Joe Rogan & Cory Sandhagen Discuss Bad Calls in the UFC
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- čas přidán 8. 04. 2023
- Joe Rogan & Cory Sandhagen Discuss Bad Calls in the UFC
Credit- @joerogan
Full Clip: Taken from JRE # 138 with Cory Sandhagen
open.spotify.com/episode/3V1o...
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Outro song:
Ray Volpe - Laserbeam (TYRAZ House Flip)
/ ray-volpe-laserbeam-ty...
#joerogan #mma #ufc - Sport
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I’ve always agreed with the Sean O’Malley vs Kris Motino stoppage, sure he was standing but let the man meet his grandchildren some day fr
Rogan and Cormier were being willfully ignorant. Moutinho will never be the same person he was before that fight and if the ref had let it go on longer it could’ve ended horribly. The strike difference was 230-70.
@@TylerG13 230-70 still seems light, Kris landed nothing of power the whole fight didn’t move his head and was quite literally a walking punching bag, I hope Kris is doing well, the commentators were more mad at the stoppage than Kris was
Yeah that fight was very lopsided. "Gotta let Him get hit another 50 times. Like Warrior spirit maaaaan"
Not to mention he got stopped in the first next fight too. Shouldve been stopped a while ago, had to have had an effect on him
I met a guy that knew kris personally and he said the whole thing was a fix, not the fight itself but how the fight came about, time to prepare and level of competition. He essentially said Kris - for as much as he loved him - didn’t belong in there.
That music at the end of the video is the worst thing ever created in the history of existence
Thank you for the warning.
It’s as if Axe body spray was noise.
@@tempsitch5632 😂😂😂 why is that so accurate lmao
100000% sounds like someone is creating a character in WWE.
My man.. thanks for the heads up in getting out a whole minute ahead of the end
Big down vote from me for the outro music. Wow that's bad. And loud
As good as Chito is, and he’s good, very good, there’s absolutely unequivocally no freaking way that he won even one round of that fight Cory dominated the whole match
The O’Malley/Moutinho fight is an awful example. Moutinho took 10 unanswered shots to the face and looked like a completely different person. It was just as good of a stoppage as Ronda/Nunes. Rogan and Cormier were on crack with that one. There is no “Let him finish the fight” when he’s eating unanswered punches to the face with meaningful time left. 30 seconds is a long time to get your ass kicked when you’ve been getting your ass kicked for 14 minutes already.
Its the same thing that happened with boxing. We used to have incredible 'infighters' like roberto duran that would get inside and work the body and tie you up and pressure from the clinch. Then over the last 30 years or so the referees got overly fussy and break up fighters in the clinch much quicker to the point that really skilled infighters are a dying breed and its kind of a lost art and its all because of casual fans just wanting two dudes to go toe to toe and don't want any of the subtleties that make a fighter great and referees caving to the booing and wanting boxing to be 'cleaner'. It absolutely sucks.
The comparison isnt even close
@@enigma1247 referees not allowing mma fighters to work on the ground vs referees not allowing boxers to work in the clinch? its directly comparable you flannel.
@@KristianH1986 hahaha I had to look up flannel as an insult. Are you British?
@Tarance Hill I'm British, and I've never heard someone say flannel
im sure it was to stop unnecessary hugging that nobody wants to see
I've always said that UFC could implement a rule mandating that ranked fighters from all weight classes must serve as judges in a certain number of fights each year. Even just the top 15 in each class would give you a pool of 165 judges that are each highly trained and qualified.
You could even mandate that you can't judge fights within your weight class to rule out most bias.
Well the judges and referees don't work for the UFC. They're from whatever Athletic Commission the company is currently fighting in.
Dan Miragliotta scoring the Maycee Barber vs Andrea Lee as 30 - 27 for Barber was criminal. You'd think as a ref he'd have a better feel for fights. And I always root for Barber but he was dead wrong with that score
Joe has got to have Cory and Andrew Santino on at the same time. It would confuse some people and it would be hilarious.
Because they look similar? If so that’s ironic because I think he looks more like Lil Dicky, and Santino is on his show.
Why is no one talking about that fighter putting the ref in the leg lock 😭
Laughed my ass off
See here's the thing, I'm all for former fighters being judges but the problem is most former fighters are friends with other fighters in the organization or train them, to many biases in play I feel like
you saying that like these stupid judges rn aren't biased towards fighters. how tf do you think islam got decission over volk.
@@Jeudaos trust me I’m with you on that but I’m just saying it’s something to think about, imagine dc as a judge. And I had $100 on volk at +350 and was 100% convinced I made the right bet, just think the judges fucked it over
@@Jeudaos one of the judges were from Australia 😂
these jre clips are the best. Love the edits
That fckn outro got all the dogs in my neighborhood barking
I was like, "holy molly, Linus knows fighting too"😁
i think 10-8 rounds should be given a lot more, same for 10-7 rounds. 10-9 only for rounds that are actually very close and it's not clear who won the round
But the problem with that is 1 round wins the fight . And 1 decently dominant round ties the fight
@@anonymousbrowsing2909 10-7 is insane, fights need to go back more pride style rules where they're judged as a whole. Let's say I get my ass beat round one and it's 10-7, I come back with a strong ass second and 10-8 him the next round then 10-9 him the third and the best I get is a draw? That's some bullshit, the way the fight ends is way more important than the way it begins
@@jiujitsumonkey1 agreed I get the rounds system but they gotta find a way too give close fights too the person who actually WON the fight in terms of damage or strikes and then control time.
@@jiujitsumonkey1 IMO I like the fight being judged as a whole with an exception. Let the judges vote on the fight as a whole and if they can't make a strong decision then look at who they thought won each round for a tie breaker. Volk should have won that fight. Joe is right the end of the fight had him winning for sure.
More room for judges to fuck fights up. No thanks.
John annik is the type of guy who would tell the teacher they forgot to hand out homework
Fun fact, the judge who gave chito the fight had not judged a professional fight prior to that night
They are put there so Vegas win because no one bets on split decisions
What does split decision have to do with betting?
Definitely disagree with the last point saying that what happens at the end of the fight matters the most. Like imagine if Nate got the decision over Edwards because he was ahead for 1 of the 25 minutes in the fight.
UFC Fans : Judges need to be less subjective or it's going to kill the sport
Boxing : Hold my beer.
i agree with joe on the number of judges. 3 is a very small amount considering the subjectivity of judging in this sport
5:48 my favorite Dana soundbite 😂
Song at the end?
Bring back Yamazaki 🤣🤣🤣
If he dies, he dies.
I think most MMA refs do a great job and are excellent representations to the sport.
The bad apples are so bad though…it almost erases all that though.
A few bad apples spoils the bunch
you often only remember by their worst moments as well. Yamasaki made a couple really bad calls. Leading up to the Cachoeira fight, he has been reffing for 20 years in the UFC alone, basically since the organization was founded. He can't be too much of a bad apple when there's what, 10/400 fights with bad calls?
Fighters should be judges but the problem with that is all the fighters know each other and have friends that have trained, sparred and fought each other…… its hard for a fighter to fairly judge a fight when feelings are involved
I've been thinking why don't they make it like a 3 colour panel scoring like a blue panel (blue corner) red panel (red corner) and blue and which is tied that way you'd be able to tell if favoritism is being played
On the opinion of the volk fight and scoring that type of battle. The first rd rarely means anything. They are pretty much feeling each other out and not really doing anything worth scoring. Why most of the time on these 5 rd fights the first rd is always more subjective
Bc it's the starting round, and in UFC getting past the first round is an accomplishment itself.
Dustin Poirier's boxing is so good
I’m starting to believe that bad score cards is a promotion or something cuz everyone talks about it forever the ufc can’t fire the judging commission then it makes you wanna see the next fights to see what other bad score cards there’s gunna be
It's a very interesting topic to me. I love most sports and we've seen what appears to be a steady decline in reffing in hockey, in football, as well as basketball. I'm sure other sports would say the same as well. Some of the sports, like the non-combat sports I have a theory on. I think we now have super high-definition slow-mo replay to critique every single call or non-call made. That hasn't always been the case. So maybe reffing has always been this bad but we're just now getting to see it because of technology advancements. I'm very curious why a sport like baseball still uses a homeplate umpire to call pitches. You literally have a camera trained on the batters box with a rectangle to show the strike zone. You don't need that human error to get it wrong anymore. I don't know, I guess I'm just curious if it's always just been bad and we just didn't know it until we've been able to see it in slow motion after the fact.
It hasn’t been declining, ref’s have always been trash. We just have social media now to show how shit they are
Nice paragraph, but here's why everything is ruined: gambling.
Are we going to act like guys don't hold guys down for points or to rest? If there was no time limit I could see the argument being valid.
True but a lot of times the refs that let them up do it in ridiculous situations. If the fight is stalled then for sure let them up. But if they’re working for positions, who cares what the crowd things just let them work and continue to practice mixed martial arts.
That's usually the case when dudes just laying on top not doing anything.
Most times theres a big struggle going on with wrist control and positioning, and those should not be stood up.
@@tclyde865 we still talking about fighting, right? 🤣
@@JakeNHale idk are we 😂
@@tclyde865 it’s ultimate FIGHTING championship not wrestling majority of time they’re stood up nothing is happening booing is happening for a reason
Good vid. Too much outro
That outro music was painful to take someone else’s work and then slap your annoying music tag on it and repost it is pretty lame
It always goes the other way. when they should be stood up the ref lets it go to the ground and when someone is in a dominate position for 25 secs, ref will stand em up
bro tf is that outro scared the hell outta me shiiet
The worst thing left behind in the Pride acquisition by the UFC was Yuji Shimada. Ive never once seen him screw up a fight.
That’s what I don’t understand we have past fighters who could judge the fights you got ppl judging a fight and they’ve probably never been in one
Bro your outro is wayy too loud
Honestly I couldn’t believe this is Sandhagen. He looks ten billion times scarier in the octagon. Here he is just a laid back dude.
Like when Maia had Kamarus back, and the ref seperated and had them stand up. If i remember correctly it was Herb Dean, but that guy makes a couple mistakes every card.
Good video, outro is obnoxious though
Joe: the fight should be judged as a whole.
Aldo Joe: if the fight ends with Volk on top of you pounding, Volk win the fight.
Looking at the end point is representative of the whole.
@@DIVAD291 How exactly? Volk was getting rocked and dropped about the same as Islam. Got outstruck a few times and then controlled in R4. It was very competitive up until R5. How is all that reflective of the whole fight when Islam put in better work? I feel like people who say this are just salty fanboys who didn't like the outcome. Would you be saying the same if Islam had that performance?
@@nicholascoob1350 Let's say you have a 500m race.
Runner A has the lead for the first 400 meters but gets passed by Runner B in the last 100 meters.
Who won the race?
If you judge the race based on who won the most individual segments, you would say that A won because he won more 100m "rounds" than B.
If you judge the race as a whole, you would give it to Runner B because overall he covered the 500m faster than A.
The difference between the endpoint and the start is what matters when you judge as a whole.
Variations between arbitrary points within the fight don't.
So if we bring it back to Volk vs Islam. Unlike racing, we stop the fight before it reaches it's actual endpoint for safety/entertainment reasons.
So to me the job of a judge should be to try and predict who would win if the fight kept going until a winner was decided and I think it's fair to say Volk had the advantage by the end due to Islam being very tired.
What’s the problem? Both things are true and volk still won.. you brain dead ?
Who is winning at the end cannot be a criteria if every 5mins the guy get to stop and rest and restart on the feet no matter where he was prior.
Really agree with a lot of their points especially at the end there, not saying the Volk v Islam fight is a great example of this but if a guy is losing 4 rounds to none and whoops the guy for the entire last 5 minutes I think he wins that fight but you physically cannot let him win that fight 4-1 with the current rules
The betting empire would not allow 10 judges.
Fighter safety > Everything else
No lmao then it’s not a fight it’s boring and we won’t know who’s actually better
best part of this video is all the clips have nothing to do with what theyre talking about
Joe wants 10 judges, no stand ups, & fights to happen on a football field. 😂😂
cry about it some more
I agree with the more knowledgeable judges. 10 may be too many, but 5 would be perfect. There has to be at least 5 highly knowledgeable MMA former/ retired fighters that could fill those jobs easily? The question is who are the 5?
Refs should be former fighters/Coaches
Is it outrageous to assume that some judges are being paid under the table by people, bookies, or because they themselves may have a vested interest in the outcome and are receiving a cut of a betting pool or something else? Some judges history is way too shady to just be a coincidence.
Not at all because it has happened in sports
As a fan I'd like to cite Pride FC judges: "ACSHIOOON!"
Mario "If He Dies He Dies" Yamasaki.
Ojeda - Vera? It does NOT take a linguistics/anthropology expert to know why THAT particular judge went for Vera. Call as you SEE them, not how you feel them.
Rogan really lost me at the end with the schoolyard analogy. No point in scoring individual rounds if whoever wins the last 30 seconds wins lol
Cory sounds a little bit like Chris Griffin
The music at the end needs to go!!!
I love the outro music, dont listen to those weenies 😅
I mean I disagree with Joes take here. If you dominate a fight but lose a 30 second sequence (as long as you don’t get KOd, Submitted, or TKOd in that sequence) then you still deserve to win that fight. To me that’s like saying only 4th quarter points matter in football, or only third period goals in hockey. Some biases here because Volk was the under dog and an absolute beauty of a man.
But volk wasn’t being dominated for 4 rounds and 4 and half minutes tho was he, it was a fairly even fight wherein volk was clearly in a better position at the end
@@zacmcloughlin3470 He got controlled in R1 and for the entirety of R4. Did you watch the fight?
@@nicholascoob1350 that’s 2 rounds out 5 buddy, yes Islam defo won those rounds but looking at the full scope of the fight you cannot argue that he was being dominated for the whole fight c’mon
@@zacmcloughlin3470 How was he being dominated? He also outstruck Volk in R2 so I'd say he took that round as well, even rocked Alex in that same round. So that's 3-2. Would you agree he lost then?
@@nicholascoob1350 please read my first comment again, I literally said it was a fairly even fight, and yes I do think based on the current ufc rules that Islam won, my point was it wasn’t a domination but if it wasn’t a regulated fight volk could have easily won
Poor ref lmaoo
Takes you out of the conversation with the quickness
This is the opinion of a grappler enthusiast. The fans are the ones that dictate the expectations. The UFC is exciting bc of finishes. BJJ, Sambo & Wresting don’t command the kind of money to understand the nuances
It’s about the gambling. The judges are in bed with the casinos. If someone is -300/+300 and it goes to the judges. Unless it’s completely one sided by the underdog. The favorite will get the decision every time. Volk vs Islam is best example
Humans through our known existence are used to showing a real exchange of force to show a winner. These submissions are not what really shows the dominance we crave. Up the pay for these beasts and let's let them go as far as they'll allow it.
Waterson was just screwed by judges
I watched the video, there was a part about judges too.
The blonde at 3:10 is perfection. Not only is she bombshell level godess level sexy and beautiful but she's clearly very intelligent and most importantly she's knowledgeable and well spoken in the art of mixed martial arts. I'm actually in love lol
this first [time danas said something i like
and theres no need to act like Dana doesnt want split decisions on every single bout now just so they can go down to the third judge to build up suspense...its so bad.
You could just eliminate rounds and have the fix you need
I ABSOLUTELY AGREE with what Joe was saying about the judges....
I think that the panel should ONLY consist of coaches & trainers....
As they have been there & done it & know all the moves themselves....
Rather than using Old Farts who doesn't know their own head from their arse....
Let alone a rear naked choke & a guillotine....
Though NOT retired fighters....
As we all know....
Fighters come with a lot of history between them....
Which will show itself in the form of bigotry....
Under the nouns & synonyms of....
Pride & Prejudice, Obstinate & bias opinions.
I agree with Joe on that last part but i feel like it’s too big of a change to have right now
I kind of agree, too, but it is a 'chicken or the egg' thing for me strategy-wise. If athletes understand that, as a whole, what they do per individual round is not as important as how they finish, the byproduct I feel would be less urgency through the beginning stages of a fight, since you'd think most would conserve their energy in anticipation of finishing strong.
It might be a scoring change that works for some types but not for all. It would certainly influence training and performance tactics. My question is if the result would be less of an emphasis on establishing a strong, pressure-friendly pace that displeases the organization as well as the fans. As for me, I think MMA has emphasized stand-up fighting far too much -- in other words, I don't believe fighters should ever be stood-up due to lack of action or initiative. If one athlete is just laying on another following a takedown, and then proceeds to do nothing from top, I don't care how boring it is. The guy on bottom or in a disadvantageous position should not receive an opportunity to stand up, period. If you're not adept in skill enough to escape, sweep, or create a scramble, then that is a problem with your skill-set.
Whoever edited this doesnt knkw what theyre doing. Why did this come up in my feed
Ya I wouldn't be happy going three rounds and then not being able to finish. I HAVE to finish, always. Especially since my wife is Finnish.
Great video until the end when the video decided to blow out my ears.
Cause nobody but hobby bjj enthusiasts want to see a stalemate on the ground
Lol a fighter pretending to still chase a win but really wants out 😅 and Yamasaki is like nope continue this fighter is a warrior 😂
That may be the worst outro I’ve ever seen please never again
Hard disagree on everything that was talked about in the first 2 minutes
I'm with Jake Shields if you get taken down it's your job to stand up or submit or sweep that's MMA don't winge or cry that's the game
shouldnt Joe be having this discussion with Dana???? Danas the guy that doesnt like the ground game because its "not exciting"....
Should rounds start, how the previous round ended 🤔
If it wasn't scored round by round I'd say that would actually be a good idea.
Nah it's judged round by round so it would be insanely unfair for the fighter in a worse position, the breaks in-between rounds are meant for fighters to gameplan and improve, a shit ton of fights wouldn't end the way they ended if it was like this
How would that work practically tho, if the fight goes 4 rounds on the feet and then one fighter gets a takedown in the last second to secure a round, does that mean the final round should start on the ground? Seems a bit unfair to me
That's how kamaru lost the first fight, herb broke them up because of boos
I think the 10 point must system is the stupidest thing I ever heard of. I have seen tones of rounds I'd score 1 to 1.05. :D
It always confuses me how rare are draws in mma. I know that too many draws would make fights indecisive and pointless in the eyes of casual fan but there was a bunch of fights that just should be contested draws. In very close championship fights draws should result in reigning champion staying a champion and rematch should be in the making.
sorry joe but jens pulver disagrees with MORE judges. Quality over quantity ALWAYS. And YES, the judges should be FORCED to explain WHY they scored certain rounds the way they did, especially if it's a bs slip decission when 95% of people watching can see a clear winner
Corey is adorable asf
Volk indeed got em
Nah one FC scoring sucks
During the current scoring criteria, I do believe Islam won that fight 3-2, but I hear Joe's point. The fight ended with massive momentum for Volk, and that can feel a bit jarring for many.
Jumpscare ass ending
sandhagen won the fight clean as day
Are they boxing refs?
ufc
Need more judges and more nuanced scoring system. 10 to 9 is too vague. Can be a coin toss where both guys had big moments and it's just 10 9. Same scoring if one guy gets completely controlled the entire round. Stupid. If it was out of 100 you could give the close round something like 100 98. Then if theres a round where a guy gets soundly beat you'd give it 100 88 or something so even if you "Lost" the first round that was close you'd be way ahead in points instead of just tied 1 to 1. 5 or 7 judges would be a big improvement too, would need more than 2 wacky opinions to flip a fight.
And I still think Volk won that fight😂
I haven't personally met a single person who doesn't
@@prettzx I was torn at first but then I watched it without commentary and seemed like a clear 3-2 for Islam
Just people from Russia and Muslims are the only ones , anyone with a brain knows who actually won
Sometimes joe has some dumb takes, if the last round was all it matters then fighters would just turtle up and bang it out in the last round. Volk didn't get shit and got out struck by a wrestler.
Joe's "schoolyard analogy" makes zero sense. Islam finished two rounds completely controlling Volkanovski on the ground, and the only reason Volkanovski got up was because the round ended. Why on earth should his analogy only count for the final round when Volkanovski is on top? By Joe's own logic Islam won the fight.
If that is the case, then they should allow knees/kicks to the head of a grounded opponent. How about head butts too, or any other subjective rule.
They created rules to both in fighter safety as well as make it more entertaining for the fans.
Wrestlers already get unfair bias in the UFC, with damage usually coming runner up to "octagon control". Like I can just push a guy up against the fence or lay on top of him doing no damage whatsoever and expect to win a fight. Even if the other guy landed more clean attacks and I took more damage.
the boxing style scoring of 10-9 rounds is so stupid and outdated theres not enough rounds for that to effectively judge a fight properly. Should go to judging the fight by whole like the pride days
most relevant part of the clip: Joe: "He won that fight.. ..Volk got em.." #GiveTheManHisSecondBelt
Volk absolutely did not win. The last 20-30 seconds of a fight don’t count more. Idk how anyone can watch that fight and think volk won
Wrestling exists and nobody watches why would you want that in the UFC??
Exactly, I'm a former wrestler and have no desire to watch it for 20 minutes or so