Knife Sharpening - Suehiro Stones - 320, 700, 1k/6k
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- čas přidán 11. 01. 2017
- Overview video after using these stones -
• Suehiro Chemical/Cerax...
Ganzo Knife
440c steel
Pressure varied, but when actually sharpening between 1-3 pounds
Stones used
Suehiro Chemical - 320 Grit
Suehiro Cerax - 700 Grit
Suehiro Cerax Combo - 1000 Grit / 6000 Grit
Sharpening Chapters -
320 grit - 13:14
700 grit - 28:40
1000 grit - 38:35
6000 grit - 44:01
Stropping - 52:15
With the exception of the 320 grit Chemical stone, which I purchased locally in store, these were bought from Chef Knives to Go. If you are interested, I would point you to that web page for ordering.
All 4 stones had a layer across the top of the sharpening surfaces. I demonstrated this in the video, and was able to remove it with the provided cleaning stone. If this layer is not removed, the knife 'slips' across the stone, with very little abrasion.
The 320 Chemical stone is incredibly soft. For use on large bevels, I think it will perform nicely. However, if using it on a standard 'V' edge, it is easily gouged, and leaves indents in the surface. The stone can develop a very thick mud, if you do not constantly flush it with water. This mud can really help remove deeper scratches from coarser grit abrasives. There is plenty of feedback, and it cuts at a rate, exactly as you would expect, of this grit.
The Suehiro Cerax 700 on the other hand, was fairly hard. Much harder in comparison to the 320. It did gouge, but took some pressure to make it do so. It too, was a muddy stone, if you allowed it to be. The feel, feedback, and hardness were a perfect combination for my own personal preferences. This is my favorite of the 4. Edge performance was nice and crisp, and did not feel toothy like I expected. I will need to use it some more to really get some opinions on performance. It did have signs of dishing after the entire sharpening process was concluded, which is a bit disappointing. Time will tell if it was just from my heavy use in this session, or if that is normal.
Combo stones are nice for testing multiple grits, without having to commit to a full purchase. Though I am not a big fan of them, I appreciate the fact they are available. This one offers 2 grits that are perfect for maintaining sharpness. I must admit I was not happy that the 6k leaves a hazy, muddy, finish. I prefer my higher grit stones, to polish to a bright finish. It is understandable for Japanese knives, that have layers of cladding, and need contrast, to make them visible. In that regard, these stones will perform admirably. Unfortunately, I do not own, nor use, these types of knives. So this combo stone, is not quite what I am looking for. I can now use them for such tasks, should the need ever come along. Both stones (1k,6k) were on the softer side, though nothing like the 320. I guess they would fall into a medium hardness range, if there is such a thing. Like the others, they develop a thick mud, if you allow them to. The 6k had a very creamy feel to it. I think the mud cushioning between the knife and the stone, caused this sensation. Either way, it was a nice experience. Once done, the finish was able to be stropped to a bright luster, though it was not what I would call, a mirror polish. It produced a standard 6k edge, which for almost any knife, is quite respectable. I will have to use this one some more as well, to form further opinions. I did not notice any wear along either stone, and they seem to have held their shape well.
I created this video with the CZcams Video Editor ( / editor )
Jef, what would suggest for a a more aggressive low grit stone? I’m currently working with a large cerax 320 that doesn’t want to cut stainless very well that’s SO damn soft and a naniwa chosera 400 that seems to cut faster; as well as a 140 atoma that leaves very deep scratches. I’m looking for something harder and aggressive to repair and reset bevels and be a segue to remove scratches from my atoma 140. I’m curious about the shapton glass 320 but there’s mixed reviews. I’m really pissed about the cerax. I got through the skin and it just melts when I work harder stainless on it. What would you suggest?
I've never had experience with the Shapton 320. The 220, I can attest, will shed grit readily. That, unfortunately, is going to be something common, among low grit stones. The key is to find one that is fast enough, to do the work you need, without shedding so much, that it dishes on you.
The Shapton Pro 120 is bar none, my go to low grit stone. It is hard, aggressive, and slow wearing. Slow in relation to other low grit stones, that is. The Norton Crystolon is another. The 220 Pride Abrasives is right there with them, in terms of speed vs grit friability. The Shapton 220 is nice, but I found it sheds grit faster, than the 3 mentioned above. If you can tolerate a little less aggression, the Imanishi Latte 400, Beston/Bester (i always forget which) 500, and of course the Naniwa 400, are very hard, slow wearing, and fast for their grit rating.
The Shapton Pro 320 is nice, but it develops a slurry very quickly. The odd thing is, in my experience, is that it doesn't dish quick. Although muddy and friable, it holds shape very well. So If you can deal with the slurry, it is another I like to use.
In terms of raw speed, nothing is going to beat the Norton Crystolon. It cuts like a demon. I don't always like dealing with the oil, so I tend to favor the Shapton Pro 120 instead. The Gritomatic 240 Sic stones are also fantastic, but I haven't seen them in stock in so long, I am not sure they are still producing them....
I'm pretty sure the first one the 320 grit is more of a budget stone for Suehiro. Whereas the 700 grit Cerax is one of their top of the line if I'm not mistaken
The 320 has grown on me..I quite enjoy it now. 700 still my fav :)
Hi Jef, wondering what was it you did at min 3:40 when you stroke the blade against the handheld stone ? What was this stone and what’s the purpose of this? Thanks.
Not sure which stone that was. Looked like a silicone carbide Norton. This is a pretty old video 🙂
I did it just too dull the edge. So i was starting with a really dull knife to store the sharpness after i completed
@@Jef thank you Jef for your response. Cheers
Old ways making one bevel to the edge. The add you're own second bevel to your liking. Reprofiling is hard with a soft stone and man you have to use what you have.
Jef-- I generally avoid trying to set an edge bevel all the way to the apex with a really soft, low-grit stone, for the reasons you are experiencing. I use a King 220 (because they're cheap) for thinning, but at the point where I'm addressing the apex I will switch to something harder like the Naniwa 400. Using the soft stone for the apex simply defeats the purpose, at least for me, usually resulting in rounding off the edge. Forrest
This was 2 years ago, I don't recall what sort of issues I was experiencing. When I first got the Suehiro chemical 320, I hated that stone. It is actually one of my go to coarse grits now. Funny how opinions change.
Now a days, I rarely have problems apexing on coarse stones, be they soft or hard. I used to try minimizing the burr when getting close the apex, and swapping over to a finer stone, just before it happens. Now a days, I just blaze right through it, cut the burr off, and keep it moving. It can be a bit wasteful, but given that most edges come from factory with some burning issues, I don't see the steel lose as a bad thing. Once I have gotten a few sharpening on it, that is when I get ultra conservative, about steel conservation
@@Jef How do you like the Cerax 1000 now after two years? I've been considering purchasing one. I generally use the King 1000 for a medium grit, since Murray Carter has been my principal sharpening mentor. But the King 1000 is a rather soft stone, and I sometimes like a harder stone, especially when I come off the grinder having finished a new knife build. Like Carter, I will use an edge trailing, stropping stroke to finish off the apex with each progressive stone. And usually I'll just use two -- the King 1000 & 6000; however, I sometimes will use the Naniwa 800 & Suehiro 3000. Either way, the results come out about the same after stropping.
If you think the King 1k is soft, the 1k Suehiro is gonna feel like playdough. Lol. It is a medium hard stone. I would classify the King 1k as a hard stone, albeit in the bottom tier of hardness. Still, it is more so than the Suehiro. That is the King KDS 1k. They have so many versions I can't keep up with em all.
I do like the 1k Suehiro, but if you want a harder stone, look to Shapton. The Shapton Pro 1k is just excellent all around goodness. The 1k glass too, although I think the glass stones are a bit soulless. They do a fine job, don't get me wrong, but they are just bland to me. If you can get your hands on a Nubatama Ume 1k hard or extra hard, those are about as good a stone as I have ever used. It is my all time favorite stone (the xhard version)
Do you think the 1k cut well enough to let you jump straight to it from the 320?
Absolutely. You may need to spend just A few extra minutes but it is quite capable of removing the 320 scratches
Is this Cerax 1k/6k a splash and go stone?
no it needs to soak
Where does one get a basin like that?
I got mine from a local restaurant supply store. Was roughly $20. You can get em that way, or check Amazon. They sell em too. Just gotta find the right dimensions your after. That was why I got mine locally. I was able to
Look at different sizes before purchase.
How do you like the Ganzo HT
It is a little soft, but makes sharpening a breeze. Edge holding isn't the best, but I tend to use my knives really hard, so they dull out from abuse, more than wear.
What holder is that?
The holder is just a universal stone holder from chef knives to go $29. The bridge is a Suehiro sink bridge I got from japanese knife imports. It was around $40 i think
Too many high angle passes ruining the sharpness. Just one gentle leading stroke with barely increased angle should be enough to remove the tiny burr on such fine stone.
Yea was just trying something new. Never got good at the high angle passes. I usually do too many or not enough. I can never find the balance
Other than that your technique is great. You actually did great with the 1k stone.
Thank you. I appreciate the kind words.