Frame Generation for Every Game - AMD Fluid Motion Frames Analyzed
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Video Index
00:00 - Welcome to Hardware Unboxed
03:11 - AFMF Has Frame Pacing Issues
07:02 - Fluid Motion Frames Image Quality
09:27 - AFMF Doesn't Handle UI Well
12:02 - AFMF Latency
13:26 - Final Thoughts
Frame Generation for Every Game - AMD Fluid Motion Frames Analyzed
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Outro music by David Vonk/DaJaVo - Věda a technologie
The latest oct 13 preview driver has been a massive improvement to my eyes. Would love to see a retest
I got the preview driver before that update. Do I need to reinstall the driver to get that or is it automatically got the fixes they did?
Has anyone tested if it works on Zen 4 series igpu which is rdna2?
I would like to test it on videos
igpus arent supported @@batelcho
The latest preview driver (4th patch, iirc) improves frame times massively. I presume the retest is due
they should just test it when it's officially out.
Also quality, look SO MUCH better, and HDR support!
@@marceelino Agree, every preview update will probably add significant changes.
And test with Elden Ring. It's locked at 60FPS for gameplay reasons but getting that 120FPS smoothness is now possible and it's amazing. If they get it working with FreeSync it will be perfect.
The soulsborne games are extremely popular and that's just 1 use case.
This review was very poor as they comoared it to DLSS FG and FSR3, this has different usecases. And since it's AMD only it's legit a selling point, assuming reviewers do their job well.
Even smaller techtubers picked up on all the possible use cases yet HUB has nothing positive to say about it?!
@@marceelino but then they can't milk it for many videos, despite hurting AMD's image by testing it in all the wrong games and not realizing what it's truly best for.
All Soulsborne games can now be played with 120FPS smoothness, no noticeable input lag and no noticeable artifacts. Considering their popularity, this is huge, and that's just 1 use case. Big W for AMD here.
Today's driver update makes it SO MUCH better, looks so much more crisp, I almost thought it was off, and HDR support, a very very good update, impressed with the speed and quality of these drivers.
What update?
@@fervargraider5274 AMD put out an update to the AFMF preview driver today that improves pacing and adds HDR support for AFMF.
Ficou muito Bom!! Agora eu vejo a fluidez!!👁️👁️
Which driver version is that?
@@fervargraider5274I believe the latest drivers are numbered something like 23.10.???
You have to got to AMDs website to find it as Adrenalin isn’t showing them at the moment.
I also think it doesn’t feature AFMF. But I did see some 3-5 fps gains after I updated from AFMF beta to the new driver.
Works amazing in MMOS. You don't turn the camera super fast, you're staring at one spot.
Works wonders in those dense towns, or in raids/world bosses.
Honestly I think this works best when playing with a gamepad. Mouse movement is jerky & unpredictable, while analog aiming has more gradual sweeping movements. You're also less sensitive to input latency that way & you get to just enjoy the motion fluidity. Not a great fit for every game genre, but racing, flight & RPG games are great. Even FPS when playing singleplayer at lower difficulties, or when the games are slower-paced.
I've been trying AFMF on all of my games to really give it a go, 7900XTX at 4k 120hz. Overall I really like it, zero frame pacing issues for me. My critiques are covered in this HU video: UI and crosshairs struggle noticeably when moved quickly over complex backgrounds, no ability to really limit FPS to match my monitor. The added latency was low enough that I definitely appreciate it. If they continue to improve it, it is a great addition with potential considering its universal use. FSR3 should of course be the focus and all devs should make it an option since it is so accessible to users - even old Nvidia GPUs.
I really liked it as well. I used it to play RE4 1440p 240hz +RT high at around 190fps, and it was glorious. I've misssed the HDR option but as of yesterday's driver that is no longer a limitation.There is a frame cap option in the driver but it's confusing how it is interpreted with AFMF. I honestly couldn't care less for flickering menus or vsync compatibility
I get lost with all these new additional features, it must make testing and reviewing an absolute nightmare. Congratulations on a VERY well deserved 1m subs, great work as always, guys.
Not really. They test with them all disabled unless it's a specific feature test like here. Native rendering is king. Native rendering performance is what we pay for. The rest is just potentially a bonus if you happen to fit a use-case where it works well enough to bother with.
I am actually curious of how AFMF will work in a heavily CPU bound scenario like Baldur's Gate III. Especially since you play it more in a slow, tactical table top perspective. If it helps smoothing out animations as well as camera pans/rotation that's okay with me. Ultimately, both FSR3 and FMF feel like they are in a beta-stage at the time being, So I really hope AMD can improve the technology over time! Personally I really want VRR to work, with good frame pacing and a framerate cap at the monitors max refresh-range. If AMD can reach that point one day, it would make me an extremely happy gamer. (And of course, native implementation of FSR3 frame generation in BGIII)
Yeah, BG3 has been my Main use-case since this was announced.
I don’t remember which channel covered BG3 with AFMF but it was covered.
I've found Forza Motorsport to be the best candidate to the point where I would actually use it because FSR doesn't give you much performance back and AFMF works really well in that game.
I tried it with bg3 and it does feel better. Just like in oxygen not included.
You should take a look at what's happening over on Linux. Valve and AMD are currently pushing, close to release, most of the stuff you're asking for. You should look at MESA, Wayland, Gamescope and the KDE Desktop ( for VRR ).
Massive 1 Mil subs! Congratulations!
I love that amd is bringing this feature in, can't wait to see how it improves over the next year.
HDR is the only reason I haven't tried this tech yet but AMD is doing the correct thing working this out in a public test branch. I'm not 100% certain what the intended use case is for this technology but I guess it's hard to complain about the option being available.
I mean you can still use it just dont use it in games you have a great frame rate in. The driver does disable screen recording tho. Or atleast i cant get mine to work.
And its usecase is NVIDIA did a thing, the media hyped it up so much that AMD was forced to release a tech prior to it being ready for tech older than rdna3
HDR works with latest driver version.
@@retro-jw9mswhere to download the update?
There's a newer version, try that one.
Been following this channel for several years, congrats on hitting 1 mil+. Cheers!
congratulations on hitting 1 million subs 😊
Congrats on the million subs and great job on the thorough and constructive analysis of this technology!
Anyone finding its harder to watch these videos with the whole youtube 3 video blocker problem?
I now checked enough games and have to say the latest preview driver seems to work very well. Hitman 3, Green Hell, Medieval Dynasty I restrict my frames to 50% of my monitor refresh rate (via riva statistic from MSI afterburner) and then activate AFMF I have my refresh rate maxed out. My Graphics card only uses 80% of the power because it only has to render 80 frames even though I could do more. This way I save power, less noises from the fans and the experience is pretty good.
It works OK for Red Dead Redemption 2, Cyberpunk and sons of the forrest.
Starfield and some other titles are a bit of stuttefest still, but in total it already works OK for a preview driver. This feature is good to max out you refresh rate by already havin solid base fps. And it also can save power usage of you graphic card.
I've starting using AFMF yesterday on my RX 6800 + R7 5800X3D, and I couldn't notice any difference at all to the the image quality. It was so dam good! On ultra, games where I was getting 100 fps, I've started getting 200 with AFMF on. I believe the latast update improved the overall image quality, because the things I saw in the video I couldn't notice at all. The only game I saw something strange was Days Gone, where I had a few chimearing on the crosshair, but nothing major. I believe it's a must use feature, I hope they make it viable to more cards, so people can test it by their on eyes and hands. PS: I'm currently running a 240hz display.
How to enable it? Or it's only an amd thing?
@@butterfly3737 AFMF stands for Amd Fluid Motion Frames. For now we have only the preview software, and it works only for the RX 6000 and 7000 series AMD GPUS. For Nvidia you should look after Frame Generation, and I guess, DLSS 3, which only works in specific games, where devs implement it. Thus, AFMF works on the software level, not needing any implementation in the games by the devs. Hope I helped you in anyway.
OCT 13 driver resolved issues I had with frame pacing and screen tearing (as well as the driver timeout issue on tabbing-out, at least as far as I can see). VRR seems to be fixed, at least on my setup.
I had reported to AMD the tearing issue on OCT 6 driver when it opened up to 6000 series, and 6 days later here is the new driver resolving that issue in particular.
not seeing any update for 0ct 13??
@@TheFob34 search for the preview drivers, there's the oct 6 (presumably what they tested) and there is a new driver for OCT 13
@@stevenbasher5363 I was running the September 29th update but have found the October 13th ,thank you
yep, I was afraid they will announce the issues when they are already fixed but they did. daniel owens and vex made a much better showcase of the technology.
@@Davinmk don't get me wrong, their main criticisms are still valid
- the quality of the generated frames is subpar in certain scenarios due to limited information (motion vectors)
- the introduced lag/latency is noticeable at anything below about 120fps on mouse (and about 70/80 on controller imo). Where this shines is ultimately super high refresh rate (165+ hz) and CPU limited scenarios, say 120 -> 240hz
- there are still minor cases of stutter, some bugs surrounding resolution switching, and refresh rate modes
- it does not work with vsync on in engine, which can not always be disabled.
- it does not feel good at anything below 50fps at all. This tech is not, and probably will not, be able to make up for that. You still need to enable upscaling or turn down settings to achieve 60fps+ at a bare minimum, so the 30-45fps crowd hoping to go up to 60/75fps are outta luck with this tech.
The benefit, however, is that it _can_ be enabled in like, 90% of all games ever. Whether it's the best option or not, especially looking at some older games or console ports that are locked to 60. I'm most excited to see how it behaves with emulators like rpcs3 and console exclusive games. I tested it out with (PC) Skyrim and, despite some artifacting, that type of game with a frame limit worked really well at 120.
Congrats on 1 million! Keep up the good work!
Also i heard u can use this as a replacement for the original fluid motion tech amd had for videos, i think someone got it working by using a gaming profile for a media app and got it working that way when enabling afmf on it then i think it worked. Good for rdna cards as i think they stopped support in drivers for them compared to vega 56 when i had it on in that tho i could never get it working somehow even tho was in the drivers with that card.
What's the point when you can use rife on vulkan?
And then they got it working again right?
Congratulations on the 1m subscribers lads, much deserved.
w000t 1mil subs! Gratz guys, here's to another mil!
Congratz on 1million:)
Talk about a quiet 1 Million subs party! I found out on Paul's hardware. Congrats you guys! It's ok to celebrate, and toot your own horn a bit! You know it was a lot of hard d work to get here!
I just got the preview driver to check it out. It seems way less blurry now I would love to see a retest and a comparison as I have no idea how the older patches looked like irl...
The new preview driver seems to have corrected this issue. Also, you should test double gpu system (with one amd and nvidia gpu) using the nvidia gpu to render the game and the amd one as the display output (and enabling afmf), because, on my end, this seems to be working.
Right now, my 3090 with dlaa is using afmf in cyberpunk :)
That would be a big plus if amd make afmf possible for their egpu.
I'm curious. What's your use case for a dual gpu system across brands? Does having ALL the drivers give your system random issues? Please tell me this is running on an Intel CPU.
That said, how exactly do you configure it to run the game on nVidia card, and then how do you configure AFMF with the AMD card as output?
Congratulations for 1million subscribers!
1 Million Subs!!! Thank you for your work guys!
I've been subbed since the blue shirt guy days, congratulations on 1M!!! You guys deserve it 100%
From the small amount I've messed around with for the full release, it feels and looks like it's maybe a bit better than whats shown in this video
Grats on the 1m subs, I know it's old tech but can we compare frame generation vs sli/crossfire?
Tried it on the robocop demo, and due to the type of game it is it worked pretty well.
dont forget a lot of this is pixel peeping stuff to specifically find issues, in general it actually might very playable and fine.
This video came out during the October 6th update. AMD has had 3 updates since then and all the Nvidiots keep referring to this video to talk badly about AFMF when they dont even realize that their GPU is now slower since then. Here are the updates since then please pin this so people dont get confused with what the actual performance is. December 7th - What’s New?
Updated to include all changes and improvements from AMD Software: Adrenalin Edition 23.12.1.
Improvements to stutter and pacing when AFMF is active.
General improvements to the stability of AFMF.
November 9th - What’s New?
Improvements to driver stability during task switching.
Improvements to resolve cases of AMD Software: Adrenalin Edition™ intermittently crashing, or failing to display metrics.
October 13th - What’s New?
We have added initial support for HDR to expand the AFMF gaming experience.
After monitoring user experience feedback, AFMF can now be globally enabled on all DirectX® 11 and 12 titles.
Users may use the per-app settings to individually disable or enable AFMF.
Improvements to frame pacing have been made, resulting in an overall smoother gameplay experience and improved image quality.
(AFMF Config for smoothness) set a frame cap to a frame rate that matches or divides into the native frame rate of the monitor this works really well and helps with frame pacing. I run AFMF with AMD Super Resolution and 20% sharpening to upscale games with higher frame rate and resolution it looks great and makes game look amazing at 5k upscale resolution. I can run it on all games where I want to turn up all the eye candy with double fps it really does work you just have get your settings right. On a high refresh monitor with a frame cap it works well the key is the fps cap, set fps cap to keep gpu below 95% usage with the rule of running at native refresh rate or one that divides evenly this will make it smooth and avoid micro stutters. Also make sure your game is running at least 90fps or higher to keep input lag manageable the higher your fps cap the lower the input lag will be with AFMF. You can make custom CRU profiles for your monitor to create different refresh rates to fine tune everything for good frame pacing.👍
This was awesome! Thank you Tim. So informative and interesting 😊
I've been using it literally ever since the preview driver and it's f****** amazing
Might eyes just might be getting old but I can’t see any difference except when it’s slowed down to 2% speed.
Happy One Million!
I would like to see this used on something that isn’t 1st or 3rd person. Like a scenario where a lower end user might want to go from 30fps to ~60 on something turn based for example.
Hey guys, with the new October 13 version of AFMF, the feature runs WAYYY better.
I think it deserves a new video because it went from unusable to really good.
Think this need a retest in the near future as updates seem to be coming fast.
Maybe doing another test and add in comparison with motion interpolation on TVs such as Samsung, Sony etc which also does not have acess to game vector data?
Hey Tim, i wonder if the local capture would be better or worse using something like OBS instead or ReLive?
Congratulations on ! million subs! You really deserve even more!
Came here from Paul's Hardware, congrats on hitting 1 million!
While I do not like idea of fake frames and upscaling in general (no matter who puts makes them), you have slight pebkac there. (Would check how well that capture card actually support freesync. And how it times captured frames which came at varying time intervals. You know, video streams tend to have static intervals between frames while variable refresh rate... varies in pacing. And if capture card supports VFR, how accurate it actually is in measuring variation in source.)
I tested it as soon as experimental driver became available and here is simple description how it works and how it does not:
- There are motion artifacts. They are object/geometry/pattern based therefore they appear around certain objects in motion. Higher the source fps, smaller they get.
- Statement that each generated frame is on screen longer than real frame is false, unless use case is something like source 75fps -> 165fps generation.
- Game with motion problems get them exaggerated. Example: Vermintide 2 limited to 30fps feels like 2 frames move forward, one back. Enabling FG makes motion smoother, but it still warps in time. Same game at 60 fps no longer has this problem, and generated frames are time-smooth too with proper pacing. No motion problems when generating from 90/120fps too.
- At 4:00, You show what appears to be v-sync off tearing, but that's not the case on AMD's HW unless you disable Freesync. (Proper use of AMD's graphics is to use FS ON + V-Sync OFF and use global fps limit 2~4 fps under max refresh rate.) I noticed this effect when generating frames from original 60fps, it is gone when generating from 90fps+. It is not between GPU and monitor, it is somewhere in software pipeline. (This means it is problem fixable in software.)
- As been stated by AMD, this is not to make your 40fps game run 90fps. It is to take your game from 90fps to 165fps. Best use case is for people with those new 480/540Hz screens as very few games can reach such fps. But they can reach 160~200fps and then generation gets them to finish line.
Tested on: Ryzen 7 7700X + DDR5 6000MHz; RX 7900 XTX; S3422DWG 3440x1440@144Hz HDR via DisplayPort
- Do I recommend it? No, those things will never work good enough to not feed some flickering artifacts to your brain at lower fps, even if they are unnoticeable to some people. And most of people who enable upsacling and frame generation, do it because they struggle to reach high fps. (And when source is bad, generated content is bad too.)
- If I still played at my older 240Hz AW2518HF, I would consider it in games where I get around 160~180 fps due to CPU limitations. There it may do some good, but people who game at under 90fps should not touch those things. Because any problem game has on visual side or pacing side will get exaggerated.
Biggest tragedy in gaming performance is that stupid promotion of 4K screens.
2nd biggest tragedy is that manufacturers do not make good, modern 1080p ultrawide screens (2560x1080) with HDR. As that can be quite comfortably driven by something like old RX 5700XT or RTX 3060 Ti.
3rd biggest tragedy is to alleviate artificial performance problem with something that makes experience worse than if user paid less money for lower resolution screen.
1 million subs, onward and upward gentleman. It was only a matter of time, success well deserved for the quality of the content you put out.
Brilliant analysis!
One scenario that absolutely sold AFMF to me was using it on games that are locked to 60 FPS. Tried it in The Crew 2 the other day and it was mindblowing. There is some artifacting, but it's still fairly minimal outside of few menu animations especially on the world map. It's a small price to pay to me anyway.
The whole game isn't as smooth as if it had a native 120 FPS, but it's still visually smoother than a locked 60 FPS. Plus this game is a best case scenario anyway considering its frame pacing is impecable to begin with.
I can see that being good since I did take a somewhat thorough look at Forza Motorsport and found it to be the best example for AFMF. Every other game I've tries though the image quality hit is still not worth the tradeoff for me but it seems to work ok in raving games?
@@TerraWare It's alright as long as there isn't a lot going on around the car for sure. Within The Crew 2, AFMF disabled itself multiple times due to large portions of the screen having very fast motion, definitively putting the "fast mouse movement" fact entirely.
But eh, for the rest it's really good.
@@impointr Without camera movement, you would barely feel the smoothness. With camera movement, AFMF breaks apart.
It's the exact same tech used in TVs under "sports" mode. This just has slightly better latency than that. So how on earth can someone say it's visually smoother when you actually cannot rotate the camera!? In most games, camera control is paramount! This is what differentiates it from movies. It's TV frame interpolation with less latency penalty.
@@jal.ajeera I suggest you actually give it a shot honestly. I was also very skeptical about all this, yet it simply just works. If I were to not care much about framerate in games with little camera movements (e.g. racing games) then I'd stick to 30 FPS which... Just isn't desirable at all is it? What would even be the point of reaching 144 FPS in a game such as Forza Horizon 5 too since there is little camera movement?
Sadly this is a very very subjective topic and there really isn't any definitive answer. Personally I see a big difference and I'm happy to use such tech for these games where I am prevented from going above a certain framerate. For any other games though I'll do without, obviously.
@@jal.ajeeraIts you again, I corrected you many times before and you stopped responding.
Now I know you're just trolling.
This might have a potential use with old games that are limited to 60fps, No One Lives Forever, for example won't display cutscenes or conversations correctly above 60. RSR is most useful in old games that have a max res of 1080p or less when using a 1440p or above displays. AFMF could find itself in a similar niche.
Could see it used in racing games capped at 60 fps like Burnout Paradise. The game heavily uses motion blur, so AFMF artifacts could be less of an issue
While this is an interesting way to look at it, the dx11/12 restriction is a massive blocker for that currently.
60 fps source framerate is not great, in practice you really want about 90 or more for a 144fps or more experience.
@@sirdapplton Not really, dgVoodoo sorts that.
@@sirdapplton You may be able to work around that with DXVK if they readd vulkan support at least back to DX9 games (though not all games work with DXVK on windows).
Honestly, driver based frame generation is incredible on paper because of how many games can't use interpolation, especially for things like emulators. Being able to interpolate old 30FPS locked games to 60 makes them playable. Same with 60->at least 90, as BFI (black frame insertion) isn't great.
I was trying to do this with SVP (smooth video project), but could never really get things working properly, and always had major latency (and color subsampling). Something like AFMF would make that obsolete, and much better.
Shame things aren't in an ideal state right now, but here's hoping they get this improved sooner rather than later, and expand it to more cards (and API's), and make NVIDIA do the same. Would be a dream come true.
They have updated the driver. It now supports HDR and they improved FMFs quality.
The experience was actually decent in Starfield, but only because I was boosting from ~100 fps to 165 fps. I don't think getting too much below 100 fps is a good experience because of the reasons mentioned, it disabling itself with high motion (the higher the fps the more you have to do) and artifacting (which is less if difference between frames is less with higher framerate). If they fix the pacing it's a neat feature for a high refreshrate experience.
Imo framegen is not advisable if you have a monitor with a refreshrate lower than 144Hz, but preferably you want 165Hz or higher to get some proper mileage out of it.
For that reason I also think it's a bit of a poor choice from Tim to only test it with a source framerate of 75fps, but I won't fault him for it as AMD states a lower amount is necessary than that.
That's a pretty pointless usecase though. 100Fps is fast enough, so you don't need Frame Gen. And the reason why it's acceptable at that framerate is that the generated frames are so short, that they don't affect the overall picture.^^ Frame generation would be a good thing for people with lower end cards, where they can get from unplayable 20, to at least playable 40. That would be a good usecase. But the tech is still so bad, that the generated pictures make the whole experience blurry and bad. Not only AMD but also NVidia have a lot of work ahead of them to bring a good quality frame generation to the lower end and middle class cards.
@@masterluckyluke But you see, that's the problem. People keep thinking it's like the holy grail for mid- or low-end cards to get more FPS. I strongly disagree with this notion. Framegen is of particular use if you have a high-er end-ish card which can already pump out enough fps but not quite enough for your refreshrate.
I can tell if games go to around 100 fps or lower and framegen definitely helped with that.
Framegen will not be of any good for lower fpses. This is not a useful feature for lower-end cards and neither do I think either company is going to solve this in the near future because this is just not something you can easily overcome. There is just not enough data.
The only game I've ever used frame generation was Diablo 4, with DLSS, and it looked and felt quite good, allowing me to use my 240hz 1440p display closer to the higher spectrum of refresh.
I mean, it adds significant latency, unless you're already above 100fps (in which case the visual bonus is negligible)
@surewhynot6259 if you're on AMD, yes. Nvidia framegen only adds minor latency
Congrats on 999k subs!
I would think with a larger previous frame buffer they could detect UI elements pretty easily. They could generate a "heat map" of changes around the edges of the screen things like health bars, buttons, etc. When you go into a menu either full screen or a radial menu, after a few frames it would be detected too. They could save this information into the driver for each executable (think SLI profile).
A tile based rendering technique might also be a nice way to handle UI elements, you just always disable the FMF algorithm on specific tiles always using the current in buffer tile for output.
Canceling you guys since you guys are not at 2 million subs!!! :D
As always, nice work gentleman. You two and your team deserve it!!
i know i am late congratulation on 1 millions subs been watching you since 100k subs keep up good work
HU is definitely my go to for PC information !
Keep up the good work
I don't want a Frame-Smearing arms race. I want better raster and better utilization of VRAM. Improving those 2 will yield results that are undeniably better, instead of new tech that makes us debate and contrast and compare under an intense microscope to even figure out which is On and which is Off and which is better, if at all.
My thoughts exactly. It seems a choice has been made to cheat (probably because it's easier and overall less expensive) rather than truly optimise games and make the experience better. We are getting visual artifacts and frames that you have no input on, no wonder retro gaming is taking more and more of my spare tim.
You won't get it. Move on. Quit whinning. Frame gen is the future.
so youre basically asking for BIG performance ? then go buy top end cards lol, the fact frame gen feature is helping boosting people is something, if you whine like this then go buy yourself an actually capable card like 4090
@@Eleganttf2 i already have a 7900 XTX. i've seen it. the frame smearing, the RT, the FSR. i've seen it all. and i hate all of it. i've paid a premium for trash-tier features, and it would be only marginally better with green team, but it'd still be trash-tier features nonetheless.
i want a gpu with the raster power of 7900 XTX, minus all the garbage features, and of course at 35% less cost.
@@jal.ajeera if only i had some fries to go with all this salt your sending me hahaha
After having used AFMF for a while now I generally agree with most of what you said in the video but the frame pacing issue you've experienced has been nonexistent for me. You mentioned it appears to be working correctly on the ReLive capture (which is how my games looked) and is chopped up haphazardly with your external capture card. Is it possible this has to do with the capture fps or the capture card and not AFMF?
I currently have AFMF, Radeon Anti-Lag, and Radeon Enhanced Sync enabled in my driver settings. VRR enabled with freesync 48-165. I am not currently locking my fps. If you decide to look into this more and have other settings questions lemme know!
Yea it doesnt look like that for me neither. Im using it in FFXIV Online. I dont recommend it for shooters, i tried it in BF2042 and it wasnt pleasant.
A lot of these issues got fixed in the driver released 4 days later that fixed frame pacing
I agree, I always prefer native over FSR or DLSS. However where I DO see this technology becoming heavily leveraged is in the handheld PC market. To see this technology on something like the ROG Ally with 120Hz VRR screen should be truly awesome.
How can it be leveraged on mobile devices when you need 60fps for the thing to not feel like junk and look strange? The pocket PC's struggle to do 60fps alone...
@@Greez1337 but how noticeable on a 7" screen remains to be seen. I certainly haven't seen any videos on it. So until then, who knows....
CONGRATULATIONS ON 1 MILLION (1,000,000) SUBS!!!
I noticed a lot of games with high micro stutter rates you are able to see the micro stutter rates in the performance metrics overlay it needs a lot of improvement.
The October 13 driver (that released while Tim was probably editing) already added initial HDR support and has addressed pacing. Haven't played with it yet though.
Seeing the starfield footage made me think.
Did you ever explore that starfields got immense artifacting on objects that are down relative to the player?
Basically if I grab a box and throw it around on the floor it's got ghosting that remains for a good while.
Do the same along the horizon of the game and I saw no issues.
I can't explain that.
Congrats on 1 million subscribers. Well deserved.
It's curious to see that the tech tries to blur rendered frames together. One would expect that trying to interpolate the movement between two frames, or extrapolate based on the previous few, would yield a sharper generated frame, which ultimately should lead to smoother frames in the end.
Game animations typically have predetermined animation frames, so one would think that this information could be used when generating frames to improve their quality.
It'd be amazing if you could get an engineer working on this tech on the podcast and ask about the various approaches to generating these frames, as well as their downsides (cost in time, cost in calculation, cost in quality, etc).
they released a new version October 13th, stating better pacing, HDR support and i guess works on Vulkan?
that's some fast updates to the drivers and also makes this current video entirely irrelevant now, i would keep it though just because it's cool to have a record for how fast the tech is improving.
feelsbadman, all of that work, i guess that's just how it is when reporting on beta software.
What I want to see is frame generation(if will be fixed) for 60fps locked games to be boost it to 120 and use BFI.
And if it will work with wrappers like dx9 to dx11.
What I want is even more unreasonable. I want consoles to be able to use it to go from 30 -> 60. I’m well aware that doing so is pretty much a pipe dream from a technical standpoint, but it’s a fun dream
@@istealpopularnamesforlikes3340And I want something that seems even more unreasonable, games already running at 60fps 😂😂😂
Sad, but true in the current gaming landscape
It is possible, specially with emulators
I hope this driver level frame gen will be compatible for OpenGL/Minecraft Java.
Yes it works for wrappers and fps locked games
Great review Tim. Ive found one game where ot works rather well where i would use it and thats Forza Motorsport. Since neither FSR or DLSS give you much performance in that game and its demandong to begin with its pretty good.
All other games though the image quality takes a noticeable hit thats not really worth it buy its a tech preview and will hopefully get better with time.
Reminder that the AFMF preview driver is at revision 4 now xd
You can use AFMF without FSR. You can use TAA, native oder XeSS.
XeSS might improve image quality in future games. At least they might be less blurry
love how he says there are all kinds of issues...and I basically barely see them...to not at all.
Just a small note, AFMF is not really based on user input, you can move your mouse extremely fast on most menus and it'll disable itself (and AFMF has not idea that you're on a menu). On cutscenes with fast camera motion, AFMF will "disable" itself despite no mouse input being received. What AFMF does is to "drop" interpolated frames that differ too much based on its internal algorithm, that way fast paced games still take advantage of AFMF, unless there's too much going on the screen, or the scene hits a corner-case on the algorithm, that's why you get mixed experience with different games in regards of AFMF auto disabling itself, that's because it's not based on the input.
As to why HDR is not supported: HDR does need special algorithm for handling a wider range of colors, so it's understandable to not have it on a Tech Preview driver, but it should be supported when AMD releases it officially.
As for V-Sync: This is not really a problem on the driver side, I think that game-based V-Sync is problematic without buffering, remember what V-Sync does: it presents a frame and waits for vertical synchronization before rendering the next frame. And remember what AFMF does: it takes two frames, interpolates and insert it in the middle of those two frames. If the game renders the Frame 1 and waits for Vertical Synchronization, AFMF will not get the second frame to interpolate until the display has synchronized. Without V-Sync, the game will render Frame 1 and start rendering Frame 2 right away, without any additional latency or wait mechanism. That's why V-Sync is not compatible, because it causes AFMF to get the second frame too late making the experience brutally worse, in games like Elden Ring, you have to force V-Sync off through AMD Adrenalin and put the game on borderless Window because it switches monitor modes on Fullscreen, and it does work. Enhanced Sync will essentially replace V-Sync in the matter of ironing out the screen tearing because it happens at the driver-level and don't hold the game from rendering frames.
I was hoping they showed an external app locking the fps to 60....it seems it works better that way from what I heard..I only want it for games that drop from a perfect locked 60 to 50, so they are always at 60. I hope it works good on that scenario.
Is there any meaningful improvement in the final rendering quality if you render at say 4K on a 1440p monitor? Or is the downscaling option not available when Fluid Motion Frames are enabled?
Unfortunately, they've already addressed some of the issues you've found. They have had an update every Friday since they rolled out the preview driver and it looks like that may continue to happen until Q1 2024 when its released into mainline drivers. You need to either keep retesting it for multiple videos or wait until official release.
Unfortunately?
"We have added initial support for HDR to expand the AFMF gaming experience." From latest preview driver release notes.
Vulkan is supported too.
I think it would be interesting to see on games that are capped to 60fps, like the Dark Souls games, or maybe even older games that were hardcoded to 30fps like Okami.
Can confirm it works beautifully in Elden ring. Literally the perfect use case. This is a botched review, they treat it like FSR3/DLSS3 but it's different tech with different use cases.
Sorry HUB but this deserves a retest.
Soulsborne games are extremely popular and that's just 1 example.
@@Altrop Well, you can unlock the Frame Rate in Elden Ring, so Frame Generation is not necessary for high frame rates in that game.
The games of the Souls series can't be unlocked without making them run faster or causing physics problems.
@@EVPointMaster False. Elden Ring must run at 60FPS for the gameplay mechanics to work properly. If you unlock the framerate you are not only banned from playing online, but you also mess with the game mechanics. The game relies on frames for dodging. If your framerate is too low it actually also bans you from online play.
AFMF gives you the smoothness of 120FPS without messing with the 60FPS core gameplay of not only Elden Ring but all soulsborne games
@@Altrop I've played Elden Ring for about 400 hours by now with an unlocked frame rate and I've yet to find anything wrong with the game mechanics.
I stopped playing Souls games online with DS3, player messages just spoil every secret in these games. And if I want to play Coop, the seemless coop mod is a much better experience than vanilla coop.
@@EVPointMaster you only get a certain amount of frames to dodge with a roll, 13 franes I believe. If you play at 120 real FPS your dodge window is halved which is a HUGE deal. You don't have to believe me just look it up. Also online play is no longer allowed.
So uhhhh, there was a new driver update TODAY (Oct 13th) that updated HDR support, allowed all DX11/12 titles, and improved frame pacing.
Congratulations for 1M totally deserved ❤
Congratulation guys, well deserved!
A new version of the driver came out the same day as this video that fixes a lot of these issues
Congrats on 1M subs!
The oct 13 beta driver works fine. Doubles my frame s with starfield and cyberpunk with no major noticeable visual degradation . Works with rdna2 aside from rdna3. Works with HDR now. No UI issues. Though lag is noticeable with cyberpunk with RT
AFMF is leaving beta at the end of January. Hopefully this gets revisited at that point to see the improvements (which there definitely has been)
Same
Congrats on 1 mil.
I'd love for this to get into a better state, even if it's not very useful now! I'd also love to see some of this hardware accelerated fluid motion in Adobe programs like Premiere and After Effects. The Optical Flow option is very slow and flawed.
most of the issues have already been patched
Does driver based frame gen work for emulated games, eg mgs1: normally limited to 30fps
I've actually been using the hyper-rx-eco mode and its actually really good on my 6800. It dropped power usage by 30 watts with no fps drops.
Hyper rx on a 6000 card?
@jelly8594 it's hyper rx-eco it doesn't have anti lag + in driver 23.10beta
Was this with the latest preview driver? I know it's probably annoying but they did say they fixed some of it
My AMD card hasn't arrived yet so I can't test it further. From what I heard, there was an update that made AFMF more fluid by correcting frame passing. and launched, but you can give your opinions about it as you wish, as the more it is tested, the more AMD will be able to improve the technology
I believe this will be good with all the new handhelds. Since the screen is so small with a high ppi, you most likely won’t notice.
Could an edge case for this be on monitors with a somewhat poor experience at the lower range of the vrr window.
For example, my Asus VG27A kind of sucks below 100hz.
I will grant that it does not look very compelling in general, just a fun little bonus.
you can always just lock your frame rate
In some games afmf artifacts are harder to notice though. Did a full playthrough of Cyberpunk 2.0 recently with afmf and barely had any issues. Also after the most recent preview drivers I find I can now justify using it in Elden ring too. It does however look horrible in Starfield still, hope they add fsr3 for it soon.
The latest preview AFMF driver is almost incredible, I tried to look for weird things in the games I tried it on, could not find any.
I guess it could help smooth gameplay with a controller where the camera turn speed is more consistent?
Good analysis as always, but I think one thing was missed.
Based on users configuration, should you go with AFMF enable and better frames or without AFMF.
My personal experience on cyberpunk is that I prefer A LOT having AFMF active since it makes the game very playable, but without AFMF it is not.
What I would recommend is a side by side comparison, with AFMF on HIGH settings versus native resolution on LOW and compare both.
This would be a fair comparison. The tech has lot of flaws but I don't think it is garbage
now it supports Vulkan too and it has hdr support
I have a lot of questions about your test setup and capture card, because with a 6900xt and a cheapo 144hz 1080p monitor, the only perceivable problems are greasy wet surfaces at times, and some of the other light artifacting, but tearing wasnt noticeable in any game tested. Seemed to work well in ff14, exceptionally well in BG3, and decently with cyberpunk. Could be because the fps of the first 2 were "so" high that it became a forest for the trees scenario, and with cyberpunk I was lucky to break far beyond 144 so... idk... All I know is I welcome our new AMD GPU overlords and I look forward to the intel AMD wars of 2030.
If the fps is so high what is the point of using it?
Take the criticisms presented by reviewers with a grain of salt, since they're out there evaluating every second frame by frame with 300% zoom and you're probably not doing that during your regular gameplay. Make your own decisions about what tech you enjoy or not if at all possible.
@@Safetytrousers Image smoothness when moving the camera around and that's it really. I theorize Frame generation, was never meant to make slow low end GPU's play high end games, they would never let that happen anyway, they want to sell the high end expensive GPU's.
IMO frame gen from AMD and Nvidia, should be renamed to "visual smoothing" or something. And also IMO frame rate counters, should be updated to ignore these fake frames, so GPU makers don't get to sell GPU's based on fake fps numbers.
6900xt for 1080p? Based
@@Safetytrousers smooths out dips in frame timing and for science mostly; cyberpunk it helped a fair bit tho
So are we back to software rendering?
i've been using AFMF exclusively on 60fps locked games, that the only scenario that i would use this tech.
The thing is frame generations requires the original fps to be more than reasonably playable already, 60+ fps. I guess some people want to trade less image quality + higher lag for additional fps.