Actually, the 3 after RM and the green label signify that it's "reduced kickback" chain, which has an extra bumper next to the depth gauge. Stihl sells chain with both types of cutter, full chisel and semi chisel, with a green label. Mike is testing RS and RM3, but you can also buy RM (semi chisel with no extra bumper) and RS3 (full chisel with the extra safety bumper). The color of the sticker doesn't denote the type of cutter.
The way to tell if you have reduced kickback chain if you aren't savvy with numbers they have bumper "teeth" on each link so if you hit a log with the tip of your bar it doesn't fling upward it just deflects it and let's the actual cutting tooth take a TINY Nick out of it
Rite on, I was confused there for a second! I purchased a new Yellow label 26RM just today that is micro chiseled...still a good video, keep up the good work.
Stihl makes RS (sharper and shaped like a 7, pointy) and RM (more of slope angle, think of it shaped like a question mark?) chain. Both RS and RM come in green and yellow versions. All the green denotes is that there is an extra tie strap to help reduce kickback. Also plunging with green chain is harder.
Thanks Mike, as it seems there might be some confusion I found this. Green (go) marks those products which are designed to reduce the risk of kickback injury and comply with the ANSI B175. 1 kickback standard. ... Yellow (caution) marks products with increased risk of kickback injury. RS stands for 'Rapid Super' and RM stands for 'Rapid Micro'. RS chains are full chisel, and typically cut faster (but you have to maintain proper sharpening and angles to continue to have that performance). ... RM is a semi chisel chain, and doesn't get as dull as fast as RS chains (therefore it is lower maintenance).
... and since a dull chain makes much more than ~1sec difference per cut, it appears his amateur testing would suggest most users are better off with a micro/semi chisel.
I spent many years in the woods as a chaser and one of the most valuable tips I learned was to run a chisel-bit chain and most importantly, to file it with a 3-sided flat file. A round file creates a cutting edge that is considerably weaker than that sharpened with a "flat" file. Once youve run a chisel-chain, properly sharpened you'll never go back, although they WILL be more prone to "kickback" because they are taking a more aggressive "bite", so maintaining proper control of the saw is critically important.
i have used both, back when i was logging and bucking up logs that had been hauled out of the woods by a skidder, i used what they call the micro, or round corner chain, the reason was if the logs had dirt on them, and they often did, your chain would stay sharp longer, no sharp corner like the chisel to get burred over, when in the woods falling i used the full chisel, everyone did this.
There is a different. I refer to these chains as a flat top, and the other as a safety chain. The flat top chain could be purchased as less expensive after market, and is the preference for cutting firewood. The safety chain, or anti kick, is best for wood carving, and/ or cutting in areas with a good chance of hitting an undesirable. Say, cleaning up an old homestead. The safety chain will be damaged less when hitting an obstacle. The flattop chain will get extensive damage losing 1/3 to 1/2 each time an undesirable is encountered.
micro/semi-chisel is best for homeowner general use imo. 10% slower than chisel, sure, but it gives that time back by not having to stop and sharpen as often.
JP Lawns&More not quite. You can get both chisel and semi chisel in green and yellow. It’s the extra bit on the link after the raker on the green that gives it the low kick back.
Compare lemons to lemons. Both chains are available in full chisel. The green does cut a bit slower, has the anti kickback drags. Green chain is supposed to be safer, made for part timers. Yellow is the pro chain.
Once Oregon came out with a chipper chain I've always stayed with a chisel design. It makes a difference if you're going to spend all day out there. Semi chisel works well enough. I don't like any chain with an antikickback feature built into it, but I've always been an aggressive cutter so I've never relaxed or been distracted while cutting.
Unfortunate that the kick-back resistant chain (green VRS yellow) got confused with the design of the cutter! I do not us the "anti-kick-back" chain, very few experienced saw-men do. As far as the design of the cutters: I like many use both - depending on conditions, hardness of the wood, dirty or not. Just try using a full chisel chain when cutting in an almond orchard or other really hard woods. Hard wood & dirty conditions dulls full chisel chains much faster. You will be changing chains much more often with the full chisel. I have had to change a full chisel chain after just a few cuts in dirty on-the-ground dry almond, oak, eucalyptus. Cut much longer with the less sharp BUT more durable semi-chisel chain. For SOFT WOOD & cleaner conditions I LOVE full chisel chain! Get done quicker and get to go home sooner! More than my opinion.
The full chisel wants a nice clean log, like standing timber. The semi doesn’t mind a little dirt. It’s a better choice for cutting timber that was already down.
I recently just tried the yellow and was amazed how fast it went from cutting like a beast to cutting hardly at all from hitting a little dirt. It went bad so quick that I was looking at my cuts for a hidden nail in the trunk that I might have struck.
In Germany Stihl explains the differences as follows. Chains with low cutting tooth profile are called PICCO. Chains with normal profile are called RAPID. Picco is designed for small chainsaws with low power output. The chains are more narrow and run in 1.1 or 1.3 mm gauges while RAPID uses 1.5 or 1.6 mm gauges and produce a wider cut. Narrow chains are offered to partly compensate for lower engine power and still producing a relatively fast cut but wearing down faster. Depending on what the chains are used for (cutting, carving,rescue etc) both types are partly available in 3 different variations: MICRO, SUPER and DURO. The codes will the be PM (Picco micro) PS (Picco Super) or RD (Rapid Duro) etc. MICRO (includes the special editions PICCO MICRO MINI for the smallest saws and Rapid Micro Special for carving) The Micro range is a "semi chisel" chain construction that produces a softer cut and lower vibration as well as less risk of kickback for home and garden users. SUPER is a full chisel , edgy design for fast cuts and longer intervals between re-sharpening. The cut is fast and more aggressive for professional users and chainsaw high power output. DURO is equipped with carbide tips and offers up to 10 times longer usage before re-sharpening. It is also used for the RDR chains (Rapid Duro Rescue)
Chainsaw Mike it was his name Cutting logs is just his game Firewood piles Stacked for miles All the work done With Morgan smiles Headed back to the house the sun goes down Always a good time in Morgan town!
It is always good to see a fellow western Pennsylvanian on CZcams. Just bought a new Stihl 261. I always try to use the green chains cause being an old mason for some reason I try and cut stone with them. It is my 9th Stihl product I own. They are amazing for the quality. Thank you for the great intel !
Thank you for this comparison side by side. It just proves that Stihl makes quality tools and equipment. Really very little difference, more personal preference and feel. Great video, thanks for the info you provide without bias
We ran the full chisel with rakers filed lower than recommended. This gave us increased production at end of day. We were using .045 supers and .056super for falling and large block stihls for bucking. We did get increased chain link wear and chain stretch thus more sprocket wear....Always a trade off...but worth it. Also more vibration...but those old stihls would eat the wood....big wood chips. Ah the good old days. Great vidios Mr. and Mrs. Morgan. Have a great day and good luck hunting..........Carry on my friend
Well the full chisel is speed falling or limbing, but if I had lots of bucking on the ground I always use the semi, it stays sharp longer and that means the most... I even have my back up saw on the ground for bucking and use the other just for falling if doing fire wood instead of logging.
Mike I have a 036 and started using the green chain and went to the yellow chain and never regretted it one bit . I felt that the yellow chain lasted longer and didn't stretch as fast . Osage orange is a very hard wood and that's what I cut most. 😊😊👍👍 Great comparison.
May be a bit late on this, but this doesn't seem right. The difference between Yellow and Green is whether or not it has the extra bumper behind the depth gauge on the drive link. This is what makes the difference in the colors. A Green chain is "low kickback" or "anti Kickback". A semi chisel or full chisel is available as "safety" or non safety chain. The "3" after the part number is what denotes whether it's a safety chain or not. You can get a 26RS or a 26RS3. The 26RS3 will be a full chisel, safety chain with the extra bumpers on the drive links. The letters after the 26 are what denotes the cutter type (semi chisel or full chisel). Typically (as you mentioned) the full chisel will cut faster but dull quicker when it gets into any dirt at all. The RM semi chisel will cut slower, but is more forgiving in dirty wood/contact with ground. In summary, The number denotes pitch and guage (according to Stihls chart on the box) RS: Yellow, Full Chisel, non safety RS3: Green, Full Chisel, safety (low kickback) RM: Yellow, Semi Chisel, non safety RM3: Green, Semi Chisel, safety (low kickback)
I didn't realize I've been using full chisel or "super" on my two MS291s because I never really asked anyone about it. I habitually go out each fall and replace both chains whether I need to or not just so I have a stock of new ones on hand...and they always throw chips and strings, barely any dust. Thanks for pointing out the fact that there is a difference and a choice. Hi Hunter!!
Hello Mike, great video about the different chains, just like everyone else issues are what do you feel the best using. Stihl caters to everyone, professional and farmer/homeowners. Stihl tries to keep their products as safe as possible and allow the people to come up with what works for them the best. I like to be able to touch up my chain and have it cut like new every time I start it up. The full chisel is the easier to sharpen for me, I don’t care for the skip-tooth chain either. I am slowing down and enjoying myself when I’m cutting, I’ve got to where I earned that privilege before passing on the tools to someone younger, which is closing in too quick. Thanks for sharing with us, keep it safe and good hunting.
Hi Mike. I'd like to throw my two cents in. As stated by other comments green is anti-kickback chain but I think it cuts well out of the box. My experience is that it doesn't cut as well over time. And after sharpening it isn't as effective due to the anti-kickback links. it's an additional thing you have to grind off with your rakers. The green came with my ms391 but I have moved to the yellow chain for better cutting and more consistent sharpening
I'm not cutting for a living only trees around the house. I work for a business that deals commercial Stihl products as one of our lines, I picked up a yellow at cost put on my small 210 and I honestly prefer the green Low KB chain, didn't notice enough difference to justify the yellow, it seems to grab quicker than I thought it would.
I've run both types of chain from both Stihl and Oregon on several of my saws. I get much better performance out of the yellow/full chisel chain. I also find that the full chisel is a lot easier to sharpen with a file. Very easy to tell whether the tooth is sharp or not.
The green or yellow has nothing to do with it being full chisel or semi chisel. You can get a full chisel green chain. Comparisons have shown they cut at the same rate. The difference is in the raker link between the teeth. The green "low-kickback" chain has an extended raker that effectively blocks the cutting teeth as the chain rounds the bar tip. The only advantage to a yellow chain in making plunge cuts which a green chain wont really do. The RS3 (GREEN) chain found on Stihl's website... "STIHL RAPID™ Super 3 is a reduced-vibration and low-kickback version of STIHL RAPID™ Super. RS3 is an aggressive, fast-cutting, full-chisel chain but has a single-humped drive link to reduce kickback"
@@rbhe357 I know what the differences are, I just wasn't going to waste my time going into detail on a youtube comment. Thank you for your response though. That said, my testing indicates that full chisel chain cuts faster for me. I don't recall the different models of chain from the different mfgs, but I mainly run Stihl RS3 chain on most of my saws. I've also run semi-chisel and safety chain from both Stihl and Oregon as well as full chisel from Oregon in both standard configuration (traditional single hump depth gauge), and the safety/homeowner configuration (double hump depth gauge). On my saws, with the way I have them set up, the full chisel chain with the traditional single hump depth gauge cuts noticeably faster. That said, my saws are not "stock", and I setup my depth gauges according to how I'm going to use the chain. Normally, that means shortening them because I run bigger saws with shorter bars and the shorter depth gauges put the saw's added HP and torque to use. That said, on a home owner grade saw that's 50cc or less, the difference between one chain and another is imperceivable.
I use the 33RSM 72 20” skip chain and the 33RS 72 20” with 3/8 pitch. I have an MS311 which replaced an 038 AV Super. I had used green chains for the 25 years I’d had it, ending with an 18” bar. I got the 2 yellow chains with the new saw and was amazed at how much easier it was to buck. The skip chain rips tight oak burl with ease and cuts 24”-30” oak without bogging. The full chipper does need to be sharpened carefully to keep it even and touching the ground will dull it quickly. Had I known about the full chipper earlier I suspect cutting with the 038 would have been quicker and easier. Most of my bucking is green/wet red and white oak. For years I split burl by hand. The skip chain is a whole lot easier.
Nice “vs” vid Mike! I started with green as a beginner.. less likely to kickback - now I always use yellow.. nice to see the speed diff. Seems minimal. But I think as the edge wears off, the green can bog the saw, where the yellow keeps going.
I use full chisel for softer wood and cleaner work-space. BUT FOR HARD, DRY WOOD I use semi-chisel, especially when the wood or the work-space is "dirty". The above works best for me. I am not cutting much soft wood now... now mostly almond, oak, ETC often mostly dry and dirty. I use STIHL semi-chisel and cut longer before changing the chain.
I definitely agree with the comment on the semi chisel in dirty wood staying sharper longer. I keep both chains on hand and when I drag logs with the tractor I use the semi chisel and when I drop and cut I use the full chisel.
From the internet: Green (go) marks those products which are designed to reduce the risk of kickback injury and comply with the ANSI B175. 1 kickback standard. ... Yellow (caution) marks products with increased risk of kickback injury. There is another variation I found: RSC which is the comfort cut, and has a bevel on the back of the cutting tooth to help reduce vibration. Thank you for the video.
Old Hickory I primarily cut hickory for firewood. When I bought my first Stihl MS 251 (18" bar), it came with a green chain. About every two cuts in a 12 to 14" log, the chain would need to be sharpened. I spent more time sharpening the chain that I did cutting wood. Then, I heard about the yellow chain. Now, I can cut hickory firewood all morning without stopping to sharpen the chain.
I was hoping to see a green vs yellow chain video with RM vs RM3 or RS vs RS3, but instead you mixed green/yellow and full/semi chisel so we don't know if it cut faster because it is full chisel or because it is yellow.
Yellow all the way. I used skip tooth Oregon chains on Husqvarna and loved them. When I bought my MS291 Stihl, the dealer said i 'd love the yellow on my 20" bar and I do. I would love to borrow that winch!!!
Great Comparison! Thanks for doing this! It seemed very little difference. The semi chisel seemed to take more power to run, and slowed the rpm of the saw a bit more IMHO. Speed of cut was pretty dam close tho. (Less than 1 second on a 13" log isnt much!) The Full chisel just seemed to run the saw at a tad bit more RPM, Maybe you were pushing harder on the semi chisel, Its a tough call . I would buy either blade tho and not worry about it.
Same as Justin said. Seams I can sharpen yellow better so that all I buy. I do have green for my 170 as I just buy whatever for that as all I use that for is small stuff and limbing. Thanks Mike, great video 👍
They all cut great out of the box....lol Once they get dull they never again cut as good as new... at least this is how it works out for me... I guess I just suck at sharpening them..lol
@@wolfpack4128 Yeah my 2 Stihl dealers I go to won't sharpen them. One of the dealers doesn't even sell the chain. Sure I could find somebody to sharpen them. Why I haven't bought any really.
As far as I know, the yellow chain is best for felling as it is more aggressive / faster - but on the other hand is really sensitive to get unsharp fast, if there is dirt involved somehow (at the stump or if the wood is on the ground) and less forgiving for kickbacks. If you are cutting a lot of wood, which is more likely in contact with the ground, the green chains stay sharp longer, nevertheless they are less aggressive and a bit slower. Ideally have both on site - and switch between them if conditions are changing. The way Stihls are constructed makes the change fast and easy enough.
Great info, have used both styles and came to roughly about same conclusions as you. A lot depends on the wood you are cutting but like the other comment about sharpening, the micro is harder for me to sharpen appropriately. Thanks for the side by side comparison.
Always like watching your CZcams videos good and honest STIHL makes the best chains. I’m cutting Australian red gum iron bark hard wood semi chisel chain they hold their edge a lot better. I don’t really care about which chain cuts quicker . The semi chisel is more durable in hard wood and smoother with less kickback.
The yellow chain, in the side by side portion of the video was throwing larger chips through the cut. Thanks for the comparison. Good information when I get another saw.
Faulty test, Rm also comes in yellow. The green means "safety chain" and has humped links to help home owners avoid kickback. Serious users never touch it. 404 RS or RM need equal care when operating.
The micro won’t dull as quick as the chisel when you are cutting wood with dirt. They both cut about the same when they are sharp. I logged for about 20 years and run both types
Biggest thing between these 2 in my opinion are production. The semi chisel chain will stay sharper longer, and is ideal for dirtier wood. Thanks for all the videos as usual!!!
The full chisel cuts like crazy -- bigger chips from what I've always noticed. But they do give you a bit more vibration because of the aggressive action. If what some on here think is right (that the sharp point is more subject to dulling than the round one), that would certainly affect things.....though I've not really seen much of that in my wood lot. I will tell you, however, if you're up against a stack of hardwood logs (black locust, hedge, etc.) I've never seen anything get through them like a brand new full chisel. Last week I bucked up a big pile of black locust with a new chain and it was like a hot knife versus butter. The downside of any chain, of course, is that even if you do a good job of sharpening, they never seem to cut quite that way again. My saw shop guy said that Stihl uses laser technology to cut the steel at the factory and because of that when brand new they cut beautifully. Anyone know anything about Stihl factory sharpening?
It cuts faster, but you can make it a helluva lot faster if you take a couple passes on the rakers before you start. You also can't plunge cut with the green or safty chain.
The green chain is a safety chain, less chance of kickback. You can get semi-chisel on yellow chain too. The semi-chisel will work better in dirty logs, cuts a bit slower, but doesn't get full as quick.
I have been told the full chisel cut better but it will dull quicker if there is dirt in the bark. If you can keep your bark clean and are cutting trees fresh, then the chisel is what you want. Lots of loggers around here in Olympic Peninsula in Washington State and they like the full chisel. Chainsaw sales people look at you and if you don't appear to use a chainsaw for a living, they steer you away from the full chisel.
The semi chisel is for dirty or frozen wood doesn't Dull as fast, the full chisel I for soft clean Woods. Chipper chain and tungsten carbide works better I dirt.
the difference of these chains that the video is talking about is in the cutting teeth the difference in low to standard kickback is in the shape and size of the rakers what adds to the confusion is there are really 4 choices when you combine different teeth with different rakers but as I mentioned about the unfortunate part is a guy making a video that doesn't really know what he is talking about and doesn't really use his saw right in the demonstration
Hey guys, I am a newbie using a chainsaw. My daughters bought me an MS 250 Stihl. I cannot get it started. Not sure what the problem is. The manual says there is possibly a decompression valve. I have not been able to find it. Any help or tips anyone could give me to get it started would be appreciated. I have watched videos of people starting the saw easily. It’s only been used once by a friend...
@@waynewilson2834 You may be flooding the engine, The MS 250 is somewhat notorious for flooding let the saw sit for an hour Set to full choke and pull cord only once or twice (you may hear it burp) set to half choke and pull 3 times If it has not started set it to idle and pull until it starts. Once you learn not to flood it from the start it should be easy. Hope this helps!
Working in the foods as a logger for awhile . The micro chain or ( yard chain ) as we would call it, where your bucking up logs or pulp, worked better because it took the dirt better when the skidder dragged them out to the yard. Use the chisel tooth for dropping and limbing . That's why we always had 4 saws. 2 for felling and two for the yard. So in a way Mike you said that you noticed the green chain cutting better in the dirt and that's why, it stays sharper in the dirt. I know kind of a long explanation, but back in the old days when all you had was a chainsaw to get the wood out. You wanted to get the most out of your saw and chains.
I prune apple trees all winter. Get least one third more trees per day with a yellow chain. However, if your cutting smaller branches, you may want to use the green as it won't leave the branch left on the tree as ragged as the yellow one does.
My stihl dealer didn't mention color choices when I picked up a new chain for a MS170. Maybe the pico chains don't have the options. Before this video, if he'd asked what color chain I wanted, I would have assumed Stihl Orange would be the only valid answer. Would be cool to hear a bit more about difficulty of sharpening well, and any difference in cost of chain.
ms170 has 3/8p .043 ga you can only get green semi chisel for that also the guys that throw 3/8p .050 ga fc on that saw always come in the shop with a shot p/c that saw cant handle any larger of a chain great saw and actually cuts better with the 16'' factory bar and chain hope this helps
I recently got the RS chain for my MS271, I like it a lot better, esp. In hardwood. Not sure it's faster, but I feel its smoother, and less effort, plus when I am sharpening it, I can see better when its fully sharpened
Hallo we use the full chissel for soft wood and it works very well.for hardwood we use full chissel too but a fiend of mine file the chains in a very special way and it works pretty well to.i ve to mention he s a professional like buckin billy ray.all the best to little ty and his uncle hunter!👋
Now you have to try the Stihl Carbide. I was cutting off tree stumps and the chain would dull so quick you could see the chips get smaller. I wanted a chain that would hold an edge longer in this demanding application. After seeing how long the carbide teeth on a stump cutter last I checked into carbide chain. My local dealer had the wheel to sharpen carbide chain so I tried one. Stihl claims they last 3 times as long as regular chain, but I think it is more than that. Try one on the chainsaw you use the most and pay attention to how much more wood you can cut before it needs to be sharpened. They are the RD series chains, and have a separate carbide insert in the cutting tooth. Don’t get the rescue chain with the triple hump safety strap. The triple hump safety chains vibrate bad in hardwood.
I will use the Green for limbing because it doesn't grab as bad but when it comes to the bigger stuff I prefer the yellow just because it throws larger chips which makes me think it cuts a little faster. Good video!
You can get a green RS3 chain instead of the RM3. It'll be full chisel instead of semi-chisel. The green and the 3 in the designator are for the safety lobes as part of the reduced kickback features. When it goes around the tip of your bar, the lobes stick out past the rakers, reducing the exposed cutting edge on the teeth. I've always been interested in a side by side comparison of two chains with the green vs yellow being the only difference, but I use them interchangeably (because I was shipped some 33RS3's instead of 33RS's by mistake).
I love a Full Chisel but for cutting firewood on the ground I prefer the semi chisel. One touch to the ground with the Full Chisel and it no longer cuts as well as the semi chisel after it's touched the ground. Even the dirt on a skidded log wipes out the edge off the Full Chisel faster than the Semi Chisel.
I love to hear those stihl saws rev up. I use a full chisel but the stihl dealer did tell me that they were more susceptible to kickback. Good luck 🦌huntin. Say hey to the family and yall HAVE A DAY 👍👍👍👍👍👍
The red oak that you where cutting had some nice growth rings. I think it would be good for bowl blanks. I think you would have some really nice bowls turned out of them.
RS is a little jumpy in spots but it sure cuts. I cut some two year old twenty inch test logs with min on my new MS 250, yesterday, to help break it in. It was its assignment.. it was its lfirst wood cutting. It is basically brand new saw. I have the same chain on my other 250 and the green chain on my recently restored Stihl 025. All three will be cutting, today.
I'm surprised at all the guys that didn't know there was a difference. Hell yea it cuts better. Full chisel or yellow dot makes hardwoods seem like soft butter. I run a yellow dot on my MS-391 That I did a muffler mod to. This summer I'm putting twin turbos on it and a big thumper cam😜
As many people have stated, the main difference between the two chains is the shape of the cutter - specifically the corner of the top plate. As shown at minute 3:50 of the video, the shape of the cutter on the yellow chain (shown just below the yellow square on the box) shows a very sharp point on the corner of the top plate. This chain cuts very well until it encounters dirt, rock, steel, etc. and the sharp point gets dull and then the cutting speed drops off significantly. The shape of the corner of the top plate of the cutter on the green chain (again shown just below the green square on the box) is more rounded rather than being a sharp point. This shape is more "forgiving" when cutting dirty logs and allows more cuts to be made before the chain needs to be resharpened. Many loggers use a chisel (yellow) chain to do the tree felling as it cuts a bit faster and they use a semi-chisel (green) chain on the landing to buck up logs that get dirty when being skidded on the ground. There are basically three cutter shapes - chisel (sharp corner), semi-chisel (partially rounded corner) and chipper (very rounded corner). I have some tree felling videos on CZcams at brilaw84
From a guy that grew up in western PA and now lives in Oregon I’d say this video checks all the boxes! Thanks and I guess I’ll stick w the green chain.
The semi chisel will tolerate dirty cutting conditions better than a true chisel chain. Once the sharp corner is blunted on a chisel tooth it starts to cut slower with more load on the engine. I cut from the clean side of a skidded log almost all of the way through. After many rounds are almost cut through I roll the log over and cut up with the top of the bar through the cut to the underside of the dirty bark. This throws the dirty bark off the end of the bar and doesn't drag the dirt into the cut. It also gets most of the cuts done with a sharp chain. Some times I do this on many logs saving the dirty cuts for the last. An old chipper chain will work longer in dirty wood than a semi chisel chain. I have some chipper chains that have a carbide layer electroplated on the tooth. They sharpen with a file and seem to last longer than a tooth with the chrome plating.
I have about the same size “mini cabin” on my property with the same rectangular viewing windows. Although, mine is not a tree house. It has a lower level. Tree house is cooler, for sure. The deer will walk right along side it even when I’m in there.
Yellow was avg 1.5 seconds faster. I've always used the yellow on both my saws. May not seem like much different, but 2 saws cutting 4 hrs like we do on Saturdays to heat 2 homes makes life a lot easier and at end of day, you've worked less for more cuts and your back don't hurt as much fighting another 2 seconds per cut.
I was always told full chisel chain cuts faster than semi. The most important fact about the two types of chain is once the leading edge on the full chisel hits rock or dirt, the performance slows down. The semi chisel and chipper chain don't have a leading edge so they perform better when there is dirt etc on the logs. If the first part of the chain (leading edge) that cuts the wood first is dull, your performance drops considerably. That's why it's so important to make sure when you sharpen the chain the leading edge and top of full chisel is the sharpest and not the gullet.
The problem is that once the chisel even slightly loses the sharp corner, it cuts way worse than the semi chisel. This is particularly seen if cutting dirty wood. The semi chisel (RM) chain, doesn't suffer from this because the edge is rounded off and it handles lose of sharpness way better. So in this end both are good, for specific tasks: dry hardwood/dirty logs? Semi chisel. Clean, green wood? Full chisel.
I usually upgrade to a full chisel on all my new saws, but I was really surprised how close they were on a big log like that. On the first cut the difference was hardly noticeable.
I wondered about the vibration you spoke about being more on the yellow chain. When I watched your play back side by side, I noticed that when you ran the yellow chain, you didn't have the saw body always contacting the log. A lot of the time you were a 1/4 to 1/2 inch away and only when you were dogged in were you in full contact with the log. The full chisel should cut faster, however, note that new chains are not razor sharp out of the box. For an accurate test, try cutting the log exactly the same way in each cut. Elevate the log off the ground so you don't have to slow down to avoid hitting the ground. Take the dogs off, let the saw cut level without changing angles or adding downforce to the saw body. You will probably see a larger difference between these two chains.
Depends on the power of the saw full chisel is a ripping chain for hard woods excellent in soft wood 25/30 degrees 10% angel grouse chain semi chisel is a good all rounder
I prefer the RM chain. I just find it more user friendly, It dulls slower, is more forgiving when sharpening, feels more smooth and predictable when cutting. The downside is ofc that it cuts slightly slower, but I'm ok with that. I'm not really a fan of the Green chains(RM3, RS3, PM3, PS3), they just make bore cutting slower, yes they do kickback less violently, but I always keep on top of that so it's not an issue for me.
The only thing the green and yellow signified is a pro chain (yellow) or homeowner (green) safety low kickback chain... the low Kickback chain has an extra bumper next to the raker to reduce kickback.
The green is a safety (low kickback) chain and the yellow is a non-safety chain. You can get any grind in either safety/non-safety configuration. One thing you will notice between the two, you can not bore cut very well with a safety chain. You won't notice too much difference doing normal cutting with either safety or non-safety chain. I do a lot of bore cuts on large blow downs that are elevate above the trail, so I only use non-safety skip tooth on a McCulloch 10-10 or 7-10. The reason you can not bore cut very well with a safety chain is because the rakers are taller than the cutter on the tip of the bar hence reduced kickback potential.
Now you need to try Stihl gold chain. I've been using it for years. With all the sugar sand in all the wood near the beaches it makes really good sense.
I've always used the green chain on my MS270C; it's the best saw and chain combo I've ever owned! I Stihl can't believe how smooth it cuts and runs! 😉😂
I use the super till dull. I then change the angle and increase depth of cut. Like a hot saw through butter. No I do not loan out or let anybody else use my saw. The kickback possibilities are greatly increased.
You probably won't notice much difference between the 2 chains on the smaller saws. Run the same test on a bigger saw like a ms 390, ms 360 or maybe a ms 460-saws that use the bigger 3/8 pitch chain. You will notice a difference I think. Also, just because a chain has a semi-chisel design doesn't make that a "green" chain. Stihl also has a "yellow" semi-chisel chain. It would be the 26 RM chain for your ms 260. The 26 RM3 chain is considered "green" because it is Stihl's "safety" (low kickback) designated by the number 3. Green chain has an extra "hump" on the driver lug next to the raker hump.
The full chisel cuts faster, bigger chips, BUT gets dull faster. The semi-chisel does not cut as fast BUT stays usably sharp longer. Don't see much difference with softer/wet wood and clean, mostly dirt-free work area. (Just heard you say that!). When I cut pine in the mountains I use full chisel... BUT when I cut almond wood in orchards (lots of dirt and harder wood) I have found the semi-chisel chain holds-up better. Very impressive to cut soft wood in clean work-space with powerful saws (example: Stihl MS 362C & MS661C) with sharp full chisel chain... chips really fly! I find STIHL chains the best... strictly my opinion. I CUT stumps now with semi-chisel chain LENGTH-WISE - "rip". Easier to handle the pieces rather than try to load/move full size stumps & the bigger pieces. Takes a powerful saw - and semi-chisel chain. I even cut/file/grind/sharpen the chains I RIP with a little flatter. At 73 I need all the help I can get!
Actually, the 3 after RM and the green label signify that it's "reduced kickback" chain, which has an extra bumper next to the depth gauge. Stihl sells chain with both types of cutter, full chisel and semi chisel, with a green label. Mike is testing RS and RM3, but you can also buy RM (semi chisel with no extra bumper) and RS3 (full chisel with the extra safety bumper). The color of the sticker doesn't denote the type of cutter.
Agree. Glad someone pointed this out. I aways run semi chisel, and I've gotten both green ("reduced" kickback) and yellow.
The way to tell if you have reduced kickback chain if you aren't savvy with numbers they have bumper "teeth" on each link so if you hit a log with the tip of your bar it doesn't fling upward it just deflects it and let's the actual cutting tooth take a TINY Nick out of it
Semi chisel is meant for dirty or icy wood the tooth edge will last longer because if you hit any dirt at all with full chisel, instantly dull
Rite on, I was confused there for a second! I purchased a new Yellow label 26RM just today that is micro chiseled...still a good video, keep up the good work.
I LOVE FACTS AND TRUE INFORMATION 👍 THANKS ALOT
Stihl makes RS (sharper and shaped like a 7, pointy) and RM (more of slope angle, think of it shaped like a question mark?) chain. Both RS and RM come in green and yellow versions.
All the green denotes is that there is an extra tie strap to help reduce kickback. Also plunging with green chain is harder.
Winner.
Years ago "R" was for Rapid. A more aggressive cutter.
@@anthonythorp7291 It still does. RS means Rapid Super and RM means Rapid Micro.
Thanks Mike, as it seems there might be some confusion I found this.
Green (go) marks those products which are designed to reduce the risk of kickback injury and comply with the ANSI B175. 1 kickback standard. ... Yellow (caution) marks products with increased risk of kickback injury.
RS stands for 'Rapid Super' and RM stands for 'Rapid Micro'. RS chains are full chisel, and typically cut faster (but you have to maintain proper sharpening and angles to continue to have that performance). ... RM is a semi chisel chain, and doesn't get as dull as fast as RS chains (therefore it is lower maintenance).
... and since a dull chain makes much more than ~1sec difference per cut, it appears his amateur testing would suggest most users are better off with a micro/semi chisel.
I spent many years in the woods as a chaser and one of the most valuable tips I learned was to run a chisel-bit chain and most importantly, to file it with a 3-sided flat file. A round file creates a cutting edge that is considerably weaker than that sharpened with a "flat" file. Once youve run a chisel-chain, properly sharpened you'll never go back, although they WILL be more prone to "kickback" because they are taking a more aggressive "bite", so maintaining proper control of the saw is critically important.
All you say is true... I've tried it BUT in hardwood and dirty conditions semi-chisel chain will go longer without sharpening - my opinion!
i have used both, back when i was logging and bucking up logs that had been hauled out of the woods by a skidder, i used what they call the micro, or round corner chain, the reason was if the logs had dirt on them, and they often did, your chain would stay sharp longer, no sharp corner like the chisel to get burred over, when in the woods falling i used the full chisel, everyone did this.
Darn good point you have there. Pun intended. You may have just perfectly described the "why" for each one of these chain styles
There is a different.
I refer to these chains as a flat top, and the other as a safety chain.
The flat top chain could be purchased as less expensive after market, and is the preference for cutting firewood.
The safety chain, or anti kick, is best for wood carving, and/ or cutting in areas with a good chance of hitting an undesirable. Say, cleaning up an old homestead.
The safety chain will be damaged less when hitting an obstacle.
The flattop chain will get extensive damage losing 1/3 to 1/2 each time an undesirable is encountered.
micro/semi-chisel is best for homeowner general use imo. 10% slower than chisel, sure, but it gives that time back by not having to stop and sharpen as often.
The micro and the simi chisel are the same thing, different manufactures call them by different names!
The folks at Stihl store say it’s about kickback. Green for Homeowner’s/ amateurs and yellow for pros. Safety.
Look forward to your results video.
That's what I've been told as well.
That is correct. Chisel vs Semi Chisel
JP Lawns&More not quite. You can get both chisel and semi chisel in green and yellow. It’s the extra bit on the link after the raker on the green that gives it the low kick back.
Right on moo man
Compare lemons to lemons. Both chains are available in full chisel. The green does cut a bit slower, has the anti kickback drags. Green chain is supposed to be safer, made for part timers. Yellow is the pro chain.
Once Oregon came out with a chipper chain I've always stayed with a chisel design. It makes a difference if you're going to spend all day out there. Semi chisel works well enough. I don't like any chain with an antikickback feature built into it, but I've always been an aggressive cutter so I've never relaxed or been distracted while cutting.
what exactly is a "chipper" chain?
Unfortunate that the kick-back resistant chain (green VRS yellow) got confused with the design of the cutter! I do not us the "anti-kick-back" chain, very few experienced saw-men do. As far as the design of the cutters: I like many use both - depending on conditions, hardness of the wood, dirty or not. Just try using a full chisel chain when cutting in an almond orchard or other really hard woods. Hard wood & dirty conditions dulls full chisel chains much faster. You will be changing chains much more often with the full chisel. I have had to change a full chisel chain after just a few cuts in dirty on-the-ground dry almond, oak, eucalyptus. Cut much longer with the less sharp BUT more durable semi-chisel chain. For SOFT WOOD & cleaner conditions I LOVE full chisel chain! Get done quicker and get to go home sooner! More than my opinion.
The full chisel wants a nice clean log, like standing timber. The semi doesn’t mind a little dirt. It’s a better choice for cutting timber that was already down.
I agree full chisel cuts faster dulls easier, semi chisel cuts just a bit slower but doesn't dull as easily
I recently just tried the yellow and was amazed how fast it went from cutting like a beast to cutting hardly at all from hitting a little dirt. It went bad so quick that I was looking at my cuts for a hidden nail in the trunk that I might have struck.
In Germany Stihl explains the differences as follows. Chains with low cutting tooth profile are called PICCO. Chains with normal profile are called RAPID. Picco is designed for small chainsaws with low power output. The chains are more narrow and run in 1.1 or 1.3 mm gauges while RAPID uses 1.5 or 1.6 mm gauges and produce a wider cut. Narrow chains are offered to partly compensate for lower engine power and still producing a relatively fast cut but wearing down faster. Depending on what the chains are used for (cutting, carving,rescue etc) both types are partly available in 3 different variations:
MICRO, SUPER and DURO.
The codes will the be PM (Picco micro) PS (Picco Super) or RD (Rapid Duro) etc.
MICRO (includes the special editions PICCO MICRO MINI for the smallest saws and Rapid Micro Special for carving) The Micro range is a "semi chisel" chain construction that produces a softer cut and lower vibration as well as less risk of kickback for home and garden users.
SUPER is a full chisel , edgy design for fast cuts and longer intervals between re-sharpening. The cut is fast and more aggressive for professional users and chainsaw high power output.
DURO is equipped with carbide tips and offers up to 10 times longer usage before re-sharpening. It is also used for the RDR chains (Rapid Duro Rescue)
what i noticed was the first cut , pretty much tells a good story ,
Well I'm a Stihl mechanic and I know that the rapid micro is meant for Hardwoods and dirtier woods and holds an edge better than the full chisel
I used to be a mechanic at a Stihl dealer. That was a pretty fun job.
Chainsaw Mike it was his name
Cutting logs is just his game
Firewood piles
Stacked for miles
All the work done
With Morgan smiles
Headed back to the house the sun goes down
Always a good time in Morgan town!
Add some music to that, that was good and don't forget the dogs
To much
It is always good to see a fellow western Pennsylvanian on CZcams. Just bought a new Stihl 261. I always try to use the green chains cause being an old mason for some reason I try and cut stone with them. It is my 9th Stihl product I own. They are amazing for the quality. Thank you for the great intel !
Thank you for this comparison side by side. It just proves that Stihl makes quality tools and equipment. Really very little difference, more personal preference and feel. Great video, thanks for the info you provide without bias
I haven't noticed much difference in speed really. I just hate untangling new chains lol. Like solving a damn Rubix's cube lol.
Lmao!
We ran the full chisel with rakers filed lower than recommended. This gave us increased production at end of day. We were using .045 supers and .056super for falling and large block stihls for bucking. We did get increased chain link wear and chain stretch thus more sprocket wear....Always a trade off...but worth it. Also more vibration...but those old stihls would eat the wood....big wood chips. Ah the good old days. Great vidios Mr. and Mrs. Morgan. Have a great day and good luck hunting..........Carry on my friend
Well the full chisel is speed falling or limbing, but if I had lots of bucking on the ground I always use the semi, it stays sharp longer and that means the most... I even have my back up saw on the ground for bucking and use the other just for falling if doing fire wood instead of logging.
Mike I have a 036 and started using the green chain and went to the yellow chain and never regretted it one bit . I felt that the yellow chain lasted longer and didn't stretch as fast . Osage orange is a very hard wood and that's what I cut most. 😊😊👍👍
Great comparison.
May be a bit late on this, but this doesn't seem right. The difference between Yellow and Green is whether or not it has the extra bumper behind the depth gauge on the drive link. This is what makes the difference in the colors. A Green chain is "low kickback" or "anti Kickback". A semi chisel or full chisel is available as "safety" or non safety chain.
The "3" after the part number is what denotes whether it's a safety chain or not. You can get a 26RS or a 26RS3. The 26RS3 will be a full chisel, safety chain with the extra bumpers on the drive links.
The letters after the 26 are what denotes the cutter type (semi chisel or full chisel). Typically (as you mentioned) the full chisel will cut faster but dull quicker when it gets into any dirt at all. The RM semi chisel will cut slower, but is more forgiving in dirty wood/contact with ground.
In summary,
The number denotes pitch and guage (according to Stihls chart on the box)
RS: Yellow, Full Chisel, non safety
RS3: Green, Full Chisel, safety (low kickback)
RM: Yellow, Semi Chisel, non safety
RM3: Green, Semi Chisel, safety (low kickback)
I didn't realize I've been using full chisel or "super" on my two MS291s because I never really asked anyone about it. I habitually go out each fall and replace both chains whether I need to or not just so I have a stock of new ones on hand...and they always throw chips and strings, barely any dust. Thanks for pointing out the fact that there is a difference and a choice. Hi Hunter!!
You can put 3/8 sprocket and chain on it, and it will cut faster and stay sharp longer.
Hello Mike, great video about the different chains, just like everyone else issues are what do you feel the best using. Stihl caters to everyone, professional and farmer/homeowners. Stihl tries to keep their products as safe as possible and allow the people to come up with what works for them the best. I like to be able to touch up my chain and have it cut like new every time I start it up. The full chisel is the easier to sharpen for me, I don’t care for the skip-tooth chain either. I am slowing down and enjoying myself when I’m cutting, I’ve got to where I earned that privilege before passing on the tools to someone younger, which is closing in too quick. Thanks for sharing with us, keep it safe and good hunting.
Hi Mike. I'd like to throw my two cents in. As stated by other comments green is anti-kickback chain but I think it cuts well out of the box. My experience is that it doesn't cut as well over time. And after sharpening it isn't as effective due to the anti-kickback links. it's an additional thing you have to grind off with your rakers. The green came with my ms391 but I have moved to the yellow chain for better cutting and more consistent sharpening
I'm not cutting for a living only trees around the house. I work for a business that deals commercial Stihl products as one of our lines, I picked up a yellow at cost put on my small 210 and I honestly prefer the green Low KB chain, didn't notice enough difference to justify the yellow, it seems to grab quicker than I thought it would.
My wife would like to thank you for showing all these Stihl videos, because the only thing on my Christmas list now is a Stihl chainsaw. :D
I've run both types of chain from both Stihl and Oregon on several of my saws. I get much better performance out of the yellow/full chisel chain. I also find that the full chisel is a lot easier to sharpen with a file. Very easy to tell whether the tooth is sharp or not.
The green or yellow has nothing to do with it being full chisel or semi chisel. You can get a full chisel green chain. Comparisons have shown they cut at the same rate.
The difference is in the raker link between the teeth. The green "low-kickback" chain has an extended raker that effectively blocks the cutting teeth as the chain rounds the bar tip.
The only advantage to a yellow chain in making plunge cuts which a green chain wont really do.
The RS3 (GREEN) chain found on Stihl's website...
"STIHL RAPID™ Super 3 is a reduced-vibration and low-kickback version of STIHL RAPID™ Super. RS3 is an aggressive, fast-cutting, full-chisel chain but has a single-humped drive link to reduce kickback"
@@rbhe357 I know what the differences are, I just wasn't going to waste my time going into detail on a youtube comment. Thank you for your response though. That said, my testing indicates that full chisel chain cuts faster for me. I don't recall the different models of chain from the different mfgs, but I mainly run Stihl RS3 chain on most of my saws. I've also run semi-chisel and safety chain from both Stihl and Oregon as well as full chisel from Oregon in both standard configuration (traditional single hump depth gauge), and the safety/homeowner configuration (double hump depth gauge). On my saws, with the way I have them set up, the full chisel chain with the traditional single hump depth gauge cuts noticeably faster. That said, my saws are not "stock", and I setup my depth gauges according to how I'm going to use the chain. Normally, that means shortening them because I run bigger saws with shorter bars and the shorter depth gauges put the saw's added HP and torque to use. That said, on a home owner grade saw that's 50cc or less, the difference between one chain and another is imperceivable.
The split screen comparison towards the end was perfect. Thanks for sharing!👍
I use the 33RSM 72 20” skip chain and the 33RS 72 20” with 3/8 pitch. I have an MS311 which replaced an 038 AV Super. I had used green chains for the 25 years I’d had it, ending with an 18” bar. I got the 2 yellow chains with the new saw and was amazed at how much easier it was to buck. The skip chain rips tight oak burl with ease and cuts 24”-30” oak without bogging. The full chipper does need to be sharpened carefully to keep it even and touching the ground will dull it quickly. Had I known about the full chipper earlier I suspect cutting with the 038 would have been quicker and easier. Most of my bucking is green/wet red and white oak. For years I split burl by hand. The skip chain is a whole lot easier.
Nice “vs” vid Mike! I started with green as a beginner.. less likely to kickback - now I always use yellow.. nice to see the speed diff. Seems minimal. But I think as the edge wears off, the green can bog the saw, where the yellow keeps going.
I use full chisel for softer wood and cleaner work-space. BUT FOR HARD, DRY WOOD I use semi-chisel, especially when the wood or the work-space is "dirty". The above works best for me. I am not cutting much soft wood now... now mostly almond, oak, ETC often mostly dry and dirty. I use STIHL semi-chisel and cut longer before changing the chain.
For Chains Saws ask Billy Ray, I have been trying Flat File, Super has bigger Chips for sure
I definitely agree with the comment on the semi chisel in dirty wood staying sharper longer. I keep both chains on hand and when I drag logs with the tractor I use the semi chisel and when I drop and cut I use the full chisel.
From the internet: Green (go) marks those products which are designed to reduce the risk of kickback injury and comply with the ANSI B175. 1 kickback standard. ... Yellow (caution) marks products with increased risk of kickback injury. There is another variation I found: RSC which is the comfort cut, and has a bevel on the back of the cutting tooth to help reduce vibration. Thank you for the video.
Old Hickory
I primarily cut hickory for firewood.
When I bought my first Stihl MS 251 (18" bar), it came with a green chain. About every two cuts in a 12 to 14" log, the chain would need to be sharpened.
I spent more time sharpening the chain that I did cutting wood.
Then, I heard about the yellow chain.
Now, I can cut hickory firewood all morning without stopping to sharpen the chain.
I was hoping to see a green vs yellow chain video with RM vs RM3 or RS vs RS3, but instead you mixed green/yellow and full/semi chisel so we don't know if it cut faster because it is full chisel or because it is yellow.
Yellow all the way. I used skip tooth Oregon chains on Husqvarna and loved them. When I bought my MS291 Stihl, the dealer said i 'd love the yellow on my 20" bar and I do. I would love to borrow that winch!!!
When sharp the Super does cut clean with less load on the engine.
Yes you are correct, dirt makes the difference. The chisel chain cuts fast but dulls fast in dirt. We stayed away from that in the spring mud season.
Great Comparison! Thanks for doing this! It seemed very little difference. The semi chisel seemed to take more power to run, and slowed the rpm of the saw a bit more IMHO. Speed of cut was pretty dam close tho. (Less than 1 second on a 13" log isnt much!) The Full chisel just seemed to run the saw at a tad bit more RPM, Maybe you were pushing harder on the semi chisel, Its a tough call . I would buy either blade tho and not worry about it.
Same as Justin said. Seams I can sharpen yellow better so that all I buy. I do have green for my 170 as I just buy whatever for that as all I use that for is small stuff and limbing. Thanks Mike, great video 👍
They all cut great out of the box....lol Once they get dull they never again cut as good as new... at least this is how it works out for me... I guess I just suck at sharpening them..lol
I bought a Stihl gold blade. Carbide. No more dull chains.
I have one too. Doesn't dull much. Problem is trying to find someone to sharpen them when they do dull.
Jeff Herndon how much did that cost?
@@wolfpack4128 Yeah my 2 Stihl dealers I go to won't sharpen them. One of the dealers doesn't even sell the chain. Sure I could find somebody to sharpen them. Why I haven't bought any really.
I barrowed one of them one time. Fence row wood.
As far as I know, the yellow chain is best for felling as it is more aggressive / faster - but on the other hand is really sensitive to get unsharp fast, if there is dirt involved somehow (at the stump or if the wood is on the ground) and less forgiving for kickbacks. If you are cutting a lot of wood, which is more likely in contact with the ground, the green chains stay sharp longer, nevertheless they are less aggressive and a bit slower. Ideally have both on site - and switch between them if conditions are changing. The way Stihls are constructed makes the change fast and easy enough.
Great info, have used both styles and came to roughly about same conclusions as you. A lot depends on the wood you are cutting but like the other comment about sharpening, the micro is harder for me to sharpen appropriately. Thanks for the side by side comparison.
Always like watching your CZcams videos good and honest STIHL makes the best chains.
I’m cutting Australian red gum iron bark hard wood
semi chisel chain they hold their edge a lot better.
I don’t really care about which chain cuts quicker .
The semi chisel is more durable in hard wood and smoother with less kickback.
Enjoyed as always. Excellent bit of editing to show the side by side cut comparison. Thanks!
The yellow chain, in the side by side portion of the video was throwing larger chips through the cut. Thanks for the comparison. Good information when I get another saw.
Faulty test, Rm also comes in yellow. The green means "safety chain" and has humped links to help home owners avoid kickback. Serious users never touch it.
404 RS or RM need equal care when operating.
The micro won’t dull as quick as the chisel when you are cutting wood with dirt. They both cut about the same when they are sharp. I logged for about 20 years and run both types
Thanks for the review! I have the same thing about the FC Getting dull sooner if you make ground contact.
Biggest thing between these 2 in my opinion are production. The semi chisel chain will stay sharper longer, and is ideal for dirtier wood. Thanks for all the videos as usual!!!
The full chisel cuts like crazy -- bigger chips from what I've always noticed. But they do give you a bit more vibration because of the aggressive action. If what some on here think is right (that the sharp point is more subject to dulling than the round one), that would certainly affect things.....though I've not really seen much of that in my wood lot. I will tell you, however, if you're up against a stack of hardwood logs (black locust, hedge, etc.) I've never seen anything get through them like a brand new full chisel. Last week I bucked up a big pile of black locust with a new chain and it was like a hot knife versus butter. The downside of any chain, of course, is that even if you do a good job of sharpening, they never seem to cut quite that way again. My saw shop guy said that Stihl uses laser technology to cut the steel at the factory and because of that when brand new they cut beautifully. Anyone know anything about Stihl factory sharpening?
It cuts faster, but you can make it a helluva lot faster if you take a couple passes on the rakers before you start. You also can't plunge cut with the green or safty chain.
The green chain is a safety chain, less chance of kickback. You can get semi-chisel on yellow chain too. The semi-chisel will work better in dirty logs, cuts a bit slower, but doesn't get full as quick.
I have been told the full chisel cut better but it will dull quicker if there is dirt in the bark. If you can keep your bark clean and are cutting trees fresh, then the chisel is what you want. Lots of loggers around here in Olympic Peninsula in Washington State and they like the full chisel. Chainsaw sales people look at you and if you don't appear to use a chainsaw for a living, they steer you away from the full chisel.
For me, the difference is when you accidentally hit some dirt. The Micro will stay sharper a bit longer. It doesn't have the point to get knocked off.
You are 100% correct. Easier and quicker 2 sharpen aswell.
The semi chisel is for dirty or frozen wood doesn't Dull as fast, the full chisel I for soft clean Woods. Chipper chain and tungsten carbide works better I dirt.
The green is a "safety chain" don't kick back as easily because of the double rakers.
the difference of these chains that the video is talking about is in the cutting teeth
the difference in low to standard kickback is in the shape and size of the rakers
what adds to the confusion is there are really 4 choices when you combine different teeth with different rakers
but as I mentioned about the unfortunate part is a guy making a video that doesn't really know what he is talking about and doesn't really use his saw right in the demonstration
@@DD-gi6kx what did he do wrong ?
Hey guys, I am a newbie using a chainsaw. My daughters bought me an MS 250 Stihl. I cannot get it started. Not sure what the problem is. The manual says there is possibly a decompression valve. I have not been able to find it. Any help or tips anyone could give me to get it started would be appreciated. I have watched videos of people starting the saw easily. It’s only been used once by a friend...
@@waynewilson2834 You may be flooding the engine, The MS 250 is somewhat notorious for flooding
let the saw sit for an hour
Set to full choke and pull cord only once or twice (you may hear it burp)
set to half choke and pull 3 times
If it has not started set it to idle and pull until it starts. Once you learn not to flood it from the start it should be easy. Hope this helps!
Working in the foods as a logger for awhile . The micro chain or ( yard chain ) as we would call it, where your bucking up logs or pulp, worked
better because it took the dirt better when the skidder dragged them out to the yard. Use the chisel tooth for dropping and limbing . That's why we always had 4 saws. 2 for felling and two for the yard. So in a way Mike you said that you noticed the green chain cutting better in the dirt and that's why, it stays sharper in the dirt. I know kind of a long explanation, but back in the old days when all you had was a chainsaw to get the wood out. You wanted to get the most out of your saw and chains.
I prune apple trees all winter. Get least one third more trees per day with a yellow chain. However, if your cutting smaller branches, you may want to use the green as it won't leave the branch left on the tree as ragged as the yellow one does.
Have always used the full chisel since 1979. Never used anything else. Creature of habit. If it ain,t broke …..
Thanks for making that clear. 👍
My stihl dealer didn't mention color choices when I picked up a new chain for a MS170. Maybe the pico chains don't have the options. Before this video, if he'd asked what color chain I wanted, I would have assumed Stihl Orange would be the only valid answer. Would be cool to hear a bit more about difficulty of sharpening well, and any difference in cost of chain.
ms170 has 3/8p .043 ga you can only get green semi chisel for that also the guys that throw 3/8p .050 ga fc on that saw always come in the shop with a shot p/c that saw cant handle any larger of a chain great saw and actually cuts better with the 16'' factory bar and chain hope this helps
@@crxlsvtecboosted Thanks for the great info. Sounds like a voice of experience, and I'll gladly take your advice to heart.
I recently got the RS chain for my MS271, I like it a lot better, esp. In hardwood. Not sure it's faster, but I feel its smoother, and less effort, plus when I am sharpening it, I can see better when its fully sharpened
Hallo we use the full chissel for soft wood and it works very well.for hardwood we use full chissel too but a fiend of mine file the chains in a very special way and it works pretty well to.i ve to mention he s a professional like buckin billy ray.all the best to little ty and his uncle hunter!👋
I had always ran chisel chain on my old 602 Echo professional saw. Worked very well in oaks , maple, beech, birch, pretty much any tree wet or ry.
Now you have to try the Stihl Carbide. I was cutting off tree stumps and the chain would dull so quick you could see the chips get smaller. I wanted a chain that would hold an edge longer in this demanding application. After seeing how long the carbide teeth on a stump cutter last I checked into carbide chain. My local dealer had the wheel to sharpen carbide chain so I tried one. Stihl claims they last 3 times as long as regular chain, but I think it is more than that. Try one on the chainsaw you use the most and pay attention to how much more wood you can cut before it needs to be sharpened. They are the RD series chains, and have a separate carbide insert in the cutting tooth. Don’t get the rescue chain with the triple hump safety strap. The triple hump safety chains vibrate bad in hardwood.
I will use the Green for limbing because it doesn't grab as bad but when it comes to the bigger stuff I prefer the yellow just because it throws larger chips which makes me think it cuts a little faster. Good video!
Good comparison. The semi chisel chain hold up better in dirty conditions. I been using it for years.
The semi stays sharp longer cutting dirty wood.
For felling and limbing I use the full chisel tooth.
Yep green chain is smoother in hardwood. I think those yellow chains really shine in some softer wood.
You can get a green RS3 chain instead of the RM3. It'll be full chisel instead of semi-chisel. The green and the 3 in the designator are for the safety lobes as part of the reduced kickback features. When it goes around the tip of your bar, the lobes stick out past the rakers, reducing the exposed cutting edge on the teeth. I've always been interested in a side by side comparison of two chains with the green vs yellow being the only difference, but I use them interchangeably (because I was shipped some 33RS3's instead of 33RS's by mistake).
I love a Full Chisel but for cutting firewood on the ground I prefer the semi chisel. One touch to the ground with the Full Chisel and it no longer cuts as well as the semi chisel after it's touched the ground. Even the dirt on a skidded log wipes out the edge off the Full Chisel faster than the Semi Chisel.
I love to hear those stihl saws rev up. I use a full chisel but the stihl dealer did tell me that they were more susceptible to kickback. Good luck 🦌huntin. Say hey to the family and yall HAVE A DAY 👍👍👍👍👍👍
The red oak that you where cutting had some nice growth rings. I think it would be good for bowl blanks. I think you would have some really nice bowls turned out of them.
RS is a little jumpy in spots but it sure cuts. I cut some two year old twenty inch test logs with min on my new MS 250, yesterday, to help break it in. It was its assignment.. it was its lfirst wood cutting. It is basically brand new saw. I have the same chain on my other 250 and the green chain on my recently restored Stihl 025. All three will be cutting, today.
I'm surprised at all the guys that didn't know there was a difference. Hell yea it cuts better. Full chisel or yellow dot makes hardwoods seem like soft butter. I run a yellow dot on my MS-391 That I did a muffler mod to. This summer I'm putting twin turbos on it and a big thumper cam😜
As many people have stated, the main difference between the two chains is the shape of the cutter - specifically the corner of the top plate. As shown at minute 3:50 of the video, the shape of the cutter on the yellow chain (shown just below the yellow square on the box) shows a very sharp point on the corner of the top plate. This chain cuts very well until it encounters dirt, rock, steel, etc. and the sharp point gets dull and then the cutting speed drops off significantly. The shape of the corner of the top plate of the cutter on the green chain (again shown just below the green square on the box) is more rounded rather than being a sharp point. This shape is more "forgiving" when cutting dirty logs and allows more cuts to be made before the chain needs to be resharpened. Many loggers use a chisel (yellow) chain to do the tree felling as it cuts a bit faster and they use a semi-chisel (green) chain on the landing to buck up logs that get dirty when being skidded on the ground. There are basically three cutter shapes - chisel (sharp corner), semi-chisel (partially rounded corner) and chipper (very rounded corner). I have some tree felling videos on CZcams at brilaw84
From a guy that grew up in western PA and now lives in Oregon I’d say this video checks all the boxes! Thanks and I guess I’ll stick w the green chain.
The semi chisel will tolerate dirty cutting conditions better than a true chisel chain. Once the sharp corner is blunted on a chisel tooth it starts to cut slower with more load on the engine. I cut from the clean side of a skidded log almost all of the way through. After many rounds are almost cut through I roll the log over and cut up with the top of the bar through the cut to the underside of the dirty bark. This throws the dirty bark off the end of the bar and doesn't drag the dirt into the cut. It also gets most of the cuts done with a sharp chain. Some times I do this on many logs saving the dirty cuts for the last. An old chipper chain will work longer in dirty wood than a semi chisel chain. I have some chipper chains that have a carbide layer electroplated on the tooth. They sharpen with a file and seem to last longer than a tooth with the chrome plating.
I agree with most of comments , only add that the Green would have added link to prevent kick back...
I noticed the Micro did make a smoother looking cut, without as many saw marks, so if you need a more finished look, looks like green's your choice.
I have about the same size “mini cabin” on my property with the same rectangular viewing windows. Although, mine is not a tree house. It has a lower level. Tree house is cooler, for sure. The deer will walk right along side it even when I’m in there.
Yellow was avg 1.5 seconds faster. I've always used the yellow on both my saws. May not seem like much different, but 2 saws cutting 4 hrs like we do on Saturdays to heat 2 homes makes life a lot easier and at end of day, you've worked less for more cuts and your back don't hurt as much fighting another 2 seconds per cut.
I was always told full chisel chain cuts faster than semi. The most important fact about the two types of chain is once the leading edge on the full chisel hits rock or dirt, the performance slows down. The semi chisel and chipper chain don't have a leading edge so they perform better when there is dirt etc on the logs. If the first part of the chain (leading edge) that cuts the wood first is dull, your performance drops considerably. That's why it's so important to make sure when you sharpen the chain the leading edge and top of full chisel is the sharpest and not the gullet.
They both seem to cut fine. The time difference really isn't a major factor. Nice hunting area !!!
I can hear the difference in the saw, it sounds like it loads down the engine more with the micro “green” chain.
I hear it too and I think on a bigger displacement saw it would out cut the yellow chain easily. This saw it too short on power to allow it.
The problem is that once the chisel even slightly loses the sharp corner, it cuts way worse than the semi chisel. This is particularly seen if cutting dirty wood. The semi chisel (RM) chain, doesn't suffer from this because the edge is rounded off and it handles lose of sharpness way better. So in this end both are good, for specific tasks: dry hardwood/dirty logs? Semi chisel. Clean, green wood? Full chisel.
That's bc the green is low kickback
It's got either extra rakers or a safety bumper. It's creating more drag/resistance on the engine
I usually upgrade to a full chisel on all my new saws, but I was really surprised how close they were on a big log like that. On the first cut the difference was hardly noticeable.
I wondered about the vibration you spoke about being more on the yellow chain. When I watched your play back side by side, I noticed that when you ran the yellow chain, you didn't have the saw body always contacting the log. A lot of the time you were a 1/4 to 1/2 inch away and only when you were dogged in were you in full contact with the log. The full chisel should cut faster, however, note that new chains are not razor sharp out of the box. For an accurate test, try cutting the log exactly the same way in each cut. Elevate the log off the ground so you don't have to slow down to avoid hitting the ground. Take the dogs off, let the saw cut level without changing angles or adding downforce to the saw body. You will probably see a larger difference between these two chains.
They yellow chains are the only way to go. Cuts faster, and much easier to sharpen.
You can often get more done with semi chisel especially in frozen wood.
I use to run full chisel yellow. Switched to Oregon EXL saves money and just as hard believe it or not and Archer makes a great chain also.
Looked semi chisel cut faster than other when just letting it drop with no rocking motion. Side by side was cool.
Depends on the power of the saw full chisel is a ripping chain for hard woods excellent in soft wood 25/30 degrees 10% angel grouse chain semi chisel is a good all rounder
I prefer the RM chain. I just find it more user friendly, It dulls slower, is more forgiving when sharpening, feels more smooth and predictable when cutting. The downside is ofc that it cuts slightly slower, but I'm ok with that. I'm not really a fan of the Green chains(RM3, RS3, PM3, PS3), they just make bore cutting slower, yes they do kickback less violently, but I always keep on top of that so it's not an issue for me.
The only thing the green and yellow signified is a pro chain (yellow) or homeowner (green) safety low kickback chain... the low Kickback chain has an extra bumper next to the raker to reduce kickback.
The green is a safety (low kickback) chain and the yellow is a non-safety chain. You can get any grind in either safety/non-safety configuration. One thing you will notice between the two, you can not bore cut very well with a safety chain. You won't notice too much difference doing normal cutting with either safety or non-safety chain. I do a lot of bore cuts on large blow downs that are elevate above the trail, so I only use non-safety skip tooth on a McCulloch 10-10 or 7-10. The reason you can not bore cut very well with a safety chain is because the rakers are taller than the cutter on the tip of the bar hence reduced kickback potential.
Now you need to try Stihl gold chain. I've been using it for years. With all the sugar sand in all the wood near the beaches it makes really good sense.
That's a carbide chain, right ?
Yes, exactly.
I've always used the green chain on my MS270C; it's the best saw and chain combo I've ever owned! I Stihl can't believe how smooth it cuts and runs! 😉😂
It’s also called Full Comp and yes it’s much faster but. Once they dull you can’t full chisel grind them!!!
I use the super till dull. I then change the angle and increase depth of cut. Like a hot saw through butter. No I do not loan out or let anybody else use my saw. The kickback possibilities are greatly increased.
You probably won't notice much difference between the 2 chains on the smaller saws. Run the same test on a bigger saw like a ms 390, ms 360 or maybe a ms 460-saws that use the bigger 3/8 pitch chain. You will notice a difference I think. Also, just because a chain has a semi-chisel design doesn't make that a "green" chain. Stihl also has a "yellow" semi-chisel chain. It would be the 26 RM chain for your ms 260. The 26 RM3 chain is considered "green" because it is Stihl's "safety" (low kickback) designated by the number 3. Green chain has an extra "hump" on the driver lug next to the raker hump.
The full chisel cuts faster, bigger chips, BUT gets dull faster. The semi-chisel does not cut as fast BUT stays usably sharp longer. Don't see much difference with softer/wet wood and clean, mostly dirt-free work area. (Just heard you say that!). When I cut pine in the mountains I use full chisel... BUT when I cut almond wood in orchards (lots of dirt and harder wood) I have found the semi-chisel chain holds-up better. Very impressive to cut soft wood in clean work-space with powerful saws (example: Stihl MS 362C & MS661C) with sharp full chisel chain... chips really fly! I find STIHL chains the best... strictly my opinion. I CUT stumps now with semi-chisel chain LENGTH-WISE - "rip". Easier to handle the pieces rather than try to load/move full size stumps & the bigger pieces. Takes a powerful saw - and semi-chisel chain. I even cut/file/grind/sharpen the chains I RIP with a little flatter. At 73 I need all the help I can get!