JJ Reacts To Team USA's Disappointing Finish At The 2023 FIBA World Cup
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- čas přidán 10. 09. 2023
- Today on The Old Man and The Three Things, JJ and Tommy react to Team USA's finish at the 2023 FIBA World Cup. First JJ takes us on a history lesson about how we've finished in past World Cups. Then the guys talk about what we've learned from this group, the international game and what we hope to do in the future. Finally, JJ goes on a classic rant about people crapping on this Team USA group.
Subscribe to The Old Man and The Three podcast w/ JJ Redick (ESPN / First Take) and Tommy Alter CZcams channel today for more NBA analysis, player interviews and highlights. - Sport
I honestly think the average American player is not excited to play for the national team, whereas in other parts of the World playing for the National team is the biggest honor. This is a cultural thing.
I agree.
Considering the climate and culture in America I can understand why…
Well a majority of American players are black and our country United States tends do not give a damn about black folks so not the most appealing thing to want to represent a racist crooked azz country.
No it's not. Americans are not obligated to play for their national team. Mbappe says "nah, I'm skipping the Euros?" He never plays for France again. Americans who are there are by choice.
Americans have a very difficult time remembering the terms of the 13th amendment, which basically says you cannot be forced to do a job unless that job is fighting a war.
Also, let's not forget, half of Americans are traitors. We saw it Jan 6th. Sure, a bunch of those people think it's 1987 or something again, where you can just resume the USA! chants, and we will forget about how in 2018 they were absolutely ok with Russian interference, or being the beneficiaries of a violent, organized coup.
A bunch of them don't care about the rest of the world. A bunch of them wanted , ha, ha, ha, to build walls to keep the rest of the world out, while remaining subservient to them, which is not how empires work, which is what they think they have.
And, of course, I would be remiss in not pointing out how many of the attitudes of the 1820's still are very active in any discussion involving black people, and I'm not just talking about the "trading block."
That’s the best comment I‘ve seen all day.
I love it how he assumes the rest of the world and international NBA players don't have those "excuses", only american NBA players do.
Very valid point
FACTS, 3 of the top 8 teams missed big time players, and half of the top 16 teams missed one or two stars too. some americans cry a lot...
did you not here what he said, nba players playing for international teams are going to have the ball in their hand more so than they did in the nba because as a whole team it isn't as talented as u.s., and it isn't. Also like brandon ingram is all nba player in the nba but on the national team he was on the bench because the roster is so talented, but put him on germany hes having a dennis schroder type of tournament just because he would have the ball more
@@n8tethegr8t20 then why not give non-star US players a chance. I am sure they will equally do well
hahaha true. just another shade of american arrogance.
German here. The obvious reason behind this victory, or probably any victory in any team sport, is the team. Our guys played together for many years, Dennis and Daniel know each other since they were children and, back then, played together as well. The US picks different players for every tournament and throws them into training camp for 5 weeks. That's not how you form a team. You can't expect to win the Worldcup in a team sport without a team, even though, individually, your players are by far the best. Simple as that.
Hypothetically, which NBA team would you say has the best chemistry that could come close to the chemistry that international players have developed on their national teams? Current teams (or historically for fun). Like would it be the Warriors?
@@phitran53362023 Nuggets, 2014 Spurs had some of the best chemistry I’ve ever seen
I hope USA doesn't win a medal again in France just like in the Philippines.
I noticed that the years changed, this was possibly the best FIBA tournament yet, it was a pretty fair playing field, the world is definitely catching up
This world cup ruled
First time watching it, only nba before…so good with great games and loads of excitement. FIBA is all about team!
@@jahoncourt
All your best players are ball dominate and also you don’t have any bigs lmao. It’s over for USA. Keep bringing the excuses.
@@jahoncourt Americans keep making that excuse. It's not our fault your best players didn't show up. Put the blame on your patriotic American players. 😏
@@jahoncourtbet
Shout out to Luka Doncic for representing his country in the World Cup as a superstar in the NBA. Much respect!
lol
Like kobe said, no defense anymore.
NBA has lost the basketball fundamentals.
Thanks to the Warriors. No hand checking
Exposed 😂😂😂
@@lbmclean😂😂he just glazed tf out luka
Shout out to the FIBA refs for not being influenced by Luka's constant crying and issuing him technical fouls. Extremely talented constant whiner.
@@settrenderhe sucking the hell outta man’s tip pause
International players can play in the NBA but our players cant adapt to International play..All i hear is excuses
EXACT!
What are you talking about my pops and pother teammates I know thrivw in other countries overseas and hope till retirement there... why you think there's so many like
BenSimmons and Kobe who dad played overseas and was the superstar....
My biggest gripe about American basketball is there is no defense. Continuity is a small issue to me. Rebounding & defense are under appreciated today. Can't just play offense and win.
The USA's defensive effort, preparedness and execution in the game vs Lithuania was not good. The guys out there were not in the same league in terms of BB IQ and hustle as all-stars who played on Team USA in the past -- Lebron, Kobe, Chris Paul, Dwayne Wade, Pippen, Jordan, ... The USA has very good coaches. I think the players this year just don't represent the top BB IQ and talent among American players in the past 20 years.
Shout out to to SGA for representing his country in the World Cup as a superstar in the NBA. Much respect!
100 likes for that 🙂He is true player and one of the biggest reason Canada to get that Pronze. Its way betteer than 4th or 32.
Well, it was about time Canada sends their best players...
@@radovanprstojevic1060 they didnt send there best. Portland will be bad this year but look at shaedon sharpe playing. And mathurin in Indiana, and wiggins " Murray ;)
Cameroon never played a single basketball game with Embiid, Siakam or even Koloko…So…every team has that problem…we don’t cry about it. If they have better things to do than represent their country, is up to them.
When we loose, we loose, we don’t say..yeah but!…
And they become Michael Jordan for what you said yes! But in the NBA, it’s a job. In national team, it’s a pride thing. Motivation comes easily
Word!
@@oo70mar I really think Lebron, Durant, Tatum, Lavine, Steph etc…can beat anybody..but it doesn’t matter if you can’t convince them to play. You are at the level of the one you CAN convince. Because the whole goal is to show up first on the court and then in the game.
@@fisheye375 They would not beat best FIBA teams without they best game. Remember other countrys has much better teams also. Much more bigger and stronger than US can have. US even with they best roster can be beaten. There are 6-8 countrys who can beat Usa in good day. Mostly u do have size problem Ayo is not really big. FIBA courts size does matter. Off rebounds are huge. Jokic will pick them over any other team alone.
@@harrikuusjarvi3795 i don’t think there is a team in earth who can beat a team consistently with curry, Tatum durant lebron and Anthony Davis with a bench with bam Adebayo, Marcus morris, ja morant , jallen brown Marcus smart , KAT and Jarrett Allen. It can happens but…others teams need to be every time on their A game. The real problem is to being able to convince all those people to come and compete.
Why they dont play for ur country?
Obviously we did not have our best lineup. But we were easily the most talented and athletic team in the tournament. The US got outplayed, out-coached, and out-hustled in each loss
So you need some current top 75 nba players all time and prob 100-150 all time just to defeat a Germany team lead by Schroeder....
International teams are just better than a typical average NBA team.. you need an allstart team to presumably win it all... nba players are the most talented individually but international players are most exposed in playing in different ways
@@Kilgore2k12 No I actually believe this team was talented enough to beat Germany. But IMO Germany outplayed and out-coached the US… whether it is was on the coaching or the players they did not bring the necessary intensity on defense
@@Kilgore2k12 No excuses for the US though. Germany played better and deserved the chip
I would say arguebly.
The whole "I have to play a lot, so I'm not going to play FIBA and Olympics b2b" excuse isn't valid to me because teams like Canada and Germany had NBA players show up and committed for both tournaments.
Yup u see a lot of International players still play for their team. And it makes u ask, why aren’t those players making all those excuses that NBA players do? Jokic is a Center and has probably played more minutes than any player in the NBA in the last 4yrs… and not once have we heard him complain? They act like they gotta work construction and work as dishwashers at night. I don’t know what’s more pathetic, the players or the excuses they have for losing?
@@siner2442Jokic didn't play in FIBA. What was his excuse?
@@jaxfor3 he just had a championship run and wanted to rest. Pretty valid, but a lot of Serbians went up in arms about it. But tell me now, how many American stars had a finals run? Oh and the other relevant Serbian NBAer, Bogdan Bogdanovic, showed up to play.
@@jaxfor3 what player has played more basketball than Jokic in the last 4yrs? He legit needs a break
@@siner2442so basically the same excuse as the American stars
So tired of the "we're not sending our best" argument, it's a cheap excuse and ignores the obvious which is that Americans don't know how to play team basketball anymore
Serbia didn’t send their best players and still made it to the final
EXACT, LIKE CANADA AND SPAIN!
Not the same
I'm just hearing biased excuses. Some of these points apply to all the teams, not just team USA.
USA didn't send any of their best players lol. How does that apply to both teams?
What is wrong with Americans 😂
@@tyler-hp7oq did Jokic play? Other teams had guys sitting too. Not to mention the best US players that didn’t go are over 35
@@tyler-hp7oq Canada didn't have Wiggins and Murray, Greece didn't have Giannis, Serbia didn't have Jokic etc... sad excuse that USA didn't win lol
This point is valid. You Americans are lacking facts. Serbia missed 4 out of its 5 best players. Germany missed two elite big men. Spain missed 3 top players. And the list goes on
Every player other than Schröder, Franz and maybe Obst had to accept a lesser on the national team. Those players are stars in their European clubs.
The main reason Germany beat team USA and eventually won the world cup is they were the best TEAM.
EXACT.
I don't remember last time i enjoyed watching basketball so much like this WC. It's way more beautifull then what NBA basketball is becoming.
The fact that the USA can't be bothered to send their best team to a world championship should not be taken against their opposition. If anything, it shows how little respect USA BASKETBALL has for the game. Shameful.
It’s just too much games for top USA nba players. Does any other professional leagues in the world play 81 games in regular season? Plus minimum of 16 games of playoffs. That’s like 97 games a season minimum.
I’m ok with sending the best team to Olympic and FIBA as a tournament for the youngest.
Not USA basketball. Nba players don't respect the game like they should.
It's just a qualifying tournament. Are you mad Yokic didn't play?
Like kobe said, no defense anymore.
NBA has lost the basketball fundamentals.
Thanks to the Warriors. No hand checking
Exposed 😂😂😂
@@nathaniel23946 That´s a BS take. European NBA players, even superstars like Doncic, play in FIBA tournaments. It´s more a US player mentality problem, than a NBA problem.
Spaniard here, going back to JJ's point about players assuming different roles when they get asked to participate for their national teams, I don't believe it's the best phrasing for it. The spanish team with Rudy, Juan Carlos, Pau, Marc, etc was a team, they all bought into the idea of being a team and played as such. Navarro had games were he would go nuts and next game it was Llull, Rudy, Ricky or even Felipe Reyes. The only player that was consistent in being a dominant figure almost every game was Pau, but even he had no problem being a 3rd guy when the other players were popping off. They also spend a lot of time playing together and had a structure behind it, which I believe it's what USA lacks off and most of the time get by games just through pure talent (which is exciting to see no doubt) and that can be inconsistent, specially when every player on every other national team knows very well what you're capable off, while most americans don't know who half of the other roster are (or at least that's the impression we get, correct me if I'm mistaken).
About being overcritical with the national team I believe that's something we all do, spanish teams from the last decade have been butchered even after winning gold in a championship, everyone likes to analize and show how clever they are (myself included, but mostly among friends haha), but USA having a bigger target and bigger expectations takes those comments more seriously than they should, at least imo.
Good luck on your next tournaments and I wish to see y'all on the olympics finals against us :P we'd love to take our revenge.
Most underrated comment! 👏👏👏
@@Practical_Noob_8833 everything you said is spot on because as an American who has played overseas this is exactly the problem. Americans get very egotistical and selfish and don’t understand how to be a dominant individual player within a team concept. They just can’t wrap their head around it. Thank God I’m not one of those bombs, and I can actually see through the façade and play the game the right way. But it is incredibly frustrating playing with fellow Americans because they just don’t have fundamentals. If they don’t have the ball in their hands, they are basically useless. Real basketball players can do everything and that’s how most European guys are they can move without the ball and they have the fundamentals.
Pocos españoles tienen tan bien nivel de inglés jajajaja. Por lo que respecta a tu comentario, estoy totalmente de acuerdo. También añadir que la mayoría de los jugadores que han traído son jóvenes y aunque por talento vayan sobrados quizás aún no tenían la suficiente madurez mental como para liderar y entender el baloncesto FIBA.
Si a eso le sumas el cambio de reglas que se nota muchísimo si no llevan a sus mejores jugadores para compensar todo lo que has dicho ya no son capaces de ganar
I’m a 45 year old American. Trust me that these younger kids here don’t have the same passion or pride as the generation that Michael Jordan was in. They’re only focused on $$$ and fame.
The "we are not sending our best players" arguments get short when you realise that many opponent teams missed several best players and that the US loss to teams which best players have a lesser "NBA status" than the worst players of the US roster. It should make the US think about the real winning impact of some NBA "mini stars" which are famous almost only for their scoring
JJ said “it wasn’t an effort issue” but if you watch them stand there and look at the rebound and not box out the effort looks poor. Other issues are that US players don’t know how to play in the post and definitely don’t know how to defend the post, too much reliance on isolation and not enough off ball movement.
As a fellow American, I've got to say.....nah, JJ. Stop with the excuses! Our team failed MASSIVELY in this World Cup. Obligations should include PLAYING FOR YOUR COUNTRY when called upon to do so, and adequately preparing for that responsibility. I'm sure other countries' teams have guys with a variety of career and sponsor obligations, even if they're non-NBA pro players. This subpar performance is simply unacceptable! Team USA better get it together for next year's Olympics.......
When he started off the "your asking alot of these guys" I was actually done with the conversation.
EXACT: the better young usa boys of nba lost against lithuania, germany and canada. NO EXCUSES!
As a german, I was really surprised how bad the defense of the U.S. team was . Of course they played small , therefore a lack of rebounding was predictable. But these guys were lacking true fundamentals, such as boxing out for defensive rebounds. The offense and the chenistry seemed just fine, but its the defense they are gonna have to change for the Paris olympics
Edwards was just lazy from both losses at the end of the tournament.
Americans critzed AR for his 1-1-defense, but the real problems had been other guys, which let player in their back without recognizing it. Edwards for example had a lot of such errors. And their was no help for the guy in the post who was mismachted by our centers
@@saxmanphd hope they learn from it. Dude is unstoppable when locked in.
Even has shown to be Good at on ball iso D too.
Him and his team didnt get beat due to lack of talent.
But they got outplayed.
Because most of them were guys with limited experience. Squad selection imho was - just random dudes with good reg season stats... With few exceptions of course. 5-6 players like that + 6-7 very good role players with experience would've been much better. Maybe they would have something to prove and you would have those Michaels Jordans yourself... Also Canada has 30 NBA players, on their roster were 7, I'm 100% sure they could've had team from only NBA players, but they didn't. The fact that Grant Hill was selecting players is nonsense - how can coaching staff run proper plays with such a mixed bag of goods.
@jonasthonniss7964 exactly. They relied on individual talent and athleticism and didn’t focus on team play. Anthony edwards was doing all the scoring. They didn’t share the ball. And it all caught up to them.
Hey JJ, that's a bit unfair comment on Luis Scola or Fournier being Michael Jordan for their national team, I can talk about Scola. He played 20 years for the Argentine team, he did not miss a single world cup or olympic until he was 39 in the 2019 world cup that got silver. He is one of the best FIBA players of all times. Can you imagine any American/NBA player playing 20 years for their national team, sacrificing life, family, career, etc. for their national team?
His last tournament was in Tokyo (he was almost 41). Got an outstanding ovation from everybody in his last game against Australia. That's real patriotism
5 things wrong with USA basketball 🇺🇸:
1. Lack of true Centers
2. Slow rotations on defense
3. Hero ball
4. Best of the best not playing
5. Sense of urgency
Respect to these guys who stepped up and played when the "more talented" players didn't want to.
This is literally the first comment from american which is true. There is no better team than one who actually wants to play for it's country. So this IS the best US team at the moment.
@@jasnazivkovic969😂😂😂 there are more important things to do than play in a meaningless tournament like prepare to win a NBA championship and NEXT yrs Olympics. You know something which is routine for USA basketball to do.
@@baller0724 pass the copium lmao
They actually performed better compared to the Team USA 2019 roster who ended up 7th place.
@@baller0724and yet here yiu are americans making these excuses
How dare they don’t make the FIBA schedule based on the NBA 😤😤😤
The first and most important ability is Availability. Don’t tell us how your best players didn’t play. You came with the best team you could assemble at the time and that team proudly wore USA on their chest.
Never watched FIBA before only NBA, here’s what I learned…all about team, exciting, tough, and dang entertaining. Canada and Latvia were my 2 fav teams, both so exciting!
European national teams play every summer, and many of them were missing their best players too.
3:14 US was 7th in 2019. They lost to Serbia in the battle for the fifth spot. Final score 94-89 for Serbia.
There was 32-7 early in the game
No excuses we have a bunch of NBA guys no reason we should lose. Just shows it's not about all talent, it's about the TEAM
I truly respect JJ takes, but these excuses for US are mostly wrong in my book. I'll give you one that actually matters. USA has the biggest pool of players, and almost every national competition they send a completely different squad. You need chemistry! Sheer will to play is not enough anymore. Maybe in the past you would win by default, just by sending any NBA squad, but not anymore. World has caught up. Look at Spain, Argentina, France, Serbia... They have core players that played together for many years, building relationships, learning to play together... Semi-decent NBA squad that just got together can't handle those teams. If (and a BIG If) everyone send their best teams on the Olympics... I would not bet on (best) USA team winning it.
So we didn't when the last four Olympics???
He wasn't wrong at all. Most of these foreign players do turn into MJ playing for their countries. FIBA Patty Mills isn't the same as NBA Patty Mills. FIBA Evan Fournier isn't the same as NBA Evan Fournier. JJ was spot on
USA needs to form a permanent national team. Even if you only get 5 superstars to commit, if you fill the rest with 7 role players, that would be a good team because the experience of playing with each other for multiple years will make them 10 times better as a team.
It’s a weak excuse from JJ. all the best talents are expected to carry their international team in soccer, and the goats do just that. It’s a matter of pride nd cultural relevance of the competition.
It’s a weak excuse from JJ. all the best talents are expected to carry their international team in soccer, and the goats do just that. And it’s a 11 player sport. It’s a matter of pride nd cultural relevance of the competition.
Congrats to Germany for their well deserved NBA championship 🎉
🤣🤣🤣
😅😅😅
Well deserved indeed. Best team in this tournament by some margin.
This miracle needs the german sport. So many big events failed in germany. Womens Soccer World Cup, Athletics World Champions and the last Football World Cup for Men were a big failure. So the german sports needed this.
😂😂😂😂😂
Just to cure some of the ignorance: Other teams had several of their best players not participating. And a crucial note: do NOT assume that each nation’s “best talent” is represented in the NBA. There were a LOT of absences, in SEVERAL teams, whether these absences came from NBA players or Euroleague players.
Dumb point..usa had 20 players better than anyone they sent...no team has anything close to that. 1 or 2 or 3 players lol
they had players missing but im sure they dont field 12 new guys every competition
Name me 2 people of relevance who were missing from their national team lol.
Jokic and Sabonis@@LogicalKicks
Agree … for example Andrew Wiggins and Tristan Thompson (Canadians) didn’t show
NBA is entertainment first, basketball second. Its a league dominated by individual players playing their own style of basketball and teams being built around players rather than an identified style of basketball to be played. Barring 3 or 4 teams, the team first mentality just isnt ingrained enough. The league throws its young players into the deep end and leaves them to figure it out. Pretty much all of these guys are still figuring out what kind of basketball is the right kind, the kind that impacts winning and what kind of attitude it takes to win. At the end of the day, it is a TEAM sport and expecting these young "starts" to leave their individuality and adapt to each other and play without personal motivations is impossible. This is a good learning experience for them.
It just proves that the NBA has the top basketball players but not all great players are playing in it.
Bro brought up shoe endorsements to negate the fact that team USA got outplayed
Exactly he said they are being asked to play extended time lol hell so are the NBA players who are playing on these World teams.
he's saying people that didn't join had obligations and probably want to wait for the Olympics and regular season
@@lakerstr8killurteam I am talking about when he initially started talking.
it’s why better players are less likely to commit. use your brain man
Why did America lose? Think of basketball IQ, think of fundamentals, think of reading plays, elaborate team defense and simply helping the helper.
I agree they didn't grow up with FIBA rules so they played at a disadvantage...If I been on the job for three months my i.q. would be less than the guy who has years under his belt
@@Weeny-ol8lh FIBA rules was not the problem. Resisting teams that play high IQ fluid basketball was the problem.
@@QuestionMarker83 Nah, the problem is that they threw a bunch of guys together for the first time in 3 months, a lot of them have little to no experience in FIBA basketball. Europe consistently brings the same teams or at the very least players that are familiar with the FIBA game.
Even if USA is more talented, why would any of you guys think a bunch of sophomores and guys under 25 would who it was their first or 2nd time playing FIBA ball would win?
Theres no denying the US is the most talented with the best players, but they can no longer win with just brining guys that have never played FIBA ball in their life.
@@razatiger22, the last time the US won was in 2014. Almost 10 years ago!!!!!
If the US keeps on "throwing together a bunch of NBA guys without FIBA experience" what does it say about our FIBA World Cup team selection/training strategy? To me its says: is not working. We may have, and our should have does not matter. Results matter: what we are doing is not working. If it is not working, should we keep doing what has not worked?
All that for JJ to say foreing players turns into MJ for the National team or that thoses Young stars have a problem adjusting to different roles
, Like the dream team adjusted and had way better raw talent.
Im not buying this BS JJ said
JJ expressing a whole lotta copium interspersed with ample servings of rationalization, caveat, qualifications and hedging.
bottom line: non one's intimidated by US ballers any more. those days are over. teams don't even celebrate wins over US team like they used. it's no longer "an event"
Canadian here - Shea, RJ, Olynyk, Brooks, Powell, Dort …. All showed up and made a multi year commitment … just saying
The rest of the world has become competitave with the USA. NBA should adopt FIBA rules. The international game is much better to watch with the emphasis on team play and passing, and refs actually making calls by the rule book.
I felt the same, not seeing dudes jacking up 3s for 3/4 of the game was refreshing.
This fiba world cup was really entertaining the teams played hard defense unlike the nba just jacking up three's excluding the playoffs.
I love basketball but I rather watch world class athletes head above the rim dunking n dribbling n making someone fall
@@deebrown9263LAME 😂
True i watch FIBA games mostly and some pointless and boring NBA games also. NBA is great when playoff starts. Before that 82 games pointless season. Tanking is ruining the game. In NHL teams try to win until the end. Player competition is so much harder. In NBA if u have $$$ contract u can lose and get your money. So when im wake i usually watch hockey. They really FIGHT for the win.
Germany could only win and call themselves "World Champion" because they had everyone on board and showed respect and passion. The U.S. was well represented by talented NBA Pros but has to ask itself why their so called "Superstars" refused to play. Probably because they had better things to do, like showing off their cars, homes and jewelery. But you don't become World Champion by mouth. You have to PLAY.
I hope jj gets the point that you are allowed to feel like you’re going to win every game internationally. YOU ARE BETTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE. But you are not a world champion unless you compete in a world championship at international or club level. It’s really that simple
When you make excuse for a team and country with SO MANY ADVANTAGES than other countries with your roster, talent, opportunities etc this is embarrassing
“They turn into mj” no. They play real basketball. That’s the difference
There’s a different level of pride and patriotism the NBA euro/foreign players bring to their team when they play, it’s infectious.
This is hugely underestimated compared to the argument that players are missing. When an NBA team loses a key player there is a "next man up" mentality that can lift a team.
Yes they are playing 100% and most importantly they are taking their practices seriously while the USA team is just there to help build their brand for their endorsement deals
@@johndurrer7869 All facts bro, especially the last part about brands and endorsements. One of the reasons why our A Team superstars skip the world cup & commit to the Olympics.
@@MVRBFree Can you blame them?
@@kidgrebo1 Not at all, as long as we win fielding our best talent.
I love your basketball knowledge jj, but also other teams didn’t have their best player and still did better than US, I think the problem about US is that is missing a program behind it, thinking that talent is always gonna be enough
Terrible argument. Who are they missing? Maxi Kleber and Ricky Rubio? Meanwhile the USA is missing Stephen Curry, LeBron James, etc 😂😂
You learnt that giving young boys the bag and telling them they're all that before they've achieved a single thing makes them soft egomaniacs.
You've also learnt that the winners of the NBA have never been further from world champions. Noahstradamus was right.
Was Canada vs USA the first FIBA game to ever have 10 NBA contracts on the floor at the same time?
Yeah what a sick bronze medal matchup
Exactly, people acting like German and Serbia had rosters loaded with NBA all stars
@@TheMissiIethe better team wins.
Spain 2008 and 2012 rosters (Marc & Pau Gasol, Ibaka, R.Rubio, Rudy Fernandez) and France 2016/2019 (Parker, Gobert, Diaw, Batum, Fournier, Ntilikina, T Luwawo Cabarrot ) could have, but were always short by one (JJ Navarro, S.Llull and Nando Decolo being the 5th guy usually)
@@Relayzy1 Canada got hosed by the refs against Serbia...all of their key players were in foul trouble in the 1st Q.
this was the best fiba i've seen. many upsets, teams score more, players are better and adds are shorter :D. loved it.
What I’m hearing here is “respect the global game and turn up having put the work in”. You can see how much this means to the other teams.
They will tell us another set of excuses if their “best” roster lose the Olympics next year. 😂
Excuses like 40 year old Lebron got high blood pressure
NBA basketball can be played more flexible than FIBA. FIBA teams were using their big man like traditional big man and not just spreading the floor. They also had more ball movement and played like a team. We were too iso heavy and lacked cohesion.
As a German, this outcome is sth none of us could’ve ever imagined. And tbh we couldnt care less that ya‘ll didn’t „send your best players. In the end our best players are nba role players and there is no excuse, it’s the product of teamwork and dedication. I hope basketball will get more popular from here on in Germany bc of this glory. But still fair Play and GG to you JJ, love your pod
Agreed. And im an American. Congrats to yall
Franz isn’t just a role player, he’s one of the best players, if not currently the best player from the 2021 draft
@@nydibsin the context of things he is a role player. Not an MVP, All nba, or all star. So yes he is young and will be a star, but currently he is a role player
@@nydibs the 2021 draft is trash, dont know why you want to flex about it
@@nerdheid7306interesting. Which draft wasn’t trash?
I played Fiba overseas, then coached for 10+ years in Kazakhstan at all levels - youth up to pro including the Junior National teams (U18). There is so much more to this conversation than just "we didn't send our best." The NBA and Fiba are two different planets - not just rules, but how rules are/aren't enforced, rhythm, pace, length of games. I'd love to chat with you all about this, but the point is, the NBA is horrible preparation for Fiba basketball. Just like almost all foreign players are bilingual and we just expect everyone to speak English, the other teams are all fluent in Fiba as their native language, while we're expecting fluency after a two-week crash fiba duolingo,
Good to see you back Tommy, hope the travels were fun !
i dont know i find it beautiful when teams around the world competes in a sport where they really put their heart and pride on it.
i watched all fiba games and it was beautiful basketball. Team effort and team play.
NBA on the other hand, it's like WWE. all that shenanigans
If you just simply count the salary of the roster, team USA is easily the top. A bunch of star players with max contracts losing to role players with minimums
It's almost as if things like player fit, roster depth, tactics etc. were more important to winning the actual game than player salaries are
NBA is about money and a bunch of overpaid pansies. How can you not play and represent the country that allows you to make the money you make? Shameful
So? We didn’t send the best. Also upsets happen all the time in ncaa tournament too when it’s a one game elimination setting…..
@@bigboner23 Upsets? Yall got defeated in your last 3 games hahaha
Who cares how much they are getting paid. They are getting paid that much because the team earns billions. So stop.
Diminishing the potential of the other national teams also plays a role here, and in this reaction there is some of that.
Shoe endorsement obligations….😂😂😂😂
Let's speak about that famous patriotism 😂
The reason the US lost is because the rest of the world is getting better. And the best big men are international players because the US no longer focuses on big men fundamentals. The US mostly focuses on guard and wing players. We need to develop better bigs in the US. Look at Nikola Jokic just dominating the NBA.
You should be used as I don't watch basketball at all button....if you put all the best players in the USA it's assembling the avengers literally 💀💀😭🤣 go assemble the best players in siberia and you got jokic and nobody😂😂
@@sgtslaughter573fiba has no 3 second rule. Having guards and wings works im the nba because of this but Good luck in the paint in fiba. Who’s rebounding? Who’s rim protecting? The European bigs will be very physical. This cocky attitude is why American players are lacking fundamentals.
@@sgtslaughter573 take best USA players vs International players...who wins? LBJ, AD, Curry, KD, ? vs Giannis, Joker, Luka, SGA, Murray
You're very intelligent because you're one hundred percent right.
@@GoodGame391 you’re correct! Literally Lithuania crowded the paint anytime we drove and we had no answer for it besides chucking up threes
This is probably the most cap report jj has ever made, i don't think they even once acknowledged how well other teams played and didn't give any other team their flowers. Just giving excuses upon excuses for why we didn't win. Lol hilarious
The excuse-making is jaw-dropping. How about keeping players accountable?
Exactly everyone making excuses like the US didnt send players worth $900 million in Salary to play. There should be 0 excuses
Dillon Brooks was cooking team USA, that says a lot!
Oh how difficult it must be for these superstars to manage their shoe contracts and play USA basketball. Think of the horrors that these players would have to endure, how challenging it would be. Thoughts and prayers to them and how much we are asking of them.
You're purposely misinterpreting his point. He's not saying their lives are hard, he's saying they have other priorities and that's why they're not choosing to play FIBA basketball.
NBA players stand to make much more money staying healthy, playing in the NBA and Olypmics. Why risk almost assured generational wealth for a FIBA championship that arguably will never be as popular as winning an Olympic Gold or NBA Finals Championship?
Those selecting the players need to take some blame. Trae Young wanted to play, but they selected Jalen Brunson instead.
@@MrMike4283
Stop it. They play in summer leagues all over the country during this time. Use to play with and against Vince and T Mac at Smith center in my neighborhood every summer. Players just weak.
@@nevertoolate7120 Yeah I think the FIBA World Cup presents a much bigger time commitment and injury risk than playing in a summer league at your neighborhood center 🤣
One guy Gordon studied in University of Idaho, then moved to Finland in 1982 to play basketball for Hyvinkään Tahko in the Finnish league, played in Finland till 1994, also in Canada's national team between 1982-1987, in 1984 Los Angeles Olympics semifinal game against USA he made two points, started his coaching career in 1994 in Uusikaupunki, Finland, and now he is the coach of the world champion team. Also coach of the year in France in season 2004-2005 and in Germany season 2015-2016. Probably wasn't the best player in the world, but he's done okay for himself and for the European basketball. Congratulations to Gordon and Germany. About roster and tournament games, this lesson comes from the world of ice hockey: "'Never Forget' - Leijonat 2019 (re-up)".
I don’t think people would be as hard on NBA players if they have shown more humility in the past. The Noah Lyles debacle is a prime example of this.
No offensive rebounds, no interior defense, no length. It was bound to fail.
Everything the NBA doesn't do anymore has been exposed.
Can't take a knife to a gunfight. Europe parked all their big bodies in the paint and laughed at the small-ball idiocy
Space and pace lineup BUT
1. cant get space without enough sharp shooters
2. Cant have pace with shot making or Rebounds
yep, and bringing in Tatum, Lebron or Jimmy will not fix this problem. It will be even worse because only Jimmy actually plays defense from those guys :D
@@marlowencna shooting was not the issue. They shot the ball well, especially from three due to the shorter distance in FIBA. and they made use of this a bunch of times when games got tough, they often resorted to desperation threes over trying to outplay the defense.
so the US can only win with stacked rosters???
The “off year” isn’t really off. There is a FIBA tournament every year.
In every other sport in the world it is an honor to represent your national team on the world stage, to say it’s asking a lot of professional players who should be proud and eager to represent their country is a very flimsy excuse
We leaned that Basketball is a team sport and the NBA will be dominated by overseas players for a long time
We learnt that Austin Reaves has the best contract in the NBA bar none lol. What a steal for the Lakers
Dude is awesome! I think you’re right, the contact is insanely good
Lakers in 5 ✋
Can’t defend to save his life plus dlo and bron lakers are fucked
Lol he got cooked on defence
The only thing is they hunt him on the switches. Other than that he’s the best player after bron and ad on lakers
The two things that I can always count on with JJ is impeccable quality basketball analysis and non-stop whining and excuse-making for his (younger gen) nba peers. 😂
By younger gen, I mean post-90s players
JJ please puts everything into context. European players play their regular season, plus de euroleague, the qualification games for the national team during the year and still show up 3 summers out of 4 for the Eurobasket, World Cup and Olympics. That's commitment for your flag.
Don't say that playing two times in a row a two weeks tournament during summer is a big commitment when the rest of the basketball world is actually doing it.
Miss me with that "long term play and obligations" bullshit excuse. My man Luka has been playing professional basketball almost year round since the day he came into the NBA. Olympics, Eurobasket, World Cup, NBA season, rinse and repeat. And he was still a top 5 player in the NBA every year. You don't get to make that excuse for these American players. First of all, most of them won't even be on the Olympics roster and the next international tournament is the next World Cup for them. Stop it with the excuses.
Biggest thing I can see making sense for why the big name players for USA don't show up is they're mostly older and have been making deep playoff runs. Steph, KD, Bron, etc are all over 30 and have already won Olympics/World Cup gold, so they may not feel the need to show instead of getting some rest for the next NBA season.
@@SeventyVelle There are enough high level players like Booker, Trae, Tatum, Brown, Aayton, etc. who would do much better.
@cryptidian3530 I don't disagree and I think those guys should play too. But it's like these guys under 30 just don't seem to care. Hell a lot of them can't even play 70 games in the season consistently
@cryptidian3530 I also can't help but think USA would do better if they built the team more like an actual team. They only need 3 or 4 of the bigger name Allstars or better level players. Then they can fill out roster with high quality role players.
These takes were laughable 💀😂
The Redeem team had no problems sacrificing they were all superstars and HOF. They carried the pride of their country there evidently and it showed but this team didnt.
can someone explain how international players can adopt to NBA's game and the US team having a hard time playing with FIBA?
Well,other teams did not send their best players too..like serbia,4 of their best players did not play.
They make a great point, the world caught up to the US in basketball. Each team has a NBA player. Some have one of the best in the NBA. A lot of team have multiple NBA players. Also, there's a lot of talented players in the other leagues that couldn't make to the NBA but, are just as high a caliber player as an NBA player, that are playing for their country. It's no longer that just pure talent can win games anymore, every team has that. It's starting to come down to actual team play, how well the team plays together, how well the team was prepared for the Olympics. This is going to be an exciting Olympics for Basketball because, any country has a real shot to win gold.
basketball is an international sport, the world is either playing soccer, or basketball, if your a kid growing up that’s who you’re looking up to in team sports right now. this is an exciting time for basketball, the american arrogance ruins that growth the sport has seen worldwide in the past 20 years.
@@moneymangg303 It would be American arrogance if the NBA didn't recruit these players, paid them millions of dollars, and celebrate their success. Lot of Americans don't even care about this tournament.
its not even just talent that they caught up in. They caught up in coaching, play style, and IQ
If the news about LeBron recruiting stars to join the Olympic squad are true, then talent might trump it all one last time. Otherwise, I absolutely agree. With talent becoming more globally recognised, you can't bet on athletic talent and run through the world.
The world always had talent, they just weren’t exposed to the NBA as much
That ‘92 Croatian team had at least 5-6 players that were drafted or signed to an NBA team - Petrovic, Kukoc, Radja, Komazec, Vrankovic, Tabak…
The world hasn’t “caught up”, the Americans forgot how to play winning basketball
Idk I just hear a lot of excuses. I thought NBA has the best players of the world that's why they disagree with Noah Lyles? Let's just admit it, other countries caught up, but the NBA doesn't really recognize nor pay attention to most of them because at the end of the day it is technically an American league and not a world league.
Other countries has caught up??? So give me just ONE country who's best 12-15 who is OBJECTIVELY better than the best 12-15 US players. Don't worry I'll wait
@@baller0724 selective reading I see and little trouble with comprehension as you literally changed the narrative of you my comment. Btw it's not an opinion, it is a fact about other countries caught up. But since you are having trouble, what that means was back in the old days, the US were dominating the world unlike now that they are barely getting the W and even losing at times.
Also, if the NBA has all the best players then in that context alone, these guys should have been dominating the World Cup even if they are tier 3 or whatever which brings me to my final point and that is the NBA is technically is just an American league and therefore cannot simply claim themselves as world champions. NBA might be the best league in the world, but it definitely doesn't have all the best players in thE league as a lot of these guys are not better than the all non NBA players in the world. Heck, not even all ethnicities are being represented in the NBA so how was that the world lol. I hope my over explanation put some clarity within you, but if not then it's on you. ✌🏽
Excellent job and observation about how the USA team competes with the World … it is a combination of rules, understanding the game, expectations, motivation to preform, continuity and world talent 👌🏽
We learnt that Noah Lyles might be unto something 😂
As a european I enjoyed JJ starting with the excuses.
1) Sure, USA didn't have their best players, but they still had the best 12 player roster by a mile
2) NBA is the only league in the world that has different rules, sooooo...
After that he gives the reason why they didn't win. No need to make excuses
Truthfully, even though we sent our C/D team, I think top to bottom our roster was far more talented than any other in the tourney. I think the biggest issues with team USA are the lack of continuity in any given year and more coaching. It would be more beneficial to have a more “set” team with tryouts every 2 years. I don’t want all of our best players, I want a team of players that have complimentary skills, can grow together, and can consistently win on the world stage. However I do recognize, the importance of stars and the impact they can have on games so I’d like to see 3 rotational spots set aside for stars to join the squad for major tournaments. Limiting the team to 3 stars will ease the transition of integrating new players but still allow us to keep an identity that wouldn’t need to drastically change or wasn’t suited to the international style of play.
Yea but them guys play together year round out advantage usually is we send teams so much more talented that it offsets their chemistry but that's not tried when we send that roster
It’s crazy that people still bring up 92. Literally 30 years ago. And basically the past 20 years, the US has consistently lost games at international competitions (less so in Olympics), but the good point they make is that even when the US has sent all-time teams, the games are very very close and very losable for the US. Just cause NBA players get paid the most doesn’t mean they always win.
Other NBA players from other countries like Schroder knew and understand the rules despite playing in the NBA so rules are a lame excuse.
To be fair, Schröder grew up with FIBA rules, he had to adapt to NBA rules, same with almost all other international NBA players! Going back to something you grew up with is much easier, than adjusting to new, unfamiliar rules!
@@exilhamburger4802yeah, but it is not as if in FIBA you are only allowed to play with your feet instead of your hands...there are changes, but it's not a completely different game they play
Adapting to rules wasn't a player issue because that implies they didn't know that the 3 second violation nor no hand checking wasn't a thing. They knew the rules, but their scheme didn't capitalize on it. They played a switch heavy defence thanks to Steve kerr which none were used to nor was it tailored to stop other team's best plays or players.
@@exilhamburger4802 Maybe they should put some effort in training and scouting. Those lazy nba asses
@@exilhamburger4802Did they teach NBA rules also at college and high school?
pretty ignorant to think that all basketball players are willing to move to a different part of the world and leave their families/lives to play the U.S. home NBA. Look at Jokic spending his entire summer home in Serbia and after the finals disappointed he couldn't leave fast enough to get out
We learned that defense matters internationally and Spo should be in charge.
Keep up the good work brother. Keep pushing rhat brand.
The problem isn't that the world caught up. It's that the 20 best American players would rather win a national title (NBA) and going on a nice summer vacation than becoming world champion. It's the other opposite for all other countries.
But also this tournament is just a qualifying tournament for the Olympics. Great you won the World Cup, but the Olympics are more relevant. Nobody is pissed that Yokic didn't go. There were several international NBA players who did not play in this tournament.
@@AHall818it is the World Cup and because of the pandemic it was a part of the qualification tournament for the Olympics next year. The timeline would have been almost impossible to fit in a qualification tournament between this World Cup and the Olympics.
I don’t get the american appreciation for an Olympic ball sports tournament. It is like a small version of the World Cup. The Olympics though. But it is only 12 national teams versus 32 in the World Cup.
@@AHall818You've wrong. This is not "qualification for olympics", this is actually WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP. The real one. Yes, some teams being directly qualified for the olympics by result at the world championship, but just few of them. The rest will play qualifications after the championship. And no, Olympics are not bigger than world cup, it is quite different kind of competition. World cup is world cup, world championship, as it is in any other sport, volleyball, waterpolo, handball, winter sports, athletics...All these sports exist at the Olympics, winter or summer, but it is not substitution for championships
@ahall818, yes, some European teams were messing ONE great player. But everybody else showed up.
Hi all, I think that there is a big point that as been missed in the whole conversation: the NBA is offense orientated and travelling, palming, moving screens, first step and other rules have deminished defence to such an extent, that NBA players have big difficulties adjusting to the FIBA game. Also with a smaller pooll of players the international teams play together longer. Especially on the defencive end the German team was super clued in. Also the FIBA game is more fundamental and the officiating showed that.
This is the only content Ive seen that is grounded, realistic, objective, and not completely self-deluded grandiosity. It's refreshing to see people talk, who haven't lost their minds.
Tommy is starting to sound wiser.
The USA has far more talent than everyone. The difference is hubris and attitude, caring about defense.
In between the world cup and olympic years there's the continental tournaments to qualify for the wold cup as well. For example last summer was Eriobasket, Americup, Afrobasket and asia cup.
Shout out Luka he ain’t a wimp 😂
I love how a week or 2 ago the media was absolutely crucifying the track star who rightly pointed out that the NBA isn't a global league and therefore not world champions and then this happens
2019 was the first time I had ever watched world cup basketball, actually, and I have been patiently waiting for this years tournament ever since then. Gotta say it hasn't disappointed. Team Canada vs Team USA was a great game and nice way to end everything off.
"we did not send our best players" boo hoo! "players were out of position" You play who you send, just because your players do not care about playing for their country and are on the beach compared to the other countries (every single one) is no one else's problem. You lost. The excuses are exhausting, the coaching was TERRIBLE. No defence. Fourth place. Stop the excuses. Now you are all excited about 40 year olds saving your team.. that is not sustainable.. And JJ wants Dwight, good lord..
Why you people who can't make a logical opinion on their own always say it is excuses? They are talking about why they lost. And yes not sending the best players is one of the main reasons. They never said anything that is an excuse. Think before you talk please.
@@abouttime2569the entire podcast was excuses. No respect on the other teams. No “look Serbia had no Joker” nope. Cos Merica..
@@Neuri So every time somebody talks about why they lost, it is an excuse? Why are you even talking about Joker? They are talking about team USA. Can you even think at all?
@@abouttime2569the 23 thumbs up agreeing with me and zero on your comment make your argument moot unfortunately..
@@abouttime2569Sorry, but this guy is right. "We didn't send our best players" IS excuse. US didn't send those "best players" because they didn't want to play for their country. So there is no one single reason to mention them. The best team US can send is the one made by players who WANT to play for their country. And that's it. That is your best team. As simple as that. Now, we can talk about why this best US team didn't take a medail, what is missing, and what should they do to make better result in the future. Everything else, any other kind of discussion is pointless.