A great no BS presentation that will get people where they want to go sonically...at an affordable price. I've spent money I didn't have to because I followed some of these over-the-top extreme DIY server build ideas.
Mikey have you tried Hysolid?It is software that does bit perfect from your server or pc using your cellphone as a controller. It reads from your hard drive and passes it directly to your DAC...untouched.Great unadulterated sound quality.🤜🤛 EDIT:And its free 😀
I’m using something very similar with a Jcat usb extreme card powered by a Farad power supply. When I compared it to my OpticalRendu I was surprised at how much better it sounded in almost every aspect
I build this streamer a couple of years ago, I am still thankful for the tip on the chassis. Another tip, take a 12v car battery to power de thing, it is nice and quiet power!
Great video Mikey! If I may add to this: For those who aren't computer inclined to build- and load Unix software onto a computer, Small Green Computer makes excellent little server/streamer starting at $1,000 and up depending on need called SonicTransporter. They come with Linux preloaded and you can run it directly to your DAC. If you want even better sonic performance, get a DDC ( I recommend Holo Audio RED) to lower jitter and noise and hook it up between your DAC and your new server. This will beat most solutions out there and you'll save thousands $$$.
Yes, and if we're going for Value, ALLO makes a streamer with outboard linear power supply for $300 give or take. The purpose of an audio USB card is to eliminate the need for a ddc and yet another box.... ;-)
Interesting thoughts on the cpu power. What do you think of the amd x3d cpu's? Some people prefer the more power hungry chips claming benefits with higher cache. I like the idea of a barel plug powered motherboard, sure is cheaper than running a linear atx psu.
Mickey great informative video, I’ve been using a very inexpensive home brew server for the past two years having owned and borrowed servers from the likes of Rockna , Innuos and the 432 Evo Aeon if you didn’t know any better some would be perfectly happy with the performance of these flagship models. Im thinking maybe it’s time to check out a new server one based around the Sotm SMB Q370mother board with some interesting innovation’s built in from a Hong Kong company AfterDark their target is reducing or eliminating noise and of course sound quality , will see ,…
Hi Mike. Good video. I got turned on to your CZcams channel years ago when you rightly showed how overpriced and overhyped and poorly designed my Innuos Zenth MK3 was. It was underpowered with a weak processor for Roon. So I have to debate you on the construction of this server. I sold my Innuos and built a Roon core server from an Intel NUC i7 with 32 GB dual rank RAM and a 256 GB M.2 SSD. This was loaded with Roon ROCK in a fan less AKASA case made for the Generation of NUC that I had. This whole setup cost about $1000 or less with parts from Amazon and ran Roon WAY better than the Innuos. I powered it with a linear power supply and ran Ethernet out to my audiophile Ethernet switch. This was a great setup. No noise. Ethernet out from the switch went to my streamer. You need a powerful CPU to run Roon. Like you said it is resource intensive. I since have converted over to a Small Green Computer i9 optical out server to my Ethernet switch which does have optical SFP ports. So any noise from that streamer is lost via the optical cable to the switch. But bottom line it is a lot simpler IMO to build a NUC in an Akasa case and load it with ROCK which is a lite version of Linux. But the premise of your video that you don’t need to spend big money on a server is correct and I completely agree. These high priced server companies are just taking advantage of us.
I don't know about the companies you mentioned but definitely Grimm is not one of the companies you think rip-off. I used to make Linux distribution. One of my current streamers is Ian Canada parts and a NUC for Roon core. Grimm Audio rewrote the library used for USB and their own FPGA if I remember correctly. Companies also need to spend money for development and advertising. If you could build one, great. But I'll guarantee you yours won't sound the same w Grimm MU1.
@@quattr03 The Grimm MU1 is a NUC with a usb cable to a DDC-card and discrete power-supply in a box, it is the same.. just look at the pictures you can even read NUC on it! The usb-standard is sat and the only thing you can change is how to use it, and Asynchronous transfer is preferred, marketing BS. The FPGA is bought and not there own (an FPGA is very expensive tio engineer and it is only a handfull manufactures that make them mostly Intel and AMD) just the programming/circuit board and they have to follow the programming and implementation guidelines and like all other companies, it is a DDC nothing else more BS. Sorry but they rip you off, how is it not the same! I bet your setup is just as good, not my choice but Ian makes good hatt's!
2020 I built me an Allo Boss/Raspberry Pi3/2TB HD DAC/Music Server with a 5V 3A Linear power supply. Volumio is the access. Absolutely love it, great fun building, tiny and works flawlessly. A cheap 10" Android Tablet is my human Interface.
@OCD HI-Fi Guy yeah bro. I'm an old fart, Love building my own stuff. Been an electronics engineer over 50 years and avid audiophile. So cool to be able to appreciate all this and just design/build stuff that you want. Hifi is all about what YOU really want achieve. Love hearing from you guys, and keep up what you're doing.
What are the advantages-disadvantages of music server/streamer vs a laptop? One advantage of the laptop ive found is being able to use a 10 band eq download, at the source vs another piece of gear in the chain. Good? Bad? Thanks!
And I'm stuck using my Dell PowerEdge T410 Tower Server 4TB RAID 10 w/2 x Intel multi-core Xeons into my Cisco SG350 L3 managed switch. End points from regular PCs to R-pi's. Perhaps interestingly, my 2ch audio system has no digital feed, turntable only.
Mikey, if possible, could you please list a BOM (Bill of Materials) for the server you showed here? I'm confident I can build one, but it would be helpful to have a BOM as a starting point. Thank you.
I have a HD Plex H5 that I will be building a silent PC with soon. These silent PCs are usually made in China, no matter the cost or brand. Larry/HDplex USA in CA is responsive too.
I use a RME ADI-2 DAC and JRiver Media Center on a Windows Laptop and it sounds as good as anything I have heard. The DAC is critical to the quality of the audio that you get from the PC or Mac. The DAC filters the USB 5v and uses it's own high precision asyncronous clock for the PCM audio stream to insure bit perfect data. I am a Linux fan but there are limitations to drivers and music applications that are only available for Windows or Mac.
RME in unique in that sense, they put a looot of filtering stages in their DACs so it should have little to no effect what you plug it into. On the other hand there are better sounding dacs out there.
Last weekend I installed Roon's OS ROCK on an Intel NUC from 2015 that I bought off of Ebay for $50, installed a cheap M2 1 TB hard drive and 16 db of DDR3 RAM ($40 total) and it's been running flawlessly for a week. It sits next to my router well away from my listening area so I don't have to care about the fan noise. I don't have a huge file library or run parametric eq/convolution filters but extra storage is as easy as sticking a USB drive into it and ROCK sees it immediately and response time is almost instantaenous. From there is streams to an iFi Zen in my rig.
I paid $2400 for my Innuos ZENith MK3 with the 2 terabyte SSD that is practically brand new. I saw that deal and pounced. No more MacBook acting as the streamer and server for me! The difference in sound quality is major.
I agree that linux is ideal for serving and streaming music. However, I am old and lazy so I use a Mac M1 mini with an external solid state drive, running Audirvana (the old version you can't buy anymore) on MacOS (sort of linuxy), and usually use my TV as a monitor. I have my ripped CDs on the external drive and stream from Qobuz. Works for me, and sure beats trying to use Windows, but linux would be better.
I see that this one doesn't have the Net card in it. I have built one just like this. How important do you feel it is to add a Net Card also? What if I just get a Jcat Femto and a 5v LPS.
That works great. It's what I do. My MOBO does not have 2 PCI slots only one. Plus I like sleek chassis and 2 cards needs a bigger box. I've had no issues with standard ENet on MOBO. I use a Fidelizer switch right before Server anyways... Holler for the cards as I can sell them to you...
I winced a bit when you touched components inside the case -- I couldn't see any wrist strap! 🙂 I'm assuming that one plugs in a screen and a mouse so that one can select folders and files using whatever software one might prefer? In my case, I don't stream externally but only internally from tracks ripped from CD, and I use AIMP. My laptop isn't connected to the internet, so no problems with Windows updates etc. I am wondering whether or not a dedicated server makes worthwhile improvements in sound over a laptop. I'm thinking that depending on which DAC one uses, a lot of the cleaning up could be done by it. Could be wrong about that, though. It sounds so good with just a laptop that I wonder if it's worth the hassle. Any comments gratefully received.
No plug in screen. It's called headless and done through the network. No lame Windows OS to navigate folders the old way. I also stream my ripped files from my desktop. Yes a dedicated server makes a difference. The level of your playback system would dictate if you'll even hear the benefits ot brings...
@@OCDHIFiGuy Thank you. However, I'm not sure I fully understand. So the box acts as a network server and you can connect it (via ethernet?) to devices like your desktop -- is that it? Presumably your ripped files, stored on your desktop, might have Windows or Apple OS rather than Linux? No matter I suppose if the processing is done on the server. But if so, why would it need an HD/SSD if the original files are stored on your desktop? So many questions... I'm evidently in dire need of a web link that explains everything from first principles -- so please don't take this as a criticism, because it's not at all your fault so much as my own ignorance. It appears I'm lacking sufficient background knowledge. 😞 I'm still struggling to see why a music server would improve the sound very much if most or all cleanup is accomplished by the DAC. And where/how do you actually do the navigation of your music? There must be a screen somewhere in the system. Perhaps it's on your mobile phone (cell), which is something I don't have because I suspect I'm EMR sensitive -- so no wireless devices anywhere in my home. I don't have a hugely expensive system, but it is, I believe, of sufficient quality to hear some differences, e.g. between a bog standard printer cable and something like my Supra USB cable. Any way, I'm off now to search for that link I mentioned so I can gen up on all this. If it can all be accomplished using wired connections, that'd be favourite for me if I ever opted to try it.
Don't call it "music server", first, if you don't want to confuse the beginners. It's very simply a PC playing music. The DAC is the soundacrd. It doesn't matter at all,how fancy is the box in which it is in.
I store my music on my QNAP Network Attached Storage, have Logitech Media Server (LMS, Squeezebox) running on my Entertainment center PC, and have two PiCorePlayer RaspberryPi SBCs with DACs in my living room and bedroom. Works great!
I2s is a hack of a video protocol and has no standard... it's for people who don't want to do it properly with ST fiber Optic because it's "too complicated," lol.
![If you can't hear this then you're not an audiophile [See description for link to followup video]](/img/n.gif)
A great no BS presentation that will get people where they want to go sonically...at an affordable price. I've spent money I didn't have to because I followed some of these over-the-top extreme DIY server build ideas.
Mikey have you tried Hysolid?It is software that does bit perfect from your server or pc using your cellphone as a controller. It reads from your hard drive and passes it directly to your DAC...untouched.Great unadulterated sound quality.🤜🤛
EDIT:And its free 😀
I’m using something very similar with a Jcat usb extreme card powered by a Farad power supply. When I compared it to my OpticalRendu I was surprised at how much better it sounded in almost every aspect
I build this streamer a couple of years ago, I am still thankful for the tip on the chassis.
Another tip, take a 12v car battery to power de thing, it is nice and quiet power!
Interesting... lol.
Great video Mikey! If I may add to this: For those who aren't computer inclined to build- and load Unix software onto a computer, Small Green Computer makes excellent little server/streamer starting at $1,000 and up depending on need called SonicTransporter. They come with Linux preloaded and you can run it directly to your DAC. If you want even better sonic performance, get a DDC ( I recommend Holo Audio RED) to lower jitter and noise and hook it up between your DAC and your new server. This will beat most solutions out there and you'll save thousands $$$.
Yes, and if we're going for Value, ALLO makes a streamer with outboard linear power supply for $300 give or take. The purpose of an audio USB card is to eliminate the need for a ddc and yet another box.... ;-)
Good tip!
Super clean video, Mikey! I recall watching one of you DIY server vids a few years ago (late-2018?). This seems much better in layout.
Quick and to the point.
Perfect! Keep it ef'n simple.
Word...
An optimised macmini with external linear power supply would do the job as well if you have decent DAC in my view.
Interesting thoughts on the cpu power. What do you think of the amd x3d cpu's? Some people prefer the more power hungry chips claming benefits with higher cache.
I like the idea of a barel plug powered motherboard, sure is cheaper than running a linear atx psu.
Mickey great informative video, I’ve been using a very inexpensive home brew server for the past two years having owned and borrowed servers from the likes of Rockna , Innuos and the 432 Evo Aeon if you didn’t know any better some would be perfectly happy with the performance of these flagship models.
Im thinking maybe it’s time to check out a new server one based around the Sotm SMB Q370mother board with some interesting innovation’s built in from a Hong Kong company AfterDark their target is reducing or eliminating noise and of course sound quality , will see ,…
Excellent
Hi Mike. Good video. I got turned on to your CZcams channel years ago when you rightly showed how overpriced and overhyped and poorly designed my Innuos Zenth MK3 was. It was underpowered with a weak processor for Roon. So I have to debate you on the construction of this server. I sold my Innuos and built a Roon core server from an Intel NUC i7 with 32 GB dual rank RAM and a 256 GB M.2 SSD. This was loaded with Roon ROCK in a fan less AKASA case made for the Generation of NUC that I had. This whole setup cost about $1000 or less with parts from Amazon and ran Roon WAY better than the Innuos. I powered it with a linear power supply and ran Ethernet out to my audiophile Ethernet switch. This was a great setup. No noise. Ethernet out from the switch went to my streamer. You need a powerful CPU to run Roon. Like you said it is resource intensive. I since have converted over to a Small Green Computer i9 optical out server to my Ethernet switch which does have optical SFP ports. So any noise from that streamer is lost via the optical cable to the switch. But bottom line it is a lot simpler IMO to build a NUC in an Akasa case and load it with ROCK which is a lite version of Linux. But the premise of your video that you don’t need to spend big money on a server is correct and I completely agree. These high priced server companies are just taking advantage of us.
I don't know about the companies you mentioned but definitely Grimm is not one of the companies you think rip-off. I used to make Linux distribution. One of my current streamers is Ian Canada parts and a NUC for Roon core. Grimm Audio rewrote the library used for USB and their own FPGA if I remember correctly. Companies also need to spend money for development and advertising. If you could build one, great. But I'll guarantee you yours won't sound the same w Grimm MU1.
@@quattr03 is the Grimm Roon Ready? Does it crash when running Roon Remote? Does it crash when operating DSP in Roon?
@@quattr03 The Grimm MU1 is a NUC with a usb cable to a DDC-card and discrete power-supply in a box, it is the same.. just look at the pictures you can even read NUC on it! The usb-standard is sat and the only thing you can change is how to use it, and Asynchronous transfer is preferred, marketing BS. The FPGA is bought and not there own (an FPGA is very expensive tio engineer and it is only a handfull manufactures that make them mostly Intel and AMD) just the programming/circuit board and they have to follow the programming and implementation guidelines and like all other companies, it is a DDC nothing else more BS. Sorry but they rip you off, how is it not the same! I bet your setup is just as good, not my choice but Ian makes good hatt's!
@@fredrikbarthel4803 weird. My response to you disappeared ;-)
2020 I built me an Allo Boss/Raspberry Pi3/2TB HD DAC/Music Server with a 5V 3A Linear power supply. Volumio is the access. Absolutely love it, great fun building, tiny and works flawlessly. A cheap 10" Android Tablet is my human Interface.
There it is !
@OCD HI-Fi Guy yeah bro. I'm an old fart, Love building my own stuff. Been an electronics engineer over 50 years and avid audiophile. So cool to be able to appreciate all this and just design/build stuff that you want. Hifi is all about what YOU really want achieve. Love hearing from you guys, and keep up what you're doing.
great video!
What are the advantages-disadvantages of music server/streamer vs a laptop?
One advantage of the laptop ive found is being able to use a 10 band eq download, at the source vs another piece of gear in the chain. Good? Bad?
Thanks!
Laptop is noisy. Not optimized for MUSIC. DSP eq is horrible unless it's professional level.
And I'm stuck using my Dell PowerEdge T410 Tower Server 4TB RAID 10 w/2 x Intel multi-core Xeons into my Cisco SG350 L3 managed switch. End points from regular PCs to R-pi's. Perhaps interestingly, my 2ch audio system has no digital feed, turntable only.
Mikey, if possible, could you please list a BOM (Bill of Materials) for the server you showed here?
I'm confident I can build one, but it would be helpful to have a BOM as a starting point. Thank you.
No. You need to make your own BOM. I gave you the outline to use. There are too many variables to have a single BOM work for everyone... ;-)
I have a HD Plex H5 that I will be building a silent PC with soon. These silent PCs are usually made in China, no matter the cost or brand. Larry/HDplex USA in CA is responsive too.
Yes, Larry is great.
I just did the same with an H5 . It sounds extremely good
I use a RME ADI-2 DAC and JRiver Media Center on a Windows Laptop and it sounds as good as anything I have heard. The DAC is critical to the quality of the audio that you get from the PC or Mac. The DAC filters the USB 5v and uses it's own high precision asyncronous clock for the PCM audio stream to insure bit perfect data. I am a Linux fan but there are limitations to drivers and music applications that are only available for Windows or Mac.
RME in unique in that sense, they put a looot of filtering stages in their DACs so it should have little to no effect what you plug it into. On the other hand there are better sounding dacs out there.
Could i use a DAP as a music server? It essentially houses all my music 🤷🏾♂️
Great Grateful Dead Sticker!
HEY NOW !!
Approx. how many $$ for DIY as shown plus LPS plus 2TB SSD plus software like HQPlayer?
Last weekend I installed Roon's OS ROCK on an Intel NUC from 2015 that I bought off of Ebay for $50, installed a cheap M2 1 TB hard drive and 16 db of DDR3 RAM ($40 total) and it's been running flawlessly for a week. It sits next to my router well away from my listening area so I don't have to care about the fan noise. I don't have a huge file library or run parametric eq/convolution filters but extra storage is as easy as sticking a USB drive into it and ROCK sees it immediately and response time is almost instantaenous. From there is streams to an iFi Zen in my rig.
Yep I did the same thing. Found a used NUC7 and installed Roon Rock on it. It connects to my Roon endpoint flawlessly!
There ya go !!
more infos on the output card please
I paid $2400 for my Innuos ZENith MK3 with the 2 terabyte SSD that is practically brand new. I saw that deal and pounced. No more MacBook acting as the streamer and server for me! The difference in sound quality is major.
Nice Mikey. I would try this if I had more time on my hands/
I agree that linux is ideal for serving and streaming music. However, I am old and lazy so I use a Mac M1 mini with an external solid state drive, running Audirvana (the old version you can't buy anymore) on MacOS (sort of linuxy), and usually use my TV as a monitor. I have my ripped CDs on the external drive and stream from Qobuz. Works for me, and sure beats trying to use Windows, but linux would be better.
I see that this one doesn't have the Net card in it. I have built one just like this. How important do you feel it is to add a Net Card also? What if I just get a Jcat Femto and a 5v LPS.
That works great. It's what I do. My MOBO does not have 2 PCI slots only one. Plus I like sleek chassis and 2 cards needs a bigger box. I've had no issues with standard ENet on MOBO. I use a Fidelizer switch right before Server anyways... Holler for the cards as I can sell them to you...
I winced a bit when you touched components inside the case -- I couldn't see any wrist strap! 🙂
I'm assuming that one plugs in a screen and a mouse so that one can select folders and files using whatever software one might prefer? In my case, I don't stream externally but only internally from tracks ripped from CD, and I use AIMP. My laptop isn't connected to the internet, so no problems with Windows updates etc.
I am wondering whether or not a dedicated server makes worthwhile improvements in sound over a laptop. I'm thinking that depending on which DAC one uses, a lot of the cleaning up could be done by it. Could be wrong about that, though. It sounds so good with just a laptop that I wonder if it's worth the hassle. Any comments gratefully received.
No plug in screen. It's called headless and done through the network. No lame Windows OS to navigate folders the old way. I also stream my ripped files from my desktop. Yes a dedicated server makes a difference. The level of your playback system would dictate if you'll even hear the benefits ot brings...
@@OCDHIFiGuy Thank you. However, I'm not sure I fully understand. So the box acts as a network server and you can connect it (via ethernet?) to devices like your desktop -- is that it? Presumably your ripped files, stored on your desktop, might have Windows or Apple OS rather than Linux? No matter I suppose if the processing is done on the server. But if so, why would it need an HD/SSD if the original files are stored on your desktop? So many questions...
I'm evidently in dire need of a web link that explains everything from first principles -- so please don't take this as a criticism, because it's not at all your fault so much as my own ignorance. It appears I'm lacking sufficient background knowledge. 😞
I'm still struggling to see why a music server would improve the sound very much if most or all cleanup is accomplished by the DAC. And where/how do you actually do the navigation of your music? There must be a screen somewhere in the system. Perhaps it's on your mobile phone (cell), which is something I don't have because I suspect I'm EMR sensitive -- so no wireless devices anywhere in my home.
I don't have a hugely expensive system, but it is, I believe, of sufficient quality to hear some differences, e.g. between a bog standard printer cable and something like my Supra USB cable. Any way, I'm off now to search for that link I mentioned so I can gen up on all this. If it can all be accomplished using wired connections, that'd be favourite for me if I ever opted to try it.
Don't call it "music server", first, if you don't want to confuse the beginners. It's very simply a PC playing music. The DAC is the soundacrd. It doesn't matter at all,how fancy is the box in which it is in.
I store my music on my QNAP Network Attached Storage, have Logitech Media Server (LMS, Squeezebox) running on my Entertainment center PC, and have two PiCorePlayer RaspberryPi SBCs with DACs in my living room and bedroom. Works great!
Or you get a pi2aes streamer with SSD option. Geeks only.😅 i2s to dac is the future. Usb /pc crap will set you off thousands to correct usb noise.
I2s is a hack of a video protocol and has no standard... it's for people who don't want to do it properly with ST fiber Optic because it's "too complicated," lol.
Why are you shouting? 😂
Because I'm full power.
@@OCDHIFiGuy 🤣🤣🤣
Complete junk build.
Get an iMac or NUC. Strip it add Akasa case and high quality LPS. Done.