Woke Colleges vs Testing
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- čas přidán 29. 03. 2021
- Colleges are ending SAT/ACT tests in the name of diversity, despite research that shows they are good at predicting college success.
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Some schools now won't even look at applicants' test scores. The reason: richer kids may get tutoring, and some minority groups, on average, don’t score as well.
Bob Schaeffer of the advocacy group FairTest compares test-makers to "the tobacco industry."
He's winning his war against testing. More than half of colleges in the country are now test-optional.
"The test makers themselves admit that the SAT and ACT are inferior predictors of college performance [to grades]," Schaeffer tells me.
But here's the data: high school grades predict 33% of college grades, while tests predict 32%. Not very “inferior!” Using both grades and SATs predicts 42% of college success.
A University of California report found that this trend holds across all races and income levels: senate.ucsd.edu/media/424154/...
In other words, tests are useful predictors of college success and failure.
Yet university administrators didn't follow the faculty report's recommendations. Why? Diversity and political correctness.
"It really is about making these campuses look right,” says Jason Riley of the Wall Street Journal editorial board. "...using them to make your college catalog look more colorful... It's about aesthetics. It's not about learning."
I ask: "What's wrong with these schools saying we want a more diverse student body?”
“How you achieve it is what I take issue with," Riley says. "There's this assumption. We just get these kids in the door. They'll be fine. They'll do okay. No, they won’t! ... they're being set up to fail."
To really increase diversity, Riley says, support school choice and charter schools that succeed in preparing disadvantaged kids for college.
I had a C to B average in high school. We couldn't afford an SAT test prep class. I purchased an SAT Test Prep book used from the library for 50 cents. I went through it and removed all the markings that the original owner put in it with whiteout that a teacher gave me. I went back and worked every problem in the book and took all the practice tests and scored 1350 out of 1600 on the SAT. The problem still wasn't solved because I couldn't afford to go to college so I went into the Marines and when I got out, I finally went to college and graduated with a degree in Engineering. I'm being told now that I was able to become an engineer because of my white privilege; however, I may look white but I am Hispanic.
You just proved that hard work pays off.
they say to never "dont judge a book by its cover", and "dont be racist", and "dont be sexist", then turn around and do the same fucking thing.
What you are is a great, hard working human being mate.
The dems are removing personal responsibility in America. Its what conservatives have that they dont.
Oo F'ing Ra
Lowering the standards just lowers the quality of the students..
profits over education
its why america is falling and china is rising, there they try to make boys more masculine and are concerned with advancement, here we want to ... well do the opposite. the west must fall, its time is over sadly
nah I disagree, it's the same everywhere, but the standards for education are a bit higher in asia, but also the best schools are still in the more affluent neighborhoods just like in America
in the end whoever has the most money will have their kids having more resources for a proper education, but if we want to give every poor person a decent education it'll cost a lot of money, and generally the schools in America pushing for diversity and pity acceptance are public schools so in the long run it'll just hurt the poor and middle classes even more.
Its done on purpose they want to dumb down the population, look at whats going on today most people believe in psuedo science than actual science. Makes for a population thats easier to control.
So when your brain surgeon mentions 'parts is parts', should you worry?
The "every child is special" and "my child can't miss out" mentality. This aint the real world Goldylocks.
Unless you have something wrong with you, you can do college. You don't have to be special just not lazy.
conservatives live in a dream world, you guys can barely finish highschool, yet alone college, most conservative colleges are a joke, then have the nerve to lecture liberals on how to teach.. ok. how about you guys just stop complaining and just go to your own garbage colleges?
@@mycollegeshirt Its hard to say who's a conservative seeing as how they are generally unwelcome in universities.
@@mycollegeshirt Consider my mind blown
True
In Georgia, several years ago, there was a scandal in the Atlanta school district. Teachers were changing students test scores in order for these students to qualify for scholarships through the Hope Foundation, this means more money for these schools. Colleges began to question why they were getting students with only a third grade reading level, or math level. In the end, about a dozen teachers and administrators were tried, convicted, and sent to jail.
Great !
This was also linked to the idea they were starting to practice in Atlanta that the teachers salary was directly linked to test scores. Desperation and funding led to it. I remember cause I got my certificate to teach right as that mess made all the hiring for teachers a mess itself.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@@als3022 problem with that approach is grade inflation, and teachers only wanting to teach the AP classes and not interested in the special needs students.
@@gerardcote8391 Oh believe me I understand all the problems that it causes. Even worse was the fact that the schools tried to implement the idea that the entire county should have the same tests. They tried to get us to work together with all the other schools to come up with a universal test.
Yeah that isn't a terrible idea that will make teachers teach the test not test what they teach. No way that'd happen.
Everything "diversity" touches, mediocrity results.
Mediocrity isn't what results, it's pure disappointment
Like your grasp of sentence structure.
I think their slogan is: if we can't achieve anything, neither can you
@@inalienablerights Says the genius who posts a sentence fragment.
@@SuperMinnesota2 You're projecting.
Most colleges don't care if you're a lousy student, they only care how much money you can borrow to keep them employed.
Spot on!
Amen brother
And they triply don't care if you don't wind up employed afterward, especially long term. If some company gives you a chance and fires you after a month because you don't know your stuff or lack in work ethic because you never had to try, they can still claim they have a high job placement rate. Or they can just ignore it altogether and focus on telling students and parents what businesses and careers their best students wind up in.
College is a massive bureaucracy. The number of employees they have outside of the job of actual teaching is mind boggling.
@@Name-cz5jj That makes too much sense for WOKE. You need to tone it down buddy.
I had a 2.9 GPA in hs and I live in a very low income area, but I got 1510/1600 on the SAT and got into a state school. I'm about to graduate now with a civil engineering degree and have a job lined up with the department of transportation. All my classmates with high GPAs struggled to keep it up in college and fell apart. Tests honestly mean more. I get some rich kids get tons of tutoring to help, but if you really wanted to, you can do well if you're capable.
I completely disagree with your statement regarding tests matter more.
It would not be fair to say that someone who scores highly on an exam is more deserving of an opportunity than someone who worked very hard to excel in High School for all four years.
However, with that being said, I do believe that someone who scores highly on an exam and is willing to work extremely hard in college deserves a chance to succeed.
@@michaeldejesus8234I personally do not believe that SATs should be required. Not because of race, but they are inaccurate metrics of one’s intelligence.
Not gonna lie, I had a little moisture in my eyes when the kid at 3:45 got his acceptance and how genuinely excited his classmates were! That reaction can only come by earning something fair and square, not having it handed to you because of the color of your skin!
I agree with you about earning stuff but need to tell you I witnessed the same type of reaction by a group of students that scammed their way into a particular college. They were screaming and cheering and dancing like crazy. All because they “gamed” the system to get into a college that wouldn’t take them based on their actual grades and test scores. None of them made it through their first year. Some of them then tried to get into the local community college but were told that they needed too much remedial classes. It was kind of sad but they got what they deserved.
These were the children of the people that cheered like crazy when OJ was found not guilty.
True
@@prepperjonpnw6482 I think this is that exact clip
Why allow only smart kids to give you money, when you can have all of them give you money.
Bingo. I bet we will see more govt subsidies and loans given with no requirements.
That’s what I was thinking
Because they get Government funding dependent upon grades, not to mention peer review recognition in papers and magazines, which recruits more students.
They could become an "easier" school, but the lower grades would mean less government funding, which means lowering tuition instead of raising it to "constantly meet demands".
@@tazjam12 well you know they are going to complain that little timmy not getting free money because his grades or bad or they will just make professor give every kid an A for skipping class.
Poor kids are just as smart as white kids...
"Test optional" - yeah try that in global competition.
Or in real life.
How far are you in life??? What kind of engineer are you? After college what are you contributing to the global competition.
The ACT and SAT testing is counterintuitive to how well you will do in your gender studies class.
@@noirekuroraigami2270 far enough to know if i expected things to be given to me just because, i would be very far. I'm where i am because I knew i had to work for it and earn it.
I mean the testing method is dogshit since students forget everything post test. This is just putting a bandaid over a severed limb. The best way is to change schooling completely.
ACT and SAT books are free to check out at the library...that is how I did it...my family was on welfare most of my life. The only way out of my situation was getting an education...Poverty is a great motivator LoL. Getting into college is not graduating college....there are plenty of colleges you can get into....but most students are not mentally, emotionally, or sadly academically prepared....." set up to fail" and basically reinforcing that they can not get ahead....
I’m good at testing but really bad at homework, the thing about schools today is that it doesn’t require intelligence to get a good grade, only viglience
100% agree. I'm in college now and you'd have to be not trying at all to fail out.
That has always been true. Schools have to cram a lot of basic knowledge in and only than can they start teaching scientific measure and how to learn. So good memory alone always was a worth at least a C
@@jc-ke3ll That's true, but in competitive classes you have to study hard to get good grades. If you're OK with Bs and Cs, you can get your participation award diploma, but if you want to standout among your peers you have to put in the work. You're not going to get As in 300-level Economics and Chemistry courses just by showing up.
That fucking TEDtalk had me rolling on the floor. "If you make the barrier to entry easier, more people will enter" Like no shit Einstein.
You at least need a iq score to predict the results
It reminds me of George Carlin's rant about someday only needing a pencil to get into college.
And they still won’t succeed
We will then turn out more underwater basket weaving professionals.
@@josephstalin7389 A good IQ score is only a partial component (and a minor one, really) for being successful in college.
We were poor, but my mom got me study material for the ACT and made me take practice tests 6-7 times and the real test twice. Got into my first choice school, graduated recently and am now working as an engineer.
In the early 90's, it never occurred to me or my family that I ought to enroll in ACT/SAT test prep courses. I prepared using free materials plus perhaps $50 of test prep books. I scored well and was awarded a 75% tuition scholarship at my preferred school (not much of a stretch in retrospect), an otherwise expensive private one. I've half-joked that I've yet to earn the equivalent hourly wage that I achieved from spending around 50 hours preparing for the ACT/SAT. My mother was a librarian, and my father was a janitor - hardly privileged by most standards (although I did not go without as a child). I did not attend a "competitive" high school at which I could have distinguished myself in the eyes of college recruiters. Required standardized testing has had a significantly positive impact on the course of my life.
the woke clan saying that SAT scores are biased or racist because 'richer' or 'whiter' kids 'get to' study for it is a complete sham. They know that white and asian students are just smarter blacks & hispanics so they are trying to ram rod in a bunch of dumb students that don't belong in top tier schools.. the result is they will no longer be top tier schools.
Home schooled, poor, my IQ is 136. Get ur kids OUT! Schools are compromised
Good for you
@@samk2266 What
I was quite unmotivated in my high school studies. Got grades in the 70s or low 80s, except math and science where I got the occasional high 80s/low 90s mixed in. No extracurricular activities at all, except the after school jobs that don't show up on transcripts.
I also scored >98th percentile in my Math SAT and >85th percentile in Verbal. Without those test scores, I do not get accepted into the program where I earned my BS Engineering degree and the career that it enabled.
And nobody in my alma mater's Admissions Department knew my race, because that information was not relevant to their decision.
So let's make things easier for those who haven't spent the time to study and work hard. Teach your children to not work hard to get ahead. Great world we are living in.
With 51% of the US population getting some sort of government handout (they call it assistance) Sadly we've already reached the turning point towards Socialism.,
My biggest regret in life is seeing to it that our three daughters went to college. They went from logic and intelligence to feelings and myths. The problem with colleges is that they now focus on emotions created by false narratives.
David, they may get back to sanity. Introduce to works by Thomas Sowell, Carol Swain, Walter E. Williams, Andy Ngo & the Walkaway Campaign by Brandon Straka, as a starter. God Bless!!!
Eastern Europe is best place in the world to live right now
You should have looked closer at those colleges' curricula, David. I know, this was probably a while ago before the leftist domination of colleges became widely known.
People come out of our education system with fraudulent educations. The longer they spend time in university, I have noticed that the worse their ability to comprehend written or spoken words is. I have spent some time as an employer, and the people with less college education have almost always performed better then those with more. It's a joke. They do not teach any meaningful critical thinking skills, and dont just ended up with years of their life wasted, it's far worse. They have years of their life conditioning them into complete idiots.
@@cici79 That is the kind of material we provided at home.
"I don't understand why kids keep failing out. It's like they're not prepared for the rigors of a prestigious university!"
I went to college after the military and barely pulled off a B average in high school. I knew I needed to pick up the slack. Low SAT scores too. I knew part of me getting into the school was being a minority. I had to work my butt off just to pull off a B average. Meanwhile I knew kids who had SAT scores in the 1400s and above with perfect GPAs who didn’t last a year. Sometimes it’s about the scores. Sometimes it’s laziness. Sometimes it’s the inability to tune out distractions. Race and privilege shouldn’t have anything to do with the equation.
Edit: I’m not disagreeing with you BTW. I’m just offering a certain perspective that tells you a ton of people shouldn’t be going to college even with good grades.
Don't worry, soon they'll attack colleges as being racist for failing a disproportionate amount of BIPOCs they forced through the door. At that point affirmative action will be extended to grading people based on more than just their work. Then, when you go see a doctor, you won't know if they actually passed med school based on achievements or if they were pushed through to fill a quota. Isn't collectivism just great.
@@wolfpack4128 can't wait for med school students to rise through the ranks through "social advancement" rather than doing the work. 😝
@@DroneDialogues Then do this... make student with low SAT scores provisional. If they don't score a 2.5 GPA or higher after the first year, they're out. Problem solved.
This is interesting, this comes at a very precarious time. I think both arguments are useless. The world is changing where now machine learning/(AI), automation, and freely accessible information and problem-solving power are threatening higher learning in general. With these factors, testing is an outdated system. But in general, information and how we learn via college may become outdated too. Google is already ditching college requirements, which is the platform that is hosting this video.
I think one thing forgotten about standardized test is that it also affects what kind of financial assistance you can get for college/universities. The better the score, the better chance you can get grants instead of loans, or at least back in the 90's.
I'm a writing tutor at a small technical college and some students have yet to master they're/there/their. I agree that we need to have a set standard of ability.
So glad I went to college in the early 2000s. Even then the wokeness was invading, but social media was luckily still in its infancy
I am 30 years old and if I was going to college today I don’t even know if I would make it through
Me too luckily. I saw the agenda in early 1999/2000 but it wasn't all consuming like it is now.
Yep you and me both. I graduated when Obama was elected. I wasn't really much into politics anyway but nevertheless it's been a massive downhill spiral ever since. And I went to college in a university in California
I, too, went to college in the early 2000's. It was painful to listen to woefully ignorant lectures at that time, but it is much worse today. Every facet of life has been infected by this leftist disease and we would all do well to combat it.
Same.
Im in college right now and as a conservative I've had to actively conceal my conservative values out of concern for social condemnation or reduced grades for not adhering to woke ideology. It's a scary time to be a conservative student.
Stay strong, stay conservative! You are not alone.
I couldnt imagine going to college these days as a conservative. I thought it was bad when I went to a liberal school back in the 90's. Its 100 times worse there now
probably best to not go to College at all. They dont teach anything useful anyway.
@@toeey14 I've been openly feminist screamed at. You know the ones... where it's just incoherent screaming.
Just walked past a protest and they saw I had a military patch on my backpack and they screamed I was a murderer.
Which immediately made me retaliate "oftly bold of you to attack someone you believe to be capable of killing people I don't like."
And she found a new victim once she realized I wasn't a victim lol
@@probablynotanagent5594 Unfortunately,I have to work on college campuses sometimes. Even colleges that still arent allowing in person schooling for most of the students. Yet the few people on campus are all masked up outside while walking alone. SAAAAAAAAFFFFFFFEEEEEE!
the most annoying thing about college is the useless classes you have to take in order to complete GE proportion of a college degree. As a accounting major why do i have to take biology, physics and art classes. I should be solely focusing on classes that would improve my understanding of my profession, hell i never had a class where we focused on the accounting software and how to use it. The only GE classes i could see being mandatory are writing, critical thinking and speech.
Getting a well rounded college education is good, but GE classes should be only a half semester mini class or something. Wasting 2 years on GE before you even start your major classes is ridiculous.
I am a teacher,which I say here to show I'm not just being cantankerous with this comment. There are always people who engineer their class schedules so that they take only classes like Drama 1,Art 1,Everything 1,so that they create a 4.0 or higher GPA when students taking Calculus or French 4 get B's because they are pursuing difficult knowledge and skills. There are also lots of students who share answers or just plain buy answers or take answers off the internet these days. It is significantly harder to fake an SAT.
"They lower the passing grades, the school looks good, everybody is happy, the IQ of the country slips another 2-3 points, and soon all you need to get into college is a ****ing pencil."
- George Carlin, Life is Worth Losing, 2005.
he is a genius
"You Got A Pencil? Get the **** in there, it's Physics."
People come out of our education system with fraudulent educations. The longer they spend time in university, I have noticed that the worse their ability to comprehend written or spoken words is. I have spent some time as an employer, and the people with less college education have almost always performed better then those with more. It's a joke. They do not teach any meaningful critical thinking skills, and dont just ended up with years of their life wasted, it's far worse. They have years of their life conditioning them into complete idiots.
@Scott Robinson i wouldn't doubt it, but now we have racist people who are just disagreeing with other's nowadays. You don't like Carlin? Become someone Smarter and Better.
@Scott Robinson He was Atheist all right. But he wasn't racist, and he sure as hell wasn't a Democrat.
Thomas Sowell spoke on this years ago. Opening Harvard, MIT and Princeton to lower performing students causes them to struggle and fail whereas if they went to a less demanding college they could excel, albeit at a different pace.
If they can even afford it. HAHA
This isn’t allowing unqualified students to get into these schools it’s getting rid of an unnecessary metric that’s not truly standardized
@@quentin8041 How exactly is it "not truly standardized"? Everyone gets the same questions which are scored the same... that's what "standardized" means.
The worst off are the ones who struggle and *don't* fail. They struggle, get expensive special services, and take 2-3 extra years (and extra loans) to graduate with a probably useless degree, then still underperform at the tasks they were ostensibly "prepared" for.
@@grantjohnson5785 very few people get useless degrees. Some people take longer to graduate because of the extra responsibilities they have for college.
Just get rid of schools altogether and give them a diploma and a degree. That’s next
yep basically that's where they are heading with the participation medals😁
I never took my SAT or ACT. I just transferred from a community college with my AA Transfer degree to Florida State University. I am now graduating with a BA in computer Science and im thinking about a masters in Computer Network and System administration. I've done all of this and my family is poor. There are other alternatives than to just take those tests. Community college transfer is also a good option.
Edit: In 2023 of May I recieved my Masters Degree in Computer Science with a focus in Computer Network and System Administration.
Elite engineering schools won't touch community college credits.
That's true. It's an affordable route that's less orthodox, but gets you to the same end point for far less money.
I do not support the SAT being a requirement. It takes away time and creativity from the students.
If you want to help someone, tell them the truth, if you want to help yourself, tell them what they want to hear.
Fairtest is also out to make money, oh, and universities are too
This “diversity” argument sounds like discrimination.
They are literally discriminating against people based on the colour of their skin. There's a word for that isn't there?
Mirror mirror on the wall, who the fartest of them all
You forgot the sign about kids going to their school of choice which would eliminate diversity because then kids would segregate themselves. You'd be back to square one with Blacks in one school, Whites in another and Asians in another, etc...with a very minor amount of diversity.
@@letsgoBrandon204 Something with an r I think... red... rap...report... ray... Ray Ban!
Agreed!
I like WGU. It is purely performance/test/achievement based. No feelings or minority privilege involved. And you need a minimum of 80% to pass each test/class. Your homework means nothing, it is all about how much you learned and how well you performed on the final test.
In person colleges let people pass that don't know the material but completed a bunch of assignments (busy work). That is why so many teacher candidates that I know (at least here in the Central valley in California) fail the CBEST, CSET and RICA tests multiple times. I passed on my first attempt. All 4s and two 3s and that was with taking ALL subjects at the same time (Multiple Subjects Teaching). The people I know that went to Fresno State, Fresno Pacific, and a couple other colleges all failed multiple times. (Most failed once on the CBEST and twice on the CSET). And yes, that included one of my Asian friends that failed the math CSET multiple times. He eventually passed on the third attempt, but has since been fired twice from teaching positions because of poor academic performance of his students.
Letting people in that aren't prepared isn't beneficial. Test scores are very telling for how well someone is likely to perform.
I actually agree with this. I never took the SAT because I was homeschooled and started taking college classes while I was still in high school. I declared high school graduation in my junior year and went to community college full time while working two jobs. I saved 20 thousand dollars over going to university, got my first two years of credits done at a 3.9 GPA, then transferred to Virginia Tech to finish my engineering degree. It took me a total of six years to get my undergrad done, but I had a great time, minimized debt, and got job experience. SAT was never even on the radar because graduating high school and transferring straight to university was too expensive to be an option for me. More should consider this education path, they wouldn't need the SAT.
Don't fool yourself, people are realizing that college degrees are worth less and less. Numbers and college attendance are going down and they want to keep them as high as they can. The pay scale for professors and the huge money machine that college sports has become, they need money to turn and burn. This is why they are slowly but surely stopping the use of tests to gain entrance into college. By the way, I have a master's degree.
I just wanna be a nurse, don't want extravagant building or prestige, why should I pay for them? Training and education, who the fuck cares about any of this other shit.
I don't believe it's because of that piece of paper, it's because the person is a hard worker and most likely would have made that much more even without the degree.
I think there is a difference between a good university and a diploma mill.
My longtime concern if this 'free college' bs continues is it will actually happen. What happens then? You'll see wages fall. No business will pay top level wages if they don't have to. Prospective employees who don't have loans to repay CAN work for less and why would you hire or continue to employ someone when you can get the same skillset for less.
I also have a Masters and I have been in roles where I am a hiring manager. The degree is used by many businesses in a few ways. One, it shows a commitment to your career. It doesn't really matter the school, just as long as its in a related field you are applying for a job. The second, it means you can be taught. The organization can show you how they do business and you will be willing to learn that method. If a position states "bachelors degree required" on a job description, the organization will most likely digitally trash any resume that doesn't state a degree on it and hence they never make it to HR or the hiring manager's desk.
Lols Imagine getting a doctor who got his license based on the color of his skin, not what he knows or how good his skillsets are. Or pilots. Or engineers. Omg
It’s already happening. Try being a white male and applying for anything competitive lol
@Coldheart Zero no it doesn't reagradless on who goes in to college professors do not change the curriculum to graduate engineers or doctors. Anyone has an equal shot at getting into competitive universities. Some people just want to make excuses for their failure to get accepted.
now imagine getting laid off that engineering job to be replaced by some guy across the world with a made up degree
Look at Stanford Medical school.
Yeah let’s get rid of the professional sports drafts too. It’s unfair that only the people who are good at it get to play and make lots of money.
When Thomas Sowell was teaching at Columbia he noticed that half of the black students were on academic probation. So he went to the department of admissions and found that the average black student was in the 75th percentile of SAT scores, while the average white student was in the 99th percentile.
I was lucky to work for a multinational company. I've been able to work with talented guys and gals from around the world. The PC people in this country that want to push "equal outcome" need to look outside our borders. Developing countries are very competitive, and promote their best and brightest. They come to us talented, with a great work ethic. We in the US keep this up, we'll be the ones wanting to emigrate to other countries to do their manual labor.
It’s not about hard work anymore, it’s about entitlement.
"School is boring!"
"No it's not!"
wouldn't see that kind of a reaction in a government run school...
That was staged!
@@UnschoolingCOM Prove it. Also, is he wrong?
@@jaycweingardt11 well it a 3 second sector so it prolly twisting the narrative
@@josephstalin7389 I wouldn't say probably but definitely could be staged!
I came from a government run school and it isn't boring. And we are supposed to be a third world country.
They wont flunk out of MIT, they'll cater a learning program just for them to succeed!
Like Dan Akroyd said to Bill Murray in GhostBusters..." You've never worked in the private sector, it's tough out there.....they expect results".
I've learned more from self learning, reading books,
the internet, and youtube,
than I ever did in college or school.
Unschooling
We'll just have to wait till the baby boom and gen X vested interests are retired or dead for things to change.
With the excessive amount of grade inflation in most high schools, the SAT’s are the only way for a good student to stand out.
I don't know what grade inflation you are talking about given that everyone I know struggle with classes in high school.
@@bluehotdog2610 It is far easier to get an "A" in high school now, than 10, 20, 30, 40+ years ago.
@@djm5687 Yet, young adults today are just as capable as adults several decades ago
@@bluehotdog2610 Young adults decades ago didn't need "migroagression trigger warnings" to get through life. Also, you had to *read books,* not just Google everything in order to do an assignment on a *typewriter* where you couldn't correct mistakes as easily. Math didn't used to allow formula sheets & graphing calculators.
Professors *confirm* that grade inflation exists. A "C" grade used to be considered average, now a "C" is considered mediocre because an "A" is easier to get.
@@djm5687 Then how come everyone I knew in high school had to pour hours and hours in their work, yet still can't get good grades?
When we interviewed people for engineering jobs where I worked we had no interest in what school they attended. Finding people who can learn after school is the key
My issues with colleges is that why am I in a mandatory philosophy class for my engineering major and why are there more writing classes than math ones?
I've decided today that lm going to identify as an engineer with a pay cheque of just over $150,000......this kind of statement use to be humorous about 2yrs ago, but now its the scary truth
I have been having a discussion with a kid from Australia on here about minimum wage. He asked: so kids out of college should only get minimum wage working at McDonalds ? I replied; Why should anyone get more money if you don't know what you are doing yet.....Go to school to learn it or work your way up to earn it. - He didn't want to hear it
No different from lowering mortgage requirements for 'disadvantaged' and then foreclosing later for payment failure.
It's almost like they want the MONEY from kids who can't even study for the SAT, and will quietly flunk out.
"Pretty soon all you need to get into school is a pencil. Get the **** in there, its physics." -George Carlin
I cannot believe how he predicted the future.
@4:00 "And if you eliminate the tests, you're just going to delay where it shows up elsewhere in this child's life."
Good luck! Thomas Sowell has been saying this and pointing it out for DECADES!
I agree that giving parents school choices is better! I’ve argued this for the last 20 years. My parents stuck me in public school, and it didn’t work for me. I didn’t fit into the environment at all, even after finding a program within public schools to change schools. Public schools have a mold and if the kid doesn’t fit that mold, they’re put to the side. I would’ve done better had I been homeschooled or if I would’ve had charter schools when I was a kid. Private was out of the question, they said, but even with scholarships, maybe that would’ve been the answer. I just couldn’t stand having to go to class. I was frequently bullied by teachers, not students. I was called stupid, an idiot, they called me names, they mocked my work in front of the other students. I would tell my parents, and then my mom would show up and raised hell, which only made them hate me more and pick more on me. I often asked to change schools. My requests fell on deaf ears. I grew up having many insecurities and I came to hate school. I learned from my experience. My kids are going to be homeschooled, and if charter is an option in our area, I will definitely explore that option for them.
I work at a resort gift shop, and I get astonished every time on daily basis, when children age up to 12+ CAN'T COUNT MONEY. I often get a pile of bills, crumbled in a knot, much more than needed, OR they give me less. I strongly dislike American education. I did homeschool my son who was born in America here, and we did much better in math than reg, school. When I had to send him to school in 5th grade, he was TWO YEARS AHEAD of what they were doing. It was a lost year. But we picked up after.
When l was in high school l barely graduated, due to an abusive household. Would have to stay up most nights to protect my mother and sisters. Scored high enough on the SAT to get a scholarship.
exactly my point. These woke people are just using "good intention" knowingly aware that it actually helps the rich elites. Look at the 1:27, the man with the "fair test" knows he's wrong. His body language is plain guilt.
Proud of you!
I'm so sorry to hear about your situation. I went to a terrible high school. The whimsical grading was appalling. One teacher actually did flunk every student in each of her classes, merely because that teacher had failed to explain the assignment. However, the rougher kids could threaten teachers and get their D turned into an A, but this left those teachers peeved, so they tried to regain their sense of authority by finding some reason to downgrade shy, nerdy kids. I kid you not. I got an A on a creative project and, when I admitted to the teacher I had initially intended to do more, he changed my grade to a D because I had not done what I described, though he had originally given me an A. Yes, it was Stupidity High, and my parents were also entirely unhelpful (they didn't want to have to pay for college). Many high schoolers also face the stress of "group projects" for which they earn "group grades", so kids who aren't college bound can cost the kids who are. No standardized test is that arbitrary. I also scored high enough on the SAT to earn college scholarships, despite my odd report card (filled almost entirely with A's and D's, though fortunately mostly A's).
Congratulations on achieving your goal of college even with adversities
lol
I dropped OUT of their stupid system.
I'm not from the US so the racial thing is just shocking to me
How is that even possible there is no class action lawsuit for racial discrimination against college who do this
It's textbook definition on treating people differently based on race
There have been multiple lawsuits over the last twenty years. They mostly involve Asians who are denied entry into putatively prestigious universities, i.e., Harvard, Yale, Princeton, U.C. Berkeley, Stanford, and Michigan. All of these schools have been sued for discrimination. The problem is that even in defeat these schools only become more discriminatory and hide their prejudices under the filthy rug of leftist tropes - inclusion, diversity, privilege, and whiteness are all examples.
Not enough students come forward. A lawsuit was tried by a few Asians against Harvard and failed. The judges didn't say Harvard doesn't discriminate racially against Asians (or whites), rather that there wasn't enough evidence Harvard racially discriminated against those specific few plaintiffs in the lawsuit. A proper lawsuit will need a lot more plaintiffs as part of it to establish the pattern the courts and public know is true. The catch though is racially rejected Asian and white applicants simply enroll elsewhere and get on with their lives, so it's tough to get them to be part of a suit. And the social climate in the US is such that if you complain as an Asian or white person in the US, you're shamed and ridiculed, possibly doxed.
@@donquijote6030 Well said. That was a beautiful paragraph.
@@ryanscottnix - Thank you, sir.
Let's eliminate grades, tests and evaluation of any kind. That way students get admitted and earn a degree without ever attending class or doing any work! Great for self esteem.
The straight F's I made back in the day are starting to look better.
Education starts at home. The color of ones skin does not matter. It's the attitude of the students that's in question.
It's not all rainbow and sunshine
Attitude of the students and involvement (and ability) of the parents.
People come out of our education system with fraudulent educations. The longer they spend time in university, I have noticed that the worse their ability to comprehend written or spoken words is. I have spent some time as an employer, and the people with less college education have almost always performed better then those with more. It's a joke. They do not teach any meaningful critical thinking skills, and dont just ended up with years of their life wasted, it's far worse. They have years of their life conditioning them into complete idiots.
@@testtest8798 exactely. College makes these Idiots dumber and dumber. Everyone who is smart skips College. Skipping College is a sign of high Intelligence 👍
"Pretty soon all you'll need to get into a college is a fuckin' pencil!" -George Carlin
George Carlin, his words are timeless
Nope. To make a pencil you have to kill trees. The production of one pencil will kill thousands of little birds. Graphite in pencils not carbon friendly. Better to use crayons in all of these woke colleges.
It hit it on the nail. I miss George.
Or an IPad
lol
Don’t you have to pick and skin color AND gender then just pick both that will get you in the college you want.
I believe in standardized tests because that's is the only way you can accurately compare students from different places. But I believe the SAT and ACT can be improved to more accurately measure intelligence or assess skills.
I hear this line a lot these days:
"just follow the money"
Yep
Graduated high school and went on to get an associates at community college. After CC I went on to transfer to a university. I truly feel like the money I spend for university isn’t worth it. The education system in America is broken. I manage to avoid getting myself into politics in school but so many professors always bring it up. I’ve got one year left and sometimes I want to quit because I’m not getting my money’s worth. It sucks when you know deep within yourself that college is money racket but you’ve got to finish just for that piece of paper to be competitive in corporate America.
tháts a sad situation
@@KienThucDoDay Big sad
Sorry to hear! Totally agreed that the college is a total scam- especially if someone need to take out a loan for it. Higher education is about to disrupt also fueled by the pandemic. You need skills to have a career in life, not some teaching by old dinosaurs or some paper credential. Someone once said, What is one thing you overpaid, with no guaranteed, and can't be refunded. And if you took out debt, it can't be forgiven... College.
Couldn't agree more.
well that's the thing, as fake as the paper is, ur still gonna be better off on average with that paper. I think u should only quit school when ur sure there's something better u can do without a degree. Yea school may suck and be expensive, but maybe quitting will make you even worse off.
I did much better in community college than high school. High school has social distractions and students are there because they have to be. I for one have never been good at doing homework and was a C average student. I went to community college on my own accord, and felt more responsible for my actions. Other than calculus, I did quite well in my other classes.
My son was struggling in high school but he excelled in college now his a software engineer working for a telecom company.
I’m gonna say a big truth pill. It’s not to help low performing kids. It’s to make more kids apply. However, the acceptance amount is the same. This makes the acceptance rate lower, and makes the school look better as a result
Or, alternatively, they want the increase merit based scholarships to students who don't deserve them so they can get them enrolled, give them a discount for a semester or two, and then reap in full tuition costs from students who might have chosen a different school. My university did something similar. They allowed people to change classes to pass/no pass in Spring 2020 to make up for covid-19 disruptions and then when grades slipped even more in the fall, got rid of that policy. They also added an online course fee for each online class and then stopped offering in-person classes.
With the quality of the student diminished the school looks worse.
That's only the 1st step. The 2nd step is to get as many freshmen to drop out as possible so they'll have gotten tuition money without having to actually educate them and give them a degree. Looks to me like they're trying to swindle the students that wouldn't have tested well. And this time they're targeting minorities and calling it wokeness. What a joke.
yeah its gonna increase tuition, more entry level jobs are seeing rise of students in college and will now make it a requirement even they are gonna be paying only minimum wage. thus now will cut out a large portion of Americans that didnt choose the college life and they wont be able to find jobs or high schoolers looking for some extra cash will be cut out cause businesses are gonna be requiring college experience
It's been true throughout history that any group that excels above the rest will be envied, resented, and hated by the other groups who will then seek to bring them down rather than emulate what made them successful.
If you have to step on someone's head and drown them to save yourself were you actually better?? No. Stop lowering the standards and find out what is holding the other students back and help fix the gap. Its sad what is happening
@@meghanconlon2037 My point exactly. Thank you.
@clam digger Yes they are. Spot on.
@clam digger The argument against that is, many of the jobs that earn big salaries are not important, and many of the jobs that are important (nurses, firefighters) are not paid according to their worth. I agree that simply taxing the rich is not the answer, but many people who aren't rich are far from stupid or lazy. They're usually the ones trying to pay their way, though, not asking for handouts and special treatment.
@@LynxSouth nurses make a helluva lot of money. I don't know what you're smoking, but can I get some?
The American Medical Association's New Medical School Test and Grades Standards, have been Lowered for 'Applicates based on their Color'! And it's also now harder for 'whyte' students with better grades/test scores!
You know honestly with my three learning disabilities and attending a lousy public school I didn't do very well on my SAT scores but I did pretty well in college.
I was fortunate enough to attend a private Christian University which has a good history and basically I relearned everything I should have learned in high school and then majored in my major and I graduated with pretty decent grades.
I didn't go into anything like medicine or law or anything like that I actually studied to be a diplomat which basically prepared me to be a self-supported missionary and I do various kinds of ministries in Taiwan yeah.
I do teach English but I prefer tutoring. I'm not outgoing person but I do help people who have gone through traumatic events in their life.
I'm trained in counseling inner healing and deliverance and I've done pretty much all of these things through the power of God.
When I'm not doing that I'm putting people through school or supporting people financially who need some help and eventually can overcome their obstacle.
Usually these are people who are working and they just need a little help.
Honestly we're moving placement test for universities that's not good. We already have schools that are underperforming in all 50 states California is the lowest which ironically is where I grew up
The results of this are already showing in society. Keep up the great work dumbing down the human race!
Colleges make huge amounts of cash by over-stuffing the freshmen class. They want most freshmen to drop out, so they don't have to spend any money expanding the college to handle bigger sophomore and up classes. It's not a secret. They've been doing it forever and everyone knows they've been doing it forever.
Harvard's endowment is over 40 billion. American colleges have become a joke. People are too hyper-fixated on prestige.
A sad reality - also applies to their noncredit prerequisites
1) Ban questions about race in college admissions applications
2) Give everyone a voucher to spend on SAT test prep classes
I was a C average in high school, mainly cuz I didn't care and just wanted to be done. I didn't go to college, but when I went to trade school I held an A+ the whole time, I was the first HVAC student at my school to make student of the month. Student of the month was out of the entire campus. Public school didn't prepare me for life as an adult, I was 30yrs old by the time I "got my shit together", basically had to get addicted to drugs, tour with my band and see the country, and cheat on my family to figure out what I was doing wasn't working. (Hit rock bottom) Now we own our first home and we're back together as a family, I really had to prove myself. Now I stand to inherit a $500k a year hvac business, my boss said he had his best year ever when I finished my first year with him. We are #1 in sales from our distributor, the year before it was the last company that I worked for. That company got voted "favorite" in our local papers best of category. Now my current boss on top in Google reveiws. Basically I've been to the top sellers dinner multiple times and have been sent to Jamaica for it. I went to Jamaica on 01/22/20 and came home to covid.
I think a point is missed here. Once they get these poor performing students into these schools where they then fail to perform the result won't be that they "flunk out" or even "struggle". No these schools will then decide that their own curriculum is just not woke enough and fair, so they will dumb down the requirements for their degrees until these poor performing students are able to graduate and then the real problems begin when one of these students with an engineering degree makes a fatal mistake that causes a bridge or building collapse or one of them becomes a doctor and due to their poor abilities end up harming or killing multiple patients. That is the inevitable result of this continued dumbing down of standards. You aren't trying to help individual work to achieve if you never let them fail or you ensure the standards are so low they can do anything and go anywhere. Each person has specific skills and abilities with which they will accel and it doesn't always means going to a specific college or even attending college at all.
The reason why I had shitty grades in highschool was because I had to work to feed myself. Straight A students were home studying and all. Now I have a 6 figure salary while most of my straight A friends are still paying student loans and have crappy jobs.
I think the ability to keep learning and to put in effort is way better than grades. I have some friends that dropped out and still working at minimum wage jobs in their late 20s. I got rejected to rejected to most of the schools to the University of CA system, and I think that was a good eye opener that even if you get in, doesn't mean that you'll get good grades and not drop out. I think commitment and effort will carry you the furthest whether or not you go to school.
I never made it to 6 figures, but I retired at 57.
To each his own.
Yeah, my dad needed my minimum wage job to help pay the bills from my alcoholic step-mother.
I got into college with a partial scholarship because of my test scores. I dropped out though since I basically landed the job I wanted while still in school. Best decision I made. I worked all through college to pay for the remainder. I had no debt after 3 semesters. I left with a 3.8 GPA. I'm pulling 6 figures now and my wife, who had a similar dysfunctional family life, makes about double what I do. She did graduate and got her MBA while I worked to pay the bills. She worked for the college, and I covered the rest. We only had to pay for 1 semester of her MBA.
I discovered if I Trail Blaze my own path to $$$ I WIN!! If i try to follow others advice I cant make as much money. I found that being in CONTROL of my own destiny has taken me down a very successful path!! :) I'm Happier :)
@@babydriver8134 :)
Keep it up John, you're a man of integrity.
This was bound to happen. In an era where children get trophies at sports events just for participating, it would only be a matter of time before universities wouldn't even care about merit anymore.
Hearing how the first man said the tests are ineffective enraged me. I went to a mediocre school in the rural south. Had I not done extremely well on my ACT I would probably have not gotten into colleges. I have a full ride to a large state school, and I’m about to graduate as an aerospace engineer. Truly infuriating
No need to test children, we're just judging them on skin color now.
I do wish CollegeBoard didn't have a monopoly over things like AP and standardized testing
My daughter didn't take SAT bc she was in a trade program. She's now majoring in creative writing at a state school. That's right. A public 4-year NY college accepted her based on her grades and writing sample.
Wokeness has become the new narcissism. "Look at me, I'm woke, too!"
It should be "Unwoke"!
Indeed
ikr
@@Senwos ,
That's the best you've got? Haven't you heard? Dull is boring and boring is dull.
Being"woke" is a mental disorder
I sure wish I didn't have to study and take the government exam for my Journeyman ticket as as an Electrician. Think of all the time time I could have saved by not going to trade school.
What's a false equivalence?
Imagine if instead of letting anyone start working as an apprentice they have a test to see if you'll maybe be allowed to try... totally not the same as becoming licensed to do a job chief.
@@franklinrichards6559 now imagine letting people into colleges who can't do the work, they then drop out with student debt.
The thing about statistics is that you can interpret them to fit one narrative or the other. Same raw data but different analysis reveals your truth. He convinced himself he’s right through science but fails to realize the common sense aspect or qualitative results.
@@xmalcom650 But what if we make college free?? In the land of woketardia everything is free, free, freeeeeee!
I love how Asians aren’t even considered people here lol
I did well on the sat and bad in classes. The teachers are way more biased than standardized tests...
How funny I just got fed up with the system and literally said “I wounded what Stossel has to say about this”
Hahaha good ole autocorrect made your sentence have an odd meaning but I get what you meant.
wounded is a great song by third eye blind
@@johnglue1744 lol wow, when I read it at first, my brain must have just autocorrected to what I assume he meant, replacing "wounded" with "wondered" so I didn't even notice, that's pretty neat that our brains can do that! :D
More people in = more cash in.
Don’t care if they’re prepared to pass or fail.
Pile up those student loans. It's a no money back guarantee.
@@MikeJones-rk1un or just no money.....whose going to pay back all those loans?
@@RobMcGrath0 The students will get nothing back for their college costs and student loans are big business these days.
colleges could make it easier to graduate
@@QuadCloudNine I hope you are kidding.
My ACT scores landed me a pretty decent scholarship to Westminster tech. I can see getting rid of SAT/ACT for maybe Liberal Arts colleges but not technical or anything that requires actual knowledge. Like Engineering.
I took the ACT twice before college and then took the GRE & GMAT for grad school. I've talked to schools that tried to "sell the school" on not having to take the entrance exams and I didn't see that as a good thing.
"If we lower the standards, more people will get in :)"
That absolute gall of these people
The irony that they’re more focus on race versus focusing on student’s success.
People come out of our education system with fraudulent educations. The longer they spend time in university, I have noticed that the worse their ability to comprehend written or spoken words is. I have spent some time as an employer, and the people with less college education have almost always performed better then those with more. It's a joke. They do not teach any meaningful critical thinking skills, and dont just ended up with years of their life wasted, it's far worse. They have years of their life conditioning them into complete idiots.
@@testtest8798 agreed, critical thinking course should be a taught back in school.
Stunning the numbers of ways people find to "help" other people which turn out to be complete failures. Success comes from hard work, perseverance, knowledge, and striving to be the best; setting artificial goals helps no one.
Please keep shining the light!
I was average in high school (C+) because of the subject matter and the social stigma of being smart. My SAT's were above average and got me into university, in which I graduated. School incorporates many factors and externalities that affect education
I left college after 1.5yrs, now i work construction overseas and can make 6 figures working for a bunch of degree holders who cant tell their ass from a hole in the ground. No one on this earth could pay me to go to university!
Foreigner students have low SAT and ACT but the schools need their money.
Thank you John for reporting on the truth! You have always been my public speaking role model! (I was a speech/ debater in high school and watched your videos before competitions.) This is so true. I did not have much growing up, and standardized tests allowed me to stand out from other kids. I never received paid tutoring, but I went to some free SAT workshops at public libraries. I worked really hard as a student. I am a physician now. If it weren't for standardized tests, I wouldn't be where I am today. It's so inappropriate for people to discredit the hard work of individuals by saying they got in just because of their race or money. We are harming kids of all races when we get rid of standards for all.
When too many kids fail to graduate college they will call for final exams to be ditched and just have the fact that you attended for a few years as enough to graduate. Here is your Dr. certificate Good Luck out there.
That's scary to think about.
I think you mean good luck to your patients out there.
heck they kind of already do this... so many professors grade on their own "bell curves" where even if an entire class fails horribly, they'll still pass with As and Bs
I'm encouraging my young children to not let schooling get in the way of their education. I'm teaching them that hard work pays off. I'm teaching them that they are in not in control of the outcomes, but they're 100% in control of the effort put forth. I'm telling them that when things don't work out, to not blame others, but look in the mirror and ask themselves what could they have done differently to effect the outcomes.
Keep at it, it sure pays off for them, you'll be proud.
It's education for educations sake. A college degree is like any other currency, its value stems from rarity. If everybody has a college degree, it becomes meaningless as a way of gauging competence. Thereby denying the lower strata any means of advancement.
Keep up the great work Stossel