Why Keyboards With Numpads On The Right Are Outdated
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- čas přidán 3. 07. 2024
- The numpad was originally designed for screen navigation back when there was no computer mouse. Numpad placement is optional, it can either be on the right, nonexistent, or on the left. If you still need the functionality of the numpad, then having a keyboard layout with it on the right hand side can potentially be cutting you down on efficiency and workflow. This is why your next keyboard purchase should have it on the left, if you need the numpad.
Products used in the video:
(Provided by Bloody)
B975(numpad on right): amzn.to/2KEUAGy
B945(numpad on left): amzn.to/2Ivvb5q
B830(10 keyless): amzn.to/2IwgJGe
A4Tech Natural A Keyboard: amzn.to/2KEVrHg
RGB Mousepad: amzn.to/2k8gTZT
P85 Mouse: amzn.to/2KGdb58
Moci Gaming Headset: amzn.to/2Ist3v8
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What other changes do you guys think would be beneficial to keyboards? (Gaming/productivity/etc..)
I've had 10 key-less models mainly and have used a separate keypad, usually placed to the right of the keyboard(I'm simply used to it that way). This is the first time I'm going to the left...I honestly hope I can get used to it ;)
I can't wait to get proficient with it, it'll help me out a lot!
Just a chip in my left temple lobe so I just have to think to type.
Arrows on the left would also be very useful because you could use them as well as the numpad without taking your hand off the mouse. There are some custom mechanical keyboard designs but they were made in small batches and would probably $200+ fully assembled with caps
I would prefer the backspace button on the left side of the keyboard a bit below Esc
Over a decade ago, I had a Microsoft gaming keyboard that had a detachable numpad that could be swapped between the left and right of the keyboard. This would be the ideal option.
Would love to have that honestly
Could you share the link of a similar product if you find any? I am looking for a normal keyboard with everything exactly in the same place, just the numberpad on the left side in stead of right...
@@virajnagpure If you want custom there is gk96lxs
@@virajnagpureRog Claymore II. Although it’s expensive as all heck.
KbdCraft's Adam 0110b kit
As a lefty, the standard numpad on the right is the ONLY DAMN THING the world has ever made which is perfect for lefties in the first place. Haha
lol
Yeah, it is, its sad thst thats the case.
As a lefty, I'd disagree
@@Silvndr its only right if you use a left hand layout, with your mouse on the right. I use a right hand layout, so this isnt aplicable.
@@Silvndr yeah for typing number it s simply a real pain
I agree numpad on left is definitely more efficient
yep i need a numpad keyboard to fly a plane in gta i guess i can use a ducky one 2 with a seperate numpad so i can have that on the left
we're right handed
@@aarav6981 dont you use the left side of your keyboard for acceleration and the num pad for moving when flying? putting both on the left seems like it makes it more difficult.
Fully agree. I was looking for a keyboard with the numpad on the left for sooo long. It would also make so much more sense for laptops, because of symmetry. I hate having to type on the left edge of the screen, if the numpad is on the left it makes the actual keyboard much more center which gives me much better posture and is less confusing for my sense of balance.
As a left-handed bloke, I've never understood a lot of things - like guitars conventionally putting the fretboard to the left, British motoring being largely manual and right-hand-drive or indeed keyboard layouts that either push the mouse off the edge of the desk or give the user RSI. If anything, keyboards should have been supplied with the numpad on the left as soon as mice started coming into play
I bought a Bloody 945 not too long ago and love it. It's great for gaming, being in easy reach of the WASD keys, and I've gotten used to entering numbers with my left hand which, as you said, means I can keep my right hand on my mouse.
100% correct. More manufacturers need to go this route.
Fantastic and on point video.
Thank you!
Interesting video JD!
Thanks Leigh for the support :)
I think a standalone keypad is the best solution, then you can move it. I really see the benefits with having it on the left, but honestly... after using my right hand on the numpad for 30+ years, it get's real slow if I try it on the left.
And I also use it in certain games - like controlling planes/helicopters in like gta. Then you want it on the right, so your left hand can do the WASD stuff.
Right now I actually have two numpads, one on the left, one on the right. And a macro pad.. Being able to hit return/enter with your left pinky finger is pretty awesome.
Too bad those Bloody keyboards look awful.
i agree
That's so true. They look bad. If they went with some more simplistic design, like HyperX Alloy, I'd buy one.
This is me. I'm not a designer, so if I'm using the NumPad, chances are I don't need my hand on the mouse.
I have the Microsoft Sidewinder X6 keyboard, where the numpad is detachable. On the left, on the right, or TKL - you can use it any way you want. It's all hotpluggable and magnetically attached, so it's super easy to swap.
I've used a separate numeric pad in my left hand for years ... more comfortable and efficient. Good video
I was also considering the numpad on the left as a way to retain full functionality.
For gaming, mouse mouvements are great not having to deal with it.
60% boards are not functional enough for my various activities so my choice was a 82 keys, still not ideal.
Adding a Trackpad (layout a la Thinkpad X220) could be a nice combo for a mechanical board dedicated to desktop.
I got a new job recently and the mouse I was provided had no forward / back buttons on it. I don't really use the forward button much, but it has been a VERY long time since I've not had a back button. The constant need to take my hand off the mouse because of that one minor difference got me thinking that having the num pad on the right side of the keyboard is just as archaic as not having a scroll wheel. Yes, the mouse also didn't have a scroll wheel. So happy they didn't mind me buying a Logitech MX Master, now I have two scroll wheels! Also I got inspired to rebind the forward button to a macro that I actually do get a lot of use out of.
In Blender I use the numpads for, like you say, Navigation. Blender also happen to use right-click to select as opposed to left click.
If I used this Keyboard then I'd be doing left side numpad and right click to select. I'd basically be going against mainstream.
or you can just have your left hand on arrow keys and your right hand on keypad. Where this type of keyboard does come into handy though is in gaming since you have a wider range of movement for your mouse without it bumping into your keyboard (thanks to the other side).
This keyboard + left hand mouse = Left hand gamers heaven! :)
I had the thought of a setup with the numpad on the left after considering a TKL board, but realising I still need the numpad. Unfortunately, just about all standalone numpads are designed for the left hand. It's a real shame to see that the B945 doesn't rectify this.
That b-roll looking crispy AF
Its really sad that people that are as old as keyboards come to dislike.
What do you think about numpads on laptops? I'm torn between a Razer Blade 2020 (no numpad) and Gigabyte Aero 15X (numpad). But the Aero 15X has that weird camera placement that shows your nose nostrils lol
they look great, i might get their tenkeyless
Yeah, built like a tank, that's why I really like them
Amazing. Love TKLs fpr gaming, but if you also need a numpad, this is perfect for a multi purpose machine.
Although these days I just use a 75% board. Other than the standard letters, numbers and symbols section, it only has a function row, arrow keys, and home/end/pgup/pgdown/del/ins/prts. And frankly
I fully agree, Gaming wise, Full size keyboard is too big for me, ; it Always made my mouse stuck on they keyboard when gaming. That forced me to use TKL keyboard. But a lot of TKL keyboards is very lacking in feature like no Multimedia and Mute button, and yeah , no Keypad that I'm using it for working. This layout should be the next change for keyboards. I hope other manufacturer will follow for a change.
I mainly use it for matlab and excel and it love the Numpad on the right, simply cause I don’t need to use the mouse much in those programs. It’s perfect for quickly entering data.
Right on the money!
Hahaha, I literally just bought a Bloody left hand side 945 series yesterday. I never used one like this before and I'd love to see how this works. I usually solve the numpad issue by removing it all together with a 10 key-less model....not the best idea to be honest. I'll report back on my experience with this when this bad boy gets in next week.
Same here man! I tried using a ten key-less for a while, and my workflow suffered from it. I'm still getting used to the left sided numpad, let me know how that works out for you.
Will do :) Fingers crossed I like it ;)
Michael Livote so how is it?
also waiting a response on this by Michael
Also waiting on a response
I use Blender 3d modeling and the number pad has assigned hot keys for viewing purposes.
I never though about this, but suddenly to day I had the Idea, googled it and here I am.
I love when I think of something good and it exists.
Buying the Keychron Q0 standalone one. Or just getting a cheapo wireless one.
On my old keyboard I had buttons to the left but I had to remove them because I always accidentally pressed them.
And I use numpad but I use it for convenience like for recording shortcuts and similar stuff
Yeah, shortcuts help a ton for me.
Man that's exactly what i want
and what if your left-handed?
How do you place your fingers on the left numpad? I have the same keyboard and I'm not sure what the best finger placement is for the numpad yet.
Thumb on enter and other 3 on number.
It's accidentially pretty natural
Totally agreed, the current full keyboard format is very flawed for modern computing with a mouse. I'm looking for a left handed keyboard to remedy this, and if I can't find a suitable one I'll go down the DIY route.
You can get a tenkeyless keyboard and a standalone numpad. That's what I did, cause I wasn't finding a left-side one that I liked.
I wouldve never thought of thid if I wouldnt have seen this video
when using the numpad in excel you can enter below you but you cant tab next to you :( then i have to hit enter click numlock move the selector to the cell i want then enter the data
thanks
I'm attempting to do my own ghetto left numpad keyboard by using a TKL keyboard with removable cable, a USB hub and a dedicated numpad (also with removable cable, what a nightmare to find)
I am using macropad with numpad layout + one column. This way you can have backspace on your numpad. Highly recommended.
When IBM model came in 80's (or even 70's) there was no mouse on the right side, which now causes carpal tunnel problems and shoulder fatigue.
So, how long until Bloody makes a gaming Dvorak keyboard?
you can simply change the layout in the system settings or buy a keycap puller and rearrange the keys yourself
i never got the having your hands closer think i personally like to have a wider stance so then i lay my arm on the desk and dont trier out my shoulder, but my desk is also plenty big so idk even if it was smaller i would rather learn a higher dpi
I'm sold, i"ll get a tkl keyboard + separate numpad to be placed on the left side.
Man, I miss a lot left numpad. Working with Autocad or a 3d software we are forced to click, type the distance on keyboard and than go back to mouse. That sucks!!!
I have tried a keyboard like this and I wasn't near as fast as I am with it on the right. And I don't really mind taking my hand of the mouse. I have never seen it as a problem.
It takes time to relearn, but relearn you can.
To each his own.
i agree, i'll go as far a to say the regular full size keyboard design has been outdated since the invention of the mouse, having the numpad on the right means either taking your right hand of the mouse to use the numbers or to extend your left arm to reach the numpad if you don't want to stop grabbing the mouse.
Look up: ''premium southpaw 75 keyboard''
Sir I am from India I have laptop 85 keys dell, I want change keyboard in 101 keys keyboard with numerical key this is possible or No please reply sir (replace 85 keys =101 keys)
dude your video was so right. They layout indeed has been changed. We have 60% and 75%!
Azerty iso User can't remove numpad.
Is azerty you have to old shift to use numbers its so annoying having no number pad
Finally, somebody else agrees with me on numpads.
Nice vid
dude, it's not outdated! I'm left handed. And the numpad on the right is king!
Perhaps, if you use the mouse left to the keyboard. It would just be nice if there was more options to better accommodate more right-handed people, such as placing the numpad on the left. Keeping the arrow and miscellaneous keys opposite the numpad in either configuration would be optimal, as it would make the alphanumeric keys more centered, helpful for typing.
As a left-handed gamer I need a numpad. But no-one thinks of us when designing stuff.
If the numpad was on the left, it would have to be phone layout (123 on top row), in order to not constantly get confused when I switched between phone and computer layout when I worked at a market research callcenter ages ago; i just moved the phone to the left and learned that layout with my left hand and the pc layout with my right.
Yeah, retraining muscle memory can be really painful at the start.
I like gaming with a numpad in place of wasd. I learned that way with the numpad on the right (I would slide the keyboard over 6" when I was gaming), then I learned wasd. I could switch back and fourth pretty seamlessly. Then I got a tenkeyless keyboard and put standalone tenkey on the left. I tried gaming with the tenkey on the left, and then my muscle memory that was trained for both was trying to do wasd on the tenkey. I figured out it was positioning. My muscle memory had developed an understanding that if my hand was far to the left, it was wasd, and if it was far to the right, it was numpad/tenkey. It took a good week to retrain and get comfortable switching back and forth again with the tenkey on the left.
Now I'm wondering what my muscle memory is keying off of (no pun) to use the wasd training or numpad training.
Also, I have found that using a numpad with a left hand is can be more efficient (provided you've adapted) because there's more that your thumb can easily reach. I dunno, maybe that's a pinky vs. thumb preference and it's not objectively more efficient if you have a well trained pinky (I never took any typing courses, I never properly learned to play piano. It's possible my pinkies are deficient due to under-use).
Honestly, do what you want with your layout. It mostly drives me crazy that most ergo keyboards have a numpad smashed onto the side in a place that is decidedly unergonomic for me, to the point of being not just inefficient but actually unhealthy. I wish the standard would change to have the tenkey be detached.
Well if you get a customizable keyboard changing the layout of the numpad buttons should be simple!
I have a b945 on the way always used a ten keyless but saw them and thought id try it out
Hope it works out for you!
It's tempting, but with shipping and import fees, it's going to cost me nearly 300 dollars
@@bacon.cheesecake whew quite the reply almost didn't even remember leaving this 3 years ago
@@Demon09-_- Lol, yeah, I stumbled upon this video because I really want a keyboard with the numpad on the left but there doesn't seem to be any good options nowadays.
@@bacon.cheesecake ah yea where are you located? If watch on ebay or a similar site for someone selling one of these guys if your not usa based
Yes! Goddamn yes! Thats what I'm talking about! I talked to my friend about it yesterday and he said me that I am the only one with this problem. Now I am almost happy that I'm not. I ordered extra numpad for my work yesterday. When I will have more money will buy one of these will numpad on the left.
Games like the Tony hawk franchise on PC use the numpad alot so having it on the right side is a lot better
That is a very obscure reason to prefer it. Why not just play tony hawk with a controller?
I think a leftward numpad is a good idea. Maybe a little redisgn would make more sense for it. Lots of ergonomic keyboards have improved or completely redesigned options for button placements. X Bows Ergo has some good reviews, though no numpad, but the numbers above the keys are in a significantly better orientation. Keyboards like the Kinesis Advantage 2 are very against the grain for their design, but I think, with enough practice, those kinds of keyboards could really change the game if people are willing to relearn typing and gaming there. Bottom line to me: all keyboards should be some for of ergonomic, and number placement might actually become more flexible and logical with ergonomics in mind.
Just using keyboards like the Logitech K350 have completely changed what I expect from companies. That keyboard felt many times more natural than the typical square design we're used to.
Plz make a vid that talks about the best brand like dragon bloody or razor and much more plz
I mean, I can try, but I'm afraid there will be a ton of backlash for people who are brand loyal or boycott..
JDTechGear that true but ja still love the vids
I prefer a keyboard with the num pad on the right cause I have a extra macro keyboard or my left for Adobe
This should be the norm
Its so easier to translocate my left hand to a numpad than translocate AND change the form of my hand and then change ahain to ajust to the mouse's positions
great video I think of getting keyless board cause I play PC gaming a lot lol
Thanks Josh, yeah can completely understand that
Since Windows function for hiding the mouse pointer while typing has been brokens since the dinosaurs roamed the earth, the mouse pointer always hides the field you're typing numbers in, that alone would be reason enough for this. So much less annoyance! And all the reasons you mention too.
I've been banging this drum for like 20 years. Sadly none of the major manufacturers (or even the indies, with the exception of DSI) seems willing to break with convention.
Thanks for the video, I'll try the numpad on the left for a while. By the way, as a gamer and an accountant, numpads are a godsend for accounting and useless for gaming, just like you said.
I've been saying this for years! It makes so much sense!
Sad that in the custom mechanical keyboard market there is only one board with this layout and it costs 500$.
Oh well guess I'll have to use a TKL or a 65% board with an external wireless numpad like the GK21s.
The big deal for me is quite simple, I have to reach to the left with my right hand constantly to type and then I have to reach over to the right to go back to the mouse and I find it messes my posture up badly and makes the muscles behind my right shoulder blade when really sore. It's honestly just stupid to have the numpad on the right, and for those talking about using WASD and macros and hotkeys, use the arrow keys on the right then. lol or a controller.
It drives me crazy that most "ergo" keyboards have a numpad on the right. They design a (usually) great ergo keyboard, than slap a numpad on the right, getting in the way and undoing a lot of the ergo they achieved.
Yes it gives more space to aim
So is this a left handed key board?
Yes! More specifically called 'southpaw' layout.
2:57
False!
Colemak layout... turns Caps Lock into backspace.
I prefer it on the right.
left handed numpad are good for blender user, so close to ctrl, shift, and alt!
I love my numpad and anyone with a job that requires heavy number use needs a numpad. Also for gamers it's those extra keys. I love the legacy idea.
Still waiting for analog keyboards.
Take a look at the Cooler Master MK850 coming out this year. You might find what you are looking for. Full Disclosure: I developed the analog keyboard technology in this keyboard - more info at aimpad.com if you are interested.
0:06 poor wire
a4 tech bloody is the best for gaming
agreed
lol ok scripter
I am actually left handed and I am using the mouse on my left hand side, so the current keyboard design is actually a advantage for me :p
what does lefted handed to do with mouse placement?
Perhaps... but do you think you might benefit from having the arrow and miscellaneous keys on the left-hand side, then? It would make the alphanumeric keys more centered, helpful for typing. It would be nice if there were different layouts of the standard 104-key mechanical keyboard.
This is really niche. I'm right handed so I don't see the value for # pad on left.
The value is that it moves the numpad to the wasted space to the left of your keyboard and gives your mouse more room on the right (Assuming you're centering your keyboard around the B key).
I like splitting keyboards that allow more space between my shoulders.
I’m left handed so
Thanks. I think a separate budget aRGB mechanical numpad (if a budget one exists) is the best, coz' you need the numpad to fly the place on GTA games.
God bless.
@Apple please take a look at this
First, thanks for the video! (I don't know why I never thought to go to CZcams until now about this matter, but...) OK, this may sound kind of crazy, but for the work I do, I'd really like to have a full-size keyboard that has the num pad on BOTH the right and left side. Does that even exist? Anyone?
There are many bilinguals or trilinguals like me, who need numpads to create special characters with Alt Combo to write texts in our own languages like for example Danish, Portugese etc.. Without it, it gets complicated.
If you type in those other languages regularly, I'd recommend using WinCompose (or likewise) Which adds the "compose key" to windows, it's a lot more intuitive and faster compared to alt codes.
Examples:
To type ú, you'd do RightAlt + u + ' (You don't need to hold any key down)
æ would be RightAlt + a + e
ø would be RightAlt + o + /
For the type of characters above, the order doesn't matter
You can also do fractions and super/subscripts
½ would be RightAlt + 1 + 2
² would be RightAlt + ^ + 2
₂ would be RightAlt + _ + 2
I would hate it.
The real problem with modern layout is the need to have different layout for every language even though theu use the greek roman alphabet. There should be an universal latin keyboard.
They are not, using your mouse with your right hand is updated
the best solution is buy any keyboard without a numpad and then buy a separate numpad that way when you game you have more mouse space and when you are not gaming you put the numpad on the table
edit: you alsovcan put it in the right side or left side
But with that way you have an extra cable... and it stinks to has one more cable around... mine has the exact setup rn and it's kinda annoying once you get to it a long time, I think if you find a good value with left numpad, just buy that instead
@@shinejnn2 or just buy a wireless numpad
@antoniosergio9128 usually they are more expensive, latency connections, and still even need battery/unchangeable, most importantly, if want mechanical ones it's even more expensive than a regular board..
At that point you could have just buy a full set board with one convenient cable all-in-one, but that shet is hard to find yet
they stopped producing the boards :-D
Me looking for a keyboard with numpad on the left because of being left handed
JDTechGear: Oh having a the numpad on the same direction of ure mouse is so trashy
I started getting tenkeyless keyboards a couple of years ago for this reason. I bought a standalone keypad/numpad/tenkey (what is the best term?) so I can put it on the left side. I have yet to think of a way in which it's better on the right. My thumb is more useful on the tenkey if it's my left hand (I can use it for 3 buttons comfortably rather than 1), and it allows me to get my typing more centered in front of me without putting my mouse so far away. I also like to use it for gaming (when I'm not too lazy to change the binds), and it's of course much better when it's not directly next to the mouse. Oh yeah and then of course it's nice for data entry as you mentioned.
Now a keyboard with a tenkey on the right feels incredibly unnatural and uncomfortable. I guess that's how folks moving away from it may feel, but it just seems like an all around superior layout both for comfort and efficiency.
we dont need arrow keys just press numlock and use numpad
Nah, it sucks for that. T-nav is infinitely better.
Try being lefthanded and you might think again lol........
I am left-handed
I use a number pad with Excel at work, I don't use a mouse in Excel because I know all the keyboard commands.
Having the pad on the left would get in my way as I use my left hand to type letters and use tab.
If you want to talk about bring inefficient, talk about using a mouse in Excel as that takes a long longer to do the same thing.
Your right hand controls the arrow keys or letters or mouse, left hand controls the number pad. And gives you closer mouse to keyboard distance. It’s the best for efficiency and ergonomics
Andddddd..I’m left handed 👍🏾
I actually spent 5 bucks more to get a keyboard without a numpad
@acash a friend said it was because smaller electronics are more difficult to make ?? it's just that they don't sell these as much probably
Mouse? Use a Trackpoint instead, then you can have both hands on the keyboard 100% of the time. I can use the trackpoint with both hands making me able to switch so I don't overstrain my finger. I haven't used a mouse for many years. I instead have a pen tablet to the right of the keyboard for photo editing and drawing.
OR you can just buy 68 keys keyboard, and separate numpad keyboard and place it on your left hand side. BRILLIANT