How to IMPROVE your classic mini's suspension
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- čas přidán 26. 01. 2018
- Our tech tip videos teach you technical skills for working on your car. Our goal is to create a resource of educational information specifically for working on older cars, classic cars, and weird cars. Subscribe for more!
Note: these are just our thoughts on how to improve the mini's suspension setup. The best parts for your car will probably be different, depending on what you use it for. We hope that sharing our ideas might point some people in the right direction, and we ALSO hope that we can learn some new things from your comments!
Mini parts www.stevestonmotorco.com - Auta a dopravní prostředky
Thanks for the great video. I suggest you box up the entire upgrade kit, and sell it yourself. If you do tell me. I will need one
Also took an MG1100 engine from an austin america on the ship and blue printed it when we were out at sea..changed the drive gear milled the head..ported and polished chambers and balanced it too..we had a great machine shop..the Chief Petty officer would come and ask what we were doing..we would tell them its an auxiliary engine for a small boat haha.. all fun stuff when youre a car nut!!
MG 1100 engine is great for a Mini, about 1969 I bought an ordinary 1100 engine from breakers yard, rebuilt, put in Duplex timing gears, 12G295 head, 1/1/2" carb. Changed the final drive to a 3.44:1. This went in my 1961 Mini. Had virtually the performance of an S, but more economical on fuel. 100 MPH was easy, in fact, one could cruise at this speed. Engine was in the car for 30 years, replaced it with a fairly 1275, guess what, not as fast or economical. I still have the 1100 (1098) engine, it's in good condition. Also still have the 1961 Mini.
I laughed at your graphs. Back in the 80s me and my mini freinds all bought adjustable trumpents we all only ever adjusted them once.
We all thought we would actually adjust them all the time in reality we set our fav ride hieght and never adjusted them again. We all agreed for steet we should have cut to adjust ride height and used our little hobby funds some where else.
Always great videos. "Cafe racer mini is my fav"
David Vizard was always cool. Because he dyno compared every after market part.You could make a choice. A very informed expert parts selection compared on results from the dyno runs graphs he posted in his books.
Funny story I lived in Atlanta in the 80s. Most of use in the club were always building minis. David Vizard books were a valuable tool we all shared. Then he came out with a big thick "bible we called it"
We all read the same book discussed all the dyno findings and every body ended up with completely different motors carbs and set ups.! One would expect very similar. Cars.There were all across the spectrem !
Just goes to show you everyone can read the same book , but interpret it "completely different"
On an even funnier note.
The Atlanta ga. Mini club in the 80s we had a mini meet in south Carolina with a few other clubs.
In south Carolina three of our minis were fueling up when a local family a Dad and four sons ( young kids) pulled up to get gas in an old mini traveler. He thought he was the only Mini in the USA. His boys were in heaven checking out our lowered modified flared racing seat cars.
Asking endless questions. Then the Dad said " Ive NEVER SEEN ANOTHER mini now im seeing 3...wow !!!'
Well we knew in a minute or two the gas station will be swamped in 30 more minis...we smiled and said "OH THERE AROUND....!!!!"
THEN ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE AND MINIS TOOK OVER EVERY SPACE OF CONCRETE THE STATION HAD EVER GAS PUMP WAS MINIS MINIS AND DRIVERS CODRIVERS AND THE MAN AND HIS KIDS WENT BAZZERK !
Hey, thanks so much for sharing your memories. Got a kick out of them. I can only imagine the disbelief of the guy at the gas station!! haha
Haha! That’s awesome!
Great comment, Vizard the Wizard.
Can't believe I've only just found this channel great work on all your videos. subscribed
Another quality explanation, great work! Thanks!
Had SMCO redo my suspension based on everything in the video. Nailed it. That was 4 years ago and its still as tight as a rock.
So happy I've found your CZcams channel
Thanks for the great info - just installed some new shocks (like your recommendation) and looking forward to seeing if I can tell the difference. Old ones definitely past it!
Lovely to see this knowledge being passed on - its what we used to do to our minis in the 80s to go rallying on tarmac.
Great explanations of everything! A pleasure to watch and learn from. My 62 mk1 is 99% done but after this video it needs a few support welds on the sub-frame and those reinforcement steel gusset pieces.
That's one of the best tutorial i have seen on YT period... Well done !
Wow, thank you!
Wicked video guys 👍🏻 explained beautifully with great performance updgrades
Watched this great video. Extremely simple and well comprehensive explanation. Learned a lot! Mnay Thanks for your time with us owning the Little Big car....
Wonderfull video, exactly what I was looking for. I'm completely rebuilding a Mini now for the first time so this is very usefull information. Much appreciated!
Really well explained. I actually understood it all😀
Great video! I’ll be sure to follow it when I get my Mini.
Very informative and clear explanation, thanks.
Another great informative and detailed Video.
Just what I needed. Thanks!😄
Great info! You gain a subscriber, with a video from 6 years ago, I'll be watching some more
Great info if you can find a Mini to work on. Haven't had my 997 for 40 years and I still miss it.
:(
Thank you for a great video I go with the same set up.
I would love to see a video on clutch upgrade kits (lightweight flywheels, types of performance clutches, up grade on pins and arms) for the 998 & 1275’s
Great video, I've saved for later when my mk1 arrives. Do you guys have something like a parts list?
Great video!!!!! Thanks guyssss
Excellent video. Really wish you were able to suggest parts for street use only. My aching back really needs it :)
good stuff , thanks for sharing
Another great video
Great vid!
Cheers Cole!
My favourite CZcams channel by far! I’ve just finished fitting this exact set-up with smaller break disks and 10 inch wheels. The ride height is really high even at its lowest setting, everything is seated correctly but it’s not sitting as low as I’d hoped, there’s 4 inch gap between the top of the tyre and the front arch. Should I expect the cones to settle or is there something I can do to get car sat lower? Thanks, and keep the great content coming.
Many thanks! Can not await the coming season.
Great Content! Simple and detalied
keep posting
Thx Enrico :)
Very good overview. Chosen most of these parts for my 99 Mini Cooper road car. At a later stage, I will make the front and rear fully adjustable but here in NZ is a certification regime that means this level of change needs engineering compliance or $450 of my money for someone to say I can bolt this all together. Go figure. For the moment I am going for the best OEM standard. 😁
Best Mini videos on the net, diferent from those Hollywoodians youtubers out there
awesome channel !!!
Very well explained #Quality
Can you please produce a video on how to set up a suspension with the performance upgrades you highlight in this video.
Great video! The level of detail is spot on. Well done Phillip! Please keep these coming... without becoming an infomercial it would be good to see where you are getting the parts.
Really great and informational video. Thanks
Welcome
Excellent video. Bought a mini last summer, it's already got the Gas-a-just shocks so I'm *really* hoping it has HiLos on there too, haven't checked yet! Really need to raise the back-end though.
Used to cut bits of the trumpets to lower and add washers to raise, much cheaper than high/low. But the rear ratio is around 9:1from memory, so 0.125" on trumpets is 1.125" on ride height.
Excellent vid, thanks. I've had Minis since 1968, so I know a little about them, nothing compared to Vizard the Wizard - he's still around. For ROAD use, rebuild your suspension to make sure all is correctly fitted - you would be surprised at how many installations are bad. Set the front up for 2 degrees negative camber, with 1/8th" toe in; rear, 2 degrees neg camber with 0" toe-in; my preference - uprated cones front, standards @ rear; Shocks - what I call 8 second shocks, full extension to full compression, quite hard. I stick with std ride height, to cope with potholes, and keep max suspension travel. Rubber bushes can be replaced with neoprene equivalents, of various hardness, go for soft or up one hardness up for the road. That lot will give you a surprisingly good setup, a starting point, take it from there if needs be.
Parts: you can always refer to Minispares (UK) or Mini Sport (UK) to start with, look for US suppliers from there. MED also manufacture top quality racing parts.
Great advice, Theo. Thanks for posting up your preferred alignment settings, too. That's helpful for anyone setting up their car for some spirited road use. We definitely prefer rubber bushes for the road, however. Plastic is excellent, but only when it's in good nick and it seems to wear pretty quickly (in our experience).
Very good video
What a fab video..
In the process of doing some of the upgrades shown pitty I'm not confident enough to take out the front sub frame to weld it or change the cones but great video your stuff has helped me alot
Welcome. With some time and persistence, you can do it!
Great video. What is the refence of the Tilton master cylinder and brake bias adjuster?
Nice Video and explanation although if memory serves the mini came originally with a single brake master cylinder later replaced with a twin split system and both had a brake limiter valve fitted for the rear brakes the early one controlled by a spring allowing a piston to shut off the brake pressure to the rear wheels thereby stopping the car swapping ends under heavy braking the later split system had a different method it had a heavy ball inside it that was moved by the braking G force I only mention this as if you fit the Tilton brake balance valve you will need to remove the existing one fitted to the rear subframe .I f you want to know how I know this all I can say is that in 1970 I started with a brand new shell.
Interesting topic and great information, As I really like and working on building a (car ) Cafe racer. I am interested in the Tilton brake setup, and wanted to more information on the parts selected and tubing sizes selected, also how you have set it up. I have not had great luck with the factory units brake booster and master cylinder. and the aftermarket Mini brake booster servo single line system.
Thanks, they're both .75" bore units. We always prefer non-servo brakes, or manual brakes. They give the best Pedal feel and because the cars are so light to begin with, boosting them isn't necessary.
Factory non-servo master cylinders work great.
HI, do you have a manual instructions of Mini?
Thanks
Awesome video!
Thanks Jacky!
Hey guys, hope all is well. Wondering what brand of tie rod you used for the upgrade. Need to replace mine, and always trust your judgement. Thanks!
I want to lower my rear and bought HiLo and KYB gasajust standard height. But the rear is still way to high.. should i have bought ‘lowered’ shocks for the rear?
Someone else already asked but can you post the part numbers and where we can shop for the parts south of the border (ie. USA). Also, anyone have a spare LHD steering rack for my '67? :-)
Phil
what is required to adjust ride of 69 countryman.
I have a lean to one side.
one side is 5/8 ' on drivers side and 1 1/4" on pass side?????
New rubber cones front and back.
Ideas????
Nicely explained. Can u pls tell that don't we need coil springs to absorb energy of the shocks faced by the vehicle ? U have uesd only damper in the case?
The rubber cones do the job that springs would normally do.
Another great video lads! It’s awesome having the explanations as I knew most of these mods were quite common but not the reason behind it!
With the subframe mods, what thickness steel did you use? I have some 4mm plate I’m guessing would be fine for this
Thanks! Can't quite remember but it roughly matched the original subframe metal thickness. It was lighter than 4mm but that should do the trick.
Another great video. I am currently running a very similar setup. Only major difference being shocks. Interested in what specs you will be running once all together, inclduing front/rear camber, toe and front caster. Also, ride height. I measure mine from the edge of the bottom seam line front and rear.
I am u r big fan from india....👏👏👏👍👍👍
Good Video. You should also add in a future episode of Dinky polyurethane suspension cones. amazing for racing and road handling.
We'd like to try those out for sure.
As you’re welding the subframe and pieces to the suspension, the flex is transferred to ??
Do you guys sell any of the parts listed in the video? You mentioned the aftermarket shock mounts but didn't mention what brand they were.
Hi, very good vid. Piece of advice regarding the pads thou. They seam to be stock Black Stuff EBCs. You want to swap them for Mintex M1144 compound.Stock ones like to fade just after 2nd or 3rd harder braking - small size of the discs means no place for heat to be dissapated quickly. Went thru couple of different sets of pads and with this brake setup Mintex are the only ones to behave consistently.
Thanks for the info on pads. Are you running them on a street car or track car? We need something that will work and not make noise on the street, those m1144’s are a pretty aggressive compound so I’m interested to hear.
I fitted them to 3 or 4 different cars now, all are road going, some do get a occasional track visit. Various different brake setups - Cooper S 7,5, aftermarket 7,9 vented disc and 4-pot calipers (Metro type pads), stock 8,4 setup and 8,4 Vented Metro Turbo setup. They work very good right from the start although they are stated as competition use only by MiniSpares. No need to take them up to temp. Noise wise I think only the 7,9 setup was squeeking at very light pedal pressures but then again I heard tone of stock pads squeeking. A bit of chamfer on leading edge might help in this situation. I suggest you take a car for a spin and do a couple of hard brakings say 100 to 0 (kph) back to back and get a good feel of the brakes and how they behave after each braking. If they don't feel right then I'd start with the pads as suggested. Did exactly that on 7,5 setup and changed the pads to EBC Green Stuff - they were a bit better but faded as well and then tried the M1144s and they were great. Also my friend has couple of Minis and he complained about braking on one of them (fiteed with EBC Green) especially comparing with his other car with Mintex pads we fitted. On the braking rollers (not sure how you call them in English) in the MOT station it turned out there is nothing wrong with the brakes. Braking force at around 2000-2200N on stock brakes is fine and I've seen it go up all the way to 2700N on the Mintex pads. Just my few cents of experience ;-) Cheers
Any chance you could link to the parts?
Can you make a video about coilovers for minis.
Really good video guys do you have a place we can get this parts from ie the cones and the bump stops?
We buy our parts from a variety of suppliers but the majority of the suspension setup, including the cones and bump stops come from Minispares.com
Dad found a copy of the Vizard book in a ditch near our house years ago. As I've now got the space and inclination to do my own work on my mini I've just started reading it and it's a revelation. There's no black art here.
I have never hear the Mini described as supple before! Why would you want more castor? Just asking - I assumed that would increase understeer. (I mainly come from a RWD Classis Lotus experience.)
What are your thoughts on Hydrolastic suspension front and back ?. Many years ago, I had a 1968, Morris Mini Cooper S
with 1275 engine, factory fitted Hydrolastic suspension.
Apparently they work great, but we don't have enough personal experience with them to comment.
Will you be doing any videos on hydrolastic systems? Although harder to source parts for, I think the ride is better in a hydro car. Awesome videos, keep up the good work.
Would love to, but we don't have many hydrolastic examples around here. Not many running ones, anyway.
Are this specs good for a 1988 mini moke.thank you
Where do we get those solid subframe mounting kits?
Fantastic video! Thank you for all of the info - really useful. Can I please ask you what thickness steel you use for the front subframe reinforcements/gussets? I’m in the UK and just about to start work on my subframes. Thanks.
Cheers. Looks like 1/8" steel.
Brilliant, thank you!
I have fit a 1275 sprite motor.I remember band sawing the rear main bearing cap flush and fitting mini rear face plate and 1275 mini crank. But it was alot cheaper way of getting a 1275 in the 80s.Never had any issues with rear main seal or rear main bearing cap.had that motor in my mini for ten years of enthusiastic road driving .Always shocked the jacked up, pick up trucks , that thought they were superior in hp and height.
One such country guy with his girl friend.rev up his motor in challenge nobody was about but we three
I performance launched and got five mini car lengths away, from the start, his gf was laughing at her bf defeat, and was punching him in his arm.
I smiled resuming , road manners....a good 1275 does bring smiles. I followed Vizards conservative mods good single intake manifold big single carb , k&n filter.
Very light head detail and exhaust header, a very mild cam regrind.
And the best 10" tires at the time.
Can you please put the part numbers and suppliers in the description? Great vid! Thank you
This.
And I'm still here sitting on hydrolastic, great vid.
Shaun Zell Haha! Thanks
What are your thoughts on air ride?
Great vid,like a public information film,welding looks a bit,,,iffy mind.
Well, I've done all the things you listed, except the subframe mounts/gusset welded in. I'm assuming it's not very easy to do with the subframe in the car?
It’s easy with the subframe out but would be a bit tricky with it in the car. Although the gussets that run to the tie bar tabs could be done with it still in and would be a worth while upgrade
Hi Guys! Cool channel and videos! Can you please upload a parts list? or give up some partnumbers for this build? I'm new to the mini world, and I think my SPI 1995 mini could use a similar suspension setup as yours! Also, where do you buy parts from, minispares.com or? Really hoping that you can give me a hint on the parts! Martin, Denmark :-)
very nice, any suggestions if this set up would be good if a Honda V - tec engine is put into the mini?
With engine weight being a roughly the same or a little lighter with the vtec, yes. But some vtec swaps will have a subframe that converts the front to a different suspension setup, so it depends on what subframe will carry the drivetrain.
Thanks for the video . Has anybody ever fitted anti roll bars to a mini
Yes, KAD makes nice versions. Many folks run rear anti-roll bar only and some run both front and rear. We like them.
Another question: Regarding the brake conversion to 7.5" discs. What diameter master cyl did you get from Tilton? In my case I am going drum to 7.5" disc so most likely will need a different master and am considering your recommendation bore diameter.
While on the subject of brakes, when you do a front drum to disc conversion does the kit push the front wheels out? I heard from some user video that they needed to purchase a spacer or a brake drum with the built in boss/spacer? I was considering a pair of Superfin's from Mini Spares. Let me hear what you think. - Mike
We are using a Tilton 75 series master cylinder in a .75” bore to move an ideal amount of fluid. We are also running .50” rear wheel cylinders. We found that this is our preferred rear cylinder bore size, because larger sizes gave a bit too much bias towards the rear, and it would lock up when hard on the brakes.
As for the conversion, yes the Cooper S disc brakes will have wider track than the drums, so the wheels will be pushed out. For the rear track to match it's recommended to buy the drums with built in spacer. The Superfins look nice!
@@Stevestonmotorco Thank you for the recommendation regarding brakes. BTW, I got the same advise on the rear drums/track width from MiniSpares. They also recommend getting longer wheel studs to accommodate the extra thickness of the SuperFin brake drums. Motor on!
Where do you normally get your parts from? My dad and I are getting his MK1 back on the road and we like your suggestions.
Mini Mania, Mini Spares, and Mini Sport
Thanks for the nice video. May I ask where to buy that shock mount at 05:20 ? Cheers
I believe it can be found from any of the big mini parts suppliers
Hi.. the suspension setup that you explain in this video will it also improve the factory sportspack wheel setup?
It depends on what you're looking for. This setup is what we prefer. The most important is that everything is working properly!
Where you buy this kits you talk? Thanks
Since I didn't see it in any of Q/A, I'll ask...what are your views on the coil spring setup over the rubber springs?
They can be good for straight-line comfort when paired with GOOD shocks, but generally poor at everything else.
@@Stevestonmotorco how about for comfort and just for daily driver?
Hope you'll be selling full suspension kit like your setup and can be shipped anywhere, like me I'm from the Philippines. All your videos are awesome, by the way.
are there opportunities in offering some of these parts on your website?
Those new upper shock mounts, who makes and supplies them please and the same for the rear bracket for the swing arms?
All of the big suppliers offer them
What are the alignment settings you like to use with this setup?
Fine video Phil ....... hope you'll be selling a kit of parts. gpm
Hey Mini Guru: I have a 1975 Mk3 RHD from New Zealand, here in California. Just powder coated and beefed up both sub-frames, put in a nasty 1380, and 5 speed. Took out the rubber cones, and went to the red springs from 7ENT with High/Lows. BUT..... once they are installed, and I try to back the nut off and lower the high/lows & springs down for the normal ride height..... the springs and trumpets flop around badly / wildly in the tower..... and if I go over a bump, the springs may not land back in place..... but land cocked off to the side in the tower. This could damage the tower, the tower centering lip, or change the ride. It seems like the tower should have a stiff foam insert, with a slippery cylinder like sleeve that will keep the spring firmly in place..... under pressure, or not. Thoughts? Thanks Doug in Sacramento
This is expected with a very low ride height. Helper springs would be one solution (or foam, as you described) but would probably be expensive and costly. They might also have trouble working because suspension travel is so short. The ultimate solution most race cars use is a shorter extended shock length, so that the shock is still holding the spring assembly in place when fully extended. Custom shocks can be built to spec.
can you give links for the Tilton break cylinders also what bore size
Eduard I Prokhor we are using Tilton 75 series master cylinders in a 0.75” bore. They do require a bit of custom work to fit though, so if you are looking for bolt on it’s best to look for something else.
its the second time that when i am blowing my head on parts you help the right time xaxaxaxa. :D nice tutorial thanks for the info. didn't know anything about the red spot cones or the bushings in the front. keep up the good work. check my instagram i also have a v8 that came in life today
where can i buy this
and weld extra plates to the floor where the rear of the front subframe bolts to
Sounds like a good idea. To clarify, do you mean adding the reinforcement on the inside of the car?
Would be cool to know the full cost of the mods.
Don't the solid subframe mounts transfer a lot of vibration to the car?
A little more vibration is transferred but it doesn't become an uncomfortable racecar. All early minis were solid mounted from factory.
i have a mg metro engine with a gt15 turbo 69 mk2 mini all stock with ford front weel disk brakes other than that it´s all stock, basically it´s a death trap but very fun to drive xD
MultiDopper that’s awesome, my personal car has an MG metro engine and fiesta brakes as well!
exacly! glad that i`m not the only one scavenging for parts xD
Great video! Do you prefer the Red Dot cone over spring?
Thanks Jerry! Yes we love the red dot cones. The rubber cone is really the best option for a mini suspension. The aftermarket spring kits are a linear spring rate design, and the mini has insufficient suspension travel to make this work properly, so the spring ends up being too soft and bottoming. With something like the red dot cone you get a comfortable ride but still retain the amazing mini handling.
Great explanation! very interesting! Are you referring to the three types of springs which exist ? or is it for the soft springs only? I went for the middle type (not the racing or the very soft ones) and after reading your comment and forums... it seems that I have made the wrong decision... thought the springs will help for the rough roads we have in Malta.
that's the read I've been getting thanks for the response
Usually the spring conversion will be used to make a more comfortable ride, however the mini was designed to run with a progressive spring as it has very little travel and needs the ramping rate to avoid bottoming. My suggestion with the spring conversion is to make sure that you have bump stops in place and that you are not having coil bind on the spring at full compression. Anti roll bars are also recommended if you are doing a coil spring conversion.
Hi Steve, what´s your take on the Smootha Ride cones by MiniSport ? what is the different between this and the Red Dot cones, are there big advantage choosing one over the other ? which one you would put on your own car and why ? I am looking for the best confort and handling money can buy.
Thanks so much for your great vids, you are of big inspiration, I wish to have friends like you around to be able to hang out. Hi from Finland.@@Stevestonmotorco
Wow
Help My mini is sitting on the tires . The suspension bags have holes and the car dropped down big time.
It probably needs new cones