Sam Seder Debates A Libertarian About Regulations
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- čas přidán 20. 08. 2024
- A caller contends that regulations are bad because no one follows them and they are just a money making scheme.
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Sam: What's on your mind well pretty much regulations?
Caller: I guess I’m a youtube fan of yours. And I work in air conditioning refrigeration. And regulations are kind of ridiculous with my industry as far as permitting and especially licensing. Licensing the requirements is unbelievable nowadays.
Sam: In Florida?
Caller: And pretty much any state I’m pretty sure regulations are nationwide.
Sam: Who creates those are those federal regulations or are they state regulations?
Caller: Actually the feds are getting into it now with energy efficiency regulations that the states are…
Sam: Adopting? So the feds have energy requirements right? I know that like they have it for you know home heating units. And they are they're saying it for I would imagine there are probably some for HVAC. But the vast majority of the regulations you're dealing with are being propagated by the Florida state legislature. but okay go ahead.
Caller: Yeah so compliance is pretty much up to the customer. I usually give a couple of quotes one with permitting one without permitting. And the permitting seems like it's just an unnecessary hassle that doesn't it doesn't really protect the consumer from anything.
Sam: The permitting I would imagine when you talk about permits that are going to be even more local right? You're not filing with a state agency to get the permit to build that you're I think you're probably. I mean if it's like new york if you're doing some type of construction work you are filing with maybe the county but probably the town or the city.
Caller: Yes but all the regular regulations are based on national standards. There's an organization called ASHRAE that that that produces standards every four years for energy efficiency for all kinds of stuff that my contractors. I mean they use them as references once in a while but they're not complied with. And obviously like inspectors are not going to check every single thing so it's pretty much impossible for the government to get involved in any of them this stuff. Pretty much the only reason that licensing and permitting exists in my opinion is just to steal money from the contractors and obviously from the customer because you have to increase the prices of what you're installing so. And the same thing goes for I’d imagine any industry you know I know about air conditioning and engineering. I also worked in the engineering field. And all that is just pretty much recommendations and with the engineers use them sometimes we use rules of thumb. And mostly to produce because if we're going to follow every single regulation we're not going to be profitable. So it's just an unnecessary hassle…
Sam: And so you don't think there should be any regulations in the context of let's say building buildings. Do you think that there should be requirements as to how much you know I don't know like maybe what the quality of the cement is? You're like you're in Florida is that right?
Caller: Yes.
Sam: Okay do you have any recollection of anything that might have happened in Florida over the past year that implicates let's say things like safety for building codes.
Caller: Yeah I watched your debate with Yaron Brook started talking about the building that fell. that's what you're talking about I guess. I’ve read up on that and it looks like it's eight years ago there was an engineer a private engineer that they hired to give him a report on the structure of the building. and they have their little you know community inside the building that they debate stuff and what gets funding and what doesn't as far as repairs.
This guy claims to be a libertarian, yet he was just publicly owned. Interesting.
Lol
This joke was funny on the first libertarian debate in 2004. Since then, not so much.
I see what ya did there silly goose you
Omg I’m totally using this
Nice Daxter icon bud
The existence of libertarians is evidence that government regulations work.
They have lived their whole life in a country that is regulated enough to make things safe that they (wrongly) believe if regulation was removed everything would be ok.
Wow. Thank you. That's an extremely good point. If buildings were falling down ALL the time no one would be a libertarian.
@Rob Mohamedally Yeah plenty of right wing libertarians here. They go through all these talking points like game of Bingo. And most of them are just your average middle class or upper middle class people, who have been taught by their industries to blame govt interference for everything.
@@thehulk525 they don't want to pay taxes. They want to exploit.
Right? The whole reason we have regulations is because humans couldn't function properly without them.
@Best Decoy Ever go to India then
Caller: "You can tell when someone doesn't know what they're talking about"
Got that right, buddy
👍👍👍👍👍
The caller is absolutely a shining example 😂😂
Explain open heart surgery to me then. And then perform it without getting trained.
@@firstlast9916 ...fucking what? What does that have to do with this? LMFAO.
@@firstlast9916 Oh, you actually think Sam doesn't have sources for his claims. LMFAO, GTFO.
I'm a simple man. I see Sam Seder debating a libertarian, I click.
It's like Christmas day when I see a new libertarian caller.
at first I thought it was a suggest for an old Sam vid, but then I seen the date.
Amazed any libertarians still have the cajones to call Sam for debate
😂🤣😂🤣😂🤜🤛
@@spiderpickle3255 I suppose if they had a grasp on recent history they would neither repeat the mistakes of the others calling in, nor would they stick with their naive political philosophy.
@@chaosvii yes, it's like they hate the news so much that they are oblivious to all the bad behaviour in the business world
“Libertarians are convinced of their own independence because of their dependence on everyone else.”
Libertarians don't need a measles shot because everyone else is vaccinated.
fantastic reply.
@@thenewcenter8848 why wouldn’t a libertarian get vaccinated for the measles? Plenty of private companies that you can pay to get vaccinated.
then add a touch of cruelty and a pinch of laziness
@@firstlast9916 if you ever have to ask why a Libertarian does anything, just know the vacuous answer will always be a variation on either "none of your business" or "muh freedum."
"I can just tell if the people I am dealing with are trustworthy."
- Every sucker in existence
Not sure if every sucker would say that, but if you show me someone who would say that, I'll show you a sucker.
Millions of Nigerian princes with billions of dollars just emailed this guy.
"free" tech industry LOL oh man this guy is clueless, there's nothing free about using google or facebook, you have to pay for the internet, and then they turn around and steal you user information, what a silly person
You must check licensing at a restaurant then. If the food isn’t good, it doesn’t matter. Because the license makes the food taste good. Correct?
@@firstlast9916 You still have to pay for internet access to get to Google or Yelp, it's not free.
“Allow me to extrapolate my limited experience as an HVAC installer into a Theory of How the World Should Work”
Eh, you made the perfect comment here, I'm not even gonna try.
And also ' *I* illegally don't follow environmental regulations, therefore allow me to project that NO one else does, and therefore Doctors must also be cheaters too! Checkmate libtards"
@@airthrowDBT "I'm a criminal, and I assume everyone in my trade is also a criminal. But if we had a TRULY free market, I'd trust everyone."
I bet a ton of HVAC's he's installed have failed or are dangerous because he blatantly refuses to follow regulations. What a self report.
To be fair. I drive a truck and have my own theories of how the world should work. What’s scary is my views probably align with yours fairly close. 😃 Left is Best
All this caller did was prove how ignorant and selfish he is. Pretty sure he'll end up going to a licensed professional whenever he experiences a health issue. Give me a break. Just admit you don't like following rules man.
not even.. it's overwhelmingly (in a blind, unaware search for identity..) only about aesthetic's.
For "libertarians" it is the association with "freedom!!!1", defined, stricly in extra-vague way's.
Libertarian ultimately want others to follow the rules except for themselves
Because the system will correct itself . Free market!!!!!
🤣
Essentially that’s their ideology
Exactly. Next time he's sick he should ask his local bum on the street.
that's what every libertarian does.
Don't worry it's "obvious" if the person is a professional, okay. If you walk in and there's a bunch of nurses, you know.
Libertarians claim the world would be better by their “rules” but can’t even follow current regulations. Libertarians are why we need regulations lol.
Well, but look - he said right at the beginning that if he - a private installer and ostensibly a structural engineer - followed regulations he would no longer be profitable. That tells me the majority of his work is not up to code compliance.
They keep trying to make the world idiot proof,then the world just makes more libertarians
Let's be super duper fair to him. He's a Florida Man who politics aligns with his work. Him being a libertarian is a bigger step forward than him being a republican. He lives in a place where it might be better that they ignore the majority of the regulation. His state is control by people who already want to destroy regulation, but they created regulation for his industry.
I think there's a good chance that the laws they have are BS and to force people to pay money. Don't forget, republicans used specific regulations to close abortion clinics instead of directly making them illegal
If the government acts like Florida and do all sorts of BS to hinder markets.. of course you will be a libertarian. Sam Seder was opening that topic on who create the regulations, but it dived into the floridian ideology of trusting the private sector.. with him not aware that the private sector heavily influence the government in Florida.
Not to mention that by default Libertarians live in a punitive rather than preventionist world. Even in the best case scenario of businesses self regulating, the self regulation only comes after repeated disasters, and law suits and loss of profit for the business. What a world to live in.
Good discussion here. In debating a libertarian, don’t get caught in a trap claiming that all regulations are inherently good, that’s absurd. You’re going to find awful and awfully implemented regulations if you search around.
It’s also absurd to claim the libertarian point that all regulations are unnecessary. So just don’t become a caricature of pro-all-regulations, or you’ll have to eat your words. And your words probably aren’t regulated, so you might end up with diarrhea 😂
Bet the caller misses the old days when you could just vent the refrigerant out the window.
Plenty of people still vent refrigerant into the atmosphere.
Thank god we have less harmful refrigerant or we would be cooking like we were in a microwave.
The school I went to vented refrigerant, apex tech in Manhattan, when I asked the teacher, he lied to me and
Told me schools are allowed to vent.
Than there are your ac mechanics that don’t care about recovery.
Regulations sound great in practice but a lot of times they are not adhered to.
The caller is not totally off.
@@uncomfortabletruth5915 The caller didn’t make one coherent point. As Sam said, yes even with regulations you will have cracks in the system, but just IMAGINE the world where the genie is totally out of the bottle. Yeah we really need to go back to times with leaded gasoline that caused brain damage, cancer, and a measurable loss of IQ. Boy those were the days.
@@MarmaladeSally
It is true that regulations have to be adhered to, for them to work.,
Just like the SEC, if they don’t enforce regulations or they have no overview of such behaviors, there is no way to enforce these
regulations.
This doesn’t mean they shouldn’t exists, just that they are not as effective as is advertised.
This was the only point I agreed with him on the rest of his rhetoric, was out in left field.
@@uncomfortabletruth5915 crimes are commited everyday doofus
Does that mean we shouldn’t have any police 👮♂️ ? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
When people don’t follow the rules, we punish them.
Just like how we catch people who break the rules and set a deterrent for future.
That’s how society works
@@uncomfortabletruth5915 crimes are commited everyday doofus
Does that mean we shouldn’t have any police 👮♂️ ? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Name a more Iconic Duo than ‘Sam Seder’ and ‘Owning Libertarians’.
I’ll wait
‘Far left Sam Seder’ debates ‘rational moderate’ woth questions
@@amkelle2 Good one. Empty assertions = questions?
Sam Seder and Steven Coward, boom
'Emma Vigland"+"toe wiggle"
Dave Rubin and "ideas"
These libertarian debates are my lifeblood... 24 minutes of delicious doltishness.
it borders on cyberbullying. but its delicious to see sam and emma dismatle their arguments with surgical precision.
Sam is a good debater. He makes no sense of course but he has the best debate tactics. That’s why I called in.
I agree, every time Sam drops a new libertarian debate I get giddy like a schoolkid
@@firstlast9916 Imagine being so owned and destroyed in a debate that your only possible claim is that the other person didn't make sense, which just further proves you have a highly disturbing lack of logic.
Crazy, but good on you being so delusional that you could save a little face. Bravo.
@@firstlast9916 hahaha dude he made perfect sense .... you're now just being deliberately belligerent 😄
"a lot of stuff doesn't get caught by regulators so why have regulations".....don't hurt yourself with that logic....
@Rob Mohamedally yes, thank you. name the topic...guns, covid...etc. The first answer is the policy is not 100% effective or absolute...which we never claimed or science never claimed....ignoring the fact that the best thing about science is that it is self correcting when new data is discovered.
*michael impersonating Sam voice* : “Yessss a libertarian that wants to debate regulations!! I can’t wait!!”
“My sinuses are tingling with anticipation!!”
Rest in Power, what a legend.
I miss his friendly strawman anti-semitic impressions of Sam he made just because it made Sam laugh so much.
God, he's missed.
Michael will always be a legend. Hope he's having a beer with Bill Hicks.
“Hiii”
Dear heavens, these so-called libertarians always have some gripe against regulations that's not grounded in any reason or fact.
Go ahead and explain my industry for me. I’d love to learn more about it.
@@firstlast9916 uh oh salty
@@jonahnesmith7004 thanks mom. Your expert opinion is very useful.
Sam wasn't hard enough on him regarding the kids and the building. He was actually ok with kids dying because the parents hadn't looked into all the paperwork regarding the building's safety. Abhorrent.
I also wished Sam had gotten specific about what regulations were SO onerous on him that it'd be impossible to turn a profit. Libertarians are the ones who say businesses NEVER absorb costs only consumers, as in the case of Minimum Wages. They are NEVER consistent except about being selfish and hating the environment and workers.
Thanks for pointing that out.
I think that one speaks for itself
This man stopped believing his own point halfway through but, like many libertarians, stubbornly pretended he still did.
Which point? I’m paying permit fees today. Against my will.
@@firstlast9916 the point about licensing was embarrassing to listen to.
You would rather have unlicensed doctors...
Are you serious!?
@@BrentWalker999 training makes a doctor competent. Not licensing. A licensed doctor opened up my knee to fix my meniscus and found out I didn’t have an ACL. So we had to re-do it. What good was the license?
@@firstlast9916 training opens the door to acquiring a license.
A license is our guarantee that the person sitting in front of you have been through that training.
It's that simple really.
I listened to your debate and you would never be qualified to judge if the person sitting in front of you is a doctor or not.
@@firstlast9916 by your strange and infantile logic, a license would only make sense of there never where any mistakes..
Piss off dude
"Sam Seder debates a Libertarian"...say no more I'm buying.
"sam seder de-" *CLICK*
@@aaronmurrayvazquez Yet you clicked on this video. Wanna try again?
Never seen little sammy debate a real libertarian. You drones couldn't handle it.
@@AliensAnonymous Do you think Walter Block isn't a real libertarian?
@@jacobholland6969 Didn't see that one. Only reason I really watch is to see EV.
Without regulations, businesses, companies, big or small, would gladly let people be harmed or die if it meant they saved a couple dollars.
@Jing Bot regulations need enforcement. You have something like 1 OSHA agent for every 100,000 worksites.
Hey, just because we have all of human history to prove your point, that doesn’t mean self regulation won’t work. Lol
Child labour and minimum wage laws are a constant reminder that companies would totally use child slaves if they could
@@Dr-Zoid-Berserk I would expect self regulation to work (or at least work a lot better) in some sort of de-commodified society with the absence of a profit motive.
Absolutely. Other countries don't allow MLMs to run amock and snake oil propaganda.
Watching Sam Seder owning libertarians is my favorite pastime
Their arguments always boil down to "the system in place is bad, let's not fix it or create a better one but instead let's get rid of everything that makes this a civilized society and let everyone to fend for themselves" (the difference between them and left libertarians is that those do want to change it for a better system).
I like asking when they're going to buy a new truck when theirs breaks down. But dude, it's broken. You can't fix something that's broken, you need to buy a nmew 80,000 dollar truck.
@Best Decoy Ever Conservatives are going to conservative.
At the same time most of them want to outlaw abortions. Freedom for me, not for thee.
@Best Decoy Ever Everything you described as being bad governing is conservative policy. You rebutted yourself.
@Best Decoy Ever Who said vote democrat? It's a vote left fix. There is no left wing party. Even the green party is neo-liberal.
This libertarian utopia just sounds exhausting. I have to be an expert in everything, just to make sure I don't get screwed over at every corner? No thanks.
Or just be rich and pay other people to do it for you. Any disputes can be solved easily by your private army.
The real dedicated ones don't even get birth certificates for their children. It's wild...
@@itcouldbelupus2842 LOL, libertarians think other libertarians will allow them to get rich.
@@crotchy7667 They'll offer them a fair wage in their salt mines with no benefits, if they just work hard for 60 years they'll be rich!
You also have to keep moving to a new state everytime the local market conditions change at the whim of neoliberal policies.
Seems maybe Dude didn't like that the combination of licensing and permitting doesn't allow him to cut corners / profits
Corners he probably don't believe are important
Exactly! I do not mean to speculate, but one probably shouldn't be doing business with him.
@@majuli8420 Yeah, it definitely sounded like he's doing illegal things on the regular. It's kind of what I'd expect from a radical libertarian. He probably thinks that he's doing a noble protest against these dumb regulations.
Well, he just admitted not abiding by regulations.
Precisely the reason regulations exist to begin with, because of schmucks like him.
My father worked in the same field- air conditioning and engineering and he has a massively successful business without defrauding anyone. He actually loved going to ASHRAE conventions. It's how he networked lol. This guy is shady.
Libertarians are liberated from the same reality the rest of us live in.
Libertarians are imprisoned by the theft the rest of you carry out. You are all thieves.
@@firstlast9916 Did Sam hurt you? LoL!
@@vertigo4236 he’s funny. That’s why I called. He’s a “subject changing” expert. Smart tactics.
@@firstlast9916 Rudy! You’re here already. Good for you man!
I hope nobody’s being too rude. Chin up man!
@Best Decoy Ever the Texas abortion law is counter to accepted law, so a little different.
These are literally a classic , they just don’t get old . Chefs kiss👨🏻🍳🤌🏼💋
"Who makes it in your industry? Only people who are good at debate."
Let me tell you about someone by the name of Tim Pool...
That's framing
Dave Dubin.
There are millions of debate channels on CZcams. Practically none of them make money.
"So you're willing to rely on Yelp?"
"I'm willing to rely on the establishment. If you walk in there.. there's a bunch of nurses. It's obvious!"
Amazing.
“Your honor, you can’t send me to prison. It was obvious I’m a scammer!”-Madoff
Doogie Howzer M.D. takes exception to the thought that just because he's a teenager he's somehow unqualified. ;)
@@Wyrmser I walk in, I see Doogie Howser. It's obvious!
"Pack your radium purse, Gretchen! A fourteen year old boy hooked on yellow heroin gave this gynecologist give a rave review on Tiktok! That breast cancer in your foot is as good as gone for only $69.98! Thank you magic hand!" ~Libertardian Rationalist
Is this guy for real? No matter how many of these libertarian calls I hear they still manage to surprise me. Truly astonishing.
I love how Matt doesn't bother trying to interrupt sam anymore, but instead feeds him attack lines that sam repeats: "shouldn't be allowed to debate it"
Matt throwing out one-liners and then laughing in the background has become my favorite part of the show
I’m a simple man: I see “Seder” and “Libertarian” , I click , and I laugh
"I still drive drunk despite it being against the law, therefore drinking and driving should not be illegal." Wrecked with facts and logic.
Caller: I am anti-government.
Sam: Facts, facts, facts on why regulation works.
Caller: You don't understand, I am anti-government...
Also caller I need no evidence of nothing but Sam needs all knowledge in the universe and even then my feels say otherwise.
Facts facts, we don't need no stinking facts!
The caller never said he was anti-government. He said he was against government regulating business. This is a classic leftist tactic, misrepresenting.
When you regulate an industry, you create new problems and regulations, don't work very well, as evidenced by the banking world, which is the most highly regulated, along with healthcare and education, and all three are extremely inefficient.
@Frank22164 I would argue the biggest issues with Healthcare is not regulation but the lack of control over insurance companies that wreck havoc in the system. We need regulation of medicine for very good reasons but the administration of medicine is a horrible mess that could be cleaned up by common sense policy and limitations of private business interference.
The past two years have been awful, but one of the bright sides of all of this is that it's completely wiped it's ass with libertarianism as a valid functioning ideology.
Yeah, but it still seems like there is plenty of them. Kind of makes me lose faith in the capacity of humanity to reach logical conclusions and take effective action on a societal scale.
@@Cancellator5000 the right doesn't operate on logic. Just conspiratorial emotions.
@@Cancellator5000 The libertarian presence online vastly over inflates their presence in the real world, as well.
@@MichaelCasanovaMusic Yeah, but I think the reasons why they are libertarian are maybe more widespread in society than their small numbers suggest. Republicans are essentially a hybrid between libertarianism and social conservatism. They have so many of the same arguments when it comes to economic issues. It's good to recall that online isn't a good sample of the population. It could be that people abandoned libertarianism in large numbers and you wouldn't notice that at all online.
How have the last 2 years had anything to do with libertarianism?
I love how all libertarian arguments are based on not thinking through any single issue or situation.
he's probably an HVAC laborer who says he's an engineer because he works with machines. I've met too many people like that to count
It's all about themselves
Did you think through the regulations for his industry? Tell us all about it like Sam didn’t.
@@firstlast9916 explain why hvac regulations are bad for society
@@firstlast9916 The fact that you think that comment is some kind of gotcha is equally sad and hilarious. Both Sam and I have already destroyed you. You have no face left to save. Just fade away bud.
"What's on your mind?"
Every libertarian to ever exist: "Oh nothing, It's just these regulations man..."
Will you pay the fees for us? Actually you already do. Regulation results in an increase of $93,000 per new house.
@@firstlast9916 yeah so there properly insulated and the wiring isn't fucking causing fires two seconds, I don't mind spending 100k more so my house is much less likely to just break on me.
@@dangerouslydubiousdoubleda9821 Nope. All unnecessary stuff. Look it up. The study is from NAHB. They created a table of categories for each phase of development and how much more the house costs during each phase due to regulations.
@@firstlast9916 Ok but what regulations do they target, because a good amount of regulations are focused on making the place sustainable, they have a certain wiring that must be followed, certain plumbing systems that need to meet a demand, again thats also a good amount of cost.
theres alot of things needed to keep people safe that costs money, and thus its enforced in the codes.
@@dangerouslydubiousdoubleda9821 If an electrician doesn’t know what gauge wiring doesn’t burn out for the load it serves, then that electrician is not going to get any work. Because he is not an electrician. He is probably the owner trying to do the wiring himself. But if the owner wants to do it himself then he should suffer the consequences of his own inexperienced work. Happens everyday with me. Owners always try to fix the refrigeration systems and burn something out in the process. Trying to save money. So they call me to fix what the broke. But that doesn’t mean we should ban owners from trying to fix the stuff they own. It would be like making it illegal for you to work on your own car without a license. It’s ridiculous.
I truly relish watching Sam intellectually and rhetorically shred Libertarians.
I'm a bit ashamed, it's like watching someone beat a child 😬
this guy seems to be advertising his criminal behavior and implicated it as part of a greater conspiracy to cut corners for special deals, no?
I get embarrassingly excited when I see a Sam Seder episode with the words “Libertarian Debate” in the title 😂😂
No need to be embarrassed about being excited about high quality content. I'm on my 3 round of listening to this debate atm. Lol. (I listen to videos at a minimum of 2x playback speed)
Instead of a government let's have some kind of "committee". And the way we could choose this "committee" is have everyone vote for it.
Way to go champ!
Isn't that literally the government?
He thinks the State doesn't hire engineers?
This guy is an engineer like a garbage man is a sanitation engineer.
Good catch! I forgot he said that.
Omg this one really pissed off Sam. He literally said "f'ing" he almost went full Thanos
I love how Sam gets during these calls! Love it!
I think it was around the time he asked the guy "do you have kids?" and the guy argued for one thing after another that would make children less safe.
He shouldn't do full Thanos, that would provide Tim Pool fodder.
Going to Brazil for his knee surgery was FAR from the first or last thing that didn’t cross his mind.
I actually did go to Brazil for dental surgery. Pretty good service they have down there. My wife went for abdominoplasty. My daughter will go soon for braces. I recommend it. I’m the caller.
@@firstlast9916 Wonderful.
@@iangraham-white5717 all you need is money and you will get excellent treatment. The public system is horrible of course. Just like in the US. My cousins are pretty good doctors. Orthopedic surgeon and an immunologist.
Public systems still discriminate against the poor. In any country. Doesn’t matter how many politicians promise you “great healthcare”. If it’s free, the doctor will stay in the room with you for 1 minute and leave or he will send a nurse to take care of your problem.
@@iangraham-white5717 there are no public doctors in Brazil. If you want a doctor, you have to call a private hospital. They are required to come save your life. The government in Brazil unfortunately doesn’t pay what the hospital charges so the private customers have to make up for it with higher prices. It’s unfortunate but not much different from here. In the US, the government pays close to “full price” for emergency services so then private customers can negotiate prices down to what the market would charge. Which is about 80% less than what the hospital charges the government. Government really ruins everything.
"Doctors just give you aspirin!" Lol
I'm assuming he believes that because he's never had to go to a doctor. He just goes to the store and buys aspirin XD
Yeah, and didn't he also say he went all the way to Brazil for surgery? Both those statements can't be true. He either flew there just for aspirin, or docs do more complicated stuff than just give aspirin.
Later... I've had orthoscopic knee surgery.
Dude really thinks medical practitioners spend hundreds of thousands of dollars and 10 years of schooling just to do what a 16 year old does at Walgreens lmao
I was only just wondering a few days back if Sam still debates callers like this guy. I love these conversations
lmao, he's like just walk in the building, see some nurses, and there ya go, you can tell its a competent doctor's office.
I burst out laughing when I heard that and I work in Nursing.
If you walk into a restaurant, and see food for sale, do you think it’s a “competent” restaurant? How do you evaluate the products you buy? Do you check licensing and that’s it? Or does the product have to be good for you buy it?
@@firstlast9916 that’s the point of the government… everywhere you go there are regulatory requirements. your life would be so exhausting if you had to rely on your own judgment for every movement in your life. just think about it. this libertarian utopia is a joke
@@harryk8696 that’s what I asked. How do you choose what food you eat? Do you eat only licensed food? Have you ever ate from a street vendor? Have you ever bought anything that you didn’t like and returned it or asked for your money back. If so, how did you make that decision? Or did the government make it for you?
@@firstlast9916 Street food operators do need a license… And you don’t lose a food license for food tasting bad. I’m sorry but your arguments are not cogent/frequently come off as rambling.
This is exactly the content I was needing rn
I don't want this guy installing my air conditioner.
I wish someone would report him to the authorities for not following environmental regulations.
@@airthrowDBT Get law enforcement to trace the caller's phone number?
I leave HEALTH to the "PRIVATE" industry😩
lol
He's against government employees determining the competency of a business...but thinks any regular person can do it just fine.
Government employees are regular people.
@@firstlast9916 Cops are regular people, so I'ma go enforce some laws now 'cause I'm just as qualified with no training.
@@BaronVonQuiply you are. Cops don’t know laws. Have you ever spoken to a cop? Warning: you will be disappointed if you do. Most inspectors I work with don’t know the laws they are supposed to be enforcing.
Owning libertarians is like breathing oxygen for Sam
Sam lost this one. He didn’t answer any questions.
Having worked in a permit office and in construction, I can tell you that most of these regulations exist for health and safety reasons. It doesn’t take a genius to know that people will take shortcuts in construction if there aren’t rules in place. Because even with regulations in place, there are still idiots who do unpermitted work, operate without a license, and or skirt around worker’s compensation and insurance requirements.
Now if you wanna be upset about obscure zoning laws about where and what is allowed in a city - fine. If you’re upset some of these permit fees are exorbitant - fine. But what you should be upset is local government having to raise fees to combat the slashed budgets from all the tax cuts we keep passing.
Your fence permit being expensive or time consuming isn’t because some local bureaucrat is having a power trip. It’s because cost cutting measures from tax cuts having local governments scrapping for cash from anywhere else they can.
"these businesses keep not paying their mafia protection money, so we have to raise yours".
the state has no right to regulate private property in any way.
@@garyhamlin3299 Uh, yeah they do when it's in the public interest because then it isn't just a private matter.
I would really love to see how you would go in Somalia or Libya, no regulation really works well there doesn't it? I've heard building standards and infrastructure are incredible in both places, especially near the slave markets and polluted river ways.
@@Speedojesus actually if you compare somalia before and after they went stateless you'll find they did much better in almost every measurable category, as well as comparing them to their immediate neighbors. I not to mention thousands of refugees were able to return to their home since they no longer had to fear a brutal dictator.
so if something is in the public interest it's automatically ethical to do it? and who gets to decide if something is in the public interest or not?
@@garyhamlin3299 Depends on the situation, I wouldn't want to drive a car that will fall apart on me as soon as I turn the ignition, I dont want to live in a house that was built on a sinkhole. Without laws policing the behavior of private businesses, companies would do whatever they possibly could to make a buck, regardless of the effect on the consumer
I am cringing so hard..
Libertarians. I used to be one of you. Please stop.
As a doctor I can say that no one who's not a healthcare professional is remotely qualified to asses the quality of the healthcare they receive.
We already know what that looks like: traditional folk medicine.
Pliny the Elder had an... interesting... cure for rabies, for example.
Yep. You could sell me chalk and I wouldn't know it's not working... probably ever.
This perspective perpetuates the problem of doctors not listening to their patients. You don’t have to be a healthcare professional to be informed, educated, & capable of assessing the quality of care you receive.
(Please bear in mind that this is coming from someone who once went to a licensed, highly recommended doctor to treat an infection and was told by the doctor that “doing yoga” would cure it. I was in the hospital less than a week later. Pretty sure anyone can assess that doctor’s “quality of care,” don’t you think?)
Well, I can. At least, after my recovery and I see or feel the results.
@@elisawhitman8526 I don't think OP was talking about doctors who recommend treatments that fall outside science based medicine. The average layperson is not scientifically literate, and doesn't know much about physiology, biochemistry, or anatomy.
This guy is so unable to be abstract in his reasoning. He can barely engage in your hypotheticals.
They aren't creative enough to play out that thought experiment.
He doesnt understand the points that Sam is trying to get across
He's way in over his head.
The best way to debunk libertarianism is to just let a Libertarian keep talking about their worldview.
They end up at some absurd notions. True.
You would have a better time convincing them if you stopped being so smug.
People who say things like this have never lived in a third world country.
Or have even, like, read a book aboit this country. Or if not, even logically considered why these regulations came about.
@@airthrowDBT When I was a child, a person could WALK across Lake Erie, because there was nothing to stop everyone from dumping whatever they liked in the water. You are right, no 3rd world examples needed.
"For the sake of your health and your children's health, I hope you never, ever, ever have to live in the world that you hope will come about." Brilliant.
Idiotic. Sam lives in a libertarian tech industry and is imposing rules in my industry. He can be free but I can’t. Hypocrisy much?
@@firstlast9916 We're not comparing talk radio and medicine here, are we? Because if we are, complete deregulation in one results in people being misinformed, whereas in the other, it results in them being killed.
@@firstlast9916 Sam… imposes regulation? How? By saying it’s a good thing that any douche in a coat can’t tell you he’s a doctor to sell medicine?
@@firstlast9916 "Idiotic. Sam lives in a libertarian tech industry and is imposing rules in my industry. He can be free but I can’t. Hypocrisy much?"
HAHAHAHA WTF are you talking about? Do you think people should be "free" to do things any way they want in your industry even if it could be harmful to people? (as in, leaving things open to fire hazards or electrocution hazards, etc).
The tech industry deals with software intellectual property rights and software patents and people *do* want to regulate the tech industry and social media.
One of the things I learned in my mechanical engineering courses is the extremely high unreliability of online surveys. The HVAC guy thinks Yelp is a good alternative to state regulation? Hope he doesn't piss anyone off at Yelp ever.
“You can tell when someone doesn’t know what they’re talking about…”
Yes, as the caller has so graciously demonstrated to everyone, yes you can tell.
If everyone behaved we wouldn’t need regulations. As the Libertarians know, full well, this is not the case.
People make mistakes. So even if everyone were honest, we'd still need a lot of regulations.
Libertarians don’t want regulations because they don’t want to behave.
@@terjeoseberg990 They want everyone ELSE to behave, but they don't have to because they're special.
Libertarians seem to be under the impression that regulations are proactive rather than reactive. The vast majority of regulations are an attempt to correct from a precedented fuck up, not the big bad gub’mint handing down arbitrary decrees just to make your life more difficult.
@@Zarastro54 YES, so true! It usually takes a tragedy and even a heavy push by the public against industry to enact regulations.
How does someone even want to debate regulations. In Sydney Australia regulators in the engineer section skipped a lot of their work and it ended up costing new apartment homes 600k+ each and deemed unsafe 6 months later and 1 year later for the building next door by the same person. When people buy brand new like that it’s bloody ridiculous and now they’re homeless spending their life savings
"Everyone knew oxycodone is addictive as fuck, that's like... one of the 3 things I'm sure of in this world." Classic libertarianism, i swear
I am a licensed civil engineer, and we absolutely do follow regulations and we absolutely are disciplined when we don't.
You have to be reported by your customers to be disciplined. Design engineers make lots of mistakes and that’s why companies have multiple people working on a project. No need for regulations that reference industry standards. Experts produce the standards and publish them. Government grabs that literature and tries to force people to do it without knowing what the standard even says.
@@firstlast9916 _"No need for regulations that reference industry standards"_
I wonder why they're standards. Hey, quick question... what's the main difference between a nasty, evil, Libtard Regulation; and a good manly, alpha, Libertarian standard?
Why is it whenever I watch one of these Libertarian debates, I feel like I'm watching a nature documentary where a Wildebeest is being eaten alive by a pack of Hyenas?
Debate tactics are fun to watch. I called in because I think he is a talented debate artist. Sam doesn’t present any useful arguments. He just smothers you with questions he can’t even answer.
@@firstlast9916 You called in to make an argument. That means the person making a case is... follow me closely now... you.
You don't get to show up, make an asinine statement, and then expect everyone to drop what they're doing and cater to your ignorance and disprove your demonstrably false imaginations. You wanted to make a case. Make it.
@@BaronVonQuiply I did. Licensing and permitting don’t serve a purpose. I should know my industry. Been doing it for 15 years.
@@firstlast9916 The entirety of your "case" was to make a fool of yourself and disclose that you do shoddy, subpar work that does no meet code and risks the safety of your customers. That's 15 years you've put people at risk while pretending to be an engineer. Just stating blatantly false claims is not making an argument.
@@BaronVonQuiply tell me more. Didn’t know I was talking to an expert in my industry. Can’t wait to hear what you think about refrigerant recovery or VFD laws or Permitting for replacements.
I'm a libertarian Socialist. Regulations are important to protect the freedoms of others. Simple. Yes, sometimes those regulations can be overreaching, stupid and can stifle growth and innovation (which is why reviews are important) but the overall principle is sound. Without rules and regulations it leaves vulnerable people (such as customers, clients and patients) without the means to legally seek compensation if something goes wrong. It also means that more informed regulations can be put into place that can prevent future incidents.
(A) ❤🖤
Libertarianism is the most idiotic political Ideology. You probably advocate for lower age of consent laws.
Even my ultra conservative business college taught this as a fundamental principle in business law lol. Libertarians are whack
@@Gilgaemesh No I don't. Children and teens cannot consent to having that type of relationship with an adult as they are still developing.
@@jakedavis5375 Right winged libertarians are conservatives that think the law shouldn't apply to them.
"The government is incapable of hiring anyone to evaluate construction as an expert, because they all work in construction, no different than a Miami condo HOA!"-Libertarian genius 2021
The government is corrupt.
Remember 911 and the EPA that OKed the reopening of lower Manhattan and told the first responders, hell
You guys don’t need hazmat suits?
@@uncomfortabletruth5915 who were they serving when they lied? Big corporations, you think? Who wants deregulation the most? Big corporations, you think?
Do you know that you're going to bat for the oligarchs when you ask for deregulation? Regulation is a response to someone in the past doing something bad. Electrical regs? Someone died from faulty wiring. Materials standards for what you can put in a building? Someone died from a roof collapse.
@@uncomfortabletruth5915 it was pretty obvious they should've been required. But Bush and Giuliani wanted to open for business to show the terrorists they didn't affect our precious "way of life".
Giuliani's government applied for, and received a waiver from OSHA. As usual the Republicans are pretty much to blame.
@@uncomfortabletruth5915 All politicians are corrupt. Why have a government!!!
Brilliant rebuttal 👍🏼
@@Pensnmusic Indeed. Some of us in my National Guard unit were sitting around laughing at some of the disclaimers we had seen, and a sobering thought was, "For every disclaimer that seems ridiculous, there is someone who did the thing they're warning about."
Libertarians: "We are against regulations."
Normal Humans: "Which ones?"
Libertarians: "Health, safety, ethical and environmental."
Normal Humans: "So...pretty much all of the ones necessary for a functional society."
Libertarians: "We also don't want to pay our employees anything."
Agree!!!
I’ve never understood how there are so many libertarians that call in
There's alot of big dumb uncles out there in the world...millennials out there herding them toward Sam Seder...I guess....
It’s just Jon Benjamin over and over, he’s a really good voice actor
There's an ancient myth that if a libertarian can stump Sam then John Galt will appear and open the gates to Narnia... or something.
He's never met anyone who've lied to him. Incredible.
Have you? Or does the government call you every-time a salesman shows up to your door to hold your hand?
10:34 - PLEASE GOD NO, not Dave Rubin and the Yelp-review school of quality-control again, PLEASE end my pain!!
Yeah, Sam had to mention Yelp, but typically in the arguments I have had, the Libertarian/Anarcho-capitalist brings up: Yelp, lawsuits, and GoFundMe. It's like they are a hive mind.
@@crotchy7667 They are a hive mind. Even if they want to think of themselves as free thinkers, they fail to notice that this ideology was spoon fed to them by very specific places...
Mexican doctors are actually really good. I'm sure surgeons in larger cities can do a knee surgery as good a job as someone in the US. It's still expensive.
Libertarians abhor regulations because regulations are the mechanism that hold people to account and define liability within a court of law. In essence, they want to get away with giving you as little as possible for your money without the risk of a lawsuit.
The customers literally ask you to cut corners. They hound you during the entire installation and keep asking why you are doing what you are doing. I’m fine with charging more for complying. Customers aren’t.
@@firstlast9916 then regulations protect you in this case. If I told you to cut corners, you would not in order to comply with regulations. If you did cut corners, and something went wrong (which is very likely) your customers could sue you and deny they ever asked you to cut corners. They'd get away with it because if you showed proof that you cut corners (even at their request) you would still be liable.
@@PDXVoiceTeacher hasn’t happened yet. Customer couldn’t care less about regulation. Following regulations adds $93,000 to the cost of a home on average. If you started forcing roofers to wear harnesses and prove they have workmans comp insurance, the cost of their project would double. It would take twice as long and both the customer and the workers would be worse off.
So this guy does some work for me. Afterward I say thanks, I’m not paying you. Get off my property. He’ll run to the government to enforce the contract we had. Consumer protections, worker protections and environmental protections are all big government regulations these guys cry about. Debt regulations, direct subsidies and intellectual property regulation are things we can’t live without for some reason. 🤔
Dunning Kruger right there
"I've watched Sam hand debaters their ass. Constantly. I'm going to defeat him in debate."
Gets his ass handed to him.
"...NAILED IT!"
Licensing doesn't make you competent, it makes you prove your competency
Nope. Your services prove your competency. Most mechanics are unlicensed.
Me seeing a Sam Debates libertarian video on my YT feed: “aww the classic are the best...”
Me seeing it’s from today: 🥳
And here I was worried that I'd be out of entertainment for the day.
11 minutes in and I can't stop laughing. Sam's just having fun with this guy
He kept interrupting me so why wouldn’t he have fun? It’s called having a better microphone.
True. There was a turning point. When they realized the guy was a clown. You could see them both physically change. Both just smiled.
I could have replaced this guy's knee for 20,000. I've got plenty of stuff in my garage and CZcams that can probably make a knee.
When he said "The good ones stay in business. Same as your business, Sam. Only the good ones stay in business" I started laughing and thinking about Dave Rubin and Tim Pool.
God, that guy was one of the most vacuous libertarians I've heard on this show.
its great! "u can walk into a doctors office and tell if they are competent" hahahaha
The caller got eerily quiet when Sam asked "Why didn't you go to another country to get it done?"
🤣🤣
It didn't cross my mind says the goof that's hell bent on anti regulations gibberish
These people are funny
Explain that to me. There are no regulations on going to Brazil to get surgery. My wife did it. My daughter is going to get her braces there. Medical tourism is a big industry. How am I a goof for choosing to get it done in the US?
Wow, this caller is a complete joke. He said that contractors "use rules of thumb, mostly." As a home builder, I know all about these types of "professionals" and they are basically scam artists. They are against regulations because it infringes on their ability to scam customers. I would never, ever, ever hire an HVAC contractor who wanted to use "rules of thumb" to size a system for a house. It is the number one way to know that this guy doesn't know what the hell he is doing.
Seriously. "no one follows regulations because if we did we wouldn't make a profit" = I'm a fucking amateur grossly overcharging customers for sub-par work. Another red flag: a contractor or an HVAC technician saying "oh, I work in the engineering field too, ASHRAE is all just recommendations that they use sometimes" is absolutely 100% bullshitting you about their knowledge (or working with complete shit head engineers). Technicians are literally not trained engineers, they follow instructions developed by engineers. Working alongside them does not mean you have anything close to the equivalent depth of knowledge.
I'm not trying to shit on technicians AT ALL, I have tons of buddies who do it, and we need more of them than we have! There are absolutely times and certain areas of jobs where an experienced technician could tell an engineer what's what, but its just a different line of work. This guy just sounds like a fool talking about how its all just recommendations and rules of thumb. Rules of thumb exist because they are a simple way to force technicians and contractors into implementing systems that abide by regulations. If the engineers break a rule of thumb, its *NOT* because theyre breaking regulation, and you can be damn sure an engineer whos routinely breaking regulations will lose their job (and their career) sooner or later for fucking up a project. This is what I'm talking about with respect to the *depth of knowledge...*
@@jeffharper4509 _"oh, I work in the engineering field too"_ Hell of a red flag.
I built a very short stone retaining wall from stones in my back yard. I'm an engineer now, whooo!
It is deeply concerning just how dense these people are. How does someone with such an obviously limited capacity to comprehend such simple concepts ever even pass a licensing exam in order to legally run a business, to begin with? How do they even tie their shoes in the morning?
Dealing with government employees is not very difficult. It’s a huge waste of time and money but they just accept everything you tell them. They don’t know what you do for a living because government employees aren’t required to know anything.
Selective intelligence. I guarantee you that if this fool suffers because there was a lack of regulation in some area of his life, he would *still* defend a lack of regulation.
@@PR--un4ub give us just one example. Just one. I double dog dare you.
Its always good advice to think twice before making a bold statement.
This is unironically comedy gold😂
"None of us follow the standards!"
Well, at least I know who I wouldn't trust for any HVAC work.
I gotta have a drink after listening to this caller.
Even though I've heard quite a few, I wasn't prepared for this.
Lol, this is hilarious. As someone who works in allied health I can confidently say that “user ratings” of doctors are completely irrelevant. I’ve personally known surgeons who were beloved by their patients despite being known in the medical community to be essentially butchers. This dude’s ideal work would be a hellscape.
The first time I encountered rating systems for doctors I laughed my ass off thinking what I would write about the clowns I saw in the 90s.
I'll just toss out one example, twice I've been prescribed lethal doses of medication. I have a bottle of Ergotmaine with instructions to take a year or two's supply in 3 days.
@@BaronVonQuiplywe should kiss the ground pharmacists walk on for stopping doctors from almost killing us everyday.
"I'm too incompetent to do my job properly, waaaaah!"
Guy arguing against regulations instantly proves why regulations in his field are necessary.
It is all I could think. Thanks for the confirmation.
"Hold on, I'm still in my course about electricity"
Lmao I love Sam
Sam: "so in your world where there aren't any regulations, how would you know if your doctor is trustworthy?"
Libertarian:"well they are licenced"
Sam: "by who"
...
These people can't connect A->C if they are given A->B and B->C.
It's extremely discouraging that even Sam, a god tier debater with incredibly sound arguments cannot sway these lunatics from their pre-existing beliefs. It is on the same level as flat earthers. We truly do not stand a chance.
I think the situation is not all that bad.
Debates in general aren't the best way to change someone's mind, at least instantly: most people cannot process new ideas in conversational real time, especially if taking in the new idea requires a paradigm shift from them. The overwhelming majority of ex-cultists, ex-fundamentalists, ex-Nazis and ex-SJWs whose story I read mention a phase when some circumstance contrary to their beliefs wouldn't leave their mind and they eventually dug into the issue deeper, doing research on their own. What Sam's debates with these numbskull libertarians _could_ achieve is to put this sense of contradiction into the back of their minds, so that eventually, they deal with it.
@@Daneelro I love your optimism, but it shows you have never talked to people like this. They are so invested in their ideas that literal proof of something will not sway them. Also, there is enormous social pressure for them to stay rooted in their beliefs because usually all of their friends and family are just as crazy.
@@johnd3687 I have talked to literally _thousands_ of people like this over the past 25 years; and also read the accounts of hundreds who left. Please read what I wrote again. I'm not at all contradicting you on the claim that "literal proof of something will not sway them". Also, to the social pressure you rightly note, I can add emotional investment and pride that is a very strong incentive against recognising any mistake. But some people still manage to get out of this, eventually, and I told you how.
@@Daneelro I agree that some people like that can change, it is just fairly rare. The issue I had with you saying they do their own research is that to so many people now, doing their own research means watching CZcams conspiracy videos and regurgitating what they hear. They only look at sources that confirm their beliefs, and ignore anything that contradicts them. That's why "doing your own research" often results in them falling further into their delusions.
You cannot reason someone out of something they were not reasoned into.
Save money on your medical bill by visiting a roofer instead of a doctor.
lol
things that I've learned from this: don't go to this guy or "the people he knows" to fix things. Go to licensed people
THAT'S WHY FREEDOM IS SO IMPORTANT SAM!
Everyone hiring a Contractor should do this.... Ask how they feel about regulations in their Field. If they say they don't like it, kindly thank them for stopping by and Find a different Contractor. Example the HVAC unit outside is connected by HIGH Energy Power Lines. If installed incorrectly, you could come home to a house or apartment on fire.