Why Spherical Video is a Bad Idea
Vložit
- čas přidán 3. 10. 2016
- I really don't see a future for spherical video, so much so that I was called the curmudgeon at Vidcon 2016. Here I try to explain my reasoning while exploring the format. I am excited by the prospect of VR, however.
i looked down at his thumb the whole time....
So did I..
were you stuck looking at his hang nail too? .. and wondering, if it's painful (it's all swollen and red, it must be)
I was going to type this exact comment!
warrenann WHOA!? REALLY!? /sarcasm
i was being a creep, staring at women as they passed us by :)
I think you're right. I'm giving immersive video a go with The Sound Traveler because I want to control the viewer's view. I'm also open to being wrong and think that shooting this video in 360 was super clever.
For your sound traveler videos to work with 360° video you would need a way to also let viewers rotate the audio with the video which isn't possible I think.
another thing 99% of people r not considering apparently including u is...... u can have a cinema in vr with the good old crappy rectangle... "very clear and focused"..... and that can transition to a proper 360 vr experience video ...part of the time
also there is a huge differece between "360 video" and a proper vr experience which is ......clear high res 3d 360 with spatial audio and good vr goggles and good headphones
+GLRaema Maybe in the future if CZcams will bundle some surround sound codec with the videos. How hard is it to record surround sound audio by the way? Just some directional antennaes each aimed at different locations?
Aren't there even special 360° microphones?
As someone who have ADHD.. I love this video that I can look around. It make me watch ALL the video instead of just stopping the video when is bla bla..
even when its interesting I need video like Vsauce to make me listen all the video.
This one I listened more than any other "2veritasium" Videos.
I love his videos and what he say.. But I dont sub.. because I cant really focus on bla bla..
I dont see the point of video when we talk... Faces is boring to ADHD ppls.. Its so... Everyday-ish lol..
Yes body language is important.. I DO pay attention to that.. But Idk.. Feel like when things are just previsible there is no point for me to look there.
Maybe ADHD is just an evolution of a certain role of ppl..
I mean.. Some got to be distracted and NOT look ahead.. and some have to look ahead. I see that as a role.
But nowdays this "Role" is not so much useful lol.. Maybe in the future we will "De-evolve" this feature OR just find a way to make it work in this system.
Humanity is a team.. A system isn't it? ^^
I've gotta say: this is the most entertaining 360 degree video I've seen so far. I tend to agree with you, but this video has changed my mind more than I expected.
Never expected to see you here
I really enjoyed looking around at the scenery while I listen to you talk. Can you make more videos like this?
I don't think you are wrong in saying 360 would not take over, but there is certainly a use for it, travel and exploration for those who can not afford to being the first to come to mind. If you are going to tackle interesting subjects while letting me look around a place I would otherwise never get the opportunity to see, I will literally watch all the videos you mak, and as I can not look at every single thing in one view I have incentive to rewatch some of them and as a result the subject matter would really stick. So for me personality I think this kind of video you just demonstrated is the best thing since sliced bread.
@@AnthonyRichardsez Yeah, I feel like I enjoyed this street-view video more than the last dozen tourist vlogs I've watched
Ya 360 should be a thing of mainstream videotapes I loved the view and having freedom of just wondering around
Cool experiment! You know my thoughts on this, Derek. Nobody really thinks 360 video is going to surpass or replace traditional video in any way, and if they say so then they are trying to sell you something, so I think you're maybe setting up a reality that doesn't exist. But 360 video is going to make a YUUUUUGE difference in delivering experiences… no stories, just self-guided immersion in a given environment.
Perfect case in point: Google Expeditions (which is incredible… I welcome someone trying to explain to me how it's not an enhancement over traditional video)
But yeah… 360 stories? Meh. 360 camera tech circa 2016? Double meh.
It's Okay To Be Smart I think you summed that up perfectly
I think combining 360 with AR is what's really going to be interesting, for a lot of different purposes.
Think I saw two cute girls, but to low resolution to be sure. I think you are right about 360 not being the future. Maybe if i had one of those VR glasses, but on a flat screen it does not add much, and it takes away important stuff that you mentioned in the video.
IKR
Joe, you sound so ... normal. Is that really you?
How the hell do you hold that thing out, navigate your way through all that mess, people yelling, birds squawking, etc... and somehow narrate everything so elegantly without your brain stopping at all or losing train of thought?
I think he can immerse himself into the topic, kind of makes him really intelligent...
A little thing called editing.
NZT is the shit yo.
Where do you see the video being edited, looks like he did it all in 1 take
There are a few cuts, but yea it's only one shot. It's very impressive that he's able to do this.
Your walk around the street actually shows what 360 degree videos are great for. VIRTUAL TOURS! if you think about how tour groups go around in a street, even though the whole group is moving in the same direction, every individual person in the group is looking in a different direction. to bring that experience to a video format, you need a 360 video. it allows you as a virtual tourist to look at whatever you find interesting while simultaneously following the virtual tour guide or the virtual tour group wherever they are going.
If you think of 360 video as just normal video, but with more range, then yes, it's a terrible idea. But, it's a NEW medium. It'll take new thinking on how to best use it, or what content is best for it.
For the types of video on Veritasium, I wouldn't think it would always be the best choice, but take this video or your other walk and talks you do on 2veritasium, it seems like it might actually be an enhancement. I've personally watched it twice, once through looking primarily at you, but then a second time, as I scanned around and looked at what was going on around you. Double the views!
Like VR (and player controlled camera games before that), understanding how to use the medium when you don't control the users view takes time, but isn't necessarily universally better or worse, but usually better at some things and worse at others.
What types of videos would you make where HD and singular viewer focus isn't the priority? Seems like a place to begin to solve a problem.
You're correct.
He can't see it has a huge potential.
security cameras!!!
Exactly. You could think the same of 360 photography for photographers in general. Now see how it is used for Google street view and how its implementation brought multiple usages. For example just visiting a place before going there (or knowing you will never go). Just to say as you said: it depends on the pertinency of the medium for each case.
This would be amazing for something like a war documentary.
I agree with you. being able to look around is cool at first, but HAVING to look around all the time is annoying.
So life is anoing to you cause you have to look around all the time.
You don't have to use a mouse to navigate life, neither do you need to have a mess of wires around your head to navigate life
Agreed. 360 video implies there's something going on all around you, but you can only take in a small section of it at a time, so it gets really exhausting really fast. I feel like I haven't properly 'watched' until I watch the video from all possible aspects, which means it takes forever - and most of the time that's wasted, because you don't need to be looking at all angles. The material could've been better presented, tighter, and punchier with an actual editor pointing out where I should be looking.
clamo6362 you always look forward, never forward and backwards simultaneously. In this video, I want to see everything at the same time so I pause a couple of seconds to see if I miss an important detail in the video. Nobody walks around turning their head 24/7.
There are pros and cons in every new technology, you just don't get them in 360. Why would you like to force people to learn specific thing, and prevent them to look around to wonder first. But this is not the point, if people aren't interested in topic that much perhaps the other stimulation would help them to catch some unwanted information from the video, or do you think you should force them?
I would love to see a 360 video of you, Michael from Vsauce, Jake Roper, Hank Green, or any other science-related CZcamsr all sitting at a table, having a conversation, with a 360 camera on a table exactly in the center. I honestly don't care if the video is an hour long or so.
Outstanding idea. 👏
That is actually a very interesting idea. Usually for these type of discussions you do the panel type set up, so everyone is lined up and you can see them all but that isn't at all natural. For a natural conversation, especially more casual ones, a 360 view around a table and stuff would be cool. My one concern however, is that it might be easy to get lost while trying to focus on who is talking.
If you had like a 3d headset, then that isn't an issue, but if you are doing it on a screen and have to scroll all around to see everyone, it might be a pain.
yeah, this is a case where the videos trhemselves aren't that interesting anyway, and would work just as well as audio only podcasts...
Using 360° video for "in-the-round" discussions might be more appropriate for VR headsets with good positional audio. That way, you could use souund to quickly and naturally direct your attention to the current speaker if and when you chose to, when you weren't looking at reactions to the speaker. The current mouse-dragging interface in videos like this doesn't seem like an elegant way to quickly redirect your vision _in time_ to see the source of a sound.
Really? I'd hate to be standing in the middle of a circle of four people who were discussing something, having to whirl around the whole time to see who's talking. And the video you're suggesting would just be a bad simulation of that terrible experience.
I was trying to pay attention to your words and look at the market at the same time. I did miss a lot of what you said.
I actually like this format for your vlogs. I feel like we're walking together while I listen to you, and I get to look around. It may not revolutionize anything, but it will have its niche.
Over 6 minutes in before I realized I could rotate the screen by swiping...
Alan Jeffrey thanks!
Alan Jeffrey thanks
Alan Jeffrey same hahah it started to be off
Me too lol
On phone you just see everything at the same time, and gosh, his hand is stretched all over the bottom point of the video...
honestly, i really enjoyed watching this in spherical. being able to look at your environment as you walked around was way more interesting a viewing experience than if you were just going to vlog this direct to camera. not that your on camera presence isn't great, but i spent a lot of time listening to your words as i looked forward, where you were walking, what you were seeing. spherical might not work for the incredibly fact based, single-learning objective videos -- but it is a useful medium for experiences. even with crappy resolution, you took me to a place i'd never been in a way that would require a lot more production equipment/experience to feel similar in a regular ol' 2d video.
Exactly. It was a lot of fun watching him going on the street, to feel we are walking with him and taking to him, rather than staring at his face while he speaks. I think 360 videos will be immensely popular, we just need better and affordable household devices to watch them, and it will happen soon. He gives examples of how people have wrongly believed something would be very popular, but there are many times more example of how people thought a new technology will never be successful and won't replace existing tech, but it did. Infact every new technology sees this initial resistance.
Maybe thats the difference between given you an experience to explore yourself and trying to explain to you what happened. In this video he is not referncing things you should see. If he would, it would be a huge hassle to follow where he wants to point your attention.
absolutely agree
3:16
Honestly, I don't care how useful this is. The engineer inside me is absolutely in love with this tech.
This 360 video reminded me of times in scouting where I would enjoy the journey of a hike while listening to the guide talk about the location.
Love that comment!
My game was to watch for the people who stared at the camera and then pretend I was staring right back at them...
KrazeeCain I like the way you think, gonna grab my vr real quick haha
I just stayed on the normal view, where you can see him talking
i enjoyed looking up at the buildings
It was funny to see the people giving him confused looks as he went past.
I enjoyed looking forward to see the city while listening (as if walking with a friend who is talking). Didn't care to watch him talk and look past his shoulders as usual, no offense. It's nice to see scenery of cities I haven't yet been to.
i looked down at his hand for ages
The problem of not being able to keep any production crew out of shot, not so much.
I watched this video at least 2 times. First time as regular. And second was interesting looking around. Pls do more of this.
I like that EVERYONE is turning around and looking at you xD.
I looked around a little bit in the beginning of the video, but then I thought to myself that was completely pointless, and watched the whole thing without looking around at all.
You're "supposed" to wear goggles :)
***** I agree completely. I think it's very very limited in its usefulnes :) Even with goggles you don't want to turn around like a maniac all the time.
If you full screen the video and click on the arrows in the top left corner you can then use your keyboard to control the camera angle. It made looking around very easy.
Derek, initially I thought it was lame to just find arguments against 360 video instead of trying to see if it could be useful. But you made precisely that point at the end, that we should actually be open to new stuff. I agree that storytelling with 360 video appears really challenging, and I would love to see you experiment more with it! Thanks.
For this video, you could just have listened to the audio and got the same message. The visuals were nothing but an example but, if you've already seen this kind of thing, so what? Towards the end, I scrolled down through the comments since the visuals were altogether pointless regarding the point he's making.
I feel like I am a little person being carried...I don't like it
Tucker The "Indian in the Cupboard" effect.
needs a steady cam. Looking sideways as you walk is jarring. Otherwise really cool.
looking down is really weird
360 videos are awesome , whoever made this ..Thank you !
This will be great if applied for educational purposes, it may needs some tweaks but it's nearly perfect *_*
I might have been staring at your chest all the time wondering why on earth you'd choose that angle.
Guess the jokes on me
I only like 360 when the videos purpose is to immerse yourself in an area or something else that would benefit from having it in a 360 form
With everything, it depends a lot on the content. Making content for 360° video can result in good experiences. Taking content that is made for "normal video", and just making it 360° just for laughs, well that'll be a bad experience.
Totally agree... sea- or skydiving, for example, where there is more than one direction that offers things to see. Alas, the quality is still subpar for these applications...
I think 360 videos are only going to work well in VR
That's why the topic is 360 VIDEOS, more precisely science videos...It can be very beneficial for other immersive content...
Anyone else not know it was 360 video for a few minutes? lol
HellzJanitor Yep. I didn't realize it until I rubbed my screen to get a bit of dirt off it.
HellzJanitor Lol. No.
HellzJanitor I couldn't figure out why all I was seeing was Derrick's hands (I watch videos with my phone flat on the table).
Then, when I realized it was a 360 video I had to hold the phone straight out in front of my face to see him speaking. Very uncomfortable. Who watched CZcams with their device held straight out in front of their face. 360 videos need to be shot at a 45 degree angle so that they can see the speaker at a comfortable angle - like help in their hand below the face.
glennac you can move it with your finger so while it's flat on the table it's in the right orientation.
glennac I watch videos on my bed so I just rest my device on my stomach while holding it up so it doesn't fall.
I would still love to see more videos like this. Particularly when you do experiments, maybe as additional footage videos. I would love the feeling of being able to feel more immersed in the environment. This video in particular. My wife being a quasi military brat grew up in Korea. Though the area has changed drastically since, I was able to get my first closer to real look at what the streets she described are like. She says, despite the progression of time and tech, the culture has retained much of what she knew.. Thanks Derek for this video.
Moving around to see everything is so much effort
I think 360 video will stick around, because you can use it to make cool looking nature documentaries, but it will never be mainstream. Fly a drone that can take 360 video and fly it through the glacier as an iceberg cleaves off. That would be amazing footage. Or do the same why flying through a swarm of locusts, school of fish, etc.
I wonder what would happen if you flew a drone through a swarm of locusts.
In the same way it could be neat for things like snowboarding, skydiving or surfing videos. But, indeed, not for regular movies.
Yeah, it will have specific applications where it will be awesome, possibly even expected, but it's neither practical nor ideal for most video.
yeah. plain 360 is for effect only. When you put it into VR you can do a little more with it and show scale to people, as that is the one thing screens are very bad at. but then again you lose a lot of focus and direction.
Concluding from that i think 360 video would be best for VR exibitions, where you port from spot to spot and get some narration with each place. there i would not stich time but much rather space as 4th dimension, at least if time is not important for atmosphere (leaves, animals, people and grass moving). Can you still call that a video then?
VR is where 360 shines. All that other crap is going to fall off short. It just isn't meant to be like that. Director of a documentary is way better off not having viewers to be in control what they see. It just destroys the whole purpose of having a director to begin with.
I'm just too lazy to move around a 360 video. Just show me what I need to see and let's get it over with...
and I sure as hell ain't strapping no tiny tv to my face!
People used to say that about watches. Yes, normal watches.
***** at the same time there are tons of accessories that never caught on to a major extent. Bluetooth headsets come to mind. Or those awful sneakers with toes.
There's really no telling what the public will love or hate.
Toed shoes are amazing for climbers and Bluetooth earpieces may just have a comeback with the rumours about the new Samsung and iPhone 7 phones. These products - if they fail to be accepted by the majority - will still fill a niche market. I don't expect the premise is to walk around with a TV permanently strapped to your face; rather, to use the technology for a particular purpose.
***** The thing is though that you don't need to create content especially designed for Bluetooth headsets. VR on the other hand requires companies to invest in reworking or creating content for VR. Which is going to be a tough sell if it's a niche market.
Still, I think VR is going to be more than just a niche thing. All I'm saying is that I personally will not strap a tv to my face, haha.
If I were a betting man, I'd bet on some form of AR being more successful.
I enjoyed this. Do more walks around places. I liked the way the angle made me have to recalculate what I was really seeing. There could be some really unique story telling with this tech, but I see where you're coming from.
I didn't even realise this was a 360 video till the tennis ball part where you pointed me the other way. Then I thought it was kinda cool and rewatched the video while looking forward instead of backwards. I think I'll have to reserve judgement till the resolution and bandwith part of the equation improves to a point where I won't notice it as a limitation. But thanks for trying it out for us!
Your first point (resolution and bandwidth) is pretty silly. Ten years ago, you could have made exactly the same argument and concluded that CZcams will never work.
Point four (the film maker wanting to direct our interest) is a much better point, for most situations. The Alaskan cruise seems like exactly the sort of case where 360 is a huge win: the whole landscape is the subject, if you will, and allowing people to explore that from their own viewpoint sounds like a big win. On the other hand, you doing a piece to camera while walking through a market is obviously a terrible choice for 360. The market is an irrelevant distraction to what you're saying, and people want to watch you, rather than it. In this case, the immersive experience is imagining that you're talking directly and personally to me, not imagining that I'm walking through a marketplace.
Point six _is_ the point: 360 does look pretty good for atmospheric shots. That's it's niche. Ultimately, it seems that you're arguing against the strawman that every video will be shot in full 360,. Any worthwhile piece of video is shot using a number of different techniques. Sometimes, 360 will be an appropriate technique for some parts of a video; most of the time, it won't be an appropriate technique for most parts of a video. You know, just like slow motion or timelapse. But you don't bother making a video pointing out that we shouldn't shoot 100% of our footage in timelapse.
I was going to comment something along the lines of this but, you said way better than I ever could.
But all videos should be shot in 8K 10000 FPS 360 slow motion...
👌
beeble2003 You said everything I was thinking. Very nice!
it's a point nevertheless, and it will get better in probably only 3-4 years
But hey, his other points is on point (no pun intended)
+beeble2003
"The market is an irrelevant distraction to what you're saying, and people want to watch you, rather than it."
I disagree that this is universal:
-I spent much of the time enjoying the interesting market (often looking left/right)
-I disliked looking "behind me" and watching the speaker
-When I got bored of looking around I wanted to look straight ahead
I agree with the rest of what you say, however.
I believe that 360 will fill an interesting niche, but otherwise that you are correct.
Exactly i think there are some nice uses for this, but for most purposes it would be a distraction. But you dont have to go all the way to 360. Imagine a VR movie with 210 degree vision where you can slightly move your head to get immersive super widescreen but still see the center focus point. And for documentaries it would be great for some scenes, but not others. This switching however is not very appealing to the user.
Decus, I agree. I can see some interesting utilitarian uses. Perhaps in the real estate business. Surveillance and live news reporting comes to mind as well.
VR Headsets are really good for games, but for video, films and the like they remove the viewpoint that the director wants you to see and look at which makes them worse.
How about the role of 360 audio (binaural and ambisonic) in the technology though? Isn't it worth it developing and using that technology having that in mind as well, especially when it comes to music? What's your thought about it?
I love this video and I hope you make more. video capturing the world around you is tool orientated. You use the kind of camera that can best illustrate what you want to convey to your audience. Walking through a city in 360 is amazing. You can point things out as if we were there with you. You just have to give, us the viewer, time to scroll around to see what you are pointing at.
360 video actually works well in this case since you aren't trying to show us something. All you are doing is talking so it isn't necessary for us to even watch the video. I could have technically opened another tab and just listened to you. It didn't work well when you wanted us to look at that tennis ball video since you have to get viewers to turn around and focus on something.
I decided to stay and look around at things because it isn't something i normally get to see. I can also choose to look at you or i can see other things. That's one thing I don't like about your other videos compared to this one, you are walking around in fascinating places but you only show us your face but i want to see what you are seeing.
Exactly.
I missed the start of the video with the girls because I was looking away. That just demonstrates Derek's point.
same, i didnt notice it played until he pointed at it :/
Just because it doesn't distract you as much does not mean it works well. Yes, you could just open another tab and just listen. But the file sizes and upload times of 360 videos are so big and long so it is worth it? Furthermore, most videos do want you to focus on one thing that is happening. Listening and looking around is ok or even good in this case, but it is not necessary. You could Google pictures up, so they would be less grainy than in the video. Even if these technical things were fixed, there is still a question: Do you really need 360 degrees of vision for your field of sight, a fraction of that amount?
Randumb Person oh i agree, theyre not needed but theyre not pointless/detrimental in this context atleast :P
I spent the entire video looking at the shops around him... Never knew every 5th shop in Korea was for optical glasses.
thaghost lol
near-sightedness is a huge problem, especially in Asia, so it makes sense. But yeah, I didn't know they had so many shops :D
They are laundering money :-D
That's actually because of the place he's at. It's called Namdaemun Market. Other neighborhoods have different varieties of shops. But still, you're right... that was also a suprise for me. I don't remember seeing that many when I lived there. Maybe I just didn't pay attention to them.
I wonder if it would be useful to be in a the middle of a round table discussion where you can choose who to look for various reasons-like a virtual meeting.
One positive I found from this format in your video is that I was able to look at other things, which actually helped me to focus on the subject of the video. Sort of like how you don't simply stare at someone constantly when they are talking to you, because it feels natural to avert your gaze and makes listening a bit more relaxed.
Spent the entire time looking at his hands at the bottom.
Kevin Yeoh lol I did tht too
You are definitely not alone sir !
Me toooooo 😂😂😂
You are definitely not alone!
*t h u m b*
I think 360 is a useful tool, but not good for entertainment. For instance, in CCTV security footage it would be useful.
I can't say it better .. The world of videography is big and expanding and always the question is what the right tool to get the wanted result.
it would also be interesting for things like music festival streaming
ironically this video demonstrates a perfect usage case for the tech.
I think that's a very limited view point(get it). But in all seriousness I think 360 video is a tool that can be used by engineers and artist alike, and used properly will give us some awesome results. It's kinda like CAD(Computer Aid Design) and 3D computer graphics software like Blender are basically two different applications of the same technology. It's probably not useful for most traditional types videos, but I'm sure somebody is going make really awesome and fun videos using this tech.
Said that people thought motion pictures would replace books. They didn't but they have their very own charme and place in our world. People still read books and watch movies (or youtube videos) and that's what 360 videos will do too. It's up to our creativity to make interesting content for it showing something you can't show with normal videos to make them earn their place where no other medium can get.
i’ve never disagree with you until now, i watched this video with you talking in the background while scanning the view around you and it was like i was walking with you in the street and talk to you, i was able to look at all those markets i wanted to look at unlike these videos when the cameraman just rotates it and you feel like oh man but i wanted to see that!! i have never been able to travel abroad but this experience felt like i’m visiting a new place! it was awesome! and of course even in real life the option of looking out at every single place around you can make you feel dizzy but the beauty is that *you* choose where to look at as in real life and in this virtual reality this is physically way more easy to look around you on everything with only your finger instead of your whole head. i didn’t think of that topic before but after this video i wish that you are wrong because if 360 cameras will be our future everything can step ahead in this media world, there are so much things to do with this technology! and the technology will get better only if people actually give it a try and start using it, then it will naturally evolve over time.
I see 360 as one tool, and it can be used well or badly. I think the best uses (at the moment) are when tracking, panning, tilting zooming decisions are made in post, then exported in standard formats. You shoot 360° but direct the viewers' attention where you want it. You can cover a scene in one take, one camera, one setup, then use various parts of it in various ways.
Look straight down and see his hand holding nothing
I spent most of the video watching his hands :)
Yes, hands :D
I dont like 360 because I can't look at everything at once and I'm afraid I'm going to miss something
That is life you will miss a lot, but you can see so much more than in only his "selfie" vlog. It is like if you don´t want to jump to pool full of money just because you are afraid that you will not get every penny...
+Drual
Well said.
If he didnt record in 360, he wouldve shown the things he wanted to show. which are probably the things i want to see or require to see the understand what he's talking about. i think 360 can be situationally perfect though.
I can't believe so many people liked this comment. People miss things constantly. Its like a law that somewhere a human is missing out on something. I actually think the missing out on things is an advantage of 360 videos. You can replay it and experience something new and different multiple times. That could lead to awesome videos with non-linear storytelling. Like having a famous speaker making a speech in front of you in a crowd, but if you look behind you or to the side, you can see an assassination attempt unfolding, no cutting necessary for the details. You don't have to look unless you want to. Very complex and immersive stories could be told. If we have the bandwidth for it....
Anthony Baker lol I haven't got that much time on my hands I have something called a life
I enjoyed this trip very much, I think it was amazing but only for certain types of interactions.
The whole time you were talking, I didn't feel like I had to focus only on your being, I could look around, and that in turn made me feel like we were taking a stroll and discussing ideas, which sharpened my focus on your voice and what you were presenting.
Then again, I got distracted a few times because I've always wanted to visit Seoul and being a responsible father with less money in the bank than I care to admit, I watched the video a few times to soak it all in ;-)
this blew my friggin mind! I want to see more even if it's just a fad
Spherical video opens up the potential to visit places that one usually can't.
To look around at architecture or great wonders of nature that are dangerous or hard to reach.
For sight seeing they hold real potential.
However, for most forms of video it is the framing and editing that imparts the feel and tension, brings drama and makes points. That is how we tell stories and educate. There is little then that 360 can bring to those types of video.
i think 360 videos are great for 'walkumentaries' , where a person walks through a place and tells a story about it
yes, but only not that
Don't just say "but only that". It makes you seem small-minded. It could be fun to watch 360 videos for space exploration, for riding virtual roller coasters, for deep sea diving, for watching specific events, for watching movies. There is way more potential than just walkumentaries.
TheGreatCapra just look how I edited the comment
Suggestion however.. What about a scale covering the mount and hand , possibly instructions in the very beginning to look or touch and swipe to look down for the said compass/scale. A sense of relative direction to forward (from your POV) and towards you, left right. Yes it may seem obvious to most. But in showing this video to others it was surprising how many got lost directionally, or did not understand how to use the touchscreen ability to turn.
i loved the video... but just because i love travelling, getting a sense and feel for different human structures and 'worlds', which the 360 video does great, and I've not been to Korea (nice loc. choice, btw!!).
Your obsv.'s that learning req. focus, and that fancy gadgets must ultimately conform to "human-hardware" input spec's are right on point.
A funny thing in the vid. happened just as you spoke about "noticing what was behind/around you"... did you catch it?
if you happen to read this, great, great product, keep up the good work!!
j-gray.
You know what was far more interesting than looking all around during the video? Hovering over the time bar and seeing the whole picture in a box.
if you watch it on a ps3 it's the same, but on a big screen xD super annoying, stuff flies by at 200 miles an hour
The moment I realized I could move the video around (it was a few seconds in) I was amazed. I immediately spiraled around and marveled at Seoul, the people, and the technology. And then ten seconds later, I stopped playing with it and went back to my Sudoku.
Adnan Ilyas same
Ikr and I was using a phone without a gyro, and it still felt amazing.
*seppuku
I think it's only useful for visiting places, because that when you turn to look everywhere.
Interesting effect when you look down at your hand holding the camera where the end of your thumb looks cut off.
well its not revolutionary
but its not useless either
agreed
It is a LITTLE revolutionary, after all it does turn around ;)
They have a lot of good purposes in my opinion but for a planned video not so much. When used as a camera to capture something that is bound to go off semi randomly out of frame this could be a good backup camera.
Beyond that I really love these cameras for security purposes and oddities like showing an environment where you walk through a building or scenery and the viewer can choose to pause and what to look at. Higher resolutions would be a a nice to have though.
You are both right and wrong. Watching a film (and other examples you mentioned) is much better to be presented in the current form, everything you say about that is correct.
However, your own video disproves your statement. No one wants to watch your face for 6 minutes as you talk, but I had fun watching the streets and shops of a far away country while listening to you. Similar to how I listen to a podcast while doing other things.
If it's not a guided experience but a world to explore, 360 can offer much more information and the ability to rewatch the same video to learn even more.
Alicorn I completely agree with you. In some cases, it provides a much better experience for the audience. For example, there are some rollercoaster review videos in 360 which have amazingly indepth videos with plenty immersion. This immersion makes the video even better because instead of saying "That looks like fun" they will say "That WAS fun, I want to do that in real life."
I completely agree.
I agree. movies, documentaries, and things like that are made to show something specific and it doesn't make sense to have people looking around. But I honestly spent most of the video watching the interesting scenery. As far as immersion goes, it felt like I was going on a stroll with Veritasium just hanging out and browsing a bizarre.
So yeah, I agree, his video disproves his point.
I also feel in walking shots it's much more natural to be moving in the same direction as the speaker. It's like you're walking and having a conversation with them. It's quite odd to stare at someone who's only talking and be moving backwards. There's a bunch of use cases where a 360 option makes for a great video.
I feel like it's better to shoot in 360, then edit the video to show the most interesting parts. My biggest problem with 360 is that moving around is slow and choppy, and I often have to rewatch videos several times in order to see the best angles.
It would be interesting to see if people are looking at the same things given the freedom to look around like in this video. It also makes me think of that video of the basketball players where you're supposed to follow the ball and half of the people completely miss the dancing bear walk through the video. it would be cool to make a 360 version of that.
This is an awesome way to see new places or podcasts when you want to rewind and see a rooms reaction. Movies would be hard and a headset is nearly a must.
omg... so many things to buy... nobody show this place to my mother.
😂😂😂
Charles Miller hurry up and take her to the Dollar tree store and drop her off b4 she sees it xD
Still dying of laughter with this comment.
you're not wrong,... 360 is pointless
Correct, there's no focus point, you can look all around. :P /s
So it's like real life, you can watch the guy talking OR look around and see what else is going on, also TOTAL focus point in VR Porn, Just saying.
did you just made a joke and no one understood?
until we find a usecase for it...
It could replace imax in a cinematic way. Planet earth in ultra mega imax HD 360 would be awesome.
For doing a remote walkthrough of a house, I like having a chained series of high resolution, 3D points that you can jump to. It might be cool for many kinds of self directed learning. But I do tune in to your channel because you are excellent at moving understanding along. You know how to frame a scene. You know how to frame a topic. So for anything like guided learning, I agree, it's a missapplication of the technology that dissapates the benifit of the guide.
With a 360 camera, it's cool that when you do these vlogs we can listen to you and look around as you're walking about these interesting places you record. It's chill.
This video is not drunk friendly. I shall visit later time.
No you didn't but funny lol!
Did you ever visit it
@@NooneStaar Thank you for reminding. Now this later time that I have visited and watched this video, I think it is not sober friendly either.
@@Fawerown Thank you for following up and reporting your finding.
I love looking at all the people going past
yea you can eyeball ppl without making mutual eye contact.
It stays unnaturally still.
with the expression of your avatar?
Enkii Muto Correct
look at his fingers holding the camera
Tbh, even besides the fact that I get to look down the little alleys while stile listening to you, it's just kind of cool attempting to process it all at once. It didn't show the extra clip real well in my opinion, so 360 video probably won't be good for demonstration purposes, but it would still be really cool for vlogs. Keep on making your awesome videos, man!
Depending on the content that you’re creating, it could be the best tool. We all need to choose the right tools for the job. Sometimes spherical video might be the best. Why not?
Exactly, why look at an innovation and try to dissuade people from using it just because it doesn't perfectly replace a previous tech?
I don't think he's arguing that it shouldn't exist. I think he's arguing that it's not going to take over the domain of video like it was being hyped up to do.
I think you are right that the 360 view is distracting to the conversation, but I can also say that you are narrowly looking at this from your point of view as a teacher of stuff.
Movies will not be shot to any real effect in 360 because movies are the art of crafting the narrative, in the same vein as teaching is the art of conveying information.
Where this will really shine is in imparting an experience. Personally i was able to follow along with your talk, but i also got a knowledge of the street. Its not useful and will be forgotten shortly, but it was someplace new. Its kinda like virtual reality, most games are not going to work well with it, but in games that focus on the experience, it can be a powerful tool.
Its all about using the tools available and correctly to get the greatest impact out of your goal.
Wraith Gear I agree , in the kind of videos he does 360 video doesn't do much.
But creators like Casey Neistat that produce content based on sharing a experience can benefit from this new technology.
its not gonna replace the traditional way of film making or videos in general but it is a good method to get a point across.
@Wraith Gear
I was just about to write a comment when I realized, what I was going to write has probably already been written. Guess what, i found my thoughts. Totally agreed. Spared me several minutes, thanks :-)
cool thank you!
+
Wraith Gear yes exactly!
Oh yes, 360 144s 15FPS and Shit internet go well together.
This is pretty cool in mobile, but it's not perfect, it's slowly drifting away, by the end of the I was stating straight upwards even though I was still gazing the exact same way.
MrAntieMatter you can drag the screen to move the footage :)
I really liked this video, and the 360 aspect is probably my favorite part. I don't think you could have provided a better place to shoot a 360 video, as their is something constantly going on around you, in all directions. One of my favorite things was tracking people who pass you, going back and seeing where they came from, and really watching the entire development. One thing I noticed is that people who are coming at you will look forward, and once you pass them they turn around and look at whatever crazy camera contraption you were holding.
the thumbnails at the seek bar are so curious!, it's like seeing in all directions at the same time!!, I wish I could watch the video like that!!
I think both 360deg and standard video both have their place.
This video would have been much more focused on the topic at hand in standard video.
However I would have not gotten the ability to see the setting, it was really interesting to look around the environment you were in with 360 deg vision. See all of the tiny shops crammed with goods, see the local culture.
Structured narrative content should be fixed viewing (2d or 3d). But I 100% believe there is a place for 360deg video. Especially for capturing a place at a given moment in time.
I think what I said will be the general way that things are, but there will be some exceptional exceptions to it.
Just tried this video in Cardboard. Was awesome.
well said. I agree.
I think you're wrong. But not because your points are wrong, but rather the concept you're starting with is wrong.
360 video isn't "the" future, rather it's "a" future. Your video is actually an excellent example of a successful way to use 360 video. It was really fun to be able to look around the same way I would have been if I was there in person. Taking in the surroundings and being oo'd and ah'd by things. It didn't distract me at all from the conversation you were having with the viewer either.
Will 360 replace normal video? Absolutely not. But I do think it will grow and find a comfortable niche.
I agree, it is just like taking a walk with someone, you can enjoy the walk and listen to person without a problem. 360 could be interesting, I can image an immersive point of view film with a story. Where you are seeing the world from the view of the main character (There is one movie that is made entirely pov but with normal camera). It would be quite similar to a video game. 360 is also great for landscapes or filming some extreme sports.
360 will find its place but "normal" filming gives a lot more opportunities for artistic expression.
Bingo! You said the same point that I tried to say, but you said it better.
Alexandr Korekov you've never been a tourist, eh? :)
Also, how many people do you walk with where one of you is walking backwards so you can be face to face the whole time? Cause that's just impressive :D
Isn't that what he was saying the whole time ? He said it's not the future, and that's the exact same thing you said, he could be willing to accept that it is a future, but mainly he was proving that it isn't THE future.
Alexandr Korekov
Oh come on, you never had conversation while driving a car or cooking? You don't need to look at the person to pay attention on what they are saying.
Please Do I have been watching your videos for a long time now and this gave it such a nice feel and im add and get side tract really easy but not once did I get off track and miss the point you were trying to make it was really surprising for me
My take on 360 is also that for video it's a passing trend, but is awsome for photography where you have time to take in all the detalis,zoom in/out etc.
I angled the camera down towards his hand and couldn't stop laughing
Scrolled down just to see if anybody else noticed that. So gross. 8(
It's like like Hanson from Scary Movie 2. _TAEK MAH HAND!_
MY STRONG HAND
Vito C I also did and it didn't impress me at all, let alone unstopable laugh
I was just watching this on my phone while sitting down, holding my phone down in my lap, pointed upwards, and I didn't actually realise what it meant that the video was 360 so for like three or four minutes literally all I saw was his hand and I genuinely thought that was just it...
You are completely missing the point. You souldn't expect 360 video format to become the only video format available in the future, it's just another tool that video editors and directors can now use to tell their stories. It's good for some tasks like showing an immersive beautiful landscapes and bad for other tasks like showing a video where the viewer is supposed to look at something specific like that tennis ball example. People are so quick to come to conclusions. Oooh we invented the internet - lets burn all the paper books, oooh we invented a CGI - lets make all movies in cgi now, oooh we created a phone - lets not talk to people in person now..
Миша Шевченко yeah you didn't watch the whole video, and if you did you missed the point by a couple miles. the point where he's talking about Edison and motion pictures replacing textbooks. his argument here isn't that 360 video shouldn't be used, he just feels like its not a replacement for anything like a lot of people seem to think.
***** you seem to miss my point. He said that he doesn't see how 360 video can become mainstream, my point is that you SOULDN'T even expect it to become mainstream. Every time a new technology is created people always say "this is it, it's gonna change the world" and that's wrong. You can't always predict these things.
Yes but people do and he's refuting that saying that it really can't as its not ideal for that purpose
I agree with you almost entirely, however it was entertaining to look around during one of your monologue pieces that you do while walking around and listen while I look around and see the sights.
Im on like the first gen iphone and 360 video on this out dated phone doesn't work properly.
I was wondering why my cursor turned into a little hand. I didn't realize the video was 360 until he said 'granted you are getting a nice view' lol...
exactly the same!
x2eXu50x u
I kept thinking, when does this video become spherical, based on the thumbnails. Took me a bit to realize earlier thumbnails looked spherical, and it was because the youtube video was only showing one direction...
Zoom down to look at his hand and then spin it around.
That was weird! Also kinda neat for about 30 seconds, but I wouldn't want it to be the future.
Thanks for making me barf
I am also not sure that I like it or not, but I would love to see more and decide later.
Interesting execution 👏
I find that using 360 video when talking about something while walking gives the viewer more to look at and interact with instead of encouraging the viewer to let it run in the background while s/he does something else.
I agree for once I was actually looking at the video all the way, then again, I was barely watching derek. Although it felt more like I was walking with him on some street in Seoul.
Exactly, you get a package deal that is relevant to the topic at least in most cases so it's got it's charm. Still no replacement for traditional flat shot filming
it is good for experiencing a place. you can turn your "head" and get a better picture of what is around the person. i only look side to side or up and down as opposed to behind the way the person is facing (while walking). so, it may work better if it was only the front hemisphere because then the person filming could orient it in the direction they were facing. thus, you could "experience the moment with them". just a thought, take it with a grain of salt.
1. Resolutions will obviously improve. Bad argument. Bandwidth will improve too.
2. Zooming on 360 will also not be a problem. Extremely weak argument.
3. Are you forgetting that VR makes 360 perfect. It makes the video viewing experience MORE like how real humans see the world not less. On top of that even in the 2D player we are still looking at and focusing on the exact same real-esate on the screen. The same amount. Only it's interactive and we get to choose where we look. Where else do we see this? Video games. I guess those aren't successful for this reason as well? (Oh wait, they are wildly sucessful.) Not only is this a bad argument... examination of the argument leads to pros of 360 video, not cons.
4. Sounds like a selfish and personal reason... not really anything against 360. End of the day the consumers drive the technology and not the content creators.
5. I'm not going to debate with you on learning (even though I don't fully agree) but this fifth point is literally nothing to do with 360 video. And is even only tangental to "teaching" 360 videos.
6? control is out of the hands of the creator? No. Does a stage performer somehow lose something by allowing the audience member's heads to move? No. Think about how magicians can control where people look and what they focus on without actually physically controlling their head or eyes. Is it more challenging? Yeah. Is that a bad thing? Not at all.
7. All of your examples were really bad and didn't help your case. Motion pictures didn't replace books... but motion pictures are insanely popular. (Way more than books.)
So you are saying that 360 won't replace 2D video... but will just be wildly more successful than 2D video?
You are looking at 360 video with a very very narrow lens. Only in education. Try to be more open minded and examine everything objectively before jumping to a conclusion. (You know, like scientists do.)
By the way, I watched the whole video looking in the direction you were walking. I was able to get everything you said just fine without looking at or focusing on your face.
It actually felt like we were walking together and having a conversation.
I agree with his points about SPECIFICALLY videos.(more so for movies and shows) It is unfeasible for the industry to stage and make movies in an artistic way, seeing as it gives more personal perspective. Movies are a NARRATIVE, thus personally interjecting yourself defeats the purpose of trying to push a specific view point.... When you think of movies/shows shot in 360, it becomes infinitely harder from an artistic and a functionally viable stand point.
That being said, I doubt 360 videos will replace movies in the same way that movies 'replaced' books, however, 360 is NOT a fad. I do own a Vive, and have not regretted the purchase once. You are arguing with focus on more than just video, which is what most of the comment section is doing. (they say that it is a fad or not useful for entertainment, which is false for anyone who has actually used 360 games or environments via VR)
In fact, 360 (in real life) for movies and shows do exist, and are already MUCH less common. Going to a play, or murder mystery, things like that, are examples were the world is around you, and you can view as you are there. You can even interact with things like murder mysteries... and yet there is still very little industry comparatively to the movie industry.
Bridden They are much less common because the market is emerging. I've already begun to see a spike in 360 video content and I am thoroughly enjoying it.
So many times in history people have labelled technology as a "fad" and quite often they were completely wrong.
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
Thomas Watson, president of IBM, 1943
"Television won't be able to hold on to any market it captures after the first six months. People will soon get tired of staring at a plywood box every night."
Darryl Zanuck, executive at 20th Century Fox, 1946
"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
Ken Olsen, founder of Digital Equipment Corporation, 1977
"Almost all of the many predictions now being made about 1996 hinge on the Internet's continuing exponential growth. But I predict the Internet will soon go spectacularly supernova and in 1996 catastrophically collapse."
Robert Metcalfe, founder of 3Com, 1995
Maybe soon we will be quoting Derek here?
I think we haven't even unlocked the full potential of 360 yet. It has a LOT of potential and I have no reason to think it won't do well.
Regardless... none of Derek's arguments were good arguments. Even if 360 goes away and is just a fad, it won't have made his arguments any less wrong.
I found it especially odd that he said "In 2013 they said online video courses would revolutionize education", with the implication that they didn't. It's been three years! That's like someone looking at ARPANET in 1976 and dismissing the chance that computer networks will revolutionize content delivery.
Is 360 video mostly a gimmick now? Quite emphatically yes, but it's also an immature technology that needs to increase in fidelity a lot (it will) and people need to learn how to play to its strengths (they will).
I liked this because I explored ure surroundings but as a result gig distracted. I love the video and was focused on it for the total duration because I kept looking around like a tourist. its fun seeing ure surroundings
I believe it depends on the information being displayed. Having the ability to gather more detail and information from any video is very useful depending on how it is displayed
I foresee virtual tourism emerging through this technology. Bad day at the office? Log into our Venice Gondola stream, or soak up the City of Lights with our Paris walking tour. 360 video is good for atmosphere, ambiance, not narrative.
Smart people once said the same thing about telephone and radio. Sure, 360 video is stupid for things like vlogs and movies, but it definitely has a niche. Especially for things like virtual tours.
So, basically it's the video equivalent of a View-Master.
I don't think View-Master has movement tracking? I don't know. I've never had one
xbmc xbmc Yeah kinda. Virtual Reality is huge with a bright future. Every VR headset is just a glorified viewmaster (stereoscopic viewer) for 360 video.
It's not even that though. His main objections are resolution and bandwidth... which are both short-sighted. Resolution just requires better camera sensors being cheaper, which I find mass production accomplishes quite well. For bandwidth... yeah wtf. My entire city and the surrounding areas have gigabit fiber internet service. And it's not even a huge city. The point is that increasing bandwidth is simply a matter of literally just going ahead and doing it. Even with wi-fi, where speed caps and range can be an issue, you can quite easily just increase the access point density so it isn't so sparse and there's less interference.
It's not even that though. His main objections are resolution and bandwidth... which are both short-sighted. Resolution just requires better camera sensors being cheaper, which I find mass production accomplishes quite well. For bandwidth... yeah wtf. My entire city and the surrounding areas have gigabit fiber internet service. And it's not even a huge city. The point is that increasing bandwidth is simply a matter of literally just going ahead and doing it. Even with wi-fi, where speed caps and range can be an issue, you can quite easily just increase the access point density so it isn't so sparse and there's less interference.
How old is the 48 megapixel sensor from Nokia? What about the far field image sensors, giving the user the ability to focus after recording?
Do you feel getting old?
Derek, you are looking at it from a content creator's point of view.
As a traveller, a 360 camera is a godsend to me. I enjoy going on long walks in foreign cities, just soaking up the atmosphere, admiring the landmarks, and having a 360 camera on a stick, sticking out of my pocket or backpack above me, I have a 3rd person view of my walk, essentially as if I had a personal drone I don't need care about and which follows me and documents the whole trip. I don't need to take photos all the time, I don't need to focus on selecting what might be interesting to watch later. Of course I still can, I still have a camera, but I don't feel the pressure of documenting those memories - the 360 camera does that for me and it is much better at documenting everything around me than me myself with any other camera ever would.
So, to me, a 360 camera is a great device if you ever feel like you'd like to have a drone following you everywhere and capturing footage of everything that's around you.
Another point of view - you can reframe the video any way you wish during editing and export in a classic format.
He's not saying that it doesn't have any use cases, just that there are to many problems for it to widely used.
He's talking specifically about people who (back then) were saying it's the future. Like it's something that will have a big impact.
I think if 360 is going to be successful, it relies on achieving widespread use of VR headsets, because without VR headsets, 360 video is exponentially more difficult to watch.
there is a potenial damage to the eyes, watching something that close will strain the eyes. So in a way 360 video may not be successful.
even with VR headsets, it is still a huge distraction, unless it is just a casual video without a particular focus. however, i am sure these kinds of video will be quickly fade away as people find it boring.
VR headsets actually reduce eyestrain by having your eyes focus at infinity.
I agree that a headset increases the immersion. However I'd argue that holding your phone up and spinning around is the next best thing. Given there are very few comfortable GUI's that support being in VR (CZcams included, shame on them), a headset becomes an extra step you have to "choose" to want to engage with prior to even loading the video. Then once the video stops, oh no, you have to take it off your head, select something else, and put it back on again. It's great fun but it's currently very very messy.
I just found this whole video a little bit annoying because it's in 360, I hate it
I actually think it's cool lol
You don't even have to look around lol.
If you have a shitty internet connection, I empathize because I have one too, and the video quality was crap lol.
I feel like this too, it's disurbing to be able to look all around. Like I want to look at him while he is explaining things, but i know i have the possibility to look somewhere else, it makes me feel a bit weird.
Like so much of film making principles are just useless if something is filmed in 360
Trying to swipe the video down on iPhone it not working bc the 360ness
Woah! Somehow I made it glitch and I can see the entire 360 view at once...
360 works on a limit sets of occasions. Lets see you want to take people on a video to experience the surface of Mars. Or maybe swim around bacteria or cells. In those scenarios I can see a very good application. Even in movies, but that movie must be design for that, and Im not sure if it will hold for a two hour one.
I saw drift and rally videos shot in 360 and it was amazing! Apart from the low resolution.
Where it doesn't matter where you look. But most of the time, it does matter.
Pretty much, I don't see it ever becoming more than a niche thing.
Talk shows and interviews might actually be very good in 360 (if you have a headset).
I think it could hold for two hours, given that the HMDs are comfortable enough, and the video is clear enough. We just need to do, as you said, design for it. Make the movie not just take place in front of the watcher, but all around them. Yes, there will be times that focus on a certain place could be important for the story (but I'd argue not paramount if you can still hear what is going on) but the actions of the movie could happen all around the viewers just like it does in life. But then I'm talking more about true VR movies and less about 360 movies in this case. Though I agree that 360 video will have specific uses. Still specific uses and niche do not equal fad.
I was staring at his hand for half the video before I figured out the camera moves
May be we should see Nat geo videos in 360 to know the advantages of 360 videos
my problem with 360 is that i dont realize that a video is in 360, so i'll often end looking down or up for half of the video