STOP playing with a pickleball paddle that is WRONG for you
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- čas přidán 21. 07. 2024
- A pickleball paddle that is too heavy for you can lead to poor play (too slow to get it in position) and potential arm pain (more weight = more stress to your arm). While the weight of your paddle is important (scale weight), the weight of your paddle as it swings is actually more important (swing weight).
In this video we share with you how to calculate your paddle's balance. Just how head-heavy is your pickleball paddle?
You can access our Paddle Selection as well as our Paddle Optimization guides by visiting us here: betterpickleball.com/paddles/
0:00 Intro to Paddle Swing Weight
1:13 Head Heaviness Explanation
8:00 Tools you will need to calculate Swing weight
9:20 Calculating Balance Line and Centerline to calculate your paddle’s head heaviness
12:37 Comparison and analysis between two paddle swing weights
15:13 Conclusion: The Three Factors that determine Swing Weight
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Tony
Better Pickleball Player Development
Tony@BetterPickleball.com
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Great Presentation and superb instruction delivery! For visual learners like myself, your presentation is a HOME RUN.
Thank you Ron - glad it helped.
GREAT VIDEO, GREAT INFO! As you have already written your letter to manufacturer's, I predict this info will now be included on the face of all paddles in the future. THANK YOU FOR THIS TIP!
Thank you
I have the invicta paddle in your example. I had to slow it down swing rate wise because despite its static weight and balance point, it’s resistance moving through the air seemed to be the critical factor. It seemed to fly through the air so quickly. i. e. The physics involved are more complex and have a huge amount of effect from air moving around an edge less paddle and with cutout throat. All very interesting components. The points in ur video are super important especially compared to just the static weight Love ur videos btw
Thanks Sal. You are 100% spot on that paddle shape, including the gap in the throat, will affect how quick the paddle is. I wish the manufacturers would help us out a bit more on weight by giving us the information we need to make intelligent decisions.
Thank you! Interesting and helpful.
Glad it was helpful Bill
In the 90's Wilson played with a series of head heavy racquets. They caused a lot of arm problems. I dial my paddles in at 10 oz , but I place the weight in the handle to change the balance.
Didn’t know about the Wilson rackets. Thanks for sharing it.
Excellent video!!
Ty John.
I see a lot of pros are now adding lead tape from the balance line to the handle. It adds weight, but doesn't change the swing weight as much as putting the lead tape above the balance line. I tried it and it made some paddles that I didn't like into a paddle that I do like.
100% - get our Paddle Optimization Guide for more on lead tape. I will put it in the pinned comment.
Great video! While not a factor for determining swing weight, another factor affecting forearm stress is grip circumference. Too small a grip circumference for one's hand can lead to squeezing the handle too frequently.
💯 agreed
@@BestPickleballCoach I find that I naturally squeeze the paddle too hard sometimes especially at the net. I used to play tennis and used to do the 2 finger test the 2 finger test. I started getting golf elbow in pickleball but took some time off from a calf injury. I started doing weight lifting forearm curls and I noticed no real pain. But when I play too long like 3 and a half hours with little rest I can feel a little discomfort. I found that a lighter paddle caused more arm pain because I was trying to generate more speed thereby gripping the paddle harder.
I know that some people swear by these paddles that are supposed to take the strain of the elbow like Kennex. I think different paddles work for different people. I have a heavier paddle now and it's working fine. I am even considering using lead tape. But my theory is, if you can't play, no paddle is going to help you.
@@nighthawk292 agree 100% that different paddles work for different players (different strokes applies pretty literally here). Some off-court exercise and stretching will help with that as well. Thanks for sharing with us and joining us on the journey.
@@nighthawk292 appreciate the information.
For simplicity, you can place one piece of tape vertically and draw both lines on it. Great info! Thank you.
True :).
Great information! I've never heard of swing weight before. . .and have been suffering from a sore elbow. Improving swing mechanics has helped but I'm sure my paddle with +12 on your swing weight calculation has not helped.
Most players are unaware of this important paddle characteristic. +12 is head heavy for sure
Good job Tony.
Thank you Jim
Thanks for the video. Interesting info. 1 issue I have: You give length of paddle as a measure of resistance in swinging, but longer paddles also have less width, as a compensation. It seems to me 'area' of the paddle would be more of a concern in creating resistance. I say this, because just by a slight swing through the air, I actually just 'feel' more resistance swinging a paddle that is more conventional (exactly like the wide/ thinner paddle shown in this video), vs my elongated paddle (also similar to the 2nd paddle shown in the video). I think how much the edge guard allows air to enter would also be a factor?? creating drag, = resistance = need for force to overcome... & 'weight' = force needing in swinging/ swing weight.
Appreciate the comment. I was not trying to refer to wind resistance. Was referring to the increased lever of the longer paddle. Let me know if that makes more sense. Thanks
Great video. I apologize if I missed it but when shopping for a new paddle and definitely needing more of a head light paddle, short of purchasing one and preforming the test, how are we to know? I never see a head heavy factor in any paddle specs sheet.
No apology required. Only way now is by swinging one paddle and then another. Check out our paddle selection guide. It’s free and you can get it at the above link (first comment). There’s a demo program you can use to get a few paddles and compare.
Thanks for the video. I'm intrigued, and my wife is probably going to wonder what im doing when i have half a dozen paddles dangling off of the kitchen table edge 😂 today.
Im assuming the number, like 117 swing weight is what comes from a fancy swing weight machine?
I am sure it was a sight to see :). That is correct. I am learning that there is actually a difference in how you set up the machine too. Interesting stuff. I think once you have a baseline paddle you know the comparison does the job.
There is very little information online as well as from manufacturers about swing rate. At most, you will find the static rate listed in the specs. I currently play with a 220 gram elongated no name paddle and started having wrist pain after 5 months of playing 3 x p/week (2 hr sessions). I found a racket called the Om Aero which actually does list the specs as static weight 230 grams, swing weight 109 and twist weight 7.0. Problem is I have no idea what that really means and whether it's going to alleviate my wrist pain.
Thanks for your comment. Agree - it is needlessly challenging for players to dig up all this information. Coincidentally, we are reaching out to Om to check out their paddle.
So do you determine balance line before or after you add weights to your paddle. The location of the weights will affect the balance.
Think of balance as something to keep in mind at all times. The calculation itself is just information you will use. As you add weight, consider how it will impact the swingweight of the paddle. Some players want a sledgehammer out there. I prefer a paddle set up for hand speed. Personal choice but understanding balance and swingweight will help any player purchase and then adapt the paddle to their preference.
Interesting information however would you agree that any modifications to the paddle e.g. wraps change the dynamics of the paddle?
Depends. Lead tape for sure. But overgrips and edge protection tape is likely negligible to paddle movement.
@@BestPickleballCoach Thanks and thanks for all you do for the great game of Pickleball!
@@smcdonald1229 our pleasure :)
First I think this is great information applicable to all players and really like the demo of how to calculate SW/points like tennis without a balance board. Just a couple of caveats. Its very important to make sure the desk or surface you area laying the paddle on is level, otherwise the paddle will tip/balance inaccurately. Also in your demo the Selkirk Invicta is 16.5 inches long vs the 16 inches you stated and as such the balance point is actually 8.25 inches which changes the HH measurement you calculated. Think you really should have done some homework online or simply measured it prior to doing calculation as this may confuse your viewers if they try to replicate the measurement. Overall a great demo though. Goes to say that if you have elbow issues you should strive for a more head light paddle (or add weight in the form of lead tape on butt end of paddle to make it more head light).
Appreciate the thoughtful comment. I must have whiffed the length. My bad there. Working on going deeper on the subject. Stay tuned for more.
I wish I had seen this video sooner. I have developed tennis elbow - which will take me out for 3 months probably. It was with the CRBN 1x, which has a small grip that I should have overgripped but which also may have a swing weight that’s too high.
Sorry you’re in pain and sidelined and hope these concepts help you avoid similar issues in the future. Get better soon.
Forgot to mention that we have an elbow pain video that you might find interesting as well. It is on this channel. Take care
Same thing happened to me with the CRBN 1x. Returned it and got the 6.0 Double Black Diamond with a swing weight of 114 instead of 122 and my tennis elbow is much better. I also took two weeks off and did strengthening and stretching exercises during those two weeks and that helped a lot as well.
@@ljbar2015 glad you’re feeling better
@@ljbar2015 I’ve been doing better with the Vatic Prism Flash. Next I may try the Ronbus R1 Pulsar, though it may be stiffer.
Whats the best paddle tennis elbow? Is there a table that gives swing weights by brand
Unfortunately, no one publishes swingweight yet. A good paddle to avoid tennis elbow is the Diadem Icon (note - not the V2 - the original Icon. There may be a few of the original Icons still available out there. You can also check out the Pro Kennex line - they focus on avoiding elbow pain and make good paddles.
Does swing weight affect a shoulder injury? As it may tennis elbow?
Cannot say 100%. I would look at mechanics plus weight. Perhaps visit with a PT in your area might be able to suss it out. Hope this helps.
So I came up with a 9 on one of my jpaddles and an 11 on another. How does that equate to Pickleball Studios and Piackleball Effects of 100 +?
I am not 100% sure how they correlate. That said - think of swing weight in relative terms. Same weight, more head heavy = greater swing weight or torque on your arm.
When I see swing weights the numbers are 114 or 125. Is this twist weight? There is a pdf that a couple podcasters did with the info on all paddles. What would be an ideal swing weight or twist weight for a female player not to get arm fatigue?PP
Those are great questions. We are working with our friends at Total Pickleball on this very project. Still a work in progress. Visit here for details
twu.tennis-warehouse.com/learning_center/pickleball/paddlespecstool.php
@@BestPickleballCoach thank you
Could you please advise if there is definite effect of the airhole above the neck of the paddle or it is a gimmick
Hello. The hole does 3 things: 1 - increases paddle flex 2 - lowers weight and 3 - reduces air pressure.
@@BestPickleballCoach thank you. Can the air hole effect noticeable though? I see majority of paddle do not have it and still make top 10 list. Ths weight of the paddle is the same for paddies without air hole and it is not an issue as I see several videos recommending increase of swing weight with bare weight reaching 10oz. Increase in Flexibility at the neck would cause drop in power so the question stands . Is air hole a gimmick?
@@yasim9435 I do not see it as a gimmick. That said. I would not buy a paddle just because it has (or does not) a neck hole. Gotta find the paddle that feels good to you
What's the purpose of the hole in the Selkirk paddles?
I am not 100% sure what they were intending with it, but I can tell you it makes the paddle easier to move around.
Where can I find you letter you submitted to mfg. Im a mfg and I have a paddle coming to market at the 3rd or 4th qtr of this year. I believe in this swing weight feature and would like to have it accounted for in my paddles
Hello Tee. Here’s the letter
betterpickleball.com/open-letter-to-pickleball-paddle-manufacturers/
Good luck with the project.
If you have a paddle that is your favourite, and that you feel comfortable with, and it seems to get you more points, etc, etc. then when you get another paddle, match it's balance line to your favourite, by adding weight to the handle or the head top. I did that with my Selkirk Invicta, and matched it to my Singleton, ... The Selkirk now is almost as good as my Singleton, .. I no longer want to use it as a wheel ramp for my car.
:)
While this is good info, it does not help me pick a paddle. So for a female with pickleball elbow, are you saying I need a lower swing weight? If so, below what swing weight number is recommended? Would lead tape help and if so should it be placed higher on paddle (like on the top) or lower (like from mid point to the grip)???
For tennis elbow check this video out. Elbow pain is a bit more complex than a lighter paddle but that oftentimes helps.
Feeling Elbow Pain? FIX IT by knowing the cause and how to solve it
czcams.com/video/uNiVAnDPVuY/video.html
I need a very lightweight paddle 7 ounces because of my pickle ball elbow but I find when they spin the ball and hits hard on the paddle I don’t have much to lift it up with. is that because the paddle is too light even though that’s what I need? People weight their paddles to make them heavier so that they can hit harder and whatever I can’t do that with mine. Edited because I wrote it on a hurry and it auto corrected
7 ounces you probably mean
@@brianbanks3044 oops that would be heavy
Wipe their paddles? I am not sure what that means but i have the same issue with spin. The ball seems to die when it hits my paddle. I think that may be due to it being a soft control type paddle more than just its weight as it's about average at 8 ounces. I'm interested in what others will say.
Nice work Tony. You ere way ahead of the pack on this a few years ago. 👍🏻
@@wafarris yes I edited. People weight their paddles at the corners near the handle to get more speed. My paddle is very light and I can’t lift a spin that hits the paddle like concrete.
i wish there could be a consistent method to these types of numbers...i have seen you use 8 for swing weight while many other sites use 110-130 for numbers....
I agree. We have published an open letter to paddle manufacturers asking them to agree on a convention. The one we used in the video and that we propose to the manufacturers is the one that tennis companies have used for years now. It at least gives us relative information between paddles and as you get to know what 8 means, you can then decide if you want 8 or another number.
So you have to purchase the paddle first. Yes, they should publish the swing weight.
They should for sure. You can test friend’s paddles to get an idea. Use demo program to check different paddles before purchase.
Can Swing Weight be calculated?
Hello Bill. I have seen a machine with a hook arm sticking out of it that swings the paddle around figuring out the weight it applies as it moves. So, yes - I believe it can be figured. Us mere mortals, however, usually lack the requisite methodology. Hence the open letter to the manufacturers to help us out by providing it. Balance helps get us closer.
@@BestPickleballCoach Thanks - I tend to add weight to my paddles but, before I do, I start with the static weight and factory balance points. Once I get the paddle close to my preferred weight, I add weight to get to my preferred balance points - without buying a machine to measure it, I've always wondered how much my swing weights vary.
@@billkennedy401 the most important factor - regardless of measurement - is how the paddle players for you. Love the approach.
While I appreciate what you’re trying to explain here, there are a couple problems.
You show a method to measure balance point relative to the center of the paddle. That’s a convention in tennis, but most racquets are a standard length of 27 inches. Pickleball paddles are more variable in length, so it doesn’t make sense to use the center as a reference. In your example, the Selkirk paddle is less head-heavy than the Franklin paddle, but the Franklin paddle is shorter. The distance from the hand to the balance point may actually be shorter with the Franklin paddle (need measurements to confirm). The reference should be the end of the handle. It's even easier, as there’s no need to determine the center. Just determine the balance point and measure the distance to the end of the handle.
Also, swingweight is a measurement of moment of inertia. You can get a relative idea of swingweight from mass and balance for paddles of similar construction, but it doesn’t work when comparing paddles of dissimilar construction or if the manufacturer or user adds weight to the paddle.
For example, consider adding 10 grams of weight to two identical paddle. For paddle A, the weight is added at the balance point. For paddle B, the weight is split. Half is added at the tip of the paddle, and half is added to the handle such that the balance point is unchanged. In both cases, the resulting mass and balance point are the same, but the swingweight of paddle B will be much higher.
Seems reasonable to use the end of the grip as the starting point. The balance point is more of a relative figure in any event. Alone it does not give us the information we are looking for - swing weight. The good news is that there are a growing number of spaces where swing weight can be found. Appreciate the thoughtful comment and your adding to the process. Take care.
@@BestPickleballCoach I get that you're trying to get a relative approximation of swingweight with mass and balance point. It's just that using the center as a reference only works if comparing paddles of the same length. And then, approximating relative swingweight from mass and balance point only works for paddles of similar construction with no added weight. Players would be better off trying to find swingweight data for the paddles they want to compare. Swingweight (moment of inertia) can't actually be determined from mass and balance point measurements. The paddle must be swinging.
@@briffidi agreed. Again - thanks for the thoughtful back and forth. Happy to converse any time :).
The midpoint of the paddle is the midpoint of the paddle. If the paddle is 16 inches long the midpoint is 8 inches. The center of gravity is when one half of the mass (weight) is on each side of the line. If he uses these terms, his description would sound more scientific.
Appreciate the comment
This doesn't apply to all players. Doing warmup, stretches, forearm exercise, strengthen muscles, proper technique, and taking rest helps prevent Tennis Elbow.
Agreed that you can take steps to reduce chances of forearm problems. But wrong paddle can definitely be problematic.
But where that hole is on the paddle is where half my shots hit !
Love it :).
Fulcrum.. What about the length of your handle and where you hold it ? I tend to hold my 5 3/4" handle towards the end . I see others choked way up on their handle . Even as far as ping pong grip with the finger on the back .
The more you choke up the lower the lever effect of the weight at the other end of the paddle. More control less power if you choke up. As most things in life: a tradeoff :).