listener appreciation is the emphasis on content validity and the provision of said within a contextual framework from both pro and con perspectives. Finally your tantalizing personality and sense of humor visibly emerge to entice one to remain fully attentive as if listening to a story proffered by a close friend.
I am truly delighted to have stumbled upon your channel to wit you have a new subscriber anxious to listen to your prior podcasts and eager for the new. Thank you so very much. 👍🏼👍🏼
Thank you, Patrick
Great stuff, man. I grew up with Young Guns and that great Time Life book, too. The local library finally gave me their old copy after the few dozen times I checked it out. Reading the "BTK: An Autobiography" book now. Led me to a CZcams search and your podcast.
Haven't read all of it yet, but Brushy initially claimed BTK was his half-brother, instead of cousin. Small point, but since you asked I wanted to throw that out there. Really enjoy the podcast and look forward to checking out more of your stuff.
I'm reading the same book!
Just found this and I absolutely love it! Going to binge watch all the episodes now. ☺👍
oh you
I recently watched an interview with the grandson of the guy Billy was supposedly staying with that night who lived in the house next to Maxwell's. Garrett was there with 2 deputies who were outside while Garrett was inside talking to Maxwell. Billy went to see who was there and Garrett shot him with a double barrel shotgun through the screen door. The deputies didn't recognize him but Garrett saw him at the door and immediately new who he was. Supposedly Garrett was hiding under a cot in the hallway just inside waiting. Maxwell didn't want to be involved so he didn't attempt to warn Billy.
That sounds more plausible then any other story I've heard. Of course, there's so many stories that it's impossible to really know. Whatever the truth, Billy's short life is legendary even if embellished.
This podcast is one of the most entertaining ones I've heard and I'm glad I found it. Also, your sponsor has me sold. Great job picking them up.
The deputy Jon Poe would have recognized Billy. I always thought it was strange that he would just walk right past Poe. He's also the one who at first said garret shot the wrong man and then changed his statement. Also the other deputy said it wasn't Billy when he was close to his death bed, he said it was a "Mexican". There's a good amount of circumstantial evidence that it wasnt Billy killed that night. We may find out when our DNA tech gets good enough to get a sample from the blood on the table they layed him on. Then they could exume and find out.
@@KurtOnoIR there's a part of me that wants to know and another that loves the mystery around him. I certainly don't think taking Garrett's word for anything is acceptable. I've always wondered, if he wasn't killed that night, would be have just stayed quiet? There's so many possibilities. At his age, he could've easily changed appearance and kept doing his thing. If he stayed out of the New Mexico/Arizona area, most people wouldn't recognize him. Even if someone did, by the time word spread around, it would've probably just been chalked up to rumors. I think it was more important to bury his name than the actual body. Also, most of the shootings he was involved in would've been justified if not for his reputation so he could've just lived a decent normal life after everything settled down. Like you said, maybe we'll learn the truth some day.
@@tonyh9970 lol yeah, one part of me wants to know for sure but I think I'd be a little disappointed if dna one day proved that it is him buried there. Some things are maybe best left a mystery.
@@KurtOnoIR agreed. I like to think that the fact that we're still talking about him almost 150 years later is proof enough. It's almost like he's still riding today. I love that idea. Thanks for a fun chat. Take care of yourself, cowboy.
That would've been Chano Silva the grandson. Years ago I visited the grave of the kid. And to meet was odd that it's behind the museum where we just walked around the side of the building to the back. No charge to see or a gate to keep out vandals. A historic site? It's a guess he's buried there. Bars all around to cage in the monuments. A flood washed away the first site. So just put up another one where they Guessed it should go ??
Wish I was rich I'd sponsor this channel . This is literally my favorite channel
I wish I was rich too!
Didn't Billy the Kid write a letter to the governor? I'm sure Brushy wrote some letters. Match the hand writing of both men..
Billy the kid had a limited education, so he may have had someone else write them. There are a few letters supposedly written by Billy the kid, and not all of them match.
No matter what no one else says I believe it's possible thAt Brushy Bill very well still could hAve been Billy The Kid, no matter what the guy on here ( talking ) says.
Brushy Bill Roberts was an opportunistic grifter who saw a chance to be famous and make a buck. Being an embalmer and restoritive artist for 20+ years for the deceased - I can assure you Brushy Bill Roberts was not Billy the Kid.
I'd love for it to be true - that Billy lived to be an old man but the evidence just isn't there.
@THE TEX you are so stupid !!!
Not allowed to look at billys hand writing. Not allowed to look at roberts’ either. Stop asking questions that make sense
One thing to consider, census records are notoriously inaccurate. The census takers were usually in a hurry and wrote names and details how the answers sounded to them.
Another thing to keep in mind is almost the entire 1890 census perished in a fire.
There was also a family bible with Brushy's actual birthdate.
@libertylighthouse8080 Yet the census records are 100% consistent with regard to Roberts, decade after decade. He lived his whole life in Texas.
@@Rollin_L I'd say they were. I was just pointing out that you can't rely on census records alone.
@@libertylighthouse8080 I agree. Sometimes they do have errors, and it's hard to know if the source of an error is the census taker or the individual giving the info. But they are a very important part of the puzzle when researching stuff like this. When they do given consistent info decade to decade, that carries some weight.
Great podcast bud! I really enjoyed it! You’re hilarious and great at it! I’m 42 years old and I’m obsessed with legend of Billy The Kid. My head is spinning lately thinking about and hoping he lived on past what we’ve all been lead to believe by Pat Garrett! It’s so frustrating thinking that there’s a true story that we will probably never know! I just hope more movies books and documentaries continue to get made because the legend lives on with all of us! Thanks!
Mate! I was also obsessed with young guns as a kid. I even had two metal toy revolvers that I learned to spin. Looks like I’m watching it with my son today it’s a must
I practiced my fast draw in front of the tv
Hah, 😅 I'm 50 and was also spellbound by these old gunslingers. The last really good movie imo was the assassination of Jesse James 2007. The 80s was a real Billy the kid fest
Very good podcast man.. Your very humble.. Keep up the great work with these interesting topics 👍
hey peppin i see you got charley crawford down there with ya-heyyyy peppin charley crawfords not with you anymore XD
Sigh, ♻️
"Yoo Hoo! I'll make ya famous!"
Man found your podcasts a couple weeks ago, haven’t turned them off, keep em up amigo👍
Gracias!
Ran across this going down a billy the kid rabbit hole. Great show, going to check out the other shows.
He wouldn't have been on the run bud! They thought he was dead so obviously noone would be looking for him! With no photos and only close friends recognizing him he would be fine to roam freely!
Absolutely no Facebook then
They thought he was dead because he was. Only about 40 documented witnesses to the body and the burial that we have names for. And some of them said the whole village, between 150-200 people, were there to see it as well.
Add to that, there is a proven photo of the Kid, even though the Kid's friends said it was not a good take. It was published in a nationally distributed magazine from Boston, The Illustrated Police News, twice before the Kid was dead. Before that, the Kid himself is given a copy of an earlier caricature and story on him in the same publication, Jan. 8, 1881 issue, while he is in the Santa Fe Jailhouse. He discusses it in a published newspaper interview, January 20, 1881 Las Vegas Gazette. So he was potentially VERY recognizable.
I've never stole a horse from a man i didn't like
" You couldn't even make his life into a movie , that's how unbelievable this shit is " !
Terry Gilliam : " Challenge accepted " ! 😆
Ha!! They likely ARE making it into a movie with Young Guns 3.
what a great podcast. yes i want to believe Brushy Bill was truly Billy the Kid. Great info and facts on this cast - you really summed it up well. Man what a ton fo names bro lol thanks so much for the episode.
Thank you! And thanks for listening!!!!
As much as I love the Young Guns movies, Billy always struck me as someone I would never want to be around. They really played up the craziness, his partiality of New Mexico, and of course his abilities with the iron, which I honestly don't think fits, (even though it's very entertaining). It's all a part of the mythos around him, which I don't believe really grew wings until after the battle of Lincoln, and the dissolution of the Regulators.
I speculate that Billy was not some half-crazed maniac so much as an impressionable kid who enjoyed the life he managed to carve out there (which of us doesn't like hanging with the bros?). My guess is that he made good his escape when he could once he saw all his pals were gone and there was absolutely no future in staying in New Mexico. Garrett, a bonified glory hound, probably shot some other poor kid and planted him as quickly as he could just to collect the reward and the recognition.
My two cents.
I think one of the most interesting things about the Kid is how short his career was and just how much "adventure packed" it was. Just the facts we know - mysterious past, deputized, fought in a county war, outlaw, run ins with Apache, etc - all by the age of 21. Very colorful life. Doubtful he was a crazed maniac, just a wild child.
He was quite intelligent. Spoke Spanish, English, and one Native tongue I can't recall now.
Garret shot a Mexican kid who washed dishes from the food place next door .
@@WildWestExtravaganza Billy the Kid got blamed for more than he did because they wanted to make him have to be more accountable !
Agreed 100%
He left Arizona when he was wanted for murder.
He stuck around NM because his friends were loyal and he was hoping to testify and get his pardon. Once that fizzled and he escaped from jail, I'm sure he was long gone.
I read some articles and writings in the Ft. Sumner museum recently. Several accounts said that Garrett was in no rush to track Billy down after he escaped prison in Lincoln. And that he treated every sighting, including the one at Ft. Sumner, as a wild goose chase. No one had seen Billy since the jail break, and the word out at the time is that he was long gone, probably to old Mexico.
There was also a U.S. Marshall's statement that I'm still digging for that was in one of the old articles, that stated the man shot at Maxwell's place had darker skin and a full beard. Corroborating Pies original and dying years statement.
Billy was long gone and everyone knew it.
I also tend to believe that he was "Wayne Brazel". Not much info on ole Wayne. And just imagine if the "dead" outlaw that Garrett supposedly killed, shows up in town the day after Garrett is killed and confesses. He was let loose almost immediately in a case of self-defense, even though Garrett's autopsy had one bullet in the back of his head, and another in the chest. A clear execution. Other theories are out there, but that is mine. It is well documented by locals in Las Cruces that Billy was living there for a while well after he was "killed", and very revered.
Very well-balanced! Not necessarily a lot of that around when it comes to Billy the kid and and brushy bill Robert’s!! Thanks very enjoyable mate😃
Thank you, sir. Had a lot of fun doing the Brushy Bill episode. I'm hoping to do a follow up on it sometime soon. Thanks again for your kind words!
After weighing all the evidence I am convinced that Bigfoot is not Billy the Kid.
Brushy Bill should've worded it differently if he wanted support...
"I identify as BTK"
Brushy Bill is the forest Gump of the wild west. Really enjoyed this.
Thanks!
Daniel A. Edwards book, The Autobiography of Billy The Kid.
EXACTLY
Daniel A. Edwards is a liar trying cash in the the growing industry of Brushy Bill Roberts. His biggest argument is about reading Morrison's letters. Morrison and Daniels were just trying to make a cheap buck
selling a hokey book.
As usual ... excellent info and hilarious delivery. Love the channel.
Much appreciated!
The middle initial change was a VERY common trick used by draft Dodgers in WW1.
I've seen that in census records during ww1 many times.
A guy is in census records for 18 years in one area, and turns up 25 miles away in 1918 doing a new job with a new middle name.
Oliver p. , born 1878, would have been 40 years old in 1918 eligible for the 3rd ww1 draft.
You are on the right track.
A middle initial/name change was ALSO commonly used by someone trying to run or hide from their past, usually debt.
And back then, they would generally get away with it too.
I've seen it in my own family tree with a distant uncle. That was exactly what he did in 1918. He changed his middle name & birthday, moved 30 miles away to avoid the draft. And his great grandson, and I, have the same pictures of him. 😂. He was a draft Dodger.
Brushy bill reminds me of a modern day jailbird. Pathological liar who makes up shit faster than you can debunk it. And then gets offended when you call bullshit.
Just like bigfoot believers. 😂
Interesting and informative vast majority of Bill's stories were exaggerated or untrue. Unfortunately Bill's mind told him that he was Billy the kid. Special thanks Bill for making this documentary possible!!!
Thanks for posting this. Most interesting. I could counter your argument regarding 'Billy the Kid' working for various well known agencies: There were very few photographs of him. He was believed to have been shot dead by sheriff Garret and so anyone suspecting him of being the outlaw could easily have been brushed off. It is just as likely that having escaped 'justice' he decided to hide in plain sight and earn a living, as it is, that he would continue his 'outlaw' ways.
I think that even if it was possible to prove that William Roberts was 'Billy the Kid' using DNA, many historians would simply discredit the evidence etc...., because the legend of this most famous of cowboys is a neat and romantic story that people would rather believe. It will continue to fascinate the public and thus continue to sell books and inspire movies, and afford some to make money from this version of the past.
This is only my opinion, and as someone once said; 'Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one and they all stink'. ;)
Yeah, it's definitely possible he survived and hide in plain sight. I personally just don't believe it based on the evidence. Would be really cool if he did! I'm currently working on an episode about Butch Cassidy possibly living to be an old man. Should be interesting!
@@WildWestExtravaganza I agree that in all probability William Roberts was not 'Billy the Kid' but it is intriguing that Garrett had shot dead two others believing them to be the outlaw, before allegedly finally getting his man, as well as the report of the other lawman saying that it wasn't him.
I do like the idea that BTK went on to live a long and fuitful existence but perhaps that is simply wishful thinking on my part and another romantic notion of a very unromantic period of history.
I shall certainly watch out for your presentation on Butch Cassidy.
That does sound very interesting.
I think he was supposed to have gone to Bolivia, if I am correct?
I live in Colombia and that is certainly down this neck of the woods.
😊
@@localbod Yep, first they set up a ranch in Argentina and then were "killed" in Bolivia. Awesome hearing that I've got a listener in Columbia!
@@WildWestExtravaganza Yep, I'm a Brit living in Colombia. I'm in a small village at the moment but moving to Bogotá soon.
Keep up the good work! 😊
local bod how’s the coke?
Just found your podcast really enjoying it 👍
Thank you! Hope you keep on listening! Working on a new episode right now.
Even if Pat Garret didn't kill Billy the Kid, that doesn't mean that Brushy Bill was Billy the Kid.
This is an amazing story. It's crazy not many people know about Brushy Bill.
I remember him being brought up on Ripley's Believe it, or not.
I have a picture of Brushy Bill at the do Billy the Kid museum , The owner of the museum said he claim to be who is the kid who was 20 years to young. To be the Kid. 🤠🇺🇸👍 just saying.
I apologize I was text talking And as usual you didn’t come out right
I hope to change that!!
@@jameswagner2634 that old man at the museum is a nice guy but totally ignorant on the real 1859 birthdate of Brushy Bill.
Look up Brett Hall's channel, he debunks this lie and proves Brushy was born in 1859.
If you look at the tintype of Billy with his Winchester and the mystery in upstate picture Billy has uneven eyes. His right eye is slanted and his left eye seems normal. Brushy Bill's eyes are both perfectly even. (Also tintype pictures are reversed when taken Billy was right handed.)
I understand early tin types the subject had to remain motionless for a length of time. Any movement could cause distortion to the image.
No, his head is tilted
You can’t really go by that Billy the Kid photo. I mean it looks blurry compared to the other Wild West photos of that time. Plus, he looks somewhat intoxicated. I wouldn’t rule it out being Brushy, especially as they both have what looks to be mismatched eyebrows which is a rarity. The only thing I will say is their jaws are kinda different…
Kenny fkin Powers giving wild west stories! Lol It finally clicked who you sounded like to me. It only took 1.5 videos lol.
Cool stuff glad I came across your channel. Thanks for making these
Thanks for listening!
I definitely subscribed. I like this type of content
Had to comeback for another listen in anticipation of the new episode coming up. Also, I always got to be Billy at recess!
Billy didn’t get a Christmas present in 1881, and he wasn’t on the naughty list.
That can only mean one thing
😅😆😀
I'm a new fan. Love your channel and I absolutely LOVE Westerns.
Thanks for listening!!!!
Damn good one bro I'm a fan for sure keep up the good work
You can’t really go by that Billy the Kid photo. I mean it looks blurry compared to the other Wild West photos of that time. Plus, he looks somewhat intoxicated. I wouldn’t rule it out being Brushy, especially as they both have what looks to be mismatched eyebrows which is a rarity. Also, I tried to cover the hair underneath Billy’s ears with my fingers and I must admit that it kinda does look like that photo of a young Brushy, especially the eyes. The only thing I will say is their jaws are kinda different. I feel that could be explained because perhaps Billy/Brushy wasn’t eating much back then. Also, when I open my mouth even a little it does make my jaw look longer and maybe he was using his jaw muscles in a weird way, like shifting his jaw to one side which anyone can do. That could maybe be explained as I said because of his drunkenness, but we don’t know if he was…There is only one photo of Billy, but, again, I wouldn’t rule it out being Brushy. There is also another photo that’s convincing and that is Denis Gaubert’s photo of a guy smoking a cigarette who happens to really match the description of Billy who I also don’t think is Brushy. Who knows…
I believe Brushy Bill was in fact Billy the Kid. The scars were there, the facial structure was there. I have had people say the eyes were different colors. Newsflash, as we age, eye color can and does change. My eyes are hazel, but when I'm either really stressed out or pissed off they can turn an icy blue. People are gonna believe what they want, I go by my gut and my good sense. Both of which told me, Billy and Brushy were one and the same. Thanks for doing this, you did a damn good job.
Thank you, Blaze
Brushy bill died at the age of 71 he was born in 1880 and billy around 1859 20 years apart no way brushy could be billy
Just a quick comment - I have a lot to say but I’ll just comment on your question about giving two children the same name and it was very common back then. For one instance there was a man in the Billy the kid stories that everyone gets confused with and it’s a man that married a woman with the same Christian name as his sister - off first and second names I can’t recall them but I can find it I only watched another doco that discussed this - anyway that woman this man married then had the ex lacy same first and second names as his sister. On a personal note, my grandmother had a son that was killed by a motorbike when he escaped the front yard his name was Rene and the next son she had they named Rene. Me and my first cousin from two sisters from the same grandmother have the same name (my mum said it was because she was in Holland at the time and after the recovery from giving birth, and both sisters (the other being in Australia at the time, both giving birth within days of eachother) and after naming us, did they speak in the phone and coincidentally named us both the same name Alexandra. My cousin got the nickname Moppy later we called her Sandra and I was always called Sandy. We both live in the same city now. It gets more confusing as an aunt was nicknamed “granny” and no one had their real name. My step brother Damien we called George and that’s my real fathers name although we call him Kiki, My step sister was named Kelly but we all called her Mickey. And when her father (my step father) married his brothers ex wife and they had children - the siblings were half cousin, brother/sisters I can’t work it out lol but that’s only 30 years ago. Interesting to note, it was far from illegal to marry an uncle - your fathers brother - in Australia our Billy the Kid is the Bush Ranger (outlaw) Ned Kelly who was shot 28 times but survived in 1881 to be deemed fit enough to be hung. Now he was a good looking bad boy lol my point being that his father and mother were first cousins. It was so common back in the last century even. It was a good way to keep land and expand family assets.
I want to know why they keep telling us that 50 years ago we all died at the age of 30 whenever I watch documentaries or follow the life of someone from the past, they die at 80-90yo and women gave birth to so many children all in some bark hut no sterilised equipment, no doctor no nurses, no antibiotics no epidural and all the kids born to first cousins or shock horror an uncle and niece and they all lived! Just something you might find interesting and worth a footnote ? Btw I’m sure not a Neanderthal and I love the way you say it how you want to don’t change it’s all good and very interesting
Are used to be obsessed with it also and also play Young Guns with my friends the scene where he jumps out of the trunk is my favorite
Did you guys know that Tom Cruise was an extra in Young Guns? He was shot in the last fight you're talking about.
While I can entertain the idea that Billy wasn't actually shot by Pat Garrett, (after all Pat shot the wrong man more than once) I don't believe Brushy Bill was Billy, for several reasons. One of which being that Billy was literate and well spoken, both in English and Spanish, while Brushy Bill was nearly illiterate and couldn't speak Spanish at all. Also his birth certificate says he's a different age than Billy, and was born in a different place. And when you look at photos of them, regardless of aging, they are clearly not the same person
Brushy Bill could speak Spanish fluently evidence supported by people who truly knew him your evidence is based on lies look into it...
He did speak fluent Spanish apparently.
Bigfoot is Billy the Kid. Billy the Kid is Bigfoot. There! I said it!
The plot thickens
"There's other lawyers around, piece a chicken shit, get back in your vehicle before I make it 22 just for the goddamn hell of it"
Brushy was barely a baby at the time of Billy. There is a statement from one of the posse, Poe, who said they went to Pete Maxwells to waylay Billy, tied up Paulita and hid until he showed up then gunned him down.
Sound like Billy had nine lives from all this dialogue
Brushy was born in 1859, research it properly
Haven't watched another channel since I found yours. You're the best. I love, love, love old west tales!!!! Thank you. Tell your wife thanks as well.
Some great stUff isn't it !!
Me too, I have been so caught up, lol these are great
Appreciate the content. Have to call false on this one about brushy bill tho. Really do appreciate your work. Such great content
If Roberts was Billy, not only did he escape death at the hand of Garrett, he then became the Forrest Gump of the old west. Holy crap
It boggles the mind
I am not biased on this subject however there's just too many things that don't add up about the original Mainline story no one really knows he was Billy or not but but from all the evidence that I can tell Brushy Bill Roberts was Billy the Kid
This was a great podcast. I too am in the camp thant Brushy Bill was not Billy the Kid, and the further evidence you laid out, especially the census listing Roberts in every year since his birth in 1879 and not before, confirms it for me.
So brushy bill was a job jumper. When I was young I went from BMX racing to working with race horses. Spent 4 and a half years as a bull rider. Settled down with wife #1 and started a cattle farm. Divorced her and after charges were dropped for hitting some asshole with a car I became a reserve deputy sherrif assisting in a few drug raids. Then I started driving a truck, ended up in New Mexico hauling road salt out of Carlsbad and Redmond Utah. Did some river guiding in Arizona while shacking up with a Navajo girl. Now back to driving a truck and started another cattle farm. Am I billy the kid? Who knoes
Who knoes
@@WildWestExtravaganza yeah, where was spell check on that one.
Great post do you by any chance have or know where to locate anything on Jose Chavez y Chavez??
Great video. Like you I am a big fan of Young Guns, and that led me to really get into the story of Billy the Kid. I have visited Lincoln New Mexico, Fort Sumner New Mexico, and even Hico and Hamilton Texas. There is no doubt that people in Texas are convinced that briushy was Billy. I am also biased. I wanted to believe he lived to an old age. I didn't get into all the census stuff with all the names you did. I came to my own conclusion that he couldn't have been. My biggest reason was something you stated very well. I didn't believe a 20 something year old kid that had a tendency to get himself into all the stuff he was involved in, wouldn't just disappear into the night , only to pop up 70 years later. Something would have happened . And I knew about the story of Brushy being attached to the guy claiming to be Jesse James. So I am in the camp of he was killed by Pat Garret in 1881. but the way you lay out the details of what Brushy says about the events of his life is unbelievable . too grandiose to be true. The Forest Gump of the wild west. But I don't blame others for believing it. I wanted to myself. But thanks for the video. you lay it out really well.
Thanks for listening! I like how you put it - the Forest Gump of the wild west.
He was killed yeah no question
Just speculating; if I were one of the most famous outlaws of ALL time & I wanted to get away with an undercover life, I might well spin up a web of bull$hit people would dismiss and disregard me entirely. Just saying. Good video
You're so ignorant
In 1948, William V. Morrison, a probate investigator working in St. Louis, Missouri, was sent to Florida to work on the case of an elderly man named Joe Hines. Hines was claiming that the land of his recently deceased brother now belonged entirely to him, since he was the only surviving heir. While Morrison and Hines talked, Hines admitted that he was Jessie Evans, who, after he had been released from prison in Texas in 1882, had by all accounts disappeared. Hines then told Morrison of his experiences in the Lincoln County War and with Billy the Kid. This held a special interest for Morrison, since he was related to the Maxwell family of Fort Sumner. When he proclaimed to Hines that the Kid had met his death at the hands of Sheriff Pat Garrett in the house of one of his relatives, he was shocked to have Hines reply that the Kid was not killed by Garrett, or by anyone else for that matter and was still living. Hines went on to say that besides himself and Billy, there was only one other surviving veteran of the Lincoln County War, namely Jim McDaniels, a member of the Jessie Evans Gang. Further intrigued, Morrison probed Hines for “the Kid’s” name and address and the old man finally consented. He gave Billy’s current name as Ollie L. “Brushy Bill” Roberts and his address as Hamilton, Texas.
Several months later, after completing the Hines case (in which Hines was given his brother’s land), Morrison struck up a written correspondence with Brushy Bill. Throughout this early correspondence, Morrison was careful not to reveal what exactly Hines had told him about his true identity. At the same time, Morrison attempted to track down Jim McDaniels, yet this proved an impossible feat. He managed to track him as far as Round Rock, Texas, but townsfolk there said that he had moved in 1945 to live out the rest of his days with his daughter in California. Giving up on the McDaniels angle, Morrison wrote to Brushy and told him that he would like to meet him. Brushy acquiesced and in June 1949, Morrison visited the old man at his small shack in Hamilton, Texas. In his journal, Morrison noted Brushy as being about 5’8” tall and weighing about 165 pounds, with blue eyes, small hands, large wrists, heavy shoulders, thinning grey hair, high forehead, prominent nose, and large ears. Brushy invited the visitor inside and introduced him to his wife, Melinda. Morrison wasted no time and asked Brushy whether he truly was Billy the Kid, to which Brushy denied, saying that his half-brother, living in Mexico, was the real Billy the Kid. Somewhat disappointed, Morrison decided to leave, but asked Brushy if it might be possible to take a trip to Mexico some day soon to interview his brother. On the way out the door, Brushy stopped Morrison and told him to come back in the afternoon of the next day, when his wife would be out visiting a friend and they would have the house to themselves. Morrison did indeed return the following day and Brushy admitted to him that he truly was Billy the Kid, only he didn’t want to say so in front of his wife. Brushy then went on to say that he knew he didn’t have many years left in him and wanted to die with the full pardon he had been promised by Gov. Lew Wallace back in 1879. Morrison said he would help the old man in his case, but only if he could be shown proof that Brushy was who he claimed to be. At this request, Brushy took off his clothes, exposing twenty-six bullet and knife scars on his body, several matching known locations of wounds Billy the Kid allegedly had. Brushy also demonstrated the ability to, in a kind of double-jointed move, make his hands smaller than his wrists, which the real Billy was known to do in order to slide handcuffs off. Believing that Brushy could be the real deal, Morrison promised him he would do all he could to help obtain a pardon, provided Brushy would allow him to investigate further into his history to find more proof that he was authentic. Brushy agreed, and the two parted company for the day. Over the next several months, Morrison met with Brushy several times and recorded his story in his journal and with a tape recorder. All the while, the pair were careful to make sure that Mrs. Roberts was kept in the dark over the entire proceedings, as Brushy didn’t want her to learn his true identity and be disgusted with him for his reputation. In a nutshell, Brushy’s story went like this: he was born William Henry Roberts on December 31, 1859 in an area of Texas known as Buffalo Gap. His parents were James H. and Mary Adeline Roberts. Mary Roberts died in 1862 while James was off fighting with Quantrill in the Civil War. He said that Catherine McCarty was not his mother, but his maternal half-aunt. After his mother died, Brushy went to live with Catherine and her son, Joe. Since Brushy was so young and Catherine moved around so much, everyone just assumed that Brushy was her son. Fearing that Brushy's father might try to take him back, she covered her tracks and gave the name Henry McCarty to Brushy as an alias. When Brushy told of his days as Billy the Kid from 1877 to 1881, Morrison determined that Brushy knew way too much about the history of the Kid and the Lincoln County War to have read all about it. Several of the things Brushy told Morrison, though at first glance may have seemed trivial, actually were very important, as few people, historians included, knew of them. When it came to the events of the night of July 14, 1881, Brushy said that a man named Billy Barlow was killed by Pat Garrett. Barlow, he said, was partially Mexican, had a beard, looked like the Kid, was a little younger than the Kid, and was possibly related to the Clements family, the cousins of John Wesley Hardin. Brushy also said that he doubted that Billy Barlow was the man's real name. After Barlow was killed, Brushy continued, he fled Fort Sumner. After fleeing Sumner, his story went, he lived in Mexico with a tribe of Yaqui Indians for two years; returned to the U.S. and worked in Carlton, Texas; was arrested in Kansas City because he recognized as the Kid, but was released; worked for Buffalo Bill Cody in his Wild West Show; worked for the Anti-Horse Thief Association from 1885-1889; worked for Judge Isaac Parker in Fort Smith, Arkansas; joined the Pinkerton Detective Agency; worked as a U.S. Marshal investigating train robberies; joined the Rough Riders and went to Cuba; briefly operated his own Wild West Show; fought for Villa and Carranza in the Mexican Revolution; worked as a plainclothes policeman in Gladewater, Texas; married four times; and used a dozen aliases. In the fall of 1949, Morrison took Brushy with him to New Mexico for the purpose of having Brushy meet with some surviving acquaintances of Billy the Kid, to see if they could verify or deny his claim. Earlier, Morrison had been given the names Billy’s remaining acquaintances by other respected historians such as Maurice Fulton and William Keleher. While in New Mexico, the pair stopped at sites such as Fort Sumner and Lincoln. In the courthouse in Lincoln, Brushy detailed to Morrison how he, as Billy the Kid, made his famous escape and killed deputies Bob Olinger and James Bell. By the time they had completed their trip and returned to Brushy’s home in Hico, Texas (he had moved from Hamilton in the summer of ‘49), they had managed to meet with Severo Gallegos, Martile Able, Jose Montoya, and Bill and Sam Jones. The first three all signed legal affidavits attesting to the fact that Brushy Bill and Billy the Kid were one and the same and the Jones brothers, although they did not sign affidavits (claiming they didn’t want to get involved in the proceedings) also stated their agreement with this. In the summer of 1950, Morrison moved, along with his family, to El Paso, Texas, in order to be closer to anything he may need in his investigation. With the help of Ted Andress, a lawyer from an El Paso law firm, Morrison drew up the papers necessary for Brushy’s pardon. Afterwards, Morrison wrote a report entitled “A Statement of Facts,” which stated that Billy Bonney was promised a pardon in 1879 by Gov. Wallace and that Billy was not killed in 1881 and still deserved his pardon. Included with the report were various documents related to Billy’s life and the affidavits from Gallegos, Able, and Montoya, along with affidavits from two of Brushy’s friends, DeWitt Travis and Robert Lee, detailing other aspects of his life. Again with the help of Andress, Morrison filed for the petition for the pardon on Nov. 15, 1950. Thomas J. Mabry, governor of New Mexico, agreed to a private hearing with Morrison and Brushy, along with one or two historians of Mabry‘s choosing, to be held on Nov. 29.
Generally speaking, it's easier to prove positives than negatives. The picture overlays are convincing. I find it very possible he was billy the kid. Especially since it was so easy to change identities. Add to that if Pat Garrett did kill the wrong man he could've been prosecuted and hung. That's not much incentive to admit to a mistake.
Especially after he had killed two innocent men previously .
You have to take into consideration that brushy bill is 20 years too young to have been Billy the kid.🤠🇺🇸👍
@@jameswagner2634 normally I would agree, but unlike modern times there were no birth certificates beck then. One could change age just as easily as changing names. Unless we could actually examine skeletal remains there's no way to verify age. And even with skeletal age, it only gets you in the ballpark which would be within about 20 years.. the truth is, we will never know.
@@Michigan_Tactical agreed
@@jameswagner2634 actually Oliver p roberts was 20 years to young he was not the same guy as Oliver l roberts one was from Arkansas born in Sulphur springs Arkansas in 1879 the other was born in Buffalo gap Texas in December 1859 that was brushy bill and there are historical documents proven that he worked for the horse thief association in 1888 if brushy bill was born in 1879 that would make him only 9 years old not possible.. Oliver p roberts and Oliver l roberts were not the same
Personally, I believe Billy didn't die that night. Not sure if Bill Roberts was the kid though. Plus I had to comment to get your comments up to 667. One number lower just bugs the shit out of me lol
Wait.. Bigfoot isnt real?? Come on. Next you'll tell me UFOs and ghosts are a figment of my imagination! Long live the memory Of Billy The Kid!
Just ran across your podcast. One thing to point out, Billy's photo and the photo of Brushy Bill, thier ears do not match. Billy has detached ear lobes in the picture, and Brushys connect to the face. Ear features do not change as you get older. They are using this to identify people just like finger prints. Fun fact. Great work.
Enjoyed the story and research...
I believe BTK was shot by Garrett. A coroners jury was called to examine the body the next
day and they confirmed it as BTK. Also, the local women prepared the body for burial.
There were many people involved in the process and it is really difficult to believe that someone would not have said something over the years if it was not BTK.
The "Kid" was a fairly good gambler. It would seem strange he would suddenly give that up, as he must have needed money to live on after his escape. Yet, there is no info that I have yet seen that says "Brushy Bill" did any gambling.
I also believe I read somewhere that "Brushy Bill" only knew a few words of Spanish and was not as fluent as BTK in the language. Furthermore, "Brushy Bill" was illiterate while BTK could read and write and write well, read his letters to Gov Wallace.
I have done quite a bit of reserch on Charles Siringo who spent a couple of weeks with the kid
in Texas. Charlie became a Pinkerton detective and was well known in his time and he never
expressed any doubt that Garrett shot the kid. He also knew Garrett.
On a new subject....
If your doing a podcast on Butch Cassidy and his return to the U.S. from Bolivia, you might like
to try and research some history in Pahrump, NV. There is a "Butch Cassidy" pass there and the story is that Butch died in a mining accident at the Johnny mine and was actually buried
there. True or not, it is pretty certain that Butch returned to the U.S. from Bolivia and lived a
long life here.
Thanks man! And I did do an episode on Butch already, specifically about his death. Check it out and let me know whatcha think - The Mysterious Death Of Butch Cassidy.
I also believe Garrett killed Billy the Kid. Garrett killed 2 of Billy's friends, and Billy killed 2 of Garrett's men escaping from jail. There would have too much bad blood between them for Garrett to just let him go. Also, I doubt Billy would have let Garrett live if given the chance to kill him.
Where is the legal documentation saying the jury saw the body? You are correct. It doesn't exist. Are these the words from Pat "Oh Shit I shot the wrong guy" Garrett? Don't feel bad, you're not the only one who got fooled by this.
There was a document signed by members of the coroner's jury confirming it was BTK's body
@@siringo55 was this the first coroner's jury report that a member said they all signed but never saw the body? Yes someone said this. Or was this the second jurors inquest that was written in Spanish? Or was it the third one that was written? What always puzzled me was how the hell did Pat Garrett lose the first jurors report? How convenient. Who wrote the first report ? Want to take a guess? The second report was written in Spanish. Pat Garrett couldn't write in Spanish. I wonder who dictated that one? I see a pattern here. Everything that happened that night was because Pat Garrett said so. All this is out there to be found. If people have questions about what I wrote, don't ask me. Ask the people who put the information out there to be found.
When everybody is looking for you then you hide and hide right in plain sight but you must be many things and not stick to one place too long cause sooner or later they will soon figure out who you are
So instead of running and hiding you just change who you are over and over until nobody knows you
But there's always those select few that knew who you are from the past
Good stuff. I learned a lot of brushy from this video.
Thanks, man
We never want our heroes to die.
Bigfoot is real! All those missing people found out the HARD way. A horned up Bigfoot carried um off to the honeymoon suite.
Haha
French Canadian loggers interbred with Bigfoot girls so often now you see Bigfoot around town ….
I’m no language expert. But I do speak Spanish and have spoken Spanish my entire life. During years that I’ve not spoken Spanish very much (due to where I was living/an absence of other Spanish speakers)-Yeah, I got a bit rusty. I imagine anyone - fluent or not - would experience some rust if they stopped speaking a language for years and years.
If you haven’t watched, there’s a 3 hour video interview with a woman that says she’s related to Jesse James. And she talks about how Billy the Kid and Jesse James were friends. It’s a good watch.
I haven't watched it. Thanks for the heads up, I'll check it out.
That's dumb
The video was posted by me on my channel. I obtained the video from my friend, the late William Tunstill who conducted the video with Mrs. Ola Everhard.
Billy would have recognized Pat Garrett’s voice...
One fact I can't get past. When pat Garrett was in maxwells place looking for Billy he left two people outside the door. So that would mean those two let Billy walk right past and into the room? Both of them at one point also said that it wasn't billy who was killed. One jon poe at the time said it wasn't him, soon retracted the other admitted on his death bed that it wasn't Billy. I dont know if brushy bill was billy but I do feel its very likely that Billy wasn't killed that night.
Several years later Kip Mckinney allegedly told three different versions of Billy the Kid Fort Sumner shooting, to a friend and family members.
Brushy Bill Roberts was Billy the Kid and he lived too be a very long life
Kurtonoirtech9 When Pat Garrett shot Billy the Kid it was in a dark room, because of that Poe said it couldn't been Billy, but when the room lit up. Poe did say that it is Billy's corpse on the floor.
@@bryanfranks1378 Ok where is the proof that your 3rd cousin Brushy is Billy?
I watched something a few years back .... it was about this dude who bought a old picture at a flea market.. turned out to be a picture of Billy and a few other regulators..... possibly a wedding picture. It was like the only other picture of the kid that is known besides the real famous one everyone knows of.
I have seen that two
You have yourself an amazing channel
Thanks Mathew
I agree with your conclusion.
It is very strange that no death photos of billy were taken. I assume that cameras weren't as common as today but, damn! Maybe one will turn up somewhere, maybe the photographers were traveling salesmen kinda folks......?
And he named his daughter Georgia! Haha. Favorite boxer of all time!
Great man
Im a Big Billy fan. Went to New Mexico not too long ago and had pics taken at the "supposed" grave of Billy , Charlie Bowdrie and Tom O'Folliard. PALS. Anyway this was done nicely with humor and both theory and fact. You Did our boy proud on this. KUDOS
Look for a follow up to this episode very soon!
“ but many a slip twixt a cup and lip “ 😂
"Brushy" Bill Roberts seemed to be the Antithesis of a character in the first
'Young Guns', "Buckshot" Roberts,
("killed more men than Small Pox!").
HE seemed the Antithesis of the
'Young Guns 2' character, 'H.W. French',
("Buckshot George"), who'd lost his wife "...to the Pox."
I can do this ALL day!
1) YG 1, Dick draws on Billy, who responds lightning fast and decisively passive.
Dick calls Billy to the yard. Who will lead?
"Buckshot" arrives. His rep precedes him.
Dick dares/challenges Billy to NOT be passive.
Billy arrogantly walks into fire, retreats and refuses. Fear?
Dick eventually approaches, draws fire and and dies. 1st TRUE 'Regulator' down. Billy leads...
2) YG 2, H.W. French joins Billy's crew of...misfits?
Hoping for "an army", Billy stays positive inspecting H.W.'s shotgun before learning his friend Garrett will leave to run an "eatin' house".
(Like the place where Dick died)
After Chavez, 2nd to last Regulator, dies...Billy sinks. Doc's sentiment rings true regarding riding the rest of them, (including "kid" Tom) "Straight to Hell!"
The Farmer, sought a name earlier, a rep.
Billy, remembers "Buckshot", as THAT moment of fear, that "Test" Billy failed, now haunted him.
He faced the responsibilty for ALL of their deaths.
H.W., lone survivor, who Billy had 'Tested' (at Chisum's was hesitant and indecisive), was now bestowed the name of He who'd initially stricken Billy to this dark and foreign land.
Billy wasn't mocking French, he was showing respect and apologizing.
I just thought of the YG 1 end battle where Billy, Fearless and Decisive, shoots both Charlie Crawford and L.G. Murphy...
from a distance.
I own the 1st film. Been watching them since '89.
What I just wrote, I JUST took into consideration after the "Brushy Bill" topic.
Thank YOU!
I mentioned Billy failing a "test" before Dick was shot.
I was considering the moment Tunstall was killed. As Billy had just left his side and witnessed his death.
No test in that moment as Tunstall had insisted Billy be with "the Boys".
Truth is everyone of them, (Dick eapecially!) Failed collectively by not watching their 6 after the party and remaining 24/7 alert upon Murphy's "Get ready for Hell!" warning.
Doing research on my family I discovered tons of amazing things. They were a bit naughty. Anyhoo, the reason I’m writing this is that my family had the same names repetitively. They would change the middle name. Also the exact same names were used by each of the brothers in each generation. It’s made sorting it all out a absolute nightmare.
Very interesting! And I feel your pain. Researching my own family tree has proven to be extremely difficult.
If for no other reason than his obvious age, Brushy couldn’t be the Kid. He was remarkably well preserved 90 year old. Even William Shatner had the option of plastic surgery and he still doesn’t look as young as Brushy. Look at Kit Carson and Jim Bridger. In their 60’s they looked far older than Brushy. For someone who spent all his life on the plains, his skin didn’t show it.
It doesn't matter if he was Billy or not. Billy the kid should be pardoned after all he was promised doesn't matter when Billy died he deserves to be pardoned as promised.
Dude, love the podcast ur hilarious. Love the take on the topics. Keep up the good work.
Thank you!!!
We all want to be billy “the kid” deep down inside but reality is Billy “the kid” died in 1881at Fort Sumner !!!!!! brushy was just a crazy old man
A crazy old man that knew the history, had the scars, and who’s been photo lines up forensically perfect I think it’s him
@@gavster_killa4591 billy the kid had blue eyes!!! Brushy did not
@@RoRo-kc8zv not true they both had the same eye color same ears and Brushy was born in 1859 and died in 1950
The stories of his later life seem implausible. It also ignores Billys mother and brother who once lived in Wichita KS and are documented on the census. There was also documentation of where he lived in New Mexico as a child. He was taken in by people when his mother died.
Yeah, lot of holes in Brushy’s story
@@WildWestExtravaganza Because something is possible does not make it probable.
Agreed
I am a 3rd cousin of Billy the Kid on my Father's side my grandma had a wanted poster that she kept under glass on her desk , she passed away in 1983 and she swore until the day that she died that Pat Garret did not shoot Billy the Kid !
the plot thickens like good stew mmmmm mmmmm. i remember the unsolved mysteries episode. and you are correct why didnt they take pictures of the famous dead outlaw hmmm
I have read that Billy had an old coat for a pillow, and that he frequently slept on the bare earth for the night's bed.
I've also read that even though he was familiar with the territory, he often got lost, not knowing where he was going, and only God knew where he had been.
You got any info or opinions on this?
Actually, yes. Everything you stated has been verified. What a lot of people don't know is that he also was a lover of the "six gun". And was likened at times to both a devil on the run and a candle in the wind, as well as a goat in a stable.
Mr. Catch me if you can
Man you sound just like actor Danny Mcbride. The Bigfoot Wallace episode got me hooked cool show keep them coming, thanks.
I understand why you didmt keep this podcast title but god damn it was a good one hahaha
haha
Well if Brushy Bill Roberts was old, then he wouldn’t exactly have the best memory and wasn’t exactly good at Spanish anymore
You don’t forget a language genius. Google it!