Best Sub $1000 Gravel Bike: State 4130 vs. Poseidon Redwood vs. Nicasio Plus
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- čas přidán 12. 06. 2024
- Close comparison of two sub $1000 bikes, the State 4130 All-Road and Poseidon Redwood. Bonus comparison with the Nicasio Plus. Which one is right for you? Help support non-competitive cycling content: / pathlesspedaled
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Yay a PREMIERE! By all means leave an insulting comment on a video you get to watch for FREE , while I try different things to eek out .50 to grow the channel and make more FREE content you can complain and insult me about.
Russ, your videos are the best. I'm actually in the market for a $1200 CAD gravel bike, I look forward to your videos very much, and they come fast and furious. A new one on the subject every week...
[CZcams comments are the worst. We all wish there was a better way...]
Russ, you provide SO MUCH good information and help us nerds and non-nerds get a handle on all the buzz that currently surrounds biking. Your efforts have probably improved the physical/mental health of many by promoting biking. Thanks to you and Laura for all you do!
Haters gotta hate. It's a shame you have to deal with them. But please know that there are many more of us than there are of them, and we value and appreciate your efforts.
All of the above 👍
If I only could find something insulting to say. Truly can't think of an insult to you that wouldn't be a lie. Thank you for the great reviews.
I LOVE that you can get this much gravel bike for less than the price of a Gorilla Monsoon frameset. ⚡️
This was super helpful! Especially your comparison of terrain and how they fit into different types of trails. Thank you for taking the time to do this.
Thanks for the great video! I love that you strive to include budget friendly bikes in your reviews. Also, your way of analyzing handling is spot on and communicated in a very understandable manner; very helpful for those of us without the option to try every bike out there. And yes, bike manufacturers, get your gearing sorted for "gravel" bikes!!! Many of us ride hills and mountains, seek out hills and mountains, and live where we cannot avoid hills and mountains!! Great content, and really great comparison!
Hi ! It's always a pleasure to watch your videos here in France. I ride a Nicasio Plus since a year ago ans it's a real pleasure. My Mouuntain bikes (all Sunn) are resting in my garage because of the Nicasio witch give me the sensations I had 30 years ago, riding my first mountain bikes. It's heavier than all of my MTB Sunn, but I don't notice that while riding. I threw the absurd WTB tires (that are not 650b) to the garbage for real 650b off road tires ans all the rest of this bike satisfies me. Great moments of biking for a reasonable amount of money...
Sorry for my broken english !
Thank you so much for this post. your brief but in-depth review helped me much in deciding to pull the trigger on the State AR 🙏🙏🙏
Love this channel! Can't make up my mind between a gravel or touring bike. That's why I watch your videos. You provide so much useful information. Over the summer I have put over 600 miles on my fat bike. Time to add another bike.
These three seem great. Gravel bikes are amazing IMO. What a time to join the community!
Thank you, Russ! This price range is super exciting to me. I got myself the state all road but I’m thinking about getting a gravel specific bike for my wife and this video gives me a lot of options! Cheers.
Would love to see an updated version of this video but watching still in 2024 😊
Another great (and for me timely!) vid, and I appreciate the confirmation from someone whose opinion I trust, that the bike that I ordered fits the bill for what I was wanting it for. (State 4130 Allroad)
I'm really happy I found your channel. I'm very much a mountain biker who's "gravel-curious". I'll mostly be ripping around the town's gravel paths while occasionally testing my mettle by under-biking myself on mtb trails. The 27.5" wheel size paired with at least a 2" tire is a major selling point since that's what I know and love. I'm curious as to how I'd get along with these sub-30 lb bikes. I definitely do not have legs, but I'm used to a much longer 35-lb machine.
It's also cool seeing some of Missoula in this video :)
Thank you so much for this video Russ!
Yo! Thanks for this video!
I'm MTBer for going on my 18th(?) year, I love gravity riding, DH, Park, Freeride, Enduro,(not into racing, just love the Zen of a fun ride) but now in my early 40s I'm learning to slow down and enjoy the simple things life, like just cruising the forest, and back country roads here in Southern Appalachian.
And thanks to this video, I decided to Order the State 4130 All Road 650b!
Should have it in a few weeks, and I'm super excited!
Thanks!
Awesome that the more mainstream these become the more affordable they are! Thanks for bringing these to the forefront
Good ass video thanks for the comparison exactly what I was looking for.
OMG not sure I can wait until morning! Better have another beer. Don't forget to wish Eric happy birthday!
Hi Russ and thanks for your content. It helped guide my 1st gravel bike purchase, the Marin Nicasio +. Very happy with it. Supremely stable platform for multi-day, multi-surface bikepacking adventures. No upgrades or changes needed after 500+ hard-gritty, grin-inducing miles. Your review is spot-on: Heavy yet nimble, basic yet sturdy, serious yet fun. All-steel is all-awesome. Keep up the great work and don’t let negative people affect you. I’m subscribing and joining your Patreon shortly. Thanks, you made a positive difference to me.
awesome just got a patch! Keep up the great content
This is a great video. I just got my Redwood a week ago, and this really solidified that I made the right decision *for me*
Love the channel. Stuck on this decision myself. I actually have the state All Road on preorder but it got delayed once already. I like the steel frame more, even though I’ve never had a steel bike. The initial price is much closer than I thought originally. If you factor in shipping and a shop assembly of the state bike, that’s about an extra $70 on the price. I think I’d definitely put different tires on the Poseidon and different brake calipers on the state, probably a smaller chain ring on the state as well. Winter is coming though, so I could probably run the kendas in the Poseidon for longer. I’m mostly riding on the roads, and I’m a super-Clyde, so I love that supple life. It’s a tough decision for me that almost comes down to frame material and geometry. Also love that you can fit big fat monster tires on the Poseidon, and it come stock with 650b. State is currently sold out and I could only get it with 700c
Ok glad I went with the Redwood after watching this with my needs.
I love the look of thin steel tubing. I’d have to pick the State bike just because of that frame.
RUSS............You and Laura help us with our choice of Bromptons, your video's guided my husband to a Surly frame set. Your reaching people in England!!, please don't the idiots get to you, you do a fine job!!!!!!! Love from England!! xx
YAY!!!!! I am so excited! This is perfect:)
Keep up your great work 👍.
Thank you for the excellent bike tasting session. Cheers
Could be a future name for your bike reviews Russ: "bike tasting"
I really love your bike flavor wheel! Such an amazing tool! I would love to see a website like bike-geometries include it in their comparison graphics.
Great video with lots of details, I went with the Redwood ! :)
I'm new to biking and went with the State because that's what my local bike shop carries, I hope I enjoy it! Cant wait for it to come in.
Redwood definitely peaks my interest as the hills and single track are calling. Winter is coming, is bikepacking with a hot tent setup something folks do in your neck of the woods? Thanks much for the detailed comparison.
Thanks for adding the weight specs. The State website doesn't have this. Still think Giant's gravel bikes do great on weight.
Hey man great breakdown I appreciate the detail! Have you had any experience with the 6061 Black Label from State?
I was at the Marin dealer today and they had a aluminum version of the Nicasio plus. I don’t remember the name of it but, hopefully a review is coming soon!
You keep saying that it is hard to pick a winner but it's pretty obvious. Only one of those bikes reviewed ships with tan sidewalls. So... Nicasio+ it is!
not sure I see the interest in colored sidewall. i find them goofy looking
@@cwr8618 Rims are 650b, WTB are not. This is the weak point of the Nicasio Plus.
Nice camera focus / background blur thing you got going on!
Love the content Russ! Keep it up. Wish I could send a picture of my bike setup the way I like because of the info you provided on the channel. It's a 2021 Specialized Diverge Base E5 with Tubus Logo Classic rack, Ortlieb Gravel Pack Panniers, Flat pedals, and a Ritchey 4-AXIS ADJUSTABLE STEM 120mm. I love the way the bike rides and handles. Thanks to you guys and this channel I've improved it and made it my own COMFORTABLE long hauler.
Thanks for the review. I would love to get your take on the Poseidon X.
Is there any chance we can see a review of the Felt Broam 30? it looks like a good allrounder bike with lots of mounts. Nice videos, very informative
I really wanted the all road but sadly it is almost never in stock. I actually ended up going for the Poseidon X because it seems fairly similar to the all road. The Redwood has tremendous value but it seems like it may be a bit sluggish.
Can you do another interview with Analog cycles. I saw they have prototypes of there Tanglefoot frameset now and I think it would be a great conversation.
Thanks
Hy i liked ur reviews n also subscribe to ur channel really enjoying it . I have questions which one us more supple and ride better for gravel and mtb light green n orange trails .
Great comparison, thank you!! Really sad that I neither can get the Poseidon nor the State in Germany. Would really appreciate an europe version of this video:)
I noticed on the Poseidon’s website there frame sizes are a bit off from what you usually see. Like I ride a medium to large and on there website they specify a small in my height. My question to you is did you find the frame sizes to be different and did you have to go down a frame size?
Glad that you mentioned the Nicasio. Also, the Kona Rove always gets good ‘smiles for your bucks’ reviews.
Thanks for the video. I'm looking to upgrade my crankset to a sealed BB away from the square tapered. Any suggestions?
The Sensah SRX Pro on the State can accommodate up to 52t without an extender, and cogs and chainrings are pretty cheap compared to a groupset so consider that rather than what's on the stock gearing. It's comparing $300 to $20 which you can easily replace in 5 minutes.
According to State shifting suffers at 46t and that is why they didn’t go bigger in the back.
I think you've had an impact on my brother. He has always been obsessed with going as fast as possible and sometimes I think it took away from the overall enjoyment. He now enjoys an occasional "party pace" and is more laid back. On another note, if you check it out, the Sensa shifters are not very reliable long term.
Got the Redwood; changed a few things including the tires. I went tubeless with WTB Venture Road tires because I will ride on pavement more than on dirt. I love the matte finish. (I wish car makers would incorporate matte finish on vehicles.) I live in Florida, so I won't be able to test it's hill climbing ability, but hope to test it off-road soon. I've never ridden a more expensive gravel bike so I have nothing to compare it to, but so far I am pleased with this one.
I've been looking at the redwood, but have seen everyone say it's more on the MTB side of gravel. No matter what I get I was gonna get a separate set of wheels for when road riding is primary. How does it feel on the road?
seems like a weird decision to get the redwood in Florida
@@cwr8618 Yeah, it's flat here.
Car makers do flat finishes, theyre a PITS to maintain though
What kind of fender and how easy would it be to install on the Poseidon? I don’t see a single picture with one with fenders
Hey Russ, thanks for the video. How much difference would swapping the front ring make on the State All Road?
It would made a decent difference. IMO it should have shipped with a 38t.
My homeboy looking freshhh.
No matter how many times I watch, I’m still paralyzed in indecision.
Get both
Russ, have you had a chance to look at the Poseidon x dropbar? I’m sold on the state all road, but it is never in stock in my size, so the Poseidon x is my second choice.
There’s only one thing I need and it’s a tiny frame bag for that seatstay triangle
Spare valve cap storage? 😁
balm bag....easy access for lip balm :)
What do you think about Cannondale Topstone 1 Alloy with Grx group set. Or should I get Salsa Journeyman 650b? I am new to road bikes and gravel bikes. This is actually gonna be my first road bike so I have no idea which one is better or better value. Thanks!
Which bike do you recommend for asphalt (maybe too rocky), light desert sand but not deep and mostly flat terrain?
The real question people want to ask is which bike do you prefer? I think you like the Nicasio because it's your supple bike winner. I would lean Poseidon because it just is more "modern" and put on a shorter stem. But I understand people thinking to get a cheap gravel bike- that's why we watch all these reviews.
I switched to an origin8 40t oval ring on my 4130. That seems to make a nice improvement so far.
Is the State crank direct mount?
@@gillonblank it is 110 bcd if i remember correctly
Add the Marin DSX 1 to your under 1k considerations.
Ordered the Poseidon X $750 USD shipped. Seems similar to the Nicasio + but comes with the Microshift 1x10 and it might be a little cheaper.
Hi Russ,
Any thoughts about the brakes? Do the dual-piston Tektro MD-C550 brakes on the Poseidon Redwood make for better and more responsive stopping power than the single-piston Promax DSK-300R calipers on State All-Road? Is there much difference in performance?
Thanks and keep the great content coming!
They’re better than the Promax on the State for sure.
@@PathLessPedaledTV Thank you! I'm leaning towards the Poseidon and this I think will tip the scales.
My question is if you were to buy the frame of one of these bikes and build it how you like it which frame would you go with
Dont forget the Salsa Journeyman Claris it's $995
Seems currently out of stock from my research.
@@nathanksimpson What isn't? 😋 I'm currently waiting on my 4130 Allroad which was supposed to ship a couple of weeks ago, and will hopefully be coming in the next week or so.
Was going to mention the same thing. Even with Claris it's a solid ride.
Bought the Jman Sora. The upgraded to Apex. Would have been cheaper to buy Claris and upgrade later. Either way, happy with frame and ride the Jman gives.
Cool review! Can we get these bikes in Europe?
Nice comparison video Russ they both look like good bikes for the price if only these bikes were 5 + pounds less .
These wheels/tires are made to be durable and long lasting so that's where all the weights are.
I really dont have room for my road and mountain bike. That being said i use 1 to 1 gearing on my mountain bike. Really i want both but when i used to have just 1 bike my old fashioned diamondback was a good all around bike so i guess more like the redwood
Compare two Phillips, like the State & Fuji Touring. Everyone tells me to get the Fuji Touring. The wheels need be strong as not to break spokes as often.
What about changing out the chainring of the state to 34? That is not so expensive and then you get the gearing range that was missing.
State is the only direct-to-consumer brand (that I'm aware of) that requires a bike shop to assemble the bike or the frame warranty is void. Assembly consists of inserting the seat post, mounting the handlebars (4 screws), mounting the front wheel, and mounting the pedals. Not sure why State requires this but potential buyers need to factor in that additional cost if they want a warranty.
Which one is more supple n absorb bumps better
Pls include the Marin 4 corners.
3x ewwww
I just got back into cycling and what the hell is the hype over gravel bikes I'm liking them but back in the 80s most sub 200 dollar road bikes had big tyres. We always had our bikes in the gravel and by the way I love your videos
is a PHAT MEATZ patch coming up?? :)
Thanks Russ, would it be a sin to put touring style handlebars on either of these?
Not at all, especially if you’re really doing some serious touring with them. I’ll say it might not be totally sensible to use them all the time if you’re not, but all it does is make the ride more comfortable and give you more hand positions. No wrong moves!
What about the Triban RC120 sitting at 750EUR?
how will you categories Marin Four Corners
How about the 2016 Diamond Hannjo Comp?
Hey Russ, just wondering if the Gravel Express from Montreal based Moose Bicycle is on your radar?
No. Hard to get Canadian brands to send bikes in to review.
Maybe after November our countries can get back to being BFFs and things can get a little easier.
Now if I could buy Poseidon Redwood in the UK, I'd be over the moon.
No one will ship it to you?
@@denverspin by the time it gets through customs and if you add shipping charges on top of that, there's no point... and you've probably got close to none warranty, etc.
We either need a guest video for the EU market or an EU distributor for Poseidon, wink wink
@@denverspin nope, you have to import it yourself from bikeflights, comes in at roughly £1200(thats including the price of the bike in the first place), still cheaper than a specialized tho.
i tried to do it myself but had a lot of issues with bikeflights not being able to recognise my UK delivery address, gave up on the idea in the end.
Can you put double or triple chainrings on the State bikes? I'm looking for a touring bike but need the lowest granny gear for steep hill climbs on a tour spinning in the saddle.
Yes.
Is making an upgrade change to the right brake / shifter worth doing?
Yes
I'd go state
I'm sorry but I completely disagree with your conclusions - JIS for the win in the screwdriver stakes and, unless you've upgraded your derailleurs to hexagon socket screws, there just no way pozi/phillips or flat head are cutting it right..... glad we got that settled and end of rant.
A gravel bike should feel like a road bike with larger tires, right?
State 4130 Road vs. Poseidon Triton?
What about the fork? The State looks like it has a steel fork, vs. the Poseidon's carbon?
Poseidon has an aluminum fork.
@@PathLessPedaledTV Ah, thanks.
Any thoughts on BikesDirect brand bikes?
For a nickel under 1k, they have Mercier Kilo GX R20 with Shimano GRX
Also for $800, the Mercier Kilo GX T11 is spec’d with Sram Apex
With all the talk about “internet bike brands” everyone seems to discount them for some reason
Would love to hear your opinion on it!
Are both of these (State and redwood) able to accept a dropper post???? Anybody know???
You can certainly use an external dropper.
Great review, thanks. I don’t think I heard an assessment of how each of these bikes would ride on the road. For example, how would they compare for use on a road ride to get to some off-road trails? It’s important for me to have a bike that can keep up with my club mates on the road. Would you be able to kindly add an assessment of this? Many thanks.
Short version: These would suck for a club ride.
@@PathLessPedaledTV Thanks.
Pretty disappointing that the Nicasio + still has the 9 speed Advent while its competitor the Poseidon has the AdventX.
Definitely Poseidon over State, I'm not keen over the shifters and drivetrain. The Redwood seems underbiked for the image it projects and too heavy and slow for paved rides. Thoughts Russ? If I were to ride a bike with more than 2.0 width tires because the going is "rough", I'd rather hop on my XC/trail bike.
I think the Redwood falls under the same niche within a niche as the Cutthroat but for far less money with trade off in weight. One could say that the Cutthroat is underbiked for the image it projects as well, but happens to be lighter and a lot more expensive.
My thought is for under $1000 you can't expect heaven on earth and there are going to be trade offs. The Poseidon is definitely not a pavement bike in its OEM form. Maybe passable with different wheels and tires. I think its a great bike for the stuff we have here in Montana and sections of the Divide for those that don't have a baller budget.
My guess is there's a 2021 model coming up for Nicasio+, the rest of them seem to have been updated...
@@Howaboua yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if it gets Advent X
@@PathLessPedaledTV Marin already shown 2021. No changes to Nicasio +. Dsx seems to be interesting. Nicasio geometry with MTB groupset
@@3CityRide that's weird then. Perhaps they built too many of them...
Trek Checkpoint 3 w/ Conti Terra Speed 7×35
A downside of those external cables out front is a limitation in pack options.
They’re not as limiting as you think. I did a whole separate video putting. Rando bags, saddle bags and handlebar bags on with Microshift advent x.
Path Less Pedaled i’ll have to check that out
Path Less Pedaled what is the title of that video Russ? How long ago did you post it?
czcams.com/video/jErtf9kZVno/video.html
Too bad Poseidon doesn't seem to ship worldwide, and Marin doesn't seem to have a dealer in my country... :(, State Allroad, and Journeyman seem to be out of stock for now or also don't ship to my country :(.
Form international shipping Poseidon uses BikeFlights but I've heard it is not cheap. You can contact them and they will give you a quote.
@@valentinbitsinandmaxx8389 Cool thanks. Wiggle will ship internationally but their offering in this category isn't as good as Poseidon and their shipping cost is expensive too. 250$ish.
Yeah but how does it feel in small bumps and through roots etc...
Amazing. Just like a full suspension :)
Party Pace🎉
Can you even buy a Nicasio Plus anywhere now?
Someone commented somewhere that they were getting one delivered last week.
doesn't the walmart brand Viathon have a gravel bike for $1000? Doesn't Schwinn also offer a gravel bike for under $1000? Same with Kent and Klein?
I don't think there is a sub $1k Viathon. Not all sub $1000 gravel bikes are the same. The schwinn is cheap but has nowhere the same amount of clearance.
@@PathLessPedaledTV Ah, I was going to say don't let Eric here that, he's a Schwinn rider. Oh, I could have sworn there is a is Viathon at $1k exactly(less on sale) and the Schwinn could do 650x47mm
Glad you are not assuming folk have 1000 s to spend ,which other reviewers think,but what about specialised
Want a bike that quits breaking back spokes on Bikepacking trips.
With clearance for 2.3” these really are just drop bar mountain bikes!
That geometry is super steep compared to modern mtb, but yes they are definitely 90s mtb with drop bars