Behringer Pro-1 vs Prophet 6 and Toraiz AS-1
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- čas přidán 14. 11. 2019
- #behringer #pro1 #review #demo
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A look at how close the Prophet 6 is to the Pro-1 demonstrating the sonic similarities and differences between Behringer's Pro-1 and the Pioneer DJ Toraiz AS-1 synth, which is effectively a single voice of the Prophet 6.
It's not a comprehensive comparison .. I've not played with the High Pass or FX or demo'd the additional capabilities of the P6 and Toriaz. This video is purely just to see if they share sonic fingerprints with the Pro-1.
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Overview 1:10
Oscillators 4:10
Filter 6:30
Modulation and FM 15:06
Sync 17:36
Conclusion 19:16 - Krátké a kreslené filmy
Dude this is the video that I was waiting for, thank you mr Carr
I hope it answers your questions... feels like the pressures on ;)
Best synth comparison vids on the net. Nice job!
The AS1 is much more ballsy than the P6, ive got both while they have a similar tone the AS1 sounds more beefy and saturated id say more aggressive, Mono synths usually are, Pro 1 sounds more beefy than Prophet 5, same with the SH101 and Jupiter 6
They both sound fantastic to my ears
Behringer sounds great as well, its cem based while sequential is using an ssm filter and custom oscilators so there should be some differences, cant go wrong for the price
The options and price points these days are awesome compared to just a couple of years ago
Why 2?
I recently got the Neutron and Pro 1 and I couldn't be happier, especially as they're semi modular, I can hook them up together. Loads of fun!
Another great video! Thanks that tuning on filter and sync is really weird, I don’t like that idea at all but I do like pro-1 aggressive sound. Will by buying that at some point;)
Another reminder of just how much of a bargain the B-Pro-1 is.
Thank you ..excellent comparison and review as ever
Hello, I have a toraiz AS-1 and I would like to buy a behringer pro-1, do you think that this is stupid given that I have the toraiz and both buy K2 or model D or neutron?@Starsky
Nice review!
Your reaction at 17:10 made me laugh my ass off. I dig the honesty
You’re a legend for sht like this, Starsky
The Poly-Mod may have less depth on the p6, but with some dialing in I've gotten some of the most organic and musical FM sounds of any synth with it.
Great comparison, I was genuinely surprised at the filter resonance differences. I was looking to see if the P6 would get the core sounds of the Pro 1 and I think within limits it does. I think the P6 is a lovely sounding synth I do wish it had a 5 octave keyboard though!
Do you have any pro 1 bass patches available?
Very nice video. I’d love to see someone with your level of competence compare the Prophet 6 with a Prophet 5. There are a couple of videos on CZcams, but they’re not very well done. This was, as usual, really well done.
If I could get my hands on a P5 I’d love to take a look... so if anyone fancies bringing one round...?? .. fingers crossed :)
Great video, are you able to do some more videos like you did with the Deepmind comparison where you compare some patches that you would use in your tracks so we get a better idea of how these synths sound compared to each other in recording scenario? For instance, I'd be interested to hear how the Toraiz and Prophet sounded doing the Yazoo cover compared to the Behringer. Many thanks
Interesting idea. Thanks... Sounds like a lot of effort 😧... but if I get some time maybe a fun afternoon!
Liking the screen shots of both frequencies, there is no mistakes in understanding the your demo Starsky. Keep up the good work.
What would the Bheringer's Pro Poly perform like if they were to produce one. Would they take your criticism and make sure they produced louder and more FM-able Poly? It would be nice to see if the Pro5 has the same stunted FM range. There might be a reason for the way the Pro6 was designed.
Amazingly some people can still hear differences even when the graphs are EXACTLY the same!!
As a long time p5 rev 3 user i can say its the best poly cem based synth for frequency modulation sounds there is / was , i am curious how the behringer version will sound , i think it will be better than any dave smith issue
I read that the AS1 isn’t getting much support from Pioneer and that there are some issues that still haven’t been addressed. Can anyone confirm?
Andy Sweetman it has a bug that causes timing issues when you switch patches in real-time when using the internal sequencer
SKYLINE SYSTEMS i think its better to use an external sequencer with it because it doesnt have any real-time record option. I use a Minibrute 2S and
Beat step pro to sequence mine. Its really fun and easier that way.
Sold mine 1 year ago due to some midi sync issues with other gear.
wooowww muy buen video saludos desde TIJUANA
The brightness of the waves pro one and p6 differ because the p6 uses cpu cycles on the vco rastering for storage while the pro one is fully analog without parameter rastering , so the filter is maybe less important on the dulling effect?
I’ve absolutely no idea what that means but it sounds like you do!! Looks like I’ll be looking up rastering when I’m next at a loose end :)
@@StarskyCarr anyway ,spoiled for choice and it is funny a newcomer in synths like behringer kicks the legendary dave smith in the @xx , your comparisons are very helpful thank you
AS-1 also has its “Slider” to mod 7 destinations without stepping.
I don’t regret selling my Pro One and buying two AS-1’s which sound no better or worse than the Pro One. If anyone cares to compare, INHALT does a good comparison.
Price of AS-1 and Bro1 isn’t very different.
i also picked up up an as1 but I still keeping my Bro one. lets see
On the Inhalt video i thought the AS-1 sounded *better* a little more than half the example patches. Which blew my mind. The AS-1 has a juicy quality to it that the Pro One didn’t. Amazing.
Superb comparison and you've confirmed all I need to know, which is that the Behringer Pro-1 is more than capable of getting the sounds I wanted from a Prophet 6, but at $2400 less, which is a massive bonus and money that can be put towards the amazing Behringer Model D and a Neutron and still have a nice chunk of change to spare. What Behringer have done is incredible and best of all, they have opened up a world of previously snobbish and overly expensive synth sounds to everyone. Way to go Behringer and many thanks Starsky Carr for your superb comparison, please keep them coming. I'd love to see the entire exciting Behringer Synth range compared to there famous much more expensive counterparts. In particular the Behringer Model D to the famous Mini-moog. Food for future thought and again many thanks.
Thanks - check out more on my channel - Behringer vs Moog / vs Sequential Pro -1 / vs Octave Cat... 😀
Well, the prophet 6 is polyphonic so you're not getting that with a pro 1!😆
@@latexmonkeys Arturia solves that problem for me nicely. 😁
I appreciate these videos of comparisons (which are ever-increasing since the the music gear industry is basically the clone wars); hats off to Starsky Carr for these comparisons, even if he talks out of his ass sometimes.
Now...Behringer product video comment sections are always a bit cringe because some of the people opine nonsensically.
These are both really different synths at the end of the day, so people blowing their load over a perception of the Pro-1 having “better” sounding oscillators or different capability is pretty ridiculous. Now if we were looking at a Prophet 6 vs a Brophet 5, that might be a different story.
Behringer does give people what they want, unlike many of the other brands, so it’s no surprise the comment sections become circle jerks every time.
When i first played my AS1 i couldn‘t get over how good it sounded, its definitely a must have.
You can’t go wrong with it. I never realised it was a full blown single voice of a P6. Very nice.
@@StarskyCarr can you help me understand what a single voice means?
@@mpmi7588 Inside the Sequential P6 you get 6 voice cards (6 voices polyphony). Inside the Pioneer Toraiz AS1 you get 1 identical voice card of the P6 (1 voice monophonic), produced by Sequential for Pioneer. So the AS1 is a single voice of a P6.
@@ellennixonwaln4162 thank you.
Hmm the stepping of the filter and the limited FM on the P6 are real clunkers. What was Dave thinking?
Yeah, the filter stepping is useful for some but I’m not a fan myself.
did you publish the music at the beginning of the video?
Zoltán Petró check out Kraftwerk- Das Model
@@chandlerguess690 I’m specifically interested in the music below the video, I know it’s Kraftwerk.
The Prophet 6 seems much more "Polite". To my ears, analogue mono synths always seem to have more balls than analogue polys, don't understand why....love your reviews....peace❤️😎❤️😎
Disagree with that cause the polys usually have unison & dual modes that will trump the mono's, of course there will be a difference when poly is in normal mode.
George Georgio interesting, not too keen on Unison mode and I still think that monos behave differently. Each to their own though!
@@GNeuman Nothing wrong with my Prophet 08 in uni mode it's fat and low end is amazing having said that the 08 can achieve fat sounds even without uni mode ex: using different mod routings and hard sync with different envelope routings , slop mode and detuning many ways to skin a cat.
George Georgio interesting!👍👍👍
@@GNeuman What you don't like soaring Leeds sounds from uni mode? wow you'd be only a handful of those that don't.
They behave differently but that doesn't make them fatter for bass sounds you can achieve great bass on both, I do love the pro 1 and odyssey though, but Polys are more versatile as you can achieve both pads and bass sounds plus a whole lot more.
Just made me want a P6 really. I just picked up an SE-02 and I’d love for you to one day compare one with your Moogs!
Nkozi Cole yes I love my SE-02 a lot
Yeah se02 comparison 👍🏻
Haha... someone send me an SE02 and I will ;). I had an SE1 for years - loved it but sold it when I bought the minimoog. Lots of love for SE here :)
Starsky Carr Lol 😂
@@StarskyCarr if I wasn't having so much fun with mine I would
What do you mean it has 1 voice? Whats the difference between a voice and an oscillator when theyre both sounds?
Voice count convention is: when you play a note you trigger one voice - whether that has 1, 2 or 3 oscillators. So Minimoog is 1 voice (3 osc) Pro-One is 1 voice (2 osc) etc. If you can play 2 notes and trigger 2 sets of oscillators it has 2 voices. A prophet 6 has 6 voices with 2 osc and 1 sub per voice. A Deepmind12 has 12 voices (you can play 12 notes simultaneously) with 2 oscillators per voice.
@@StarskyCarr thank you. I think i get it now. The deepmind example was a bit confusing tho. Lol. Would voices have to be divided to tracks (parts) or combined in order to be played? Synth language is a bit strange to me. Example: tracks are parts, oscillators are sounds, voices are as you described.
This must be why mono synths dont typically come with various tracks? Lol im learning man. Forgive me. Lol. Thanks for responding. Love the page and subscribed a while back.
Track or multitimbral (playing more than one sound at a time) is a different thing. For each note you play you still need a voice (with whatever osc count the synth has) but some synths can play more than one sound at a time (eg bass on one MIDI channel, and a pad on another). You still need eg 6 voices for a bass not and 5 note chord for the pad - if it’s multitimbral (or has tracks) you can play both sounds at the same time. A prophet 6 isn’t multitimbral so can only play six notes - but all being the same sound. You can’t play different sounds at the same time unless it’s multitimbral. I think that’s what you mean. Typically workstations are multitimbral, and some synths designed for gigging (bass note in the left hand and piano or chords on the right).
And then there’s synths like the Behringer Poly D that confuse things completely by having 4 oscillators for a single voice - but they can be split over 4 notes. Most synths can’t do this. But is it 4 voice or a 4 oscillator single voice...? You can switch between both modes. Is it polyphonic or paraphonic (another discussion altogether) ?? So I understand your confusion! :) thanks for watching.
@@StarskyCarr i just copied that whole explanation and pasted into my notes dude. Thank you so much. I actually understood that. Lol
those super resonant notes at 12 minutes are quite louder then everything else
well. osc sync and realtime filter tweaking... definitely, pro-1 wins. thanks for your review.
He did it! The crazy sunuvabish actually did it!
The filter knob of the cute AS-1 doesn't behave as it's father Prophet when tweaked...
It's smooth as you could expect from an analog synth, suited for dj labours... no stepping...
I suppose, Mr. Dave Smith implemented that controversial feature in his flagship synth for sound design purposes, more than for live performance needs...
Cheers...!
That annoys me... it means there's a way the P6 could work without the filter. DSI should give the option somehow.. Can't be that difficult to put it as an option ... a combination of key presses on startup or something. I understand the decision to implement it as they have, but so many people have complained about it you think they'd do something about it... maybe in another more expensive synth they will !! :)
Not all dudes complaint about the stepping...
Check this out:
czcams.com/video/WIsdJe8DKWk/video.html
What I consider a gift on the AS-1 is the tiny oled display, due to the lack of knob-per-function facility... But a lot of sound designers find it useful for precise adjustments, and wonder why DSI didn't include one on the P6...
Another useful feature is the touch-sensitive slider, that allows you to modulate up to seven crucial parameters at the same time, not just lfo amount like the mod wheel on the P6...
After watching this I can't decide between waiting for the Behringer Pro 800 or buy two Pro 1
I think we're all waiting to see what the Pro 800 is like :)
When I worked in the industry our biggest criticism of the then current crop of cutting edge physical analog modelling was the stepping... so here we are again 20 years later with an "analog" Prophet 6 :/
That stepping really is horrible. :l
It’s a real pita. When playing patch,however, it’s not noticeable until you tweak it. But....If for example you automate a filter sweep in your DAW it gets worse... the P6 uses 256 bits of MIDI so uses 2 bytes ie bit 1 for 0-127 and bit 2 for 128-256 CCs this creates a small click between 127 and 128 as it changes from MIDI bit 1 to bit 2 when sweeping the filter through the half-way mark. THIS is incredibly annoying and I’ve never come across it on anything else. It makes automated sweeps impossible.
In the words of Robot Heart of Sequential on their forum...
“ I was curious so I looked into this further, and it turns out it's a limitation of the pots themselves over the ADC. You only get so much resolution from the pot, and once you build in hysteresis to get rid of the otherwise inevitable jitter from the pot landing in between values interpreted by the ADC you're not left with a ton of usable bits. The solution would be to find a pot with more resolution; perhaps an optical pot but not necessarily. But a more expensive pot for sure. If all pots on the instrument were to be this new hypothetical pot it would add significantly to the cost of the instrument.”
P6 came off as being a bit lacklustre here, I have to say …
I think that was planned, so as not to cannibalise their later P5/10 rereleases at all
I’d buy the other two ‘series 6’ sequentials, before I bought a P6
Still - the ‘series 6’ give you the flavours, without paying for the flagships … and/or, are more portable/all-in-one
i have the pro 3 and the toraiz. Sigh..... I'm still gonna get the pro one. And I need to learn how to play.
But not how to control your addiction :)
Great overview! The AS-1 really looks like a toy, no hand on controls if such a dealbreaker for me. I rather save money for a more live performing oriented instrument, then having to menu-dive yuck
So basically when it comes to all of these synths that people are paying crazy money for, the only differences really come out to who has more wave shapes or oscillators but somewhere within all of these synths there's a sound that all of them can achieve. So why not just buy a 1 or 2 synths that both carry more than 1 oscillator that you can choose to use together or separately, have anywhere from 8-16 note poly, ability to go mono, offers white and pink noise, has all the LFO shapes and pulse as well as the filters. I'm really trying to figure out why there's a new synth every damn month with most of them creating the same sounds and everyone is going crazy over them when they probably have something that can make the same sounds. I understand if there's some slight differences in the sound/quality. Maybe some do bass better and some to high end sounds better. So why not get a super dope analog synth and a super dope digital synth. Somebody shed some light for me. Lol
Where’s the fun in thinking logically and being sensible ;)
Some people need new stuff from time to time. Some more than others. It helps to keep the brain filled with 'happy-hormones' or so...
I think you are mostly right about that there are many synths that can sound like others on many occasions. But some are better suited for special needs than others, that alone can be enough to want another device in the collection.
But i get the message, just get a flagship analog mono and poly, maybe another digital poly and be done with it ;-)
Synths can also have different workflows that you can either hate/like. But the big difference I think are some of the unique sweetspots you can find on different machines. If you are only after a clean saw sawtooth with no filter, then yeah... you can use whatever synths.
i hear you man. Just seems to make sense to get a synth or two that can cover all the needs and then use themt accordingly to suit the need at the time.
@@StarskyCarr i'm with you on the fun part, but at the same time, everyone cant do what you can. Lol. But If I personally had your smarts with synths, I'd definitely get whats needed and just duplicate these sounds/textures. lol
Crap wobbly knobs on £2,300 P6, Behringer solid as a rock!!
oh! What crappy decisions were made in the Prophet-6 design! Especially this weak FM amount. It could be done with x10 - x20 amount easily. Neutron has even more FM amount ability probably. And it's not a waste of knobs' range.
Also they've could add a small button "quantized" near the tuning knob of Prophet 6. Why not? Very strange choices for not a cheap synth!
I can see why Dave just sold the company. Imagine when Behringer start on the Pro polys!
interesting point!
The Pro One is the one.
Your videos are fantastic. Just one criticism on all of them. You talk in between playing one and the other. This kills peoples’ ability to compare the two. It resets peoples’ ears. It drives me crazy tbh. 😂 If you can just play one, then the other, it would be sooo much more useful. You could put whatever you were going to say on screen, if you wanted to.
thanks for the tip... I'm always trying to improve stuff so will give it a go.
Interesting. But I almost unsubscribed when you make p6 sound "rubbish". Allmost blasphemy.
Haha... but it’s not my fault !!! :)
@@StarskyCarr Behave yourself! :)
I don't like the tone of the new Prophet 6, never have.
Barefoot Joe Turn down that resonance!
@@brentvalleywhag3477 I just mean the new version, I enjoyed my vintage one, but I would not describe the new Prophet as warm..
Totally disagree...out of all the DSI synths, the Prophet 6 is the warmest sounding...Personally, the Prophet 6 is a tad too "Polite" for me....But, It's a beautiful sounding analogue synth that sits perfectly in a mix though.....Like having a Rolls Royce as opposed to a Ferrari...just my opinion....please, please, please don't start comparing to a Prophet 5....that particular argument makes me want to vomit.
Cold is overstating i think, a sort of " plastic " quality yes, even a prophet 600 has a more edgy bite than that p6 ,
@@cnfuzz Plastic is a much better term thanks, shiny and crisp.