The big problems with putting the driver at the center - Tesla Semi truck review
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- čas přidán 26. 02. 2023
- Tesla officially launched its Semi truck in December 2022, but many truckers hated the cab. What are the problems with Elon Musk's idea of putting the driver in the middle of the cabin?
The Tesla Semi is a battery electric Class 8 semi-truck by Tesla, Inc. The truck is powered by three motors and is claimed by Tesla to have approximately three times the power of a typical diesel semi-truck, a range of 500 miles (800 km), and operate at an energy use of less than 2 kWh/mi (1.2 kW⋅h/km).
Two concept vehicles were unveiled in November 2017. Production was originally planned to begin as early as 2019, with Tesla projecting the manufacture of as many as 100,000 trucks per year by 2022. Production began in October 2022, and initial deliveries were made to PepsiCo on December 1, 2022.
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Note: This video is an adaptation of a video from my Brazilian Portuguese channel called "Integrando Conhecimento".
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Inside semi truck.
Semi truck review.
Tesla Pepsi truck.
Tesla Semi truck Pepsi.
PepsiCo. - Auta a dopravní prostředky
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You should check out Edison motors
For real world applications this truck is as useful as putting tittys on a bull.
Energy density hasn’t been solved yet. What is the load these can carry? Why haven’t they stated what this load capacity level is, for, as you put it, a released truck? Batteries weigh too much and take too long to recharge (currently). I would have liked to see exchangeable batteries so that they don’t have to lug around so much battery weight, displacing cargo.
The company may be innovative although will have to hold on until they work out the kinks and affiliations with them (buy) until the CEO decides to realign with more American ideals.
They’re on the right path, but I can’t stress enough how important a bed is for a truck driver. Imagine having to sit in your seat while being unloaded after 500miles of driving.
all they need to do is grab some blankets and pillows and put them behind the seat.
If your DOT officer is a prick, he could call it on duty driving.
@@bobjoned3398: And he's be correct.
Same though where's the sleeper aspect?
This is actually more room than what diesel day cabs have. This isn’t a truck for 500 miles one way. Hell I would take it a max of 150 miles one way and 150 miles the back.
Car or truck, putting all the vehicle controls on a screen is a trend I really hate. Being able to feel for those tactile buttons is important. Also keeps you from searching through menus to get to something.
It also makes user interface design a secondary priority, somewhat ironically. People tend to think "oh we can just add more menus when we need them" and end up with screen GUIs that are actually less intuitive and user friendly than buttons
this will only be a trend for a few years, industry will catch up and start using buttons again I think...
Gotta have tactile controls so you're looking at the ROAD instead of the screen!
I just rented a 2022 Ford edge, not by choice, but it's what my insurance got me. Nice vehicle, but everything is touchscreen. Everything. My steering wheel has like 3 analog pads, plus another like 12 buttons. To change my Gan speed, I gotta hit the fan symbol, and hit plus or minus on the screen, slowly...
It's a nightmare. Very distracting.
Should be illegal to put on customers.
Touchscreens are cheaper and easier to build and install. Meaning eventually touchscreens without tactile buttons will become the norm and they will sell you tactile buttons as a special safety feature for an additional fee. At least that’s what a profit driven business model would require.
I work in the heavy truck industry. This design may work well for certain dedicated routes. However, the average freight hauler will find the center seat configuration impractical. They need to interact with security gates at many terminals, warehouses, and distribution centers, providing ID and documentation. Climbing in and out of that cab is inconvenient and a time waster compared to rolling down the driver side window. Many gate houses are designed with high service windows for this reason. This may even force someone ro come out of the gatehouse to interact with the driver at ground level. Scales have the button pad at driver window height. Getting out of the truck will put the button pad out of reach, forcing the driver to walk all the way across the lot to go inside, thus delaying those behind the Tesla. They may have designed it "around the driver". But that's like saying a straight jacket is designed for a snug and close fit.
thats the best analogy i have ever heard
It can be solved with sliding seat.
As a truck driver, you are 100% correct
an actual question can be raised, why are ids and documentation still in paper form?
@@Joso997 because paper cant be hacked or corrupted like data, its all digital but paper copies are given to us drivers because we must have it by law while in transit
They could add so many things to this, like a bed with a large TV screen that also acts as a surveillance screen, a console, a fridge with a freezer, maybe an electric stove but instead they opted on.... LITERALLY NOTHING IN THE BACK. What a genious idea I'm sure it will sell well.
But it's innovative 😂 Did you not hear the man on the stage with the microphone? I think he said that word a few times 😂
But seriously speaking here's how a megacorp works - create problems and then sell the solutions to those previously non-existent problems.
Once these trucks have breached a majority market share, they will sell you an even more expensive version with the bed, or create an infrastructure where truckers can go rest and pay for the rest stops.
Bed will be useless because the semi will have very limited range. Battery tech is not at a level to make long haul trucks viable
@@berzerius Bed is not "useless," especially if Tesla launches a longer range model. Having the ability to lay down while on a break/charging would be really beneficial for a trucker's health. Albeit not needed for most shorter trips that isn't several hours long, the option should still be there for other models Tesla launches 😄
@@crxssfire525 laws of physics and economics don't support a long range model. Don't believe the Elon hype.
Save money, keep shareholders happy, inflate stock price
Like a lot of companies, Tesla designed this with engineers not drivers and not with current infrastructures. Sure, the drivers can adapt but that doesn’t mean it’s an improvement.
Sorry very wrong, having been employed by truck manufacturer your opinion is not incorrect but we employ out of the box drivers who have a vision for the future, our engineers try to design this but sometimes it's too advanced!
It is hard to hear you when you are talking out of your hat.
no no no, they didn't design with engineers. They designed based on a crayon drawing Elon Musk drew.
The Pepsi Co drivers seem happy with the Tesla semi.
@@asommer518 No bobblehead injuries from backing up.
Musk said it handled like a sports car, just what you need with a full load of concrete lintels!
handles grip the road yes you want that
@@timg2973 they won't be pulling 90k plus pounds that far nor that good up hills
@@matthewwilson5019 82k to be the limit unless they get permits. but they do go over Donner pass round trip with no issue on a daily trip from factory to factory. I don't know why you think they can't. a 530 mile trip.
If by full load you mean half of what a diesel truck will pull sure
@@timg2973 Handling like a sport car and having good grip are two different things. seeing as Elon highlits multiple times the acceleration of the truck like if its a thing Semi truck drivers care about i think he meant it Handles like a sport car not relating to it grips the ground well. and since i doubt they put most of the weight in the front i doubt its front grip on icy up hills runs
The problem of the excessive use of touch screens is also common in many recent cars.
Touch screens should be illegal for any function used while driving. They are lethal
@@74HC138 Only if they are used by an idiot. You can easily learn how to interact with a touch screen without looking at it.
Many exotic and luxury cars already went back to physical buttons, nothing replaces tactile feedback when you have to keep your eyes on the road.
@@TheObscuran You can just learn how to use a touch screen without looking at it.
It actually is illegal, touching the screen while driving is being fined the same way as if you were touching your phone. @@74HC138
As a former truck driver the issue of being able to pass documents out of the window is not to be understated. This is a frequent occurrence when checking into places for pick ups and deliveries. For a day cab, most drivers would rather not have that space behind them and instead have a shorter cab for more maneuverability in tight areas. Backup camera's might be nice but it's also really important to be able to stick your head out the window and judge based on that. It isn't like putting camera's on the trailer is possible and the cameras on the truck are likely to be fixed in place and as such when backing into a tight spot where the trailer, the 90 degree angle will mean all those camera's will show is a very nice side shot of the trailer and not the very important back of the trailer. It's very common for that trailer to come within a foot of another truck or corner and pivot around to get into a spot and a mistake isn't acceptable. No one wants that space in the back, not a single damn person and this setup also makes it impossible to use this truck for training/assessment/ect because the instructor can't sit in the passenger seat. Day cab drivers will want a shorter truck to make it into tighter spots easier and a OTR person will want a bed and some storage to sleep. Without the supporting infrastructure however it's impossible for OTR drivers to use this thing and they are the ones doing the bulk of the deliveries by truck. That's not even taking into account the general pushback swapping to an electric truck in general will end up receiving from the trucking community.
Some really good points you made there.
as a driver I do want the space A small cab is not nearly as comfortable as a larger one. sound and air quality is important. The seat in the center is great. Nice big door and low step ,super nice
UX (user experience) is top-of-mind in technical design. While you may have to move your butt to the side, and thus out of the seat, to transact documents, there is surely a thought out workflow, even if it requires change from the standard cab.
@@markstevens1729 a lot of trucking companies avoid toll roads. I think the paperwork transaction not a convincing argument. As a delivery truck getting in and out of the seat with the least amount of effort is much more important
I think the length of the cab is driven by the size of the battery. A shorter cab would mean a smaller battery. That might not be an issue for some local haulers.
As a retired safety and risk management professional, I think the learning curve for drivers needs to be recognized. Most commercial fleets I know of facilitate interoperability among their entire fleet. Jumping into a Tesla truck is not that simple.
Apparently the Pepsi Co drivers got up to speed very quickly. They are driving the Tesla's on regional delivery routes and feed back has been very positive, Fact is they are way easier to drive with no shifting, turn radius is astounding, regenerative braking means taking a 6% down grade using ZERO mechanical breaking. This is game changer.
@@asommer518Sure, and that's valid. But outside of the mechanical concerns, where most agree EVs have a massive advantage, the ergonomic choices Tesla is making are extraordinarily questionable. That's in addition to the fact that, in terms of adjusting our infrastructure to be more sustainable, there are simply better solutions than relying on automobiles for many tasks. Shipping included. Improving and expanding our use of locomotives for example and creating sustainable solutions on that front would provide dividends over further expanding trucking. That's not to say there won't be a place for these electric trucks, but the angle that EV makers are playing, in terms of sustainability, just doesn't make much sense. The modern personal vehicle centered transit system simply doesn't align with that goal.
I think it's interesting that it's the only truck with electric controls for the parking brake and trailer brake... I didn't think that was legal
Except it doesn't, if you watch in cab video carefully you will see standard air brake controls to the right of the driver
@@grunt98444 buttons. It's a pair of buttons with the same symbols as a standard knob
As a trucker myself, this is going to be a hard pass for me! Beds in our sleeper truck! Additionally comma day cabs are much smaller than that for a reason so it's not even a good day cab!
They'll be driving themselves by 2030. They didn't need to put beds.
@@Ev3rNoor23 Even if you are right (which I doubt) 2030 is 7 years away. There is no excuse to not have a bed right now and release updated self-driving version in 7-10 years.
@@procerator They are for short runs, try to keep up.
@@BioniqBob try to read other comments from actual truckers. People mention usecases when you arrive at destination and wait to be unloaded. Instead of sitting in the chair, lying in the bed would be nice don't you think?
@procerator These vehicles are not yet on the market. Even if they were, they will be in operation much longer than 7 years. Again, very soon, we will not have truck drivers. I am 100% certain this is the reason why they were engineered without a sleeper for you. Not because they just decided to ignore your wants and needs.
I really dislike the increasing trend away from physical buttons. I like being able to manipulate controls without looking and having tactile feedback. Not to mention cheaper touchscreens can have input lag when the computer gets overloaded.
Its why its important to put a good GPU on them. Car companies put the cheapest of the cheap onto the touchscreens these days.
Teslas need a big GPU to run inference on the AI models that run the self driving and safety stuff.
Hence why they generally have decent touchscreens.
But commercial equipment should definitely have physical buttons though.
Manufacturers love it because it means cost reduction. Every physical button replaced by a touch screen button means fewer parts and less labor during assembly. And, with more people growing up with touchscreens, there will be fewer complaints.
touch screens can be good if auto makers didn't somehow fuck them up, an IPad from 2013 runs faster and is easier to use than like 90% of new cars interfaces. If every car maker actually made good software ( like tesla, not a fanboy but I respect that theirs is actually good ) combined with haptic feedback on what you would find on your smartphone, then I bet the general public would actually be totally fine with everything being on the screen.
@@TypicalBlox Touchscreens definitely have higher levels of quality possible than what's commonly implemented. I still don't think haptic feedback is a true replacement for knobs and buttons. It's not just the feedback from pushing the button that's important. It's being able to find the controls by touch. I think most of the diagnostics and settings are fine with touchscreen controls, but not the things that you would be manipulating while driving.
@honkhonk8009 Touchscreens *are* cheapest of the cheap, that's why they're used. The only real benefit is profit margins for the manufacturers.
I have been driving for afew years now and I can honestly say in this industry we are told how to do our jobs by people who don’t, can’t and haven’t done our jobs.
“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.” -Henry Ford
@@TheHumanNacho”if I knew black people colored people and women would be driving my cars I never would have made them in the first place” -Henry, probably
@@josephmother2659
Don't forget Jews!
Don't worry. Those jobs won't exist in 25 years because those people(myself included) will have made AI so smart enough and with such integration that a driver will not be needed anymore and for those cases where you do need a driver to hand something out the window or touch on the screen We will have robots that can sit there and be ready to perform those tasks when they come up.
So many sayings but regardless if its trucking or not your still a human and you still know how to do what your good at and wouldn’t want anyone to tell you otherwise. All of you argue just to argue when you all feel and go through the same shit. Let me go and tell you how to do your job then.
This is what happens when a company tries to make a product without understanding their customers or the niche.
Exactly!!!
Same as bud light news
That's total BS, not all trucks do the same function, trucks are tailored to meet the needs of the tasks they are intended for.
The feedback from Pepsi and it's drivers is that the Tesla Semi is fantastic.
The fact that some other truck drivers and operators, who haven't driven it yet, and who want to use it for different purposes, are opining on the truck is irrelevant. Use it first, for the purpose it was intended, then I'll give your critique some merit.
@@christopherhartley6900 I don't need to test it to know it won't be a good fit for my company. It could lead to some pretty dangerous situations and it's unpractical. If this was a good idea it would already be in use. It's not like this is a big brain move that nobody thought of before.
@@christopherhartley6900 Pepsi uses them for last mile delivery, I've checked some of them out while servicing forklifts at the local Pepsico plant that has them. Their oldest truck was delivered 1 year ago and has 4000 miles on the dash. Of course it's going to work if you're not going anywhere.
As a local driver in California this design is ridiculous from the center seat design to the unnecessary larger touchscreens. This is the perfect example why some people need to stay in their own lane😂😂😂😂 pun intended
What do you plan to do after California enforces the no diesel trucks rule?
centre seat gives the best visibility, the only reason car seats arent mounted in the centre is space. the more conventional offset is a better use of space. but this is irrelavent in a truck.
@ArtStoneUS watch its economy start to crumble. Also, watch how the energy grid goes out. Currently, we do not produce enough energy to completely switch to EV. Also coal is the biggest producer of energy in america
@@tj_mcdonald21 What a truck driver supposed to do with ''better visibility'', this is a F1 car?? All they need is seeing the road a head and traffic in front and behind them and left side seat has far better visibility for that than center. This is also why no other company ever produced a center seat truck, tesla doing stupid things to be unique it is just that. And their terrible cabin design proves it, two huge touchscreen to block visibility while they care about it so much supposedly ofc, literally half of cabin is empty space where you can hang your coat!!..
@@ggoddkkiller1342 you should check out Edison motors. It’s called safety, also backing into a dock becomes 10 times easier when you can see. Chase (edison motors) explains it very well. They’re making an electric vocational truck that has a diesel gen on board. Same reason dozers, tractors and alk other kinds of heavy duty vehicles. The seat was placed offset to provide more space for passenger seating, they chose the left because it provides better visibility than the right when driving on the right side of the road. The downside is you can’t see shit out the passenger side. The only reason people are hating on the center seat is because it’s a Tesla and Tesla can do no good because hur dur electric bad or some stupid ass shit.
Buttons are really good to have in professional settings. Tactile feedback and being able to perform certain functions without locking away is critical. Most military vehicle functions can be operated without having to look away (once trained).
Same with cameras. Same with alot of equipment. Companies pay an extra thousand for physical interfaces on em.
This is a poorly designed semi imo. Teslas prolly gonna have to redesign it
My number one gripe with modern cars is the lack of tactile control. I had a car that all the interior lights went out on. It was fine because I knew where every switch was. It's just not that way anymore. If I need to adjust the radio I have to take my eyes off traffic and find the right screen.
When Tesla truck introduced, I already figured that center driver position is designed by someone who never been in the trucking industry. Not just gate entering, when backing ally dock, both sides view of side-mirror disappear when jackknifing trailer that is why driver side must be either left or right side of cab to secure at least one side of whole view to backing up.
You simply have no idea about the future. Don't try to explain the future with your knowledge from yesterday or you will embarrass yourself.
@@whynotstartusingyourbrain8726 Perhaps, In some industries still traditional way and human’s hands and eyes are required, can’t ignore that.
@@johnnyk682 These people are Elon fanboy's. He could shit in their mouths, call it the future and they would swallow it with a smile on their face
Fsd back up mode coming soon 😎
I see a lot of truck drivers struggling to back up in tight spaces in NYC . Tesla semi will use cameras , sensors and software to park faster and better than any human being on earth . Or elsewhere
A day cab that has the wheelbase of a sleeper, makes every back a blind side, and requires you to take your eyes off the road more often. Count me in.
These are made for full self driving. That’s why they are touch screen. How are they blind side? These have like 12 cameras 😂
@@AzeOfSpadez Tesla is barely level 3 self-driving. Shit's a pipe dream to obtain never-ending subsidies from the government like most of Tesla and Silicon Valley's motif at this point.
@@calebmatty5060 The subsidies Tesla receives now only account for about 10% of the companies net quarterly profits. They no longer need them. But if the government is giving out free money you can hardly blame them for taking it.
@@calebmatty5060what subsidy for FSD. You are talking nonsense!
@@AzeOfSpadez don`t you think it is a bad idea to design a vehicle around technology that does not 100% exist yet?
Thank goodness there’s a coat hook. Now that’s innovation
I have a Land Cruiser, and it has a mix of buttons and screen. I can confirm that the screen functions are both a safety hazzard, and are not as easy to use as physical buttons. I have audio, climate, phone, navigation, etc on the screen. Navigation is the only function I am happy with as touch screen, because I set it before driving. The rest of it is just annoying.
Edit: i am incorrect on some of this. Leaving original post. Enjoy the conversation. 👍
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One issue with electric trucks is the 20,000# batteries. Most sleeper cabs weigh in at around 18,000-20,000# already. A dry-van trailer weighs in around 15,000#. With a legal max weight of 80,000#, that leaves 45,000# useful cargo load. With a Tesla truck that drops to 25,000#. Granted, many loads are less than 25,000#. But it puts limits on common load options. I think full electric works for smaller vehicles like local delivery vans and other small commercial vehicles. But for medium vehicles I think the clean running CNG vehicles is a better option. But I'm just a truck driver.
More axles and more wheels can be added to carry the extra weight. The weight of the battery is not a problem.
@@charlesbutterfield3464then with more axles you add more weight so not helping much, more weight means even less range
The battery of a Tesla Semi is probably around 10,000 pounds, not 20,000. And that replaces the engine and fuel of a diesel, it isn't just added to the diesel truck's weight. The overall result is that a battery-electric truck of this battery capacity and range is heavier than a diesel, but by much less than 20,000 pounds.
US federal regulations allow battery-electric (and natural gas) trucks to have a gross combination weight 2,000 pounds more than normal (so 82,000 pounds instead of 80,000 pounds), to compensate for the higher truck weight. The doesn't completely offset the extra weight of the Tesla Semi, but is close enough that payload won't be an issue in most applications.
The Tesla does not have diesel fuel tanks, an exhaust system or drive train. The diesel fuel itself is close to 2,000 lb
@@ArtStoneUS 2000 pounds of diesel fuel would be about 290 US gallons, providing a range of about 2000 miles. A realistic comparison to the Tesla would be to carry 75 gallons or 500 pounds of diesel.
Any truck has a drive train. Some battery-electric trucks (such as Volvo and Mack) have the same driveline shafts as a diesel, because the mount the motor to the frame; others (such as Tesla, Kenworth, and Peterbilt) mount motors to the axles... so they save a few pounds of shaft, but they still have reduction gears and differentials.
Design a truck cab where the driving position can be moved between left and right hand side. The same truck can then be used in all countries and a trucker moving between left and right hand drive countries can adjust accordingly. If the controls are by wire (not physical) then reap the benefits that drive by wire can offer.
Don't talk common sense with some of these cave dwellers.
Why? Most places drive on the correct side anyway
Great idea, but not really a financially viable one. Really the only place(s) that happens are the UK and possibly Japan (Don't know how many trucks go from Japan to right lane countries). So it doesn't make sense for a company to develop that for such a small market.
That said, I love that idea and it wouldn't be that hard if it's all drive by wire.
there is nearly zero demand for a truck which changes side of the road. There are specialized applications where is beneficial to be able to drive on the road from the normal side of the cab, but switch to the curb side for some work (such as waste collection); for those applications, Mercedes offers the Unimog with VarioPilot, a system which allows the driver position to be moved to either side as desired (only when stopped, of course).
@@themisterchristieThe Unimog VarioPilot system isn't even steer-by-wire, and it can still move from side to side.
The larger issue with these trucks, and electric cars in general, is that performance TANKS when the temperature changes. Colder/warmer climates affect the systems in the vehicle greatly, it saps charge like mad.
These use battery heaters.
@@davidlang4442and where do the heaters get power from?, plus range is effected by how much the load weights, yesterday you got there today you will have to charge, same distance different load, same driving hours legislation.
Touch screen controls are a deal breaker for me on vehicles. I shouldn't have to navigate a menu system to change the air temp or flow on the heater/AC. Same goes for the radio. This seems to be the trend (hopefully just that) for all newer vehicles these days. I'm surprised it is allowed given how long you have to take your eyes off the road to make minor adjustments.
I'm glad you made that point about the touchscreens. They're just cost savings billed as innovation, and they fail when it comes to ease of use (and safety).
Agree. I want dials and buttons I can use without looking, not be fiddling with a stupid touch screen.
I'd have agreed with you a few months back, when I bought my Model 3 - missing tactile feedback was very annoying. I realized the correct way to handle the touch screen was to put the car into lane assist - basically it drives itself very reliably on most roads - and fiddle with the controls, then take back driving. A bunch of controls are also accessible through the steering wheel buttons and voice recognition.
All in all, it takes adjustment, but not a big deal if you made the transition.
@@AWZool Doesn't the auto steering require you to be able to take over if something goes wrong and it disengages? Wouldn't want to be the truck driver suddenly finding himself with half a second to grasp the situation on the road and react after a couple seconds staring at the screen because the computers fail. I think this approach will kill people
@@zlifoet4305 I admit it's fucking scary to relinquish control of the vehicle to a dumb ass computer, but _most_ of the times, on relatively fair road conditions, it does work. By that I mean visible lanes in fairly good visibility - I only had problems in dark + wet road, with shitty paintings and cars parking on the side of the road.
Also, it's goal is to let you peek over to the computer and follow the lane without rear-ending someone, which is well within the autopilot's capabilities.
@@AWZool If you have to put the vehicle into lane assist in order to use other controls we have an interface problem and now you're driving distracted.
Got to agree with the button statement. I've delt with a control system that had no buttons and frankly am still convinced that it is a big part of what got 10 people killed on my ship.
What happened to them? Can you explain a bit?
@orze7218 USS John S McCain Aug2017 collision. Most of its in the report which is available if you go looking for it. Not really a conversation/personal perspective I'm willing to randomly give out online but the report does a good enough explanation.
one thing not a lot of people mention is that tesla actually made these for their own needs of transporting stuff from their facilities. it also adds up with why there is no sleeper set or the range lasts roughly as much as their facilities trip do ;)
Im pretty sure they made them to sell idiot!
Also for Walmart/Amazon btw.
Walmart needs these for the short haul routes between warehouses and whatnot
A sleeper cab would promote long haul usage, but battery lifespans when used in long haul route would be terrible, like 2 years or less. And, since a battery that large is going to cost about $150K or even $200K the cost per mile advantage EV's have is entirely lost when you have to shell out $150K or more every couple years. But, well before the battery needs to be replaced the range is going to diminish so that instead of recharging 2-3 times per day it might be 4-5 times per day. For short routes, less than 200 miles, the battery will last much longer so long as the battery isn't abused by excessive high speed charging to 100% or excessive high power usage (hot rodding).
So, if the reported range is, say, 500 miles and you limit the charging and discharging to 80% and 10% the range will be reduced from 500 miles to 350 miles -- with a new battery. When the battery is a year old 350 miles might be more like 300 miles and at 2 years 200 miles.
Did you miss the part where they said 80% of all truck routes in the US are under 250miles?
Just a small correction/addition to "on duty times". In EU full 9 hours shift is split into two 4,5 hours sections where 45 min break is required in between. Within last two weeks (this being a moving average), a trucker can have I think 3 times 12 hours shifts. From the video some non EU viewers could have a feeling that we can repeat 4,5 hours drive + 45 min break indefinitely.
Big touch screens that control everything in and out of the truck are the worst things you can put in any vehicle. Your eyes are on the screen and not on the road
ur right make it buttons spread out everywhere lol STFU
Yup. Give me the buttons. I can keep my eyes on the road and a hand on the wheel. With muscular memory, I don't even have to look.
@@jamesgizasson and then you scroll on youtube...
@@timg2973 I don't use my phone to drive. Computers have their place, but it is not between me and the road.
And you can count on that screen malfunctioning at some point. When it goes blank or says "🛑ERROR!" What then?
The first prototypes of the Land Rover Series 1 was also designed with a center-mounted steering wheel, but it immediately ran into the problem of poor hand signals and an inability to collect toll tickets by the driver, forcing the designers to revert back to a traditional layout.
very good point for a passenger vehicle but doesnt really apply to semis.
@@godw1ll99 Doesn't? How will you get a ticket out of a manually operated toll road machine? Or give your passport while crossing a border checkpoint?
@@dustojnikhummer semis, at least in my area, are "ticketed" automatically via camera operated tolls that capture license plates. think of it like an ezpass. as far as passports, idk.
Similar story to SpaceX's designs: Elon refuses to learn from past mistakes made by people before him, causing him to repeat those mistakes. Like how he removed the flame trenches on the launch pads of his rockets, because he found them pointless. Now the launch pads get damaged severely with each launch.
@@godw1ll99 Just because a few states has this facility doesn’t necessarily mean that it would apply everywhere. You need to have the option of manual ticket collection rather than getting down every time, especially if the transit is cross state.
How much water do we need to but the fire out in this?
One of the missing links in electrifying and automating the trucking industry is to first apply that to the trucking terminal. Automating and electrifying the terminal yard dog so that over road truckers can just drop and pick up their loads in an open area and let the docking and undocking process be automated. It would also mean every moment of inactivity by a yard dog can be invested in recharging. Odd that they are skipping that step in favor of focusing on same day trucking
"Electrified yard infrastructure" isn't quite as marketable on twitter unfortunately
Polish company PESA is doing that to freight rail. They built a hydrogen yard locomotive.
“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.” -Henry Ford
The irony here is that they clearly asked customers what they wanted. They were involved in the development from the start and anybody who paid the slightest attention to the unveil of the Semi truck knows that.
@@whynotstartusingyourbrain8726 this is true
But I want safe not too speed but I love electric truck
There's also the fact that he never actually said that.
@@rogermouton2273he did.
Just checked, neither window rolls down, they pop open like old minivan windows. Thats gonna suck at a shipper/receiver, or if the A/C takes a dump on you🤷♂️
😯 Is true
@@leprzworld yes, look up the truck.
The air-conditioning uses heat transfer, it is this not dependent on a compressor and the motor running
@@ArtStoneUSdoesn't mean it can't break
You want to get used to using voice commands rather than searching through the menus while you’re driving. It’s weird at first, but actually works pretty well. You can basically do everything with voice commands and the scroll wheels on the steering wheel.
You had me at the “over the top” clip
Imagine how expensive and frustrating it'll be when you have to ship that truck out to a tesla factory do to no one near by being able to work on it because of all their proprietary software and tech.
i think they offer a 1 million mile warranty. and much easier to work on less moving parts you could do a motor swap in few hours or less. also they can diagnose and know the problem with out even being at the truck.
@timg2973 if it is easier, they don't show it the suv and Sedan tesla everyone drives takes months to get repaired for single panel and it cost like 10k. The one mil warranty is kinda epic though
@@antares2953 all cars are expensive to repair these days. shops charging 200 an hour. annd shortage in parts. i just had a honda take 5 months just to get 3 body parts.
@@antares2953 it won't be a million mile warranty..but lets say it is...who is going to tow it and how much are they going to charge to tow the truck? lol warranty is useless if a tow bill will be 40k usd..
I'm a retired truck driver. I'd love to try out this truck.
I love my Model 3 and it only has half of the range of this truck 😎. Still some kinks to work out on the truck but hope it catches on over the next decade.
I'm still out here myself and feel the same way. I'd like to try it, but not necessarily buy it
Electric semis will do a great job hauling their own batteries around, eventually.
My grandparents were both long distance truck driver… that's why I've always been facinated everytime I see huge trucks since I was a kid. Reminds me of my roots. Through theri connections couple with fortunate happenstances people always surprised everytime they learned that my roots originate from truckers.
Perhaps that's why I always wanted to experience at least a few years as one.
This is why I love what Edison motors is doing with their diesel electric logging trucks. Its a realistic design and they built the truck to last a very long time with standard parts that are cheaper to replace than all this futuristic bs
But they have a centre seat too...
@@samthesr20man On Topsy, yes, but that one is specifically a logging truck. It also has the large wheel-well windows, and combined, this allows you good visibility on those narrow mountain logging roads. They also said that they're listening to people's comments about making diesel-electric conversion kits for their existing pickup trucks, which I'm excited about. I like my '98 Chevy 3500.
diesel electric trains don't have electric motors for the reasons you stated, they have motors because it does away with a very complicated transmission system, if the engine was coupled directly to the wheels then they would need a massive gearbox between them, its best to just spin a generator and use electric motors
Yep. I've rebuilt a few locomotive engines and replaced a many of the electric generators. Don't think you wanna build a gearbox for a V16 2 stroke diesel engine that's damn near 20 feet long.
Diesel electric locomotives are coupled together with all the motors on the same power circuit.
Edison motors is making a better electric truck than Tesla. While being based out of the mountains somewhere in Canada.
Electric drive train and a smaller diesel motor to charge the batteries.
@@goshawk4340 Edison Motors is going to be awesome very soon. I'm excited about their concept of retrofitting old rigs with new drivetrains to keep the old trucks viable for years to come.
@@Bearthedancingman oh god after over 100 years it's back to Edison Vs Tesla huh
leaning and looking out of the drivers window is essential to backing up efficiently and easily.
So they built a sleeper cab for daycab operations. A daycab has a shorter wheel base that is great for lots of backing into docks in tight areas. Visibility is also hampered by a center driver position.
As a trucker what I see is these electric trucks reducing the small amount of parking spots we have now in order to put in chargers. So itll force the drivers of the diseal trucks to drive sleepy trying to find a safe spot to park.
they dont make sleepers buddy. they wont be sitting at a truck stop in your lifetime. they chard at their yard...
Loves is already on board. During the mandatory 30-minute break, Tesla says you'll be able to get a 70% recharge
@@ArtStoneUS - from 70% to 100 would be 4-5 hours a bet... all stats on quick charges never go above 80 when advertised for a reason
@@ArtStoneUSonly if your break time coinsides with a charger.
As a driver of 30 yrs. Tesla hasn't released the actual tractor weight .
At the the day it's all about weight .
Less weight in a Tractor trailer combination
equals more profit at the end of the day
its a little more then an ICE truck but thats why the goverment gives then an extra 2,000 pounds so they can run 82,000lbs
So the cost of fuel and maintenance doesn't count ?
@@timg2973 It's usually a bad sign when maximum vehicle weights, which were presumably arrived at based on safety and road damage considerations, suddenly get ignored in the quest to push new sales for a billion dollar corporation.
What isn't considered in the push for all electric vehicles is what the same amount of battery capacity and investment money could do instead of making a Tesla Semi. I suspect overall pollution levels (When accounting for mining and battery manufacturing costs) could be reduced in a lot more trucks at a much lower cost per truck by changing them to a hybrid setup, allowing the truck to run all electric in built up areas, switching to liquid fuel between urban areas where the exhaust pollution don't impact people nearby.
Once the battery and electric motor are big enough for regen braking on long downhills, turning the waste and noise of the jake brake into more range, that's more than enough battery to give huge benefits without the massive environmental cost in making a battery multiples of times the size to go full electric.
That or consider that conservatively 10 houses could be taken completely off the grid on solar power with a Tesla Semi sized battery.
It's not good, thats why they don't release it :) Those batteries are hella heavy, not to mention dangerous... Getting stuck in a tunel behind a battery malfunction. Mmm, roasted human
@@tomc4717The good news is the fumes would most likely kill you before the fire gets to you... 😕
how long does it take to charge after a 500 mile trip from a conventional outlet? how much weight can it carry? remember its competing against a truck that you can fill from empty in about 20 mins
Button is an issue on so many modern cars at the moment. They keep pushing to touch screen but its so much more dangerous.
I also feel like the cab position, aside from just being bad due to the mentioned reasons, is also kind of dangerous since I thought, and maybe i'm wrong here, that Truckers often drive lots of different trucks. If you only drive Tesla then sure ok, its fine. But you get very, very used to the slightly off centre positioning when driver, and suddenly being in the centre throws that off. Whilst you'd adjust if its all you drive, if you swapping between Tesla and normal trucks, your going to end up losing you positioning alot surely?
I feel that there’s much more space for improvement due to the fact that it has one seat in the middle and don’t require a engine
Pretty sure where the engine would be is just replaced by the battery
@@hefywefy5331 still a battery dosent take up as much space this is why EVs usually have a storage compartment in the front
@@hefywefy5331batteries are flat cube shape package, takes way less place then engine, transmission, exhaust system & fuel tank
@@neotastic5731 not quite. lets used the Ford lightning as an example but it applies to most EV's
So Batteries like to be inter connected together before going to the power distribution pack
So they make a big flat racks about 4-10" thick and typically takes up most of the underside of the car. on a normal F-150 this holds the transmission, shaft, Gas tank, exhaust pipes. but keeping in mind all this is normally is along the center in the middle of the underside now the whole underside of the truck is battery. The engine with is big and in the hood is now replaced with power pack and motor for front axel as this is much smaller then engine its leave room for the Funk (front trunk)
So yes you loose the engine space but significantly more space is taken underneath the vehicle compared to before. best example look at the original Tesla roadster. based on lotus Elise they are wider longer and taller then the original car to make room for those batteries.
There is one thing i noticed when looking at the entire layout of the cabin (seat in the middle, foldable passenger seat behind the driver etc.)
It basically seems like they took a look at agricultural machines and were like „yep, let‘s turn that into a truck“
I want to see how the driver will back up in a difficult situation and harsh weather.
Fsd parking mode 😎
Thats what all the cameras are for they even have blind spots cameras plus they will have assisted docking maybe even full self docking
@@BioniqBob Yeah yeah, "SOON"
As any usable "Autopilot" huh?
Thing is, Tesla's parking assistant is worse than most major automakers who use regular systems.
So yeah sure, auto park will be along soon....
I can drive during a heavy snowstorm on the freeway at 65 mph in my model 3, I think the tesla semi can handle blindspots while parking at 5mph. The whole blindspot thing is bs and if a camare is blocked or blinded you can just clean it. And the terminal thing is also easily solved by standing up and opening the window while the truck is stamding.
None of these are reasonable.
@@jz261 he said backing up. not driving a non combination vehicle in a straight line. I can tell you have never backed up a 53 foot trailer in shitty weather conditions while your sliding on ice and you have inches on both sides. This thing would be the stuff nightmares are made from. Look I like electrification. I think its dope. You can tell this was not designed by someone who would be driving it.
For regional and local it's range and power is fine for me it's the seating position I really wouldnt want center seating. I see them occasionally running in Cali they're pretty neat for sure
I miss buttons. I remember being able to text entire conversations while driving and never looking away from the road back on my Nokia.
It is physically impossible to back a trailer into a spot with a center seat!
nope the cams and mirrors move to follow the trailer.. next question?
@@timg2973 That makes sense... but do they actually move?
If they were that smart, you'd think they'd at least have a fold down bed in that walkway. Perhaps not an ideal situation, but you could catch a nap while waiting on unloading and charging.
Us DOt regulations say that sitting in either a passenger seat or drivers seat is 'ON Duty not driving' which eats away at their hours or service...
@@richardlamm4826 DOT regulations describe a bed that is allowed.. it even includes a seat belt
The better metric for electric trucks would be: Can you go as long as the driver is allowed to drive the vehicle without taking his mandatory rest periods and can you recharge in that rest period?
so true about the physical buttons giving access to spacial memory so you dont have to take your eyes off the road.
_Most_ trains are either electric (power from overhead wire or third-rail) or diesel electric. Steam power is still around, in places. There are a few oddities: maglev, funicular (gravity powered), etc.
Just as most things they make it’s more so built to be a show stopper or draw attention because it looks cool. But most drivers will find this truck frustrating mainly because it is not like what they are use to. I never thought about how far the cab will be from tollbooths etc until it was mentioned in this video. This country’s infrastructure is not ready for something like this, especially when there are plenty of states who do not have automated toll roads, or charging on those toll roads.
Pretty much every trucker that I've seen uses E-ZPass or the equivalent to pay tolls
@@ArtStoneUS E-Zpass is still a card you need to scan. so you still need to get out of the seat opened the window and scan the card at toll booths. What about showing ID and pass port for Cross country freight.
You're right about the lack of fume emissions, but what about the battery cells?
Good visibility and such, but no bed for a trucker to properly sleep in?
Adam Something once pointed out that the load problem is yet to be solved. And even if it gets solved, what will you do when the thing catches fire?
Until a mega-charging network is established , no point in marketing to long haul truckers who need a bed…yet….As Tesla has clearly stated the current generation is marketed specifically for the 80% of trucking that is 250 miles/day ( or less)
In Germany and Austria, the police can insert their card and download data to see how much you’ve been driving and resting, how fast you’ve been driving at what zones, and on a traffic control you’ll get fines accordingly. So drivers rest and rest well here.
Now they download data while the truck its driving on the highwaay,they dont need to stop the truck
How do you know they were resting well ? What if they were unloading and had a truck tahograph on 🛏️?
@@Xv1p3rCr0
These systems are more than enough and they are more about putting the driver in a position that they are likely to rest well since they are not driving, because that is exactly what they would be wanting to do, since they live in a culture where safety is first. The culture in Austria, Switzerland and Germany is that of self responsibility. People want to be responsible. The system simply aids them.
So trucks really go
@@sm5970perfectly summarised the difference in EU Vs US work ethic
Range of 500 miles then how long to recharge? I run 550-630 every day so how long am I going to get stuck charging for that last 100 miles? Then there’s the little problem of batteries not doing well in the cold so up here I’ll be limited further on my range.
* 500 miles but you need to only charge to 80% to keep from damaging it, only 300 mile effective range and the only active route with the new semi is just 100 miles.
This is what happens when people who never drove a truck has to design one
I can only imagine the safety restrictions companies are going to put on the Tesla Semi, most don’t even let you use a Bluetooth headset that requires more than 1 press to operate.
I drove a front discharge concrete mixer. We had to sit in the center of the truck. It wasn’t that bad. Even the rear discharge trucks, you had to exit the vehicle to use keypads to access gated sites.
I can see this thing costing a FORTUNE to repair. While regular semis are already wildly expensive to maintain, I feel that the components in these will be even more expensive and far harder to get to in the first place
The large air deflector above the cab is an ideal place for a sleeper berth. Cut a hole in the roof, add a ladder and voila! You have a bed! Duh!
It probably cost more money for them to do that
Right? And because you're sleeping outside, it's easier to detect thieves. 😁
day cabs buddy.. sleepers are 20 or so more years out when the electric grid grows. for now the truck charge when parked in their yard.
That's a recipe for disaster. Half of the truckers are middle aged.
Besides, the air deflector in the Tesla Semi is already open to the cabin. That's why you can stand behind the front seat.
Trains use electric motors on the wheels and they have lots of them. Running a piece of wire from the internal combustion engine to the motor is so much easier than gearboxes. Nothing to do with torque.
Trains do not have motors on all the wheels.
@@Charlesbjtown He never claimed they did
The point at 5:05 doesn’t really work because the UI will likely remain static. Even with different pages to view, they still function as buttons that are in a specific space relative to you.
Sooo, I have seen 2 or 3 milliona miles Trucks quite often, and with a new Engine or a Rebuild they keep going, but with a battery, how will that impact cost of maintaining the truck, enviromental issues with lithium waste.
They would have room for a fold down bed. They could even make the driver seat foldable to convert it into a table (had a passenger seat in the car, was great for breaks or transporting long goods).
Like it is now it is so much waster space...install a swivel seat and get a fold down table, fridge, microwave, tv, let it fold back and give it an extended foot rest.
That cab has potential, it just needs to get digged out
Not the 1st truck with a central seat, the Scammell Scarab was the first..look it up what a machine!!
Scarabs were used mainly for yard work, or short distance (10-15miles)deliveries, where a normal vehicle would be unable to turn round. A lot were used by British Rail as it was, or in my home town as brewery drays for deliveries to local pubs.
How much carrying cargo weight is lost to the weight of the batteries
Touch screens should have verbal input abilities with an HUD menu display that turns off after it's needed.
well elon musk is always very good at inventing something that allready exists, give it a stupid name, make it 3 times more expensive and make it have half the functionality.
I don’t like him, either, but that’s just plain ridiculous.
He has had huge impact on the introduction of EVs and on space technology. If he wasn’t such a fascist shit (Henry Ford was, too) he’d be one of my heroes. Ford only “invented” something that already existed, but his influence on automobile adoption was second to no-one else’s. Same goes for Musk with both EVs and re-usable rocket stages.
Let’s attack the prick for his racism (fascism?) and his shitty politics, including his workplace practices. Attacking his actual achievements just undermines that.
Segway from half: what is the actual load capacity of Tesla's semi? How many pounds of batteries does it hold?
What happens in cold weather, like the owners of Tesla cars said when it gets bitter cold, the charging stations can even warm the batteries enough for them to charge.
I use to drive an Oshkosh mixer, with the cab in the center. What really sucked was, drinking bad coffee (Starbucks) and being to far away from the window to spit it out! toll booths.9
oke but how much ton does it carry? , since its for logistic its wierd i cant find it on tesla website
Add a motor driven lateral mover on a track and the driver can handle the paper transfers at lading station gates. Probably easy to say but harder to do and more costly but if it's critical then it has to be done.
But the door is behind the drivers seat and I didn't see anything about roll down windows. There's not really any way to avoid getting up.
that paperwork will be gone soon...
@@AmauryJacquot when?
@@procerator for most of the shipments in the USA its already gone to paperless. FEDEX and UPS shipping systems with electronic bills of lading for line haul. Probably could be pushed to 90+ percent of the US shipments (if it isnt already) with just a bit of effort. The problem is with States and the FED being very slow to adapt to the change. Other than greed, there is really no reason for any toll road not to have completely electronic tolls - which would eliminate drivers hanging out of their cabs to grab toll tickets, etc or pay a toll.
I want to see on i80 in Wyoming in January. Especially when they shut down the interstate
For days
I've been stuck in the Texas panhandle from Sunday until Thursday with snow closing the road.
Three days in Tulsa, two days in Florida. Try that. Ice storm closed I-10 from Mississippi to I-95 outside of Jacksonville Florida. No equipment other than sunshine to clear the roads.
So, there will be challenges.
another thing is how most truckers talk about how weird it feels to go from their rig to their daily driver, I can see the centered control setup making that feeling even worse.
I wonder how the range of this truck changes with the temperature
One of the biggest problems with the Tesla Semi is that Elon Musk likes to make futuristic changes of things that already work great, just for the sake of change. For all the good things that come out of this truck, there are also unnecessary flaws that are there because of a wish for change
My guess is it having as little drag as possible took priority, leading to this design.
Between no diesel engine + no manual transmission + clean aerodynamics, I would guess it's vastly quieter than what truckers are used to.
The clean aerodynamics are an obvious place to decrease energy consumption, increase range.
That corridor in back it should be possible to hide a bed that can fold out, free space is unused space maybe some mini homes can be used as inspiration on how to compact more stuff in such as a bed.
Growing up on a farm almost all equipment is center driven. Except for some rare instances where it is offset for a better view of an attachment. Same with most heavy off-road equipment. unless it isn't feasible because of drivetrain or attachment requirements.
I do like that idea of getting into the truck and being able to stand and change clothes especially in the winter months. It’s the same feeling as a Freight Train Conductor putting on layers before getting off the Locomotive. Makes the job more comfortable.
And like their passenger vehicles, climate control is not dependent on the motor running.
It would be interesting to see if Tesla can come up with automated backing for semis. If the driver's view is going to be cut off, the computer needs to take up the slack.
that's stated to be on the cards.
their view ia not cut oof the cams and or mirrors auto fallow the trailer so no need to look behind you.
considering the simple fact that ford already aoffers that on the range it clearly can't be that hard.
How are the batteries mined?
so if the screen malfunctions do you lose your buttons....
I think for now, Pepsi and Frito=Lay and whom ever else is buying the trucks will provide enough feed back to Tesla for improvements. The OTR (Owner Operators) won't be buying or leasing the Tesla Semi for a number of years.
they are not even thinking about OTR trucks yet. unless pilot and loves says they will house charging stations and the government goes nuke on the power grid
"OTR" means "Over The Road", not owner-operator.
I drove one, and i tell you, the center seat when driving is the best thing ever!! backing up, LOVE them cameras! The ONLY time i need to go to the side window is to hand over paper work at security booths
🛑🧢😂
And someday, we'll come to our senses and stop using paper
@@ArtStoneUSIdiotic take. You need physical proof.
Most docking bays if unable to be backed up into straight on, are designed to be angled into from the driver side so the truck driver can utilize his driver side mirror. Where im from this is called "good siding". Doing it from the passenger side is called "blind siding".
Putting the driver in the center makes good siding more difficult, which is more common of a turn. But itl make blind siding a little easier.
This can be offset by providing even more oversized mirrors. That said, actual mirrors are critical. That parallax movement is critical. By slightly leaning forward or backwards i can suddenly see into a spot that has suddenly gone blind due to the angle of my trailer. These camera mirror things will not only be more expensive and more prone to failure. But less effective in general.
Where is all the cobalt being mined from ?
Everything seems nice except no buttons and driver seat location. Hope the next model has traditional options for both of those issues.
Id argue those particularly the buttons should not be options but standard. look at the 3 knob system for HVAC on most card it is honestly peak level understanding you know what setting is on without even looking at them. just feeling them day or night. for a driver Semi, or service van or anything job with driving this is very important. Touch screens have a place in vehicles but not for HVAC, Light settings, Windshield wipers , turn signals/hazards.
4:30 Just that you are aware: at least in Germany it is illegal for a Commercial Truck Driver to sleep in the Cab. not sure about the rest of the EU though.
It's allowed in Sweden, but only when stationary. So if you got two drivers one is not allowed to sleep in the bed while moving.
@@morilot Makes two drivers some what of a waste.
Tesla has just the truck for them.
@BobbyBear105 No not really. The other driver can drive when the other has a break and there's nothing prohibiting the other to snooze in the passenger seat as long as he or she uses the seat belt.
@@morilot Makes two drivers SOME WHAT of a waste.
And you have another valid point about the buttons yes I can hit anything on my truck without looking at it I know exactly where it is and I don't to guess and I can think of several things for safety reasons that I would need to know exactly where