Why can’t we just be good people? Not pass judgment on others (like it says in the Bible). Help those in need. Be more understanding of others views............shoot, that’s how it was suppose to be!
Prayer is the solution to this. We all have free will to do what we want. Murder is never right. Every wrong we do on earth has consequences. The first and only religion to last over 2000 years is the Catholic religion. These so called "pastors" get the bible, misinterpret scripture and preach what they please. Do let these other religions mislead you.
I had never thought about abortion or what it really meant until I had been raped when I was in college. I was on birth control, but my period was late. I had no idea what to do. It was actually a Christian group leader who took me to a local planned parenthood, and she was a great support during that time. I remember doing the pregnancy test and the rep sat down and asked me, just in case it came out positive, what would I want to do. My world stopped. I was a freshman in college, only 18. I wasn’t, and still don’t feel 5 years on, mature enough to have a baby. I couldn’t afford a baby. I didn’t ask for a baby. I had no control in that moment, and it was one of the scariest things I have ever been through. Thank god I wasn’t pregnant. But it really opened my eyes to a new perspective. I started doing research and began advocating for choice. Because I had no choice when that person took advantage of me, I want to make sure others can have a choice if they are in my shoes. If they’re in that room. It’s important. EDIT: Adding this because I DID see that deleted comment about how my rape must have been consensual because “alcohol must have been involved” since I was in college. 1. How dare you make assumptions about me or any other survivor and fill in holes in my story just to fit a stupid narrative (which is very wrong btw) 2. That is not how consent works and the fact that that is still not common sense actually disgusts me. If there is no, especially verbal, consent, it is RAPE. 3. You’re a piece of shit
@Vivien Bissell Adoption: sure, but the adoption system is know to be fucking awful, and I couldn't do that to my child. Protection - I was raped. Responsibility - I. was. raped. Financial Help - for me, yes I probably would've had the help, but not everyone is that lucky. Not to mention, like mentioned in the video, sometimes it's not enough to properly raise a child. I hope you never have to be where I was to see my side of this argument.
Vivien Bissell I wasn’t pregnant, but okay. And I actually probably would’ve kept it if I had been. I was in a position where I had resources, but not everyone is me. My whole comment was about how I get it, and can totally understand choosing to have an abortion. I’ve heard more than enough stories and know people who are social workers, and I stand behind my point that the foster care system needs serious reforms and I would be hesitant to ever put a child through that. I’d personally go a private route but that can be costly and doesn’t have any standard safeguards. Because after doing research, I don’t consider it killing. Fetuses aren’t what we consider “alive” until about week 32, since they’re not even aware consciously until that point due to the brains developing fully at that point. Until then, they’re basically another organ. Majority of abortions are done in the first trimester, late ones realistically only occurring when it’s deemed too dangerous and both baby and mother will die. It cannot feel any kind of pain because it’s not developed into anything just yet. Hope that clarifies
People only give a shit about the fetus until it is born. So much talk and so much pressure for that baby to be born, but no one worries about how that baby is gonna live after birth.
CAN YOU SAY THIS LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK PLEASE!!! But no like seriously this is so true,it’s obvious that if someone doesn’t want to have a child,than they probably shouldn’t have one ,not everyone can be a parent.And nothings worse than not being wanted by your parents
*Truth I say this all the time especially sad how these same people don’t support social services that help low income people with food stamps and welfare yet tell same people not to have abortions like seriously they bitch either way without actually trying to help because it doesn’t in the end effect them so they actually don’t care*
Yes, and if you get married, you dishonestly tricked a man. If you don't get married, you are a single mother who contributes to social breakdown. And if you don't have kids at all? Then you are a selfish cold old cat lady. It is set up so we can never win.
@@user-hb3qv1eh5e do they give enough money for you to raise child until its 18 years old? No i dont think so those mothers dont have enough money to raise the child, the foster care system is pretty terrible too. How i see it abortion is not a bad thing, in this world where it's so expensive to live especially with kids abortion is a way of saving the child too
I have heard “ Stop having adult fun time ” over and over. First of all, I have never heard that directed at a man. Men have just as much of a responsibility to use protection as woman. It also goes with the fact that woman are considered property of their husband and the expectation for woman to remain pure and not have much control of their adult fun time life. Second of all, If you haven’t realized, Many people enjoy adult fun time. It isn’t just something people do to have kids. Plus, most encounters don’t result in children.
I get what you are saying, but I would suggest that since women are the ones who actually get pregnant, they may need to take extra steps in terms of preventing an accidental pregnancy. They can discuss birth control options with their partner(s), and encourage men to use condoms when needed.
Responsibility people. With the exception of Rape, every woman AND participating man is Responsible for their actions. And in the times that birth control (condoms, pills, shots, patches, etc.) Fail, be a man , be a woman and step up to the results. Have the child and do your best to raise the child regardless of how hard it will be. You choose to play the game, noone obligated you to play. America and some other countries are giving out too many get out Responsibility free cards. Yes, we should all support, in multiple ways, young pregnant woman or women with dirtbag boyfriends/husbands that are just about useless. At the same time council women on the fact that sex can lead to another unwanted pregnancy. Saying it's OK and we will be here in 12 months if you want another abortion is not good for anyone. Does the AA organization tell the member that it's OK and continue on the same path of Irresponsibility. I think not. Responsibility is on all of our shoulders.....men AND women. God bless all souls that hope for life.
I was fifteen when I was raped and got pregnant, having to carry the baby to almost second term before I had my abortion. It was a necessary life saver, I honestly would’ve killed myself if I had a baby. Now I just can’t imagine the women who are denied it..
I’m pro life but I approve of your decision, as it is morally the right decision. You were at risk of death, and the baby was the threat, so you might have doubts of your decision, but you made the right choice. I hope your path to healing continues
Comedic Psychologist thank you for supporting other people’s deduction. people are allowed to be ‘pro life’ but it shouldn’t affect law and other people who don’t have the same beliefs. it’s a personal choice that should only affect you
The basic arguments of pro-lifer is religion but in a nation where we have freedom of religion does your religion have the right to infringe on my decision? What if someone is an atheist? Why does your belief have to take over my choices?
@milldog65 Google American holocaust. That was religion based genocide by the Spanish, British and French. Whome are, mostly, catholic. Religion kills, divide people and poison the mind through fear.
I just think that people are entitled to their own belief but it shouldn’t be applied to everyone else let me believe what I want and you believe what you want
Put all the money supporting abortion into LIFE centers and associations, that’ll take care for single moms and every woman in a vulnerable situation. Why investing so much in death (?
@@dulcejocelyn7102 Great reply Dulce. it doesn't happen because the people that push the murdering of babies in the womb are inspired by Satan's death mandate to kill, steal and destroy.
@Pinecone Person Having been at the forefront of the issue for 40 years and done copious amounts of study into it, I do think I know what I am talking about. It may be a tough decision for some but for the majority it is a decision of convenience. How do I know? Reseasrch, research and research.
@Pinecone Person Yes, and I will give them to you when all the others who are pro-death give the source of their information. As yet none of them have.
Zap Brannigan you people can’t let anything be about just women for once, can you? when women are focused on, you have to say something about men. ridiculous.
@Zap Brannigan women can't get pregnant on their own so if men don't want to be just a paycheck, maybe those same men shouldn't bail on the organism that they had a 50% part in making...
Why is the idea of separation of church and state thrown out the window when we talk about this. If your belief is that life begins at conception because the bible told you so that's fine. That belief cannot be turned into a law. Sometimes Americans sounds like the '3rd world' countries they despise.
AfroQueen The Bible says that theft is wrong too. Should we stop banning that because of “separation of church and state?” If someone believes life begins at conception, then killing a fetus is killing a person, which is murder. They don’t want to ban abortion because the Bible told them to. They want to ban abortion because they see it as murder and they are anti-murder. Surely anti-murder is a valid secular stance.
In my opinion, there is a difference between "Pro-life" and "Pro-baby". Most of the "Pro-Lifers" are actually just "Pro-Baby", which means they feel as though a woman should give birth no matter the circumstances surrounding it. How can one say they are "Pro-Life" when they don't care about the baby's wellbeing after it is born? For example, you don't see many "Pro-Lifers" promoting the welfare of juveniles, single mothers, the homeless, widows, and orphans. So basically when a person says they are 'Pro-Life' they really just mean 'Pro-Baby'! I think people should care about the welfare of people throughout their ENTIRE lives, not just at birth! If you are going to insist that a woman keep her child as a moral thing, then just make sure that you help her raise that child as that is also the moral thing to do! Don't be a hypocrite, you can't push morality about some things and be hypocritical about others! And yes, I am a Christian: edifythebody.org/curriculums/
Except that there simply is no biblical justification for this nonsense. So the "pro-life" crowd is just making shit up and flailing around to use whatever they can to attempt to justify their fanatical and irrational stance.
@@elijahculper5522 Your attempt at making a point is irrational. There is a difference between theft (which is against secular law with a secular basis in secular property rights) and moral prohibitions against individual behaviour (adultery, honouring the Sabbath, not taking the Lord's name in vain) the basis for which are scriptural.
I’m pro choice because while I’d never get an abortion no matter what, I want those who decide that it’s the best choice for them to be able to be safe and at least a little more okay. Because it’s their body and they should decide what’s best for them and have whatever they need.
Abortion is never the best choice for the reason that a baby is murdered when it has done no wrong and the mother can suffer for years after the abortion with regret and depression.
Having a baby killed is NOT its their body. it is the body of another life in the womb, so where do people get the idea of killing it will solve their problem? We are worse than animals as they don't kill their babies in the womb.
@Gaming with Giss I have got a better idea. if she doesn't want that don't get pregnant. We managed that for years so why can't today's women do the same?
I don't get how people care way more about a fetus whose brain isn't even developed yet than for a young woman/girl that has a whole future in front of them
As someone who aged out of the foster care system I can tell you 100’s of horror stores. Kids viscously abused. Told daily that they weren’t wanted ... they’re the worst mistake... brutal abuse that you can’t even imagine. A child is born in to a home where they aren’t wanted then your ripped from that hell and thrown in to a different hell. Then you turn 18 and your put out. If your lucky maybe you’ll find a shelter to take you. Then I’ve seen these same kids come to foster pregnant 11,12,13 abused broken kids.. and you expect them to have babies? No one could protect them but you expect them to trust in god? GTFOOH I’ve watched those “pregnancy centers” step in and help drug addicts stay pregnant till they deliver a premature drug addicted baby.. then disappear. Or turn around and criticize the young mother using WIC at the store. You can’t have it both ways! It’s never the pro-life holy rolling Christians that foster. (I’ll let ya in on a little secret If that’s what they claimed to be )their homes are usually the worst! It won’t take long till he’s at your door at night.. and he’s not here to help you say your prayers. Instead of trying to save a clump of cells maybe we should focus on helping the living breathing kids that need us now. The young mothers that need our support.
YES!!!!! Thank you for this, my brother is from the system himself and luckily he wasn’t abused as much as the rest of them. They picked favorites and he luckily was one of them. But other kids were abused, raped, and got punishments like being locked in a closet, being forced to eat food, given medicine overdoses, and shagging in front of the other kids. It was really sad and I hope they’ve been exposed. Thank god he ended up with us when he did because so many of the foster families were in it for the money
@supalonely one example of someone who got out of that childhood. While there are thousands of stories that dont end up fine. And you are only looking at the child. Focus on the mother, why should she be forced to give up her health, her energy, her mental stability, her job for a clump of cells that wont know what its going to miss
@ricky roach Do you think that those people who abort their child would even try to give them a good childhood? They'll just be abandoned, and would wander between foster homes. Most of them if not all would have a life of hell. Besides, people like rape victims...do you think that they wish to conceive their rapist's child?
@@UnripeApple2003 Okay I'm a Feminist but I'm also adopted. Your comment is bringing me close to tears. Look. I'm a Democrat. 70 years ago, my party ENCOURAGED women in the lower class and women of color to abort they're babies, because they would be a burden to society. Now it's considered Feminism. As a Woman, as an adoptee, as a Feminist I am insulted. I agree, we seriously need to improve conditions for the lower class and provide basic human rights for people of color. But aborting a whole generation because of they're class or race is not a solution. They can rise from the ashes and make it to the top no matter what background. I'm disgusted.
@@schnitzelberry I can understand you, people in my country used to abort female child because they thought that they were a burden, and that is why I believe while abortion should be legal, there should still be certain systems to check that people don't misuse it and know that aborting a fetus is no laughing matter, they shouldn't become careless.
@@UnripeApple2003 Actually I can somewhat agree with that. I am Pro Life but I believe that if it threatens the life/health of the mother, it should be her fundamental choice. I also believe that if she was a victim of rape/incest it should also be her choice. And she should be allowed to be provided information of what she's about to do, without healthcare providers pressuring her into such a decision. I'm happy you understand my point of view ✌
@@schnitzelberry I think abortion should also be legal in the case of accidental pregnancies (failed condom, etc. ) and shitty people who would be the type to abuse their kids. Because at the end of the day, it is easy for an abusive parent to abondon and ignore their child, even if they go to prison, the trauma that the child received can never be undone. Why do that? Both the parents must be ready and understand the consequences and seriousness of having a child, if they can't then it would be better for them to abort it.
I was raped, had my first positive pregnancy test, & decided to keep child. I was nearly homeless at the time. I miscarried. I had chosen a name for the child, was prepping everything myself. I found out I would have to go out of country to have my child bc in my state, a rapist can sue & has won full custody. I was prepping to buy a flight to get out, bc that would give my child citizenship w/another country & prevent the rapist from being able to to sue for custody domestically. I was getting therapy 3x a wk to cope w/the rape, but suddenly being told afterwards first “you’re pregnant” & then “you’re not pregnant” was worse. It was a ray of light to me to be as Marcus Aurelius said, “the best revenge is to be unlike him who caused the injury.” Frankly, having been through the experience, the painful thing is to have a person tell me that the worst thing that could have happened to any child of mine is to have been born to me as a mother. I can tell you the politics of the people who have repeatedly told me that with 95% accuracy. They are all pro-abortion. I survived attempted murder by my rapist. He tried to strangle me to death & while he left handprints on my neck, & though I lost consciousness, he failed to kill me. To feel the heartbeat of another person & to claim that it is best to allow them to die, for me is simply condemning a child for the crimes of the father. I cannot do that.
I will never understand how someone can be pro-life and support the death penalty. That's just pro-birth and anti-science. I identify as pro-life, valuing all life from conception until natural death, and all stages in between. But I also recognize that I can not judge a woman for the choice she made to have an abortion. I fall left on the political scale, as the right usually does value all life. I will fight to protect all life. That is what being pro-life really is.
" They allowed us to hear his heartbeat until it was no more. " I got goosebumps , I can't even imagine how sad and miserable she must have felt as a mother . May his son rest in peace.
@milldog65 its not murder to hit pause on a bundle of cells. plus what if health is at stake? both my grandmother and mother had to terminate their last pregnancies because it would've ended with them sick in hospital for the whole pregnancy and/or both them and their babies dead anyway. My grandmothers womb failed, they never found out what was wrong with my mother except that she was gravely ill. despite the fact their pregnancies would most likely have killed them or disabled them for life, people like you harassed them and told them the baby's life was more important than theirs, even though the babies were likely to die. sickos like you just want people to carry a baby for as long as they can til their body gives out. if YOU'RE so interested in other people's offspring you're gonna need to get your shit in order and make a lot of money to support all those kids. No? not your problem? not possible? then shut the fuck up and stop acting like anyone else is going to do it. abortion is a right and a necessity.
Niyah W no one is forcing anything the parents had a choice to create the baby and then give birth to that baby, if you can’t raise the child properly give it to a foster home or an adoption Centre
When I hear that a woman could receive the death penalty for an abortion, that made me mad as hell. Why just the women? She didn’t have an immaculate conception. There was a man that got her pregnant. We all know if you have heterosexual unprotected sex, there is a chance a pregnancy may be the result. Where is his death penalty warning? Where is his death sentence for not protecting himself? And if a pregnancy is a result of a rape or some sexual assault, there should be no judgement and she should be allowed to abort the clump off cells if she wants. When it comes to a woman’s body, it’s just that... her body. No man or woman has any right to tell a woman what she can or can not do with her body. Period. If you are pro life, great. Don’t have an abortion. As a vegetarian, I feel eating or wearing animals and animal byproducts is murder. So I am forcing ‘you’ to not eat and wear animals anymore. They also have lives, feelings and can sense pain and loss. Yet you can justify that for survival. Vegetarians and vegans are proof you don’t need to murder animals for survival.
Our society holds human life to a higher regard than animal life. Would you rather save a drowning baby or a drowning puppy? I would save the baby, no questions asked.
"They allowed us to hear his heatbeat until it was no more" I absolutely have no words how sick in my stomach I felt. People are always selfish of whatever they believe or feel because they have never experienced something tragic or difficult in their lives.
And the most selfish are those who support abortion because they don't care a baby is going to be murdered who did not ask to be born and has done no wrong. We are worse than animals because they don't abort their babies.
@@sonalipatel8832 I raise that point when homosexuals claim there are 1500 species that are homosexual and ask them if they are going to eat their young because animals do. So far no takers.
@@s-truth The point they’re trying to make is that it’s just in their nature, not that they’re copying other species. As humans we’re technically part of the animal kingdom, there isn’t really a physical separation between ourselves and what we consider to be animals. The difference is just that we’re also more aware of ourselves as a species. I honestly don’t understand why people like yourself have such an issue with homosexuality, it really doesn’t affect you at all
@@elj955 i usually am not so hostile but only answer i can give you is that he's miserable as fuck and wants to project negativity onto others. if they got the energy to spout bs unprovoked, they're not as well-adjusted as they think they are.
gold3nstar girl you ain’t adopting none of these kids🤣especially if they are over the age of ten. Y’all barely go in those adoption centers enough as it is
My biggest problem with the situation is what about women who were raped and got pregnant or children that were molested or raped and got pregnant!!!!!!! What about a woman who accidentally got pregnant meaning the birth control she use did not work or what about when the pregnancy can be dangerous to mother and child. We all know that protection is not 100% proof. HER BODY HER CHOICE! In my opinion I feel like there is a bigger agenda behind this, ijs💅🏽
@Elisa Castro They are humans, the mothers just believe that their life would be really bad. Maybe she's too young, maybe she is suffering because of the abuse she passed, maybe she is in a bad financial position, maybe she has a genetic sickness she doesn't want to pass on. There are various reasons, but this is mostly for the babies and mothers to have a better chance
every day at least one person DIES giving birth. and many more pass away due to pregnancy complications. Carrying, delivering, and raising a child is a hard thing. The cost of childcare, $272,049 is the average amount spent on raising a child to age 18 this not to mention the mental and physical strength this takes.
Every day someone does after being assaulted. By your "logic" we should be able to take a gun and shoot anyone else walking down the street because someone MIGHT turn around and attack us at some point.
As a former passionate pro-lifer who stood in picket lines, my dedication was converted when I discovered that most states with stricter abortion laws actually have higher abortion rates. Abortions have been steadily declining in America, with less than 600,000 in 2017, the lowest since 1973 and significantly lower than most years in the 1960s when abortions were still illegal. What convinced me in the end was the Netherlands which has one of the loosest approaches to abortions, even allowing them to teens without parental consent, and yet they have one of the lowest rates in the world (far lower than the US). They choose to start a healthy regimen of sex education by age five and allow easy and affordable access to birth control. They also have much better support systems for low income families. These are the true defeaters of abortions. Banning it simply drives it underground, where in 1969 an estimate 1.5 million abortions took place illegally in the US with approximately 5,000 maternal fatalities according to the Washington Post. Women have been drinking bitter herbs to end pregnancies since Leviticus. You cannot stop it by banning it, you can only prevent it by education, accessible alternatives and resources which make it less needed.
What do rates have to do with anything? I find your claim that you used to be pro-life pretty sus. Abortion kills an unborn baby, if you were pro-life you would know this, so I don't see how abortion rates in the US declining would translate into you no longer wanting people to not murder their offspring.
@@michaelmannucci8585 it's a more sustainable solution than outrightly banning abortion which further excercabates the problem you are trying to solve. Basically, by trying to make it less of a crime to have abortion. People will have less of a need to abort an unwanted child.
@ImOnIt4272 Yes I agree, but conservative policies criminalize abortions. People choose to not abort based on moral values. But not everyone shares those moral values.
I'm Dutch. I think all laws should be thought of like this. Making abortion, birth control, sex education more accessible and having a good support system will lower the amount abortions, unwanted pregnancies and unwanted children. But the same for punishments of crimes. If you look at the crime numbers in Sweden and the amount of criminals that repeatedly commit crimes after punishments, it's lower then any other countries. We should punish shorter, educate people in prison and let them keep their humanity. The death sentence should not exist anymore in this day and age. Healthcare is cheaper in countries were it's accessible and free for all. Economies are more successful when there is less of a division between rich and poor. Don't base your policies and laws on faith, culture, emotion, but look at science, other cultures and see what laws and policies are most efficient for your country as a whole. Everyone is happier when everyone has enough. Economies work better when everyone has enough. Prison systems work better if they are aimed at preparing inmates at a successful return to society.
@@michaelmannucci8585 I marched in Teens for Life. Attended rallies, stood in picket lines. I'm also a mother, and a woman who chooses to research. ... 1) You only believe it's a baby if you are Catholic or if your Protestant views were altered in the 1970s when Protestants aligned with Catholics to get more clout in their desire to reimpose Segregation. 2) Abortion was the Catholic stance and Evangelical leaders adopted it for more political clout in their pursuit of legalized Segregation. In 1974, the Dallas Theological Seminary even released a treatise stating that Christians follow the Jewish viewpoint of life beginning at birth, not conception. The view only changed in 1977 as Segregation was attempted for the final time, struck down by SCOTUS in 1978. Evangelicals kept the Pro-Life stance after that. 3) So if you aren't Catholic, your simplistic idea that abortion murders a baby, stems from religious leaders using this concept for political clout to push Segregation laws back onto the books. 4) A woman carries a Zygote, later a Fetus. It relies on her body, depriving her of nutrients and if unhealthy, potentially puts her life at risk. A life? Yes. So is the deer your buddies hunted, or the ant you stepped on. A baby? Not until it's born, by Jewish law (God's chosen people).
crystal gonzalez Mary gave consent to put her life on the line to carry a fetus. She could have easily died in pregnancy or delivery. Especially that long ago. She gave consent for her body to be used.
Cried when Joseph’s mom was talking. She’s a strong women and I wish her all the peace and love in the world. I’m not religious at all but I do believe that I am not “higher” than anyone else and that I do not have a right to say who gets to live and who gets death. Just like I have no right to dictate the choices of other women. The only right I have is to myself, I’m responsible for myself (I don’t have children yet) and I only have the right to say what I need to do in order to live my true honest life.
This series is so underrated, it gives me hope that humanity isn't as bad is feels a lot of the time. Wow... Joseph's mother got me...i couldn't imagine hearing my child's heart like when in utero but knowing it's the last.
Yes and because God can see hearts and intentions and she believes God should give her handout. He’s leaving her as she is. When you truly believe in God and he sees that he is always there for you.
Alexandria God knows we need food, water, shelter.. etc. the creator knows his creation. But when you moan and whine and have this “woe is me” mentality then you stay in that mentality.
@@loverofjesus4856 Your mentality and the fact that you are unable to give food to two children are two different things! In fact she had a great mentality acting upon her best judgement! Was it the right one?Llet that be her problem. But it is certainly better than just letting everything happen to her while life goes by she ( and small children) suffer because she didn't act.
This series has truly challenged me and made me rethink and change a lot of what I believed. I have always had the conversation about abortion but never about death penalty. Truly opened my eyes.
The argument of whether or not the fetus is alive is not a productive argument. We are talking about whose life we should value more, the women or the children. Bringing science into this and saying that the cells are considered alive and therefore should have human rights makes no sense. Some people believe that life starts at conception or when the fetus develops a conscience. What people should be focusing on is how we can stop unwanted pregnancies and decrease the number of women getting abortions. Not about ending a safe and legal practice which many women need. Lastly, the whole pregnancy should be a punishment for women having sex makes no sense. The Data shows that the majority of abortion patients (60%) were in their 20s, and the second-largest age group was in their 30s (25%). Not to mention most of the women having abortions are in relationships. These women were not sex addicts or idiots who forgot to use birth control. These were women who knew that having a child would affect them financially or their health. Using punishment as an argument on why abortions should not be banned is horrendous. It shows that you do not genuinely care about the unborn child but rather that you care about spiting these women. If you're going to talk about abortion do it with sincerity for both the women and the unborn child. Sources www.umassmed.edu/news/news-archives/2019/05/who-are-the-1-in-4-american-women-who-choose-abortion/ www.guttmacher.org/report/characteristics-us-abortion-patients-2014
The argument is about human rights. All innocent human beings (born and unborn) should have them - the most fundamental right being a right not to be killed. And yes I agree :"the whole pregnancy should be a punishment for women having sex makes no sense." - the law telling someone not to kill a child, born or unborn, isn't about punishing anyone, it's about PROTECTING vulnerable human beings. It's those for abortion that have no sincerity for the unborn child. It's those against abortion that run places that help pregnant women keep their babies.
Unfortunately too many people use the bad logic of “if I can’t see it, it doesn’t exist!!” so climate change won’t be taken seriously until we’re living like the humans on Wall-E, living in space because the Earth is an uninhabitable wasteland
@Miss Cute it is a clump of cells after fertilization. Woman's body womans choice. If u don't like abortion that's fine but u have no right to tell other ppl what to do with there body's. A feotus hasn't lived yet and they can't even have memory till 3 years after birth. Getting rig of something in ur body that u don't want and could impact ur life forever is reasonable. What if a woman gets raped and then they are pregnant?? They should not have to keep it. What if there are complications and the baby could cause the pregnant women to die? Should the woman die??
@Miss Cute so if I stamped on a sperm cell does that mean I've killed someone? If I stamped on a clump of cells that was developing does that mean I've killed someone. By no means is having an abortion an easy or painless choice for the pregnant women who wants it. What if that baby would have to grow up in a toxic home and ppl? I'm sorry but ppl like u are sick. Keep Ur options to urself. Not everyone is religious
Oh there is a simple answer to why Pro-Life supporters tend to be hypocritical in regards to other life-related issues: The unborn is super convenient compared to advocating for other groups like the poor or the sick. Unlike the sick and the poor, the unborn won't complain about how your political actions effects them nor make you deal with any of the cultural baggage that is often attached. Unborn won't demand obligations or reparations. Advocating for the unborn is wonderful when you don't want to accept uncomfortable truths from the mouths of the same group you're supposedly fighting for.
HitomiNoRyu From my experience, most pro life voters do care about the sick and poor. They wish the gop did more to help children and families. They want to support vulnerable people. But they see abortion as a moral equivalent to murder. If you believed that one political party was in favor of legalized murder, all other policies would become unimportant. A ton of the people who care about ending abortion are single issue voters. They would simply never vote for a candidate they perceive as in favor of murder, so they stomach the rest of the Republican platform to vote prolife. I think if democrats softened their rhetoric on the issue, they’d be way more competitive in the South and Midwest because Christian values voters could vote on issues other than abortion and be sympathetic to the DNC’s platforms on healthcare, foreign policy, childcare, and welfare.
In my opinion, there is a difference between "Pro-life" and "Pro-baby". Most of the "Pro-Lifers" are actually just "Pro-Baby", which means they feel as though a woman should give birth no matter the circumstances surrounding it. How can one say they are "Pro-Life" when they don't care about the baby's wellbeing after it is born? For example, you don't see many "Pro-Lifers" promoting the welfare of juveniles, single mothers, the homeless, widows, and orphans. So basically when a person says they are 'Pro-Life' they really just mean 'Pro-Baby'! I think people should care about the welfare of people throughout their ENTIRE lives, not just at birth! If you are going to insist that a woman keep her child as a moral thing, then just make sure that you help her raise that child as that is also the moral thing to do! Don't be a hypocrite, you can't push morality about some things and be hypocritical about others! And yes, I am a Christian: edifythebody.org/curriculums/
The pro-life, pro-death penalty stance makes sense when you realize what it is really about: punishment. Conservatives love it. Having a child is a woman's just punishment for having sex. And the death penalty- of course they love that, it is the ultimate punishment! Viewed through this lens, their ideas are totally consistent.
Pro-life does have abortion as last result, but it would be really hard to access to, and very very last process. I wonder if pro-life people won, and ended up having baby booms. How big the mortality rate would be on pregnant women? Considering they would need to visit at least 3 doctors to see, if mother HAS to take abortion if they're in danger.
When I spoke to some family members who were complaining about how things are against their beliefs I asked them realistic questions and had to make them realize people aren't protesting to make others get abortions we are protesting against others taking away our choice and access. When fighting for the right to love who you love I said what if someone took away your right to love who you love. The objective is to preserve rights and access not to force others to utilize these rights and services. I don't know a single person campaigning for people to have an abortion but there are people campaigning for your choice and access to be taken away.
"We're all religious, we all have our ideas, or belief systems; until you don't." Very powerful and truthful line. I'm sure ol' Aldous Huxley would be proud of this line.
@@earienurnjd4506 A friendly question if the woman did die after or while giving birth, who will take care of the baby? U may say family, ok but who will breastfed it?
@EqualSign wrong. Breastmilk is basically the child's first reliable source of vaccine that helps them build their immune system. Even formula milk can't totally replace breastmilk, look it up. It's not about the money even. Yeah, you can hrie as much mommies to give milk to the child, but then you didn't factor in the possible complications that might happen to the child. Basically ignorant, you.
With videos like this.... I'm forever grateful that I was born into a country that doesn't have abortion control based on religion *AND* can make my own decisions about sex, birth control etc. Thank you Finland 🙏🏽🇫🇮❤️
If I have an unwanted baby and a pro lifer interferes to convince me to keep it, I will only do so if they choose to adopt the baby right then and there. If you don't spontaneously want a child, neither do I.
Okay, I'm pro-life and conservative but I have to admit this is one point that the pro-choice crowd makes that's a valid point - many conservatives don't care about helping out families that need it. I'm socially conservative, but economics is a different story. We need improved social welfare programs, a universal healthcare system, and an end to income inequality (nobody can convince me that CEOs work 10,000x harder than the workers keeping the companies running).
@@goliraman656 Many of us are for exceptions such as rape, incest, or the mother's life is in danger. But getting an abortion because a baby will put an end to her hedonistic lifestyle, that's morally wrong. And one area where I differ from most of the pro-life crowd is that I support social welfare programs and a complete restructuring of the economic system that would negate any economic reasons for abortion.
Vivien Bissell the system isn't good for children and neither is putting them in adoption, people barely adopt anymore and in some states its illegal for gay people to adopt. And you arent ending a life its a fetus.
Vivien Bissell It hasnt? Its a clump of cells thats smaller than shrimps💀 The cancer tumor and the fetus are the same thing so are you against curing cancer too? a fetus starts living AFTER birth not before birth. And abortion is maximum before the 12th week (depends where you live)
I love your work & this video hits really close to home. I lived in TX as a teenager & my mother took me to the abortion clinic without giving me a choice once she found out. At 49, I've just relocated back to TX due to Covid-19 times, & I am still pro-choice . My mother's view has only intensified re: pro- life as she voted for that horrific TX abortion bill stating that if it had been against the law she wouldn't have forced me to abort. Honestly, it's a conversation we both try to avoid as it's always fruitless. Re: death penalty, I never really knew where I stood until a few years ago when I heard of so many innocent people on death row. After this video I am even more solid in my stance against the death penalty. Again, thank you for this video. Keep on rocking it!
Bible thumpers aren't the only people who disagree with abortion. That's a strawman set up by liberals so they can ignore the actual issue on abortion.
The core of this argument really isn't about pro-life, pro-choice. It's really pro-choice, anti-choice. You can be pro-life, but believe it isn't your right to enforce your beliefs on someone else who believes differently.
I don't like using pro-life for people who would want me and so many others dead and want to create needless suffering and harm. They don't care about saving lives.
@@DustMoons Fully agree. 'Pro-life' people have so far told me: -That it is my job to die for a baby if necessary (when I told them that my body is wrecked from my (freely chosen) births and can't handle another) -That pregnancies from rape are a gift one should be thankful for (sometimes with a 'you asked for it', 'you should be thankful a guy found you attractive enough to risk that', or my personal favorite that I still have saved up 'God saw that you weren't fulfilling your role and duty as a woman so he send an angel to make you realize your mistake, learn from it' I am still not sure if that person meant just being a mother or also a wife, as they went on and on about evil single women depriving poor men of wives. -That tokophobia doesn't exist and/or people who are suicidal should be held captive until the birth of the child which than can go up for adoption, basically going full 'use people as incubators' (oh and afterwards? just let them go, if they kill themselves then they at least don't kill the precious fetus) -that they are fine with abortions if the person getting it is shot afterwards -that there are no abortions ever needed for medical reasons, even if the pregnant one is a literal child, and people just lie about how hard, dangerous, and painful pregnancy and birth are That always feels like they care about lives so much. And weirdly, very few were in favor of things that actually help make abortion less needed (paid parental leave, a living wage, better social programs, free long-term contraception, etc) and quite a few were adamantly against such things.
@@evem6154 That’s disgusting that people could even think like that. Fortunately I haven’t had too many bad experiences with pro lifers (Just the religious ones telling me I’m going to hell.). Although their was this one time a man said “You should die for your unborn child because if you do it will be natural, even if the child only lives for a few hours.”.
@@DustMoons I have been around for a few years and have had countless discussions on the topic. Yeah, I have had people repeatedly telling me to die, EVEN IF the fetus dies with me. Because that's natural. That's their deities will. Or karma or something. Sometimes with 'if you would only pray and accept Jesus into your heart your problems would magically be fixed' 🙄 The worst I had was someone calling themselves 'a warrior for humanity and a protector of life' who straight up told me Lina Medina, the girl who became famous because she had a baby at 5 years should not have been allowed an abortion because if she menstruated, she was deemed ready by God to have kids and she must have seduced her baby-daddy This is a way nicer summary of the three paragraph rant. Yeah, if you are around a while, the filth will show itself. But I find it useful to remember that quite many people can and do change their mind. There is always hope.
This series is honestly so good. As a non-American, I find the fact that your country still has the death penalty abhorrent. It's state-sanctioned homicide, as you called it in the video. The contradiction of self-proclaimed "pro-lifers" supporting the death penalty has baffled me for years, looking at this debate from the outside. Glad you're discussing this here. Keep up the great work, Grace, this is so needed!
So you believe a man that rapes beats sodomizes and then murders a five year old child should be allowed to live. And that you should be liable for paying for his continued life of three meals a day a recess time access to a tv etc???? This is what is wrong with your country
@@JustMe-tl3ex I don't believe he should be "allowed" to live, no; I believe he has a fundamental right to life, and that no other person has a right to take that away (that's what fundamental right means). I'm not against life in prison, it's just murder I'm against.
Coming from UK where there is abortion and no death penalty i have some questions for the US. If you are so keen to avoid abortions why do you also argue against sex ed and contraception? Things that would reduce the unplanned and unwanted pregnancies, would drop abortion rate right off. Here I can get birth control pills, coil etc on NHS. I know the agruement is that morally 'just say no' is why you don't give teens the info they need, but if avoiding abortions was important enough for you then you would do good sex ed. Costs of healthcare through pregnancy - this as well as the lifetime cost of raising a child is going to be an issue where insurance cover limited. And how about some social justice for the poorest so that if that pregnancy occurs they don't have to choose between the the born and the yet to be born, we still need to tackle that wealth divide here in UK, but this are things that would impact on the number of abortions that requested. But I guess that is too solialist for the conserative dominated anti abortion lobby. They prefer to ban something than ask why people feel this is the only option, and how their circumstances can be altered. Late abortions - here that would only be if medical issue with baby or if the fetus has died in the womb. Because access to abortion is available decisions can be made earlier in the pregnancy. In contrast when I read of all the legal steps to get an abortion in some states and how far need to travel to a clinic, and costs all along the way, some can't get the resources together in time for an early abortion. By limiting access the pro-lifers make it more likely that an abortion will be at a later stage. And if you think abortions will go away completely if you make a law, I ask you to consider what in UK was called a 'back street abortion' - not clinical, and many women permenantly damaged or dying as a result. No one wants an abortion, it is never a 'good thing' but they are at times needed. Meanwhile - death penalty, why? As long as society and the legal system means that the poorer, the lighter and the mentally unwell are more likely to end up in jail and on death row, how can we sanction that death. They are punished by prison, communities are protected from them, that is enough. I was a teenager when I first realised that the same people shouting pro life for a forming bundle of cells also argued for more and more executions. I didn't find that consisent then, and I don't see how it can be consisent now.
Mthoughtz 1 it’s an independent media channel on YT. They are progressive news. I highly recommended to check out some clips on here, CZcams. :-) if you like, become a member and DL their app.
I love my life. Im 26, I had an abortion when I was 19. The best decision I've ever made. Im proud that I had a voice and could make the right decision for myself, and myself only. Im pro choice and I will always support women who wants to have control of their own body and life.
@Smokey the problem with religious nuts is that they preach empty platitude but not realizing that they are demanding a human to give up their internal organs and suffer to bring out another human from inside their body. It is a choice, not a moral duty. Unless you are morally obliged to give up your organs to save another life? I'm sure you can live with one lung and one kidney, and I am sure there are people who need it to live. If you have more than one lung and one kidney and haven't had them ripping out of your body while being conscious and you preach about childbirth, you're a hypocrite.
@ricky roach I don't believe in anything but science and love. And that we are just microscopic pieces with opinions and free will. I don't care what happens when I die, I believe it goes black, like it was before I even was born. Imagine how peaceful it would be.
@ricky roach I'm religious myself but science is a thing, and abortion isn't murder. Go pick and choose other things from the bible to fit your beliefs who harm other people
I was once a major proponent of the death penalty. I've worked in public safety for over a decade and a half and have seen the worst of humanity. Then I saw how many people have been exonerated and how often laws like the one in my home state are abused to send people who didn't deserve it to the chamber...I now only support death in extreme cases, such as serial killers and mass murderers. I was also once anti-abortion. Being a paramedic and seeing what the extreme restrictive laws have done has drastically changed my views on that. Learning biology beyond the high school level was very eye-opening.
If you are ⊂_ヽ ＼＼ wondering why ＼( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) > ⌒ヽ / へ＼ / / ＼＼ I changed this ﾚ ノ ヽ_つ / / / /| ( (ヽ Its because this comment... | |、＼ | 丿 ＼ ⌒) | Stressed me out so I changed it✌✌
Shaun Pattinson YES thank you I’m sick of the people wanting to control other women and f*** up their life, like it affects their own life And a being is not technically live if it doesn’t have a heart beat there for it’s body being formed until that point, there for it’s not murder 110% agree with you
it is not her body and abortion should only be done if it is a risk for the mother and in a case of rape however, using abortion as birth control is just a madness
Thank you so much for all you're doing to shed light on these much-needed discussions. I do believe it is inevitable that there will be change, and you are an important forerunner of a much more compassionate and inclusive paradigm shift in all areas of our culture. Much gratitude to you, and blessings on your journey! ⭐💛⭐
Most of the pro-life Christians would never even consider adopting or fostering a child. If they’re so pro-birth and pro-life and care so much about children, then they ought to practice what they preach.
To me getting an abortion is unimaginable that’s exactly why I’m pro choice because if a woman is getting an abortion it means she must be so unbelievably desperate and cannot have that baby, NO woman makes that decision lightly.
milldog65 If you choose to only see it as simply and bluntly as cold blooded murder then that’s your choice, I don’t imagine you’d have much room to see any complexities in that. I however don’t view abortion so simply. Also I’m assuming you’re a vegetarian?
there have been many people to get abortions because they claim they’re “not ready”. if they truly weren’t ready, why did they allow themselves to get pregnant?
I absolutely love how Grace conducts these interviews. I am a completely different religion than her, so I don't subscribe to many of her beliefs, but I have so much respect for the kind, open-minded way she examines controversial issues.
I recently left the Christian faith and she still moved me with her videos. I live in Texas and am horrified by our systems. I applaud her for exposing it.
The stupidity of this video is beyond parody. This woman attempts to highlight “hypocrisy” among those who are pro-life AND also support capital punishment. However, such a claim of hypocrisy necessarily draws a moral equivalence between an unborn child and a convicted murderer, which is obviously inane.
@Zane Drake abortion isn’t a horrible thing. And regardless if a woman is raped or not, it should be a basic human right. How is forcing a woman to destroy her body and go through the extreme pain of labor not a war crime?
@Zane Drake and men shouldn’t have an opinion on abortion because it’s not there bodies. Birth, rape, pregnancy, are all things men will never experience or rarely ever experience. Imagine men who will never go through this extreme pain trying to tell you that you can’t choose a way out and that you HAVE to have a child the rest of your life and go through the pain of child birth. And giving birth to a child who will just get abused and raped or put in horrible foster homes seems a lot worse then removing a clump of cells and saving the life of a woman.
@@SomeGuy-df8gs apologies for saying it bad I didn’t mean to say never get raped, of course they do, it’s just extremely low compared to the rates women and children face rape. It’s a crime that can effect all but it is a crime that usually targets women.
Alright, so if she decides to have a baby and the man doesn’t want her to, then he doesn’t have to pay child support. If she can make 100% of the choice, then she can take care of it by herself. 👍🏾 My money, my choice!
Syd Lane The interview with Stephanie refutes the talking point about how birth control prevents abortions. Birth control facilitates risky sexual behavior. And when birth control fails, abortion is the next step. If people choose to be abstinent, their birth control regimen is 100% effective and they don’t need abortion as a failsafe.
@@elijahculper5522 As a person who chose to be abstinent until marriage, I still advocate for comprehensive sex education and access to birth control. As much as I would like and encourage people to wait, let's face it, people are going to choose to have sex or not. The least we can do is properly educate people on the physical, emotional and spiritual weight of making the decision to be sexually active, the importance of enthusiastic consent, what healthy relationships look like, and provide them access to multiple types of contraceptives (both male & female). Provide free or lost cost IUDs and implants for long-term, more effective protection. It also needs to be said that waiting is perfectly fine so people don't feel pressured into being "left behind" by their peers.
@@elijahculper5522 How old were you when you got married? Some of us weren't lucky enough to find our life partner at 22 or 23 years old. I was 38 when I finally found him. And no, I sure as shit wasn't a virgin. But I was very safe about the sex I did have. Still, just because birth control worked for me, doesn't mean it doesn't fail for others. If your only solution to not wanting a baby is just to remain abstinent then you're exposing you're true agenda: Controlling women's sexuality. That's what's REALLY behind the pro-life movement.
Gotta tell you, I love these Refinery 29 videos the best. The ones where hard questions are asked and many of us need to start admitting we don’t know the answers, but want to move toward finding them. Thank you! ✌🏼 (BTW - you have the solution: Listen, think, understand. It’s getting everyone to do it calmly, thoughtfully, nonjudgmentally that’s really the problem.)
i'm in my mid teens. i was molested for years from a very young age. luckily when i was 12 i told someone before it went farther. but if it had gone farther, i can't even imagine the terror of getting tested. it coming out positive. not having the ability to choose. you can't imagine other's lives either. can't imagine what they're going through. what they're dealing with. when the rent is due. where they're going to sleep tonight. what they're going to eat today, if anything. that they're not ready. that it's endangering their own life, however that may be. not old enough. didn't want another child. can't support another child. that they can barely support themselves. that they were raped, and now there's something inside them that should have never been there. don't judge other's for their reasons. they don't need to tell you why. it's *none* of your business. but if you do anyway, then you're an absolute piece of shit.
People don't seek abortion because a child would be "inconvenient", they do it because a child is *life-changing*. Even if you don't raise a child, carrying a pregnancy to term has an unbelievable impact- physically and mentally. Some of these changes can be permanent. Many chronic medical conditions are treated with medication that harm fetal development, especially those that treat mental health. You cannot bring a pregnancy to term or raise a child if you aren't able to care for yourself. Especially if you're already a parent or caregiver. Please do not over-simplify an extremely complex and personal choice.
I think many people who are pro-life have little to no knowledge about what the U.S. funded in Asia about 50 years ago... I am not saying one or the other is correct, but the hippocracy from the U.S. (and the UN and Sweden in particular) is something that people really deserve to know about as a U.S. citizen when addressing abortion rights. In case you're curious, women were fighting for the right to choose their pregnancies, people were calling them baby murderers, yet the U.S. was funding the methodical culling of South Korean, Indian, and Chinese populations with the threat of revoking food aid to the starving populations if they did not cooperate, and their methods were to disperse birth control and provide full funding AND facilities to provide (and many times FORCE) abortions on the poorer populace in those countries. When that wasn't reducing the numbers enough, they found that since those cultures prefer a male heir, they funded research into sex determination which resulted in Chorionic Villus Sampling (CVS). They would provide these tests for free, abort the females, and then when they had a confirmed male they would leave it and pay women to submit to sterilization after they gave birth to their male heir. This was the reason for that "one child policy" in China that you have likely heard about. People were starving to death because of a population boom CAUSED BY a lack of education of the poor, and the solution was to systematically abort the poor's pregnancies, pay them (or often force them) in exchange for their fertility, install non-sterile and rejected (from the U.S. use due to safety concerns) IUDs into many Indian women without consent or even INFORMING THEM afterwards, and many more horrors. Even though it is proven that just educating people results in lower birth rates. *The main point I find so bizarre is that women were struggling for the legal right to abortion, while their government and elite sponsored the mostly forced and paid abortion over in Asia. Even when U.S. women have the legal right to abort, they are the ones that have to pay for the procedure, even though their own government was paying for it in other countries.*
@@stefansile6790 I know, right?! I was horrified when I found out about this happening. It is a MASSIVE problem in those countries because there is now a huge lack of women and it results in a lot of kidnappings and abuse. Here is a documentary that gives a good synopsis of the whole crisis: czcams.com/video/0uj6bDqAVJA/video.html Many of the references mentioned are able to be looked up, like the involved companies/organizations, politicians, and medical staff. There are many reports, documents, audio recordings, and records about this event in history. If you want me to post some specifics, I can, but it'll take a while for me to sift through for the correct ones from reputable website sources. The big marker is the funding provided to the UN for their Population Fund. The US has revoked funding currently I believe, but they were by a huge margin the primary source of money.
They did this to U.S Citizens too... Look up eugenics, anyone not deemed having desirable genes (poor, person of color, not WASP) were mostly sterilized :'(. Women deserve the right to choose no matter where. Absolutely disgusting they spread it elsewhere too.
I've officially changed my mind on the death penalty. I'm no longer in favor of it. And further, I can't believe after all this time I've been pro-human rights, yet hadn't the sense to put 2 and 2 together to see why I was wrong.
@Smokey why should they get the easy way out? Death is quick and in modern times painless. Being stuck inside till you die is difficult, the only thing is that prisons need is to be less fancy. If those prisoners had no access to entertainment and to each other they would live in hell. Nowadays a lot of prisons have TVs and books, the prisoners live together a big part of the day. And I get that is a good thing for people who commited a small crime. But some murderers should be locked away forever and they shouldnt get to live a nice life after what they did
Examining your beliefs and admitting where you went wrong is a powerful, tough thing to do. I’ve definitely done it before. Good for you, and keep it up.
I was randomly searching for something on this topic and I was pleasantly surprised by how intelligent, emotional, and professional this video was. Thanks. I have been on the train of thought that takes me to resolve all societal problems with one answer. We all needed to be smarter. Our society needs to be better educated. We need to be discussing these kinds of complex issues in grade school.
@@katiegeeish Its unborn you fucking dolt, they cant choose because they arent even alive. Yet you chucklefucks call it murder because you dont understand the difference between a clump of cells and a fully grown adult human being. Did you read the title of the video btw? You fucking idiots advocate murder of fully grown adult human criminals but cant deal with a clump of cells being terminated because you cant use logic, and your fee-fees get hurt when someone has to make an incredibly tough decision. Well, I have a tough lesson for you, the world is a harsh place and doesnt give two fucking shits about your feelings, and trying to change the laws because of that is asinine, wrong, disgusting, and will never happen because there are too many people who use logical reasoning to ensure that you crazed thought-nazis never get your way.
@@LeahBeth_1997 You are murdering someone at this very moment by not donating a kidney, part of your liver, bone marrow, a lung or even blood... And yet it is entirely legal for you to deny even blood to save even your children. The debate of how moral would that choice be it's one thing, but it would be completely legal for you to deny the use of your body to save your already born, sentient child.
@@xion5514 I love how liberals are so appalled when somebody has a different opinion, it shows how immature some of you can be. Conservatives are expected to be kind when you have an opinion but you don't follow what you preach
How can you say you're pro life when you dont care about the situation and the lives women are living. If all life is equal, their lives matter too. Life isnt just about birth. If we lived in a world where resources, ongoing financial support, and equal opportunity to succeed existed we wouldn't need abortion but sadly we dont live in that kind of world. It' about autonomy and freedom. Quality of life dicates mortality everywhere, how could it be morally corrupt to make the decision to not bring a child into a life where you can't afford to provide basic necessities or love. How can you not want the right to choose.
That's a good point. I'm conservative and pro-life but agree with you that we need improved social welfare programs, guaranteed basic necessities for everyone, and an end to income inequality. People are often baffled by my conservative socialist political views but to me it's the only ideology that makes sense. I do think though abortion exceptions can be made for rape, incest, and if the mother's life is in danger. But addressing economic issues is key to improving the quality of life for everyone.
@Speedzone Speedforce who gives you the right to decide who is innocent? And who says an innocent life is worth more than anothers? Point blank, one law shouldn't dictate the lives of so many women. No one should be trapped into motherhood and only 1-2% of women who originally planned to give a child up for adoption follow through with it. Some may have great lives afterwoods and feel grateful but there will always be those who won't, it's not up to you or anyone but the woman to decide for herself.
First of all you failed biology my brother,, fetus CAN'T feel ANY pain before 24 weeks. It's like saying if you cut a paper it will feel pain...and second many people are forced into pregnancy and that's rape. And second when you will get raped at 12 dont get an abortion cuz its "hurting" something that cant feel any pain but that will kill you but yea who cares if you die.
@Speedzone Speedforce First of all you failed biology my brother,, fetus CAN'T feel ANY pain before 24 weeks. It's like saying if you cut a paper it will feel pain...and second many people are forced into pregnancy and that's rape. And second when you will get raped at 12 dont get an abortion cuz its "hurting" something that cant feel any pain but that will kill you but yea who cares if you die.
The death penalty is simply abhorrent. Taking someone’s life is either right or wrong. It certainly doesn’t become righteous when it’s done by committee! We don’t rape our rapists or steal from our thieves.
I never thought I'd ever get an abortion but at 32, after a very difficult second pregnancy that left me wrecked, I found myself pregnant again when my youngest was only 4 months. I was on birth control. My world came crashing down. My Obgyn had already told me that I although I would probably survive another pregnancy I would probably have permanent disability. My whole faith came crashing down. I realised that I wanted to live. I wanted to be there for my kids and husband, and yes, myself. I realised that until you're in that situation you don't understand. No-one should judge you because you judge yourself enough.
You’re so strong for going through that. It’s amazing how being in someone’s places can make you understand so much. Wishing you and your family the best :)
Most abortions have nothing to do with the woman's life being endangered. Most are done for excuses of convenience like money or it simply not being the right time for a child. Do you at least agree those excuses should be illegal? i.e. if they are not good excuses to kill a born child they are not good excuses to kill an unborn child... Also, the law telling someone not to kill their child, born or unborn, isn't about judging anyone, they are about PROTECTING an innocent human being.
@@mathildeyoung1823 It is not a human being until it can breathe on it's own. Even the bible says that. Until then there is no viability of life. I've known women who have had stillborn children or who have miscarried at 19 weeks. Are they then condemned as murderers because they were the carrier of the child? Is God responsible for the murder because, in God's words, he knew them before, he created them, and if the "baby" did not survive through no fault of the mother, is GOD THEN A MURDERER??? Answer me that question. Are you going to help a grandmother who is told by her opiate addled prostitute daughter who doesn't believe in abortion that she has to look after her daughter's 5th child when it's born. I had to support that Grandmother, I had to hold her while she cried her eyes out because she was 74 and about to look after another baby on her own. It's obvious that you have never seen this side of life, that Child Safety staff see, that you are untouched by actual humanity, and that you will blindly go through life being piously Christian and therefore judgmental, not holding God as accountable for tragedy as you hold humans, even though they are "human" and therefore subject to flaws, whereas God has the power to take away all pain. why is the father not held equally as responsible, why can men refuse to take a paternity test, why isn't the son of rich parents able to get away with raping and impregnating young, usually poor and vulnerable girls and then walk away from any responsibility and actually have judges say in verdicts that they didn't want "his prospects" in life hindered. Until those inequalities in life are addressed don't come at me or other women for the sins of society. My take on abortion changed when a girl I went to school with got knocked up by her filthy rich boyfriend, who immediately dumped her and got another girl pregnant. One friend wanted an abortion, but her Christian parents made her have the baby, only to force her into adoption and wonder about her baby for the rest of her life. I'm 60 and that decision created more pain in her life than having an abortion would have. And the father. Oh, he went on to have a marvelous career, of course! Really I'd like to hear your take on things.
This is so well done. The lovely woman at the end speaking about her son was enlightening. I also liked the Methodist Pastor. I'm glad they didn't speak to men about this.
I want to applaud Refinery 29 & Grace for setting a stage where these extremely important topics can be viewed and challenged. Compassion and conversation should go hand in hand.
Do you think it's an emotionally manipulative tactic, that they chose such a case to feature (that of a man who should NOT be on Death row) instead of featuring someone like Ted Bundy? Do you think they were trying to manipulate the audience in any way, by making such a choice?
@@SydLane They're manipulating the audience by providing an example of a person who didn't pull the trigger and was sentenced to death? Or stating the fact that 1 in 10 people executed were later exonerated? The fact that a single innocent soul has EVER been executed unjustly...is enough of a reason to abolish the death penalty.
@@SydLane Just say you dont care about innocent lives (ei: the thing all anti-choice people claim is the main reason against abortion) and keep it moving.
@@mycatiswaysmarterthanmosto8500 Can't say what isn't true, sorry. And it's hilariously ironic for someone who is OK with murdering unborn babies to wax lyrical about caring about innocent lives. lol That's good. 😂
The last child I got pregnant with I found out about at 6 weeks gestation. My second son was only about 4-5 months old. The first Dr. I saw told me that if I did not terminate the pregnancy the "baby" would not survive, and I had a very low survival rate also. There were so many complications, I did not mean to get pregnant but that is what happens when men and women share the same bed. I was married and this was the 4th pregnancy. I chose to NOT have it terminated, LOL should have seen my Dr. face. He started really talking like maybe I did not understand that maybe I could die. I WAS REALLY SCARED. I WAS REALLY SICK. But I trusted the Lord Jesus and gave birth a month early to a beautiful HEALTHY little girl. I'm so glad I listened to the Lord my God. Yes it was very hard to take care of all of them. No we didn't always have all the best money could buy. But I ALWAYS HAD GODS LOVE AND MY BABIES. Beloved, don't believe the lies, your babies are so very special. I love you all God Bless
14:06 What about the reverse though? Let me rephrase her statement: "It feels somewhat hypocritical that there's a major movement to criminalize capital punishment to protect guilty life but the same energy is not given to saving that same life if they haven't committed a crime."
right? I read lists of the best places to live in the US and the majority of them I would never feel safe in. Texas cities are almost always on the list.
Yeah! Grace always makes sure to let us know how she feels but not let that affect her professionalism. She has everyone give their answers and experiences from all sides of the board, letting them share without silencing them. Now that's a fine Journalist right there!
I used to watch Grace on Pop Trigger and always thought she had more to offer. So happy she got this opportunity, this series is excellent. Great job, Grace!!
I really like your videos. Sensitive, honest, touching. I hope you continue to seek understanding as you have been, and to take us with you as you do. Bless you.
@@mathildeyoung1823 That's not really surprising, considering most pregnancies happen to women over 20. Do you have data on the rates? Abortion/pregnancies in different age brackets? Absolute numbers mean nothing in this particular debate.
I was raised hardcore Catholic and idk if it's bc I'm Canadian and we haven't had the death penalty since my mom was born, but I was raised with this very strong anti-death penalty sentiment in addition to the anti-abortion sentiment. Kinda weird to see Christians doing the opposite. If you're gonna be dicks at least be consistent.
Kye Talks lmao thanks for this comment. a lot of Christians, particularly conservative- christians, tend to cherry pick what they think is wrong or not. as you said, be consistent. though i’m pro- choice, i really like this comment. also, i’m a fellow canadian so hey!!
Omg exactly my point! I'm not a Christian but I'm firmly Pro Life and Firmly Anti Death penalty. I wish everyone would stop making Pro Life Movement, portrayed as a religious thing. More so, I do really wish other Pro Lifers would stop being hypocrites and treat every living being the same. Innocent or guilty.
@John Smith Okay as a New Yorker, I can agree that many laws here are really bad when it comes to the criminal justice system and I don't believe all criminals should be rehabilitated. But what your saying is its either death or go onto the streets and kill more people. Bruh. I don't think it works that way anywhere and I really advise you educate yourself. We can jail criminals, we don't have to let them back on the streets. But execution in a modern civilized society that is supposed to value the lives of ALL its citizens, is simply immoral and barbaric.
When they find a living cell on Mars they call that life. When a pregnant woman dies in a car accident they call it a double homicide...life is life. Period.
There’s a difference between killing an innocent child who has done no harm in this world and is a direct result of the woman’s incompetence than killing a murderer/rapist who shows no remorse to their actions
this should be a non issue. there's no brain-body connection until 3rd trimester. a human cannot live without those connections. bam life starts at the 3rd trimester
@@VictoriousLaura Those studies don't exist. There are many systems that need to develop and work together to feel pain. The nerve systems and the part of the brain necessary to feel pain aren't developed until around 23 weeks. You might be talking about withdrawal reflex. That isn't pain. It's the same thing that happens when a doctor tests your knee reflexes with the little hammer. No pain is felt, but your leg kicks out automatically.
VictoriousLaura it responds to a stimulus not necessarily infliction of pain. I agree that it opens a compelling discussion. One that requires deep philosophical reflection about a persons self and their definitions of pain and about compassion. Or how a person views pain or views compassion through a heretic lens. Ultimately that would create a crisis of identity for too many people so it’s easier to not confront those ideas. Why rock the boat of your world view when you know there’s a good chance it won’t personally affect you? That seems to be where the US stands on this in my opinion.
@Kayla M why are you twisting my words? and you know "lol" is kind of a passive aggressive thing right? i'm saying that if you dont agree with it you don't do it. i never said that women enjoy having an abortion, it can be a hard decision. no one should be forced to have one or not to have one. Kind of like China or other countries. Would you rather children be put in adoption where they grow up abused and neglected wondering why their mom couldn't keep them or how they were a mistake. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean that the world should abide by your way of thinking. My aunt would rather spend over 30,000 thousand dollars of trying to have her own baby and still trying) than to adopt one in need, kind of shows that people would rather have their own kid than adopt one. We have over two million kids in the foster system, you honestly think there should be more? As it is almost all of them don't get adopted, and there's more to come with your way of thinking. people are so against having an abortion but dont even care about the baby until its born.
@@Themakeupchair15 i wasn't responding to the original comment, there was another person but my conversation with that person was deleted on their part. hahah
Yeah but she wasn't given the choice to kill her baby. She was given the choice whether or not to become pregnant in the first place. It's not as though she was made pregnant, and then agreed to go ahead with it, and had she not consented, the unborn baby would have been murdered at her behest. It's a really dumb comparison which makes no sense.
It’s not quite the same thing, but it is still relevant. The rest of us aren’t lucky enough to have an angel come down and confirm to us whether it’s going to result in a pregnancy. We have to wait at least 6 weeks. But the point is God wants women to make choices regarding their own bodies.
@@doraymeandyou God does want women to make choices regarding their own bodies. For example, if one isn't ready to have a child, then one should choose not to have sex (and if we're talking about what God wants, then no one should EVER be having sex outside of marriage)... God wants women to choose to follow Him. And choose to live according to His word. But God is not in favor of women murdering anyone... let alone their unborn babies. Life begins at conception. That unborn baby, as tiny and undeveloped as it is, has the exact same DNA it will have for the rest of its life - the full and complete plans for the way it will look, what it will be like, what it will be good at, etc... it's all there... and it has a soul. God has breathed life into this baby. It is a human being. If you think the God of the bible is cool with women killing their own babies, then you don't know God at all.
@@candieland4276 People are really trying to suggest that Mary could have had an abortion and God would have been fine with it lol ... what on earth is going on in this world?? I'm thankful for your comment.
My sister was raped, and was forced to have the baby (by my parents who wanted her to have the kid rather than care about her mental health) she would have panic attacks almost every other day during the pregnancy even with our support, she died during childbirth and the baby died 5 minutes later due to her stress. Call it for what it is, it’s pro-birth not pro-life.
What do you think the solution to this conflict is? Share your ideas with us below.
Refinery29 I don’t know, it just goes down to way people think
Why can’t we just be good people? Not pass judgment on others (like it says in the Bible). Help those in need. Be more understanding of others views............shoot, that’s how it was suppose to be!
Refinery29 free contraception
Prayer is the solution to this. We all have free will to do what we want. Murder is never right. Every wrong we do on earth has consequences. The first and only religion to last over 2000 years is the Catholic religion. These so called "pastors" get the bible, misinterpret scripture and preach what they please. Do let these other religions mislead you.
I Just think you show is very biased. Let the people who dont agree say something.
You dont have both sides there.
I had never thought about abortion or what it really meant until I had been raped when I was in college. I was on birth control, but my period was late. I had no idea what to do. It was actually a Christian group leader who took me to a local planned parenthood, and she was a great support during that time. I remember doing the pregnancy test and the rep sat down and asked me, just in case it came out positive, what would I want to do.
My world stopped. I was a freshman in college, only 18. I wasn’t, and still don’t feel 5 years on, mature enough to have a baby. I couldn’t afford a baby. I didn’t ask for a baby.
I had no control in that moment, and it was one of the scariest things I have ever been through.
Thank god I wasn’t pregnant. But it really opened my eyes to a new perspective. I started doing research and began advocating for choice. Because I had no choice when that person took advantage of me, I want to make sure others can have a choice if they are in my shoes. If they’re in that room.
It’s important.
EDIT:
Adding this because I DID see that deleted comment about how my rape must have been consensual because “alcohol must have been involved” since I was in college.
1. How dare you make assumptions about me or any other survivor and fill in holes in my story just to fit a stupid narrative (which is very wrong btw)
2. That is not how consent works and the fact that that is still not common sense actually disgusts me. If there is no, especially verbal, consent, it is RAPE.
3. You’re a piece of shit
exactly. thank you.
@Vivien Bissell Adoption: sure, but the adoption system is know to be fucking awful, and I couldn't do that to my child.
Protection - I was raped.
Responsibility - I. was. raped.
Financial Help - for me, yes I probably would've had the help, but not everyone is that lucky. Not to mention, like mentioned in the video, sometimes it's not enough to properly raise a child.
I hope you never have to be where I was to see my side of this argument.
Sry to hear what happened to u, hope u r doing better 🙌
Vivien Bissell I wasn’t pregnant, but okay. And I actually probably would’ve kept it if I had been. I was in a position where I had resources, but not everyone is me. My whole comment was about how I get it, and can totally understand choosing to have an abortion.
I’ve heard more than enough stories and know people who are social workers, and I stand behind my point that the foster care system needs serious reforms and I would be hesitant to ever put a child through that. I’d personally go a private route but that can be costly and doesn’t have any standard safeguards.
Because after doing research, I don’t consider it killing. Fetuses aren’t what we consider “alive” until about week 32, since they’re not even aware consciously until that point due to the brains developing fully at that point. Until then, they’re basically another organ. Majority of abortions are done in the first trimester, late ones realistically only occurring when it’s deemed too dangerous and both baby and mother will die. It cannot feel any kind of pain because it’s not developed into anything just yet.
Hope that clarifies
Vivien Bissell well “life” isn’t what I’m referring to, I’m referring to “consciousness.”
Just wanted to clarify. Live a good one
People only give a shit about the fetus until it is born. So much talk and so much pressure for that baby to be born, but no one worries about how that baby is gonna live after birth.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
CAN YOU SAY THIS LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK PLEASE!!! But no like seriously this is so true,it’s obvious that if someone doesn’t want to have a child,than they probably shouldn’t have one ,not everyone can be a parent.And nothings worse than not being wanted by your parents
AMEN
*Truth I say this all the time especially sad how these same people don’t support social services that help low income people with food stamps and welfare yet tell same people not to have abortions like seriously they bitch either way without actually trying to help because it doesn’t in the end effect them so they actually don’t care*
+annienguyen 100%!!
If you have an abortion “how dare you”
If you need assistance after giving birth “how dare you”
Yes, and if you get married, you dishonestly tricked a man. If you don't get married, you are a single mother who contributes to social breakdown. And if you don't have kids at all? Then you are a selfish cold old cat lady. It is set up so we can never win.
that's literally untrue.. lmao. Pro-life healthcare centers provide post-birth care for child and mother, including financial support.
@@user-hb3qv1eh5e do they give enough money for you to raise child until its 18 years old? No i dont think so those mothers dont have enough money to raise the child, the foster care system is pretty terrible too. How i see it abortion is not a bad thing, in this world where it's so expensive to live especially with kids abortion is a way of saving the child too
You could always try taking responsibility for your own actions. You people really hate that word.
@@lynnettehardy4533 that would be having an abortion for an unwanted child. If you people could mind your own business, that would be great!
I have heard “ Stop having adult fun time ” over and over.
First of all, I have never heard that directed at a man. Men have just as much of a responsibility to use protection as woman. It also goes with the fact that woman are considered property of their husband and the expectation for woman to remain pure and not have much control of their adult fun time life.
Second of all, If you haven’t realized, Many people enjoy adult fun time. It isn’t just something people do to have kids. Plus, most encounters don’t result in children.
riiggghht
I get what you are saying, but I would suggest that since women are the ones who actually get pregnant, they may need to take extra steps in terms of preventing an accidental pregnancy. They can discuss birth control options with their partner(s), and encourage men to use condoms when needed.
Responsibility people. With the exception of Rape, every woman AND participating man is Responsible for their actions. And in the times that birth control (condoms, pills, shots, patches, etc.) Fail, be a man , be a woman and step up to the results. Have the child and do your best to raise the child regardless of how hard it will be. You choose to play the game, noone obligated you to play. America and some other countries are giving out too many get out Responsibility free cards. Yes, we should all support, in multiple ways, young pregnant woman or women with dirtbag boyfriends/husbands that are just about useless. At the same time council women on the fact that sex can lead to another unwanted pregnancy. Saying it's OK and we will be here in 12 months if you want another abortion is not good for anyone. Does the AA organization tell the member that it's OK and continue on the same path of Irresponsibility. I think not. Responsibility is on all of our shoulders.....men AND women. God bless all souls that hope for life.
Where in the US are women considered property? You made that up.
@@glennwatson3313 have you heard extreme right people
I was fifteen when I was raped and got pregnant, having to carry the baby to almost second term before I had my abortion. It was a necessary life saver, I honestly would’ve killed myself if I had a baby. Now I just can’t imagine the women who are denied it..
I am sorry that happened to you. I hope you are doing better 💗💗
good on you for doing what was right for you, it mustn’t have been an easy decision.
I’m pro life but I approve of your decision, as it is morally the right decision. You were at risk of death, and the baby was the threat, so you might have doubts of your decision, but you made the right choice. I hope your path to healing continues
neodreams well I am male soooooo ( but get your point)
Comedic Psychologist thank you for supporting other people’s deduction. people are allowed to be ‘pro life’ but it shouldn’t affect law and other people who don’t have the same beliefs. it’s a personal choice that should only affect you
The basic arguments of pro-lifer is religion but in a nation where we have freedom of religion does your religion have the right to infringe on my decision? What if someone is an atheist? Why does your belief have to take over my choices?
Jasmine Shah I never seen any other religious demanding everyone else follow their religious belief
You said it! Thank you! Religion kills and needs to resign its progress being apart of our laws and regulations. We are PEOPLE, not a witch hunt.
@@madambrianne religion has no ownership over people. If you believe it, you are disrespecting diversity.
@milldog65 Google American holocaust. That was religion based genocide by the Spanish, British and French. Whome are, mostly, catholic. Religion kills, divide people and poison the mind through fear.
I just think that people are entitled to their own belief but it shouldn’t be applied to everyone else let me believe what I want and you believe what you want
3:53 "It's not pro-life, it's pro-birth" sums it all up.
JAMES, you have no idea what you are talking about.
Put all the money supporting abortion into LIFE centers and associations, that’ll take care for single moms and every woman in a vulnerable situation. Why investing so much in death (?
@@dulcejocelyn7102 Great reply Dulce. it doesn't happen because the people that push the murdering of babies in the womb are inspired by Satan's death mandate to kill, steal and destroy.
@Pinecone Person Having been at the forefront of the issue for 40 years and done copious amounts of study into it, I do think I know what I am talking about. It may be a tough decision for some but for the majority it is a decision of convenience. How do I know? Reseasrch, research and research.
@Pinecone Person Yes, and I will give them to you when all the others who are pro-death give the source of their information. As yet none of them have.
“I prayed for Joseph to be free but I never specified how he should be free.” That's heartbreaking.
"The mothers are just forgotten shells"
That shit is so true I could just sob uncontrollably
Zap Brannigan you people can’t let anything be about just women for once, can you? when women are focused on, you have to say something about men. ridiculous.
@Zap Brannigan women can't get pregnant on their own so if men don't want to be just a paycheck, maybe those same men shouldn't bail on the organism that they had a 50% part in making...
Aww, poor mothers. The mother isn't the one being killed, the fetus is.
Zap Brannigan men have the choice to not get women pregnant as well
You are right. I'm one of them.
Why is the idea of separation of church and state thrown out the window when we talk about this. If your belief is that life begins at conception because the bible told you so that's fine. That belief cannot be turned into a law. Sometimes Americans sounds like the '3rd world' countries they despise.
czcams.com/video/jnAbwc_pHSY/video.html
AfroQueen
The Bible says that theft is wrong too. Should we stop banning that because of “separation of church and state?” If someone believes life begins at conception, then killing a fetus is killing a person, which is murder. They don’t want to ban abortion because the Bible told them to. They want to ban abortion because they see it as murder and they are anti-murder. Surely anti-murder is a valid secular stance.
In my opinion, there is a difference between "Pro-life" and "Pro-baby". Most of the "Pro-Lifers" are actually just "Pro-Baby", which means they feel as though a woman should give birth no matter the circumstances surrounding it. How can one say they are "Pro-Life" when they don't care about the baby's wellbeing after it is born? For example, you don't see many "Pro-Lifers" promoting the welfare of juveniles, single mothers, the homeless, widows, and orphans. So basically when a person says they are 'Pro-Life' they really just mean 'Pro-Baby'! I think people should care about the welfare of people throughout their ENTIRE lives, not just at birth! If you are going to insist that a woman keep her child as a moral thing, then just make sure that you help her raise that child as that is also the moral thing to do! Don't be a hypocrite, you can't push morality about some things and be hypocritical about others! And yes, I am a Christian: edifythebody.org/curriculums/
Except that there simply is no biblical justification for this nonsense. So the "pro-life" crowd is just making shit up and flailing around to use whatever they can to attempt to justify their fanatical and irrational stance.
@@elijahculper5522 Your attempt at making a point is irrational. There is a difference between theft (which is against secular law with a secular basis in secular property rights) and moral prohibitions against individual behaviour (adultery, honouring the Sabbath, not taking the Lord's name in vain) the basis for which are scriptural.
I’m pro choice because while I’d never get an abortion no matter what, I want those who decide that it’s the best choice for them to be able to be safe and at least a little more okay. Because it’s their body and they should decide what’s best for them and have whatever they need.
Abortion is never the best choice for the reason that a baby is murdered when it has done no wrong and the mother can suffer for years after the abortion with regret and depression.
Having a baby killed is NOT its their body. it is the body of another life in the womb, so where do people get the idea of killing it will solve their problem? We are worse than animals as they don't kill their babies in the womb.
@Gaming with Giss I have got a better idea. if she doesn't want that don't get pregnant. We managed that for years so why can't today's women do the same?
@Gaming with Giss And are you going to tell me that 60 million babies killed were product of accidents?
@Gaming with Giss First it is an accident then it is an inconvenience. Holey Moley. Hasn't anyone heard of responsibility?
I don't get how people care way more about a fetus whose brain isn't even developed yet than for a young woman/girl that has a whole future in front of them
They project their own feelings and desires on to fetuses and glorify their innocence
As someone who aged out of the foster care system I can tell you 100’s of horror stores. Kids viscously abused. Told daily that they weren’t wanted ... they’re the worst mistake... brutal abuse that you can’t even imagine.
A child is born in to a home where they aren’t wanted then your ripped from that hell and thrown in to a different hell.
Then you turn 18 and your put out. If your lucky maybe you’ll find a shelter to take you. Then I’ve seen these same kids come to foster pregnant 11,12,13 abused broken kids.. and you expect them to have babies? No one could protect them but you expect them to trust in god? GTFOOH
I’ve watched those “pregnancy centers” step in and help drug addicts stay pregnant till they deliver a premature drug addicted baby.. then disappear. Or turn around and criticize the young mother using WIC at the store. You can’t have it both ways!
It’s never the pro-life holy rolling Christians that foster. (I’ll let ya in on a little secret
If that’s what they claimed to be )their homes are usually the worst! It won’t take long till he’s at your door at night.. and he’s not here to help you say your prayers.
Instead of trying to save a clump of cells maybe we should focus on helping the living breathing kids that need us now.
The young mothers that need our support.
Landon Taylor YES 110% agreed ❤️❤️
YES!!!!! Thank you for this, my brother is from the system himself and luckily he wasn’t abused as much as the rest of them. They picked favorites and he luckily was one of them. But other kids were abused, raped, and got punishments like being locked in a closet, being forced to eat food, given medicine overdoses, and shagging in front of the other kids. It was really sad and I hope they’ve been exposed. Thank god he ended up with us when he did because so many of the foster families were in it for the money
@supalonely one example of someone who got out of that childhood. While there are thousands of stories that dont end up fine. And you are only looking at the child. Focus on the mother, why should she be forced to give up her health, her energy, her mental stability, her job for a clump of cells that wont know what its going to miss
agreed👏👏👏
basicgurl even so, just because oprah is successful doesn’t mean she isn’t affected by what she suffered through as a child
It's better to abort a child without consciousness than giving that child a life of neglect and abuse for years.
@ricky roach
Do you think that those people who abort their child would even try to give them a good childhood? They'll just be abandoned, and would wander between foster homes. Most of them if not all would have a life of hell.
Besides, people like rape victims...do you think that they wish to conceive their rapist's child?
@@UnripeApple2003
Okay I'm a Feminist but I'm also adopted. Your comment is bringing me close to tears.
Look. I'm a Democrat. 70 years ago, my party ENCOURAGED women in the lower class and women of color to abort they're babies, because they would be a burden to society. Now it's considered Feminism. As a Woman, as an adoptee, as a Feminist I am insulted. I agree, we seriously need to improve conditions for the lower class and provide basic human rights for people of color. But aborting a whole generation because of they're class or race is not a solution. They can rise from the ashes and make it to the top no matter what background. I'm disgusted.
@@schnitzelberry
I can understand you, people in my country used to abort female child because they thought that they were a burden, and that is why I believe while abortion should be legal, there should still be certain systems to check that people don't misuse it and know that aborting a fetus is no laughing matter, they shouldn't become careless.
@@UnripeApple2003
Actually I can somewhat agree with that. I am Pro Life but I believe that if it threatens the life/health of the mother, it should be her fundamental choice. I also believe that if she was a victim of rape/incest it should also be her choice. And she should be allowed to be provided information of what she's about to do, without healthcare providers pressuring her into such a decision.
I'm happy you understand my point of view ✌
@@schnitzelberry
I think abortion should also be legal in the case of accidental pregnancies (failed condom, etc. ) and shitty people who would be the type to abuse their kids. Because at the end of the day, it is easy for an abusive parent to abondon and ignore their child, even if they go to prison, the trauma that the child received can never be undone. Why do that? Both the parents must be ready and understand the consequences and seriousness of having a child, if they can't then it would be better for them to abort it.
I was raped, had my first positive pregnancy test, & decided to keep child. I was nearly homeless at the time. I miscarried. I had chosen a name for the child, was prepping everything myself. I found out I would have to go out of country to have my child bc in my state, a rapist can sue & has won full custody. I was prepping to buy a flight to get out, bc that would give my child citizenship w/another country & prevent the rapist from being able to to sue for custody domestically. I was getting therapy 3x a wk to cope w/the rape, but suddenly being told afterwards first “you’re pregnant” & then “you’re not pregnant” was worse. It was a ray of light to me to be as Marcus Aurelius said, “the best revenge is to be unlike him who caused the injury.” Frankly, having been through the experience, the painful thing is to have a person tell me that the worst thing that could have happened to any child of mine is to have been born to me as a mother. I can tell you the politics of the people who have repeatedly told me that with 95% accuracy. They are all pro-abortion. I survived attempted murder by my rapist. He tried to strangle me to death & while he left handprints on my neck, & though I lost consciousness, he failed to kill me. To feel the heartbeat of another person & to claim that it is best to allow them to die, for me is simply condemning a child for the crimes of the father. I cannot do that.
I will never understand how someone can be pro-life and support the death penalty. That's just pro-birth and anti-science. I identify as pro-life, valuing all life from conception until natural death, and all stages in between. But I also recognize that I can not judge a woman for the choice she made to have an abortion. I fall left on the political scale, as the right usually does value all life. I will fight to protect all life. That is what being pro-life really is.
.
If you value all life, then you WOULD have a problem with abortion, as that baby IS life.
@@jesussaves6625 a women should have more rights than an unborn fetus
Fetuses are alive how is that anti science
@@alaraarmenyan7396 they should have equal rights
" They allowed us to hear his heartbeat until it was no more. "
I got goosebumps , I can't even imagine how sad and miserable she must have felt as a mother . May his son rest in peace.
I don't get why they are forcing strangers to have a kid as if its theirs🤷🏽♀️
@milldog65 its not murder to hit pause on a bundle of cells. plus what if health is at stake? both my grandmother and mother had to terminate their last pregnancies because it would've ended with them sick in hospital for the whole pregnancy and/or both them and their babies dead anyway. My grandmothers womb failed, they never found out what was wrong with my mother except that she was gravely ill. despite the fact their pregnancies would most likely have killed them or disabled them for life, people like you harassed them and told them the baby's life was more important than theirs, even though the babies were likely to die. sickos like you just want people to carry a baby for as long as they can til their body gives out. if YOU'RE so interested in other people's offspring you're gonna need to get your shit in order and make a lot of money to support all those kids. No? not your problem? not possible? then shut the fuck up and stop acting like anyone else is going to do it. abortion is a right and a necessity.
milldog65 that’s still forcing them to have it
milldog65 How do you know the child wants to be born? In that sense forcing a child to be born is just the same as having an abortion...
@milldog65 Because I can tell you what I want, try asking that to an unborn baby...
Niyah W no one is forcing anything the parents had a choice to create the baby and then give birth to that baby, if you can’t raise the child properly give it to a foster home or an adoption Centre
When I hear that a woman could receive the death penalty for an abortion, that made me mad as hell. Why just the women? She didn’t have an immaculate conception. There was a man that got her pregnant. We all know if you have heterosexual unprotected sex, there is a chance a pregnancy may be the result. Where is his death penalty warning? Where is his death sentence for not protecting himself?
And if a pregnancy is a result of a rape or some sexual assault, there should be no judgement and she should be allowed to abort the clump off cells if she wants.
When it comes to a woman’s body, it’s just that... her body. No man or woman has any right to tell a woman what she can or can not do with her body. Period.
If you are pro life, great. Don’t have an abortion.
As a vegetarian, I feel eating or wearing animals and animal byproducts is murder. So I am forcing ‘you’ to not eat and wear animals anymore. They also have lives, feelings and can sense pain and loss. Yet you can justify that for survival. Vegetarians and vegans are proof you don’t need to murder animals for survival.
I wish I could like this more than once
There is no laws of what men do with there bodies. Not fair
Hi I’m vegan and I act as a proof
@@teenabaskar7000 damnn, imagine
Our society holds human life to a higher regard than animal life. Would you rather save a drowning baby or a drowning puppy? I would save the baby, no questions asked.
"They allowed us to hear his heatbeat until it was no more"
I absolutely have no words how sick in my stomach I felt. People are always selfish of whatever they believe or feel because they have never experienced something tragic or difficult in their lives.
And the most selfish are those who support abortion because they don't care a baby is going to be murdered who did not ask to be born and has done no wrong. We are worse than animals because they don't abort their babies.
@@s-truth you do know there are other species where animals eat their young?
@@sonalipatel8832 I raise that point when homosexuals claim there are 1500 species that are homosexual and ask them if they are going to eat their young because animals do. So far no takers.
@@s-truth The point they’re trying to make is that it’s just in their nature, not that they’re copying other species. As humans we’re technically part of the animal kingdom, there isn’t really a physical separation between ourselves and what we consider to be animals. The difference is just that we’re also more aware of ourselves as a species. I honestly don’t understand why people like yourself have such an issue with homosexuality, it really doesn’t affect you at all
@@elj955 i usually am not so hostile but only answer i can give you is that he's miserable as fuck and wants to project negativity onto others. if they got the energy to spout bs unprovoked, they're not as well-adjusted as they think they are.
fine, then why don't they adopt the "child" if they care about them so much
Garlic Bread From Olive Garden true
How can we if it’s gets killed
gold3nstar girl you ain’t adopting none of these kids🤣especially if they are over the age of ten. Y’all barely go in those adoption centers enough as it is
Aloe believe what you want hun 😂😂
@@vera5171 periodt
My biggest problem with the situation is what about women who were raped and got pregnant or children that were molested or raped and got pregnant!!!!!!! What about a woman who accidentally got pregnant meaning the birth control she use did not work or what about when the pregnancy can be dangerous to mother and child. We all know that protection is not 100% proof. HER BODY HER CHOICE! In my opinion I feel like there is a bigger agenda behind this, ijs💅🏽
I was gonna say the say the same thing, im standing ten toes down with what you said.
@@Iyona96 thank you, you from Florida huh
According to them the raped child should suffer because it was a gift from god.
Fuck these people.
Yes. Also fetus vs baby. Not viable vs viable. Seed vs tree
@Elisa Castro They are humans, the mothers just believe that their life would be really bad. Maybe she's too young, maybe she is suffering because of the abuse she passed, maybe she is in a bad financial position, maybe she has a genetic sickness she doesn't want to pass on. There are various reasons, but this is mostly for the babies and mothers to have a better chance
Church is separate from state, simple.
Omg such a weak arguement, you prob have not read what thomas jefferson wrote.
Fu*** church should stay out of the government
@@janefonda3749 you do know that that was ment to keep government out of church not the other way around
every day at least one person DIES giving birth. and many more pass away due to pregnancy complications. Carrying, delivering, and raising a child is a hard thing. The cost of childcare, $272,049 is the average amount spent on raising a child to age 18
this not to mention the mental and physical strength this takes.
Every day someone does after being assaulted. By your "logic" we should be able to take a gun and shoot anyone else walking down the street because someone MIGHT turn around and attack us at some point.
Do you even know what adoption is?
As a former passionate pro-lifer who stood in picket lines, my dedication was converted when I discovered that most states with stricter abortion laws actually have higher abortion rates. Abortions have been steadily declining in America, with less than 600,000 in 2017, the lowest since 1973 and significantly lower than most years in the 1960s when abortions were still illegal. What convinced me in the end was the Netherlands which has one of the loosest approaches to abortions, even allowing them to teens without parental consent, and yet they have one of the lowest rates in the world (far lower than the US). They choose to start a healthy regimen of sex education by age five and allow easy and affordable access to birth control. They also have much better support systems for low income families. These are the true defeaters of abortions. Banning it simply drives it underground, where in 1969 an estimate 1.5 million abortions took place illegally in the US with approximately 5,000 maternal fatalities according to the Washington Post. Women have been drinking bitter herbs to end pregnancies since Leviticus. You cannot stop it by banning it, you can only prevent it by education, accessible alternatives and resources which make it less needed.
What do rates have to do with anything? I find your claim that you used to be pro-life pretty sus. Abortion kills an unborn baby, if you were pro-life you would know this, so I don't see how abortion rates in the US declining would translate into you no longer wanting people to not murder their offspring.
@@michaelmannucci8585 it's a more sustainable solution than outrightly banning abortion which further excercabates the problem you are trying to solve. Basically, by trying to make it less of a crime to have abortion. People will have less of a need to abort an unwanted child.
@ImOnIt4272 Yes I agree, but conservative policies criminalize abortions. People choose to not abort based on moral values. But not everyone shares those moral values.
I'm Dutch. I think all laws should be thought of like this. Making abortion, birth control, sex education more accessible and having a good support system will lower the amount abortions, unwanted pregnancies and unwanted children. But the same for punishments of crimes. If you look at the crime numbers in Sweden and the amount of criminals that repeatedly commit crimes after punishments, it's lower then any other countries. We should punish shorter, educate people in prison and let them keep their humanity. The death sentence should not exist anymore in this day and age. Healthcare is cheaper in countries were it's accessible and free for all. Economies are more successful when there is less of a division between rich and poor.
Don't base your policies and laws on faith, culture, emotion, but look at science, other cultures and see what laws and policies are most efficient for your country as a whole. Everyone is happier when everyone has enough. Economies work better when everyone has enough. Prison systems work better if they are aimed at preparing inmates at a successful return to society.
@@michaelmannucci8585 I marched in Teens for Life. Attended rallies, stood in picket lines. I'm also a mother, and a woman who chooses to research. ...
1) You only believe it's a baby if you are Catholic or if your Protestant views were altered in the 1970s when Protestants aligned with Catholics to get more clout in their desire to reimpose Segregation.
2) Abortion was the Catholic stance and Evangelical leaders adopted it for more political clout in their pursuit of legalized Segregation. In 1974, the Dallas Theological Seminary even released a treatise stating that Christians follow the Jewish viewpoint of life beginning at birth, not conception. The view only changed in 1977 as Segregation was attempted for the final time, struck down by SCOTUS in 1978. Evangelicals kept the Pro-Life stance after that.
3) So if you aren't Catholic, your simplistic idea that abortion murders a baby, stems from religious leaders using this concept for political clout to push Segregation laws back onto the books.
4) A woman carries a Zygote, later a Fetus. It relies on her body, depriving her of nutrients and if unhealthy, potentially puts her life at risk. A life? Yes. So is the deer your buddies hunted, or the ant you stepped on. A baby? Not until it's born, by Jewish law (God's chosen people).
“‘Let it be with me.’ *MARY. GAVE. CONSENT.”* Excellent point!!!
Overworked CNA dumb cuz Mary didn’t have sex. Totally different context
So even if she would say no it wouldn’t be any form of abortion.
crystal gonzalez Mary gave consent to put her life on the line to carry a fetus. She could have easily died in pregnancy or delivery. Especially that long ago. She gave consent for her body to be used.
@@warriorgirl126 and
simply not being married, she could've been stoned to death. Mary risked a lot
fortheone4 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Cried when Joseph’s mom was talking. She’s a strong women and I wish her all the peace and love in the world. I’m not religious at all but I do believe that I am not “higher” than anyone else and that I do not have a right to say who gets to live and who gets death. Just like I have no right to dictate the choices of other women. The only right I have is to myself, I’m responsible for myself (I don’t have children yet) and I only have the right to say what I need to do in order to live my true honest life.
This series is so underrated, it gives me hope that humanity isn't as bad is feels a lot of the time.
Wow... Joseph's mother got me...i couldn't imagine hearing my child's heart like when in utero but knowing it's the last.
Taking out a seed is not the same as chopping down a tree
How about we don't compare human life to simple organisms like plants?
@@Irisicaaa how about we agree to disagree
@@xxhalfemptyxx7713 Okay, ignore science then. Basically be a liberal flat-earther.
@@Irisicaaa im not a liberal, nor a republican, and i belive that the earth is a sphere.
HinaHina bro that’s what we call a straw man argument stay on topic smh
"god wasn't helping me pay the bills" i love that.
Why do you love that? Do you think that what happens in this world, with our flesh, is the be all, and end all of existence?
Yes and because God can see hearts and intentions and she believes God should give her handout. He’s leaving her as she is. When you truly believe in God and he sees that he is always there for you.
Alexandria
God knows we need food, water, shelter.. etc. the creator knows his creation. But when you moan and whine and have this “woe is me” mentality then you stay in that mentality.
@@loverofjesus4856 Your mentality and the fact that you are unable to give food to two children are two different things! In fact she had a great mentality acting upon her best judgement! Was it the right one?Llet that be her problem. But it is certainly better than just letting everything happen to her while life goes by she ( and small children) suffer because she didn't act.
Lover of Jesus So what, be grateful for starving and god will help you?
This series has truly challenged me and made me rethink and change a lot of what I believed.
I have always had the conversation about abortion but never about death penalty. Truly opened my eyes.
The argument of whether or not the fetus is alive is not a productive argument. We are talking about whose life we should value more, the women or the children. Bringing science into this and saying that the cells are considered alive and therefore should have human rights makes no sense. Some people believe that life starts at conception or when the fetus develops a conscience. What people should be focusing on is how we can stop unwanted pregnancies and decrease the number of women getting abortions. Not about ending a safe and legal practice which many women need.
Lastly, the whole pregnancy should be a punishment for women having sex makes no sense. The Data shows that the majority of abortion patients (60%) were in their 20s, and the second-largest age group was in their 30s (25%). Not to mention most of the women having abortions are in relationships. These women were not sex addicts or idiots who forgot to use birth control. These were women who knew that having a child would affect them financially or their health. Using punishment as an argument on why abortions should not be banned is horrendous. It shows that you do not genuinely care about the unborn child but rather that you care about spiting these women. If you're going to talk about abortion do it with sincerity for both the women and the unborn child.
Sources
www.umassmed.edu/news/news-archives/2019/05/who-are-the-1-in-4-american-women-who-choose-abortion/
www.guttmacher.org/report/characteristics-us-abortion-patients-2014
The argument is about human rights. All innocent human beings (born and unborn) should have them - the most fundamental right being a right not to be killed.
And yes I agree :"the whole pregnancy should be a punishment for women having sex makes no sense." - the law telling someone not to kill a child, born or unborn, isn't about punishing anyone, it's about PROTECTING vulnerable human beings.
It's those for abortion that have no sincerity for the unborn child. It's those against abortion that run places that help pregnant women keep their babies.
If only people were this enthusiastic about climate change.
Unfortunately too many people use the bad logic of “if I can’t see it, it doesn’t exist!!” so climate change won’t be taken seriously until we’re living like the humans on Wall-E, living in space because the Earth is an uninhabitable wasteland
Thank you
@Miss Cute why are u against my rights to control what I want to do with my body and my life! It's not murder, they haven't even lived yet
@Miss Cute it is a clump of cells after fertilization. Woman's body womans choice. If u don't like abortion that's fine but u have no right to tell other ppl what to do with there body's. A feotus hasn't lived yet and they can't even have memory till 3 years after birth. Getting rig of something in ur body that u don't want and could impact ur life forever is reasonable. What if a woman gets raped and then they are pregnant?? They should not have to keep it. What if there are complications and the baby could cause the pregnant women to die? Should the woman die??
@Miss Cute so if I stamped on a sperm cell does that mean I've killed someone? If I stamped on a clump of cells that was developing does that mean I've killed someone. By no means is having an abortion an easy or painless choice for the pregnant women who wants it. What if that baby would have to grow up in a toxic home and ppl? I'm sorry but ppl like u are sick. Keep Ur options to urself. Not everyone is religious
Oh there is a simple answer to why Pro-Life supporters tend to be hypocritical in regards to other life-related issues: The unborn is super convenient compared to advocating for other groups like the poor or the sick. Unlike the sick and the poor, the unborn won't complain about how your political actions effects them nor make you deal with any of the cultural baggage that is often attached. Unborn won't demand obligations or reparations. Advocating for the unborn is wonderful when you don't want to accept uncomfortable truths from the mouths of the same group you're supposedly fighting for.
HitomiNoRyu
From my experience, most pro life voters do care about the sick and poor. They wish the gop did more to help children and families. They want to support vulnerable people. But they see abortion as a moral equivalent to murder. If you believed that one political party was in favor of legalized murder, all other policies would become unimportant. A ton of the people who care about ending abortion are single issue voters. They would simply never vote for a candidate they perceive as in favor of murder, so they stomach the rest of the Republican platform to vote prolife. I think if democrats softened their rhetoric on the issue, they’d be way more competitive in the South and Midwest because Christian values voters could vote on issues other than abortion and be sympathetic to the DNC’s platforms on healthcare, foreign policy, childcare, and welfare.
In my opinion, there is a difference between "Pro-life" and "Pro-baby". Most of the "Pro-Lifers" are actually just "Pro-Baby", which means they feel as though a woman should give birth no matter the circumstances surrounding it. How can one say they are "Pro-Life" when they don't care about the baby's wellbeing after it is born? For example, you don't see many "Pro-Lifers" promoting the welfare of juveniles, single mothers, the homeless, widows, and orphans. So basically when a person says they are 'Pro-Life' they really just mean 'Pro-Baby'! I think people should care about the welfare of people throughout their ENTIRE lives, not just at birth! If you are going to insist that a woman keep her child as a moral thing, then just make sure that you help her raise that child as that is also the moral thing to do! Don't be a hypocrite, you can't push morality about some things and be hypocritical about others! And yes, I am a Christian: edifythebody.org/curriculums/
@@tdr.220 I think the better term would be "Pro-Birth" than "Pro-Baby"
The pro-life, pro-death penalty stance makes sense when you realize what it is really about: punishment. Conservatives love it. Having a child is a woman's just punishment for having sex. And the death penalty- of course they love that, it is the ultimate punishment! Viewed through this lens, their ideas are totally consistent.
Pro-life does have abortion as last result, but it would be really hard to access to, and very very last process.
I wonder if pro-life people won, and ended up having baby booms.
How big the mortality rate would be on pregnant women? Considering they would need to visit at least 3 doctors to see, if mother HAS to take abortion if they're in danger.
When I spoke to some family members who were complaining about how things are against their beliefs I asked them realistic questions and had to make them realize people aren't protesting to make others get abortions we are protesting against others taking away our choice and access. When fighting for the right to love who you love I said what if someone took away your right to love who you love. The objective is to preserve rights and access not to force others to utilize these rights and services. I don't know a single person campaigning for people to have an abortion but there are people campaigning for your choice and access to be taken away.
"We're all religious, we all have our ideas, or belief systems; until you don't." Very powerful and truthful line. I'm sure ol' Aldous Huxley would be proud of this line.
"It's only once a person is pregnant that they care about that pregnancy." Bruh. That hit me.
I don’t care about the women, I care about the child.
@@earienurnjd4506 I care about both....😑
@@earienurnjd4506 A friendly question if the woman did die after or while giving birth, who will take care of the baby? U may say family, ok but who will breastfed it?
@EqualSign wrong. Breastmilk is basically the child's first reliable source of vaccine that helps them build their immune system. Even formula milk can't totally replace breastmilk, look it up. It's not about the money even. Yeah, you can hrie as much mommies to give milk to the child, but then you didn't factor in the possible complications that might happen to the child. Basically ignorant, you.
@@earienurnjd4506 i care more about the one that contributes to society than the one that does nothing but shit its pants and cry.
With videos like this.... I'm forever grateful that I was born into a country that doesn't have abortion control based on religion *AND* can make my own decisions about sex, birth control etc.
Thank you Finland 🙏🏽🇫🇮❤️
I’m in Sweden right now, and go to Ålandislands tomorrow, and the Finland I wish I could stay her.e
Torille!
I wish I was there
...and no death penalty.
Jakob Schulze 😂😂😂
If I have an unwanted baby and a pro lifer interferes to convince me to keep it, I will only do so if they choose to adopt the baby right then and there. If you don't spontaneously want a child, neither do I.
Many of us will adopt your baby or find someone who can.
Pro life: Save the fetus, throw away the child
Say it louder for the ones with their heads in the sand!
Okay, I'm pro-life and conservative but I have to admit this is one point that the pro-choice crowd makes that's a valid point - many conservatives don't care about helping out families that need it. I'm socially conservative, but economics is a different story. We need improved social welfare programs, a universal healthcare system, and an end to income inequality (nobody can convince me that CEOs work 10,000x harder than the workers keeping the companies running).
@@goliraman656 Many of us are for exceptions such as rape, incest, or the mother's life is in danger. But getting an abortion because a baby will put an end to her hedonistic lifestyle, that's morally wrong. And one area where I differ from most of the pro-life crowd is that I support social welfare programs and a complete restructuring of the economic system that would negate any economic reasons for abortion.
Vivien Bissell the system isn't good for children and neither is putting them in adoption, people barely adopt anymore and in some states its illegal for gay people to adopt. And you arent ending a life its a fetus.
Vivien Bissell It hasnt? Its a clump of cells thats smaller than shrimps💀 The cancer tumor and the fetus are the same thing so are you against curing cancer too? a fetus starts living AFTER birth not before birth. And abortion is maximum before the 12th week (depends where you live)
Grace is your best journalist. Looking forward to more from her.
I love your work & this video hits really close to home. I lived in TX as a teenager & my mother took me to the abortion clinic without giving me a choice once she found out. At 49, I've just relocated back to TX due to Covid-19 times, & I am still pro-choice . My mother's view has only intensified re: pro- life as she voted for that horrific TX abortion bill stating that if it had been against the law she wouldn't have forced me to abort. Honestly, it's a conversation we both try to avoid as it's always fruitless. Re: death penalty, I never really knew where I stood until a few years ago when I heard of so many innocent people on death row. After this video I am even more solid in my stance against the death penalty. Again, thank you for this video. Keep on rocking it!
I am sorry you had no choice. No one should have their choice taken away. I hope you are well.
As a Texas native thank you for this video. The law regarding abortion made me leave the state for good, I don’t feel safe living there anymore
See, my parents are pro-life, and they just recently told me they’d disown me if I ever got an abortion regardless of how they pregnancy started
Sorry to hear that 🤗. Do what you have to do. You are living your life noone else is living it.
Same bb
Shoot if my parents said that...i'd disown them.
If you were ever in that situation you don't have to tell them.
Disown them. No religion or its followers are more important then you and your well being.
"I don't see anywhere in the bible that says you get to only care about innocent life."
Bible thumpers aren't the only people who disagree with abortion. That's a strawman set up by liberals so they can ignore the actual issue on abortion.
@@Irisicaaa intersting
I’d not give a shit about the Bible and I don’t like abortion.
@Marcos Estevez How are we brainwashed? Apparently morality is brainwashing people, what has society condescended into?
Got any more stupid comments up your sleeve?
The core of this argument really isn't about pro-life, pro-choice. It's really pro-choice, anti-choice. You can be pro-life, but believe it isn't your right to enforce your beliefs on someone else who believes differently.
I don't like using pro-life for people who would want me and so many others dead and want to create needless suffering and harm. They don't care about saving lives.
@@evem6154 exactly. I don’t want to call you pro life as you believe that god should take me off this earth to hell.
@@DustMoons Fully agree.
'Pro-life' people have so far told me:
-That it is my job to die for a baby if necessary (when I told them that my body is wrecked from my (freely chosen) births and can't handle another)
-That pregnancies from rape are a gift one should be thankful for (sometimes with a 'you asked for it', 'you should be thankful a guy found you attractive enough to risk that', or my personal favorite that I still have saved up 'God saw that you weren't fulfilling your role and duty as a woman so he send an angel to make you realize your mistake, learn from it'
I am still not sure if that person meant just being a mother or also a wife, as they went on and on about evil single women depriving poor men of wives.
-That tokophobia doesn't exist and/or people who are suicidal should be held captive until the birth of the child which than can go up for adoption, basically going full 'use people as incubators' (oh and afterwards? just let them go, if they kill themselves then they at least don't kill the precious fetus)
-that they are fine with abortions if the person getting it is shot afterwards
-that there are no abortions ever needed for medical reasons, even if the pregnant one is a literal child, and people just lie about how hard, dangerous, and painful pregnancy and birth are
That always feels like they care about lives so much. And weirdly, very few were in favor of things that actually help make abortion less needed (paid parental leave, a living wage, better social programs, free long-term contraception, etc) and quite a few were adamantly against such things.
@@evem6154 That’s disgusting that people could even think like that. Fortunately I haven’t had too many bad experiences with pro lifers (Just the religious ones telling me I’m going to hell.). Although their was this one time a man said “You should die for your unborn child because if you do it will be natural, even if the child only lives for a few hours.”.
@@DustMoons I have been around for a few years and have had countless discussions on the topic.
Yeah, I have had people repeatedly telling me to die, EVEN IF the fetus dies with me. Because that's natural. That's their deities will. Or karma or something.
Sometimes with 'if you would only pray and accept Jesus into your heart your problems would magically be fixed' 🙄
The worst I had was someone calling themselves 'a warrior for humanity and a protector of life' who straight up told me Lina Medina, the girl who became famous because she had a baby at 5 years should not have been allowed an abortion because if she menstruated, she was deemed ready by God to have kids and she must have seduced her baby-daddy
This is a way nicer summary of the three paragraph rant.
Yeah, if you are around a while, the filth will show itself. But I find it useful to remember that quite many people can and do change their mind. There is always hope.
Grace: "and good looking"
Me: *blushes as I was just thinking about how cute and good looking she is*
Also Me: How did she know...?
This is not about „saving life’s“ and „caring for the children“ this is about controlling women and I’m hella happy to not live in the USA.
@Bow Legged no I wanna leave this shitshoe called america
wow, hella has spread far from the Bay Area
Every Pro life fool should listen to the lyrics of this song ! : ( czcams.com/video/vVXIK1xCRpY/video.html
Kenadi Elise. The please leave
Glad you don’t live here. We don’t want fools like you in our great country
This series is honestly so good. As a non-American, I find the fact that your country still has the death penalty abhorrent. It's state-sanctioned homicide, as you called it in the video. The contradiction of self-proclaimed "pro-lifers" supporting the death penalty has baffled me for years, looking at this debate from the outside. Glad you're discussing this here. Keep up the great work, Grace, this is so needed!
don't forget about america putting immigrant children in cages and supperting from their parents
So you believe a man that rapes beats sodomizes and then murders a five year old child should be allowed to live. And that you should be liable for paying for his continued life of three meals a day a recess time access to a tv etc???? This is what is wrong with your country
@@JustMe-tl3ex I don't believe he should be "allowed" to live, no; I believe he has a fundamental right to life, and that no other person has a right to take that away (that's what fundamental right means). I'm not against life in prison, it's just murder I'm against.
Would be curious how you would punish severe criminal cases.
wazzup20011983 With a prison sentence, like it’s done in many other countries as well as in those US states that don’t practice the death penalty.
"Then let it be with me, as You have said."
Whoa. The stillness I felt within.
Whoa.
Coming from UK where there is abortion and no death penalty i have some questions for the US. If you are so keen to avoid abortions why do you also argue against sex ed and contraception? Things that would reduce the unplanned and unwanted pregnancies, would drop abortion rate right off. Here I can get birth control pills, coil etc on NHS. I know the agruement is that morally 'just say no' is why you don't give teens the info they need, but if avoiding abortions was important enough for you then you would do good sex ed.
Costs of healthcare through pregnancy - this as well as the lifetime cost of raising a child is going to be an issue where insurance cover limited. And how about some social justice for the poorest so that if that pregnancy occurs they don't have to choose between the the born and the yet to be born, we still need to tackle that wealth divide here in UK, but this are things that would impact on the number of abortions that requested. But I guess that is too solialist for the conserative dominated anti abortion lobby. They prefer to ban something than ask why people feel this is the only option, and how their circumstances can be altered.
Late abortions - here that would only be if medical issue with baby or if the fetus has died in the womb. Because access to abortion is available decisions can be made earlier in the pregnancy. In contrast when I read of all the legal steps to get an abortion in some states and how far need to travel to a clinic, and costs all along the way, some can't get the resources together in time for an early abortion. By limiting access the pro-lifers make it more likely that an abortion will be at a later stage.
And if you think abortions will go away completely if you make a law, I ask you to consider what in UK was called a 'back street abortion' - not clinical, and many women permenantly damaged or dying as a result. No one wants an abortion, it is never a 'good thing' but they are at times needed.
Meanwhile - death penalty, why? As long as society and the legal system means that the poorer, the lighter and the mentally unwell are more likely to end up in jail and on death row, how can we sanction that death. They are punished by prison, communities are protected from them, that is enough. I was a teenager when I first realised that the same people shouting pro life for a forming bundle of cells also argued for more and more executions. I didn't find that consisent then, and I don't see how it can be consisent now.
Glad Grace is doing this kind of journalism. Loved her on TYT.
+alexisvillacerrillos So glad you're enjoying the content!
What is TYT? I really like Grace and would love to see more of her.
Mthoughtz 1 it’s an independent media channel on YT. They are progressive news. I highly recommended to check out some clips on here, CZcams. :-) if you like, become a member and DL their app.
I love my life. Im 26, I had an abortion when I was 19. The best decision I've ever made. Im proud that I had a voice and could make the right decision for myself, and myself only. Im pro choice and I will always support women who wants to have control of their own body and life.
@Smokey the problem with religious nuts is that they preach empty platitude but not realizing that they are demanding a human to give up their internal organs and suffer to bring out another human from inside their body. It is a choice, not a moral duty. Unless you are morally obliged to give up your organs to save another life? I'm sure you can live with one lung and one kidney, and I am sure there are people who need it to live. If you have more than one lung and one kidney and haven't had them ripping out of your body while being conscious and you preach about childbirth, you're a hypocrite.
@Smokey I don't believe in no God. For me there is or will never be a God.
@ricky roach I don't believe in anything but science and love. And that we are just microscopic pieces with opinions and free will. I don't care what happens when I die, I believe it goes black, like it was before I even was born. Imagine how peaceful it would be.
@Smokey God doesn't exist
@ricky roach I'm religious myself but science is a thing, and abortion isn't murder. Go pick and choose other things from the bible to fit your beliefs who harm other people
Anti abortion isn't " pro life " it's pro birth.
that's how I've viewed it for a long time, like pro-choice really does mean pro-choice but the other side is really reaching
I was once a major proponent of the death penalty. I've worked in public safety for over a decade and a half and have seen the worst of humanity. Then I saw how many people have been exonerated and how often laws like the one in my home state are abused to send people who didn't deserve it to the chamber...I now only support death in extreme cases, such as serial killers and mass murderers. I was also once anti-abortion. Being a paramedic and seeing what the extreme restrictive laws have done has drastically changed my views on that. Learning biology beyond the high school level was very eye-opening.
I completely changed this comment. Enjoy reading all of the comments and being confused!😉
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milldog65 well, what if the pregnancy kills the mother. What then?
well I'm guessing u've never been a mother then
Skyler Grey // Melanie Martinez \\ K-12 2% actually
@milldog65 You definition of equal is "The mom dies and the baby lives". Yeah, really equal.
A woman’s body, a woman’s choice.
Shaun Pattinson YES thank you I’m sick of the people wanting to control other women and f*** up their life, like it affects their own life
And a being is not technically live if it doesn’t have a heart beat there for it’s body being formed until that point, there for it’s not murder
110% agree with you
FACTS.
exactly, thanks man 💖
The life in her body isn't her. So she can't choose for her.
it is not her body and abortion should only be done if it is a risk for the mother and in a case of rape however, using abortion as birth control is just a madness
Thank you so much for all you're doing to shed light on these much-needed discussions. I do believe it is inevitable that there will be change, and you are an important forerunner of a much more compassionate and inclusive paradigm shift in all areas of our culture. Much gratitude to you, and blessings on your journey! ⭐💛⭐
Most of the pro-life Christians would never even consider adopting or fostering a child. If they’re so pro-birth and pro-life and care so much about children, then they ought to practice what they preach.
To me getting an abortion is unimaginable that’s exactly why I’m pro choice because if a woman is getting an abortion it means she must be so unbelievably desperate and cannot have that baby, NO woman makes that decision lightly.
milldog65 there’s no “easy” way out this doesn’t exist
milldog65 you can’t have such a one sided view to something so complex people have abortions for a multitude of reasons
milldog65 If you choose to only see it as simply and bluntly as cold blooded murder then that’s your choice, I don’t imagine you’d have much room to see any complexities in that. I however don’t view abortion so simply. Also I’m assuming you’re a vegetarian?
+unicornmagic Well said!
there have been many people to get abortions because they claim they’re “not ready”. if they truly weren’t ready, why did they allow themselves to get pregnant?
Joseph’s mother is one of the strongest and inspirational women I’ll ever hear from. Her testimony on her son made me so sad
She strong a steel! My god! She moved me to tears!
I absolutely love how Grace conducts these interviews. I am a completely different religion than her, so I don't subscribe to many of her beliefs, but I have so much respect for the kind, open-minded way she examines controversial issues.
I recently left the Christian faith and she still moved me with her videos. I live in Texas and am horrified by our systems. I applaud her for exposing it.
The stupidity of this video is beyond parody.
This woman attempts to highlight “hypocrisy” among those who are pro-life AND also support capital punishment.
However, such a claim of hypocrisy necessarily draws a moral equivalence between an unborn child and a convicted murderer, which is obviously inane.
If a 15 year old girl who lived in a council estate with just her abusive drunkard father got pregnant, shouldn't she be allowed to abort..?
@Zane Drake Hi Zane Drake. Keep your grubby hands off my body. Keep your zipper zipped up. You can't BREED me...
@Zane Drake abortion isn’t a horrible thing. And regardless if a woman is raped or not, it should be a basic human right. How is forcing a woman to destroy her body and go through the extreme pain of labor not a war crime?
@Zane Drake and men shouldn’t have an opinion on abortion because it’s not there bodies. Birth, rape, pregnancy, are all things men will never experience or rarely ever experience. Imagine men who will never go through this extreme pain trying to tell you that you can’t choose a way out and that you HAVE to have a child the rest of your life and go through the pain of child birth. And giving birth to a child who will just get abused and raped or put in horrible foster homes seems a lot worse then removing a clump of cells and saving the life of a woman.
@@nyumyu4265 I agree with everything you expect that men don't or rarely experience rape that's just false
@@SomeGuy-df8gs apologies for saying it bad I didn’t mean to say never get raped, of course they do, it’s just extremely low compared to the rates women and children face rape. It’s a crime that can effect all but it is a crime that usually targets women.
That last interview was incredibly powerful. Thank you for sharing
+dednridgeway Thank you so much for watching!
“I just couldn’t choose between a child I didn’t know and a child I already had.”
Alright, so if she decides to have a baby and the man doesn’t want her to, then he doesn’t have to pay child support.
If she can make 100% of the choice, then she can take care of it by herself. 👍🏾
My money, my choice!
many of the anti-choice people are also in the same group that make prevention of pregnancy more difficult. how anti-woman do you want to be??
Is killing unborn babies an inherent and integral part of womanhood? That's the only way being pro-life would be anti-women.
Syd Lane
The interview with Stephanie refutes the talking point about how birth control prevents abortions. Birth control facilitates risky sexual behavior. And when birth control fails, abortion is the next step. If people choose to be abstinent, their birth control regimen is 100% effective and they don’t need abortion as a failsafe.
@@elijahculper5522 As a person who chose to be abstinent until marriage, I still advocate for comprehensive sex education and access to birth control. As much as I would like and encourage people to wait, let's face it, people are going to choose to have sex or not. The least we can do is properly educate people on the physical, emotional and spiritual weight of making the decision to be sexually active, the importance of enthusiastic consent, what healthy relationships look like, and provide them access to multiple types of contraceptives (both male & female). Provide free or lost cost IUDs and implants for long-term, more effective protection. It also needs to be said that waiting is perfectly fine so people don't feel pressured into being "left behind" by their peers.
They don’t want women to have sex lol. They don’t mind being inside a woman until she decides to start making her own choices.
@@elijahculper5522 How old were you when you got married? Some of us weren't lucky enough to find our life partner at 22 or 23 years old. I was 38 when I finally found him. And no, I sure as shit wasn't a virgin. But I was very safe about the sex I did have. Still, just because birth control worked for me, doesn't mean it doesn't fail for others. If your only solution to not wanting a baby is just to remain abstinent then you're exposing you're true agenda: Controlling women's sexuality. That's what's REALLY behind the pro-life movement.
Gotta tell you, I love these Refinery 29 videos the best. The ones where hard questions are asked and many of us need to start admitting we don’t know the answers, but want to move toward finding them. Thank you! ✌🏼 (BTW - you have the solution: Listen, think, understand. It’s getting everyone to do it calmly, thoughtfully, nonjudgmentally that’s really the problem.)
+lynno We're so glad that you're loving our content! Thanks for being here!
i'm in my mid teens.
i was molested for years from a very young age.
luckily when i was 12 i told someone before it went farther.
but if it had gone farther, i can't even imagine the terror of getting tested.
it coming out positive.
not having the ability to choose.
you can't imagine other's lives either.
can't imagine what they're going through. what they're dealing with. when the rent is due. where they're going to sleep tonight. what they're going to eat today, if anything.
that they're not ready. that it's endangering their own life, however that may be. not old enough. didn't want another child. can't support another child. that they can barely support themselves.
that they were raped, and now there's something inside them that should have never been there.
don't judge other's for their reasons. they don't need to tell you why. it's *none* of your business.
but if you do anyway, then you're an absolute piece of shit.
I’m so sorry that happened to you and I hope you’re doing better in life, thank you for sharing your story.
There’s a difference between killing someone who did something horrible and killing someone for no reason other than inconvenience
People don't seek abortion because a child would be "inconvenient", they do it because a child is *life-changing*.
Even if you don't raise a child, carrying a pregnancy to term has an unbelievable impact- physically and mentally. Some of these changes can be permanent. Many chronic medical conditions are treated with medication that harm fetal development, especially those that treat mental health. You cannot bring a pregnancy to term or raise a child if you aren't able to care for yourself. Especially if you're already a parent or caregiver.
Please do not over-simplify an extremely complex and personal choice.
I think many people who are pro-life have little to no knowledge about what the U.S. funded in Asia about 50 years ago... I am not saying one or the other is correct, but the hippocracy from the U.S. (and the UN and Sweden in particular) is something that people really deserve to know about as a U.S. citizen when addressing abortion rights.
In case you're curious, women were fighting for the right to choose their pregnancies, people were calling them baby murderers, yet the U.S. was funding the methodical culling of South Korean, Indian, and Chinese populations with the threat of revoking food aid to the starving populations if they did not cooperate, and their methods were to disperse birth control and provide full funding AND facilities to provide (and many times FORCE) abortions on the poorer populace in those countries. When that wasn't reducing the numbers enough, they found that since those cultures prefer a male heir, they funded research into sex determination which resulted in Chorionic Villus Sampling (CVS). They would provide these tests for free, abort the females, and then when they had a confirmed male they would leave it and pay women to submit to sterilization after they gave birth to their male heir.
This was the reason for that "one child policy" in China that you have likely heard about.
People were starving to death because of a population boom CAUSED BY a lack of education of the poor, and the solution was to systematically abort the poor's pregnancies, pay them (or often force them) in exchange for their fertility, install non-sterile and rejected (from the U.S. use due to safety concerns) IUDs into many Indian women without consent or even INFORMING THEM afterwards, and many more horrors.
Even though it is proven that just educating people results in lower birth rates.
*The main point I find so bizarre is that women were struggling for the legal right to abortion, while their government and elite sponsored the mostly forced and paid abortion over in Asia. Even when U.S. women have the legal right to abort, they are the ones that have to pay for the procedure, even though their own government was paying for it in other countries.*
Do you have a more reputable source? Haven't heard about all of this
@@stefansile6790 I know, right?! I was horrified when I found out about this happening. It is a MASSIVE problem in those countries because there is now a huge lack of women and it results in a lot of kidnappings and abuse. Here is a documentary that gives a good synopsis of the whole crisis: czcams.com/video/0uj6bDqAVJA/video.html
Many of the references mentioned are able to be looked up, like the involved companies/organizations, politicians, and medical staff. There are many reports, documents, audio recordings, and records about this event in history. If you want me to post some specifics, I can, but it'll take a while for me to sift through for the correct ones from reputable website sources. The big marker is the funding provided to the UN for their Population Fund. The US has revoked funding currently I believe, but they were by a huge margin the primary source of money.
This is an interesting dive. No wonder we have trust issues....
I learned about this in my Chinese Society class. So messed up and just sad.
They did this to U.S Citizens too... Look up eugenics, anyone not deemed having desirable genes (poor, person of color, not WASP) were mostly sterilized :'(. Women deserve the right to choose no matter where. Absolutely disgusting they spread it elsewhere too.
I've officially changed my mind on the death penalty. I'm no longer in favor of it. And further, I can't believe after all this time I've been pro-human rights, yet hadn't the sense to put 2 and 2 together to see why I was wrong.
TheChickenRiceBowl I’m glad you’ve been open minded enough to change your mind. Brightens my day.
@Smokey Cool, so what happens when people in power want to get rid of somebody so they just frame them for murder? As has happened before.
@Smokey why should they get the easy way out? Death is quick and in modern times painless. Being stuck inside till you die is difficult, the only thing is that prisons need is to be less fancy. If those prisoners had no access to entertainment and to each other they would live in hell. Nowadays a lot of prisons have TVs and books, the prisoners live together a big part of the day. And I get that is a good thing for people who commited a small crime. But some murderers should be locked away forever and they shouldnt get to live a nice life after what they did
@@nadiar.4638 totally agree
Examining your beliefs and admitting where you went wrong is a powerful, tough thing to do. I’ve definitely done it before. Good for you, and keep it up.
I was randomly searching for something on this topic and I was pleasantly surprised by how intelligent, emotional, and professional this video was. Thanks. I have been on the train of thought that takes me to resolve all societal problems with one answer. We all needed to be smarter. Our society needs to be better educated. We need to be discussing these kinds of complex issues in grade school.
“If you kill a killer, the number of killers stays the same”
A women's right to choose. End of conversation.
And man’s! A zygote takes two btw
What about the unborn woman's choice?
@@katiegeeish Its unborn you fucking dolt, they cant choose because they arent even alive. Yet you chucklefucks call it murder because you dont understand the difference between a clump of cells and a fully grown adult human being. Did you read the title of the video btw? You fucking idiots advocate murder of fully grown adult human criminals but cant deal with a clump of cells being terminated because you cant use logic, and your fee-fees get hurt when someone has to make an incredibly tough decision. Well, I have a tough lesson for you, the world is a harsh place and doesnt give two fucking shits about your feelings, and trying to change the laws because of that is asinine, wrong, disgusting, and will never happen because there are too many people who use logical reasoning to ensure that you crazed thought-nazis never get your way.
@@LeahBeth_1997 You are murdering someone at this very moment by not donating a kidney, part of your liver, bone marrow, a lung or even blood... And yet it is entirely legal for you to deny even blood to save even your children.
The debate of how moral would that choice be it's one thing, but it would be completely legal for you to deny the use of your body to save your already born, sentient child.
@@xion5514 I love how liberals are so appalled when somebody has a different opinion, it shows how immature some of you can be. Conservatives are expected to be kind when you have an opinion but you don't follow what you preach
How can you say you're pro life when you dont care about the situation and the lives women are living. If all life is equal, their lives matter too. Life isnt just about birth. If we lived in a world where resources, ongoing financial support, and equal opportunity to succeed existed we wouldn't need abortion but sadly we dont live in that kind of world.
It' about autonomy and freedom. Quality of life dicates mortality everywhere, how could it be morally corrupt to make the decision to not bring a child into a life where you can't afford to provide basic necessities or love. How can you not want the right to choose.
That's a good point. I'm conservative and pro-life but agree with you that we need improved social welfare programs, guaranteed basic necessities for everyone, and an end to income inequality. People are often baffled by my conservative socialist political views but to me it's the only ideology that makes sense. I do think though abortion exceptions can be made for rape, incest, and if the mother's life is in danger. But addressing economic issues is key to improving the quality of life for everyone.
@Speedzone Speedforce who gives you the right to decide who is innocent? And who says an innocent life is worth more than anothers? Point blank, one law shouldn't dictate the lives of so many women. No one should be trapped into motherhood and only 1-2% of women who originally planned to give a child up for adoption follow through with it. Some may have great lives afterwoods and feel grateful but there will always be those who won't, it's not up to you or anyone but the woman to decide for herself.
@@ErikaBell_Z Thank you Erika for sharing:)
First of all you failed biology my brother,, fetus CAN'T feel ANY pain before 24 weeks. It's like saying if you cut a paper it will feel pain...and second many people are forced into pregnancy and that's rape. And second when you will get raped at 12 dont get an abortion cuz its "hurting" something that cant feel any pain but that will kill you but yea who cares if you die.
@Speedzone Speedforce First of all you failed biology my brother,, fetus CAN'T feel ANY pain before 24 weeks. It's like saying if you cut a paper it will feel pain...and second many people are forced into pregnancy and that's rape. And second when you will get raped at 12 dont get an abortion cuz its "hurting" something that cant feel any pain but that will kill you but yea who cares if you die.
The death penalty is simply abhorrent. Taking someone’s life is either right or wrong. It certainly doesn’t become righteous when it’s done by committee! We don’t rape our rapists or steal from our thieves.
BluckKraken You are implying it’s either murdering them back or zero consequences? 🤷♀️ Of course there should be severe consequences
I never thought I'd ever get an abortion but at 32, after a very difficult second pregnancy that left me wrecked, I found myself pregnant again when my youngest was only 4 months. I was on birth control. My world came crashing down. My Obgyn had already told me that I although I would probably survive another pregnancy I would probably have permanent disability. My whole faith came crashing down. I realised that I wanted to live. I wanted to be there for my kids and husband, and yes, myself. I realised that until you're in that situation you don't understand. No-one should judge you because you judge yourself enough.
You’re so strong for going through that. It’s amazing how being in someone’s places can make you understand so much. Wishing you and your family the best :)
@@DustMoons Thank you. I just hope it makes some people think.
Most abortions have nothing to do with the woman's life being endangered. Most are done for excuses of convenience like money or it simply not being the right time for a child. Do you at least agree those excuses should be illegal? i.e. if they are not good excuses to kill a born child they are not good excuses to kill an unborn child... Also, the law telling someone not to kill their child, born or unborn, isn't about judging anyone, they are about PROTECTING an innocent human being.
@@mathildeyoung1823 It is not a human being until it can breathe on it's own. Even the bible says that. Until then there is no viability of life. I've known women who have had stillborn children or who have miscarried at 19 weeks. Are they then condemned as murderers because they were the carrier of the child? Is God responsible for the murder because, in God's words, he knew them before, he created them, and if the "baby" did not survive through no fault of the mother, is GOD THEN A MURDERER??? Answer me that question.
Are you going to help a grandmother who is told by her opiate addled prostitute daughter who doesn't believe in abortion that she has to look after her daughter's 5th child when it's born. I had to support that Grandmother, I had to hold her while she cried her eyes out because she was 74 and about to look after another baby on her own. It's obvious that you have never seen this side of life, that Child Safety staff see, that you are untouched by actual humanity, and that you will blindly go through life being piously Christian and therefore judgmental, not holding God as accountable for tragedy as you hold humans, even though they are "human" and therefore subject to flaws, whereas God has the power to take away all pain. why is the father not held equally as responsible, why can men refuse to take a paternity test, why isn't the son of rich parents able to get away with raping and impregnating young, usually poor and vulnerable girls and then walk away from any responsibility and actually have judges say in verdicts that they didn't want "his prospects" in life hindered. Until those inequalities in life are addressed don't come at me or other women for the sins of society. My take on abortion changed when a girl I went to school with got knocked up by her filthy rich boyfriend, who immediately dumped her and got another girl pregnant. One friend wanted an abortion, but her Christian parents made her have the baby, only to force her into adoption and wonder about her baby for the rest of her life. I'm 60 and that decision created more pain in her life than having an abortion would have. And the father. Oh, he went on to have a marvelous career, of course! Really I'd like to hear your take on things.
@@mathildeyoung1823 No I do not agree.
This is so well done. The lovely woman at the end speaking about her son was enlightening. I also liked the Methodist Pastor. I'm glad they didn't speak to men about this.
I want to applaud Refinery 29 & Grace for setting a stage where these extremely important topics can be viewed and challenged. Compassion and conversation should go hand in hand.
Do you think it's an emotionally manipulative tactic, that they chose such a case to feature (that of a man who should NOT be on Death row) instead of featuring someone like Ted Bundy? Do you think they were trying to manipulate the audience in any way, by making such a choice?
@The Four Horsemen In what way?
@@SydLane They're manipulating the audience by providing an example of a person who didn't pull the trigger and was sentenced to death? Or stating the fact that 1 in 10 people executed were later exonerated? The fact that a single innocent soul has EVER been executed unjustly...is enough of a reason to abolish the death penalty.
@@SydLane Just say you dont care about innocent lives (ei: the thing all anti-choice people claim is the main reason against abortion) and keep it moving.
@@mycatiswaysmarterthanmosto8500 Can't say what isn't true, sorry. And it's hilariously ironic for someone who is OK with murdering unborn babies to wax lyrical about caring about innocent lives. lol That's good. 😂
The last child I got pregnant with I found out about at 6 weeks gestation. My second son was only about 4-5 months old. The first Dr. I saw told me that if I did not terminate the pregnancy the "baby" would not survive, and I had a very low survival rate also.
There were so many complications, I did not mean to get pregnant but that is what happens when men and women share the same bed. I was married and this was the 4th pregnancy.
I chose to NOT have it terminated, LOL should have seen my Dr. face. He started really talking like maybe I did not understand that maybe I could die. I WAS REALLY SCARED. I WAS REALLY SICK. But I trusted the Lord Jesus and gave birth a month early to a beautiful HEALTHY little girl.
I'm so glad I listened to the Lord my God.
Yes it was very hard to take care of all of them. No we didn't always have all the best money could buy. But I ALWAYS HAD GODS LOVE AND MY BABIES.
Beloved, don't believe the lies, your babies are so very special.
I love you all
God Bless
14:06 What about the reverse though? Let me rephrase her statement: "It feels somewhat hypocritical that there's a major movement to criminalize capital punishment to protect guilty life but the same energy is not given to saving that same life if they haven't committed a crime."
Texas just isn't a place I wanna go to, just, heh no
right? I read lists of the best places to live in the US and the majority of them I would never feel safe in. Texas cities are almost always on the list.
I’m from Texas
Big cities - college towns are pretty cool
Austin Tx is the place to be!
Dallas is cool too!
Same. But also I think Austin is maybe mostly liberal tho so that’s cool
PREACH
Don't come to Texas, Austin is getting crowded.
Is it nice/the best place I have ever lived?...you bet!
Can we just say, we all love Grace? Cause I know I do.
@@FuryWings27 the comment is talking about the reporter in this video, Grace Baldridge
Yeah! Grace always makes sure to let us know how she feels but not let that affect her professionalism. She has everyone give their answers and experiences from all sides of the board, letting them share without silencing them. Now that's a fine Journalist right there!
Did you see that pro bortion lady bragging about she's having abortions shower and then she died two days after her abortion... Now that is karma
I used to watch Grace on Pop Trigger and always thought she had more to offer. So happy she got this opportunity, this series is excellent. Great job, Grace!!
I really like your videos. Sensitive, honest, touching. I hope you continue to seek understanding as you have been, and to take us with you as you do. Bless you.
Welp I hope they have no problem allowing their future daughters to have a baby around the ages of 9-17 🤷🏽♀️
Ikr.
Teenage pregnancies scare the s**t out of me 😭
@@suzawilo Most abortions are done by women over 20
@@mathildeyoung1823 That's not really surprising, considering most pregnancies happen to women over 20. Do you have data on the rates? Abortion/pregnancies in different age brackets? Absolute numbers mean nothing in this particular debate.
@@lemondrizzlecake7766 Here is a link with the rates- www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/67/ss/ss6713a1.htm
@@suzawilo Then don't have sex??
I was raised hardcore Catholic and idk if it's bc I'm Canadian and we haven't had the death penalty since my mom was born, but I was raised with this very strong anti-death penalty sentiment in addition to the anti-abortion sentiment.
Kinda weird to see Christians doing the opposite. If you're gonna be dicks at least be consistent.
Kye Talks lmao thanks for this comment. a lot of Christians, particularly conservative- christians, tend to cherry pick what they think is wrong or not. as you said, be consistent. though i’m pro- choice, i really like this comment. also, i’m a fellow canadian so hey!!
Good for you! Stay strong!
@John Smith
Whether the life is innocent or not, *Its still a life* Your probably religious, you should let G-D decide punishment, not the state.
Omg exactly my point! I'm not a Christian but I'm firmly Pro Life and Firmly Anti Death penalty. I wish everyone would stop making Pro Life Movement, portrayed as a religious thing. More so, I do really wish other Pro Lifers would stop being hypocrites and treat every living being the same. Innocent or guilty.
@John Smith
Okay as a New Yorker, I can agree that many laws here are really bad when it comes to the criminal justice system and I don't believe all criminals should be rehabilitated.
But what your saying is its either death or go onto the streets and kill more people. Bruh. I don't think it works that way anywhere and I really advise you educate yourself. We can jail criminals, we don't have to let them back on the streets. But execution in a modern civilized society that is supposed to value the lives of ALL its citizens, is simply immoral and barbaric.
When they find a living cell on Mars they call that life. When a pregnant woman dies in a car accident they call it a double homicide...life is life. Period.
There’s a difference between killing an innocent child who has done no harm in this world and is a direct result of the woman’s incompetence than killing a murderer/rapist who shows no remorse to their actions
Yes, the later is fully sentient with hopes and fears, and a complex history of injustices and disappointment s.
this should be a non issue. there's no brain-body connection until 3rd trimester. a human cannot live without those connections. bam life starts at the 3rd trimester
What about the scientific studies that show the child in the early trimester feels pain and responds when pain is inflicted?
@@VictoriousLaura Those studies don't exist. There are many systems that need to develop and work together to feel pain. The nerve systems and the part of the brain necessary to feel pain aren't developed until around 23 weeks.
You might be talking about withdrawal reflex. That isn't pain. It's the same thing that happens when a doctor tests your knee reflexes with the little hammer. No pain is felt, but your leg kicks out automatically.
@@VictoriousLaura Link to those studies.
It wouldn't make a difference about the legality of abortion but I'm interested
VictoriousLaura it responds to a stimulus not necessarily infliction of pain. I agree that it opens a compelling discussion. One that requires deep philosophical reflection about a persons self and their definitions of pain and about compassion. Or how a person views pain or views compassion through a heretic lens. Ultimately that would create a crisis of identity for too many people so it’s easier to not confront those ideas. Why rock the boat of your world view when you know there’s a good chance it won’t personally affect you? That seems to be where the US stands on this in my opinion.
Even if they were alive, bodily autonomy should still be the priority
The mother at the end had me crying. She is so strong.
Why would we treat prisoners any different than we treat our unborn children.
Lived down the road from the execution chamber in Huntsville. Always really, really made me uncomfortable knowing what happened in there.
The mom in the last interview had me crying. Watching your child be killed right in front of you 😭😭
@Kayla M if you don't like it you don't do it lol
@Kayla M why are you twisting my words? and you know "lol" is kind of a passive aggressive thing right? i'm saying that if you dont agree with it you don't do it. i never said that women enjoy having an abortion, it can be a hard decision. no one should be forced to have one or not to have one. Kind of like China or other countries. Would you rather children be put in adoption where they grow up abused and neglected wondering why their mom couldn't keep them or how they were a mistake. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean that the world should abide by your way of thinking. My aunt would rather spend over 30,000 thousand dollars of trying to have her own baby and still trying) than to adopt one in need, kind of shows that people would rather have their own kid than adopt one. We have over two million kids in the foster system, you honestly think there should be more? As it is almost all of them don't get adopted, and there's more to come with your way of thinking. people are so against having an abortion but dont even care about the baby until its born.
Eloise Newtman she was talking about the mom who had to watch her son get the death penalty
@@Themakeupchair15 i wasn't responding to the original comment, there was another person but my conversation with that person was deleted on their part. hahah
Eloise Newtman ok I was so confused 😂
What a beautiful message, I never realized Mary was given a choice.
Yeah but she wasn't given the choice to kill her baby. She was given the choice whether or not to become pregnant in the first place. It's not as though she was made pregnant, and then agreed to go ahead with it, and had she not consented, the unborn baby would have been murdered at her behest. It's a really dumb comparison which makes no sense.
It’s not quite the same thing, but it is still relevant. The rest of us aren’t lucky enough to have an angel come down and confirm to us whether it’s going to result in a pregnancy. We have to wait at least 6 weeks. But the point is God wants women to make choices regarding their own bodies.
@@SydLane exactly! Thank you. I was going to say just that, but you said it for me👍
@@doraymeandyou God does want women to make choices regarding their own bodies. For example, if one isn't ready to have a child, then one should choose not to have sex (and if we're talking about what God wants, then no one should EVER be having sex outside of marriage)... God wants women to choose to follow Him. And choose to live according to His word. But God is not in favor of women murdering anyone... let alone their unborn babies. Life begins at conception. That unborn baby, as tiny and undeveloped as it is, has the exact same DNA it will have for the rest of its life - the full and complete plans for the way it will look, what it will be like, what it will be good at, etc... it's all there... and it has a soul. God has breathed life into this baby. It is a human being. If you think the God of the bible is cool with women killing their own babies, then you don't know God at all.
@@candieland4276 People are really trying to suggest that Mary could have had an abortion and God would have been fine with it lol ... what on earth is going on in this world?? I'm thankful for your comment.
What a courageous interview, exploring some painful and terrifying realities and a challenge to how we live.
My sister was raped, and was forced to have the baby (by my parents who wanted her to have the kid rather than care about her mental health) she would have panic attacks almost every other day during the pregnancy even with our support, she died during childbirth and the baby died 5 minutes later due to her stress. Call it for what it is, it’s pro-birth not pro-life.
Most pro-life are pro-abortion in cases of rape