Minas Tirith Tactics - Middle Earth SBG
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- čas přidán 30. 06. 2024
- In this video Kevin teach you all you need to know about Minas Tirith and the Legiondary Legions. Let us know what you think of the channel and support us by subscribe and comment. Thanks guys!
We also do a dice set giveaway. Watch the outro to hear more about it.
Chapters of the video:
00:00 Intro
01:40 The Armybonus
02:51 King Ellesar
04:36 Boromir, captain of the White Tower
07:38 Gandalf the White
09:40 Denethor
11:53 Hurin, Warden of the keys
14:16 Faramir
16:05 King of Men
16:48 Captain of Gondor
17:25 Ingold
19:14 Irolas
20:12 Madril
21:13 Ranger heroes
22:03 Beregrond
22:50 Cirion
23:27 Sieges
28:07 Gondor warriors
29:13 Rangers of Gondor
30:17 Fountain Court Guard
31:30 Citadel guards
32:40 Knight of Gondor
34:28 Legiondary Legions
37:30 How to play
45:07 How to beat
50:34 Listbuilding
58:05 Outro - GIVEAWAY - Hry
Easily the best MESBG videos on youtube, do more please.
My army project for 2023! Perfect timing. These videos are so in-depth, I really appreciate the content. Wishing all the best for your channel. Please keep up the great videos.
Thanks man! And you're welcome. These are a lot of fun to make :)
This is perfect. I was gifted the osgiliath box for Christmas and decided to go with gondor. I love all the advice in this video. And those dice sure are gorgeous.
Great summary of the Gondor list! Especially the Shout-out to Eorl the Young is much appreciated as a fan of niche lists that still contains a lot of fluffy elements. On that note, is missed the Osgiliath Veterans and their combo with the brothers. It is such a shame that Faramir and the veterans did not get some renewed love with the new Boxset... Love to debate some armylists in the future with you guys (and throw some DICE!). Keep up the great work!
Yeah I totally forgot about the vets. They are awesome, thematic units, but really not that great for their cost. You don't need the increased courage (bodyguard is better), and F4 can be more reliably gotten from rangers and FCG. It's a shame, because the theme (and conversion opportunities!) is great
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 the conversions are so fun! A pity I'll probably never run them 😅
Starting playing MESBG for the first time in 15 years this year with Minas tirith and this video is so helpful.
My local areas normally play around 450pts and I'm struggling because gobdors heroes are either really expensive or really cheap.
This has been a huge help!
Love the Videos, you've Just recently been recommend to me by a friend of mine and the quality of your Videos hooked me instantly. Its realy astonishing you dont habe more subs. Keep up the great quality, maybe in a Mordor deep dive i would really appreiciate it.
Hahahhaha great comment, a Rohan video would be also great :)
Thanks man, I really appreciate it. Mordor is definitely in the cards. But I've only recently started playing it, and it is a big faction, so it will take a while. Corsairs are up first!
These videos are very useful and I really enjoy listening to them! Thanks for putting out amazing content. Dice!
Really great overview! One of my favorite armies to use for sure, Boromir is a beast and the amount of stuff you can work with is fantastic. Would love to see more videos like this for other armies. Checking out the ones that you've already done
I like this format and the way you discuss things. Very comprehensive and insightful! Pretty hard to make videos as a one man team but do keep making as this is encouraging for the community!
Really good guide. The best i saw yet. Very informative and understandable. Would like to see more of this quality faction videos;)
Great video as always! I learned a lot especially about the larger heroes. Thank you! DICE!
The best video to the MiddleEarth SBG lowkey! Thanks :)
Confirming about many of my own thoughts about Minas Tirith, especially about rangers with spears and fountian court gaurd. Cool idea about Denethor, never would have thought of that. Great video, i learned a lot. Thanks.
I've been collecting MT recently and just built up a 800pt list. Got my first competitive game in a few weeks so going through this stuff has helped a lot. Great insight, thanks man!
Really nice video, Kevin!! I'd like to participate in the Giveaway Dice, awesome dices by the way. Congratulations, you know a lot about Minas Tirith, now I have to crush them in the battlefield with your tips!
I am excited to see a video like this about Rivendell
im brand new and just picked up the battlehost, the level of insight i got from this video is nothing short of incredible. thank you so much for sharing ya brain!
Welcome to the game! I hope you get a lot of fun out of it. Glad I could help :)
A good slice and dice! of Gondor. I am looking at building a Gondor army next, moving on from Battle for Osgiliath and Captain Boromir.
Denethor is Key in Gondor and becomes even better with Hurin in the list with his special rule about not giving away leader kill Vps so Denney is even more safe.
Old mate Denny slaps hard with his 2A F5 S4 Mental, don't mess with him in combat. Fav saying with him is "gonna attack Denny?" "Cool fuck around and find out"
Boz with banner is amazing and In my opinion is a support hero. Banner, shield and on foot is the best way to run him.
Being that Gondor is a defensive army boz sits behind the line buffs troops and then you use your troops and other heroes to drain the might of enemy heroes, then late game boz pops out full stack and slaps everyone out.
Ingolds is also a must take in Gondor
Shield wall, no back away, 3 might, and striking. He is top tier at keeping the shield wall still and draining the might of your opponent heroes.
800-1000pts
Denney
Boz banner
Hurin horse
Ingold
Is the perfect hero setup
P.s.
I had a whole essey written and had to delete alot hahaha
P.p.s
MARCH IS OVERATED
P.p.p.s
You don't always buy heros horses.
-Sean
I really don't see the point of keeping bozza behind the line when he can just be in the line and slapping troops or tanking heroes. What are they gonna do? He's F7 with 6 might, 3 wounds and 3 fate. Horse is always worth it, especially on more expensive heroes. Even if they don't get use out of it while charging, it protects them from other cav heroes, gives them mobility, an extra wound against shooting, etc etc. If you don't need it in a specific situation you can always dismount. March is overrated, except when the scenario is seize the prize and it can literally win you the game 😅
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060
horses make heros bigger targets and more of a priority Target and in most cases die early to shooting unless you hide the hero on horse. I've never found it worth it.
Hurin on horse is worth it tho.
Boz staying behind the lines It's the play style of Gondor as a defensive Army.
You tank hits and might from your opponents heroes with troops and low point heroes ingold, Hurin and cirion do it best, mainly due to the striking ability.
It's true Boz is not a killing hero or a beat stick, he is a hand grenade.
Buffs everyone around till the opportune moment to jump in and kill a hero or something with his F7 6 might.
You don't wanna be striking with boz unless you have to, such as when facing a base F7 model. you wanna use his might to confirm kills, which is why he sits and waits whilst you draw out strikes, moves, marches, combats with your troops and smaller heroes.
Gondor wins games by holding the opponent up, so they can't get to objectives whilst grabbing VPs and Objectives.
If your opponents control objectives you shoot them with, well usually in my case a Bolt thrower or 2. Once you know where Objectives and and what are that's when you decide
What Objectives will I hold and what objectives will I not get but deny my opponent VPs.
Though I have achieved many 12VP victories with Gondor it's an army that thrives on winning games with scoring the lowest amount of VPs possible.
Movement and deployment are key factors in playing Gondor and winning tournaments with them.
Sorry to go on a rant, as a multiple tournament winning player with Gondor I'm just super passionate about them.
Keep up the videos mate love watching them whilst painting, especially these long form chats
-Sean
@@NoobsandMen nah not to worry mate! I love these kind of discussions. I definitely agree on the low vp scoring aspect. The ability to deny your opponent VP's and just get away with a small win is great in this army list.
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 that's what's brilliant about this game aye. We can have these discussions because there are so many ways to play an army and it's all still viable.
-Sean
say it louder for the people in the back march is OVERRATED
Great video as I am new to Gondor and looking forward to making my army. Thanks!! DICE!
Just started Minas Tirith, seriously amazing video thanks a bunch!
DICE ;-)
And thank you for the in-depth discussion of Minas Tirith. It was very insightful, and I will definitely share it with our league players.
Love this, can't wait to hear about other factions. Really enjoy your conversational style
Thanks Henry :)
These tactics videos are very well done, in depth, but clear. great content to listen to while painting, even if i dont play the army myself (it is my main opponents army however XD). also DICE. cheers from australia
Well done! I am devouring this content and looking forward to more! Also, dice!
Awesome video man, keep it up! More competitive focus is what drives MESBG forward
Thx these are by far the helpful videos that no one else makes
Good to see that there are other people in the Netherlands playing MESBG, got into it recently and have been getting my friends into it too!
Awesome good to hear that. There is a huge discord community.
If you haven't found the discord yet, give us a shout!
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 could you direct me to the community? I also live in the Netherlands and I was thinking of taking up the hobby again.
Me and my friends have played this game for almost a year now, but 'it was actually quite recent that I bought my army. And I'm very glad I chose Minas Tirith. I only have the battlehost now, but soon I will expand and thanks to this video, I know what I'm gonna spend my money on. Dice!
Never not spend money on dice ;) have fun, glad I could help!
this is a great video and huge inspo for any starting out channel!
Llooking up on how to defeat Iron Hills, Rivendell and Harad. Hopefully with your analisys because this video is so good
A FANTASTIC in depth video on Minas Tirith, and just in Time for todays game night, so i watched everything beforehand and it really helped! I do really like the format, soo keep it up and surely this channel will continue growing to reach more people. Maybe a Collab with another big MESBG youtuber could Give a nice boost! Looking forward to the following Tactics videos, especially on Isengard and Rivendell, oh and dice 😄
Love how two of my favorite models are also the ones you hate xD Love playing with both Faramir and Gandalf despite their high cost.
There's nothing wrong with fielding the models you love! But since I'm looking at stuff from a purely competitive standpoint I have to point out they are suboptimal :)
Excellent video with great insights
I love these reviews! I would really like it if you were able to do this for ever faction. Or even just getting your opinions on each one
Irolas has March and Defence not Strike. With his D6, F5 and Bodyguard this can make him a viable alternative to Madril.
Particularly if you know you are not going to play a Maelstrom scenario / Recon (for example in a 3/4 game tournament or a tournament where the scenarios are set)
That being said I do normally take Madril 😅
Yup I completely missed that! He's certainly not a bad take at all. Though similarly I'd probably end up taking madril for the maelstrom insurance, since I mostly also bring siege when the points are high enough that I'm slotting in Madril. I'd definitely field him to try him out if I'd own him, but somehow it's not tempting enough to justify buying him+fw denethor. Hope that makes sense?
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 Yeh I know what you mean! There is a good 3D file available for him
@@davygravy2 I'll give that a look when I get my printer up and running
Again, very interesting. Learned a lot from it. Gandalf the White and Faramir can move to the modelcabinet 🙂. Would love to get my hands on these dice!
Love this video series. You should do more factions!
Really good video! Keep it up!
Great video 👌 thanks 🙏
Love the video. Instant subscription. Would love you doing it for Isengard, Mordor and Rohan.
Faramir, Madril and Beregond are the perfect base hero's for a solid list. I bring boromir with banner for 500 plus points games
Just take húrin instead of faramir.
Great video! Just found your stuff. Excellent.
Thanks Steve :) enjoy!
Great video and a beautifull dice :)
Fantastic vid man very knowledgable. I've always wanted to try a tincan spam army at 800pts, Just as many as I can get with low Teir heros, not sure it would be viable at all but would like to give it a bash. DICE
Honestly fortitude and minor hero only minas tirith is pretty fun. You can absolutely spam heroes and units. You end up with great numbers and lots of might, but you do run the risk of just becoming the punching bag for the opponent's big toys, especially at that kind of points level.
@Kevin van Ravenswaaij I'll need to give it a bash then. What hero's to prioritise, the same as the vid? Ill just need to manage their big toys with tincan screen or strikes.
@@jmaccsarmiesofmiddleearth at that points level you could probably run all of them? I'd still skip cirion, but the rest are all pretty good. Might as well make irolas your leader. Or take denethor anyway and hide him somewhere.
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 Sweet man thanks for the tips ill start writing a list. Shame i love the Cirion model I wish he was more viable :(
DICE ...
Excellent video. I literally just started with MESBG with the Osgiliath box and MT Battlehost box.
Local club I found is running some introduction games 500pts. I played 1 game with the Farmir / Madril / Damrod heroes that came with the box.
Thanks to your video I'm thinking 'outside the box' and juggling between (still 500 points).
OPTION 1
Boromir + 4 Guards of Fountain; 9 Warriors
Madril + 8 Rangers; 3 Guards of Fountain
OPTION 2
Hurin + 9 Guards of Fountain; 3 Knights
Ingold + 8 Warriors; 4 Guards of Fount
Beregond + 3 Rangers; 3 Citadel Guard
Hi there! A bit late to the party after one year, but so far I have only Gondor, which I love and I've found your videos very very helpful and fun. I'm running on Sunday a 600p list which I wanted to try new stuff and make it a bit unconventional. I have Faramir with horse and lance, a Knight of the White Tower for intfantry hero and Anborn and Mablung with Rangers. I'll let you know how it went and I got into thinking of making an evil army list with Corsairs and Suladan. You convinced me haha. Thanks again!
Maybe my next army to collect 🤔 love those dice !
Love the video! And dice
As a newbie to mesbg this video is goated
23:00 Cirion is also fun to play if you want to include murin&drar.
Very nice and informativ Video! You are clearly very experienced! Please more :D
I agree with most! So sad about Gandalf, i want to play him but he is just not competitiv...
Boromir and Hurin for me are must have picks, because you will really lack the damage threat if not.
Would love to see 1 or 2 complete example Armylist 500-800 Points~ you can recommend.
I think most people watching these kind of Tactics analysis Videos would be interested in that, espacially because Gondor has so many Options.
PS: I think you forgot Osgiliath Veterans. I never picked them yet, but worth a mention. :)
Thanks so much for your work! Keep it up!
Cheers
You are absolutely right I forgot about the vets! I also forgot about pippin. Both for a reason I guess, they're not very competitive haha!
These videos are awesome, guys! They are very useful and interesting! Please, keep them going!
The Minas Tirith conversions look amazing. Did you do them yourself?
Dice!
Great analysis, loved watching it! I wonder how you would run a purely tin can list on a competitive level. Would you still max out on shooting but with citadel bows? Take a second bolt thrower instead? Or just get in a few bows and focus more on combat units?
Also, interesting that you mention the swift reload as an auto pick. I did the calculations on it once and it turns out that a bolt thrower with swift reload is actually less efficient than one without. Average shots go up from 3,5 to 4,47, which is 1,28 times more, while the points cost goes up from 50 to 70, which is 1,4 more. So from that viewpoint I'd say that, unless you have the 20 points spare with no other purpose, you might be better off either running a second one or adding a bit more numbers.
And of course I'd love getting those dice 😊
I would love to see a high point Gondor batrep where you demonstrate some of this advice or at least the theory behind the list-building and the strategy.
thanks for the info mate ! very usefull
So after a eigth year break (and lots of Horus Heresy) I decided to bring out my LotR Miniatures again. I used to play Easterlings and Gondor in War of the Rings, so I have lots of basic units and some of the old heros (Amdur, Khamul, cirion and a few commandsections). I am really grateful for your insights in both armies and will probably pick up the Dragon Emperor and the Rest of the FW Range. Really looking forward to get my hand back on a nice and balanced Skirmisher. Whats next on the List? What armies do you play and what will be featured next? Oh ye also DICE.
Next up would probably be corsairs! I only make these videos about factions I've played a good amount at tournaments, and it takes time to paint armies and run them a lot. I could also do a shorter video on the Eorl the Young list I mentioned
So little subscribers to such great channel! I've watched your vid on Easterlings, now watching this one... The army compositions and ground analysis of each and every hero and unit are sooo good, tips are useful too. It is really nice to listen a person who knows what they are up to and share experience in very simple, attractive and interesting way. Really enjoy these videos, please keep going to do next videos on how to play army X (at least please do so for LoTR armies, as Hobbit ones are not that much enjoyable - too many OP characters that break the balance IMO, like e.g Azog with F7...seriously? GW puts an orc in par with the highest king of Numenor in exile? That is bad joke at least).
Cheeky dice giveaway eh? Don't mind if I do. Stay hydrated!
Great video
really cool and interesting video :)
Never played mesbg but your presenting style is great
these tactics series is mint ! Will you cover more armies in the future ?
Definitely! Next up is probably corsairs, but it will take a while.
Hey! Great video, I was thinking about starting my adventure wit SGB with Gondor I want with Isengard becouse I prefer the esthetic of it and I love the painting so far! So could you make a video on the army of Saruman? I’d also love to use your dice at the first tournament I’ll be playing next month. Keep the great work up 😊
Personally I don't play isengard, but maybe we can get another player in the community to do a video on that faction
Wow where did you get the 3rd party beregond from?
I can't wait for a mordor tactics..
Good video guys! You clearly put a lot of effort into the video! It also comes right in time, as im now making a MT list for a local tournament in Arnhem. Oh and lovely dice!
Have fun! I heard it sold out! Go on and represent the tin cans, I hope you do well :)
Why people forget about anbon and mablung? Those 2 rangers are quite good, and no-one is adding them to their descriptions. That first one gets 1 free might in shooting phase, so I would say it could be a must have
Awesome vid, Rohan next please!
Awesome video. Any chance you could do that for Rivendell as well?
I always found Minas Tirith to be a bit dull, except for Boromir and Aragorn Elessar. No special toys (except maybe the ballista) or specialties. I still much prefer some niche armies. Then again, I do like Easterlings (and the video you did on them), which do also feel like a strong shield wall army without too many toys (maybe some Kandish chariots).
Thank you for your insights (also DICE)
At least the Easterlings have brorgîr now, which gives you quite a few tricks! They also had/have khamul on fel beast as a potential add. Minas Tirith is just very vanilla. So if you're good at using those kind of units, you can do well with Minas Tirith. But it can feel a bit boring at times, I agree!
Nice video, did I miss the osgiliath veterans? I
They are the core to one of my new projects!
You didn't! I did make notes on them, but totally forgot to cover it. Sadly they're not really worth it in the army. They are very thematic, but if you want F4 the other options are far more reliable and do more for your army. As a 'elite' troop, they don't do enough. But they're still really thematic, so it's a shame they get outshone
Thank you for another awesome video just like the Easterlings!
Could i ask for Lothlorien at some point please 😀
Maybe we can get a guest presenter on the channel at some point. I don't play elves personally, but there are plenty in the community that do!
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 ok no worries that's awesome. Interested to see your future videos 🔥
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 guest presenters would be cool, you can give your perspective on the army as someone who has played against them too. These faction breakdowns have been truly excellent, very in depth and well presented. Quickly becoming my favourite mesbg channel.
Gandalf doesn't suck. He's a CC hero. He could probably use a bit of a price reduction.
That's the whole point - he's too expensive for what he does, making him a suboptimal pick.
Very good analysis! Where did you get the 3D models for the warriors of Minas Tirith? I couldn't find similar models online so far.
Bro love the video keep it up but where did you get all your bits for conversions or are they all hand made? Would live a link to more picks of the army or bits shops
Thanks for your video Kevin, it was very dice! Eh, nice! Question: what is a good ratio of points, warriors, bows and might? Is there a rule of thumb for this? Does it differ in evil vs good?
GvE always changes list building. You can expect more terror and numbers, and less F5 (other than Easterlings). Evil typically has more magic. So bodyguard becomes more useful, and taking a big hero is a bit more risky. You could try to leave boromir at home and go F4 horde instead, with lots of FCG, a healthy amount of rangers, and a frontline of regular warriors. Denethor is still a good pick, you just have to be careful with him. As for ratio, I try to fill up the warbands I have mostly. Always 1/3d rangers with spears, a few cav, the rest warriors and as many fcg as I can get away with. Following those guidelines you'll automatically end up with a certain amount of heroes and might.
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 Thanks for your reply! Seems like I've been doing it right, good to know :)
What model do you use as your mounted king of men? Amazing video thanks!
Both are from unreleased miniatures.
I need to know where to get those Fountain Court guards!
Any chance we might see a similar video for Rohan? 🐎 🐎
Best I can do is an Eorl the Young vid. I haven't played 'proper' Rohan in 15 years 😂
I play the legendary legion "rangers of ithilien" every now and then when I don't play army of gothmog and I have to say that I love faramir. Yes he is just like a captain but if you support him enough with some spear rangers he can be dangerous
Is there a website where we can see other people’s listing or tier list for armies and heroes I love your videos, but I’m interested in other armies like Rohan Isengard and Mordor
Such a Great Video! Any one knows where to find these alternative warrior of Minas tirith models or STLs?
Enjoyed the video. I started MESBG last year, and my only army so far is MT, and I have been struggling badly with it, so any advice is welcome.
I never really gave rangers a try because they die so easily, and never kill anything with shooting (unfortunately elves are super popular here), so I am going to see if bringing a 3rd of my army as rangers helps.
Do you think they perform better at lower points levels, as there seems to be a lot MT generally has no answer for at 800 points?
Also, did I see correctly that you will be attending the event in Belfast in July? If so, I will hopefully see you there (and maybe actually be good enough at the game by then to avoid the bottom tables all weekend!).
Aye! I'll be coming to Belfast, looking forward to meeting you there! I do think MT at 800 plateaus a little. You could look into bringing gwaihir in as an ally to spice things up a little. Rangers are really good overall, but if your opponent has elven shooting they might still out shoot you. It depends on the situation unfortunately.
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 yes I have found that MT struggle at 800 due to the lack of 2 big hitter heroes (if only Boromir and Aragorn could be in the same list), but it will be a while before I have a more "competitive" army for 800, as I am currently painting up some Army of Thror, who look like they also peak around 650. Angmar will follow though, so long term I hope to do well at 800 with them!
See you in July.
Where did you get the fountain court proxies? They look solid!
They are done by moya forge. Look for him on insta
Where did you get your third party sculpts from? They look amazing!
Ooh, me likes those dice!
love the video! I have to say though, hard hard disagree with gandalf. he has a very high skill floor, but is absolutely amazing- he offers so much to your army! shooting protection on a 2+, magic protection on a 3+ for himself and anyone else you need (banners, heroes, etc), the best movement of anything that doesnt fly, a free defensive will from shadowfax, fate on his horse, and 3 rerollable fate points on d6 means he's incredibly difficult to kill, he does great at killing troops, can totally nullify any other hero with immobilise and command, ringwraiths and any other spirits are terrified of him with the banishment, the list goes on and on and on. putting some time into learning how to use him correctly is the only downside!
We'll just have to agree to disagree then. Gandalf does do a lot and can be very useful in the right hands, but it still doesn't justify the points cost.
Just to put it in perspective: in a vacuum I'd already give a slight preference to boromir since I feel like he's more likely to be worth his points in any given matchup. Gandalf effectively is 50 points more expensive, after you add on the cost of the banner you need to bring because he doesn't have one (and boromir does): 265 vs 215. That's 5-6 extra bodies with boromir to sweeten the deal.
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 Gandalf spanks boromir every day of the week though, even with 6 extra infantry 😅 all down to personal preference, boromir is indeed very good
Hi, which caster would you add as an ally for MT lists?
Great Video.
I know I‘m a bit late but where did you get the alternative warriors of Minas Tirith from? 28:07
Search for moya forge :)
This video helped me very much in picking what miniatures to buy, btw are you dutch?
Yup! We are Dutch
Your thoughts on Anborn specifically? I was wondering if he's particularly good out of the ranger heroes.
Also, you think Cirion is worthwhile to bring in Murin and Drar?
Murin and drar are not worth it because they can't lead troops as wanderers. And they're not good enough on their own to be worth bringing in. What do they bring to minas tirith? They're solid options for iron Hills, though.
Awesome video/format! do you plan to make videos on other factions?
Thanks! And yes we do. It takes time though :)
@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 what are the other factions we could expect? really looking forward
@@hav6301 corsairs are probably next.
Heard people say not to use boromir mounted but on foot. Take hurin and a knight of minas tirith contingent. And take captains due to d8? Opinions
I mean, those are definitely opinions :)
Jokes aside, that seems pretty suboptimal advise. The idea that you need a cav warband is pretty outdated too, usually it is better to spread out your cav through your warbands. Ingold is better than a foot captain in every way. A horse is a massive force multiplier for a big hero for a very small investment, there's no reason not to put bozza on a horse.
Please do Assault on Lothlorian next!
Do the osgiliath veterans stack with both brothers nearby ? So they get f5 with boromir banner potentially F6? Or does it only boost +1f max? 😁
Only once unfortunately. So they can get to F5 with the boromir banner.
I would disagree about ABT upgrade. Average +1 shot ain’t worth 40% cost. You want more shots, take 2 ABTs.
Also 2 ABTs are much harder to play around for the opponent and do the job of forcing their hand way better.
It's an option, sure, but what the upgrade does more than anything is ensure reliability. 8/9 times you're getting 3+ shots, 75% of the time you're getting 4+ shots. With 2 ABT's it's both easier and harder to position them, and you're out an extra 30 points.
You always take swift reload on the bolt thrower.
I run 2 bolt throwers as well with swift reload on each. It's hectic
Never leave home without a Swift reload on your bolt thrower, they ain't 50pts they are 70pts, cause "say it with me now" you never leave home without swift reload
-Sean
@@NoobsandMen preach!
Can you do an Isengard list?
I should take all the time spears with shields in gundabad army? Trying to save some points and don t have shields.
I think you forgot to mention Osigliath vets. Are they any good?
The fact that I forgot about them should clue you in about how good they are ;)
They're not really worth taking. Which is sad, because they are really cool
If you're running boromir or faramir is it worth taking osgiliath veterans over normal warriors in their warband?
Honestly, not really. They're really cool, but if you want F4, rangers and fountain Court guard are better value.